[G] 5 Roach Rush: early game without the all-in - Page 38

On October 12 2010 21:39 Undercroft wrote:
Against sentries you only need to abort if there's more than one. A single sentry won't be able to stop the rush or slow it enough to actually do anything. All you do is wait out the first forcefield and then break in. It doesn't matter as much if your roaches get a little split as you can still use them to open a hole for the lings.

Against terrans i've had a bit more mixed success. Tech builds get demolished unless the wall is build properly (ie two big buildings like a rax, etc) or they go for lots of marauders early. Not sure how a 1rax FE stops the 5RR. What units do you have at your wall? and how do you manage to expand when the zerg has all those units for map control? I don't see what you can mean by having the expansion up before the zerg player when you won';t be able to land the cc

On October 13 2010 00:43 MorsCerta wrote:

I have never, ever ever ever, seen someone open with 5 sentries. (1200 diamond take with grain of salt.) The most I have seen is 1, and warp tech does finish as I get there and I have faced stalkers incoming, which is why if I see they will need to warp in to hold off my attack, I will follow up with 8-12 speedlings, Because 9 times out of 10 they will warp 2-3 stalkers.

On October 13 2010 10:56 Armsved wrote:


1st of all any terran should be using 2 structures to wall off because of baneling busts. Basicly with 1 rax FE you get 2 reapers out first. The first reaper will spot w/e you are doing and then you just get marauder (the fact that you take gas after pool is also a huge give away). You really only need 2 marauders to defend vs this push. I tend to go 1 rax with techlab, get out 2 reaper (or w/e is needed, marauders if I see this opening). Start CC when at 400 minerals, produce rauders after the 2 reapers, at 600 minerals put down 3rax and 1 factory (this is before the CC is done) and start stim. The OC is done around the time the first cycle of units has come out, so you can just go down, secure nat and land OC.

On October 13 2010 11:43 ewswes wrote:


don't really know what to tell you then, there's absolutely no reason not to dump early gas on sentries to start building their energy asap.

Even if they only have 1 sentry, i assume that means they have more zealots. Which means all he has to do is delay with his 1 ff, warp in some stalkers. And I don't know how zerglings are supposed to get into his base when he built 2-3 zealots early on to wall off.

On October 13 2010 13:46 MorsCerta wrote:

Umm....roaches attacked the zealots? Roaches kite zealots -> zealots either on hold and die or chase and die, if they chase run speedlings past zealots to surround stalkers -> roaches kill zealots -> finish up stalkers.

The time he had a sentry I believe he cut my roaches into 2 and 3, i focused down the zealots because they were in range then he warped in stalkers to counter my roaches and my speedlings were waiting outside for the FF to go away. FF goes away I simply run in and at this point my second wave of speedlings is on the way. i would imagine the correct thing to do would be warp in 1 more sentry and 2 stalkers to maintain a FF but my opponent is not aware of speedlings waiting outside nor do most people when under pressure have the composure to warp in a caster. People think oh shitshitshit need dps roaches here ok STALKERS! Which is really their downfall.

I'll try to find replays for you I have saved and also I'll open this on toss every opportunity I have and save you more replays. I think the main thing though is all toss scouts at the most is I am researching ling speed. I never ever have let a toss scout my roach warren going down and if they do I would probably cancel and expand.

On October 13 2010 14:22 ewswes wrote:


I've never lost to a zerg doing a roach rush on me even when I've played sloppy and messed up my BO so I don't have enough sentries up or my warpgate came a bit late. Or I would try to do a 2gate/forge/nexus build and would get surprised by a roach push and had to cancel my nexus and lose a pylon. Still held it off easily with ff, stalkers, and warp-in.

When your roaches get split by ff, the majority of your roaches aren't able to attack anything at all while I kill the 2-3 roaches that I split off from your army. I have plenty of time to warp in 2 stalker/1 sentry which gives me even more time to delay to warp in whatever unit I require.

I don't see this build working on anyone competent. I'm no pro or anything, I'm at around low-mid diamond, same as you. There's a reason why we're not seeing any top zergs doing 5RR in pvz.

edit: noticed you said most people don't warp in more sentries. It's kind of essential to have enough sentries to maintain force fields until they're stabalized. If the opponents youre playing never build more than 1 sentry at that stage and never warp in additional sentries, then you might as well baneling bust them every game.

On October 14 2010 09:06 mrfatbush wrote:



I probably agree with this, because if they go 1gate into cyber, even just one stalker with zealots can hold this off. And once they do hold it off they're back to doing whatever it is they were planning to do with 1gate into cyber whilst you've delayed your expansion significantly.

On the other hand, if they 2 gate roach is ok as you kind of have to get roach anyway if they pressure with 5 zealots. So yeah, I like fast roach if 2 gate. 1 gate i prefer hatch first macro style

Edit: clearly i dont know how to quote properly...

On August 20 2010 11:46 obsid wrote:
Seems to be a slower versions of this: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Baneling/Roach_Rush_(vs._Terran)

With a later expo and no banelings. Any damage you could do with your build, I would think the roach/baneling build would do even more damage (as it gets through the wall faster with the 5 roaches with the banelings). And with only 1 base (until after the attack starts), you will be less able to spam lings/drones to power or prevent a counter attack.

On October 14 2010 11:22 TellMeWhy wrote:



its probably slower because its meant to be an opening and not an all-in

On October 15 2010 22:04 Undercroft wrote:

It's also the reason my success with this build vs terran is a bit so-so too. Good sim city can be a pain, especially with a funnel-like placement when there's marines to pew pew over the buildings.

tldr:
Be warned that good building placement can augment their defence force

On October 15 2010 22:24 me_viet wrote:
Post patch 1.1.2 i'm pretty sure on Kulas Ravine where the entrance is not on higher grounds, Roaches will now be able to shoot at depots or Rax without fear of retaliation by marines or maybe even Marauders. (Marines range 5, Roaches range 4, Depot is 2 'space')

Another good point of this build I think