• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 10:08
CET 16:08
KST 00:08
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !8Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump
Tourneys
$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1: Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle screp: Command line app to parse SC rep files How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO8 - Day 2 - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1160 users

Busting myths with UnitTester - Page 8

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 6 7 8 9 10 Next All
Zoltan
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States656 Posts
July 26 2010 03:02 GMT
#141
can i just go ahead and applaud your effort, but this must be some of the most misleading data ever. There is no micro involved, and no unit mixing, meaning that none of these scenarios will ever lead to fruition. The thors vs ultras one is particularly misleading- if a thor strike cannons an ultra and ONE MARINE is nearby, the ultra dies before the end of the cannons and the thor takes like ~90 damage. No transfusion on the queens? Why do u think that multiple queens is good vs air...

That being said the thors vs mutas was well done.
'HOW LONG HAVE THOSE REAPERS BEEN KILLING MY PROBES?!?!
Zato-1
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Chile4253 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-26 03:44:14
July 26 2010 03:43 GMT
#142
On July 26 2010 11:48 obsid wrote:
I dont know I can kill 3 carriers with 5 voidrays which is about equal in value (mind you voidrays dont see to own carriers at all, maybe they come out even though). The real key in voidray vr carrier battles is charge, in small to medium numbers the voidrays do just fine, but at very large numbers (like 10 carriers), the voidrays will actualy kill the first carrier too quickly (if you focus fire), and most of the voidrays wont be charged up enough to kill the rest of the carriers, but if you split fire onthe first carrier, the carriers will rip the voidrays appart with focus fire. Also there doesnt seem to be a lot you can do with micro in this fight, the voidrays can keep up with the carriers and both of them have moving attack.

If the voidrays enter any battle with even close to even resource cost and already charged (on rocks or something), they kill tons of carriers.

I tried 5 Carriers vs. an equivalent number of Void Rays on XGDragon's Unit Tester, and the Carriers absolutely demolished the Void Rays (Void Rays weren't pre-charged). It's not even close. And no, the Void Rays weren't shooting the interceptors or anything of the like.
Go here http://vina.biobiochile.cl/ and input the Konami Code (up up down down left right left right B A)
NeWnAr
Profile Joined April 2010
Singapore231 Posts
July 26 2010 04:48 GMT
#143
Check Roaches vs Zealots pls.
Live For the Swarm!
oxxo
Profile Joined February 2010
988 Posts
July 26 2010 05:07 GMT
#144
On July 26 2010 12:02 Zoltan wrote:
can i just go ahead and applaud your effort, but this must be some of the most misleading data ever. There is no micro involved, and no unit mixing, meaning that none of these scenarios will ever lead to fruition. The thors vs ultras one is particularly misleading- if a thor strike cannons an ultra and ONE MARINE is nearby, the ultra dies before the end of the cannons and the thor takes like ~90 damage. No transfusion on the queens? Why do u think that multiple queens is good vs air...

That being said the thors vs mutas was well done.


He's unit testing for hard counters. It's not misleading if you understand what he's testing.
Iri
Profile Joined January 2010
150 Posts
July 26 2010 05:51 GMT
#145
Thank you SO much for this... I thought I was the only one who realized that phoenixes will beat vikings and mutalisks certainly can beat thors.
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
MangoTango
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States3670 Posts
July 26 2010 05:56 GMT
#146
So, given this data, Ultralisks are pretty much lolpwn against Terran, since you will never have enough room to manouver 40 Marauders against 12 Ultras. And those Ultras will be accompanied by 9435623454 lings. Enough whining about Ultras not being good enough then?
"One fish, two fish, red fish, BLUE TANK!" - Artosis
t3tsubo
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Canada682 Posts
July 26 2010 06:01 GMT
#147
roaches versus zealots and roaches versus thors plz, roaches versus thors only because of Idra's awesome hold against TLO in the KOTB tourney
Therealdevil
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands1021 Posts
July 26 2010 06:08 GMT
#148
roaches versus zealots without micro is stupid, cause thats only something stupid people will do, the op shouldn't even bother.

gj on the other stuff though, i found the bc's interesting they are apparently a very cost effective unit.

I'd like to see some more archon though, vs roaches or hydras for example.
BigDatez
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada434 Posts
July 26 2010 06:15 GMT
#149
veryyy nice. thought that vikings did better vs corruptors..
Video games > sex (Proven fact)
Sabresandiego
Profile Joined July 2010
United States227 Posts
July 26 2010 10:05 GMT
#150
If you just go by the unit tester, hellions lose to every unit in the game cost for cost. If you micro them however things change.
Terran
Jermstuddog
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2231 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-26 10:53:10
July 26 2010 10:50 GMT
#151
On July 26 2010 19:05 Sabresandiego wrote:
If you just go by the unit tester, hellions lose to every unit in the game cost for cost. If you micro them however things change.


Busted

10 Hellions vs 20 Marines.

If you do nothing other than move the blob of hellions where the first row is touching the blob of marines and stop, hellions win by a large margin. (this causes about 1/2 the marines to die on the first attack)

10 Hellions vs 40 Zerglings.

With no micro they actually do lose here, until you get Infernal Pre-igniter, then it's no contest regardless of how many upgrades the lings have.

This is no different from the amount of micro he does on most of these tests. Go figure that hellions are actually good against the units they're good against eh?
As it turns out, marines don't actually cost any money -Jinro
Batch
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden692 Posts
July 26 2010 11:04 GMT
#152
On July 26 2010 14:56 MangoTango wrote:
So, given this data, Ultralisks are pretty much lolpwn against Terran, since you will never have enough room to manouver 40 Marauders against 12 Ultras. And those Ultras will be accompanied by 9435623454 lings. Enough whining about Ultras not being good enough then?

You whine about not enough room to manouver 40 Marines? How do you expect anyone to manuover 12 Ultras in the same space? You can be happy if you are able to have 3 of those 12 Ultras attacking.

I think Ultralisks are fine. Their damage can be avoided by placeing a single unit a little bit in front of your ball of units and can be countered by the right terrain usage or by air.
Jermstuddog
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2231 Posts
July 26 2010 11:20 GMT
#153
No, lets keep complaining about the 1 good unit Zerg has against Terran when there are only 8 good units Terran has against Zerg... Totally Zerg favored matchup there...
As it turns out, marines don't actually cost any money -Jinro
Svizcy
Profile Joined May 2010
Slovenia300 Posts
July 26 2010 14:34 GMT
#154
Wow, i would never say that Ultras beat Marauderers with stim. It felt so easy when i was kitting zerg opponent ultras with my MM ball. We werent on creep thou, i dont know if you tested on creep or not?

Anyways, awsome thread, good work.

good day, svizcy
fdsdfg
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States1251 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-26 15:35:29
July 26 2010 15:30 GMT
#155
On July 26 2010 19:50 Jermstuddog wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 19:05 Sabresandiego wrote:
If you just go by the unit tester, hellions lose to every unit in the game cost for cost. If you micro them however things change.


Busted

10 Hellions vs 20 Marines.

If you do nothing other than move the blob of hellions where the first row is touching the blob of marines and stop, hellions win by a large margin. (this causes about 1/2 the marines to die on the first attack)

10 Hellions vs 40 Zerglings.

With no micro they actually do lose here, until you get Infernal Pre-igniter, then it's no contest regardless of how many upgrades the lings have.

This is no different from the amount of micro he does on most of these tests. Go figure that hellions are actually good against the units they're good against eh?


Uh.. you just confirmed his point.

Also a lot of these are really misleading as others have said - especially looking at Vikings vs Corruptors.

Vikings have the range advantage and can score a lot of free damage from kiting. Vikings also are HALF the gas of a corruptor, so it's really not fair to face them 1v1.

You didn't face BC vs Hydra 1v1, you actually looked at cost - why didn't you with a 100/150 unit vs a 125/75 unit?

Ultras vs thors, why don't you use strike cannons? They have the ability for a reason. Yes if you use it stupidly it will be worthless, just like if you psi storm your own units. An HT counters Marines even though you can waste psi storm if you want.
aka Siyko
harky
Profile Joined July 2010
98 Posts
July 26 2010 16:45 GMT
#156
That doesn't confirm the point at all in regard to Hellions. Zerglings are about the only thing that requires much micro and that's only before Speed + Igniter are researched. Once those two are if you're testing them you should just A-move anyway because micro barely matters. If you attack move Marines into Hellions the Marines get slaughtered. If you attack move fully upgraded zerglings into fully upgraded Hellions the Zerglings get slaughtered. Same for Hydras. Same for Zealots. Hellions + Igniter are amazing against light units. The problem is they're so one dimensional that you never see some big Hellion vs Zealot battle. It's too easy to just go Stalker, or Roach, or Marauder against them.
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-26 17:11:22
July 26 2010 17:08 GMT
#157
I feel like Hellions should beat sentries, which are definitely more expensive. Reapers as well.

On July 26 2010 14:56 MangoTango wrote:
So, given this data, Ultralisks are pretty much lolpwn against Terran, since you will never have enough room to manouver 40 Marauders against 12 Ultras. And those Ultras will be accompanied by 9435623454 lings. Enough whining about Ultras not being good enough then?


Pity it's hard to ever get 12 Ultras at once, especially because 12 ultras = 72 supply.
roliax
Profile Joined May 2010
135 Posts
July 26 2010 17:12 GMT
#158
These data are cool to look at but not particularly useful. It's like measuring quarterback's vertical jump or a center's 100m dash.

EvasivE
Profile Joined July 2010
United States70 Posts
July 26 2010 17:35 GMT
#159
brilliant.
queens are def underrated i should incorporate them more often.
!
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
July 26 2010 18:11 GMT
#160
On July 27 2010 02:35 EvasivE wrote:
brilliant.
queens are def underrated i should incorporate them more often.


Problem is if you focus on building them then you can't go on the offensive. For example, you build mass queen because they have a decent amount of air. Well now when you move out your army will get slaughtered by the enemy unless you bring all your queens along. Yeah, they are good, just don't overestimate them.
Prev 1 6 7 8 9 10 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
14:00
King of the Hill #234
SteadfastSC54
Liquipedia
WardiTV 2025
11:00
Playoffs
Clem vs CreatorLIVE!
Scarlett vs Spirit
ShoWTimE vs Cure
WardiTV1517
ComeBackTV 1172
TaKeTV 427
IndyStarCraft 233
Rex137
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko599
IndyStarCraft 233
Harstem 194
Rex 137
ProTech84
RotterdaM 68
SteadfastSC 54
Liquid`VortiX 42
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 31074
Calm 5213
Rain 2268
Bisu 2011
Horang2 1062
Stork 860
actioN 833
BeSt 414
Shuttle 333
firebathero 270
[ Show more ]
Larva 268
Mini 178
ggaemo 173
Mind 115
Hyun 101
Killer 91
hero 86
Snow 77
Zeus 74
Aegong 65
JYJ 64
Barracks 59
ToSsGirL 48
Bale 46
Shinee 40
soO 38
Mong 27
zelot 25
910 20
ajuk12(nOOB) 18
Terrorterran 15
GoRush 15
sorry 15
scan(afreeca) 14
JulyZerg 14
Yoon 12
Sacsri 11
SilentControl 5
Dota 2
Gorgc5061
singsing3841
qojqva1615
XcaliburYe110
LuMiX1
League of Legends
C9.Mang0371
Counter-Strike
allub314
oskar114
Other Games
B2W.Neo1655
hiko545
crisheroes421
Fuzer 329
XaKoH 112
djWHEAT68
Trikslyr27
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HeavenSC 17
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis2243
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
1h 52m
YoungYakov vs Jumy
TriGGeR vs Spirit
The PiG Daily
5h 52m
SHIN vs ByuN
Reynor vs Classic
TBD vs herO
Maru vs SHIN
TBD vs Classic
CranKy Ducklings
18h 52m
WardiTV 2025
19h 52m
Reynor vs MaxPax
SHIN vs TBD
Solar vs herO
Classic vs TBD
SC Evo League
21h 22m
Ladder Legends
1d 3h
BSL 21
1d 4h
Sziky vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs Cross
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 18h
Ladder Legends
2 days
BSL 21
2 days
StRyKeR vs TBD
Bonyth vs TBD
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 1
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.