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On April 13 2010 22:07 Osmoses wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 19:53 Paladia wrote:Not sure if people are really facing the Super Fast Reaper rush. In the really fast one (proxy 6 rax) you get the first reaper inside your base at around 2:45, the second at 3:25. There is no possible way to have a stalker up in time even for the second Reaper and two of them kill probes and zealots so fast they hardly even have to micro. Even if you 11 gate you will have your first zealot out right before has two reapers inside your base. Check for example this replay where a 20 APM guy does it (quite poorly but still), at least it shows how easy it is. http://www.sc2rc.com/index.php/replay/download/1166 What is the appropriate counter for this? As even if I go fast Stalker I won't have it up until more than a minute later and by that time there are several Reapers in the base which have already killed everything. I state again for the record that if someone does this kind of allin rush then it better pay off or they're dead. Get someone to do it against you for a couple games and see if you can't at least get even when the rush is over.
The only way I've found to beat it is going 10 Gate (or even earlier) and rush to stalkers while using zealots / probes to defend but even then the failure rate is high. Not to mention I have to do it blindly, so if they don't go the rush I'm behind from the get go.
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you have to build a barracks, a tech lab, a refinery and a supply depot to do a reaper rush. it is too expensive. you cut scv production and protoss doubles your supply with chrono boost.
terran is so behind in scv and supply count that it will be really hard to win if protoss loses 2-3 probes. protoss players lose it in their heads.
if protoss and zerg continues whining like this. every unit will own terran in the next patch. collossus, immortal, high templar, mass tier1 units, broodlord, mutalisk, baneling. terran unit and building build times are becoming ridiculous. upgrades are becoming ridiculous. terran is already hard to play.
we will all say gg in patch 9 when we enter the game. marauders and reapers will dance and start shooting with an upgrade 
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i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist
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build a zealot and buy time with your probes until you get a stalker. you will lose 1 or 2 probes and own terran easily because terran doesn't have an economy if the rush fails.
terran doesn't wall in before tech lab. you can scout easily. if you don't scout and build 2 gates or skip zealot you will get owned of course.
try that. even bronze league players with 30 apm can do that.
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On April 13 2010 23:29 gavss wrote:
build a zealot and buy time with your probes until you get a stalker. you will lose 1 or 2 probes and own terran easily because terran doesn't have an economy if the rush fails.
terran doesn't wall in before tech lab. you can scout easily. if you don't scout and build 2 gates or skip zealot you will get owned of course.
try that. even bronze league players with 30 apm can do that.
orb is just trolling his thread now, I think it should be closed as we have enough feedback/counters/advice to this TvP opening.
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yea... all you have to do is micro good and you will stop it, thx for question
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On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist
Hey orb, I feel kind of bad for not recognizing the real problem. I know what you really need. I heard you can get some at this site: http://www.tampax.com/en-US/home/home.aspx
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On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist
i love when people talk about MULE imbalance as if chronoboost doesn't exist...
/agreed with antimage that orb is just trolling this thread now since he can't exactly whine that its impossible to beat anymore, guess he learned how to do math or something..
somebody close thread please
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you don't build mule when you 10 rax 10 ref rush because you need a supply depot and you need to build reapers. this topic is getting ridiculous.
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Holding off Reaper with loosing next to nothing is quite easy, I'd go for 9pylon, then always in between 2 chronoboosted probes Gateway, then assim, then Pylon, then w8 till gateway finishes and Core. safe a chronoboost for first Stalker et voilà - BO win against any sort of Proxy-Reaper ^^'
What I think is much mroe annoying are T wallin's with some Marauder in front and maybe a Bunker when you try to pressure him that mass up 4 Reaper with Speed-Upgrade that hop in your base when you try to push out - extremely hard to deal with, especially on Maps like Kulas, DO, LT and Metalopolis.
Proxy-Reapers are quite bad though. If P goes for a now quite standard fast Stalker, you are way behind... ^^'
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On April 13 2010 23:48 NightOne wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist i love when people talk about MULE imbalance as if chronoboost doesn't exist... /agreed with antimage that orb is just trolling this thread now since he can't exactly whine that its impossible to beat anymore, guess he learned how to do math or something.. somebody close thread please
What, you can't do simple addition?
Dumb fuck go check the math in the OP
I'm not the retard that keeps bumping this from the 3rd page of the strategy forum, don't look at me
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On April 13 2010 23:43 Floophead_III wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist Hey orb, I feel kind of bad for not recognizing the real problem. I know what you really need. I heard you can get some at this site: http://www.tampax.com/en-US/home/home.aspx
mathematically proven to be hilarious.
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On April 13 2010 23:49 gavss wrote:
you don't build mule when you 10 rax 10 ref rush because you need a supply depot and you need to build reapers. this topic is getting ridiculous.
You evidently have no idea how to play terran
zomg i herd building 1 reaper and then using your next 150 minerals on an orbital command is hard work guys what do you think?
yeah pressing that one button can be pretty hard, then you have to press another button to drop the mule
even if terran cuts scvs for a build like this and even if protoss uses every single chrono all game for probes instead of units protoss will still be behind on income so please stfu
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On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist
At the end of the day, you're just a whiny little bitch aren't you?
1) That comment is in no way constructive and is completely off topic.
2) The solution to your little reaper tissue box issue has already been presented to you.
3) protoss has chrono boosts, so faster probe count, less production facility investments.
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11 supply will be enough for anyone
- bill gates
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On April 13 2010 23:56 -orb- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:49 gavss wrote:
you don't build mule when you 10 rax 10 ref rush because you need a supply depot and you need to build reapers. this topic is getting ridiculous. You evidently have no idea how to play terran zomg i herd building 1 reaper and then using your next 150 minerals on an orbital command is hard work guys what do you think? yeah pressing that one button can be pretty hard, then you have to press another button to drop the mule even if terran cuts scvs for a build like this and even if protoss uses every single chrono all game for probes instead of units protoss will still be behind on income so please stfu
Orb, once the stalker is out the reaper harrass is basically over. If a Terran rushes to reapers, he is behind, and he damn well ought to get something for taking that risk, so no, I don't think you should be able to get a stalker out in time to stop this completely unless you also cut probes. I watched one of the replays in the OP and you basically LET the guy kill your probes, you don't even try to dodge. Tried it myself a couple of times, 8 rax and 10rax, and if the protoss gets a zeal out or uses his probes in anything close to an intelligent way then the rush is a fair gamble, I can get shut down completely or I can get slightly ahead, worse odds than a 6 pool tbh.
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On April 14 2010 00:13 Osmoses wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:56 -orb- wrote:On April 13 2010 23:49 gavss wrote:
you don't build mule when you 10 rax 10 ref rush because you need a supply depot and you need to build reapers. this topic is getting ridiculous. You evidently have no idea how to play terran zomg i herd building 1 reaper and then using your next 150 minerals on an orbital command is hard work guys what do you think? yeah pressing that one button can be pretty hard, then you have to press another button to drop the mule even if terran cuts scvs for a build like this and even if protoss uses every single chrono all game for probes instead of units protoss will still be behind on income so please stfu Orb, once the stalker is out the reaper harrass is basically over. If a Terran rushes to reapers, he is behind, and he damn well ought to get something for taking that risk, so no, I don't think you should be able to get a stalker out in time to stop this completely unless you also cut probes. I watched one of the replays in the OP and you basically LET the guy kill your probes, you don't even try to dodge. Tried it myself a couple of times, 8 rax and 10rax, and if the protoss gets a zeal out or uses his probes in anything close to an intelligent way then the rush is a fair gamble, I can get shut down completely or I can get slightly ahead, worse odds than a 6 pool tbh.
I don't know why ppl solely fixate on rushing, all-in's and cheese...
Reapers are good, I'd use them if I played Terran, but never for rushing, that's for sure.
But they're imba for scouting in the mid-game, they help you deal with any sort of cheese stuff on your cliff by giving you vision and on certain Maps like Kulas ravine they can even snipe the second gas at the Main and on LT, they can snipe the gas from the expansion, so your opponent has to invest into Observers, use a scan etc. just do deal with one little Reaper that gets out of a building you need anyways, why do you want to rush with them in addition to all that? ^^'
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On April 13 2010 23:53 -orb- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:48 NightOne wrote:On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist i love when people talk about MULE imbalance as if chronoboost doesn't exist... /agreed with antimage that orb is just trolling this thread now since he can't exactly whine that its impossible to beat anymore, guess he learned how to do math or something.. somebody close thread please What, you can't do simple addition? Dumb fuck go check the math in the OP I'm not the retard that keeps bumping this from the 3rd page of the strategy forum, don't look at me
Ur dumb, your math on the reaper doesn't make it "mathematically impossible" to beat, it just makes you a whiney little scrub that cant find the solution on his own so you come bitching on these forums with your excuse for "imba" and "overpowred" or some other riduculous excuse etc
and the fact that you are posting still means you are the retard that keeps bumping thi sfrom the 3rd page of the strategy forum, because you are the OP u are responsible for your own thread, kthx
sidenote: if you can comprehend something beyond your own bias observations
MULE does not automatically put protoss behind on income since chronoboosted probes actually go a long way, maybe check economy and income after every PVT game from now on k? its pretty even every time unless you can't macro or comprehend that maybe he expanded and has more mineral patches and more scvs.. k?.. ok.. thats what i thought k thx bye
can't wait until you come to these forums about some other "mathematically impossible to beat" strategy, itll be something ridiculous tomorrow with thor drops, you will inevitably come to the forums with 10 replays getting bent over by rank 3 bronze players that do fast thor drop and whine that they are imba and its "mathematically impossible" to get a stalker out before a thor or something...
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On April 13 2010 23:57 FortuneSyn wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:20 -orb- wrote:
i love when people talk about supply count for probes as if the MULE doesn't exist At the end of the day, you're just a whiny little bitch aren't you? 1) That comment is in no way constructive and is completely off topic. 2) The solution to your little reaper tissue box issue has already been presented to you. 3) protoss has chrono boosts, so faster probe count, less production facility investments.
+1
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On April 13 2010 23:36 Antimage wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2010 23:29 gavss wrote:
build a zealot and buy time with your probes until you get a stalker. you will lose 1 or 2 probes and own terran easily because terran doesn't have an economy if the rush fails.
terran doesn't wall in before tech lab. you can scout easily. if you don't scout and build 2 gates or skip zealot you will get owned of course.
try that. even bronze league players with 30 apm can do that. orb is just trolling his thread now, I think it should be closed as we have enough feedback/counters/advice to this TvP opening. Didn't really get any feedback on how to deal with 6 rax reaper rush.
I even tried it a couple of times myself (even though I don't play Terran) to see how other Protoss deals with it, unfortunately I won every game despite never having played the race before and being a poor player in general, not to mention everyone I faced was higher ranked than me.
Will have to try it a bit more and see if any toss has a viable strategy against it, as dealing with 2 reapers and one bunker being made while you only have zealots is fairly annoying to say the least.
Seems quite clear to me that the skill required to defend it is much higher than the skill to do it.
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EPT
