[M] (4) Morningside

Xenotolerance

United States464 Posts

December 11 2014 23:35 GMT

Morningside v1.3
by Xenotolerance
Size: 156x156
4 players
All spawns enabled
Close nat to nat: 35.5
Cross nat to nat: 47.8
Published on NA and EU

Analyzer
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The main entrance is three units across, so it can be blocked with a single forcefield, or walled with a single depot and barracks. It is possible to make an aggressive wall-in with three pylons, but it's more like walling at the top of the ramp on a standard main where zerg can get more surface area so it's not worthwhile for protoss. The un-buildable plates visible there are the 3x3 doodad plates, which are functionally the same but can not be destroyed, so no building can ever go directly in the choke.

The pod

Reapers and colossi can cliffwalk over the space with no doodads in front of the choke.

This is great for defense, but it's also great for proxies, blink stalkers, reapers, cannons, tank drops, etc. In my play-testing, I didn't find anything obviously broken here around reaper access, cannon rushes from the 3rd, tank pushes with an elevator, etc, but obviously your opponent getting onto your high ground pod in force is bad for you. I see this a point of interesting space control that's not too imba.

Details
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Main

Nat

Other bases

Art

Changes
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v1.2+v1.3 - Aesthetic update, improved texture blending, changed doodads to clarify pathing esp at main and nat
v1.1 - Tightened main choke, changed nat choke from 11-wide with 2x2 debris assist to simple 9-wide.
v1.0 - Published

Meavis

Netherlands1300 Posts

December 12 2014 00:29 GMT

Suprised you made that wip work, doesnt look that bad but the man to nat, you should consider to make it sealable with 1forcefield probs for pvp

skdeimos

Canada155 Posts

December 12 2014 01:15 GMT

Oh man that pod with tanks can protect all three first bases in TvZ. I can imagine getting a few missile turrets and a few tanks on there being really, really strong.

Cool map, although the center seems a little boring. The expansion pattern is solid. I agree with Meavis on the main entrance. I think there's some positional imba though.

Kazahk

United States385 Posts

December 12 2014 04:39 GMT

IDK if horizontal spawns should be enabled as it could have some match-up dependent imbalances. Other than that it seems to be a very defensive macro oriented map. I love how many attack paths there are and the aesthetics look beautiful, like how the snow almost looks like dirty slush and stuff.

SwedenTheKid

567 Posts

December 12 2014 05:16 GMT

Looks great to me. Even though it can be a bit imba with asymmetric spawns, it's a 4 player rotational map, so it's kinda something you have to deal with. I think forcing players to play differently depending on spawns is a good thing. Love the snow. It's funny, since we posted our maps at the same time and they sound kinda similar.

Homonuncnunc

United States41 Posts

December 12 2014 05:48 GMT

On December 12 2014 10:15 skdeimos wrote:Cool map, although the center seems a little boring.

Agreed. Who was it that said the real benefit of having low mains is that you can have a 3-layer center? Missed opportunity there I think.

Other than that I like it. I liked the look of this map as it went through the WIP thread and main is interesting. I'm fond of the aesthetics as well. I always like well done snow, and snow on platforms looks good. Clever use of snow drifts!

OtherWorld

France17333 Posts

December 12 2014 07:21 GMT

That's a pretty cool map (not sure if the nat is Zerg-friendly though)

Xenotolerance

United States464 Posts

December 12 2014 23:27 GMT

Tanks can defend the natural very effectively but not so well the 3rd. Terran maybe not OP?

As for making the main entrance tighter, I'd actually tried it, but it's pretty funny: In order to keep aggressive wall-ins from being hilariously easy, I'd have to overuse no-building pathing or plates. Here are some screens of the puzzling I did on this:

Current entrance

Easy change, can be blocked with 1 FF

Let the QQ begin

We block the choke itself, but toss can still get an advantageous wall here

Sweet relief. Rather than plates, it may be better to use snow and ice to display that it's permanently non-buildable in the choke. Note that this last screenshot allows a wall-in on the inside of the plates, but that's more like walling at the top of a standard ramp entrance and is no big deal.

I had opted to use Tal'Darim's opening as a model, but given how much complaining there was over 4-gate on that map, I'm inclined to change my mind. Will make some edits...

As for the middle, it's true, it's an open center. There are no features there, no XNT, no crazy innovative high ground, and it's Boring, Oregon. 2/5. Now consider the following highly technical screenshots:

Now with a Nimbus-style XNT in the middle:

By 'ownage' I mean the open center forces certain decisions in all matchups:
(races listed clockwise, so TvZ is like above, ZvT is switched positions)
TvZ - standard flow is above. seems to make sense in current meta without much imba. zerg can expand away safely, terran has to be careful moving out but if they're too cautious zerg takes over the map. with a more closed center, zerg has a harder time defending pushes into the 4th and terran can kind of go anywhere they want: See current map pool.
ZvT - zerg has a harder time taking a 3rd since attack from terran is right there, 4more likely to force zerg to be more aggressive, and mutas are really good. Also note the low 3rd is only one tumor from natural creep. terran has an easy base flow. Terran can tank push above the nat, push down the tower and siege the natural geysers from high ground. possible T favored unless you consider 2-base timings from zerg which are really good. remember the rush distance is relatively short - roach busts own, but tanks are back, sooo... hard to say. The open center again lets zerg take good fights and surrounds despite unfavorable base flow - a tower would make tank pushes too strong here.
TvP - not much to say here. drops are good, protoss has lots of good places to take fights, so does terran, largely regardless of which bases are taken, though that does change the flow. Seems good. The open center lets terran have a space they can move into more safely - high ground or XNT would make it much harder for T to take good fights moving out from three bases.
PvT - same, though terran would be forced to take far 3rd. Also fine imo
PvZ - 2-base immortal timings are really good. the zerg has to make use of surrounds and towers to buy time. It might suffer in this matchup just from being a little short in the rush distance. But again, the open center gives zerg lots of good opportunities to surround, and if the toss takes a side path they're easily vulnerable to counterattack.
ZvP - Similar to ZvT, zerg is vulnerable to a push down the high ground but can take advantage of the middle for counterpressure. I think it's unlikely this matchup would go late in close positions but imo that's fine.

I wrote the above after thinking the map through more thoroughly - old version of above is spoilered
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What's the difference? Well the first one has a big red ownage on it. Aside from that, all I can tell you is I think open centers are anything but boring. There's not actually enough space for a 3rd layer, an XNT would make holding the center even better than it is now, and in any case, an open center makes for some surprisingly interesting choices one has to make for army movement. A maxed protoss deathball can get completely blindsided and surrounded if caught in the very center - this would not be possible without so much space (see the 2nd diagram above). So a large and / or slow army has to be careful about staying close to escape routes and ridges to avoid getting rocked in the open space, and I'm not interested in lessening this dynamic. Because it rules, imho, to have an open center, boring be damned.

(to be clear - I agree that the middle is kind of boring, but it's a fun kind of boring)

Thank you for your feedback everyone! Changes coming