[M] (2) Prophets Passage

Are those just LOS blocker going form main to natural? I feel like having 2 openings to main just isn't feasible.. 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 pool..Am I missing something?
Hehe I tried to edit, but you guys quoted me, it's all good. I played the map, it feels like it would be zerg favored, but not entirely sure I only played vs the computer haha. once you have 3 bases up it's way easier to hold than 2. Because when trying to defend only the main and nat, the attacker can bounce back and forth from easier than defender can.. not sure how I feel about that.

I dunno about only having 35 minerals each. I think they should either be blue patches, so it takes 7 harvests, or increase the mineral amount. Since there are LoS blockers on the inside, it's tough to know they're working on knocking down that door, and having the drones with the zerglings makes it even more of an all-in. It's probably not as imbalanced as I'm making it seem, it's just something that would be a nasty surprise for the defending player, and nasty surprises usually aren't fun.

The rest of the map looks really cool though. I love how there are several different expansion patterns you can take, based on your race and opening. The aesthetics are pretty neat, too.

It would take a long time for all 5 drones to mine through that as well. You'd definitely have time to get zealots/marines up, even if you didn't know it was coming.

I really like the orange lines and the aesthetic as a whole. The map feels very put together.

The natural is very open... I feel like it's too vulnerable for forge fast expands and 15cc, and too easy to bunker rush. Perhaps bringing it in just a little closer to the ramp? so that you can get that partial wall off with two 3x3 buildings and protect your pylon?

The high ground in the middle is also interesting, but it means that almost all the open areas where a zerg would normally want to engage are on the low ground... just something to consider.

wonderful layout, but i think there needs to be more space to maneuver, also the rock/snow works really well in some areas but others seems like too stark.

I dont like the back door too the main... I like the idea but I feel like the size of it makes it too small to be practical. Obviously there are alot of possibilities for getting hellions or lings into the main, but medivacs and drops will come out faster, and this passage will only be opened once you have a 3rd. It seems that you can use it defensively, but I think that the entrance is too small because running your units into that small of a choke is going to be disadvantageous for you. I would like to hear your take on it tho. I love the aesthetics on this map, and how creative you are being really stretching your map to the limit. Those are my two cents keep up the inspiring work!

Make sure you manually test the warp in possibility very thoroughly at both bases. Sometimes you can drop a zealot in right at the near edge of the LosB, which would grant vision on the other side as soon as it was finished warping -> move a skosh.

Also that is plainly light colored sand not snow. ;D

I like it in general, I don't like the chokiness in the middle and at the middle bases, and I'm not sure how much the back door really adds given that the defensive dynamic doesn't change much either way if you have natural and 3rd. The natural unwallableness (that's a word!) is fine by me but I'm not sure you can convince SC2dom at large.

But all those things are cool, and worth trying out. I would just simplify those highground things with ramps on either side of middle. Shorten by one diagonal quantum and get rid of the jutting side platforms--or something. Also the holes around the cliff of the main, I would fill that in to create a little more width along that lowground channel that feeds into the base next to center. I would. (meh)

Very eye-catching aesthetics, nicely done! Quite a map to show up with.

Interesting dynamic, very original as always

HOWEVER, you need to test your model VERY THOROUGHLY before publishing it. 35 minerals isn't alot- an all in sixpool handles that nicely. You need to make it so that at least 10 or so harvesters are required to clear one patch. Cause If I get sixpooled with all drones....

Also- I would think about making the foreword base HY. Double also, I haven't stalked you in a while. How have you been ^^

This is violently good o____o

Although I'd definitely 6-pool with drones every single game ^^ I think those bloacking min patches should really contain more than 35.

Eh, I may kinda regret wasting my 5k post, but the proximity of that mineral blocker to that gas reminded me of a certain old BW game...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDNMvEVtInA

Basically, Flash used a Refinery to exchange his SCVs' minerals for gas so that they could return to mine those blocking minerals. Perhaps that may work on this map?

While it would be cool, it's not actually as epic as in BW because you can shift queue the mining directly between the geyser and the minerals (I think the geyser building needs to finish before the shift queue back to the geyser is taken as a harvest command, but I could be wrong -- it's been a while since I've messed with it) like 5 times. So really, with just 30 conscutive clicks, you could mine out that whole wall and not even have to keep tabs on it while you built up your army, scouted, etc.

Also, have you considered mineral patch stacking? Two mule trips and that wall is breached. If you want to force 5 trips per patch you should make them each 7 minerals or less (since they are high yield), then select them all, go to the object properties, and choose ignore placement restrictions. Then copy and paste the group directly over the first group 4 more times. This method will allow for a little more possibilty for "epic" plays since you could send 15 workers across the map and mine out the whole section in one fell swoop thereby creating a tense situation where the workers could be scouted and picked off before opening the hole. Anyway, just something to think about.

It seems to me you can fix the LOS blocker/mineral wall issue by turning one of the high ground pods into a pathable, buildable area with a ramp into the main. Then you could build a scout pylon or depot to keep an eye on the mineral wall. The enemy couldn't hurt it without a flying unit giving vision, which would negate the LOS blockers anyway.

I also agree that it's going to be very hard to have 2 bases on this map.

The map looks really nice and the idea behind the mineral-blocked backdoor is awesome, but there's a problem with the natural. The method you used to wall off is impractical: it's easy to roach/baneling bust and a single cannon doesn't cover all the mineral patches. I would suggest putting destructible rocks at the second entrance to the natural so the choke can be walled off without using the nexus.

Another concern would be opponents taking the long path to get to the third, allowing easy siege of the natural. You might want to separate the third from the natural a bit more.

"Space for 510 CC's" that is just hilarious! hahaha

Anyone want to test out the 6 pool on the map?

I like this. It's turning what we were originally thinking of as the natural into a third. That justifies making it so much harder to hold.

My only concern right now is the 6th base (yeah a little late-game I know). The natural is now safely tucked in the back, and the third is right out front. But the 4th and 5th are both in a line from the natural, which leaves the 6th awkwardly stuck on the far side of the map.

Not sure if I have a solution for you right now, but I'm imagining that that 6th would be mighty underutilized...

I actually like those dynamics less than the old. With the minerals being moved, I see them coming into play much later in the game now, at a time players are likely to have that third already, removing a lot of the excitement/danger of them. I think its still an awesome map, and I havent the faintest what to do myself, but my gut reaction is that a lot of the danger is lost with the new configuration

Assuming you can't gain vision past the minerals, I like the change. The backdoor's no longer an issue early game but it's a viable means of, for example, busting a FFE as zerg. The Protoss sees the mineral fields dropping and has to get cannons there in time. In principle, that's great.

In practice there are still problems. If the defending player only has the main and the back door expansion, it's faster for the attacking player to get from ramp to ramp. The defending player has to go nearly twice the distance with their units to be able to hold off the attacker. Much like the back door on blistering sands. It's getting better but it still needs some work.

i like the mineral block, but unsure if it will really be of any use.

but i really like the map. i think the only thing to change is make the outside natural 1 gas and 5 patches so you cant just camp off 3 bases.

This is considerably different and also very interesting for new reasons. I like it, and I like it much better I think. ^^

The new ramps with rocks are a good addition for better flow in the lategame to compensate for the somewhat tight areas at the hotspots. The general twistiness of the pathways is just right for the map's style, and doesn't take it too far.

That was kind of a bold choice to add that water ditch to cut off the low ground connection to the back door ramp. But it's definitely the right call. I love the tension now between the front small 3rd (which feeds you into the center small 4th) compared to opening the back door and taking a full fledge 3rd that is farther away from the enemy but also more distant for you, and more vulnerable spatially.

The progression of expansions has a nice curve of more demanding map presence, and there are lots of interesting places for army dances or army standoffs throughout the phases of a game.

The only little thing I'd like to see changed (that I can think of)... since the towers currently don't cover the main route, it'd be nice if there was a small high ground pod where you could park a unit to watch for enemy push coming through the middle. You already have those pillars with crystals on top next to the watch tower. This makes them bad overlord spots because tower vision will just reveal them anyway. Why not make these pathable with a small ramp? That way it becomes useful tactical terrain, as well as an excellent place that gives you a lookout spot over the middle path -- like a mini watch tower, but significantly apart from the tower vision despite the proximity.

Okay I lied there is one more change except it's not a nitpick, it's pretty important. You need to adjust the choke to the backdoor natural somehow, because right now it's automatic cannon walloff spot in PvZ. Maybe the whole choke + 1-2 tiles around it should be unbuildable (but allow creep)? Or just use checkerboard LosB around there? I think I like those better than a parade of sunken depots.

Really curious to hear what other people think about the new version, nice work. ;D