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Dark Colossus
Version 1.0:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/jj7z9l.jpg)
High Resolution: here
Map Analyzer Images:+ Show Spoiler +
Changes:
- Slightly opened choke to the close expansion.
- Slightly increased size of ramp below the top left expo and above the bottom right expo.
- Moved large halo doodad.
Tournaments:
- PolaCup #1
Initial Comments:
Hey all. I've dabbled in mapping before during the beta, but after a few months of watching many pro games and playing Random on the ladder (1800 Diamond, btw), I feel I've got a rudimentary grasp of how certain races benefit from certain map features and how entertaining games come about based on map features. I decided to try my hand at designing a fairly large 2-player melee map.
Previous Versions:
Version 0.1: + Show Spoiler +
Version 0.2: + Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/mmVvLl.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3oggQl.jpg) Map Analyzer:+ Show Spoiler +Changes: - Widened ramps to the top left and bottom right expansions. - Added Destructible Rocks on the paths that lead to the opponent's corner base. - Terrain mostly finished. - Doodads partially completed.
Version 0.35:+ Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/vPXSkl.jpg) Changes: - Refined high ground accessible through the natural. - Destructible rocks blocking access to the top left and lower right expansions have been removed. - Xelnaga watch tower has been relocated. It is also surrounded with LOS Blockers. - Ramps to the low ground near the corner expansions have been extended. - Small ledge jutting from the main near the ramp to the natural has been removed. + 0.05: - Expanded size of main. - Put 10 pairs of minerals with 1 mineral each in the long, narrow path. - Considering removing the thin, narrow path entirely as it was originally a way to access the corner base directly from the main, but the corner expos are not as well-defended or crucial as they used to be. Map Analyzer Images: + Show Spoiler +
Version 0.45: + Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/883/darkcolossus.png) Changes: - Removed backdoor path to the corner expansions. - Increased size of the mains. - Increased size of the "inner" ramps near the jagged terrain. - Rebalanced positions. - More doodad work. 0.05: - Finished doodad work. - Cleaned up map textures. Map Analyzer Images:+ Show Spoiler +
Version 0.5:+ Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/poxLCl.jpg) High Resolution: hereMap Analyzer Images:+ Show Spoiler +Changes: - Major, major changes to map layout. - Close third now has two gas and 6 mineral patches. - Corner expansions are now on the 2nd cliff level instead of the 3rd. - Small low ground area connecting to the corner expansions from the 2nd level is now reachable from the center. - Center area opened up and LOS blockers removed. - Small ramps connecting center to the high grounds outside of the corner expansions. - LOS blockers cutting off the high grounds outside of the corner expansions from the expansions themselves.
Version 0.6: + Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qUjZml.jpg) High Resolution: hereMap Analyzer Images:+ Show Spoiler +Album Link: hereChanges: - Moved corner bases away from the push path and pushed the corners of the map out. - Added Destructible Rocks on the wide ramp the the high ground. - Narrowed various paths to create semi-chokes. - Increased size of the natural choke. - Added LOS blockers around the high yield bases. - Doubled up LOS blockers near the corner bases and around the path to the corner bases. Notes:I paid special attention to the "defensive arc" required to hold the third base and realized that the needed army presence to hold the corner base was simply too spread out. Thus, the Destructible Rocks. Also, I narrowed various paths to semi-chokes, which makes either the close third or the corner third viable choices with similar required defensive arcs. Holding both at the same time, however, is very difficult to do. If this becomes an issue I'll consider repositioning high ground locations or the bases entirely.
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A few notables.
I think the rich minerals are not really worth taking since it only provides three patches, While 8 patches yield more income and deplete less faster but still giving the same amount of income.
While the bottom and top pillars might look good and provide Spectator value, I don't think its realistic and fitting the map. But im not sure if you can walk there tough. (Being a space platform). Also your saying it favors harrassment for air, Does this mean terran Banshee will be quite powerfull?
However you can be free to disagree.
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On December 07 2010 23:22 BuuGhost wrote:
A few notables.
I think the rich minerals are not really worth taking since it only provides three patches, While 8 patches yield more income and deplete less faster but still giving the same amount of income.
While the bottom and top pillars might look good and provide Spectator value, I don't think its realistic and fitting the map. But im not sure if you can walk there tough. (Being a space platform). Also your saying it favors harrassment for air, Does this mean terran Banshee will be quite powerfull?
However you can be free to disagree.
Thanks for the feedback 
There are 6 patches at the rich mineral bases and the geysers are rich geysers. The pock-marked areas of the map are not pathable, as indicated in the map analyzer.
Also, all of the easily harassable areas are expansions only. The main and natural are not affected in any special way.
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United Kingdom580 Posts
Good map, it seams quite an open map so mabye add a few more choaks/ destructable rocks so that zerg dont have to much of an advantage, also i dont think you should widen any of the ramps. i feel that the 3rd is vunrable becasue you need to be able to defend the chock at ur nat and the wide area next to the third. However there are a couple of small choaks so im not sure how it would play out, and if terran/toss would 2 base timing push much on it. Anyway i would really like to play on this map cos it seams quite a good map (and im zerg so i like those 2 paths to the opponents 3rd).
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The two thin paths to the satellite bases - are those covered by two destructible rocks each? If so, the first rock is behind a mineral patch (or so it appears) that presumably has a low quantity and needs to be mined before the rocks can be busted and headway can be made to get over to the satellite base. If all these things are true, keep in mind that this makes the rocks most easily busted by Terran as melee units (core DPS of Zerg and Protoss) are unable to hit the rocks early on.
I like the even ground chokes near the natural. While Kulas Ravine was a poor map overall, I feel that the even ground chokes provide a unique defensive feel to maps that allows for more creative strategies and more offensive play than ramp chokes.
I like the high ground next to these even ground chokes as it allows Terran to still utilize a defensive tank, but doesn't necessarily prevent well executed pushes. I'm curious - how many tiles of dead space in between the even ground choke and the neighboring high ground? It looks like somewhere around 6-7. You may want to shrink this just a little bit to allow some ranged units to hit tanks positioned too closely to the edge on the high ground if they have a spotting unit or a scan. I think this forces tanks to recess themselves slightly, still being able to hit the entirity of the choke area, but unable to fire into the mineral lines or too far into the Xel'Naga area - not firing into the mineral lines allows run-bys but also prevents tank splash from killing your own workers.
I think the watchtowers might provide just a little too much vision, heavily benefiting a Zerg player in the early game. The watchtower is highly favored to the defending player and provides complete ground vision of ALL useful attack paths. This essentially gives a Zerg player an absolutely risk-free scouting setup for only 25 minerals, as the Zerg doesn't need to put Overlords in any ranged-vulnerable positions to spot incoming attacks. I think this is by far the greatest imbalance on the map and would heavily urge you to adjust it - perhaps two way entry to the Xel'Naga, perhaps moving the watchtower to the low ground, or perhaps just rethinking the positioning of the Xel'Naga in general. If a Protoss or Terran player can send in 1-3 units to take the Xel'Naga immediately prior to an offensive push, that fixes the problem - however if the position is so indefensible for the aggressor (e.g. the push can't arrive in a remotely timely fashion to protect the 1-3 units) due to the only ramp facing the defender at +2 height from the attack terrain, it greatly reduces the ability to perform a successful early attack on Zerg - a necessity in the current metagame.
All in all I do like the map, once things settle down closer to the holidays I plan to begin hosting regular tournaments. If you were able to make some small corrections, I could definitely see this map having potential for our map pool if you're interested.
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seeing this map, banshees pop into my mind
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@ Polatrite: Thanks for looking at my map! You bring up an interesting point about the high ground. I'll implement some changes after testing tank range on the high ground against other ranged units. Also, you bring up a very true point about the Xelnaga watch towers. I'll include these adjustments in iteration 0.3. Oh, and it would be very cool if you'd consider my map to be included in your map pool 
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not enough bases, this wont help zerg much at all on this map, and favors terran as they can lift off and take the gold with old expo. i fear this map is too camp freindley.
quick quetion what are seig tanks like on the Xel naga tower?
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Quick question, the green stuff is the LOS blocker right? the green dots
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@njAI: Yes, the green lights are LOS blockers
@TibblesEvilCat: I have since adjusted the sizes of the high ground areas in the natural, relocated the Xelnaga watchtowers, and removed the Destructible Rocks. Zerg should be able to take a gas third much more easily now and Siege Tanks should be able to exert much less control over the possible attack routes. Also, said attack routes have been widened to allow more room for maneuvering. I'll see if I can fit more bases into the map, since it is rather short on expansions.
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The map is large with long rush distances which usually mean a macro game, yet there is only one viable expansion. The expo marked as the third in the analyzer images is mineral only and quite open, the gold is difficult to secure, and the other expansion is blocked by rocks. Taking a third seems difficult.
The main seems small. You could easily expand it's size into the dead area you made. And of course that area makes air attacks all the more effective. I guess that's what you wanted though. Also, the natural minerals don't have any space behind them to defend from air harass.
I'm not sure how much that long and narrow path to the main will be used. It seems difficult to access with 2 rocks and a mineral patch blocking it. Small sneak attack groups won't be able to easily take out the blockers and it's too long and narrow for large armies.
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On December 08 2010 06:29 BoomStevo wrote:
The map is large with long rush distances which usually mean a macro game, yet there is only one viable expansion. The expo marked as the third in the analyzer images is mineral only and quite open, the gold is difficult to secure, and the other expansion is blocked by rocks. Taking a third seems difficult.
The main seems small. You could easily expand it's size into the dead area you made. And of course that area makes air attacks all the more effective. I guess that's what you wanted though. Also, the natural minerals don't have any space behind them to defend from air harass.
I'm not sure how much that long and narrow path to the main will be used. It seems difficult to access with 2 rocks and a mineral patch blocking it. Small sneak attack groups won't be able to easily take out the blockers and it's too long and narrow for large armies.
Yeah I noticed the problems you're talking about right now, so I've removed the rocks.
About the long and narrow path: Small units like Zerglings, workers, and Marines can bypass the rocks at the expansion. The really key thing is that workers will automatically mine from the mineral patch that blocks the rocks in the main. This will cause the rocks in the main to become accessible after a certain amount of time has passed, assuming players don't actively avoid or target that patch.
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On December 08 2010 06:48 LunarC wrote:
Yeah I noticed the problems you're talking about right now, so I've removed the rocks.
About the long and narrow path: Small units like Zerglings, workers, and Marines can bypass the rocks at the expansion. The really key thing is that workers will automatically mine from the mineral patch that blocks the rocks in the main. This will cause the rocks in the main to become accessible after a certain amount of time has passed, assuming players don't actively avoid or target that patch.
Just noticed version 0.3 without the rocks right after I posted.
So my workers at my main will actively try to mine the patch that keeps my base safer? I would definitely want to keep my workers from mining it, and I don't want to be wasting APM to keep workers off that one patch.
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On December 08 2010 06:53 BoomStevo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2010 06:48 LunarC wrote:
Yeah I noticed the problems you're talking about right now, so I've removed the rocks.
About the long and narrow path: Small units like Zerglings, workers, and Marines can bypass the rocks at the expansion. The really key thing is that workers will automatically mine from the mineral patch that blocks the rocks in the main. This will cause the rocks in the main to become accessible after a certain amount of time has passed, assuming players don't actively avoid or target that patch. Just noticed version 0.3 without the rocks right after I posted. So my workers at my main will actively try to mine the patch that keeps my base safer? I would definitely want to keep my workers from mining it, and I don't want to be wasting APM to keep workers off that one patch.
I'll place the Destructible Rocks on the other side of the mineral patch to keep them from automatically mining it in the next iteration. Also, I have expanded the size of the main.
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Wow man, this map is really good, I would like to see it in the GSL. I must say though Banshees do seem very powerful on this map. Perhaps make it so that Banshees can't just retreat over into space behind mineral lines. Other than that good job.
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Normally I do not comment on maps, but this one compels me to. I had seen an older version, and did not like it so much, but this one is really do like. It has some ..taste..flavor..flair.., a certain something which gives me the feeling that a game an this map might be interesting, and also, from an roll playing point of view, to be worth to fight over.
After poring over the high-res map for some 15 minutes I wanted to make comments which I notices Barrin did address already(and in a very constructive way), but I make them anyways:
- The two gold bases feel too close to eayh other from a gameplay point of view. line of sight blockers should fix that.
-the entry to the natural should open up more, so that an attacker can get a better arc.
-the third(base close to main) should be a bit less exposed in direction of the opponent. A CC, nexus or hatch there seriously restricts the movement of the defender in high food battles, so a somewhat smaller entrance balances things out
-the corner bases could be moved slightly more out of the way, so that they offer the opportunity for a hidden base. also that would open up the option to "expand far away" for a zerg player
-I somehow like the idea of a typical attack to arrive in front of the natural via the lowground middle, so that one can try to cut between natural and third. however not playing the map makes this a purely theoretical idea
-the green area in barrins post seems a bit odd to me as well. however a have mixed feelings with his suggestions. it could be that that issue resolves itself if the corresponding bases were farther away, as I suggested.
Oh, and do not take what I said as an educated opinion, as I am not experienced enough with sc2 map making.
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I dont like how easy to defend the natural is. But i like the little loop mechanic around the middle area.
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Dark Colossus Version 0.6 posted.
OP updated.
Changes:
- Moved corner bases away from the push path and pushed the corners of the map out.
- Added Destructible Rocks on the wide ramp the the high ground.
- Narrowed various paths to create semi-chokes.
- Increased size of the natural choke.
- Added LOS blockers around the high yield bases.
- Doubled up LOS blockers near the corner bases and around the path to the corner bases.
Notes:
I paid special attention to the "defensive arc" required to hold the third base and realized that the needed army presence to hold the corner base was simply too spread out. Thus, the Destructible Rocks. Also, I narrowed various paths to semi-chokes, which makes either the close third or the corner third viable choices with similar required defensive arcs.
Holding both at the same time, however, is very difficult to do. If this becomes an issue I'll consider repositioning high ground locations or the bases entirely.
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