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Nailath
Canada4 Posts
My questions is, is there a way to get around this? If you care to know about my situation, read on. I was playing a game of Phantom Mode (great map) and some player was accusing me of 'teaming' which I wasn't, and we started to argue and I raged on him. I said some things that I normally wouldn't have. He was just being very very dumb. I'm sure I won't be unbanned if I messaged the map maker. Thank you for your time, Nailath | ||
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awu25
United States2003 Posts
if you were banned why would you still be able to join/start the game | ||
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Nightmarjoo
United States3360 Posts
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Nailath
Canada4 Posts
On November 07 2010 15:50 awu25 wrote: lol i don't think you can even do this if you were banned why would you still be able to join/start the game I'm not all that sure how it works to be honest, I think it's something to do with the triggers. He puts my name and code into some list, the triggers check for players in the game (after 2 minutes) and it drops players on the list that are in the game. That's just my un-educated guess. I'm just looking for a workaround for it. | ||
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awu25
United States2003 Posts
On November 07 2010 15:54 Nailath wrote: I'm not all that sure how it works to be honest, I think it's something to do with the triggers. He puts my name and code into some list, the triggers check for players in the game (after 2 minutes) and it drops players on the list that are in the game. That's just my un-educated guess. I'm just looking for a workaround for it. well unless that guy was the original mapmaker, there's no way it could happen even if it was him, i'm still skeptical | ||
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Trion
Canada291 Posts
Maybe you should start with figuring out how it is possible to be banned, and how you were banned? | ||
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Nailath
Canada4 Posts
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Nightmarjoo
United States3360 Posts
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
In Wc3, it only required something similar to... function HG takes nothing returns boolean return(GetPlayerName(Player(5))==" ")or(GetPlayerName(Player(5))==" ") call CustomDefeatBJ(Player(5),"Defeated") endfunction kind of useless since they can just make another account or they can create some triggers to desync you... | ||
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Antiochus
Canada548 Posts
There is however a silver lining to all this as this is a problem with only one real solution. You need to remake the map except somehow better then the original and get it really popular so its at the top of the game list. At this point you have 2 options, enjoy life and take the highroad with your new and improved version and/or ban the maker of the other phantom map along with the guy who reported you out of spite. | ||
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levophed
United States7 Posts
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
In Wc3, you can make a trigger that also forces Wc3 to exit/endgame/skip score screen/disable replay ( the latter three are native functions so it was intended when they made the game ) call EndGame(false) ( this one is still in SC2 if someone wanted to add it ) // this would force the player to go back to windows, no fatal error is given so it's kind of "WTF" for the player since that'd normally only happen if their game crashed function ExitWarcraft takes nothing returns nothing loop call ExecuteFunc("ExitWarcraft") endloop endfunction function SendExit takes player p returns nothing if p==GetLocalPlayer()then call ExecuteFunc("ExitWarcraft") endif endfunction | ||
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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kyrshiro
United States3 Posts
C:\Users\Kyrshiro\Documents\StarCraft II\Accounts\843236\1-S2-1-266760\Banks Go through a path that looks like that one of the folders should contain the "bank" file used by Starcraft 2 to save data from custom maps Depending on how many custom maps you've played that save variables you could have anywhere from 1 to any number of folders containing these files. You really just have to guess. It might be labeled something obvious like "PhantomBan.SC2Bank" but I don't know. | ||
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
probably a mapmaker made trigger | ||
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Trang
Australia324 Posts
On November 07 2010 16:29 Nailath wrote: He is the original map maker. Apparently people send in the replays, he reviews them, and if he doesn't like what he sees (such as 'teaming' or whatever else he doesn't like) he bans them. I don't know how, but he does. Essentially banned people just can't play the map any more. Aw shucks, for real? I 'team' all the time in Phantom with my friends. The fun part though is that most the time we lie to each other about whether we're the Phantom, and a lot of backstabbing diplomacy goes on, lol. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On November 07 2010 20:11 Trang wrote: Aw shucks, for real? I 'team' all the time in Phantom with my friends. The fun part though is that most the time we lie to each other about whether we're the Phantom, and a lot of backstabbing diplomacy goes on, lol. aint that what phantoms all about? | ||
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thekibk
United States116 Posts
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Nailath
Canada4 Posts
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
He also doesn't need to "ban" you, but he could use a similar trigger with GetPlayerName== to disable your chat messages. ( This only works in SC2 and there's a map that uses it ) +give all your units negative regeneration or something similar to -kick name + some action that follows it or he could be lying to you so he wouldn't have to unban you | ||
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Eiviyn
United Kingdom169 Posts
![[image loading]](http://img155.imageshack.us/i/playername.jpg/) Note that it isn't possible to choose the player name variable. You also may only call a player's name by "Text" value, whereas nearly every game function uses "String", and they deliberately made it impossible to convert from Text to String, I've seen people spending hours on a workaround to this to no avail (as this also prevents a few other less nefarious things...). Now, there is a way to get around this, but it's very simple to break and also pretty complex (the Phantom map isn't a very complex map, so I honestly doubt the creator knows how to do this in the first place). You can assign a player a number key and then store this key in their bank file. The number key cannot correlate to their username for the above reason. As a result, the fix is easy; clear your sc2 bank files. If the problem persists then the issue is definitely local. | ||
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PhantomInfernal
1 Post
Now, there is a way to get around this, but it's very simple to break and also pretty complex (the Phantom map isn't a very complex map, so I honestly doubt the creator knows how to do this in the first place). It isn't complex at all, and it saddens me you think I'm that bad at map making that I wouldn't be able to figure it out. Yes, Phantom Mode stores a bank file on the banned player's computer, and yes it is very easy to unban yourself, that is until Blizzard allows server side bank storage, and then it will be impossible. You are also a little cocky to be honest, claiming banks to be complex and then offering an unnecessarily complex way of doing a banning system with them. You don't need to assign them a number key or anything like that, you just need to check if the bank exists at all, and if so, remove them from the game. This is far more efficient and also makes it so players can't edit the file, but are forced to remove it entirely (I realize this is just as easy, but many players don't know that). Just so everyone knows the original poster is not banned, in fact I have never even played with the original poster to ban him. Ask him to post a replay of playing with me and me banning him if you don't believe it. Another way to be sure he isn't banned is that bans happen 5 seconds into the game, not 2 minutes like he is claiming. This is most likely just a case of him dropping from the game for some unknown reason. I move to find the maker of this map's TeamLiquid account and IP ban him from TL to see how he feels Fine with me, I have never been to this site before, and will never be back. The only reason I came here is because one of you went to the official forums and posted about this. If you can't play my map without teaming, cheating, or griefing other players, find another Phantom map to play. Also for everyone's information what the original poster claims is actually impossible. If I think you are teaming I always ask you if you are teaming to be sure, and won't ban you unless you or your friend admits it. Most people don't realize they are playing with the map maker, and tend to be honest about this. | ||
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PinkPrincess
United States149 Posts
On November 10 2010 03:29 PhantomInfernal wrote: Fine with me, I have never been to this site before, and will never be back. The only reason I came here is because one of you went to the official forums and posted about this. If you can't play my map without teaming, cheating, or griefing other players, find another Phantom map to play. Some random poster doesn't have access to ban you anyway. People don't have some good workaround for the string/text conversion issue? Also I think it's awesome that you can ban people from your map. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
On November 10 2010 03:29 PhantomInfernal wrote: Yes you can't compare player names to a string, which means you can't use a player name for bans, however this wasn't the reason it was done by Blizzard at all. Blizzard did this because text isn't localized, this was done by Blizzard to make it easier to convert the game into different languages. They have said that they intend to allow map makers to convert at the very least player names in the future, don't believe everything you read here, this was not a step taken to prevent banning. It isn't complex at all, and it saddens me you think I'm that bad at map making that I wouldn't be able to figure it out. Yes, Phantom Mode stores a bank file on the banned player's computer, and yes it is very easy to unban yourself, that is until Blizzard allows server side bank storage, and then it will be impossible. You are also a little cocky to be honest, claiming banks to be complex and then offering an unnecessarily complex way of doing a banning system with them. You don't need to assign them a number key or anything like that, you just need to check if the bank exists at all, and if so, remove them from the game. This is far more efficient and also makes it so players can't edit the file, but are forced to remove it entirely (I realize this is just as easy, but many players don't know that). Just so everyone knows the original poster is not banned, in fact I have never even played with the original poster to ban him. Ask him to post a replay of playing with me and me banning him if you don't believe it. Another way to be sure he isn't banned is that bans happen 5 seconds into the game, not 2 minutes like he is claiming. This is most likely just a case of him dropping from the game for some unknown reason. Fine with me, I have never been to this site before, and will never be back. The only reason I came here is because one of you went to the official forums and posted about this. If you can't play my map without teaming, cheating, or griefing other players, find another Phantom map to play. Also for everyone's information what the original poster claims is actually impossible. If I think you are teaming I always ask you if you are teaming to be sure, and won't ban you unless you or your friend admits it. Most people don't realize they are playing with the map maker, and tend to be honest about this. Seriously get off your high horse. You should be happy people play your map, not banning people for stupid shit. If they want to team up, let them. Who cares? It's not ranked or anything... | ||
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10366 Posts
Edit: Ah, cool the mapmaker posted here. Well good to know apparently a ban isn't the case. @Diamond I think you're being a bit arrogant and harsh here, he said he didn't band him. So why are you criticizing him as if he does ban people for "stupid shit"? And "who cares"? I do. And I'm sure a lot of other phantom players who want to play fairly and not be roflpwned by a group of friends that decide to join. It's like playing a custom melee 4v4 where 2 of the enemies are actually friends and just purposefully help the other team. It's not ranked, but it wastes the 2 enemies' time, and that's unfair. People should be allowed to play the game as intended. Edit 2: Oh I see, even though he asks to make sure they are teaming before possibly banning them, I don't think even that is the best way to go about banning... because what if they say they are teaming but are just decepting you? But I guess it won't matter once the game finishes and Infernal can decide if there was abuse. ***** OLD: I think Blizzard should really look into this. How can the mapmaker tell if you were "teaming"? In order to team, you have to talk with people. In ally chat, usually for Phantom Mode. He can't see those chats. So what is something "bad" that he may see? A couple players killing off others regardless of whether or not they were Phantoms? How does he knows this was teaming? May be they thought and believed the other was not a Phantom and therefore went after someone they thought was the phantom. And if he wasn't , may be they went after another. And another. Really don't see a way he can possibly tell if someone is "cheating". I don't want to see custom games being abused again, auto kick and autoban in WC3 was already a terrible experience. | ||
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CowFu
United States35 Posts
On November 10 2010 06:24 iCCup.Diamond wrote: Seriously get off your high horse. You should be happy people play your map, not banning people for stupid shit. If they want to team up, let them. Who cares? It's not ranked or anything... I'm going to play his map now that I found out he's banning people. My biggest problem with customs is the high level of griefers/teamers (in non team games)/glitchers. If he found a way to keep those people from playing it's much more appealing to me. | ||
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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Nixda
119 Posts
On November 10 2010 07:11 Barrin wrote: Anyone who's played real player vs player mmo's knows what I'm talkin about for sure... Feluccia Ultima Online anyone? ^^ Oldschool UO even, before that stupid Trammel/Fellucca split, those were the days ^^ If only they still had a game like this around.. But I don't want to draw this off-topic - might a bug in the map coding be the reason ? It's been a while since I last played that Sotis map, but I remember nearly always seeing one or more players drop at the beginning, and then I had the map crash on me in the begining once so I assumed that was the reason the others dropped as well. | ||
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TheFinalWord
Australia790 Posts
On November 07 2010 20:11 Trang wrote: Aw shucks, for real? I 'team' all the time in Phantom with my friends. The fun part though is that most the time we lie to each other about whether we're the Phantom, and a lot of backstabbing diplomacy goes on, lol. So much hating on the map maker, If you've played phantom you may realise that alot of people (myself included) really hate it when you've figured out who the phantom is and then 2 slayers start teamkilling everyone because they dont want their friend to die. I think the mapmaker has every right to ban people who ruin the game for everyone else. In your case op, depending on what you did I guess, he might have made a mistake and I would try and message him somehow and ask him politely to unban you. When I say "teaming" sucks, I'm not talking about what trang does, I also enjoy playing with friends, but stacking the odds just makes the game really bad. Note I love phantom mode and if the map maker is reading this thanks alot.  I didnt know banning was possible and I might send some of my replays where people were teaming. It also finally makes sense to me why it seemed like every time I played someone left at the start lol. | ||
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Shudder
Canada6 Posts
I haven't even played Phantom, but if you are banning people who are legitimately trying to ruin the experience for others, well done mapmaker. | ||
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Nightmarjoo
United States3360 Posts
It's really easy for your game experience to get ruined in a game like phantom, simply by having things turn out differently than how you expected. You can be a slayer and get killed by another slayer who wasn't teaming, and your game experience is ruined. You can identify the phantom, try to kill him, and have everyone gang up on you and kill you even though you're doing the right thing. That's how phantom works! No one plays phantom with a friend for the sole sake of "ruining" the game, they play it to have fun together. Who is the author to say who gets to play his map and who doesn't? Why does he get to decide the kind of experience the players get out of it? Blizzard has made it quite clear that a map maker does not own his map. Be grateful so many people play your map. We're not talking about cheating or hacking, we're only talking about diplomacies that any of the players in the game are capable of making. You think friends in a phantom game never lie to eachother, and never fight eachother? You'd be wrong. | ||
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Aelip
Denmark321 Posts
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On November 13 2010 06:03 Aelip wrote: "Teaming" seems like an entertaining aspect of the game. If i were the mapmaker i'd embrace it, encourage it. USE IT! It adds so much more to the game. But oh well. as far as i can tell, a concept of teaming basically is the whole game :/ | ||
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sikyon
Canada1045 Posts
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awu25
United States2003 Posts
On November 16 2010 02:19 sikyon wrote: I support mapmakers banning people. Frankly I don't know what kind of a right people think they have when playing these things. Someone spends a ton of time making a map, it becomes popular, they support and update it, and people enjoy playing it. And then people come in and ruin the game experience for everyone else because they want to do stupid things. Why shouldn't they be banned? Anonymity breeds immature behavior and frankly turns people into irrational assholes when given without reason. it's all cool until you play with the mapmakers friend and you some how piss him off mapmaker's friend goes to mapmaker and tells him to ban this newb (you) now you've been banned for no reason and can never play that game again too much power to the mapmakers as some mapmakers can be immature like that | ||
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sikyon
Canada1045 Posts
On November 16 2010 03:00 awu25 wrote: it's all cool until you play with the mapmakers friend and you some how piss him off mapmaker's friend goes to mapmaker and tells him to ban this newb (you) now you've been banned for no reason and can never play that game again too much power to the mapmakers as some mapmakers can be immature like that So what? Did you make the map? No. Is the mapmaker being paid to make the map? No. What right do you have to play a game that the mapmaker has made? When someone else makes something, it's theirs, not yours, fullstop. When a mapmaker makes a map it's both theirs and blizzard's for being made on the starcraft engine. To give an example, suppose I buy MATLAB programming package. Does this mean I get access to all the code anyone has ever distributed that's written in MATLAB? Of course not. If you like playing great games, go write your own. | ||
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Vanished131
France311 Posts
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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Eiviyn
United Kingdom169 Posts
On November 16 2010 04:34 Vanished131 wrote: Sadly with banks, a map maker could actually ban you permanently. Then you can delete your bank and unban yourself. I went into specifics over why you can't be banned in my post near the top of page 2. There is currently no way to store an offending username in a map file with the aim of removing them from the game if they try to play. | ||
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Vanished131
France311 Posts
On November 16 2010 16:50 Eiviyn wrote: Then you can delete your bank and unban yourself. I went into specifics over why you can't be banned in my post near the top of page 2. There is currently no way to store an offending username in a map file with the aim of removing them from the game if they try to play. Agreed. But when battle.net 0.2 implements server banks, what will you do then? | ||
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Chriamon
United States886 Posts
On November 10 2010 08:44 Barrin wrote: To elaborate on my previous post: The way I always saw Phantom was you literally had to team up with your "slayer" friends to beat the Phantom. And the Phantom is the fucking phantom, you don't know who he is. For all you know the "slayer(s)" you just allied with to kill the "phantom" could indeed be the phantom himself! You never know what's going through people's heads and when they're convinced who's the phantom and who's not, especially when it is to the slayer's benefit to not let the phantom know that they know. + Show Spoiler + Then you would know that they know you know... or do they? As for friends that team up premeditatively (that's not actually a word but who cares), that just makes it all the more satisfying when you smash their faces in IMO. I hope you didn't miss that side of gaming either  While it should be the case that teaming up is necessary to beat the phantom, there are many lobbies i get into where i see everyone else is bronze, and I am the only diamond level player there. Everyone ends up playing terrible except 1 person, who is obviously the phantom. I think the good vs evil mode does a much better job of avoiding this, as there are 2 phantoms and 2 paladins, making it much harder to narrow down the phantoms. | ||
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Eiviyn
United Kingdom169 Posts
Agreed. But when battle.net 0.2 implements server banks, what will you do then? Me, as a mapper? Thank God that I don't have to spend hours reading how to encrypt data and learn how to implement it just to store simple, progressive data entries like a persistent scoreboard. | ||
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Vanished131
France311 Posts
On November 18 2010 05:30 Eiviyn wrote: Me, as a mapper? Thank God that I don't have to spend hours reading how to encrypt data and learn how to implement it just to store simple, progressive data entries like a persistent scoreboard. We won't have to encrypt our data if we have the xml files stored on the servers. Jubilation! | ||
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