On September 09 2012 23:33 MavercK wrote: i've been fixing bugs brought on by hots beta. will probably test it with current WoL version and if it works fine i'll upload it. it's large however. 100+mb
Does the hots beta do anything to help this mod? The developers seem to be posting a lot on the custom map battle.net forum now so it might be worth a shot to try to get their attention on the selection limit again.
On FIghting spirit (I think) the lurker has 200hp. Can someone confirm/deny this bug and if true what is the meaning behind this/when will it be fixed?
On September 15 2012 19:15 forfriends wrote: On FIghting spirit (I think) the lurker has 200hp. Can someone confirm/deny this bug and if true what is the meaning behind this/when will it be fixed?
THanks
dependency loading issues... stuff from the campaign files is leaking through. i thought i caught all of it tho, thanks. i'll fix that now but not sure when my next update will be.
maverk..... great job!! but... plss ...for me because i am a fool and without brain plss give me a simple link to simple click it ! i don'[t know where is you mod rly.... where is it!? why are thanks to you because i don't see any mod((((!!!!!1
So MavercK is your goal to make the pathing similar to Brood War like dumb AI and such? I think thats awesome but isn't the point of your mod that one can play brood war with StarCraft 2 mechanics? Or is the pathing differences just going to be one more option for gameplay at the beginning of the game?
Amazing work. You keep doing stuff I thought couldn't be done. Got a couple of questions.
I see that the SC2BW workers don't wait in line to start mining from a mineral patch. Which behavior did you need to tweak for that? Return delay? I think it's great, removes the whole need of that 6m1g-movement. I like how the workers are wandering, so that even with a bunch of workers on one base, you can still move closer towards max saturation by adding a few more.
When it comes to moving shot, I like your implementation for the flying units. Even if it's not 100% true to BW, it allows for just as much fun/amazing micro. In BW, units would not retain the direction of the momentum they had before the issuing of the patrol/attack command. I believe that was partly offset by their wider attack arcs. While being chased by for example scourges, wraiths/mutas would be moved 90 degrees left/right (they probably had around 180 degrees arc) before issuing the patrol command.
The difference isn't a problem for the microability of flying units in SC2BW. But it seems to affect hovering units like the vulture. The vulture moving shot doesn't behave smoothly unless its target is right on front of it. I believe it's because the vulture, unlike the flying units, is not allowed to glide while turning around to fire. So it just stops if its target is not right in front of it.
Is it possible to give the vulture flying unit behavior for its movement? Along with a wider arc of attack? I'm not too good with the map editor, I tried looking through SC2BW data in the editor, but I couldn't find any weapon behavior for it.
I'd be interested to hear how your patrol mechanic works differently from attack move.
I'll do my best to help hype this up as you get closer to finishing it.
On September 16 2012 03:40 Pucca wrote: So MavercK is your goal to make the pathing similar to Brood War like dumb AI and such? I think thats awesome but isn't the point of your mod that one can play brood war with StarCraft 2 mechanics? Or is the pathing differences just going to be one more option for gameplay at the beginning of the game?
A big difference between bw and sc2 are deathballs, which he is trying to eliminate for the good of his mod. I don't know why you would like to retain deathballs, as they were not in bw.
On September 20 2012 01:24 LaLuSh wrote: Amazing work. You keep doing stuff I thought couldn't be done. Got a couple of questions.
I see that the SC2BW workers don't wait in line to start mining from a mineral patch. Which behavior did you need to tweak for that? Return delay? I think it's great, removes the whole need of that 6m1g-movement. I like how the workers are wandering, so that even with a bunch of workers on one base, you can still move closer towards max saturation by adding a few more.
When it comes to moving shot, I like your implementation for the flying units. Even if it's not 100% true to BW, it allows for just as much fun/amazing micro. In BW, units would not retain the direction of the momentum they had before the issuing of the patrol/attack command. I believe that was partly offset by their wider attack arcs. While being chased by for example scourges, wraiths/mutas would be moved 90 degrees left/right (they probably had around 180 degrees arc) before issuing the patrol command.
The difference isn't a problem for the microability of flying units in SC2BW. But it seems to affect hovering units like the vulture. The vulture moving shot doesn't behave smoothly unless its target is right on front of it. I believe it's because the vulture, unlike the flying units, is not allowed to glide while turning around to fire. So it just stops if its target is not right in front of it.
Is it possible to give the vulture flying unit behavior for its movement? Along with a wider arc of attack? I'm not too good with the map editor, I tried looking through SC2BW data in the editor, but I couldn't find any weapon behavior for it.
I'd be interested to hear how your patrol mechanic works differently from attack move.
I'll do my best to help hype this up as you get closer to finishing it.
iirc i have two weapons on the vulture, one is attached to a turret, when conditions are met the normal weapon is disabled and the turret active, this lets the vulture act like a flying unit when it does "moving shot" it should glide and retain its speed/direction. Its pretty difficult to do however online sith the forced delay
With worker mining i had trouble getting worker float to work, i had to create a trigger specifically to override the "wait in line" mechanic of workers.
On September 20 2012 04:09 Sucrose wrote: Have you thought about changing the lighting perspective? This was posted around a year ago: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=280114 I think top-down lighting makes the game feel more like BroodWar, might be worth checking out.
Thats pretty awesome and definitely something i would like to implement, i played around with lighting before but all i really tried to do was play with contrast, trying to make it feel abit more grimdark and also highlight edges abit more. But ill give it another shot based on that thread, ty.
Sorry for the multi post replies tl mods, replying while in bed at 6:30am on my phone is difficult
On September 20 2012 01:24 LaLuSh wrote: Amazing work. You keep doing stuff I thought couldn't be done. Got a couple of questions.
I see that the SC2BW workers don't wait in line to start mining from a mineral patch. Which behavior did you need to tweak for that? Return delay? I think it's great, removes the whole need of that 6m1g-movement. I like how the workers are wandering, so that even with a bunch of workers on one base, you can still move closer towards max saturation by adding a few more.
When it comes to moving shot, I like your implementation for the flying units. Even if it's not 100% true to BW, it allows for just as much fun/amazing micro. In BW, units would not retain the direction of the momentum they had before the issuing of the patrol/attack command. I believe that was partly offset by their wider attack arcs. While being chased by for example scourges, wraiths/mutas would be moved 90 degrees left/right (they probably had around 180 degrees arc) before issuing the patrol command.
The difference isn't a problem for the microability of flying units in SC2BW. But it seems to affect hovering units like the vulture. The vulture moving shot doesn't behave smoothly unless its target is right on front of it. I believe it's because the vulture, unlike the flying units, is not allowed to glide while turning around to fire. So it just stops if its target is not right in front of it.
Is it possible to give the vulture flying unit behavior for its movement? Along with a wider arc of attack? I'm not too good with the map editor, I tried looking through SC2BW data in the editor, but I couldn't find any weapon behavior for it.
I'd be interested to hear how your patrol mechanic works differently from attack move.
I'll do my best to help hype this up as you get closer to finishing it.
iirc i have two weapons on the vulture, one is attached to a turret, when conditions are met the normal weapon is disabled and the turret active, this lets the vulture act like a flying unit when it does "moving shot" it should glide and retain its speed/direction. Its pretty difficult to do however online sith the forced delay
With worker mining i had trouble getting worker float to work, i had to create a trigger specifically to override the "wait in line" mechanic of workers.
Thanks for the support as always
Yea I just find it odd that vultures work perfectly when you attack forward, but not to the sides/backwards. I will keep trying it out to see if it's just me screwing up. I can, however, move shoot easily enough to the side/backwards with flying units, so it's confusing me a bit. Maybe they behave differently because i can't stack them.
I also notice on the video where you're showing off SC2BW moving shot, that you're issuing a move command towards the target everytime before firing. That makes it look much more authentic in regards to the BW moving shot (because afaik, BW units were always forced to travel towards their target; just that you could snap them out of that movement very quickly). But, in contrast, SC2BW moving allows for some cool backwards gliding micro, which I seem to be able to pull off pretty reliably.
I'm gonna make a video of it and show it off.
What I think makes it hard for certain people to micro SC2BW units correctly (and which they blame on delay), is that the flying units behave differently depending upon two scenarios:
1. If the flying unit is within attacking range of its target and you issue a patrol/hold command, it will keep gliding in its current direction while rotating around its axis to fire.
2. If the flying unit is not within attacking range of its target it will behave like the Broodwar patrol, where it turns around and moves towards its target and then fires after it comes into range (only difference being that Broodwar moving shot works like this regardless of whether it's in range or not).
So you end up sort of being confused when some of the time your flying units turn around, and other times they just keep gliding. But I think it's easy enough to learn to predict and anticipate which of the two is going to be triggered.
SC2 ground units have some sort of override when they start attacking. if they are in range they instantly stop. turn and fire.
iirc in BW if you had a vulture and moved it past a target (so target is beside the vulture) and told the vulture to attack. it would start decelerating. holding it's current heading. stop. turn. fire. in SC2 the vulture will stop immedietly once given the move command. i can't really seem to stop this. it only works with the turret which ofcourse only works if the target is within the turret's attack angle which is probably 45 or 90 degrees. otherwise it will behave as normal and stop instantly.
as for air units yea they just love to glide. completely unlike ground units which will stop on a dime irregardless of their deceleration value. air units just glide. but they lack the BW mechanic of maintaining their heading before stopping and turning to attack.
these are probably the most difficult/seemingly impossible things to overcome, most likely tied directly into the engine.
EPT
((((!!!!!1
