EPTI find the current player pool very interesting, and would certainly not watch without the koreans and chinese players.
Should the 2014 season of WCS have residency/citizenship r…
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Zenbrez
Canada5973 Posts
I find the current player pool very interesting, and would certainly not watch without the koreans and chinese players. | ||
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slowbacontron
United States7722 Posts
On September 26 2013 14:19 Zenbrez wrote: I'm still undecided. Despite what some people say, WCS NA would not be better (for the viewers) if it was largely NA players. I don't think most of the koreans currently in the league would move over here for a year. I find the current player pool very interesting, and would certainly not watch without the koreans and chinese players. Agreed, though the 2012 style of WCS was nice in its own right. If restrictions were imposed this time around, Blizzard would certainly at least have to expand the number of regions. | ||
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Oiseaux
United States676 Posts
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ejozl
Denmark3379 Posts
And would China&SEA then still be part of America? I think a better restriction is just that on the day the player needs to be in the country, this would stop the latency issues along with Koreans just being everywhere at once. Maybe even have the offline part be a bigger part of the tournament instead of just the top 16 of the premier division. | ||
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BreAKerTV
Taiwan1658 Posts
The best thing to do now is just open a fourth region that is open for everyone from Iran to New Zealand. | ||
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
a) Would WCS NA have the same prize pool than WCS KOR or WCS EU? b) What about the players from China and Australia? | ||
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Sjokola
Netherlands800 Posts
Edit: Players from none of the regions should be allowed to choose where they want to play. | ||
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MuMeise
Germany81 Posts
Guys like MVP though who just arrive the day before the live shows should no longer participate or they should actually live in the EU. I don't like the attitude to play in WCS EU because it's EZ like they say. | ||
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Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
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KristofferAG
Norway25712 Posts
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Gaius Baltar
United States449 Posts
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Cyroch
Germany45 Posts
On the other hand I see a few potential problems with the lock: 1. If foreigners would only play amongst themselves for the whole year, I think it is possible to see an overall decrease in foreign skill. Right now I would carefully say that there are a few foreign player who can cause upsets against good Koreans on a regular basis and some who are on the brink of getting there. 2. While I would probably still watch my local WCS (EU) and Korea, I would most probably stop watching NA, just because I'm just not related enough to that region. Assuming I am not the only one who feels like that, this could lead to a decrease in viewers for the foreign regions. And let's be honest, they aren't that high anyway right now. In General, I think that a region lock would not tackle the main problem WCS has IMO. The oversaturation of tournaments going on. Right after each PL, challenger starts right up again. Sometimes having WCS streams 5 days a week. It is too much in my opinion. I just don't get that pumped for tournament days anymore. | ||
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thimius
Sweden29 Posts
On September 26 2013 15:15 Oiseaux wrote: I already know who the strong koreans are. If I want to see them I'll watch GSL. I want to see strong NA players. Do you also think its fair that Kane, Goswser and Demuslim could end up winning the same prize money as say...Soulkey, Jaedong, Innovation, Rain and any other of the 50 koreany players that are ACTUALLY better players than the American ones? BEcause if they were to create a region lock, the code A of korea should actually have a higher prize pool than the american premier one, it's sad to say, but it's actually the truth... | ||
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Elite_
United States4259 Posts
It might be good for the foreign players if it was region locked but it would only mean that they'll be wrecked at the season finals by Koreans instead of Premier League which lessens the value of the games for the viewers at later stages of the tournament. I mean what's more important? Seeing your favorite foreign players do well in Premier League and getting bopped by Koreans at the season finals or seeing the best games between the best players at season finals and BlizzCon? ~_~ | ||
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pNRG
United States333 Posts
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BraveProbe
36 Posts
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eonrulz
United Kingdom225 Posts
As it is, there's not enough big tournaments for players to make a name for themselves, so players are slowly becoming strangled and choked out of money. So they retire and seek employment in the traditional job market. More restrictive region-locking, without changing the current WCS structure, would only aggravate the situation, especially in Korea. | ||
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j1nzo
Germany367 Posts
however for me wathing the koreans duke it out is one of the reasons to watch wcs. i mean think about it- if the best football/basketball etc players were koreans, would we really wanna restrict their number and prevent us from watching the best play? | ||
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Undead1993
Germany17651 Posts
On September 26 2013 18:15 MuMeise wrote: It definitly should have residency check. Not citizenship though. Guys like MC living in germany, or ForGG livin in France should be able to participate in WCS EU. Guys like MVP though who just arrive the day before the live shows should no longer participate or they should actually live in the EU. I don't like the attitude to play in WCS EU because it's EZ like they say. i didn't hear a single progamer saying wcs eu is easy, except for huk. on topic, that's so ridiculous. the skill of game would be just so so much lower. i don't get how anyone could think that would improve anything. i love it the way it is. and if we would have the restrictions and then only blizzcon at the end, it wouldn't change anything the foreigners would still get crushed left and right, i really dislike this discussion. i think it's even comparable with the globalisation. people who were in a country before think they should be prefered over the immigrants, but it's just not true, it doesn't help any organisation if they hire workers only because of their nationality. | ||
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elmoDD
89 Posts
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FlukyS
Ireland485 Posts
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Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate you know it wouldnt be that good of a show without them dont you? | ||
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c0olL
129 Posts
dont really care about this EU\NA thing... | ||
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polarwolf
924 Posts
If there was a region lock, it would be unfair for the Koreans as their league would be much more competetive and not comparable to the other 2 regions, in which players would need much less skill to earn the same amout of money and fame. | ||
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Fus
Sweden1112 Posts
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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Sjokola
Netherlands800 Posts
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NKB
United Kingdom608 Posts
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RuiBarbO
United States1340 Posts
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Jerom
Netherlands588 Posts
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LittleRedBoy
United States229 Posts
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FoShao
United States256 Posts
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KaiserKieran
United States615 Posts
Then there Wouldn't really be restrictions on citizen ships since it'd be just like a tournament. | ||
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jax1492
United States1632 Posts
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jinsanity
United States137 Posts
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Incand
143 Posts
The best alternative I've heard so far was from State of the game where someone suggested ladder would be used as qualification for challenger league (with some checks to shoutcraft america obviously). That way players become invested in the region and provide valuable practice partners and raise the overall skill level of the r Region. Furthermore it doesn´'t hurt or even punish players outside a region that may be grouped in somewhat arbitrary. As it is now it feel like koreans win the tournament but isn't invested in the region only making the rest of the players get even further behind unless they commit to korea. In the long term i hope it will lead to the na scene being to support itself more in the long run having players that can compete. If instead we had a complete regionlock i feel one concern would be viewer number. Having a few of those koreans in there makes for good games and everyone wants to watch high quality games while still cheering for the local hero. And while I assumed it would enable more foreign pros to make a living i think it would be a temporary effects as the two other regions would fall further behind and the best scene imo is one where they're somewhat comparable. i.e. the people from other regions won't just get completely crushed in the season finaly. | ||
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Darthsanta13
United States564 Posts
I think having more opportunites for Korean players to show their stuff is pretty important too. Whether that's opening up another Korean WCS league (GSL/OSL running concurrently?) or just making the player pool for WCS Korea much larger (even having twice as large would leave a lot of Koreans looking in from the outside). It would allow the fringe Code S players to get a little more exposure and money to live off of. | ||
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Nirel
Israel1526 Posts
On the other hand WCS NA doesn't really feel NA so I voted not sure, maybe it's best if they could change the system and not just region locking. | ||
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TJ31
630 Posts
Also that will make season finals so much worse. Now there's a chance for awesome games starting from the group stage. If more foreigners will be there... Well, see season 1 and 2 finals. Your average foreigners were stomped 0:5(1:10), and only 2 more or less good foreigners advanced. | ||
Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
On September 26 2013 15:15 Oiseaux wrote: I already know who the strong koreans are. If I want to see them I'll watch GSL. I want to see strong NA players. That's the problem - there arent't 32 or even 8 "strong" NA players | ||
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GreenMash
Norway1746 Posts
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DannyJ
United States5110 Posts
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Ragnarork
France9034 Posts
For example, keeping the current Premier/Challenger league system, but reworking the qualifiers. Qualifiers should have cash prizes (of course not huge ones, but noticeable), and should be focused on the region's players. Like say, divide into two qualifiers: one region locked which gives three quarters of the spots the qualifiers give, and one open to the other regions which gives the remaining quarter. This way, you'd have something a bit more meaningful for local players I'd think. Still, I don't really think that would work well for NA, as we've seen there's not that much NA players that can go far once in Challenger league, but I'd like to think a better reward for qualifiers, and qualifiers more region-centered would be an improvement. | ||
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Bowzar
Sweden741 Posts
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riyanme
Philippines940 Posts
NA, EU, KR, ASIA (china, sea) Double the pot money of KR. Compensate it by decreasing other regions. Twice the amount of players represented on KR server on season finals or whatever. NA (3), EU (3), KR (6), ASIA (3), WILDCARD(1) | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
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BaconofWar
United States369 Posts
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Wingbladez
United States2 Posts
Koreans help the talent in NA become better Playing against a good Korean once or twice a year doesn't improve your skill all that much. Increase the Korean prize money That would set a bad precedent where it is accepted that Koreans are better than everyone else, therefore they should win the tournament.This is bad for players who rely on their confidence to get them through the tournament and very unfair for a serious competition. I won't watch NA and/or EU anymore Seems to be a vocal minority of people who feel this way when you look at the poll. | ||
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Hayl_Storm
The Shire633 Posts
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chuiboy
55 Posts
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kochanfe
Micronesia1338 Posts
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Dontkillme
Korea (South)806 Posts
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Incubus1993
Canada140 Posts
Personally I would scrap a lot of the broadcast time on the challenger leagues and some qualifiers. WCS hogs way too much of the game up so newer players have such a narrow window of opportunity to achieve goals and if they fail that's it for a long time, we need to find a better balance between individual tournaments and leauges and WCS. | ||
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for_the_swarm
United States48 Posts
If there is a region lock, NA scene might just die. I for one would not watch NA at all. I cannot name top 10 NA players and i live in the US! | ||
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DavoS
United States4605 Posts
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Sum41
Chile345 Posts
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xxpack09
United States2160 Posts
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Ansinjunger
United States2451 Posts
https://twitter.com/ROOTnathanias Also HuK clarified. https://twitter.com/LorangerChris "He's saying that they will for sure region lock. Just to clarify," "He" meaning Slasher, I believe. I personally don't believe the pendulum needs to completely swing back the other way, if much at all. WCS in 2012 culminated in a bop. And what of Korean players on foreign teams, like MMA? He most likely gets to stay in WCS, but does Mvp? Is being a fan favorite gonna give an unfair advantage? Too many questions with imperfect answers. | ||
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ladysman09
237 Posts
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Mocking
Brazil52 Posts
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HeadlessWonder
United States1096 Posts
I preferred WCS 2012 a lot more, would be perfect imo if they leveled out the seeding more (as in, each country sends X to regional finals, each region sends X to World Finals. Not "you get 3 and you get 9 and you get 1 etc) Sure, it wouldn't be the best players. But isn't WCS meant to grow the world scene? | ||
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Sjokola
Netherlands800 Posts
And if we would have region locked wcs am we would get to see new American talent. There's no way to break out via wcs AM this way. We also have to understand that this is a site for dedicated star craft fans. Off course a lot of forum goers here want only to see the best sc. But that's not how you become an e-sport. I believe most casuals don't care to much about kr vs kr battles in wcs am. But seeing your local heroes duke it out vs players from all around the world 3 times a year would be great. And for the people who want to only see the best games: a region lock would make wcs korea even more stacked resulting in better games. | ||
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omisa
United States494 Posts
Personally I like watching koreans play starcraft so having them play in all the leagues dosent really bother me too much. I can, however, see why having koreans beat up on everyone else might not be much fun for others to sit and watch for multiple seasons. | ||
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Survivor61316
United States470 Posts
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TaishiCi
Korea (South)211 Posts
For everyone that is trying to disguise their xenophobia through bullshit reasons, just know that Koreans leaving EU/NA WCS would mean the gap will continue to grow even larger than before. ROLF stomps all day! | ||
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DusTerr
2520 Posts
Play only 2 seasons and have more local/lan/regional tournaments. As much as I've loved having WCS to watch, I feel like it dominates everything but the occasional DH/IEM. | ||
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scares
Germany239 Posts
On September 28 2013 17:39 DusTerr wrote: Just name it Blizzard Championship Series "West", "North/Central" and "East". Play only 2 seasons and have more local/lan/regional tournaments. As much as I've loved having WCS to watch, I feel like it dominates everything but the occasional DH/IEM. Or make WCS team focused and bring back the many "smaller" or whatever you want to call them events and make one huge push for blizzcon as the blizz individual tournament or something (if needed at all). Just an idea maybe it's crap but I think a team league as constant content would be kinda cool and you could then keep having lots of iem, dreamhack, redbull, MLG, chinese things (NSL i think was one) and maybe also some korean events aside from gsl (even though just having everyone back in gsl would also be cool with stuff like the super tournament) just an idea though. | ||
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borussia1871
Belgium23 Posts
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Luiwtf
England217 Posts
The way it is currently I don't really care about WCS KR because it's missing certain players, I don't care about NA/EU because it's mostly bad players and I don't care about the global finals because of the lack of prep time and inclusion of bad players/lack of better players from WCS KR. | ||
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Janko
Slovenia28 Posts
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TheHansBecker
United States117 Posts
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Jonoman92
United States9103 Posts
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rpddropshot
United States82 Posts
On September 28 2013 07:04 HeadlessWonder wrote: If the highest quality of games is what people are really after, you should be arguing for getting rid of wcs altogether. The highest quality of games would involve sending Taeja, Jaedong, Alive etc. back to Korea to compete in GSL, not beating on AM players and lesser Koreans. Exactly. You can't have one true premier league if you already have 3 premier leagues. | ||
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glaresc
31 Posts
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desRow
Canada2654 Posts
On September 26 2013 19:06 KristofferAG wrote: Not sure. I would never watch NA, and probably never watch EU either. The prize pools would have to be changed, I don't see why the NA winner would get the same as KR winner, for example. Dat elitist attitude. Take a look at the current LCS format and the winning recipe. Personally I think WCS KR needs to die and go back to OSL/GSL and make it Tier 1. | ||
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pookums
151 Posts
On September 26 2013 19:44 Cyroch wrote: 1. If foreigners would only play amongst themselves for the whole year, I think it is possible to see an overall decrease in foreign skill. I don't understand this line of thinking? Is the assumption that the handful of official WCS matches against Koreans are making foreigners better? | ||
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astray71
United States325 Posts
Sure there are people who you will watch (Huk, Demuslim, etc etc) but those are probably going to be the only games you'll watch. People complain about the number of Koreans but the quality of games will go drastically down if it's only Americans. Plus, what happens at all the season finals? Everyone from WCS NA gets trashed in the ro16. What happens at Blizzcon? All of the NA people that qualified get kicked around again. It makes perfect sense to not region lock. They get more viewers with high level Koreans spread out in the tournaments. Also, do you really think all of the players from NA should get to go to Blizzcon when their level of play is barely high enough to beat Code B level Koreans? | ||
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tomastaz
United States976 Posts
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Cheren
United States2911 Posts
On September 29 2013 10:30 tomastaz wrote: I don't know...I like seeing certain Korean players there but I agree there are too many there, but you can't just only let a few in and prevent the others. Conflicted. That's exactly what a region lock would do, let in the Koreans who are willing to move and keep out the others. | ||
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WightyCity
Canada887 Posts
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Cyroch
Germany45 Posts
On September 29 2013 09:43 pookums wrote: I don't understand this line of thinking? Is the assumption that the handful of official WCS matches against Koreans are making foreigners better? My reasoning behind this is that the Koreans in all regions keep the competition on a high level, thus increasing motivation of foreign players as well as the need to always bring your very best game. This would not necessarily be the case without Korean competition. Of course, this is just a hypothesis and I have now proof whatsoever for this assumption. | ||
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LeviathanDK
Denmark87 Posts
On September 26 2013 15:15 Oiseaux wrote: I already know who the strong koreans are. If I want to see them I'll watch GSL. I want to see strong NA players. well that is impossible as there is Scarlett.... and that's it | ||
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yaxv
Denmark50 Posts
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Cheren
United States2911 Posts
On September 29 2013 18:23 Cyroch wrote: My reasoning behind this is that the Koreans in all regions keep the competition on a high level, thus increasing motivation of foreign players as well as the need to always bring your very best game. This would not necessarily be the case without Korean competition. Of course, this is just a hypothesis and I have now proof whatsoever for this assumption. Yeah but foreigners can't win those games since they can't practice against Koreans since all the Koreans live in Korea. With region lock Koreans would move to NA and EU and increase the overall skill level of those servers. | ||
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Kylo55
Poland64 Posts
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Cyroch
Germany45 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:20 Cheren wrote: Yeah but foreigners can't win those games since they can't practice against Koreans since all the Koreans live in Korea. With region lock Koreans would move to NA and EU and increase the overall skill level of those servers. Still, most of them ladder in the region they're playing in. If a lock would mean Koreans would actually move to live in the region they're playing in, then I am all for it. But I fear a lot of them would just go back to play in Korea. | ||
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a9arnn
United States1537 Posts
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redpeople
70 Posts
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magnaflow
Canada1521 Posts
On September 26 2013 14:19 Zenbrez wrote: I'm still undecided. Despite what some people say, WCS NA would not be better (for the viewers) if it was largely NA players. I don't think most of the koreans currently in the league would move over here for a year. I find the current player pool very interesting, and would certainly not watch without the koreans and chinese players. At this point I don't think WCS NA should be about viewership, and should be more about building the NA scene. People are going to watch regardless, Sure some may not tune in but whatevs. LCS seems to do just fine, and look at the hype for the finals. the NA/Foreign teams got smoked, yet the scene will still thrive because story lines were built around peoples favorite players/teams. This needs to happen for SC2 in North America, other wise we will just have 3 Korean WCS tournaments and the NA scene will wither away | ||
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KobraKay
Portugal4231 Posts
On September 29 2013 19:12 LeviathanDK wrote: well that is impossible as there is Scarlett.... and that's it And she would not qualify as she lives in Korea right? So she wouldnt even be able to play in WCS NA. . . | ||
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TimKim0713
Korea (South)221 Posts
It'd be boring too | ||
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Lukeeze[zR]
Switzerland6838 Posts
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AWalker9
United Kingdom7229 Posts
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Noobity
United States871 Posts
On September 29 2013 21:07 Cyroch wrote: Still, most of them ladder in the region they're playing in. If a lock would mean Koreans would actually move to live in the region they're playing in, then I am all for it. But I fear a lot of them would just go back to play in Korea. I think you're extremely mistaken. If this was the case we wouldn't have so many NA pros laddering on the KR ladder | ||
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imprecis
Poland6 Posts
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alainysaur
United States131 Posts
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syroz
France249 Posts
I want the better players. "Affirmative action" for NA and EU players would be silly: the competition will lose value and interest. The problem is still korean. There is way to many players with kespa players. Blizzard should organize few more events in korea (with WCS korea, its worst than before there). | ||
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Chairman Ray
United States11903 Posts
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Fubi
2228 Posts
So I vote no, let the koreans be where they want to be, at least the games that I do watch are better. | ||
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dtawom
Netherlands5 Posts
Each country gets a certain amount of spots earned by how they preforme. For example England gets 4 Championslueuge spots well Netherlands only gets one. So fro example region finals could have 10 from kr region 3 from eu 3 from na. Should adjust the WCS points for each region after finding out what the right balance is. We stil have great tournaments like dh and iem where every nationallity can compete. People like polt, mc, who live study in the region should be allowed to play in region where they live. | ||
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Homework
United States283 Posts
if the NA players can't keep up with the koreans it's their damn fault and they know it. weaker play should not be excused in our strategy game. | ||
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Hammer442
Australia749 Posts
On September 30 2013 17:20 Homework wrote: The NBA, NHL, NFL do not limit players of a different nationality / residency from playing, why should starcraft? if the NA players can't keep up with the koreans it's their damn fault and they know it. weaker play should not be excused in our strategy game. Pretty sure NFL players can't play their games online from another country. This poll isn't just about disallowing other nationalities from playing in other regions, it is also suggesting residency requirement. Which is the same in all sports. | ||
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MCXD
Australia2738 Posts
Residency yes, citizenship no. | ||
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bakemonoda
United Kingdom18 Posts
also it defines who is actually the best in the country and if the koreans do want to move, that will increse the level of skill cap in the country, as they will play on the ladder, since region switching has lag i.e. playing korea server from us the best matches in sc2 are foreigner vs korean both different races with players like jaedong and taeja, korean will probably still win in US and EU but there will be more hope | ||
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Noizhende
Austria328 Posts
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Warheart
Italy25 Posts
On September 26 2013 18:15 MuMeise wrote: It definitly should have residency check. Not citizenship though. Guys like MC living in germany, or ForGG livin in France should be able to participate in WCS EU. Guys like MVP though who just arrive the day before the live shows should no longer participate or they should actually live in the EU. I don't like the attitude to play in WCS EU because it's EZ like they say. amen to that | ||
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WetSocks
United States953 Posts
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JtoK
Germany232 Posts
But I think I would watch less matches then, because the regions will be less strong of players. But better to have fair regions with no lag. | ||
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Clbull
United Kingdom1439 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate Same here. LCS is so successful because it's actually region locked. You don't see SK Telecom T1 going through and bulldozing North America's LCS, do you? | ||
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Musicus
Germany23576 Posts
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Joedaddy
United States1948 Posts
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Passion
Netherlands1486 Posts
On October 01 2013 00:39 Musicus wrote: No residecny/citizenship should be needed imo. But make everything offline, every round. Just like past GSLs for foreigners, it should be a commitment. You don't even have to make everything offline - even if you'd just do that to the qualifiers it would be enough  | ||
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TigerKarl
1757 Posts
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crazyweasel
607 Posts
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Petninja
United States159 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate I feel the opposite. There are very few foreigners worth following for anything other than their personality, which doesn't get exposed in these tournaments anyway. All the free time I'll have from not having to keep up with western leagues will be amazing! | ||
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chuiboy
55 Posts
On October 01 2013 00:36 Clbull wrote: Same here. LCS is so successful because it's actually region locked. You don't see SK Telecom T1 going through and bulldozing North America's LCS, do you? False. LCS is successful because LoL is a very popular esport. | ||
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MrMotionPicture
United States4327 Posts
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Cheren
United States2911 Posts
On October 01 2013 00:36 Clbull wrote: Same here. LCS is so successful because it's actually region locked. You don't see SK Telecom T1 going through and bulldozing North America's LCS, do you? You see Quantic bringing Koreans over to NA and raising the skill level of NA solo queue, which is exactly what would happen with SC2. (and it would be a good thing) | ||
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Zenniv
United States545 Posts
However, I can't say that would be a good move overall. As more Koreans definitely mean better games. | ||
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Requiem-
Uruguay162 Posts
i think this one is the best. | ||
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bduddy
United States1326 Posts
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Footler
United States560 Posts
Go from 16 to 32 for Grand Finals with something like 4 other representives from each of the 4 residency tournaments (4 NA, 4 EU, 4 Korea/Asia, 4 Everyone Else). Of course the remaining 16 come from the current set up. | ||
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ivancype
Brazil485 Posts
And also I would like to see a new region for SEA/China and a change in the number of spots for season finals, something like 8 for KR, 4 for EU and 2 for AM SEA/China. Or maybe no, just make ladder relevant for WCS. | ||
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iEatWoofers
Switzerland108 Posts
It's pretty obvious that the current WCS setup is killing the US scene. Especially with MLG not hosting SC2 tournaments anymore. Sure, the skill level won't be as high as Korea for a long time, but that's just how it is if you have to (re)build a scene. Pumping Koreans in the tournament will not help at all, because the players know that they are at a HUGE disadvantage. So they lose motivation and the scene dies. I for one don't need two WCS Koreas. One is enough. | ||
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Greendotz
United Kingdom2053 Posts
On September 26 2013 16:00 ejozl wrote: I think that's too hard a restriction, having DeMusliM earn the same money as Soulkey in prize pool, seems a bit strange. As well as the residency lock idea who's to say there won't also be changes to the allocation of prize funds? I think GSL should return to it's original form, I feel Blizzard have kind of robbed GOM of their identity a bit. Overall I actually do like what Blizzard are trying to do with WCS, but there is so much that needs to change and needs to be revised for 2014. | ||
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vrok
Sweden2541 Posts
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DDie
Brazil2369 Posts
On September 28 2013 06:16 ladysman09 wrote: There should be a Korean Qualifier/Invite system for the non Korean WCS regions. like only 4 or 5 can qualify or be invited. This. | ||
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zelevin
United States260 Posts
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MysticaL
Canada118 Posts
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IMR
70 Posts
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Nyvis
France284 Posts
If we do that, the GSL will be back to being the only relevant tournament. And the foreigners will keep stagnating because they won't have to face the best to do a living. A residing requirement could be a decent compromise, but citizenship seems really impossible without making the foreign WCS completely irrelevant. And even a massive joke if they keep the number of seeds. And on the long run, it will hurt the foreign scene, because blizzard won't put as much money into a second grade tournament. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23221 Posts
I do think we have seen a significant increase in the quality of play by NA players and European players as a result of having to regularly prepare for and compete against competition they just don't normally have access to. If you want to be the best you have to beat the best(or at least compete with them). | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
What is the point with EU/NA/Korea if everyone is free to play whereever they want? Sure the Korean would win if they entered the competition somewhere else but that goes for any other sport. How many of the young sprinters of Jamaica wouldn't crush competition anywhere else on the planet besides Jamaica? Same with badminton/table tennis. Chinese players nowhere near the top in China would crush competition else where if they could participate. | ||
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PhobosSc2
Netherlands6 Posts
Bottom line: I like the good games where both players have the same conditions to keep it equal. Playing in korea for WCS EU makes the lag high and there is an unequal advantage for the players which can be exploited at the higher level by high micro battles. The location where the player is is important. | ||
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dirtydurb82
United States178 Posts
"The only way to make E-Sports grow is to tell the truth." - Richard Lewis. Well here's the truth. I want a WCS America winner who looks like me, talks like me, and grew up watching the fucking Simpsons, just like me. That's how I like my Olympics, that's how I like my Superbowls. The truth is, region locking is the first step to making E-Sports successful. The second step is nerfing Widow Mines. Fucking Widow Mines man. | ||
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goldentb
Slovenia15 Posts
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Rider517
70 Posts
yes, koreans are better and more talented, but i want to see an american player coming out from an american pool of players, and i want to see the same for EU and KR i want to know who is the best american, european and korean players each season and this can be only achieved with a "region lock" system so i voted yes. | ||
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Linwelin
Ireland7554 Posts
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contaminant.237
Canada13 Posts
Personally, I watch WCS for great games, not because of player's names. I think it hugely diminishes the successes of the most talented Korean players to say you'd prefer to see lower-level play because it's someone from your home country. Individual sports should be about the players, not the regions they represent. This isn't football - you don't have to cheer for your "home-town team". | ||
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Aliwia
United Kingdom6 Posts
On September 26 2013 18:39 Targe wrote: No don't care option? Yes there is, it's the big red cross at the top right | ||
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andoRRR
Germany36 Posts
To decrease the prize pools is not a good option because Koreans can still participate in the other regions... they just have to live there. I read here anywhere that "if in sports the best players would be koreans who could not ban them, because everyone wants to see them." Well, what would you say if there's a Korean basketball team which flies in 3 times a year for a few days to play the playoffs and wins everything and then goes home again? Anybody who's not a "success fan" would be rooting against them, because there's absolutely no reason to cheer for a team or players with which you can't identify yourselves... Guys like Jaedong can still participate in NA if he wants to... he plays for an american team and could move into their teamhouse. If the NA scene is dying it is partly because of all the Koreans, because new players don't have a chance to even qualify and get better in a tournament (yes, training is good, but not everything, you can't simulate a good tournament run or motivation to train harder because of tournaments you maybe have a chance of winning...). | ||
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JJH777
United States4407 Posts
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ander
Canada403 Posts
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Cereb
Denmark3388 Posts
What's the point of the system if all you have is 3xKorea. I want to to see local players to actually give me something to aspire to. I want them to have a chance to win something so it actually makes sense using your time as a professional SC2 player for nonkoreans so we hopefully can have a more balanced scene. The more you screw over nonkorean players, the less likely we are to see any of them actually be able to compete in the future with Koreans cause it just doesn't make any sense to play financially. WCS is already killing most of the player stream viewers that was keeping the nonkoreans going, so I do not see how it could make any sense for most players to continue too far into the future. There is also no way these guys are getting a good contract with their team if they can barely get any time on the WCS streams. There is just no value for these players if they are knocked out in qualifier by Koreans. Unlike BW, SC2 actually needs the entire globe to be the massive success that it is, and I feel that this would be much more interesting for most of the crucial viewers who are on the fence of what game they want to get into. | ||
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
Easy choice to make if you ask me | ||
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Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
On October 03 2013 05:09 Aliwia wrote: Yes there is, it's the big red cross at the top right ? | ||
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Apoptotic
United States137 Posts
He means close your browser. I'm okay with it not being regionlocked, but the point still stands that WCS hurts SC2 more than it helps | ||
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TaishiCi
Korea (South)211 Posts
Remove challenger league from NA/EU. Increase the Korean prize pool. Decrease the EU/NA prize pool. All offline events. They are hoping to get a team league with GSTL champ, KeSPA champ, EU champ, and NA champ. Also trying to create 24/7 stream with regular content. | ||
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Fasy
Italy13 Posts
On October 03 2013 21:52 TaishiCi wrote: They are going to make it residential. Remove challenger league from NA/EU. Increase the Korean prize pool. Decrease the EU/NA prize pool. All offline events. They are hoping to get a team league with GSTL champ, KeSPA champ, EU champ, and NA champ. Also trying to create 24/7 stream with regular content. if i didn't miss understood it sound amazing! | ||
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Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
On October 03 2013 21:48 Apoptotic wrote: He means close your browser. I'm okay with it not being regionlocked, but the point still stands that WCS hurts SC2 more than it helps Well I know he meant that, but that's not what I asked for, not everyone cares where Koreans play. | ||
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heavenz
Austria301 Posts
On September 26 2013 18:39 Targe wrote: No don't care option? don't care, but bother posting here? You need the -get a life option. Or build yourself a opinion. Or go fuck yourself. User was banned for this post. | ||
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scott31337
United States2979 Posts
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dogmode
Philippines491 Posts
just a summary of why i believe in no region locks: 1. it spreads the koreans out thereby increasing the skill cap of all regions. playing with better foreigners make local players better 2. it gives NA and EU their very own GSL (think about this) 3. a region locked tournament already exists. WCG. what should be changed: 1. Blizzard should support and encourage independent and smaller tournaments instead of restricting them 2. overhaul the game to reward skill more. make it less coin-tossy (for lack of a better term). this is a tall order but its really needed to get more viewers-fans and players back. | ||
739
Bearded Elder29903 Posts
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CthulhuZerg
Australia17 Posts
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Coolhwip
Sweden1381 Posts
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verne
United States43 Posts
This is only my perception of things and may not accurately reflect the views of all korean players but it's the way I feel regardless. Its the same thing that happened with SC1/BW that caused me to lose interest. Korea got hold of the game and the ladder became horrible. you couldnt even communicate with people because no one spoke english anymore. Anyone remember, "manner ladderer, no rush 5min ok? Couple this with the fact that SC2 casters are mostly, ignorant at best, and I have almost no interest in watching tournaments. When I do I am forced to use the mute button most of the time. I think locking the WCS leagues is a start but I dunno. | ||
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Havik_
United States5585 Posts
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WoodLeagueAllStar
United States806 Posts
Listen, its a fallacy that there even are "best players". The amount of times a "best player" wins a major tournament its probably worse than Golf pre-Tiger Woods. Lets try something different. Rather than have a different winner who nobody has any attachment too, lets start building fans for players here that speak the language and are inspiring interest. We may not have best but we can begin building attachments to players who win tournaments and that can perpetuate something bigger. Now its like oh here is the Korean of the Month winner. Big deal. In NA we have very very few players. This is a hidden asset, with only a top 8 of players there is easy to root for only one and know the strengths weaknesses of each. So being a fan of a NA player is very easy. Also another fallacy I think I see is that play is the most important thing. I think play has stagnated and there is very little left to do. You won't amaze the rubes anymore with a flashy move, its all been seen before. At best what I hope for is a 'highlight reel' play every few games. Now it should evolve into matchups, rivalries or competition. Without region lock SC2 is becoming a amorphous blob, very few times will the same players ever play anymore, and WCS NA can feature literally anyone as Koreans, EU and NA try desperately to get a spot. So its like a room of people who barely know each other, and can't really possibly remember each others builds, so they HAVE TO play standard boring builds which is making for very STALE gameplay. So I just hope that Blizzard gives the Yes side a chance this year, lets No have to watch and see if they are proven wrong. | ||
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Fiallach
France38 Posts
Residency is cool, i think it would give a heatlhy balance between koreans and foreigners, and would help improve training on the different servers. | ||
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BaneRiders
Sweden3630 Posts
The only way to build the entire EU scene and the interest among EU viewers is to have strong EU competitions imo, where EU players get the chance to play as much as possible to gain experience in the big tournaments. Having top or middle level Koreans dominating EU tournaments is not going to do anything to grow the interest for SC2 in EU. Quite the contrary. It would be great to have the best of EU to compete with the rest of the world in the finals, without seeing the best of the EU Koreans taking some/all of the EU spots. Also, why should WCS EU and WCS NA deprive WCS KR of so much talent? Let WCS KR be the best tournament for Koreans it can possibly be. | ||
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Deadlyeye
Germany14 Posts
i do think koreans that are living in the eu should participate, so mma/mc/forgg are defenitely part of the european sceene. wcs kor has this restricition, you have to play in seoul to participate. thats not as easy in NA/EU so the online part is a clear benefit for this regions. i enjoy watching the europeans (well extended europeans) and some koreans that live somewhere around enhance the quality. but looking at blizzcon where 15 out of 16 players are koreans... not that many foreingers to cheer for... sure the best consistant players (in each region) are there, but some koreans that qualified throu NA/EU are only qualyfied because they skipped the challenge of there own region. i would like to see NA/EU/KOR champions that battle in the season finals, not koreans out of 3 regions to battle it out, thats what regional tournaments are designed for, for the international challenge theres the finals. | ||
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Fall.182
United States126 Posts
On September 27 2013 04:38 polarwolf wrote: I voted "no" because the game is about skill, and if there is such a surplus of talent from Korea that they can dominate the other WCS regions, so be it. If there was a region lock, it would be unfair for the Koreans as their league would be much more competetive and not comparable to the other 2 regions, in which players would need much less skill to earn the same amout of money and fame. This. The game is about skill. Foreign pro players shouldnt be baby-sat by allowing only foreigners to play foreigners. Its stupid. I for one, would not watch EU or NA at all if the Koreans are not there. | ||
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Steinhein
Germany7 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate ^ this i simply don't care anymore. it's no WCS EU/NA its just WCS KR in every region | ||
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BaneRiders
Sweden3630 Posts
On October 06 2013 15:52 Fall.182 wrote: This. The game is about skill. Foreign pro players shouldnt be baby-sat by allowing only foreigners to play foreigners. Its stupid. I for one, would not watch EU or NA at all if the Koreans are not there. You can still watch Koreans in Korea. So those who want to watch Europeans and Americans can get their chance in to watch WCS EU/AM. Everyone gets something to watch. Fair enough? That is from the viewers point of view. From the players point of view: Honor and glory comes in the season finals and the overall final, and there is nothing horribly unfair about having qualifications that allows participation in a grand final from the entire world. For both players and viewers: Please add another WCS Asia (excluding KR) so that we can have all the other Asians & Oceania playing in their timezone. | ||
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Swisslink
2953 Posts
1) WAY higher price pool for the Korean region. Everything else would just be absurd. The current price pool is just ridiculous for the amount of Korean pro gamers anyway. If they weren't allowed so switch region... how should they get the money? 2) More spots at the season finals for the Korean region. Simply because the skill level would be so much higher. 3) More tournaments in Korea. These 4 WCS Seasons are simply not enough in this case. They can't just introduce a residency restriction without changing a lot. And I'd definitely prefer the current format over a format which just completely destroys the Korean scene. | ||
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SampritB
United Kingdom56 Posts
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quebecman77
Canada133 Posts
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Champi
1422 Posts
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BrowbeatSC2
Germany4 Posts
1. We (the foreign community) went to Korea for years! Now, when we want to establish our own scene we suddenly say: "Fuck you, Koreans! Stay out! You are too good!" ?! 2. If you actually want restrictions, then I demand that the prize pools get changed. NA players only deserve half of what EU players deserve and those only deserve half of the Korean ones. See where this is getting? But otherwise it wouldn't really be fair. Fact: NA players suck heavily and Koreans rock. 3. We are dumping the prize pools effectively on our own aswell then... Less commercial income due to a lesser variety in play and less bigger names, leading to even less commercial income... the spiral goes on and on 4. As a viewer I highly appreciate good and neat play over "Americans need to win!!!111" or the fact, that some people apparently can't enjoy good play without saying "This is my man!/team!" as in other sports. (I see several problems in my last point... would take too long to explain accurately what I mean... I guess I could illustrate it with the stereotype of an US citizen, screaming "USA! USA! WE ARE THE BEST! FUCK THE REST!" but still thinking that some imaginary "something" created us humans and actually cares about us humans more than about every other collection of atoms in this universe/not caring about the fact that their government probably fucked human and war rights more often than every other country, but still yelling "We need to get rid of those muslims!" and so on (I guess you get my point. - And as I said, I was using stereotypes... I know that by far not every american is like this - but as I'm not a native english speaker, this was a very easy way to illustrate my point. :p | ||
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CreationSoul
Romania231 Posts
Korean domination actually hurts SC2 and is the prime reason my interest in SC2 diminished. I want to cheer for local heroes like I do in LoL LCS (for EG and Vulcun). | ||
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TaishiCi
Korea (South)211 Posts
On October 07 2013 15:42 BrowbeatSC2 wrote: Okay... Voted "No". 1. We (the foreign community) went to Korea for years! Now, when we want to establish our own scene we suddenly say: "Fuck you, Koreans! Stay out! You are too good!" ?! 2. If you actually want restrictions, then I demand that the prize pools get changed. NA players only deserve half of what EU players deserve and those only deserve half of the Korean ones. See where this is getting? But otherwise it wouldn't really be fair. Fact: NA players suck heavily and Koreans rock. 3. We are dumping the prize pools effectively on our own aswell then... Less commercial income due to a lesser variety in play and less bigger names, leading to even less commercial income... the spiral goes on and on 4. As a viewer I highly appreciate good and neat play over "Americans need to win!!!111" or the fact, that some people apparently can't enjoy good play without saying "This is my man!/team!" as in other sports. (I see several problems in my last point... would take too long to explain accurately what I mean... I guess I could illustrate it with the stereotype of an US citizen, screaming "USA! USA! WE ARE THE BEST! FUCK THE REST!" but still thinking that some imaginary "something" created us humans and actually cares about us humans more than about every other collection of atoms in this universe/not caring about the fact that their government probably fucked human and war rights more often than every other country, but still yelling "We need to get rid of those muslims!" and so on (I guess you get my point. - And as I said, I was using stereotypes... I know that by far not every american is like this - but as I'm not a native english speaker, this was a very easy way to illustrate my point. :p I wish more people can appreciate the game like you. I think that is the difference between sc2 players and fanboys. People that can play the game at least at a plat level can understand the game enough to appreciate players for their mechanics, strategy, and nerves. Most people in masters league now are players that keep up with Koreans or at least shift with their meta. But on the point of Americans being bigger fanboys, I see way more BM and whine from EU side than NA. | ||
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superpanda27
111 Posts
On October 06 2013 20:19 BaneRiders wrote: You can still watch Koreans in Korea. So those who want to watch Europeans and Americans can get their chance in to watch WCS EU/AM. Everyone gets something to watch. Fair enough? That is from the viewers point of view. From the players point of view: Honor and glory comes in the season finals and the overall final, and there is nothing horribly unfair about having qualifications that allows participation in a grand final from the entire world. For both players and viewers: Please add another WCS Asia (excluding KR) so that we can have all the other Asians & Oceania playing in their timezone. I agree from a viewer's perspective, as much as I want to see skill I also want to see the region the competition is based in thrive by showing off its best players. WCS NA or WCS EU being represented by KR just doesn't sit right. I mean it doesn't help anyone that KR dominates the entire scene. It benefits everyone, the scene as a whole if every region is able to be competitive not just representatives from another region coming into another region just because in a way its 'easier" competition. I don't want to say it, but SC2 isn't as popular as it was and is fairly stagnate. And because Korea hasn't taken to SC2 as it had BW it doesn't have the support it (Korea) used to. The foreign competition is where SC2's longevity and support really is and if the foreign competition is squandered then SC2 will be stuck in Korea where it is a stagnant game. While I did vote "yes" I would put an asterisk next to that. Why not limit how many foreigners to a region can play in that region? Let's say an EU-based player tries to qualify for NA, they would have to play another EU player or KR player that is also trying to qualify for NA. Same goes for every region. Set aside 4-8 slots for foreigner competitors in a specific region. That would leave 24-28 slots for regional players. Having that happen guarantees that regional players make up the majority of competition. NA gets to mostly represent NA, EU mostly represents EU, and KR represents KR. TL;DR Foreign competition needs to thrive. While a form of region locking should exist, foreigners to a region should still be invited. Limit how many foreigners to a region can compete in the Premier League. 4-8 non-regional players in Premier. Separate Challenger division for non-regional players. | ||
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KingFool
Canada428 Posts
It all seems pretty muddy. I voted residency because I'm hoping it could all work out. Not because I think it will work. | ||
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superpanda27
111 Posts
On October 07 2013 15:42 BrowbeatSC2 wrote: Okay... Voted "No". 1. We (the foreign community) went to Korea for years! Now, when we want to establish our own scene we suddenly say: "Fuck you, Koreans! Stay out! You are too good!" ?! 2. If you actually want restrictions, then I demand that the prize pools get changed. NA players only deserve half of what EU players deserve and those only deserve half of the Korean ones. See where this is getting? But otherwise it wouldn't really be fair. Fact: NA players suck heavily and Koreans rock. 3. We are dumping the prize pools effectively on our own aswell then... Less commercial income due to a lesser variety in play and less bigger names, leading to even less commercial income... the spiral goes on and on 4. As a viewer I highly appreciate good and neat play over "Americans need to win!!!111" or the fact, that some people apparently can't enjoy good play without saying "This is my man!/team!" as in other sports. (I see several problems in my last point... would take too long to explain accurately what I mean... I guess I could illustrate it with the stereotype of an US citizen, screaming "USA! USA! WE ARE THE BEST! FUCK THE REST!" but still thinking that some imaginary "something" created us humans and actually cares about us humans more than about every other collection of atoms in this universe/not caring about the fact that their government probably fucked human and war rights more often than every other country, but still yelling "We need to get rid of those muslims!" and so on (I guess you get my point. - And as I said, I was using stereotypes... I know that by far not every american is like this - but as I'm not a native english speaker, this was a very easy way to illustrate my point. :p 1. It's not that the foreign scene is saying the "get the fuck out" it's that their dominance is hurting the scene as a whole. Even in Korea, SC2 is not as popular as it once was. SC2 as compared to BW days, is even more global than it was. 2. A higher prize pool for the most competitive region would be best. That should be determined by how many of a region's players are in the top 16 of WCS points. Obviously that is overwhelmingly going to be in the Korean's favor. I don't disagree with this point. 3. I don't quite what you're getting at. However, big names will find a way to thrive if they want to stay big. What the scene needs is to propel new talent while also trying keep enough big names from falling. You want a variety in play, but I say a variety in players directly supports more variety in play. No matter if they are Korean or not. 4. This is a very subjective point. But you have to look at the base viewer, which is the casual viewer. That kind of viewer doesn't know or get what good and neat play is. They want to be entertained. When it comes that type of viewer it is easier relate to the player rather than having them fully understand how good that play is. | ||
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Leimus
72 Posts
1) I want to watch quality games. If it's Koreans, so be it. 2) I don't support players due to their nationality, but due to their playstyle and thus it's a good thing for me that the other WCS regions have some Koreans in them. 3) It makes 0 sense that weaker players from EU/NA would get into season finals or BlizzCon only to be completely crushed. Currently they'll have to be on the level of competition to even get there, which is good. | ||
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Desive
Spain13 Posts
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ninazerg
United States7291 Posts
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insanet
Peru439 Posts
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Aserrin
Uruguay231 Posts
Besides, the skill level difference between the koreans and the rest is abysmal. I doubt anyone would watch WCS EU and especially NA without them. Not to say it would be ridiculous to give the same prize pool to considerably less skilled players. | ||
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Akaann
Switzerland82 Posts
On September 27 2013 00:34 j1nzo wrote: i mean think about it- if the best football/basketball etc players were koreans, would we really wanna restrict their number and prevent us from watching the best play? In Champions League not, but if there would be a world championship held, than certainly each country would build their team out of their players. And since this should be a world championship, europe/na and korea should each send their best players. And in terms of fairness. Nobody out there says, in Brazil it's much more difficult to get into the football national team, so a brazil football player who don't make it there can play in the swiss national team because he is still better then swiss nationplayers. But that's exactly what is allowed in de WCS. So imho this is no world championship, it's just a large tournament. I would prefer the system of 2012. Many torunaments like GSL, NASL, MLG, DH, IEM etc. and than one World Championship... | ||
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LastLordofCastamere
288 Posts
RO32 onward should be completely offline and preferably more spread out. Any players that go through the qualification process and are able to attend should attend. The Korean scene need more tournaments - OSL and GSL should be separate tournaments with some playoff to determine which players go on to the season finals to represent the Korean region (some weekend tournaments won't hurt, either) | ||
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ShadowBrood
United States9 Posts
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BrowbeatSC2
Germany4 Posts
On October 08 2013 13:48 superpanda27 wrote: 1. It's not that the foreign scene is saying the "get the fuck out" it's that their dominance is hurting the scene as a whole. Even in Korea, SC2 is not as popular as it once was. SC2 as compared to BW days, is even more global than it was. 2. A higher prize pool for the most competitive region would be best. That should be determined by how many of a region's players are in the top 16 of WCS points. Obviously that is overwhelmingly going to be in the Korean's favor. I don't disagree with this point. 3. I don't quite what you're getting at. However, big names will find a way to thrive if they want to stay big. What the scene needs is to propel new talent while also trying keep enough big names from falling. You want a variety in play, but I say a variety in players directly supports more variety in play. No matter if they are Korean or not. 4. This is a very subjective point. But you have to look at the base viewer, which is the casual viewer. That kind of viewer doesn't know or get what good and neat play is. They want to be entertained. When it comes that type of viewer it is easier relate to the player rather than having them fully understand how good that play is. I know that my 4th point is subjective - as is basically my whole post as it is heavily influenced by my opinion. To explain what I meant with my 3rd point though: Forbidding the REAL BIG NAMES like Innovation/Mvp/DRG to participate in european tournaments results in way less commercial income for the respective tournaments, as those players produce way more income than for example Goody. | ||
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paralleluniverse
4065 Posts
No one has been able to explain how Blizzard can do a workable, creditable and fair WCS system if region locking is removed. There are 2 options for a Blizzard-run WCS tournament: 1. Continue without region lock, like it is now (my preference). 2. End WCS NA and EU and move everyone over to WCS Korea. Other tournaments (not WCS-related) will have to fill the void left in NA and EU. | ||
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HYRULE15
Germany72 Posts
Koreans. I would love to cheer for more foreigners in the wcs finals, but I still voted for no. I think the Koreans competing in other regions wcs tournaments should think about that by their own, I personally think its kind of sad that they are avoiding the high lvl competition in wcs Korea, by just fleeing from it and competing in other regions. EDIT: I agree on a opinion posted before, Korea should get two main tournaments with wcs seats. | ||
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Aserrin
Uruguay231 Posts
On October 11 2013 01:18 Akaann wrote:And in terms of fairness. Nobody out there says, in Brazil it's much more difficult to get into the football national team, so a brazil football player who don't make it there can play in the swiss national team because he is still better then swiss nationplayers. But that's exactly what is allowed in de WCS. Except WCS isn't like the world cup, that's WCG. I think WCS is more like the continental tournaments, and WCS Global Finals are the club's world cup. In your example a brazilian player can go from his country to Switzerland, dominate, get signed to stronger teams, and end up playing the Champion's League (WCS Europe) instead of Copa Libertadores (WCS America), and if he does well in any of these he'll reach Club's World Cup (WCS Global). | ||
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Zorkmid
4410 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate Just like I won't watch any Starcraft if it features two B-tier foreigners. Games like HasuObs vs. Happy from a recent challenger league make me want to never open a tournament stream again. | ||
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ECA.BruTATroN
United States282 Posts
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SinO[Ob]
France897 Posts
And a higher prize pool for WCS KR is an absolute obligation! Nopbody will care about that cause its totally legit. Higher lvl of play = more money. | ||
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SamirDuran
Philippines894 Posts
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partouf
Netherlands405 Posts
That said, I would vote for residency; players like MC, Stardust, ForGG, MMA, maybe DuckDuck if he stays at SK, etc should be able to stay in WCS EU. | ||
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Warcry
United States47 Posts
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Khai
Australia551 Posts
On September 27 2013 02:27 elmoDD wrote: I won't be watching WCS EU/NA anymore if the Koreans continue to dominate The racism and xenophobia is strong in this one, sadly he's not a minority. | ||
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guN-viCe
United States687 Posts
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mnck
Denmark1518 Posts
Also hope that all premier league games are played offline in the future. Not sure if its a possibility tho. Would be sick! | ||
nimdil
Poland3748 Posts
On October 13 2013 11:12 Khai wrote: The racism and xenophobia is strong in this one, sadly he's not a minority. That's neither racism nor xenophobia. o_O | ||
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boxerfred
Germany8360 Posts
On September 26 2013 20:38 thimius wrote: Do you also think its fair that Kane, Goswser and Demuslim could end up winning the same prize money as say...Soulkey, Jaedong, Innovation, Rain and any other of the 50 koreany players that are ACTUALLY better players than the American ones? BEcause if they were to create a region lock, the code A of korea should actually have a higher prize pool than the american premier one, it's sad to say, but it's actually the truth... Yes. Those guys can prove that they are better and earn more prize money via the global finals. What you're saying is not the truth, it's your opinion. Different things, sometimes. | ||
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yocheco619
United States28 Posts
On October 12 2013 10:50 HyJynX wrote: i would love to have a NORTH AMERICAN CHAMPION If they can't compete against a Code A Korean or, heaven forbid, a round of 32 code S player, they aren't really a champion and everyone knows it. To be the best you have to beat the best. | ||
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BaneRiders
Sweden3630 Posts
On October 15 2013 22:36 yocheco619 wrote: If they can't compete against a Code A Korean or, heaven forbid, a round of 32 code S player, they aren't really a champion and everyone knows it. To be the best you have to beat the best. No, this is not correct. In order to crown a North American Champion, you will have to have a tournament with only North Americans in it, where the best North American has beaten the best North America has to offer. It has absolutely nothing to do with Korea, Brazil or Sweden for that matter. FYI - Sweden had a National Championship (in connection with DH this summer). Naniwa beat ThorZain and took the crown as the "King in the North". | ||
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theatreofwar
Canada60 Posts
I used to love the GSL. I watched it religiously. I'd stay up until five in the morning to stream it live. But now WCS has effectively devalued its prestige in the SC2 scene, we get less seasons of it every year because hosting KR has been split with OSL whose format I don't like, and the whole region lock mess meant that the concentration of my favourite players was diminished around AM and EU where they were busy smashing my favourite foreigner players into the ground and then some. I saw the same few Korean players in EU and AM all the time as I expected and stopped watching because it's boring. I've maybe followed KR for half the year at most, and only because I'm that loyal to GOMTV and the GSL. However as it turns out currently, we might see one non-Korean player in the global finals. Just the one, and only if other Koreans marginally lower in points don't do well in the next couple of weeks. Doesn't seem right to me. </rant> | ||
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TaishiCi
Korea (South)211 Posts
On October 14 2013 19:38 boxerfred wrote: Yes. Those guys can prove that they are better and earn more prize money via the global finals. What you're saying is not the truth, it's your opinion. Different things, sometimes. Soulkey, Jaedong, Innovation is on the same level as Kane, Goswser, and Demuslim? It really doesn't look like it from the competition that they are playing against. | ||
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Brian333
657 Posts
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Ctone23
United States1839 Posts
It's obviously a touchy subject, you hate to tell someone "no", but at the same time, the goal is for SC2 to be more popular. | ||
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TheMagicianSC2
France74 Posts
But imagine a full NA players... how boring would it be. The best way is for sure a limit, but not a total restriction. sorry for my poor eng skills. | ||
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TheMagicianSC2
France74 Posts
On October 16 2013 03:00 TaishiCi wrote: Soulkey, Jaedong, Innovation is on the same level as Kane, Goswser, and Demuslim? It really doesn't look like it from the competition that they are playing against. Total agree. | ||
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RyLai
United States477 Posts
I would not watch WCS NA or WCS EU if there are 0 Koreans in it. I watch the game for the quality of play, not for foreigner consolation matches. If foreigners want to get better, then train harder than the Koreans and rip carbon copy builds like they do. Some foreigners did that, and as a result competed at their level. Jinro worked his ass off and got to GSL semifinals. I'm not saying other foreigners don't also work their asses off, some damn well do, but a lot of Koreans work at least as hard as well as preparing retarded builds tailored for a single win on a single map. I forgot who it was, Ganzi or MMA, but someone in the GSL (I think Super Tournament) in a TvT brought out 2-3 sick cheeses designed just for the maps they played on. And people were talking about how Maru all ins the crap out of everyone. If we restrict Koreans from distributing themselves around the world, then we get a bunch of foreigners who don't deserve to be at Blizzcon and getting the crap stomped out of the the instant they hit a Korean in the draw (only a few foreigners would be an exemption to this rule, and they have a fairly high chance of qualifying regardless of whether we enforce restrictions on tournament entry or not). You'd be giving some foreigner fans the delusion that player X is playing well and has a chance at winning Blizzcon against the Koreans, where he/she proceeds to get 2-0'd or 3-0'd by the first Korean they meet. The quality of play at Blizzcon would drop sharply until the round of 8 at least assuming none of the Koreans meet each other in the draw. I mean, yes, it would be nice to have a place to grow local hopes. But for something as big as what WCS NA and WCS EU give you, that's NOT the tournament for it. This is one of the reasons the current WCS system should be scrapped in its entirety. It's just a bad system all around. You can never really please anyone, but with the current WCS system, everyone gets fucked over some way or another. | ||
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liberate71
Australia10252 Posts
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
A lot of these people suffer from tunnel vision and at the end of the day the format won't affect your viewership. If there is one thing Blizzard understood it's the fact that it's important to make sure skill is spread throughout. If North Americans don't get good repetitions in they'll only get further behind. They don't learn much from losing to run of the mill, average Koreans. You don't learn much when you get your 15 seconds of fame by playing only 2 to 3 sets either. Give them 20 kicks at the can. You already have 24 major tournaments scattered throughout a year. I recommend you use them. On October 13 2013 04:29 Warcry wrote: Definitely Residency, not citizenship That's what they wanted in the first place. There are a lot of glaring issues with following a similar scheme to Riot's model, but most people don't know any better (they don't even follow the LoL scene). We need more forward-thinkers. ![[image loading]](http://emoticonhq.com/images/MSN/MSNsick.gif) | ||
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