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On May 17 2010 11:50 danbel1005 wrote:Ma Jae Yoon DIDNT DO IT. The Fucking MAESTRO of Zerg didnt do shit.  Stop this nonsense crap. ITS OBVIOUS, Progamers have nothing to do with all this stupidity. Progamers train more than 10 hours a day everyday for weeks after weeks after weeks and You want me to believe that one or two or three of them agreed to lose on "purpose" after days of nonstop training. How many of u can believe such thing? This has nothing to do with progamers specifically, BUT with Coaching Staff and such cuz those are the ones who could agreed to such shit and have no regrets, after all they Do Not have to go through ridiculous training sessions, backstage stuff, and shit like that before a televised match. I can not imagine this being possible. IM ON PROGAMERS side. If they say they r innocent I will TOTALLY believe it. Those fuckers who r really involve in this lame situation were ask for names, so they did it, they started giving out names, BUT as in every scandal similar to this one, they gave names randomly, they lied about it, Of Course they did, they wanna keep this going in the near future. They will not give the real names and lose this fucktard business. There's a Mr. Ma involved in this thing and everyone is relating him to Savior, WTF ppl, that Mr. Ma could be anybody. I Hope I would know the truth about this, unfortunately no one does. And as in almost every single thing that happens in this world, when something gets big and turns out to be an OMFG Moment in history the truth always evolves behind the story we are being told. Obviously we get to know only what they want us to know, and most the time the result is a big, twisted, well worked fixed lie, I know that by a fact...I live in America.  
If only we were all like this...
Gullibility is so great....
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Reading the entire thread and it's still just players extremely likely to have done it. I want to hold out until we get that news that they're actually guilty if I can.
Yes progaming won't end because of this scandal, E-sports will live on but this does affect some fans more than others like Savior and Sparkyz fans. Though I would still be a Sparkyz fan if this is true (unless even more members are indicated) it's pretty upsetting.
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Baltimore, USA22260 Posts
Ugh, DarkElf, nooooo.... didn't think I'd see his name on this list. The rest, meh...
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On May 17 2010 11:50 danbel1005 wrote:
ITS OBVIOUS, Progamers have nothing to do with all this stupidity. Progamers train more than 10 hours a day everyday for weeks after weeks after weeks and You want me to believe that one or two or three of them agreed to lose on "purpose" after days of nonstop training. How many of u can believe such thing?
Happens all the time mate, that's the key to match fixing. No one would bet on someone who is slacking off, not practicing etc. The key to match fixing is that the player is expected to win, because of their hard work, experience, training and skill. They have to keep up the image that they are seriously trying in order not to arouse suspicion. Sad, but true.
On May 17 2010 12:21 Zato-1 wrote:For all the hate and disappointment directed at Ma Jae Yoon in this thread, he can still kick the ass out of just about anyone who's posted in this thread in a starcraft match anyway- especially since I don't think he'll be throwing any more games again.
I doubt he will be playing many more games lolz
On May 17 2010 12:35 29 fps wrote:
it also occurred to me that many more players than the ones listed knew about the match-fixing but didn't say anything about it. i'm guessing that not everyone who was asked to throw a game away for money said yes to it. And also players who weren't involved might have overheard info inside their practice houses. of course, nobody wants to be the snitch.
Yeah, if you look at the article it says one of the guys doing the bribing is a known gangster in korea. I don't know how gangsters operate in korea but I sure as fuck wouldn't be speaking out against organised crime. I wouldn't want to risk getting my kneecaps shot/legs broken/murdered for whistleblowing against people making a few thousand extra dollars in starcraft. On top of that, many of these progamers are just kids, most who know nothing outside of starcraft which they live and breathe.
I definitely also feel that the match fixing was considerably more extensive but has been covered up amongst the current top players by KeSpa, an organisation with which corruption seems to go hand in hand. It seems that the players that were reported are ones that wouldn't have too huge an effect on the pro scene's health overall - a little too convenient if you ask me.
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It seems they did this incredibly cheaply...
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fuck yea, Gangster Ma strikes again!
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Lol, Protoss players are most ethical 
Can't say I'm surprised by this, considering that every major sport has had some kind of similar scandal, and in Korea Starcraft is as big as a major sport in another country.
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Baltimore, USA22260 Posts
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On May 17 2010 11:50 danbel1005 wrote:Ma Jae Yoon DIDNT DO IT. The Fucking MAESTRO of Zerg didnt do shit. Stop this nonsense crap. ITS OBVIOUS, Progamers have nothing to do with all this stupidity. Progamers train more than 10 hours a day everyday for weeks after weeks after weeks and You want me to believe that one or two or three of them agreed to lose on "purpose" after days of nonstop training. How many of u can believe such thing? This has nothing to do with progamers specifically, BUT with Coaching Staff and such cuz those are the ones who could agreed to such shit and have no regrets, after all they Do Not have to go through ridiculous training sessions, backstage stuff, and shit like that before a televised match. I can not imagine this being possible. IM ON PROGAMERS side. If they say they r innocent I will TOTALLY believe it. Those fuckers who r really involve in this lame situation were ask for names, so they did it, they started giving out names, BUT as in every scandal similar to this one, they gave names randomly, they lied about it, Of Course they did, they wanna keep this going in the near future. They will not give the real names and lose this fucktard business. There's a Mr. Ma involved in this thing and everyone is relating him to Savior, WTF ppl, that Mr. Ma could be anybody. I Hope I would know the truth about this, unfortunately no one does. And as in almost every single thing that happens in this world, when something gets big and turns out to be an OMFG Moment in history the truth always evolves behind the story we are being told. Obviously we get to know only what they want us to know, and most the time the result is a big, twisted, well worked fixed lie, I know that by a fact...I live in America.
I'm on to you Romanian
On May 17 2010 12:21 Zato-1 wrote:For all the hate and disappointment directed at Ma Jae Yoon in this thread, he can still kick the ass out of just about anyone who's posted in this thread in a starcraft match anyway- especially since I don't think he'll be throwing any more games again.
Hey fanboy, no one here was making the claim that he could beat Savior in a match. The issue here (you prolly don't know this yet) is that Savior and a bunch of other progamers are throwing matches (oh, and you probably don't know this yet, but this has more to do with ethics). So, next time, plz refrain yourself from making the "He can beat the shit out of you, so he's ok" argument.
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Korea (South)17174 Posts
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It does...
I just can't understand a word of it ¬¬
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On May 17 2010 13:26 O-ops wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2010 12:21 Zato-1 wrote:For all the hate and disappointment directed at Ma Jae Yoon in this thread, he can still kick the ass out of just about anyone who's posted in this thread in a starcraft match anyway- especially since I don't think he'll be throwing any more games again. Hey fanboy, no one here was making the claim that he could beat Savior in a match. The issue here (you prolly don't know this yet) is that Savior and a bunch of other progamers are throwing matches (oh, and you probably don't know this yet, but this has more to do with ethics). So, next time, plz refrain yourself from making the "He can beat the shit out of you, so he's ok" argument.
hahahahahahaha. I am the farthest thing possible from a Savior fanboy- If you didn't understand my point, let me reiterate it for you:
Savior's the hero of a lot of people in the Brood Wars scene- just like Boxer, Jaedong, or Bisu, name your pick. We don't look up to these people due to their outstanding moral character- we look up to them because they're mind-blowingly good at Starcraft.
I'd be offended by your tone, but your comment is just too funny for someone who's had to endure the ravings of actual Savior fanboys for so long.
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I'm sorry I know this is hard to believe but imo I think its a possibility. I mean I really hope all this is not true because alot of the progamers listed we all love! I don't remember which competition it was but I remember Hwasin vs Calm I believe, and in a fpvod it showed Calm whispering to Hwasin telling him his build, funny that Hwasin scouted only the natural in that game. Maybe some players feel as if they're not making enough money or wouldn't mind using some extra money so they agree to such bribes, but I really hope its not true!!
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You know, if anyone should be investigated for throwing games.... it's Stork. I mean, cmonnnnnnnnnn. Should Stork really lose to ANYONE??
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On May 17 2010 13:34 Zato-1 wrote:
hahahahahahaha. I am the farthest thing possible from a Savior fanboy- If you didn't understand my point, let me reiterate it for you:
Savior's the hero of a lot of people in the Brood Wars scene- just like Boxer, Jaedong, or Bisu, name your pick. We don't look up to these people due to their outstanding moral character- we look up to them because they're mind-blowingly good at Starcraft.
I'd be offended by your tone, but your comment is just too funny for someone who's had to endure the ravings of actual Savior fanboys for so long.
So let's say that he's the greatest player to have ever played starcraft.
And he got lazy.
And he maphacked.
Are you saying that you wouldn't care, just because he's mind-blowingly good at starcraft?
People are hurt because he has made all of his games, and progaming in general, seem illegitimate. When you say that these criticisms are invalid because he's better at starcraft than anyone here... can you understand how much that misses the point?
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On May 17 2010 13:34 Zato-1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2010 13:26 O-ops wrote:On May 17 2010 12:21 Zato-1 wrote:For all the hate and disappointment directed at Ma Jae Yoon in this thread, he can still kick the ass out of just about anyone who's posted in this thread in a starcraft match anyway- especially since I don't think he'll be throwing any more games again. Hey fanboy, no one here was making the claim that he could beat Savior in a match. The issue here (you prolly don't know this yet) is that Savior and a bunch of other progamers are throwing matches (oh, and you probably don't know this yet, but this has more to do with ethics). So, next time, plz refrain yourself from making the "He can beat the shit out of you, so he's ok" argument. hahahahahahaha. I am the farthest thing possible from a Savior fanboy- If you didn't understand my point, let me reiterate it for you: Savior's the hero of a lot of people in the Brood Wars scene- just like Boxer, Jaedong, or Bisu, name your pick. We don't look up to these people due to their outstanding moral character- we look up to them because they're mind-blowingly good at Starcraft. I'd be offended by your tone, but your comment is just too funny for someone who's had to endure the ravings of actual Savior fanboys for so long.
Many of us here aren't feeling comfortable being backstabbed. I don't watch Savior because of his high moral standings, but when he fucked up this bad he betrayed anyone who follow his progress out there, both the fans, the antifans, and the casuals. This is even worse to those people who considered him their hero for any reason, just like you said.
And i prolly should go root for the people who could beat me on iccup now since they could "kick the ass" out of me LOL
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I don't understand at all.
What's the purpose of that cannon placement?
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On May 17 2010 13:42 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2010 13:34 Zato-1 wrote:
hahahahahahaha. I am the farthest thing possible from a Savior fanboy- If you didn't understand my point, let me reiterate it for you:
Savior's the hero of a lot of people in the Brood Wars scene- just like Boxer, Jaedong, or Bisu, name your pick. We don't look up to these people due to their outstanding moral character- we look up to them because they're mind-blowingly good at Starcraft.
I'd be offended by your tone, but your comment is just too funny for someone who's had to endure the ravings of actual Savior fanboys for so long. So let's say that he's the greatest player to have ever played starcraft. And he got lazy. And he maphacked. Are you saying that you wouldn't care, just because he's mind-blowingly good at starcraft? People are hurt because he has made all of his games, and progaming in general, seem illegitimate. When you say that these criticisms are invalid because he's better at starcraft than anyone here... can you understand how much that misses the point?
Your reading comprehension is appalling.
Really slowly now, so you can follow: The world isn't black and white. You can have very successful businessmen who are lousy parents; great starcraft players who are very bad mannered; and great leaders of people who engage in corruption.
In Savior's case, there's this ugly side of his life everyone's commenting in this thread. Criticizing it is completely valid, because it was retarded of him to get involved in this. However, this doesn't mean Savior goes from hero to villain overnight; dropping matches certainly doesn't invalidate his past achievements. Maradona is arguably the best football (soccer) player ever, but he did drugs- does his drug use (purely recreational, no steroids or such) invalidate his kickass football skills? No. You have to take the good with the bad.
I feel it is unfair to Savior to just say, "He was engaged in illegal match-fixing and is therefore scum"
What I'm saying instead is, "He's a very talented and successful Starcraft player, who also engaged in illegal match-fixing. The former quality is commendable; the latter, deplorable."
User was warned for this post
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On May 17 2010 14:00 okum wrote:I don't understand at all. What's the purpose of that cannon placement?
yaa that cannon placement is very questionable i don't understand it either
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EPT![[image loading]](http://thimg.dreamwiz.com/upfile/201005/1274069553106_2.jpg)
