EPTIt's precisely this imbalance that leads players to come up with new micro, and try new units / build orders.
[SC2B] Power Overwhelming - Page 8
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bay
United States20 Posts
It's precisely this imbalance that leads players to come up with new micro, and try new units / build orders. | ||
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guitarizt
United States1492 Posts
On April 20 2010 23:30 mcneebs wrote: I still don't know why so many new players feel that they know how to balance a game better than those who have been designing them for the past 15 years. OP should be mandatory reading for everyone and I totally agree with this ^. If bw was in beta as it is today I would think a whole ton of stuff would have to be changed to make it balanced if I didn't know any better. | ||
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DoomBacon
United States165 Posts
SC:BW matches always seem like a race to see who can get the crazyest stuff done the fastest and get away with it. That said some units/abilities are truly broken in SC2. In my eyes the only major issue still with the game other than possible minor HP dmg and build time changes. That issue is the sentry's force field. It makes it almost impossible to engage a protoss ground army with a ground army of your own since they can either cut your army in half or make it impossible to have any kind of concave. It also serves an enraging tactic of infinitely walling a ramp, for just 400 mins 800 gas (does even need to be spent all at once since they spawn in with enough energy to cast it) at the cybernetics core tech with no research you can prevent any ground army from moving up your ramp or down their own until they have enough air to overwhelm the sentries (which are fairly strong combat units for cost). I'm not sure just adding HP to the forcefields would be enough but it would certainly be better than no change. | ||
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3FFA
United States3931 Posts
On April 20 2010 23:20 Plexa wrote: Good article This ^^ I loved it all and agreed with almost all of it. Why didn't you talk about dark swarm against any race but terran? | ||
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Skeggaba
Korea (South)1556 Posts
Also, you are making a very good point. The chance of an epic comeback (most exciting maybe in ZvT with perfectly controlled swarms combined with scourge that kills SV and dropships) is definitely a big factor to why i love the game so much, and why i dont just turn of the game after 10 minutes. | ||
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Orpheos
United States1663 Posts
I especially like the point about how roaches and marauders are all-purpose. SC1 had some really powerful units but were all kinda niche. lurker, defiler, reaver, vulture etc. they had certain roles to fill in a varied attack strategy. also another key thing about them is that they required TECH. Thats why i really like banshees and ravens(2 of my fav units in SC2). they are really cool and powerful but require tech and a strategy/game plan to go along with it. SC2 better add on more creative units like the lurker and vulture in the next expansions(emphasis on LIKE the lurker and vult not the same units) | ||
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Jugan
United States1566 Posts
 Although I'm still going to keep whining about immortals LOL | ||
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iheartpurplez
Canada54 Posts
I really feel like smartcasting should be removed from the game. Yes, spells would be harder for some players to use, but because the skills would be harder to use they could get buffed and become 'cool' or interesting again. The point that "this fear of the overpowered could eventually end up hurting the game" is something i strongly agree with and i feel like that's exactly how blizzard is approaching the balancing of SC2 so far. I hope something does change; I really want to see powerful units and spells such as lurkers and dark swarm reappear in the game. also, i think carriers need to be changed / given their old system of attacking back. | ||
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ELA
Denmark4608 Posts
I don't know if it's a World of Warcraft thing going on right now, with "Nerf this, this class is OP" etc. I hope that every poster reads this article before crying out, that Immortals/Banshees/Broodlords needs nerfs.. ELA. | ||
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Dragonman777
United States17 Posts
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da_head
Canada3350 Posts
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Ilithyium
Denmark88 Posts
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-orb-
United States5770 Posts
The best example is dark swarm with lurkers. This is essentially a combination that has only one terran counter: irradiate. Lurkers burrowed underneath dark swarm are practically invincible to anything other than irradiate that terran is likely to have. Yet it stayed in the game, and it definitely didn't break the game. And then you say that because as it is now, there's just no way, apart from brood lords, to approach a properly controlled protoss ball, and you certainly want more than one potential counter for a unit. Also I know I'm not alone in saying that Zerg has the advantage with the current balance in ZvP... in the polls on the tl sc2 forums it's definitely a large majority that think Zerg is the imba one... | ||
Inkblood
United States463 Posts
The Raven has Point Defense Drone, which can really turn the tides of battle if you’re fighting anything with projectiles. And it doesn’t cost a huge amount of energy. It’s a bit like dark swarm, just not quite as good. It also has Hunter-Seeker Missile, which deals a ton of damage if it connects. The opponent can of course micro the Hunter-Seekered unit away, and take little or no damage. But it’s kind of like microing out of storm, yeah you can do it, but chances are you’re going to take some heavy damage. Then there’s the Infestor for zerg, Neural Parasite isn’t super powerful, but it can be useful against huge units like the Thor and Colossus. But Fungal Growth is pretty potent. Yeah it deals kind of sad damage, especially when compared to Plague. But it’s really the damage when coupled with the movement stopping effect that is really what makes this powerful. Say you’re up against a Roach, Muta army, and you’ve got some Infestors and a fair number of Hydra’s out. Using Fungal Growth on the enemy army would enable you to pretty much walk all over them. (And if you have energy left over you can throw down some Infested Terran) Muta/Roach only have 3 range, unless I’m mistaken, while Infested Terran and Hyrda have 5. They can outrange the enemy army easily, and tear through them. Oh, and it’s also good against ranged units, because they can’t micro and if you have melee units you can close the gap quickly and take out the softened up enemy units. I know that not all situations will be custom tailored to make Fungal Growth look powerful, but I’m just saying that though we don’t have abilities as powerful as in BW, they are pretty close.(Unless Blizzard continues nurfing things.) (There’s also the ghost but this post is getting to lengthy anyways. And all that really needs be said is they devour Protoss shields and any energy.) Once again I agree with most of the points Drone made, I just wanted to articulate my opinion that we are not totally lost of potent units. I disagree with giving Force Fields life, it would totally clutter up big battles, and give Protoss a sort of mobile meat shield. Good post though. TTFN | ||
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Mykill
Canada3402 Posts
makes sense | ||
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zul
Germany5427 Posts
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bjwithbraces
United States549 Posts
That being said you have to be honest with yourself about what you can and can not do. Example: TvZ and terran banshee rushes zerg and the zerg player says "Well I couldn't have done anything, banshees rape me and kill my queen and I have no early Anti-Air. Well that's not true, if you get an evolution chamber earlier in your build(cuz you better be getting at least one but probably two later) you now can build a spore crawler that can hold off the air with your queen, allowing you to get mutas or hydras to respond. | ||
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Versita
Canada1032 Posts
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InDaHouse
Sweden956 Posts
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Swap
Sweden144 Posts
I also agree that unique and powerful units is one of Brood Wars biggest advantages! But hey! A beta period like this have never been seen before, we also cant say for sure whats good and bad about the ways things turning. Its probably going to end up pretty good. When the game feels kind of balanced, maybe Blizzard can start patching with audience aspects in mind, and so on.. Anyway, really nice writeup! Keep those damn good articles coming and Im happy. (Especially when battle.net Europe having a downperiod, sob sob sob.) | ||
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