EPTOn September 08 2009 20:11 Alethios wrote:
In essence, you claim the following:
-The MSL final wasn't bad. You didn't say however, that the MSL wasn't.
-Effort and Jaedong were at the absolute peak of their games, and Calm beat them both.
-This is significant because ZvZ is the hardest matchup at the moment for Zergs because they stomp the other races.
Firstly, the final. Calm versus Kwanro, who you neglect to mention, entirely with good reason. Kwanro (love or hate him), has not won a ZvZ this season against anybody but Zero and great. Furthermore, he is completely absent from the power rank (or even the CBNC catergory), despite being in a MSL final. Hardly the record of a serious contender to the MSL crown.
Now look at this month's power rank. Effort, slipped down to 10 because "The CJ Zerg didn't really put much of himself into playing these few weeks, and it shows." Jaedong, whos best matchup has admittedly traditionally been ZvZ was instead losing to players like Hyuk, Orion and Effort. Hardly the performance of a ZvZ bonjwa who our valiant hero Calm beat, against the odds. Again, look at the power rank "For most players, a week like that would have meant only one thing, a beginning of a long, excruciatingly bad slump". I'm not trying to make excuses for Jaedong. but It's you trying to make excuses for Calm.
Now this idea of the ZvZ being damned tough. Full credit to Calm. He pulled off some great plays throughout the tournament. He turned his weakness into a relative strength and anybody deserves credit for that. Firstly, It further diminishes his wins against the Terrans early on, leaving only his ZvZ matches to speak well of him, but they don't. He won them, he often won them convincingly, but, in my opinion, he has yet to prove anything significant.
I admired Calm's games this season, I eagerly await to see where he goes from here, but I don't see any evidence to suggest that this MSL should be regarded as an amazing achievement on par with, for example, Bisu's win in Gom S1, or most other starleagues for that matter, as Hot Bid suggests.
In essence, you claim the following:
-The MSL final wasn't bad. You didn't say however, that the MSL wasn't.
-Effort and Jaedong were at the absolute peak of their games, and Calm beat them both.
-This is significant because ZvZ is the hardest matchup at the moment for Zergs because they stomp the other races.
Firstly, the final. Calm versus Kwanro, who you neglect to mention, entirely with good reason. Kwanro (love or hate him), has not won a ZvZ this season against anybody but Zero and great. Furthermore, he is completely absent from the power rank (or even the CBNC catergory), despite being in a MSL final. Hardly the record of a serious contender to the MSL crown.
Now look at this month's power rank. Effort, slipped down to 10 because "The CJ Zerg didn't really put much of himself into playing these few weeks, and it shows." Jaedong, whos best matchup has admittedly traditionally been ZvZ was instead losing to players like Hyuk, Orion and Effort. Hardly the performance of a ZvZ bonjwa who our valiant hero Calm beat, against the odds. Again, look at the power rank "For most players, a week like that would have meant only one thing, a beginning of a long, excruciatingly bad slump". I'm not trying to make excuses for Jaedong. but It's you trying to make excuses for Calm.
Now this idea of the ZvZ being damned tough. Full credit to Calm. He pulled off some great plays throughout the tournament. He turned his weakness into a relative strength and anybody deserves credit for that. Firstly, It further diminishes his wins against the Terrans early on, leaving only his ZvZ matches to speak well of him, but they don't. He won them, he often won them convincingly, but, in my opinion, he has yet to prove anything significant.
I admired Calm's games this season, I eagerly await to see where he goes from here, but I don't see any evidence to suggest that this MSL should be regarded as an amazing achievement on par with, for example, Bisu's win in Gom S1, or most other starleagues for that matter, as Hot Bid suggests.
aaand
On September 08 2009 23:24 Dagobert wrote:
"-Effort and Jaedong were at the absolute peak of their games, and Calm beat them both."
Well, I guess if you call a tremendous training schedule for proleague and two major individual leagues, personal problems / FA disaster 'absolute peak of his game'...
"-Effort and Jaedong were at the absolute peak of their games, and Calm beat them both."
Well, I guess if you call a tremendous training schedule for proleague and two major individual leagues, personal problems / FA disaster 'absolute peak of his game'...
Ok, I did exaggerate a bit, but still... the FA thing came much later, and it didn't seem to hinder him in the OSL. While he did lose a few games, he was on top of the Power Rank for a reason - overall Jaedong was doing better than anyone else. Yes he lost a few games. Still, in a short span of time, he went to the semifinals in the MSL, he won OSL (and his golden mouse) and was in the Proleague finals. With results like those it's hard to argue that Jaedong was in any way slumping.
Yes, Effort did produce less spectacular results lately, but at the moment of the game he was still seen as the 2nd best zerg, with a ZvZ that rivals JD's.
I guess the win would have been more spectacular (and memorable) if it didn't happen in a time of such obvious zerg domination - but the way I see it, it's no less of an achievement than say... Stork's OSL or Bisu's last MSL - both of which took place in a time of protoss dominance, when the six dragons were tearing things up.
He managed to beat two of the best players of the moment in the only matchup that couldn't invoke some map imbalance. Sure, it would have been nice if he had met the likes of Bisu, Fantasy or Flash along the way, but you can't meet all the aces in one tournament.
It wasn't a perfect MSL, but there is no such thing. While this win doesn't suddenly mean he's S-class, it is no less relevant than any other MSL title of any other player.
his MSL run was so fucking awesome, Sea, Kal, flash, AND Jaedong? GODDAMN
