Hi, Wax from TLMC here to give an update on the provisional ladder map pool and some thoughts on the feedback so far.

We began with a 6 new, 3 old split of maps, as the last pre-EWC rotation also retained a number of old maps. Also, it seemed safer to go for a partial rotation on TLMC's first go about. Still, there was some community feedback wanting a full nine-map rotation, and the longer history of map pool rotations suggests there isn't a set standard for what percent of maps get swapped out.

In response, we're putting out a second provisional pool, which has already been tested in a couple of this week's Monday cup events. Again, this is not the final pool, and adjustments will be made depending on gameplay and feedback.

As said in the original announcement, there are no illusions that TLMC voting is a comprehensive representation of the entire SC2 community, and that's the same with any enthusiast community site such as TL.net or Reddit. However, we still value any information we can get, so we're hosting an open poll on the TL.net front page (and Reddit) about community preference on carrying current maps over into the next pool.

Thank you for your feedback so far!

Provisional Map Pool #2

Top 4 community voted maps from TLMC #20 finalists

Last Fantasy
Persephone
Torches
The Grid (new)

Top 4 pro-player polled maps from TLMC #20 finalists (polled via the old ESL feedback chat)

Incorporeal
Tokamak
Magannatha
Killer's Mile (new)

Top 1 pick from map-maker poll

~~Tokamak~~ (overlap with pro-poll)
~~Incorporeal~~ (overlap with pro-poll)
Pylon (new)

Kantuva

Uruguay211 Posts

April 22 2025 03:52 GMT

Oh wow, interested in seeing Last Fantasy still there 👀

It has been a great experience seeing this level of engagement between the community and TLMC, so overall very happy for the reception in all sides, and ofc Thank you Wax for all the work!

RandomPlayer

Russian Federation400 Posts

April 22 2025 04:58 GMT

That's exactly how I felt seeing old three maps being kept (ugh). Brand new nine maps is great!

Cygnus

United States853 Posts

April 22 2025 06:01 GMT

Seeing Last Fantasy leading the charge for community top voted is great to see!

Channeling that vibe of something different I'd say having all new maps could keep everything a bit more unpredictable and exciting for viewers and players.

MJG

United Kingdom1451 Posts

April 22 2025 06:24 GMT

Having played on them in the Monday night weekly, Magannatha and Pylon are really hard to look at whilst playing. I hope some aesthetic changes will be made to polish these maps up before being put onto the ladder.

Last Fantasy remains an auto-veto lmao.

Philippe

354 Posts

April 22 2025 07:30 GMT

On April 22 2025 15:01 Cygnus wrote:
Seeing Last Fantasy leading the charge for community top voted is great to see!

Channeling that vibe of something different I'd say having all new maps could keep everything a bit more unpredictable and exciting for viewers and players.

Last Fantasy will be a judge of how deep the divide possibly is between the community voting and the pros. Some might not like it but without the pros, you don't have grassroots, and grassroots can't alienate the pros either.

I guess I'll see how this turns out in Dallas.

EDIT : instead of " and grassroots can't alienate the pros either. " wanted to say " pros can't alienate grassroots either " to underline it's a balance to find between both, but I wrote the post too quickly

MJG

United Kingdom1451 Posts

April 22 2025 08:05 GMT

On April 22 2025 16:30 Philippe wrote:

Show nested quote +

Unless there's a Bo9 series, it will probably just get vetoed by pros.

It being on the ladder isn't a big issue. People can veto it if they don't like it.

zelevin

United States317 Posts

April 22 2025 20:54 GMT

I like this approach of a whole new map pool. I only like the idea of keeping old maps if I'm the one picking them. (Post youth and hardwire would never leave) I'll never be in charge so let's keep'em changing.

sidasf

104 Posts

April 23 2025 06:03 GMT

Thanks for the update!

I still yet to have had anybody to answer two simple questions for the sake of the community:

1. What do healing shrines add to the game?

2. Is it worth introducing this completely untested mechanic in 2025, where it is risking to throw off balance and create abusive, unfun strategies?

The reality is that we get extremely infrequent patches and map rotations, we don't have the liberty to provide quick fixes. I think these are very fair questions anybody involved in the map choosing process should ask themselves. It's only fair to the community who loves SC2 so much, including myself.

We are set to get one 3 player map, and TWO maps with healing shrines? I think that's way too volatile. One 3p and one healing shrine map would be much better in my opinion. We tried a map pool with multiple freestyle maps-the pool with post youth, amphion, dynasty etc-reception was overwhelmingly negative from what I saw.

I'm honestly a proponent of keeping a couple maps from the previous pool. This has been done numerous times in the past, it's a way to keep maps that are tested and loved by the community. Would love to see Ultralove again.

I love Pylon, Magannatha, and Tokamak. Sad to see Sandwyrm didn't get much traction. Thanks for all your hard work, long live SC2.

ejozl

Denmark3498 Posts

April 24 2025 06:08 GMT

#10

I like dynasty and that other more weird map. I just don't like when the memorable unconventional maps only get 1 season, but the std one that no one cares about because it's the same as all other maps get to stay. I still think golden wall and purity/industry got shafted hard.

What's the point of having a 9 map map pool if 6 of them are the same, might as well lower that to 5 then.

dR_JIT

1 Post

April 24 2025 15:00 GMT

#11

I don't like the idea of a healing shrine in an SC2 map. It rather ruined a good game in Harstem vs Cure on the last Monday night weekly. [Maybe I'm wrong about this. I also dislike speed zones and slow zones.]

A map with more than 2 spawning positions could be a good inclusion in every map pool. I would like to even see a four-spawn map, but I think most people would disagree. [It would have to be chosen with care. Four-spawn maps where you get trapped in one corner are no good, I think.]

That would leave 8 other maps, and perhaps it would be useful to allocate them to categories, and ensure a representation of each: rush maps, macro maps, & maps with unusual features.

The veto system has a useful role to play in balancing the game. Veto - veto - pick - pick - veto - veto - pick - pick - decider is very different to veto - veto - veto - veto - pick - pick - pick - pick - decider, I think.

Please or register to reply.

Live Events Refresh