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On July 29 2009 15:47 Ace wrote:
For now I'll also vote for Mountain Dew as I like his post. It's clear and to the point.
There's also something I thought about. Look at that rule set. Mafia is supremely fucked. Remember the main advantage Mafia has over the town is that they know who each other are ahead of time and can kill at night much better than the town. Also they have to kill enough of us under a time limit - lol. This is such a fucked condition for them.
Look at it like this: Mafia can essentially choose to Role Check OR Kill. See the problem? They don't know each other. The optimal move would be for all of them to role check people hoping they get lucky to land some mafia. However this conflicts with their win condition - if they don't kill enough of us in time we automatically win. So they really do need to start killing asap. Problem is when they start killing not only do they leave clues to themselves but they might hit another mafia. So they do need to investigate.
^_^
The Army has a really good starting stronghold - Mafia have to pick one of those abilities individually each night and both abilities contradict the other early in the game. I'm betting on mafia investigating on Night 1 instead of all going around popping people in fear of hitting each other.
Now for our side we have it pretty simple. We have all the classic Mafia game roles: DT,Medic,Vet,Vigi + a suicide bomber. Unlike them our win condition is more about survival than outright killing all of them. This game we shouldn't be too worried about killing everything that moves - this means no dumb lynches just because a guy has 1 or 2 clues tied to him. Sure we can make mistakes but if we don't lynch it's really not a big deal as we win by surviving also.
I too would like to stress the fact that mafia not knowing each other puts them at a huge disadvantage. I mentioned this in my campaign as well. If town can stay organized this is sure to be a victory.
I also suspect, as Ace has said, that mafia kills are likely to be down for the first few days. I do not believe mafia is going to risk killing unless they for sure know the persons' role.
Because mafia are not a team for now, it will take the town longer to figure them out. In other mafia games voting patterns could quickly lead to a mafia's defeat. This game the town does not have that information. Depending on how many DT's there are, it might take us a while to figure them all out.
And to Ace's earlier post: I put in the bit about lynching inactives because I've seen how easily the town can get strayed from this goal. Obviously first lynch will probably be an inactive, but what happens after that? In one game, maybe Pyrrhuloxia's I don't remember, the town seem to start off on a good level, but then ended up killing each other while the mafia sat around in the inactive pool. Once the town finally got reorganized it was already too late. I want to make sure that does not happen.
Ace has clearly laid out that the mafia are going to be rolechecking first. I suspect that mafia will be rolechecking for at least a few nights, only to kill if they happen to rolecheck a blue role. For this time, the mafia will be hiding in the inactive pool, and it will be important that we make them scared to be in there.
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By blue sniping I assume that the mafia go "ok this guy is definitely holding an important role" then bam - he's dead. If the mafia hit him and he just happens to flip blue that's not a blue snipe. But yes, the number of players I'd consider not dumb is pretty close to 0. Maybe 5.
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Well MountianDew it will be a bit harder for the Mafia to play inactive since Caller will be shooting them asap. So they'd have to be a little bit in the light this game.
Also I don't believe we have vote checks this game. It's a pretty broken ability imo and I'm glad we don't have it as it makes people pay attention more in order to win the game.
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On July 29 2009 16:18 Ace wrote:
Well MountianDew it will be a bit harder for the Mafia to play inactive since Caller will be shooting them asap. So they'd have to be a little bit in the light this game.
Also I don't believe we have vote checks this game. It's a pretty broken ability imo and I'm glad we don't have it as it makes people pay attention more in order to win the game.
Yes, but I'm expecting there to be a few people who will always vote but hardly post in the thread. These are the people I'll be very suspicious of.
If your second paragraph here was in response to me, I said voting patterns, not vote checks. Sometimes mafia can get pinned down because they pile on votes on one person to save one of their own. Since mafia does not know each other that won't ever be happening.
Another consequence of this is that bandwagoning is going to happen a lot, and there's not much we can do about it. I want to say that it is quite possible first few days we keep lynching greens because there won't be much debate about it. A bandwagon vote won't help us at all.
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Oh my god, 8 pages already.
Kinda expected it with this many players, but still 
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Reporting for duty so I don't get picked off as an inactive. When does Night 1 start?
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well bandwagons are natural in every mafia game. The key to picking out the mafia are finding the people voting for stupid reasons ala omg stupid townie made stupid barely convincing post so I'll believe it: lynch that guy.
People being cautious with their vote but posting in the thread are almost always suspect as they are waiting on others to vote. True townies, especially the really good ones tend to be really straight forward with their votes and have some solid reasoning to back it up. Likewise they aren't afraid of being questioned on why they did it. So this game I'll be taking things a bit more seriously (lol) and anyone playing dumb is instantly suspect.
Let the Ukrainian rape machine commence.
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First of all, i wanna run for office.
Any of you know me, i havent played mafia here ever.
I dont trust any of you right now, and i am willing to use you all to get all those traitor bastards.
I dont know you either, so i dont have any prejudgment.
If elected I will lynch at random on day 1, I dont mind if they are vets or newbs, im not wasting the lynch on inactives, cause they will be modkill anyway, i dont know who is vet and who is knew, so i read all voices.
I havent read previous games, just the last one.
I know a lot of shit and have a quick mind.
I will start disposing the 3 extra votes to active townies and spread them, so they wont make any difference. As the game progres i will dispose less votes, so i will gain votes gradually. I havent decided yet how, wanna make some calculations about how many mafia are out there first.
I have a really good strategy, i will post it and after this i will be dead tomorrow unless i am office and have bodyguards.
Ukranians can rolecheck, so there are 4 options:
More than one Ukranian rolechecking the same guy --> they lose KP not knowing
Ukranian rolecheck Ukranian --> they lose KP knowing
Ukranian rolecheck NKVD as Ukranian --> Better thing could happen to town and lose KP
Ukranian rolecheck Townie --> they gain KP
In the other hand:
NKVD rolecheck Townie --> do ukranians can conceal their ID? (if they cant we can abuse this)
NKVD rolecheck Ukranian --> could be NKVD undercover.
So for now NKVD cant be trusted. I say they should infiltrate the mafia and play by their own for a while. We should trust their ability to make mafia hit mafia hunting NKVD, i think is the most dificult place to be now.
Oh, i forgot... office man is inmune to DT (his role becomes Field Marshal to NKVD and Mafiya checks) so rolecheck runners NOW.
Im voting for myself.
We also discovered the body of redtooth lying in the mud today. After deserting the army, he apparently attempted to go to a local tavern for a shot of vodka. Unfortunately for him, but fortunately for the people’s justice, some Ukrainians had other ideas and blew out his brains, as well as stripping him naked. All that was left on him were a pair of pennies on top of his eyelids.
How could this not being a clue, Ace?
It clearly points to "some Ukranians" and descrives behaviors. Its related to death rituals (i believe more than one)
But i agree it wont help to much right now, just checked the 54 profiles to see any clear, and there is nothing yet...
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ok there are a few reasons I wouldn't vote for you:
1.) You say you're so sure you'd be dead tomorrow - how? Thats just really out of the blue bs as no one knows you and you haven't posted anything that could get you killed at the moment.
2.) You have some grand plan - great. If you were so sure you'd be dead why would you hide it? If the plan is really that good why not tell us, get yourself elected and live a bit longer? Some of us aren't stupid enough to elect some guy and then wait to hear his plan - tell us now or give up hope of being elected.
3.) Why would an NKVD Agent want to disguise them self as Ukrainian? That would lead to them getting killed if they got role checked. I'm hoping they really aren't that bad. Sure they could take the chance a Mafia checks them and hey they are in the Mafia circle - but when their kills don't sync up that same night what do you think happens? :/
4.) For someone who "knows a lot of shit and has a quick mind" you've already made a huge mistake. You propose that you will lynch at random. Oh really? So instead of trying to glean more information by questioning suspects you'd rather spin the wheel and see who it lands on? Oh how is that different that a townie that randomly votes for whomever they feel like? Why would we want you as Field Marshal? You'd be pretty useless.
5.) Lastly, going with the someone who has a quick mind idea...why would you spread your votes out to townies? You don't know if they are Ukrainian scum or not so how will you know they are using their votes with pro-town(Army) benefits in mind? You don't because even if you were an NKVD Agent I doubt you'd investigate all 3 of them in time to know. Hence, it's a bad idea to do so.
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also, NKVD can be trusted. Anyone that is rolechecked and flips NKVD is 100% confirmed innocent. The only thing that can't be confirmed is someone who flips Ukrainian as they can be an NKVD agent posing as Mafia but I've already said that would be a very risky and unwise move.
Also I'll never vote for a guy who says he's going to use me and doesn't even have a plan. Sorry ^_^
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On July 29 2009 17:37 Ace wrote:
ok there are a few reasons I wouldn't vote for you:
1.) You say you're so sure you'd be dead tomorrow - how? Thats just really out of the blue bs as no one knows you and you haven't posted anything that could get you killed at the moment.
2.) You have some grand plan - great. If you were so sure you'd be dead why would you hide it? If the plan is really that good why not tell us, get yourself elected and live a bit longer? Some of us aren't stupid enough to elect some guy and then wait to hear his plan - tell us now or give up hope of being elected.
3.) Why would an NKVD Agent want to disguise them self as Ukrainian? That would lead to them getting killed if they got role checked. I'm hoping they really aren't that bad. Sure they could take the chance a Mafia checks them and hey they are in the Mafia circle - but when their kills don't sync up that same night what do you think happens? :/
4.) For someone who "knows a lot of shit and has a quick mind" you've already made a huge mistake. You propose that you will lynch at random. Oh really? So instead of trying to glean more information by questioning suspects you'd rather spin the wheel and see who it lands on? Oh how is that different that a townie that randomly votes for whomever they feel like? Why would we want you as Field Marshal? You'd be pretty useless.
5.) Lastly, going with the someone who has a quick mind idea...why would you spread your votes out to townies? You don't know if they are Ukrainian scum or not so how will you know they are using their votes with pro-town(Army) benefits in mind? You don't because even if you were an NKVD Agent I doubt you'd investigate all 3 of them in time to know. Hence, it's a bad idea to do so.
1)I could be as dead as any townie. I am pretty sure there are plenty of mafia, cuz if there are not so much this would be unbalanced. They have a grotesque KP after first night unless they are less than 6, we are 54, 1/9 of them as mafia is not likely. And even if it was like that they could have 5 or 6 KP on night two. Any runner will be checked, so all of them who dont make it are most likely death by day 2 unless is mafia or NKVD. I think is good to grab DTS on me today, and in someone everyday, and mafia is going to kill every single sureshot, so i am dead anyway and you too.
2) Im doing my maths right now, posted it and erased it cause i saw something wrong with my numbers. Let me finish it and i will post it, of course. I dont mind if i died and town wins because of my numbers.
3)As said before... Ukranian KP deppend on their detection. While more Ukranians are shown by DT less people DIE. So NKVD disguised as Ukranian lower their DT effectiveness and therefor their killpower.
4)Show me 1 suspect if i win, maybe you are right in *only* this point.
5)I said SPREAD, im not giving my vote to someone in particular, i just wont vote 4 times for someone unless we have good reasons. I cant DT so clues should be the way into this game to me,not DT.
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@1) sry, should it say "by day 3"
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triple post!
And while NKVD shows as Ukranian they cant trust each other if DT them
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Voted for MountainDew as of now as he is the one who made all his intentions clear so far. Didn't like colatrane's approach on leadership. And its probably good for some new blood to run leadership this round.
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United States2186 Posts
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I voted for mountaindew because coltrane's plan sucks and I still can't forget L vs ace in qatol's game
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So wait, why are so many people voting for L?
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I'd like a veteran as leader, which is why I didn't vote for MountainDew. Perfectly understand those who vote for him though, his platform is well thought out and nicely worded. coltrane's platform is way too random (literally) for my liking, which leaves me choosing from L and Ace. Now, I know L is a good player, but repeatedly stating his conscript status seems.. iffy to me. So until further notice, I'm voting for Ace, who even though he didn't write a proper platform (yet), has proven himself to me through sound reasoning and arguments thus far.
Either way, I'd be fine with having any one of Ace, L or MountainDew as Field Marshal.
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Pm recieved. And for all poor souls that didnt catch a role: just blame Caller, he is known for handpicking the roles.
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United States2186 Posts
On July 29 2009 19:50 Shikyo wrote:
So wait, why are so many people voting for L?
ionno, wanting to cause some chaos?
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EPT
