EPT[M][N]MiniFeast 1.5
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Holyflare
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Holyflare
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On July 02 2019 10:37 Trfel wrote: I'm not sure if I fully understand what you are getting at but I'll try... Last game I noticed a difference in Eversince's play to her last mafia game, but I wasn't sure if the difference was caused by a change in alignment or the passage of time, so I didn't think much of it. Then it became clear she was town, leading me to believe that the change in alignment is the primary reason for the posting style difference mentioned previously. Yes, this is an assumption, but I think it's an okay assumption because other reasons also support the townread. In this game, Eversince's play is like her town game last game and different from her mafia game. And moreso, the difference is in a way that is harder to replicate as mafia. I know for me and many others, posting as mafia is difficult, and as a result the posts feel rigid, forced, and dry. Posts tend to be a little longer, more focused and less carefree and spontaneous. This contrast is how I was able to townread Tumblewood early on in a previous game and that townread nearly managed to win the game. Do you feel like this applies to you this game trfel? | ||
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Holyflare
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Feels like you ignored everything trfel was saying. Don't hate the picking up on grack and conversion later but the trfel thing, especially downgrading your read after for something not relevant at all (the bolded thing you highlighted) looks like you're just winging your read and aren't thinking it through. | ||
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On July 02 2019 17:15 Eversince wrote: Where did HF go? Here | ||
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Trfel seems like a robot. I like all his content but absolutely feel like he's playing how he says he plays as mafia (although he seems to not agree (shocking)). Jock looks fine. Rayn is here I guess. Grack/conversion obviously look mediocre. Nothing really unique to add. Disappointed nobody even quoted my pandain post, I thought it was quite good. | ||
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Holyflare
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On July 02 2019 17:28 Jockmcplop wrote: I didn't quote your pandain post, but i did take notice of it and it prompted me to have a closer look at him, hence my posting since. That surely applies to his scum read of ES too, right? No idea what his es read is lol. Null read or something? | ||
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On July 03 2019 01:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: I lied though, i had no idea HF has played so many games. Only 15 more. I played the most games in 2015, 2017 and 2018 on the site though. | ||
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On July 03 2019 01:06 Eversince wrote: Yeah and he just didn't care most of it because he found the game boring. He was mod confirmed though. That was literally the last game lol! | ||
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On July 03 2019 01:22 Eversince wrote: I can go rummage my play history but I don't see the point in it Rayn. If you've been here so long (I know you have), you know HF can play a mean town game. If he's mafia he'll drop off and we lynch him. Where are you going with this? You're mafia. ##vote Eversince | ||
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Holyflare
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If you believe this meta I've made like 2-3 posts this entire game so I'm way more likely mafia with that meta than last game but it's an out for me to look more town (because I am!) | ||
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On July 03 2019 02:16 raynpelikoneet wrote: True. Why does she say otherwise as mafia? Because she doesn't know my meta and has been asked to give a read on me and I have little to no content. She knows I'm town and that I get shot by mafia so she says the truth, that I'm likely to come back and post more if town but then obviously has to arbitrarily fit in the alternative to make it look like she's weighing up my alignment but she got it way wrong. How does she know I'm likely to be shot as town because I'm good at mafia and mafia fear me but not know my mafia meta? It sounds like she just knows hf = vet = apply generic vet meta. | ||
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On July 03 2019 02:19 Holyflare wrote: Because she doesn't know my meta and has been asked to give a read on me and I have little to no content. She knows I'm town and that I get shot by mafia so she says the truth, that I'm likely to come back and post more if town but then obviously has to arbitrarily fit in the alternative to make it look like she's weighing up my alignment but she got it way wrong. How does she know I'm likely to be shot as town because I'm good at mafia and mafia fear me but not know my mafia meta? It sounds like she just knows hf = vet = apply generic vet meta. It's really evident because you asked her for my town meta games and she only talked about the last one being my meta. | ||
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On July 03 2019 02:39 Eversince wrote: Ok. I've dug and dug. I can't find it.. Which makes me look bad. But I don't want to dedicate much more time. So I filter some of his other mafia games and I'm clearly wrong. I'll own up to this now. The only m!HF game we played together he was super dis-motivated/burnt out. That's where I was basing my HF meta from. Whoa what game was that? | ||
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On July 03 2019 02:49 Eversince wrote: I posted that saying I couldn't find it  ! It was a mistake to make the meta read because I breezed your filters on a couple other and you clearly don't play the way I described! Just owning up to my mistakes! Just to make sure: Student Mafia XV - didn't play together Student Mafia XVI - didn't play together A Simple Game of Mafia - vt shot night 2 TL Mafia LXXV - vt shot night 1 MafiacalFeast I - town and lynched all the mafia (tbh this is the only game I remember with you because of the gunsmith claim lol) | ||
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that's fucked up logic | ||
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On July 03 2019 17:51 Pandain wrote: I don't think ES is crazy/meta enough to do something like that. It's obvious she's been desperate to survive, if she was mafia she would jump at the opportunity to lynch someone she has expressed doubts about before. @conf, HF, Rayn please comment on this. I don't agree with your conclusion. She's meekly soft defended grack all game and then sprinkled "hesitance" and done nothing with it. They could easily be mafia together, or she could know he's town. Both things point to a mafia es because grack looks absolutely shit and a free lynch for literally anyone to hop onto. | ||
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On July 03 2019 18:12 Pandain wrote: She's said several times that she might be up for lynching Grack. It would not be suspicious at all for her to vote Grack if she thought it was the only way to not get lynched. But she refused to do this. The fact she refuses to lynch someone who you think "Looks absolutely shit and a free lynch" should strike you as townie, particuarly when it's the only way she could avoid getting lynched. It also doesn't matter if she knows he's town. If she's mafia, she's trying to survive. You still can't justify mafia ES not joining the grack train. I can because I can simultaneously think Grack is mafia and do. | ||
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On July 03 2019 18:13 Pandain wrote: Actually what does that even mean "she could know he's town." Why would that matter for mafia ES? What is this reasoning? I think you have a completely different read of how ES thinks than I do because in my world ES seems too nice to be a ruthless mafia alignment player who would callously lynch someone she's called town based on meta. I think the culmination of that personality is to slowly erode her meta read with these little sprinklings of hesitance so that eventually she can vote grack. If they are mafia together then why would she ever want to lynch her partner? | ||
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On July 03 2019 19:15 Jockmcplop wrote: I'm not saying this wouldn't be possible but it would be the worst possible play for ES not to join the grack train if she was mafia. It pretty much guarantees a town win if she gets lynched today. I think the worst possible play is to lynch your mafia partner after saying he's town sooooo. You don't even know mafia roles, grack could be a valuable role who knows. All I see is classic mafia traits. | ||
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On July 03 2019 19:16 Jockmcplop wrote: Because if she doesn't, and then dies anyway, we kill grack tomorrow and win And then she can't play after friday when her hotspot goes so okay. | ||
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On July 03 2019 19:36 Pandain wrote: HF you're completely misreading what ES has said. She's not defending Grack and saying he's town. She's just saying his play is NAI. So your argument that she wouldn't want to lynch a town read is wrong because she hasn't town read him. Also think about this HF: If Grack turns out to be town, I'm sure you agree it would be crazy stupid for ES to not vote to lynch him. Possible, but unlikely. So we should lynch Grack first because that will help us with ES. On July 03 2019 18:16 Eversince wrote: Meek? I've hard defended Grack on a meta read all game! @Pand ok but don't see the issue. My own read :Grack gets his thing together or lynch.I talk to Grack and he is still basic 'I'm be useless'. Everyone else pages later: Grack gets his things togthero or we lynch him. Either you're misreading or just needlessly defending her. If the person themselves said they're defending a person then what do you think they think of their alignment? | ||
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Holyflare
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On July 03 2019 19:26 Jockmcplop wrote: Here's a spreadsheet, it was really easy to make this time, please tell me if I've got anything wrong. ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/Azlh232.png) This is wrong, I quite clearly called out pandain and you piggybacked it but it's not here. Me being lazy doesn't make me mafia though. | ||
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On July 03 2019 20:14 Jockmcplop wrote: I just missed it I'll change it now. I also forgot to put all of rayn's reads in there for some reason. I'll post the updated version when I get back to work I'm just at home having lunch. But you do believe that ES is mafia because she got a meta read wrong on you. Among other things that I'm clearly talking about? Who is she actually calling mafia? Eywa? Eywa looks identical to eywa last game but for some reason they are ES's seemingly only scum read in the whole game. Defends bad looking grack. Defended me when I've posted literally nothing of substance. Pretty sure she's defended more people. | ||
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On July 03 2019 20:44 Jockmcplop wrote: Why shouldn't I lynch you from your play so far? I'm just lazy doesn't make me mafia. | ||
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They could both be mafia and that's why she's arbitrarily picked someone that in my eyes is an easy lynch that isn't grack. I don't believe if they're both mafia they'd vote each other, that's stupid logic. | ||
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Holyflare
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On July 03 2019 22:29 Jockmcplop wrote: What does this even mean? Grack isn't voting for ES right now. Are you telling me that if ES flips red, we shouldn't go and immediately lynch grack? You're telling me that es is town because she won't vote grack. Then why is that logic not made for grack who isn't voting es??? | ||
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Holyflare
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On July 03 2019 22:36 Pandain wrote: Does this look like "slowly eroding a town read" to you? It's the opposite, Holyflare. Are we even reading the same thing. Of course it fucking does? Oh look that guy i meta read and hard defended suddenly became the other wagon to me. Better fucking backtrack that read so he's an available lynch if I have to later. But before I do that let's try this eywa wagon on! I feel like I'm talking to aliens that have such a skewed perception of words that they take everything people say literally rather than reading between the lines and putting yourselves in mafia shoes. | ||
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On July 03 2019 22:58 Jockmcplop wrote: Because grack has not been in the thread while he's been close to being lynched. He had 3 votes for a short time earlier but wasn't here. And what if he now reads this and decides he doesn't want to lynch es? Free town read? Dumb | ||
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On July 03 2019 23:01 Jockmcplop wrote: Whereas hf, you have been inconsistent, have constantly made terrible, illogical points trying to get ES lynched, and even contradicted yourself on eywa while you were doing it. Scum. Feel free to vote me. | ||
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On July 03 2019 23:19 Jockmcplop wrote: You must have missed the posts i made about it. They way you have gone after ES is scummy. The bad logic that seems like an excuse to vote for ES more than anything else. The way you then brought up the eywa thing even though it contradicts your own post from earlier - just to make ES look bad. Every post you make about ES seems like you're trying to get the evidence to fit instead of seeing where the evidence leads. As if you already knew who you were accusing and just need to twist the facts to make it look right. You keep referencing the bad logic but then said you're starting to see my point of view. So which is it eh? I don't think anyone reading my post can disagree with my point in eywa. It's different, even eywa agrees. If you are mafia es and your partner is up for lynch mafia go for lynch bait which es did even though eywa is playing similarly to last game. My thoughts on eywa mean nothing because of several reasons: Es never agreed with those points. Es played with eywa literally last game. If you take away my point on eywa, eywa looks the same as last game and es is pushing that as scummy even though literally in the last game eywa was the same. There is no hesitance. Its "oh yeah counter wagon grack is up for lynch, maybe he is scummy! But this eyway guy that's the same as last game though!" It's superficial and contradictory to what her own thought process should be and is typical of mafia trying to find an easy lynch wagon to place a vote. Who else does es really scum read? Sure your read list can elaborate on that. | ||
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Holyflare
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On July 03 2019 23:19 Trfel wrote: @Raynpelikoneet, is the bolded the thing you are using to scumread Eversince? Because to me, Eversince is saying here that Holyflare is good at mafia as a game, not as an alignment. She also clarified that she meant I'm good at mafia rather than the mafia alignment. | ||
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On July 03 2019 23:44 Jockmcplop wrote: The bad logic i'm referring to is the whole 'ES got a meta read on me wrong therefore she is mafia'. It makes no sense and is stupid. Your point on eywa was specifically that eywa has played differently in this game to other games. You thne scum read ES because you say eywa has played exactly the same in this game as in the last game. You really can't see a contradiction there? You really can't see how it looks like you will say anything to make ES look bad? Point me to the place where I say eywa is playing so differently in this game to the last. I guarantee you can't because I never said that. If you think my only continual point for lynching es is the meta read on me then you clearly have not been reading what I've said in the slightest. The meta read is bad, yes, but I've clearly made several points after that. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + I think you're town  | ||
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On July 04 2019 00:05 Holyflare wrote: Yeah but it's clearly not anymore is it lol? This was to pandain. Completely fair though, I've never said eywa looked the same so you got me there. Definitely thought it though and that's how I've ended up on es longer. If it's not clear, eywa feels exactly the same as last game but just did something that was massively out of character. Es did not reference this out of character thing so all there is to go by for es is that eywa is the same. | ||
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On July 04 2019 00:35 Pandain wrote: Explain this. So you admit you did say eywa looks different? No, I thought I posted that eywa looks exactly the same since that's what I've based most of my reads off of. I didn't though. The point about eywa posting explanations does not mean eywa is playing differently, just that eywa posted something out of the norm. Eywa still looks the same to me other than that. | ||
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On July 03 2019 23:31 Holyflare wrote: You keep referencing the bad logic but then said you're starting to see my point of view. So which is it eh? I don't think anyone reading my post can disagree with my point in eywa. It's different, even eywa agrees. If you are mafia es and your partner is up for lynch mafia go for lynch bait which es did even though eywa is playing similarly to last game. My thoughts on eywa mean nothing because of several reasons: Es never agreed with those points. Es played with eywa literally last game. If you take away my point on eywa, eywa looks the same as last game and es is pushing that as scummy even though literally in the last game eywa was the same. There is no hesitance. Its "oh yeah counter wagon grack is up for lynch, maybe he is scummy! But this eyway guy that's the same as last game though!" It's superficial and contradictory to what her own thought process should be and is typical of mafia trying to find an easy lynch wagon to place a vote. Who else does es really scum read? Sure your read list can elaborate on that. I reference it several times even. It's nothing new. Please don't cherry pick something you think you caught me out on when I've already acknowledged the argument. | ||
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Holyflare
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Conversion/grack/es/rayn/trfl/jock It's a big list but I really haven't given a shit about the game until now so I'll narrow it down when I'm home. | ||
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On July 04 2019 00:47 Jockmcplop wrote: Wait a minute. Is this my point that STILL FUCKING STANDS In regard to Jock, I think it's this point that really makes me waiver. What other points or theories does he actually have that would make him think I'm mafia? I'm pretty sure they're all gone. He didn't even realise this was still a point for him until someone pointed it out again yet I was still mafia to him before that. | ||
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Dumb and probably mafia. | ||
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On July 04 2019 01:58 Jockmcplop wrote: This is the thing hf every time you begin to even look a little bit town you say something like this: I have no idea why you would think that's true. It isn't at all. I have brought up the eywa thing consistently over the last few pages. You're literally just making this shit up out of nowhere. I didn't make it up I literally quoted the post where you said it? If you still had it all along then you really misworded that post and the intention wasn't clear. | ||
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On July 04 2019 02:06 Jockmcplop wrote: I just mirrored this language: I probably should have quoted it, but i thought you would make the connection. I wouldn't make the connection because I explained that point multiple times. Hey ho let's move on to actual mafia. | ||
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On July 04 2019 02:14 Pandain wrote: I still want to hear thoughts on Conf. I still think he's another viable lynch. On tube. Will look into when home. | ||
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Difference being I read your filter in between those posts. It's bad. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:22 raynpelikoneet wrote: I know she did but do you believe that's the truth? I don't. Yeah because why would she say I'm good as mafia and simultaneously say I'm afk as mafia? She wouldn't. My points were about something completely different though and I don't think they're as awful as pandain and jock make them out to be. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:28 Eversince wrote: Summarize for me. because I thought your points against me where crap. But you agreed with them and said my vote is valid because of it originally lol? | ||
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On July 03 2019 02:55 Eversince wrote: I don't even think his scum read on me is wrong. I made a mistake and HF finding a problem with it makes sense because I made no sense. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:29 Eversince wrote: m!ES makes a trash meta read on me. Get caught. Lynch with bunches of fire!! What other point did you have? That you meekly defend grack and don't even give a read on him. Just that he's not leading the town anywhere so isn't likely mafia (your meta read on him) but you also say if he doesn't play and is inactive that's what he does as town if he comes back and plays later. Then grack does not much at all and suddenly it's oh grack is inactive maybe he's the lynch later but you never really push that. If grack is mafia he's not following your mafia meta of grack by being inactive. If he's town, he is. You don't double down on the meta read but start to open up on the option of grack just as he becomes a wagon and you're in the lead. The person you jump to lynching is eywa who is playing almost identical to last game with the exception of posting why they actually scum read you BUT you're mafia reading eywa, not for explaining the read which is different play from last game but scum reading eywa for playing exactly like last game (where they were town)! You are eroding your grack read which doesn't match to your thought process. You have only ever wanted to lynch the lynch bait who plays like they were town last game. You defended me from pressure even though I did literally nothing AND THAT WAS YOUR MAFIA META ON ME. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:34 Eversince wrote: I agreed with why you made them! I tried real hard to explain myself after that fact. You obviously don't like it but it still kind of proved my point because here you are. trying to engage game (Did the same there), and solve things. The fact you completely ignore my response due to mia/w/e makes me feel worse on you because I've been transparent on how I develop. So you continuing to push me is questionable at this point. No, it's not. I did literally the same thing to Pandain last game and he even complained about it. If you agreed with them why did you just come in and say my points were trash? | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:52 Eversince wrote: I am generating content! That's bologna! I've spent half my time trying to explain myself. You continuing to try to kill me is weird now. Like 'nothing ES says this game' changes your opinion? You want huge case post? Too bad, I'm really bad at them. You want analysis? Point me where. You want explanation? On what? Your driving me seems super forced here. I don't like it at all. I was ready to call the whole Jock/HF thing town vs town but your making me doubt myself.. I've literally done nothing but summarise my case on you, which has yet to be answered. So, yeah, I want a case on who we should vote that isn't anything to do with eywa who is currently my town read and is playing exactly like last game. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:59 Conversion wrote: I have one person in Pandain telling people I’m being “aggressive” and “not doing anything” and he can’t even bother to read a 2 page filter. I have another person in Grack making trash tier posts, and all of a sudden wanting to lynch me There’s no way either of you are town with these garbage tier plays, is there? You're not up for lynch and neither are any of them (apart from kind of grack). Would you like to make a case on them? | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:10 Eversince wrote: Basically to sum it up. I think it's trash to come in throw a vote on me. Doesn't explain anything. Leave.. Come back and respond with more useless crap because 'ES is mafia so ignore' Rinse repeat. I give Conv a little more room because at the point he did it wouldn't matter. I still think it's a iffy reason to vote but his vote is leading to nothing there. The first 2 quotes are Eywa trolling you. The last 2 quotes look like fine reasons to think you're mafia? | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:13 Holyflare wrote: The first 2 quotes are Eywa trolling you. The last 2 quotes look like fine reasons to think you're mafia? Do you not remember Eywa posting the exact same things in the last game as town? | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:21 raynpelikoneet wrote: that's not my point. my point is noone says "good at the game" unless the player in consideration is also good as mafia, because people who are only good as town are not good mafia players. Even I think this point is a stretch my dude. I've seen plenty of people say that. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:24 Eversince wrote: It's ok. I hope you don't mind I do the same. I'm town so surviving is high on my list. I didn't want to lynch you yet though because I figured you'd play. THIS is my point exactly. WHY do you figure he'll just randomly play instead of being mafia?????????????? BUT THEN you say during the day "grack is being useless, maybe he's a good vote!"???????? | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:27 Eversince wrote: Because he's FORCED to play as mafia. t!Grack doesn't care here and want to be useful so to AVOID this happening! Why so hard to understand? Then why did you say he's starting to be a good lynch for not playing??? | ||
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On July 03 2019 18:16 Eversince wrote: Meek? I've hard defended Grack on a meta read all game! @Pand ok but don't see the issue. My own read :Grack gets his thing together or lynch.I talk to Grack and he is still basic 'I'm be useless'. Everyone else pages later: Grack gets his things togthero or we lynch him. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:28 Pandain wrote: HF no idea why you're talking when you're never gonna change your mind in a million years Because I know you tools will do some stupid shit and she won't get lynched. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:29 Holyflare wrote: Because I know you tools will do some stupid shit and she won't get lynched. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:30 Eversince wrote: Sheesh do I ned to go over this again? I had multiple page over the reasons I didn't want to lynch Grack yet. Let me make this really blunt because I think you're essentially confirmed mafia now. You have said that Grack does the following things: A) As mafia he is PRESENT in the thread and CONTROLS it through his actions. B) As town he is AFK and then comes back and makes MEANINGFUL posts. You town read Grack for B. Grack CONTINUED to do B and you then changed your read to "If he doesn't contribute then he's mafia" which goes against your meta read of Grack being mafia (A). I think you made this entirely up and saw that Grack was a counter wagon and then eroded your meta read to give you the option of looking like you're evaluating him but you failed because it's a direct contradiction. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:42 Holyflare wrote: Let me make this really blunt because I think you're essentially confirmed mafia now. You have said that Grack does the following things: A) As mafia he is PRESENT in the thread and CONTROLS it through his actions. B) As town he is AFK and then comes back and makes MEANINGFUL posts. You town read Grack for B. Grack CONTINUED to do B and you then changed your read to "If he doesn't contribute then he's mafia" which goes against your meta read of Grack being mafia (A). I think you made this entirely up and saw that Grack was a counter wagon and then eroded your meta read to give you the option of looking like you're evaluating him but you failed because it's a direct contradiction. You town read Grack for B should actually be you neglected to ever give a concrete read on Grack even though he was doing B but still defended him saying he will come back and be town. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:48 Eversince wrote: This is all bullshit HF! I'm so tired of fighting but ok let's do this dance. I've REPEATEDLY said I THINK Grack can mia/ or not as EITHER alignment! This is not a reason to lynch Grack over more possible mafia ever. You continue to hate on me for it. Which I'm starting to worry about. More worrying that you say I "made it up" when I've been hard defending Grack literally all D1. Where do you say this? | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:50 Eversince wrote: HF are you trying to intentionally get me to spam the thread? It's everywhere. Other people have responded to it. If your not even bother to read the thread .Quote it. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:53 Eversince wrote: No. If you are too lazy to filter me that's not making me mafia. But it might mean you are. Then I will proceed on the basis that it does not exist. It is your prerogative to provide me with evidence to the contrary of my read because tomorrow I will be leading the lynch on you and nothing will dissuade me other than cold hard evidence to the contrary. I will not let these monkeys divert this next lynch. | ||
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On July 04 2019 04:57 Pandain wrote: That's just one. There's like six or seven you can find This is after the fact she got called out. That is not real. | ||
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On July 02 2019 13:44 Eversince wrote: I think your point about both are fine. Rayn generally will push hard, but not get irate with you, if he thinks your doing something. If he isn't sure he's not going to try to put you on a stick and burn you. The problem with Conversion is that he came in, rehashed a valid point, ignored the rest of the thread and left. Grack's just a special one. He's got a funny personal attitude. I'm not wanting to lynch him today. He'll pick up and engage like he did last game or then we can lynch. But he's not trying to move us anywhere. Which is trash town play. But m!Grack wants to lead town to do stupid things. Like voting our parity cop......... On July 02 2019 15:39 Eversince wrote: Actually no. I was reference a point that anyone mafia in that position would do that. I could go filter Gracks past games but that seems real petty! The meta wasn't even meta, it was just a general that's what mafia does post??????? Didn't sound like it in the slightest and I think you got called out here. On July 02 2019 16:12 Eversince wrote: I'm going off memory (not reliable). Any mafia would want to try to change thread sentiment. Grack did nothing.. Even on your example.. if he bussed his whole team he still did something. Was my point. t!Grack doesn't care m!Grack does something (if that's true he just killed his whole team)! What game is it though? I'll filter him to try to see. Now it is meta again....... On July 02 2019 16:15 Eversince wrote: Assuming Grack is mafia where is he taking that Pand? Just throwing shadows? I'll agree he's been useless but last game was the same. Most I've played with him he's been in-active then picks up and is semi useful. TOWN meta. On July 02 2019 16:28 Eversince wrote: I need to figure who to vote for. I'd be fine with Conv for reasons I already said. Grack would be ok but rather not, if he's town he'll start playing. Or we just lynch into lurkers. Which is also trash. Grack would be an okay lynch, wow that town meta sure devolved quickly. He's not even doing that thing you said he does as mafia. This is softly calling him town too just like you did to me because he could literally just afk and be mafia. On July 02 2019 18:02 Eversince wrote: Exactly, m!Grack makes no sense to me there because he just mia off. Nothing happens that early. You either try to be active and start the thread or just mia. Which he did. Or you try to get groundwork into looking town (Which he didn't). Showing up and being general useless doesn't make any sense as town or mafia. But Grack is flighty, tends to put a hell of a lot more effort late D1/D2. I don't like him continuing to be useless but I made post on this already. If he's still useless day 2 we can just lynch him but standard Grack play is standard Grack. None of this post makes the slightest bit of sense. It's a town read for going afk but you also say mafia grack can afk but you also say mafia Grack makes no sense? So which is it? On July 02 2019 18:26 Eversince wrote: He's been playing since I joined this site so I'm sure yes. Probably uses it to advantage as scum, why I think he's not worth the lynch now but later? Sure. @Jock I'll go filter that game and brainstorm. Grack is self away of meta probably, that's why he should be lynched later.......? Why does this make any sense? If he's self aware of meta then his meta IS to afk as town is what you're saying. If he is self aware of this and afks then how does it make any sense to lynch him because he can do that as town???? On July 03 2019 00:32 Eversince wrote: Guilty as charged! I'm just reading up thread and trying to make conclusions. Your Pand point makes sense but why would m!Pand point it out? He did vote me but he didn't push for it. m!Pand here would want to start a wagon? Oh crap, I think that happened though! No one seems to like me !Also you sum my Grack points back up yourself. He could be mafia, but he could be t!Grack here and not giving a darn. I don't like to lynch town. He could be mafia but he could be town grack for afking? So you won't lynch him because he COULD be town?? On July 03 2019 00:42 Eversince wrote: @Rayn He doesn't but it could be either m!Grack/t!Grack. I'm saying we lynch most likely mafia over him. Because Grack playstyle make it hard to tell if he's m!Grack yet because his town play looks the same D1. His meta has completely changed from him afking as town to him now being aware of his town meta as mafia and now he could be doing it as mafia. On July 03 2019 00:47 Eversince wrote: .......I'm getting annoyed with answering this! It's all over my filter! I think Grack could play his inactive self d1 as either mafia!Grack or town!Grack. I give him the pass today because I know this about him. I would still lynch but I think it's not worth our votes with better options Now it's not even him being self aware it's just it's his meta as either alignment. THIS IS COMPLETELY COMPLETELY different to what you've already said at the start of the game! On July 03 2019 01:04 Eversince wrote: I said 'I don't want to lynch Grack because x'.. Rayn stop being dense! You berate rayn for making a TOTALLY valid point. On July 03 2019 01:18 Eversince wrote: Okok Rayn. I make this as simple as I can. My issue with lynching Grack has always been 'Grack is being useless!' Truffles said something about it 'he's not posting gifs and making jokes' I say 'Yeh, but he might be trying to change because people wanted to lynch him last game for the same reason' (Not in those words but basic thoughts I had) Grack mia/being general useless is not uncommon. I've played with him enough to know. I'm saying I don't think m!Grack does come into thread, be useless then disappears, for no better reason than to make himself look bad. t!Grack totally wouldn't care.. Conclusion: Grack may totes be scum. But his play there is not a reason to think he is a mafia yet. Now you're just assuming he's changing his meta based on absolutely nothing but why do you even mention he MIGHT be changing his meta when you've already been saying it IS his meta to do this?????? Now you're also saying mafia grack doesn't come into the thread to disappear but your conclusion is that he might be scum???? On July 03 2019 01:30 Eversince wrote: Given the fact thats how Grack plays period and I know it.. Yeh, makes no sense. Not a 0%chance for reasons I've repeated like 65536 times now but yeh. It made me think 'why does m!Grack bother here?' 'he doesn't he just mia' thus t!Grack for now because there are other things I want to think about. That's it. Interpreting any other way is just wrong. Repeating the read. On July 03 2019 11:40 Eversince wrote: Grack stop being useless! I've given you so much room this game but everyone wants to kill for that crap. You've really giving me no reason to think your scum yet but I'm die because of 'loose reads'! Also if you don't start posting super town soon I'm have to re-evaluate myself because you made your yourself obvious town last game. Where is it here? No reason to think you're scum yet but I might reevaluate! On July 03 2019 11:45 Eversince wrote: Town is getting mislynched and Grack read my is a reason why. Please do something! Because I spent so much time and effort into defending saying you would do stuff. Show it already.. I post about Conv.. nothing I post about Ewya.. nothing.. I post about Pandain.. nothing. Are you just mafia letting town die? Because I wanted to let you off for your meta but this is just bologna.! YOU'RE LITERALLY APPEALING TO A GUY WHO YOU THINK COULD BE MAFIA OR TOWN BUT THIS REALLY LOOKS LIKE YOU KNOW HE'S TOWN. On July 03 2019 17:44 Eversince wrote: I've already said what I feel about Grack. His poor contribution after I defend him so hard is bleh though. I'd be ok with lynching him to be honest. HIS POOR CONTRIBUTION THAT YOU SAID MAKES HIM TOWN MAKES HIM AN OKAY LYNCH. You literally said he's useless till day 2 at least!!!!! Your read has totally flipped when he's doing EXACTLY what you say he does as town. And he isn't pushing any agenda like you said he would as mafia! On July 03 2019 17:49 Eversince wrote: No actually Grack can wait I still think what Ewya did is so scummy, This needs dealt with first. But then you ditch it to Eywa when Grack becomes a wagon!!! On July 03 2019 18:16 Eversince wrote: Meek? I've hard defended Grack on a meta read all game! @Pand ok but don't see the issue. My own read :Grack gets his thing together or lynch.I talk to Grack and he is still basic 'I'm be useless'. Everyone else pages later: Grack gets his things togthero or we lynch him. Now you've hard defended Grack all game, that's your own admission! Why would you hard defend someone you think still could be mafia and even said he could be mafia after all? I can't make this stuff up. It's literally right here in your filter. First, you make a meta read up on Grack but then that's proven wrong and you say it's a general meta read for people when they play mafia. Then you change it to say that Grack afks as town and does things to control the game as mafia. Then you get called out again and it CHANGES to Grack afks as town and comes back to play but mafia Grack doesn't. Then it changes again to mafia Grack knows his town meta and could be emulating it! Then it changes to Grack's actual mafia meta is to also afk! Then you say to someone that Grack is changing his meta on gif posting based on last game maybe?????? Then you say you have no reason to lynch Grack because he could be town (or presumably mafia now) Then you interact with Grack saying prove you right and play. BUT HIS MAFIA META ISN'T JUST TO AFK EITHER SO HOW IS THAT RELEVANT. Then you appeal to Grack to do something because you defended him and say he's the reason you're getting lynched but don't EVER EVER just assume Grack is mafia letting you die if you're town. You never assume this at any point. Ever. Then suddenly his poor contribution makes him mafia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But then Eywa is suddenly a better lynch?????????????? Then you say you've hard defended Grack on a meta read all game but YOU MAKE NO CONCLUSION ON HIS ALIGNMENT STILL AND NOTHING MAKES SENSE. You are really really really just mafia. | ||
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Not talking about your reads I will disagree with though because sometimes it's good to back and forth and get your ideas out there. | ||
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On July 04 2019 06:11 Eywa- wrote: I think #116 & #117 is a hard slip to be honest, when trfl asks about ES' reads, she makes up a read on Conversion which contradicts what she said about conversions in #104. That's a quick conversion from conversion is fine to conversion is bleh. wow that's really correct lol the points why conversion changes to bleh is that he pointed out good points but didn't comment on the rest of the game too which shouldn't make him bleh at all..... | ||
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On July 04 2019 07:12 Eversince wrote: Why is me thinking what I did then make me scum? I'm sorry t!Conv died but that wasn't the reason here. Your trying to real hard to put a mafia poster on me. Which t!ES never gets shot tonight because easy mislynch. I don't know why you're asking me when Eywa is the one pointing it out but it's quite simple. You first said that Conversion's entrance was fine and then somehow you've completely changed your point of view to it's not fine. Not only is that a contradiction but your points for calling it not fine are that the points Conversion raised were GOOD points and well reasoned so you shouldn't be changing your mind to Conversion being bleh because of that, it just seems like baseless posturing. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:28 Eversince wrote: Summarize for me. because I thought your points against me where crap. This literally happened. I called your meta read on me crap and voted on you. You backtracked and said, yeah, you got it wrong. You said I was correct to not like you because of it. I said many other points after this. You enter the thread and say "summarise for me because I thought your points against me were crap". You then just say my points are the meta read against you and that's it but you already said those were fine. So, not only did you not know why I was actually scum reading you at that point but on top of that you've changed your point of view on the meta read points too! Now you're coming back into the thread saying you don't know if I'm scum or not because the points against you are, yet again, crap but you never ever address them AGAIN. You tell me to just read your filter because it's all there but guess what, that's exactly what you're going to have to do to my filter now because it's all in there for you to read and comment on. Solve the game, prove me wrong and that you're town. Don't just needlessly pander to people. I am not lynching eywa and don't think I ever will and don't really think they're mafia so you're barking up the wrong tree here. Who else is mafia? | ||
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People that voted conversion and posted shit all to solving the game or why they voted the way they did after they lynched the parity cop: Pandain, jock, grack, Eversince, trfel People that voted Eversince: Rayn, hf, eywa, conversion People that didn't vote the parity but still talked about reads and who to lynch after the parity cop mishap: Hf, eywa There's at least 2 confirmed town on the eversince wagon in myself and conversion and I'm pretty sure eywa is town too. That means that unless you all think rayn is mafia (which almost none of you do) then either eversince is town and all the mafia suddenly bandwagoned conversion to look shit at the end of the day lynching town instead of afking or there's a much more simple answer that Eversince is mafia and you played right into their objective. | ||
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I don't think she understands the points against her totally still either lol. | ||
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On July 04 2019 15:59 Trfel wrote: Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Eversince I noticed you'd just discussed it right after I posted. Can I ask what in particular you liked about Holyflare's reasoning? I went through Holyflare's filter and there's some stuff I don't like but I'm not sure what it means. Need to think more. Holyflare, why do you think Pandain is town? Or do you still? What do you think about Grackaroni? Elaborate. I've lost my read on Pandain after the deadline slightly. It was more the interaction with Jock and myself with him there calming jock down with reasonable assumptions that made me town read him but I realise this can be someone trying to pocket me with perfect information. | ||
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On July 04 2019 16:42 Jockmcplop wrote: Where are you on rayn currently hf (other than the fact he voted for someone you also think is scum)? He agrees with me and pretty much talked about the grack meta on Eversince first. He's town until further notice. | ||
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On July 04 2019 16:55 Holyflare wrote: He agrees with me and pretty much talked about the grack meta on Eversince first. He's town until further notice. The Eversince meta on grack * | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:06 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why didnt you vote for grack though at the time in case you thought hes better lynch than ES? I am almost 100% certain eversince returned and said something I hated and I said the words "I think I'm fine leaving my vote where it is". | ||
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On July 04 2019 02:38 Holyflare wrote: Difference being I read your filter in between those posts. It's bad. Read grack's filter on train posted this. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:11 Holyflare wrote: I think I'll leave my vote where it is in the meanwhile... Posted this when Eversince returned. | ||
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On July 04 2019 03:02 Eversince wrote: Looks like I'm die.. I'm try to catch up but I have to go take care of animals. No promises. It was after this post which was essentially an afk excuse when under pressure. Keep seeing them every time I bring up a case or valid points on her. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:00 Trfel wrote: The Most Sucky Case You Will Ever See
@Holyflare, please feel free to address the points I've brought up and help me to understand. If you're town it would make me feel a whole lot better about you at least. No need to explain a ton, I know my case is weak. I'll answer these in order because obviously you just read my filter like some journalist and misconstrued it by not reading the context. Pandain opening looked really bad. Hf works Hf works Hf works Jock says hf is mafia, pandain says reasonable things (eywa too at the time) Hf says pandain and eywa town Original scum read on eversince was meta. That faded and was replaced with better points (that I've said multiple times). Jock gave me passion to write things in thread. Grack looked shit from memory (100% of my play is just skimming in a minute at work on phone and writing posts every so often) so I read his filter. It looked terrible. Would much rather lynch a guy that looks terrible over someone that was talking and said a lot of words (es). Es returns and says bad things, misconstrues points, says lies. My vote is fine where it is. Point about not making people vote es at deadline is whatever. Just because I don't care doesn't mean I'm mafia. Just arrived home not that long ago and had better things to do. That was also only 4 minutes to go and I didn't think they'd ever get 5 votes but you were a ninja and didn't say a word so. I blame you personally. Have you ever seen a game where I don't argue with my scum read? I think I'm more frustrated that Eversince misconstrues my own case against her than anything lol :D it's not arguing, it's more trying to get es to understand my points which I guess is a losing battle. I can always be wrong so I don't see the harm in arguing. That's the game. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: I am pretty sure ES doesnt make afk excuses based purely on her filter size. No she makes plenty of them and then responds to points which is imo worse because it looks like an excuse to leave at any point. It's unnecessary and a bad habit for mafia. Either way it reinvigorated my want to lynch her until she actually responded. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:15 Pandain wrote: Like the whole conversation between HF and Grack was so bad. HF: Thinking about voting for Grack. I think he's mafia Actually, I will vote for him! Grack: Hey! HF: Convince me you're town Grack: I'm just a lazy boy. HF: Sounds great to me! That's not what happened at all. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:22 Jockmcplop wrote: ES did exactly the same in the last game as town. Do you think I pay attention to people I don't scum read? | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:23 Pandain wrote: You think the person with the largest filter who has been constantly responding to criticism the entire previous day suddenly chooses one hour before lynch to make an AFK excuse? THAT'S NOT WHAT I SAID. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:10 Holyflare wrote: It was after this post which was essentially an afk excuse when under pressure. Keep seeing them every time I bring up a case or valid points on her. EVERY TIME there is a valid point or case an excuse comes out. It doesn't matter if she posts more after it, feeling the need to post it is scummy imo. Especially if you stay! On July 04 2019 17:22 Holyflare wrote: No she makes plenty of them and then responds to points which is imo worse because it looks like an excuse to leave at any point. It's unnecessary and a bad habit for mafia. Either way it reinvigorated my want to lynch her until she actually responded. If you think this is solely why I wanted to lynch Eversince and this is what you think made me solely keep my vote on her then you're either terrible or mafia. It's way better to keep pressure on someone that I have a case on and instill the fear of a lynch in them than vote grack who has done nothing. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:26 Pandain wrote: It's exactly what happened, just add in your nonsensical anger at ES claiming she was AFK. I invite anyone to reread the conversation: https://tl.net/forum/mafia/549333-minifeast-15?page=38 Like it's quite literally not what happened in the slightest. If es posted nothing I would have moved to grack. | ||
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Coupled that with the fact I had outstanding points on her and she was the leading wagon vs a guy that at the time had done nothing and now that I read back was posting valid points on rayn's read on es why would I not keep my vote on her? | ||
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Then you acknowledge I never actually dropped it because of grack's posts so what you're doing is in fact misrepresenting the "facts" entirely. Very bad look for you pandain. What is even the point behind your read here? That I voted someone over someone else or what? That I didn't vote grack so I'm mafia because? Either I told the truth or in some way I lied but you've never said my motivation for lying at any point so the only option left is truth. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:31 Holyflare wrote: Do you think it matters if the person with the largest filter posts afk excuses? What's your point? My point is clearly that she has some subconscious need to post afk excuses when she doesn't actually need to afk. Coupled that with the fact I had outstanding points on her and she was the leading wagon vs a guy that at the time had done nothing and now that I read back was posting valid points on rayn's read on es why would I not keep my vote on her? You either believe this or you call me mafia for it. If you call me mafia for it then you explain WHY it makes me mafia. Do not just pick up on lol afk excuse or omg grack said he was lazy. These are solid points on why I did what I did. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:52 raynpelikoneet wrote: That's true and this bothers me aswell. I cant go more into detail before i am home, but your final conclusion was "hf is scum for this" regardless of if hf's explanation makes sense (or should make sense) or not. That's not really true. Grack posted shit all and if ES had posted nothing (bear in mind I had a case on es outstanding!) I would have voted grack. Then she returned and said that post. I thought, eh, may as well keep my vote where it is and see what she does and how she responds to my points. Meanwhile grack starts to say not abhorrent things about rayn that I didn't hate (how his es read didn't make sense) but I think this is a language barrier thing so what looked weird to me and grack at the time rayn explains as not weird. THEN LITERALLY the beginning of the next page she says the points I raised were crap so I was way more focused on her because she only thought I had the meta points against her (which she said was good originally!) so I became hyper focused on that. So, no, there is no switch because I never switched to grack in the first place. The only reason I was thinking of lynching grack in the first place was because his filter was shit and void of content vs an actual mafia case on eversince. So, yes, when my mafia case posts more things I think make her mafia then I will remain voting her. Especially as keeping her as the leading lynch wagon os beneficial for information. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:53 Pandain wrote: You're completely misrepresenting yourself. You specifically said the reason you changed was because of ES's afk excuse. Not because you were rethinking things in general. None of this is debatable. And sure, I agree that you could be town and think ES's afk excuse is bad. But it makes you more suspicious because that's terrible logic. This absolutely terrible logic makes you mafia. As well as you trying to say that "I NEVER SAID THAT" when you clearly did. And you even now admit that you did say that. I never ever said this is the sole reason that es is more mafia than grack did I? No. I would much rather keep my vote on a mafia case who posted a really poor reentry case than a vote on grack who is purely because he's done shit all. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:59 raynpelikoneet wrote: Did ES ever post "afk excuses" before this game and if she did, why didnt you care about it enough to add it to your case earlier HF? I have literally no idea, it's just something I see skimming through the thread. You're conflating the reasoning anyway! I just think it's a bad reentry post to make when there are multiple points against you and you're the leading wagon. | ||
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On July 04 2019 17:58 Holyflare wrote: That's not really true. Grack posted shit all and if ES had posted nothing (bear in mind I had a case on es outstanding!) I would have voted grack. Then she returned and said that post. I thought, eh, may as well keep my vote where it is and see what she does and how she responds to my points. Meanwhile grack starts to say not abhorrent things about rayn that I didn't hate (how his es read didn't make sense) but I think this is a language barrier thing so what looked weird to me and grack at the time rayn explains as not weird. THEN LITERALLY the beginning of the next page she says the points I raised were crap so I was way more focused on her because she only thought I had the meta points against her (which she said was good originally!) so I became hyper focused on that. So, no, there is no switch because I never switched to grack in the first place. The only reason I was thinking of lynching grack in the first place was because his filter was shit and void of content vs an actual mafia case on eversince. So, yes, when my mafia case posts more things I think make her mafia then I will remain voting her. Especially as keeping her as the leading lynch wagon os beneficial for information. You either believe this post or you do not. If you do not then call me mafia for the rest of the game. If you do believe it then move on. I will speak nothing further of this point because it is absolutely irrelevant unless you think I'm specifically mafia with grack which only rayn has kind of hinted at the possibility of. And even then it's terrible because I'm just doing what I do and pushing my mafia reads. | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:02 raynpelikoneet wrote: But didnt you say shes been doing that continuously? Every time I skim the thread I see something like "oh gtg bye!" yes. Whether she does it all the time or does it as town I don't know nor really care. Nothing to do with her afk excuse is the sole reason I'm scum reading her. It's probably about the lowest reason I can think of. It was a good enough reason for me to want to keep pressure on her until she answered my points though. | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:05 raynpelikoneet wrote: Maybe i worded poorly. Do you remember es posting "afk excuses" vefore the es/grack thing in this game and if she did, why wasnt that in your case since you think its scummy? Vaguely, yes. I think you're not really thinking from the perspective that I had 0 investment into the game. I'll be at work skim thread and not care. Yes, she probably posted a lot of those and I noticed but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt and not care. UNTIL it relates to me and points I raise and call people mafia for. Dumb? Maybe. | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:07 Jockmcplop wrote: Was it a good enough reason to literally try and kill her instead of grack at a vital moment? Are you intentionally dense? I had a mafia case on ES and it wasn't very close to deadline so, yes, it is a good reason to keep my vote on someone I think is mafia to force them to generate content? | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:08 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well coffee break is over. I will go over this kn more detail when i get off work. Please don't it's a massive waste of time. Es is mafia and I'm going to get shot. The odds of that just ever decrease the more this nonsense goes on. Why can't you guys just wait till after the night to post stuff about me? Really stupid. | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:16 raynpelikoneet wrote: Because if i get shot instead i fear people will do something stupid. That's fair enough. | ||
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On July 04 2019 18:15 Jockmcplop wrote: Intentionally dense lol. THAT'S THE NAME OF MY NEW BAND So, and I'm sorry that you've explained all of this over the course of about 25 different posts but I'm trying to get it all in order so I know exactly what you are saying and cna judge on those terms.. Way before deadline You had a case on ES and were pushing You said that you would probably prefer to kill grack but could kill either You noticed ES was making afk excuses so you kept your vote on her to force her to generate content Just before deadline ES still generating content, arguing with you about your case on her Grack still doing nothing, generating zero content. About 15-20 minutes before deadline, the wagon on grack builds to the point where a single vote switch would kill grack instead of ES. You keep your vote on ES. I'm not accusing you of anything here, but your arguments are difficult to follow so I'm trying to understand what you're saying. At this point 15-20 minutes before deadline, exactly what was your reason for sticking with ES rather than switching to Grack, as you earlier indicated you would? Well you're missing the entirety of the posts ES was posting so, yes. It wasn't "content" it was more reasons for me to keep my vote on her. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:02 Pandain wrote: I don't agree with any of it. I have a hard strong town read on ES as I've already said. You don't agree with something the person in question agrees with? Lol | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:11 Grackaroni wrote: Pandain you're going to get shot. Don't ruin it | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:19 Pandain wrote: I'm just grateful still the majority of people are against an ES lynch. Really only HF, Rayn, and Eywa. The people that didn't lynch the parity cop, yes. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:20 Pandain wrote: But most people think you're town. and you are against an ES lynch which mafia would love to happen day 2. And if HF ends up being mafia you're not even playing that poorly considering he was your #1 scum read. A) She's not town B) You think grack is mafia with me but he doesn't even want to lynch ES and actively joined the wagon with YOU guys to lynch conversion so why is it mafia's plan to lynch ES when there are only 2 mafia and for some reason you think their plan goes against 50% of their team's strategy? | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:22 Grackaroni wrote: Because you're being townie and you won't get lynched. Whoa there, that's completely the opposite. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:25 Grackaroni wrote: lol are you pushing Pandain? I didn't read yet between after the lynch and now. Perhaps you should get to doing that then because his push tonight was completely bat shit insane. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:28 Pandain wrote: Yeah it sucks Conv was parity cop but he wasn't a bad lynch objectively. He was pretty null. Meanwhile, you guys are trying to lynch someone who is obviously town (ES) Please highlight why she is obviously town because what I see is the complete opposite and you needlessly defend her over and over again with absolutely 0 content to say WHY she is town when there are a plethora of reasons to say why she is not. I won't ever listen to somebody repeatedly saying oh because she's obviously town when there are cold hard facts to say otherwise. Don't you love facts? You kept harping on about them to me over and over again like 2 hours ago. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:31 Pandain wrote: I'd be good with lynching Eywa, someone who is down with lynching someone who he thinks is obvtown Yes, this is what mafia does. Blatantly points to their objective in the thread. | ||
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You defended me from Jock when Jock was actually CORRECT that I didn't post any other information about Eywa in the thread other than Eywa was different from last game because of the content of their posts. You defended ES from people by really bad logic saying "oh, ES must be town because she's not voting Grack" while simultaneously thinking Grack was mafia. You then twisted it to say that if she was mafia with Grack she's always vote Grack which I don't think you can point to any mafia game really where any mafia would do that over trying to start a wagon on someone else. This morning you were creating the narrative on me where you extrapolated some information, made up some bs about me not reading grack an alignment because he said he was lazy (not the case, but so what if I even did that?) and neglected to put any of the other information I posted into your read and just resolutely repeated the point despite other people telling you it was bad. Then you ignored ACTUAL evidence that Eversince has lied about her Grack meta read repeatedly in the thread, something that Eversince even ACKNOWLEDGES but you say you didn't like it. You didn't like FACTS that were true. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:34 Jockmcplop wrote: It absolutely wasn't bat shit insane. Your posts are actually quite hard to follow (because you tend to make a point over the course of a bunch of pages and expect people to follow exactly the same train of thought as you) and it always makes you look somewhat mafia regardless of your alignment. You probably know this already yourself. I haven't played a game yet where you have been confirmed town from your post content alone (ie without game mechanics confirming it for you). Why do you think there's so much argument about things you have/haven't said already? Its because you make it really difficult by always having the big picture message buried somewhat between the lines and then pull it out later as if it was obvious all along. So when you say things like 'his push was bat shit insane' and other stuff you say about how obvious it is that you're right and other people aren't and how stupid everyone else it, it might be worth wondering whether its everyone else being stupid or the fact that you are obscuring the simplicity of your points for some unknown reason. Jock, you say my posts are quite hard to follow but that's PURELY because Pandain made it about my initial post. He never once asked me why my vote stayed on Eversince after the fact did he? It's classic manipulation to hyper focus on one part of a filter and make it all about that and ignore any context about the read or what could have influenced it. So, yeah, it may have looked really fucked up from your perspective but that's because I'm just defending it from the accusation rather than the view as a whole. The big picture thing is totally understandable because I work 90% of the day and phone post 100% of it. That's why typically on a weekend (or now because I've come home early today) you'll see my posts have 100% more clarity than usual. So, when Pandain says "oh, you're mafia because all it took to switch to ES was an afk post and Grack saying he's lazy" it's obviously incorrect because all you have to do is look at literally the next page of the thread and see me talking to ES about my case, not liking her responses and pushing her forward. Something that is really very obvious if you even look at my filter more than a few posts past what Pandain was mentioning! | ||
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Either lied about my meta read being good or trash Misconstrued my case to just being about the meta read when really that was old and I had many more points after that These are the reasons I KEPT my vote on her after she returned otherwise I would have just simply switched to Grack. So I initially kept it on her because the return afk post looked bad and MAINTAINED my vote on her because what she said AFTER that was lies, misconstruing etc. ----- Now I'm at the rest of your post. It's quite simple. I had read grack's filter, made up my mind to lynch him because my mind only ever focuses on one person at a time to lynch rather than the big picture. THEN ES posted the afk excuse and she's in the forefront of my mind now, my case is still outstanding on her and I want to keep the pressure up and vote her still. THEN the next page she posts about the meta thing and lies etc. If ES had simply posted nothing I would have been voting Grack because his filter was fresh in my mind. If ES had made that afk excuse, answered my points and moved on I would also be voting Grack. You just have to look at the next page of the thread to see why I kept voting her, it's really a trivial point. If you break down the grack post into individual details and whatnot, sure, I probably don't agree with it all. I agreed with the fact he said your logic is wrong because to me it was also wrong, as I highlighted before when I said to you "I don't agree with this point" and I think Pandain even corrected you. I think people can say good as mafia but mean just as town so we disagreed there. It wasn't until you explained it later that I really understood what you were getting at so in retrospect, yeah, I agree with Grack at that point because I felt similarly but I can see how a mafia Grack can also make that post knowing what I know about the language you think ES wrote vs what I interpreted it as. | ||
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On July 04 2019 21:56 raynpelikoneet wrote: Also HF, i would also want an aswer to this: You said you don't remember. You however posted this: Every time there is a valid point or a case[...] But you didn't even remember if she did that when you made your original case. I would instantly buy your explanation if that happened before in this game AND you had remembered it and explained it with that, but you didn't. Also the lower part of the quote; I was looking for that post when i wrote my big post and couldn't find it for some reason. But doesn't this contradict solely the fact you even said you wanted to lynch Grack in the first place? Like idk why do you say that? Do you think Grack will fall and GRACK (lol you get it? ) under pressure if you just say you might want to lynch him? If you actually meant to pressure Grack as you say, i think your follow up on Grack isn't really townie as per my bullet point list.I don't know how to explain it and I don't really know if I wrote "my cases" or cases in general but every time I see some really good points in my mind while skimming I see ES having to dash off - even if she stays and answers briefly. I can't explain if it's true or not and maybe it happened and was accurate or didn't happen but it's synonymous in my mind with good points and afk excuses. Can I explain it if it's wrong? No, and I'll look bad. It's just what I had in the back of my head and why it isn't in any case. I have no reason to lie about this at all in any alignment. If I'm mafia I have no need to make up an excuse to vote Eversince for posting an afk excuse when I can just reference any of her other points in the next page as reasons. It's just the truth and whether it's accurate or not doesn't really matter if it's what I believed at the time. The main reason that the vote stayed is because I thought it was REALLY convenient to be the leading wagon with outstanding points on you and say "I don't have much time gotta dash soon!" The last point I'm not really sure what you're saying. I was going to vote Grack, put him in the lead and then ES returned, posted that post and I left my vote on there with the option to vote Grack and my intention to vote Grack made really clear. Then literally the NEXT page ES starting spouting lies and all semblance of wanting to vote Grack went out of the window when all I cared about was someone lying and most likely being mafia. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + My heart isn't really in it and I think she's probably town from tone alone and it's a bit depressing but you should never trust your heart so I'm going to ignore it in the hunt for information on everyone else. | ||
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Trfel is really just a person that exists... I remember liking his posts when he posts them but he's so background and he ninja voted at deadline. | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:13 raynpelikoneet wrote: I am trying to weigh where your vote should be (or go) on how you reacted to things at that time and how i think you SHOULD react as town in my mind. It is not 100% clear to me where your vote should go. Can you point out me the first post when you got home or somewhere where you had actual time to be properly involved with the game last night? Google says I got home about 19:15 https://tl.net/forum/mafia/549333-minifeast-15?page=38#758 So about here. But I didn't really go on the computer, I got naked first because that's the first thing I do when I get home. Did some other things, made some food, played a bit of Mario briefly. The part where I say Grack is a good vote is from reading his filter on the train because I can just press all and I don't need signal to load his filter pages after it's all loaded. Obviously can't go to the vote thread when on public transport because of signal/no room to play anyway and then I pretty much get through the door when ES returns. | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:17 Eversince wrote: What I don't get HF is you literally said it was a meta read I got wrong you m!ES for. Then I prodded you to talk, you scum me for that too. But I did it because I could see m!HF trying to kill the t!ES that has a lot of pressure and is going to drop like a stone Friday. I felt better after our conversations though. I don't really agree with what you think but I could see how you made it there.Now you're saying I don't even understand so it's back to 'let's start a storm with ES so I can make her look scum'. Originally, yes? When you returned and said that my points were trash you only referenced my meta points even though Jock was quizzing me on why I scum read you after that fact and I had many more points. It made it look like you hadn't read the thread, you hadn't even really contemplated what I'd posted. Then you said only the meta points were trash even though previously you said they were okay for me to vote you on so obviously that's conflicting information and I mafia read you for it. Now, since then I've delved into your filter, found the grack inconsistencies etc and called you mafia again but I don't really want to get into a fight, that's the last thing I want to do. Just want to post my honest thoughts and see what happens. | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:20 Grackaroni wrote: I'm quite annoyed at you HF. I don't want to listen to your shit just because I didn't post in the night phase. I gave my best attempt at solving the game yesterday. It's not an easy game to solve because a lot of the players (ES, Pandain, Eywa) are reads that I have that are pure tone reads. I think I could definitely be wrong about my Eywa read, and maybe Eversince but that would impress me. I don't want to cause any offense, it was a little jab at mafia players who play under the radar. I don't think it's insulting to call you out on something that you've said you haven't done (read any of the thread this night phase). Of all the people that have posted they have some kind of reason for thinking what they do and accusing someone of something, excluding you who have not weighed in any thoughts. What am I supposed to conclude from that? | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:20 raynpelikoneet wrote: I think he did his town thing on the post on HF. Oh, forgot trfel made the case on me lol! Yeah, that was good (even if it was completely wrong). Don't think he'd be that bold as mafia at least. | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:28 Grackaroni wrote: I don't think it's bad to suspect someone for being the only person not contributing at night and I don't mind being lynched. Just you going out and saying that you don't respect me for not posting in the game felt a little personal. I'd never intentionally insult someone that way just for the sake of it. Sorry :/ | ||
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On July 04 2019 22:33 Jockmcplop wrote: I still think the way trfel writes the following point is actually really good: I understand what you are saying hf when you say that you didn't switch to grack because ES was making more mafia posts at the end of the day, right, making you determined to kill ES? (this makes sense out of context of the timing of events) Here's the thing... flashback to 15 minutes before deadline and votes are going down left right and center. You know what you're doing and are normally quite insistent that you get your way, but there was no discussion at all about other people's votes at this point. I would expect you to be at least trying to stop the shenanigans or join in so you have some measure of control over what happens.. So were you distracted by arguing with ES, did you not see all the votes go in or were you just not really bothered who got lynched? Sorry if you already explained this. I think all the shenanigans happened in the last five minutes didn't they? Was far more concerned with arguing with ES and playing Mario Maker than the game :D Got a world record on my friend's level at least. | ||
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On July 05 2019 02:54 Eversince wrote: Ok Rayn. That's fine I think this argument is a lost cause. Your misconstruing everything I say to fit your narrative. I have problems with that. I'll address those tomorrow when I'm not dead on my feet. He's not, it's the exact same thing I talked about in my long post. | ||
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On July 05 2019 04:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: YOU HF should see why it is mafia post. I dont think anyone else will, you should. Which post? The one I said I liked lol? :D | ||
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No, he said that your meta points on es were shit. Eg. The "he's good at mafia" points. He didn't reference me because my points weren't the same as that and I'd done other stuff to pad out my scum read. | ||
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On July 05 2019 04:18 raynpelikoneet wrote: me on ES --> grack meta you on ES --> grack meta 100% same, just with different words. Oh I'm not sure if he was referring to that. My grack meta points only came in the night. | ||
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Whoops. Would have definitely solidified my read yesterday though. | ||
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On July 10 2019 04:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: yeah you played really really well. i didnt even have to lie or twist the facts when you got lynched for no reason at all. i was literally never prepared in you getting lynched so i didnt think i needed to do anything (if i did i would have yelled to lynch ES since i thought HF will figure me out in 1 sec if i change my mind), on that front trfel's case D2 was not so good. I think i would have had that read on Grack if i was town, i cant say for sure but i think i would have done it early on. HolyflarePerson was signed in when posted 07-09-2019 02:18 PM ET (US) I told you all no lynch was optimal. Always no lynch after rayn's day 2. Why? I heavily disagree with no-lynching here, mafiajsut kills Pandain and then what? Well because your day 2 was essentially opening up the entire game by calling the 2 townier people in the game mafia opportunistically and Eversince was known to have to afk after Friday so bussing was optimal. You played very well though either way. Gives you a whole lot more time to make errors too and search for more mafia but I guess the two people up for lynch didn't really give that great of a defence and seemed to just give up (even though they did try I guess). Obviously it's super different being in obs compared to in the game. | ||
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On July 10 2019 05:15 raynpelikoneet wrote: I honestly never accounted ES' "possibly afking" into anything. I would never do that. I told her if she needs to go and cant play ask for a replacement. Idk who townier people i called mafia? I only called jock mafia i think and that was after when he made that case on me which i honestly thought was soooo bad (granted idk if it was "soooo bad" since i misread one of his posts). Idk about the last paragraph? Are you talking about D3 here earlier too or? I dunno what to tell you, at one point you started going on Jock or someone just after I called jock and trfel really townie in obs and it looked really opportunistic and I called you 100% mafia and never backed down. So I must have seen something that you wouldn't ever do as town there. | ||
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On July 10 2019 06:50 raynpelikoneet wrote: As HF and Eywa said (HF had TMI in obs qt though!!) idk, i would have liked to see if people actually catch me for actual reasons (idk, maybe you jock and trfel had reasons but even as mafia i thought they dont apply to me because i was lynching mafia -- or if i got lynched ES will prolly win anyways). I mean i think i called out ES for all the right reasons and that's it. Town just fucked up on the lynch D1 and there was an unfortunate vigi who didn't shoot mafia, so i had an opening. No I didn't lol? | ||
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