EPTBut the problem with this is we would need at least one of the two remaining townies to see this and i am not sure if that's gonna happen so i go with the route of proving who is scum then instead. Sorry guys, this will take a bit more time, but i know what i am doing.
[T][M] Resistance V - Section 31 - Page 37
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
But the problem with this is we would need at least one of the two remaining townies to see this and i am not sure if that's gonna happen so i go with the route of proving who is scum then instead. Sorry guys, this will take a bit more time, but i know what i am doing. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On November 03 2015 18:03 raynpelikoneet wrote: This is probably the dumbest shit i have heard in this game. Yeah... There's almost certainly at least one scum between Kita/shockey IMO. Basically agreed with rayn... Kita has been very vague about everything, and only jumped in to push me (?) when it looked like me/rayn/HTS was going to pass (probably means Kita isn't scum with HTS/rayn because otherwise why bother to do that?). Shockey' push on rayn has been bad and somehow continued even though it was proven that rayn's "anger" shouldn't be alignment-indicative... Probably agenda-driven after all even if it just seemed paranoid at the start. I'd be really interested to see the reasoning for these reads (unless I managed to miss it). Chances are, Rels could just be scum and pulling reads out of nowhere :/ | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On November 03 2015 19:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: Xatalos i hope you read the thread, especially my posts really carefully before you post. I maybe get what you mean with your proposal... It could work? But it might just be easier to aim for a town team.. It would be more reliant on our skill rather than... Well, you know. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On November 03 2015 20:28 raynpelikoneet wrote: On the other hand we could just pick three of rayn/Xatalos/Artanis/sicklucker and when the mission 1 passes then add the fourth and i guarantee you we will win the game, otherwise you can call me scum and i won't even resist. But the problem with this is we would need at least one of the two remaining townies to see this and i am not sure if that's gonna happen so i go with the route of proving who is scum then instead. Sorry guys, this will take a bit more time, but i know what i am doing. You're that confident in Artanis/SL? Over HTS? I can kind of see suspecting HTS after that odd team proposal, but if she was scum with Kita, why bother with adding Kita anyway? If HTS was scum and Kita town (lol), then.. Hm, maybe it could be to blame it on Kita? Well, I guess that makes sense. Still I doubt HTS/Kita are both Spies and Kita looks worse IMO. Neither Artanis nor SL has done much yet... I guess that could be taken as not pushing an agenda like you said. I'm not quite ready to call them "obvious town" yet though, because not doing anything could also mean that there hasn't been a reason to do anything (for example, if HTS was scum? - although I don't think it's too likely). | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
 A bit annoying that we can't talk openly about the pros/cons of either plan... | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On November 03 2015 21:38 Xatalos wrote: You're that confident in Artanis/SL? Over HTS? I can kind of see suspecting HTS after that odd team proposal, but if she was scum with Kita, why bother with adding Kita anyway? If HTS was scum and Kita town (lol), then.. Hm, maybe it could be to blame it on Kita? Well, I guess that makes sense. Still I doubt HTS/Kita are both Spies and Kita looks worse IMO. Neither Artanis nor SL has done much yet... I guess that could be taken as not pushing an agenda like you said. I'm not quite ready to call them "obvious town" yet though, because not doing anything could also mean that there hasn't been a reason to do anything (for example, if HTS was scum? - although I don't think it's too likely). Yeah that's what i am basically saying. I see no reason for HtS to not think you are town anymore, and add kita into the team if they are both mafia. That's why i think they are not both mafia. And kita is definitely easier to put the sabotage blame on than you are. But the switch from you -> kita gives me a pause, especially after HtS even puts Superbia as a townread over you (which i definitely do not agree with). The way i see scum approaching this from the point of view that you are town is basically that casting doubt on you is at this point of the game a good play, because it's highly unlike the HtS team gets passed, and you are the next leader on line. So whoever you pick (assuming you are picking two other townies), they have a valid excuse to disagree with the team based on "Xatalos is there". That's exactly what i did as scum in the last game i played, and it works out surprisingly well if you can't get your own team through and/or if you have the (rest of the) leaders from your scumteam in the bottom of the queue. That's also what i see all of kitaman/shockeyy/rels/hts possibly doing here. I don't understand any of those people's reasons for not heavily townreading you because you are very obviously town in this game. As for your last paragraph, i do think at least Artanis would push stuff more, and SL would bus (lol).  Basically as scum you want to look as town as possible and bussing is definitely not out of question, since you only need one scum onto a mission. If you, from the beginning, cut your own chances of getting to missions as scum, you basically just lose the game. Artanis knows better, and i find it genuine that he just has not have time to play and therefore hasn't have good reads. And i still think SL would just bus. And the rest of the people look worse anyways, and everyone cannot be scum. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
1) If there are three scum, and the plan goes through, we autowin the game. 2) That is not going to happen because kitaman will refuse to follow up with that if there is three scum 3) When kitaman refuses to the plan, he actually has to explain why one of Rels/ShoCkeyy is mafia 4) When kitaman says "no" to the plan, i am going to ask Rels about his read on kitaman, and where does he base that on -- in contrary to the read on you (the "Xatalos does not have scumreads" part -- i will explain that further then) 5) And then all of this doesn't matter, except for we get scum talking about each other and not give bullshit reads 6) And the plan will still be town-favored if there is even 2 scum in that group of three (which i am 95% sure of, unless i am playing horribly in this game). | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
If my current team fails, no big deal, I think if it failing helps figure more people out, that's probably better instead of getting a surprise sabotage and already losing one of our three chances. As for me being more clear on Superbia, that comes down to me being much more familiar with Superbia's town game than Xatalos (as I said before I have never played a game with Xatalos as town) so if you are saying the read is flawed, great, but it's not maliciously flawed. I think I've said before in multiple games that I've played with you (rayn) that people not agreeing with you or seeing the same things as you doesn't mean they are mafia (or a spy in this case). If you're arguing that I'm not being transparent about my reads or something of that sort, then you have an entirely different argument on your hands as to why I might be a spy. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:06 Xatalos wrote: I guess that makes sense.... I mean, clearing then with PoE / lack of scum agenda. At least for now. I think Artanis could be genuinely busy as either alignment, so that's not really a sure thing? That's why he's still a null for me. I'll probably have a more concrete read on him based on what he does on Thursday (the day he says he'll still be around). I have talked with him out of game re: his job/capoeira/sport so it's certainly true, but separate from what he puts in here. That said based on any game-relevant information he has I'd need to see something firmer based on what I do know of his scum play, which is generally lacklustre. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:03 raynpelikoneet wrote: Basically Xatalos, the point is the following: 1) If there are three scum, and the plan goes through, we autowin the game. 2) That is not going to happen because kitaman will refuse to follow up with that if there is three scum 3) When kitaman refuses to the plan, he actually has to explain why one of Rels/ShoCkeyy is mafia 4) When kitaman says "no" to the plan, i am going to ask Rels about his read on kitaman, and where does he base that on -- in contrary to the read on you (the "Xatalos does not have scumreads" part -- i will explain that further then) 5) And then all of this doesn't matter, except for we get scum talking about each other and not give bullshit reads 6) And the plan will still be town-favored if there is even 2 scum in that group of three (which i am 95% sure of, unless i am playing horribly in this game). Yeah, I think it's a good way to put pressure on the scumteam. Not sure if you want to talk about the reasons openly like this though? I also thought of a couple other reasons unrelated to those, but I definitely wouldn't want to talk about them this openly.. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:12 Xatalos wrote: Yeah, I think it's a good way to put pressure on the scumteam. Not sure if you want to talk about the reasons openly like this though? I also thought of a couple other reasons unrelated to those, but I definitely wouldn't want to talk about them this openly.. Well if kitaman is scum he knows all this already because he is a smart guy. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well if kitaman is scum he knows all this already because he is a smart guy. Could be... But his teammates might not, and they have no way to communicate in this game. | ||
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: I would still like you HtS to explain why kitaman is town. Pretty sure I did through the course of things, but sure will do again. Basically I had gone though his filter and I'm seeing points where he's driving the discussion pretty constructively. #455 is a good example of this to a response from Xatalos that would appear somewhat worded vaguely "like solving the game" where he's asking him to substantiate his read. He did the same thing to me in #458, the followups were there re: Superbia. The other posts that I liked were 569 and anything he mentioned after the nominations went through. The responses to Xatalos re: Superbia were spot on - the latter was not engaged constantly with the thread and from what I can tell those questions would appear to me as trying to figure Xata's alignment since he's obviously said he's not sold on him. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
Here is what has happened regarding ShoCkeyy and his reads. He calls me scum. People point out how his reasoning is flawed. This makes him call ALSO Xatalos scum. Now okay, he thinks i am scum and Xatalos is scum, therefore he refuses a team of HtS/rayn/Xatalos. Logicwise this could make sense but the next thing he says is "at least switch rayn to Superbia so we know who is scum if the mission fails". This doesn't make any sense as town as: 1) If he reads Xatalos scum, he should want to swap BOTH of me and Xatalos from that team 2) therefore the only logical explanation for me is (if he actually wants to push a team of his liking and not just say something) that he needs scum there -> and that scum would be Superbia. Now i know this is unflipped association but you cannot basically deny that this is possible, and even likely. There is really nothing but unflipped associations in Resistance, and that is the only way i can see that (logically) making sense. Noone should ever push a team with scum in it unless they can logically explain it -- and "at least we know who is scum" is not a logical explanation for picking a team where there is scum over all town team. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On November 03 2015 22:20 sicklucker wrote: yo xataloser is a bad guy Why? | ||
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