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On September 24 2015 08:27 Damdred wrote:
Ok so, this is a bit wifom argument to a degree but I think its correct.
More than likely geript is going to be lynched today with an outside shot of me. I believe geript is town and I know I'm town. Here's the reasons I think geript is town.
1) A real lack of a drive to survive. If he's scum he needs to get a mislynch to get into mylo and then another to win the game. The obvious play here is to push either Damdred or Ceph today. Instead he takes the much more suicidal way of going about the voting he tackles jat.
2) Building on that Geeipt has one person who thinks he has a shot of not being scum here (me). And I don't have the thread presence to save him obviously so what's the play? Poke at what most consider town jat and hope you get ignored?
While this is somewhat nai and a bit of conjecture I don't believe geript would do this as scum he would more than likely start pushing ver or myself to get into a winnable situation. And its not where he's at or where he's going.
Besides that he has been incredibly wrong this game has had 0 impact on the lynch and just doesn't care as much and I see this coming from a more town aligned geript.
Its a lot of feelings and what I expect from geript but id he's just going to suicide he would just concede probably.
The reason to do what he is doing is exactly this. People calling him town for it. To the bolded: and that's why you do not do this. If he is the last mafia pushing for the easy lynches will get him scumread. His only chance of winning is being townread enough to survive today which he thinks he can achieve by being retarded and irrelevant again.
On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:
So for why Palmar is town.
When Marv/Palmar are mafia together, I've always seen them confirm each other and work to utilize their thread capability with each other. You know, they use their names and ability to push to get people lynched; often they'll push two people and consolidate on one. It's basically how Marv operates with any vet who can control a thread in the slightest. But Marv was happy to not coordinate with Palmar and vice versa. Marv seconded my early read on Palmar (although not to the same extent) and was happy to remove the townreads on him (or try); Palmar was happy to question Marv from D2.
I'm town for lots of reasons:
1. Mod confirmed on N1 when I blew up on Ceph.
2. Gave power to Marv. I'm good at mafia; but I don't think I'm good enough to simulate my town game by just sheeping (scumbuddy) Marv. I'd pull a Kita and just be less active while trying to be pushy.
3. I've been super wrong. I think I made 1 comment on thinking Wile was scum and it wasn't even fleshed out. As scum, I bother to be at least partially right. I dont' push it, but I at least bother to save room in case my partners are complete fucking retards and I have to hard carry another game.
4. Zero fucks given. I can't think of a single scum game where I've given zero fucks. I think I actually try harder as mafia than as town on average because it's just more fun.
5. I've been in no way reasonable the entire game. When have I been scum and not been at least reasonably reasonable?
6. JAT can suck my big hairy town balls.
7. Because I'd just kill Scott and not risk it. Also, i wouldn't have rb'd Koshi. Like I have really solid NKs; I lost a game because Rayn modkilled himself and I deferred to Palmar for NKs even though I knew mine were better (and would've won us the game btw). There's literally no reason for me to kill Koshi over Scott. On the other hand, there's every reason for JAT to kill him to shut him up because JAT will just try to spam his way to victory
8. I'M FUCKING MODCONFIRMED. HOW CAN DECONDUO BE SURE IF i'M FUCKING STRESSED IF I'M FUCKING SCUM????
9. Because I don't care how I look. I haven't at all. When I'm mafia, I care to be well ahead of the "front" of the kill list line. Often, I'm leading the kill list.
10. Do I really need more.
I don't know if it's Ceph or JAT, but honestly, JAT needs to die 100% because there's no way people would lynch him in lylo and there's no way town wins then.
The marv/Palmar thing is pure speculation. If marv feels Palmar isn't towny enough he will feel the need to call him mafia/not townread him - it was the same in assassination.
1. Wrong. The host will moderate this kind of post each and every time regardless who posts it. It doesn't matter if he thinks the person in question really feels this way or not.
2. WIFOM and bullshit.
3.-5. Yes, and that's why you are mafia. You do not give a fuck about being right this game. You act retardedly to not have to push something good and later you try to clear yourself by saying this shit. If it is so clear to you now that you haven't been reasonable then why the fuck were you like this in the first place and continue to be right now?
7. I have 0 fucking reason to shoot Koshi there. Koshi wanted to lynch marv above all and then Palmar. He said he would sheep my case on marv. So what you are trying to sell is that I not only did not shoot the tracker I was convinced was multi-shot (enough reason to clear me alone) but Koshi instead who would have sheeped me that day. Ok, you might argue "well, if he wants to kill marv then it makes sense to shoot him". That is true. But then why the heck am I killing him and STILL push and lynch marv? It makes absolutely no sense for me to do that.
8. See 1.
9. See 3.-5.
10. Yes, yes you do.
People won't lynch me now and they also won't in LYLO because I am obviously town.
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On September 24 2015 17:58 Palmar wrote:This is a weak but clever point: Damdred decided to check up on me (ok fair enough). He said he should read my filter. My filter is 17 pages of some hard hitting analysis. Time analysis is actually quite valid: Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 12:21 Damdred wrote:
just have to read jats filter again and palmar and see what I can find Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 13:31 Damdred wrote:
I just read palmars filter.
I'm pretty sure he's town in this situation. He seems to waver about Marv a good bit. Pushes Marv at good times for town palmar to do so and while it is in his wheel house especially the pressure n1 just seems way out of place for a palmar and Marv scum team.
He basically didn't fall into the mafia trap of saying "I read someone's filter" in 5 minutes. This is super weak though.
Yes, it is. Because regardless of his alignment it most likely takes the same time to read it if he really does. And he would be pretty stupid not to at this point.
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This is very real btw.:
On September 23 2015 21:54 Palmar wrote:
There's also the strong urge to lynch him because I would never forgive myself for losing to a scum geript trolling through the game.
It's awful but it's true. I don't want to reward retarded play.
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On September 24 2015 12:21 Damdred wrote:
Game is hard though...
Like I'm fairly certain geript is town
Rit is lock town
I was reading marvs filter and its pretty filled with wifom.
Reading his filter his lynch order if he could lived seemed to be, geript, cerph then me. He was super hedgy on me and contradicted what he thought of geript at points.
His read progressions on hat feel flawed to a poin, goes from a decent sized acum read to a town read.
Like maybe rits right about ceph Marv did push him a good bit even after wile was found out. He would be in danger of getting lynched the next day especially with his attitude.
Even his palmar interactions seem strange to me. Bad idea to read his filte ri think.
just have to read jats filter again and palmar and see what I can find
That's the problem. One of Marvs strengths as scum is that he doesn't leave connections with anyone when he gets lynched. When I read his filter yesterday or the day before I also came to the conclusion that it doesn't really tell us that much.
His read progression on damdred could be mafia/mafia - I think I explained that more than enough. But it also makes sense to agree with him trying to clear geript if geript is his partner. His push on Cephiro wasn't strong enough to clear him (although I think marv might have stpped playing earlier if he was mafia with cephiro - not sure on it though). Basically every one of damdred, geript, palmar and cephiro could be mafia with marv.
To the underlined: where did you get that from? I do not recall marv wanting to lynch geript or you at all. He wanted to kill cephiro or me and then stopped playing as far as I recall it.
To the bolded: Of course it's flawed. I told you as much in my case on him. That's why he was obviously mafia.
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On September 24 2015 22:31 Damdred wrote:
Don't do that jat near the end of his filter Marv says
I'd probably lynch geript first but id reverse ceph and damdred in your list and lynch ceroh over damdred.
But he was going pretty 50/50 on me keeping options open meh
No, he doesn't?! I think you are misunderstanding the post where he answers me.
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He agrees with me about geript being the LEAST scummy. And he wants to lynch ceph before you while he doesn't say where he would put you while he substitutes himself with me behind cephiro.
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On September 24 2015 22:52 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2015 19:54 marvellosity wrote:On September 18 2015 19:52 justanothertownie wrote:On September 18 2015 19:50 marvellosity wrote:On September 18 2015 19:49 justanothertownie wrote:On September 18 2015 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
alright, you're god, these other players are trash, you're obviously right about everything because you're so awesome etc.
srsly enough of this one. I am not saying anything like that. Those are just the facts. If Palmar and me both think you are mafia it means something. But sure, we can stop this so you can start figuring out that it basically has to be damdred/cephiro or maybe geript if it's not you. Palmar hedging/waffling on me/suggesting it's possible i'm mafia means absolutely nothing. figure it out yourself my love. I already said my part. I think geript is the least likely. Damdred probably the most likely followed by you and cephiro. I would lynch Cephiro above Damdred fo sho. And we agree on geript. fiddle you/me, and voila. I just misremembered this post since it said it agreed with you on geript which I'm curious what changed exactly between here and now to take geript from least likely to top scum by a mile? Its not like his d1 or 2 was super town to most anyway?
It's not by a mile but yes, I want to lynch him the most. The reason for the change is that earlier in the game I read his wrongness and multiple dumbtells as towny (the more calculated as mafia argument) but now he is just overdoing it and I am not buying it anymore.
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On September 24 2015 22:53 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 22:45 Palmar wrote:
I would probably not try to rely too much on marv's filter to make reads. I agree with this also there's a lot of wifom in there
Yes.
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On September 24 2015 23:12 justanothertownie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 22:52 Damdred wrote:On September 18 2015 19:54 marvellosity wrote:On September 18 2015 19:52 justanothertownie wrote:On September 18 2015 19:50 marvellosity wrote:On September 18 2015 19:49 justanothertownie wrote:On September 18 2015 19:46 marvellosity wrote:
alright, you're god, these other players are trash, you're obviously right about everything because you're so awesome etc.
srsly enough of this one. I am not saying anything like that. Those are just the facts. If Palmar and me both think you are mafia it means something. But sure, we can stop this so you can start figuring out that it basically has to be damdred/cephiro or maybe geript if it's not you. Palmar hedging/waffling on me/suggesting it's possible i'm mafia means absolutely nothing. figure it out yourself my love. I already said my part. I think geript is the least likely. Damdred probably the most likely followed by you and cephiro. I would lynch Cephiro above Damdred fo sho. And we agree on geript. fiddle you/me, and voila. I just misremembered this post since it said it agreed with you on geript which I'm curious what changed exactly between here and now to take geript from least likely to top scum by a mile? Its not like his d1 or 2 was super town to most anyway? It's not by a mile but yes, I want to lynch him the most. The reason for the change is that earlier in the game I read his wrongness and multiple dumbtells as towny (the more calculated as mafia argument) but now he is just overdoing it and I am not buying it anymore.
Like I made this argument very early in the game and geript saw that he would be townread this way. Marv even jumped on this too. So he just kept acting as retarded and illogical as possible.
It sounds farfetched but it really isn't. Normally you can at least see some sort of thought process from geript even if you disagree with his logic. But there is no thought process in this game. I don't think he really explained any of his stances since his rayn push. He just wanted to lynch me for ages now without ever really saying why except for an unexplained "poe" list and without caring about other peoples opinion on me or the points brought up by them. He also doesn't care about what I am doing this game/my contributions in the slightest. He is content with calling me mafia/voting me and doing nothing else while sliding by.
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On September 24 2015 23:18 Damdred wrote:
I mean I hope you guys are right and I'm just dead wrong, but its pretty obvious that geript isn't going to really try to move the lynch off of him there might be some rumblings and maybe I'll convince him to move to ceph but I don't think it matters today..
Total wifom this situation I just can't see geript not conceding I guess.
but I hope I'm wrong and games over
I don't think any of the alive players would concede in this situation. Why would they? Mafia needs 2 mislynches and there are 5 unconfirmed people. 3 of them are really scummy (geript, damdred, cephiro) so even if the mafia is one of them he can still win the game by lynching the other 2.
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On September 24 2015 23:21 Damdred wrote:
Well geript foes the tunnel on someone and not get off it alot lately student game we were in. He even was going to fake a red check on Yamato when yam was being pretty towny so that's null at worse meh.
Yes, but there usually is a thought process. There is none here. I just lynched mafia marv. Does geript care? NOPE. JAT is still mafia.
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This post is a perfect description of geripts play this game:
On September 23 2015 02:55 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2015 02:50 justanothertownie wrote:On September 23 2015 02:48 geript wrote:
A summary of Jat's play today:
Pushes people while ignoring evidence to the contrary. This sentence doesn't even make sense. Must be hard for you to understand such a simple concept. But I'll use small words so everyone can understand. 1. You say you don't see how X can be town 2. It gets explained to you multiple ways 3. You continue to push X. I'll make it really simple. It's a classic scum tactic to ignore evidence that isn't favorable (oops a big word... It means 'good') for their ability to win.
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He just invents reasons to call people mafia. He did it with Palmar day1, he did it with me today. He wants to lynch me because of rayn of all people. When rayn was the one calling me almost definitely town while all you other idiots said I might be scum.
Tell me, why does a townie do this shit?
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On September 24 2015 23:29 Damdred wrote:
Lynching mafia Marv is nai here though he just pushed in his chips with no extra info.
Tgere are better things to point to. And no sometimes geript doesn't have trains of thoughts and he does have some on you if I agree or disagree that's not important.
but if geript needs 2 lynches he's not escaping this one so what's the plan
It's not like geript can magically escape this one just because he is mafia.
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Like, if I am wrong and geript is choosing to play this way as town then I have 0 problems mislynching him for it. He would fuck up or get lynched in LYLO anyways.
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On September 24 2015 23:36 geript wrote:
If everyone's so convinced I'm mafia, how about this. How about everyone not bother reading tomorrow and just lynch JAT?
Or maybe not because I am not mafia and for people who have even half a brain this should be very obvious by now.
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On September 24 2015 23:42 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 17:37 Palmar wrote:Geript's analysis calling me town has literally 0 reasons to call me town in it, On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:
So for why Palmar is town.
When Marv/Palmar are mafia together, I've always seen them confirm each other and work to utilize their thread capability with each other. You know, they use their names and ability to push to get people lynched; often they'll push two people and consolidate on one. It's basically how Marv operates with any vet who can control a thread in the slightest. This is semi-true. Generally marv figures out my alignment (especially when I'm being useful like this game). I sometimes figure him out (and I have been trying lately to be less waffly), but most of the time (I think) I waffle on him for a long time until we lynch mafia together. Like historically that has been the point where I start trusting marv. This sentence is just an introduction to a (directionless) point geript is making. Nothing in here suggests anything about my alignment, one way or the other. On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:
But Marv was happy to not coordinate with Palmar and vice versa. He basically avoided talking to me too much. He just wasn't there very much. In hindsight I should've thought more about it, but I guess knowing he was actually in real life afk (we're co-hosts of another game and he let me know) I gave him some leeway on activity/interactiveness. What's important here is that this is (in hindsight) very revealing about marv's alignment, but says absolutely nothing about mine. I always do my own shit if I feel I need to, and I'll do it no matter my alignment. On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:Marv seconded my early read on Palmar (although not to the same extent) and was happy to remove the townreads on him (or try); Again, this makes marv mafia, it says nothing about my alignment. (He has to call me town as mafia) On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:Palmar was happy to question Marv from D2.
This is the only thing that says anything about my alignment. So let's summarize geript's reasons for why I'm town down to: "Palmar was happy to question Marv from D2" That's really the only thing in there that makes me town. It is, of course, correct, but I don't think it's a particularly insightful way of calling me town. I feel like this piece is more of a conclusion -> evidence process than evidence -> conclusion. No you're flat out wrong. There are two ways to read people. 1. By waht they do. 2. By what they don't do. Best example of a recent game where you were scum was Ver's game. Palmar and Marv were both mafia and I was traitor. Palmar and Marv were both happy to call each other town and use that to direct town KP and direct lynches. The point about Marv not treating Palmar like confirmed town (and even trying to prevent such) shows that his alignment is the same as Palmar's. It's actually a very clever read and I'm rather proud of it.
No, they were not happy to call each other town. In fact marv called Palmar mafia for his retarded push on Sandro which ultimately lost us the fucking game.
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On September 24 2015 23:45 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 23:38 justanothertownie wrote:On September 24 2015 23:36 geript wrote:
If everyone's so convinced I'm mafia, how about this. How about everyone not bother reading tomorrow and just lynch JAT? Or maybe not because I am not mafia and for people who have even half a brain this should be very obvious by now. Nope. Don't be a pussy scum. You're 100% sold that I'm mafia. So agree to get lynched at LYLO. I'm even agreeing to be lynched first. Literally just lynch JAT. He does not care about trying to see if who he's lynching is any alignment. He's literally shit all over every reason (which has been many good reasons) for why I'm town. Palmar made the argument that I'm taking the "path of least resistence" for me considering previous reads. Which is an understandable PoV. The problem with that argument, is that it's exactly the same for JAT.
I am not 100 % sold and I said as much a few posts ago. But there are 0 good reasons to think you are town.
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On September 24 2015 23:47 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 23:44 justanothertownie wrote:On September 24 2015 23:42 geript wrote:On September 24 2015 17:37 Palmar wrote:Geript's analysis calling me town has literally 0 reasons to call me town in it, On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:
So for why Palmar is town.
When Marv/Palmar are mafia together, I've always seen them confirm each other and work to utilize their thread capability with each other. You know, they use their names and ability to push to get people lynched; often they'll push two people and consolidate on one. It's basically how Marv operates with any vet who can control a thread in the slightest. This is semi-true. Generally marv figures out my alignment (especially when I'm being useful like this game). I sometimes figure him out (and I have been trying lately to be less waffly), but most of the time (I think) I waffle on him for a long time until we lynch mafia together. Like historically that has been the point where I start trusting marv. This sentence is just an introduction to a (directionless) point geript is making. Nothing in here suggests anything about my alignment, one way or the other. On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:
But Marv was happy to not coordinate with Palmar and vice versa. He basically avoided talking to me too much. He just wasn't there very much. In hindsight I should've thought more about it, but I guess knowing he was actually in real life afk (we're co-hosts of another game and he let me know) I gave him some leeway on activity/interactiveness. What's important here is that this is (in hindsight) very revealing about marv's alignment, but says absolutely nothing about mine. I always do my own shit if I feel I need to, and I'll do it no matter my alignment. On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:Marv seconded my early read on Palmar (although not to the same extent) and was happy to remove the townreads on him (or try); Again, this makes marv mafia, it says nothing about my alignment. (He has to call me town as mafia) On September 24 2015 13:17 geript wrote:Palmar was happy to question Marv from D2.
This is the only thing that says anything about my alignment. So let's summarize geript's reasons for why I'm town down to: "Palmar was happy to question Marv from D2" That's really the only thing in there that makes me town. It is, of course, correct, but I don't think it's a particularly insightful way of calling me town. I feel like this piece is more of a conclusion -> evidence process than evidence -> conclusion. No you're flat out wrong. There are two ways to read people. 1. By waht they do. 2. By what they don't do. Best example of a recent game where you were scum was Ver's game. Palmar and Marv were both mafia and I was traitor. Palmar and Marv were both happy to call each other town and use that to direct town KP and direct lynches. The point about Marv not treating Palmar like confirmed town (and even trying to prevent such) shows that his alignment is the same as Palmar's. It's actually a very clever read and I'm rather proud of it. No, they were not happy to call each other town. In fact marv called Palmar mafia for his retarded push on Sandro which ultimately lost us the fucking game. No. The sandroba push was not what lost the game. It was BM and You doing stupid shit with your excess KP. Palmar's Sandro push didn't come until later in D1. The early game however, they were happy to townread each other. Not only that; Marv did the exact opposite here. So check yourself before you wreck yourself bitch.
Wrong.
I did not use my excess KP before day2 when Palmar was dead and we had already made up our minds to concede. Marv called Palmar mafia before that. Palmars death lost us the game because he was the bluesniping role and all the blue roles claimed.
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On September 24 2015 23:49 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2015 23:46 justanothertownie wrote:On September 24 2015 23:45 geript wrote:On September 24 2015 23:38 justanothertownie wrote:On September 24 2015 23:36 geript wrote:
If everyone's so convinced I'm mafia, how about this. How about everyone not bother reading tomorrow and just lynch JAT? Or maybe not because I am not mafia and for people who have even half a brain this should be very obvious by now. Nope. Don't be a pussy scum. You're 100% sold that I'm mafia. So agree to get lynched at LYLO. I'm even agreeing to be lynched first. Literally just lynch JAT. He does not care about trying to see if who he's lynching is any alignment. He's literally shit all over every reason (which has been many good reasons) for why I'm town. Palmar made the argument that I'm taking the "path of least resistence" for me considering previous reads. Which is an understandable PoV. The problem with that argument, is that it's exactly the same for JAT. I am not 100 % sold and I said as much a few posts ago. But there are 0 good reasons to think you are town. And there are even fewer reasons to think someone who will 100% spam the thread and out post people, who will be more than willing to bus players who won't be able to keep up and will get lynched regardless is town too. So eat a dick scum. Deal with it. They should and will lynch you next.
I will never be lynched this game and there is nothing you can do about it regardless of if you are mafia or just retarded.
:p
The fact that I can spam up the thread says nothing about my alignment and if you knew the slightest bit about my mafia play you would know that I can't stand bussing at all.
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EPT
