EPTTL Mafia LXX: Guardians of the Galaxy
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Trfel
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Trfel
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On March 15 2015 13:59 Fecalfeast wrote: He's playing vs Action this week. He'll win.Are you going to trade out soO or are you riding that train to hell? | ||
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Trfel
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On March 16 2015 07:11 LightningStrike wrote: You realize that last game I only made a case on Day 1 to make sure I didn't get lynched, right?Can I policy lynch ExO and or Tfrel if they don't make a case in the first 48 hours into the game? Why do people think that I always have reads T.T | ||
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Trfel
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On March 16 2015 09:36 LightningStrike wrote: No, my last game, Mini Mafia Down Under 2.You were scum ofc you had to make sure you weren't getting lynched till I cop checked you lol Ever since I learned how inaccurate my reads are, I stopped making cases constantly  | ||
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Trfel
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The hard part for me is getting it correct. | ||
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On March 19 2015 02:04 Half the Sky wrote: I would do this, but I just came off of a posting restriction game, and I want freedom again (to be fair, I was nowhere near any of the post limits, but still).I'm still looking to see if any player (in any game of his/her choice) will do what geript was trying to do for a few games - impose a self posting limit of 20 posts per day/10 per night, I think in the one student game he was trying to go as low as 10 day and 5 night which is insane in a mini. Though I don't expect I'll be posting all that much this game. | ||
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Trfel
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And they teach the uncertainty principle in basic physics classes. | ||
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On March 19 2015 03:33 Fecalfeast wrote: Yes, this.http://i.imgur.com/z1DWvNj.jpg The image is huge but is this the futurama version of what you're talking about? On March 19 2015 03:36 Half the Sky wrote: I am studying physics. Though I haven't really learned any actual physics yet. Maybe someday...Trfel, you are studying physics or mechanical engineering? I can't remember...I know JAT is studying chemistry but I could have sworn there was a physics student in this bunch. Back on topic, what I wouldn't give to be a mason.... That or vanilla town. Anything else and I won't be very happy. | ||
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Trfel
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 03:48 LightningStrike wrote: Wow...I guess but I would prefer rsoultin to be masoned with me though. ##vote LightningStrike | ||
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Unless you're suggesting that Half the Sky would make us all town and not make a mafia team.... | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 04:50 LightningStrike wrote: I already voted for you. Everyone, vote LightningStrike! Don't let him lynch my scum partner Damdred.I see a lack of reasons from Damdred for voting is he claiming scum before the game even starts O_o? ##Vote: Damdred | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 04:54 LightningStrike wrote: To easy man you outed yourself and your partner bravo. Rsoultin if you reading this lynch both of them with fire! Oops. Time to bus! ##unvote ##vote Damdred | ||
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Trfel
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![[image loading]](http://fullyillustrated.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/fully-illustrated-devil.jpg) There are people in this town who seek to destroy your hopes and dreams. By day, they manipulate and coerce you into doing their bidding. By night, they silently approach your homes and then kill you without mercy. Only a cruel, stone-cold, heartless person could live in this manner. We are the mafia. You cannot win. If you have a power role, please state it here, and you might be killed less painfully. | ||
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Trfel
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I never miss the first post when I actually try for it. I guess I've got to step up my game. | ||
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On March 17 2015 10:45 Alakaslam wrote: Anyone remember this?Hey This game I am doing what I never do Pregame wifom excuse So it should actually hold weight I have no idea what my schedule will do this week. It could get very busy, it could be I AM HEER Depends unfortunately | ||
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Trfel
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Have fun. | ||
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Trfel
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Is this correct? And should I share it (general explanation)? | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 09:37 VisceraEyes wrote: Aw, shucks. He caught me. I thought I could get away with it.##Vote: Trfel I'll do it. I'll rise to the bait. He claims mafia theatrically. I THINK HE DOES IT AS MAFIA. | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 09:38 rsoultin wrote: Nope, I made it after I knew my role. Not like the geript vote.i actually agree with damdy that truffle may be mafia this game :/ but hardly for that post that was probably made before he even knew his role xP | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 09:41 rsoultin wrote: You probably think I'm scum because:...truuuufffllleee ;o; please tell me you're not scum this game. you know how i like to bounce ideas off you tell me the two reasons i'm thinking you're possibly scum (hint: one i've already alluded to and the other has to do with the post I just quoted) 1. I'm ignoring the entire thread, and instead being useless and distracting the people who are playing the game properly. This is valid. 2. If you have a reason to scumread me other than that, I think it's terrible? Are you thinking of meta based on my opening in Student Mafia V? For the record, I've only skimmed the game so far, I haven't read it in detail at all. | ||
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On March 19 2015 10:08 Eden1892 wrote: Why 4 or 5? Because those are (to the best of my knowledge) the only possibilities. Superbia's only answer was 7, and I don't think that is true....i'm not actually sure that you're wrong why did he narrow it down to 4 or 5 if he didn't know how many mafia there are? The recent Titanic mafia was 17 players, with one third party, so 16 players. There were 4 mafia. I believe the standard large games (Carol of the Bells, Imperial Mafia, for example) have 5 mafia. Thus, I expect this game to have 4 or 5 mafia. I'm asking because I feel that it is helpful to know how many mafia are in the game. Maybe you disagree, but I would like to know. And I don't have enough experience to really know if there would be 4 or 5 mafia, especially not compared to many of the players in this game. | ||
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Trfel
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Give me a chance to read the thread in detail, and actually provide thoughts. As in, I'll actually play the game correctly this time. Don't scumread me until I finish and share serious thoughts, okay? If you want a meta reason not to scumread me, last game, Mini Mafia Down Under 2, I trolled for nearly the entire game. | ||
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On March 19 2015 10:49 Fecalfeast wrote: I think there's a very reasonable chance it's a joke. Though of course you are right that if Eden is in fact a miller, he wouldn't know.am I wrong or did eden fakeclaim miller? Claiming unaware miller is something I was planning on doing eventually. Actually, I would have done that this game, but I forgot and claimed mafia instead. | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 10:53 Fecalfeast wrote: I'm still inclined to give Eden the benefit of the doubt, and I see no real reason to say he isn't joking.idk yours was obviously tongue-in-cheek. This was a lot more subtle if it was a joke | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 10:58 Fecalfeast wrote: You asked for an answer twice, so I provided one. Eden isn't a moron, I'm sure that if he actually is scum, he would say the same thing.Well then I'm excited that you've given eden an out if he did infact slip. And I have two other reasons to say that this isn't a scumslip. 1. Look at Eden's tone. By saying the specific name of the miller, he shows that he's read the first page to find out what the miller is, which contains the phrase You are not aware. So, it's extremely unlikely that Eden didn't know that the miller was unaware. Furthermore, if he wanted to claim as scum, he would have said straight-out that he is claiming, not this indirect reference. Thus, I'm inclined to think that Eden is joking. 2. Eden townread rsoultin very strongly, and very early in the game. And he did this knowing that he wouldn't be able to provide good reasons for it, much less explain this read to the thread. I don't really see why mafia!Eden would want to do this. | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 11:04 Fecalfeast wrote: Maybe because I didn't want your comment to be ignored, and I felt you deserved an answer?Brother look here and see that eden could in fact have misread the OP! Why do you insist on defending eden before he even has a chance to respond? | ||
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On March 19 2015 08:34 Toadesstern wrote: Do any of our expert tonereaders agree with me that the tone in this post seems suspicious? I'm primarily looking at the grammar of the last sentence, it feels out of place compared to the rest of the post, and makes me wonder if Toadesstern felt rushed to post this.last time I was sitting there waiting for the game. This time I'm boating and alt-tabbing while torping the shit out of people, so not exactly time for colors right now. Last time you also tried to kill me for it. I can only assume that you're joking right now to get something started? There's no way you'd just repeat the same shit you did last time, mislynched and ragequitted afterwards, right? + Show Spoiler + My tone reads are widely known to be miserable, and that is why I ask others. | ||
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Trfel
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Leaning town on rsoultin, Eden, and Alakaslam so far. Holyflare would also be a townlean, but I'm not sure what to make of his early interactions with Alakaslam, once I finish reading I'll probably ask a few questions to get this sorted out. Sicklucker could very well be scum, but I have some reasons for doubt. Notably that he's been more active, and the point that Toadesstern brought up about one of the reasons he is being scumread actually being not alignment indicative. I need to look into sicklucker more tomorrow. | ||
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Trfel
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Superbia, that's all I have to say at this very moment. I don't like sharing thoughts until I am completely caught up. Toadesstern, I said that I thought one of your sentences had suspicious wording, and asked for what other people thought about it. That's not a scumread. | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 08:26 Damdred wrote: Why does this make Alakaslam scum? I feel like his attack on Holyflare is more likely to come from town than scum, since attacking a high profile player early on seems like a poor play from scum.Actually slam has literally come into the game super serious and is throwing mud on HF? Slam is probable scum i'm parroting here a bit Also, can someone explain to me why Alakaslam says that Holyflare's scumread of him is WIFOM? To me it seems like a meta read, not WIFOM. Thanks! | ||
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On March 19 2015 12:36 Toadesstern wrote: Rsoultin meta-read Alakaslam quite nicely in Down Under 2?noone knows what slam is doing. Thus we engage with him as much as possible talking about anything and everything to get as much data as possible. We talk about the weather, about anime, about warships disguised as anime girls just to get some idea about him and make an educated guess around d2/d3. Anyone claiming he knows how to read Slam early on is lying~ If you don't think it's possible to read Alakaslam, what do you think about Holyflare scumreading him so confidently after only a handful of posts? Though Alakaslam is playing a different style this game, so... | ||
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On March 19 2015 08:49 Damdred wrote: Oh, Damdred already said this. Town points to Damdred, then.It gives me a bit of pause at this juncture, also Slam went against quite possibly the hardest hitting player in the thread because he thought he was getting railroaded early. I think that's kind of towny coming from slams position rather than just straight omgus. | ||
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Trfel
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That's one nice thing about no post limits, I can thank people for answering questions and it doesn't feel like I'm wasting a post. | ||
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In Down Under 2, Alakaslam was wagoned for most of Day 1, but never actually defended himself. He was scum. Perhaps aggressively defending himself is a sign of being town? And I am well aware that I am both ignoring and using meta on Alakaslam simultaneously. Deal with it. | ||
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Trfel
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On March 19 2015 13:00 Alakaslam wrote: Sorry, what's a confirmation claim?I was saying Holyflare (and other's!) confirmation claims are wifom. | ||
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On March 19 2015 08:59 Alakaslam wrote: Just noticed this.It's still true and why I have been in and out I referred to the "I am doing what I never do" part, as in Alakaslam playing seriously. Alakaslam thought I was referring to activity. Perhaps he is being self-conscious? | ||
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Trfel
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I'm not sure if you are aware, but as of late, Palmar has become an incredibly lazy player in many of his games. I wouldn't expect him to check your game history for this. | ||
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On March 19 2015 13:08 Eden1892 wrote: Oh, I see, thanks. That makes sense.Dang, I already got baited into replying. The thing he claims never to do is make pregame wifom excuses for activity. Slam wasn't talking about playing especially seriously there My bad. | ||
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On March 19 2015 08:50 Eden1892 wrote: Eden, why did you say this?hmm i think i like damdred | ||
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On March 19 2015 13:16 Toadesstern wrote: I guess I see where you're coming from, but I still don't think it makes Palmar mafia, given my (limited) knowledge of his play and personality.he was completly crushed in hammertime after mislynching me d1 and singlehandedly ruining the game by doing exactly the same read he did this game. I do a post like that every game I played recently and the tone changes most of the times. Depends on wether I prepare it ahead of time or wether I'm posting while doing something else. And he ran into exactly the same mistake. What I'm saying is that there's no way he'd repeat that mistake after that crushing defeat in hammertime without at least checking. That's the important point here. He got wrecked and doesn't care in the slightest bit while knowing everything he said last time about me was wrong already when he tried to read me that time | ||
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And I don't like Eden ignoring me..... | ||
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On March 19 2015 13:25 Toadesstern wrote: Fair enough, good night Toadesstern. Should have gone to sleep long ago XDnoone knows. He kept on spamming "Kill Toad" for 72hours while refusing to explain it more than that it's based on my tone and phrasing But well, I'm going to bed know... 6am over here | ||
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On March 19 2015 13:45 Eden1892 wrote: To be honest, at the moment I'm not sure.....Sure thing. Who are your suspects right now, Trfel? You're saying a lot of pretty sensible things and asking questions that are showing me you're paying attention, but I'm not sure who you suspect. I think the Holyflare/Alakaslam argument boils down to some misinterpretations (pending an explanation of what a confirmation read is). So I don't think it is particularly alignment indicative, except for Alakaslam being willing to attack Holyflare. I thought I found a pretty terrible contradiction in sicklucker's filter, but I realized I was misinterpreting a post. I'm still on page 22, and as much as I'd like to keep playing, I really need to go to bed or I'm going to sleep through class tomorrow. I'm sorry I don't have any actual reads yet. At this very moment, sicklucker is probably the best lynch for reasons others have stated already, but I'm not sure if they are truly alignment indicative. I'll take a look tomorrow. Good night, all. | ||
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I'll try to catch up sometime later today, but I need to go to class, so this could take quite some time. | ||
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On March 19 2015 23:17 Holyflare wrote: And you're more sure about this than your previous reads on Alakaslam and sicklucker?no i've literally caught him out on something that makes him most definitely mafia, he can bitch and whine all you want and you can relax in the knowledge that he's just still plain old mafia and we are guaranteed a mafia lynch today so sheep me | ||
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On March 19 2015 23:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote: This reminds me a whole lot of ritoky last game...No you haven't, he's just been pretty useless so far. Piling on him is just going to make him mad and be guaranteed unproductive for the rest of the day and shit up the thread. If he's still unproductive by the time we approach deadline I'm happy to vote him but not until then. If raynpelikoneet does flip mafia, this probably deserves a second look. Just saving it for my memory. | ||
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On March 19 2015 23:21 Superbia wrote: Regardless of Eden's alignment, I felt that his miller claim was obviously a joke. Since Fecalfeast was very persistent about it, and no one else was answering, I shared my thoughts on the matter.I disagree. I think it was interesting, but I could see the fake-claim coming from either alignment. I thought trfel's hard defense was much more interesting. I was wondering why he was willing to defend eden like that. In retrospect I actually completely forgot about it. Looking at his filter now it seems like he seemed unsure about eden prior to FF bringing up the fake claim. Which makes the hard defend more strange. Trfel, any input on this? Also I hesistated on Eden for a slight moment when FF came out with the info, as I said before. As it stands, I think my town read on Eden still holds somewhat solid. | ||
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On March 19 2015 23:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Which is exactly what mafia!Artanis[Xp] would want to do with suspicion on mafia!raynpelikoneet.This is dumb thinking because I'm committing myself to voting for Rayn if he doesn't improve regardless. I see why town!Artanis[Xp] would do exactly what you just did. And I think the chance that my comment actually means something isn't all that high. I'm just saying it to make sure I don't forget. When I miss something and it costs me the game (in this case, lost the game at 5p LYLO due to this), I want to make sure I don't make the same mistake again. | ||
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That seems self-conscious and defensive at the same time. | ||
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On March 20 2015 09:03 Breshke wrote: I don't think that the argument between Palmar and Toadesstern says much about Palmar's alignment, but I do think it suggests that Toadesstern is town. As for it not making Palmar scum, Palmar's played really lazily for many games lately (Linux, Down Under 2, etc). Palmar also really likes to use tonereads. I can understand Palmar seeing Toadesstern's opening, and remembering it being different from the heavily formatted, fancy, and pristine opening that he used in Hammertime Mafia, and saying that Toadesstern is scum for it. I wouldn't actually expect Palmar to check Toadesstern's other games here (which clearly show that Toadesstern's opening post isn't alignment indicative). And if Palmar only knows Toadesstern's play in Hammertime Mafia and this game, his scumread of Toadesstern wasn't that horrible of a play (I would still disagree, but not that horrible).I actually have a question for you. So you were talking with toad about his palmar scum read and you were basically along the lines of you don't really see it as palmar being scummy. I'd actually agree with toad that it is. So palmar reads toad as scum for reasons and cbf's explaining them so jsut spams kill toad. Toad gets lynched and is town. I know that you trefel are very self conscious when you are wrong even if your case is really good and you try to change things so you don't make the same mistakes. Why then do you think that palmar isn't doing that and seemingly ignores past mistakes. Obviously you arn't the same person but would you not think that it would cross palmars mind that oh I read toad as scum for doing this and he was town. Toad is doing these things again maybe this isn't a reason to call him scum. I guess the difference is probably that I have different expectations for Palmar than you and Toadesstern do. | ||
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Trfel
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All these people keep playing league... We should play SC2 sometime. Trfel #642 if you want to add me. | ||
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I challenge you to a SC2 best of 3, loser gets lynched. Deal? | ||
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On March 20 2015 11:59 Alakaslam wrote: I saw that Day[9] Funday Monday cannon rush game that you linked once, haha XDPfft Sson I am bronze/UNRANKED. What, you spend like days play sc2? I cannot top 20 apm average or something like that | ||
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On March 20 2015 12:32 Fecalfeast wrote: Was waiting for you to post here....Trfl isn't online on SC2 therefore scum Turning on SC2 now. | ||
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Based on the voting, it seems that Vivax and LightningStrike are most likely to be lynched. Are there any other commonly accepted lynch targets? Damdred wrote a case on Vivax, so I will go read that. Whose filter should I read to see the LightningStrike case? Thanks. | ||
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On March 21 2015 04:40 rsoultin wrote: If I read your filter, is that enough to show all the arguments against raynpelikoneet?nah, it's between vivax and ls cause people won't trust me on rayn -_- and lord knows what hf is doing | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:03 Vivax wrote: Well......Ok now that enough mafia or idiots are piled up on me I hardclaim Drax. ##vote raynpelikoneet for now. I wasn't really liking a Vivax lynch anyway (based on the first 4 pages of Vivax's filter and Damdred's case). Raynpelikoneet's filter feels weaker. | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:07 Vivax wrote: Why Toadesstern?Y'all scrubs have to vote Toad | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:07 Toadesstern wrote: I'm not saying that it makes Vivax 100% town. It doesn't. But it definitely makes me hesitant to lynch him today.get back on Vivax. Nothing about this claim should make you unvote The chances are fairly good that we do have a vigilante. Vivax is leaving himself wide open to counterclaims here. In addition, while (until he started being wagoned) Vivax wasn't very active, his filter seemed aggressive enough to me, and Damdred's case felt exaggerated. The primary point being that it appeared like Vivax really did push Superbia, it's just that he was unable to get many others to agree with him. And yes, eventually he dropped it, as one would expect someone to do when no one else agrees. | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:08 Vivax wrote: I openly acknowledged that I have not much idea of what's going on. I'm sorry. But that's not going to change before this lynch. If you're annoyed at me asking for summaries of things that already happened, you don't need to answer. I'm trying to do the best that I can with limited knowledge.Cause he's still pushing for my lynch and everything I wrote. Are you even reading this game? If Vivax was mafia here, I don't think he would be naturally inclined to pick on the person who actually accepts his claim as genuine? | ||
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Why? Before the final swell of signups, the vigilantes (town and mafia) were listed as having two shots each. Now, they are listed as having one shot each. That makes me extremely likely to think that there is in fact a vigilante in this game. There might be more than one. But that still seems unlikely. Thus, I think that Vivax's claim leaves him at a fair risk of counterclaim. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + I don't feel particularly inclined to believe it, but it seems sensible to not lynch him today? Reason is because there is a good chance of there not being a tracker in the game. | ||
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How many blue roles would we be expected to have in this game? Any clue? The orb sort of counts as a blue role, too... | ||
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I don't see mafia!Toadesstern claiming vigilante here to secure a lynch on Vivax. That seems like a bad play, with the potential exception being if raynpelikoneet is mafia (but raynpelikoneet already claimed tracker, so I don't think Toadesstern's counterclaim vigilante would be necessary). Thus, I believe Toadesstern's claim. The question then becomes if Vivax should be lynched. I do think it is possible to have two vigilantes in this game, somewhat unlikely, but very possible. Half the Sky does like vigilantes. | ||
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I agree with Superbia that there is a very real chance that both Vivax and Toadesstern are town. Though Vivax could still be a good lynch today, maybe. | ||
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I need to leave basically right now, I hope I'll get back for EOD. I'm looking at Vivax and raynpelikoneet for the lynch. For now, I think Vivax. Reason being how stubbornly he's attacking Toadesstern instead of taking a step back and realizing that his counterclaim means he is probably town. Though I could see a desperate, tunneling town doing this as well. ##vote Vivax | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:30 VisceraEyes wrote: ExO_ already discussed this. I answer because I feel the same way about raynpelikoneet's claim.Yeah this is really weird. Like - he should have no reason to throw rayn in there because no counterclaim to tracker....why would he lump rayn in there with the ones that there LIKELY IS a liar between, Vivax/Toad? Tracker is a niche role, and there is a very good chance that a tracker is not in this game. If anyone has other reasons for why raynpelikoneet's claim is more believable, I'm listening. | ||
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Claims vigilante Pushes the counterclaim (Toadesstern) with no restraint Suddenly acknowledges that there could be two vigilantes Continues pushing Toadesstern with complete confidence Leaves in frustration Hm. | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:28 Vivax wrote: Not lies?A lot of people are pushing the idea of two vigis in the game. | ||
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On March 21 2015 05:36 Palmar wrote: Grr, that's a good point, isn't it.why did Toad even counterclaim, couldn't he just find an alternative lynch and shoot vivax in the night? I need to leave ASAP, already late. To elaborate on the Vivax quote I just posted, while it's possible that I am misinterpreting it, it seems that Vivax is endorsing the suggestion that there are multiple vigilantes. Otherwise, he would say something else other than "a lot of people like this idea". | ||
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I know I'm going to get a ton of flak for this, but.... ExO_, are you soft-claiming blue? | ||
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As is alignment cop. Both Vivax and Toadesstern have made an error with regards to possible roles in the game. | ||
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On March 21 2015 06:14 Eden1892 wrote: Come on guys someone help a brother out here. I don't wanna have to read 50 pgs real fast like Vivax claimed vigilante. raynpelikoneet claimed tracker. Toadesstern counterclaimed vigilante. Now the question is, who do we lynch? I think Vivax is a good lynch. Raynpelikoneet isn't a bad lynch IMO, but most people seem willing to leave that for another day, so I guess I'll accept that. | ||
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Palmar, why did you switch to Vivax from Toadesstern? | ||
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On March 21 2015 06:22 Holyflare wrote: Holyflare to save the day!So what's happening Vivax claimed vigilante, then raynpelikoneet claimed tracker, then Toadesstern counterclaimed vigilante. | ||
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On March 21 2015 06:28 Breshke wrote: But then we still don't know which vigilante is town and which one is mafia?So both of you can't be roleblocked by mafia. If one of you doesn't shoot the other one then they die in the night.. If one of you shoots the other and they flip town big then they die. I think it is very unlikely we have two town vigi's. With my plan the town vig gets a chance to shoot still. What will probs happen is that the town vig will get RB (they might not even have one) and the mafia vig wont shoot so that could be even better since the town vig willl still be alive and soak up a RB | ||
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Does this change your view at all? | ||
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Who is your primary lynch target, other than Toadesstern? | ||
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Plus, your group of people is there for extremely bad reasons. | ||
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On March 21 2015 06:57 rsoultin wrote: That doesn't count onegu has been claiming the whole game practically lol | ||
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Hrmph. Almost certainly we have too many claimed power roles then, especially if ExO_ did actually softclaim blue. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:02 Superbia wrote: Uh, what?It's still possible that they're both town. I like HF's play. Let Vigi(s) do what they want, if mafia RB a vigi the tracker gets free reign, otherwise vigi(s) can confirm themselves (probably). First of all, I'm not convinced that raynpelikoneet's claim is truthful. Second, let's imagine it is truthful, and the vigilantes are both still alive, and raynpelikoneet wasn't roleblocked. I don't see how this helps us at all? Please explain. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:07 Breshke wrote: Ok, let's imagine that mafia roleblocks the town vigilante. If the tracker tracks the roleblocked vigilante, then town gets no information. If the tracker tracks the mafia, then as long as that mafia isn't carrying KP (reasonable assumption), then they won't get anything from that either.tracker tracks a vigi. They can see if they shoot someone or if they are roleblocked etc. This plan fails though if the mafia who CC'd is not the mafia vig | ||
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The only way this makes you mafia is because you are being defensive to the point of continuously misinterpreting what I'm saying. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: I just don't see all that much reason to believe your claim. That's all. I'm suspicious of you because your play has seemed very strange and illogical, and a lot of people were suspecting you earlier (I believe for not doing very much).why am i mafia again Trfel? I'm not worrying about you at this time because you're not the lynch for today. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:17 raynpelikoneet wrote: I was responding to someone who was using the tracker as a reason to not lynch both vigilantes. It makes sense that my doubt of the validity of the tracker claim would have an affect on this argument.but you read vivax scum, there is no reason fro you to throw me there when my claim is totally unrealted to his/toad's. So explain, why am i there in that post? You don't even want to really lynch Vivax in that post. I need to leave for a while, I'll be back right before EOD. But I'm feeling okay with a Vivax lynch here. | ||
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What? | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:43 Vivax wrote: To be honest, I don't know.What's the first thing you think when you have a role and get CCd that role? But I don't see how it is relevant to what I posted at all. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote: This is where I'm at, too.Vote for Vivax unless you want to talk about vigis all day again tomorrow as neither of them die and one shot probably gets rbed. I just don't see this getting resolved without using a lynch. | ||
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On March 21 2015 07:46 Vivax wrote: You kept insisting that Toadesstern was obvious mafia and we could only have one vigilante for well over an hour. This seems unlikely.You think the guy who's CCing you is mafia. But in this case it only makes sense for Toad if it means that a mafia would die guaranteed if I don't get lynched. Like it makes sense for me to not fakeclaim vig out of all the roles if I was mafia. I reacted, I thought, I concluded. | ||
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If you're town, I'm sorry. I need to run and grab dinner really fast, I'll try to be back for the deadline. | ||
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On March 21 2015 08:07 Vivax wrote: What about the part where you just said that Toadesstern was probably town, and there could be two vigilantes?![[image loading]](http://i.giphy.com/4bpgqEqmOTwuk.gif) BETTER A VANILLA THAN ME. Now I can shoot Toad. Let's start making plans on how to solve this situation without wasting blues. | ||
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On March 21 2015 23:56 VisceraEyes wrote: Hm? It's not good, I already explained why it's not good, before he posted......Vivax catch on Trfel so good. On March 21 2015 07:52 Trfel wrote: Yes, I was (and still am) open to the possibility of two vigilantes. Yes, I wasn't wanting to lynch Vivax earlier. However, after Toadesstern counterclaimed, Vivax's play was extremely weird. He jumped around without logic, and his play was riddled with inconsistency. This is rather obvious. Because of this, and because I don't think the vigilante problem will resolve itself at night, I decided that lynching Vivax wasn't bad. This was completely unrelated to my willingness to accept the possibility of multiple vigilantes.Vivax, I wasn't wanting to lynch you before the claimfest began. It was Toadesstern's counterclaim and your play after that that made me want to lynch you. I tried to look for alternative lynches, however without having actually read the thread, that was difficult. And no one wanted to talk about alternative lynches at all, at least until Holyflare came. | ||
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Vivax seems to have an extremely incorrect view of my level of play. Vivax was my coach in my first game ever, and then he played in my second game ever (Carol of the Bells). We haven't played in the same game since then. In my first game, I was killed Night 1, and in my second game, I led a lynch on scum and was killed Night 2. Since then, I have led a large number of mislynches, not truly led a scum lynch, and was only night killed once (due to incorrect reputation on Night 1, I was on a plane for much of Day 1 in that game). My two most recent games were losses in 3p and 5p LYLO, due to me not being able to make correct reads. Vivax, don't shoot me. I'm town. You really don't want to do that. But if I spend all my time trying to convince you not to shoot me, I'll just derail the thread, and I won't be able to find scum. I hope you can understand why I felt your play post-Toadesstern counterclaim was scummy and contradictory. I'm going to go read this game, and I'm going to try to avoid interacting with the thread so as to not distract myself. | ||
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I had two reasons for lynching Vivax. 1. Poor and inconsistent play after Toadesstern's counter-claim. 2. Helping to resolve the vigilante mess, since night actions are very likely not to do it. Much of my reason for townreading Vivax was because of the non cc'd vigilante claim. Other than that, I did not have a good town read on Vivax, I just didn't want to lynch him on Day 1.. This is a significant difference. On March 21 2015 05:04 Trfel wrote: "I wasn't really liking a Vivax lynch" isn't the same as "Vivax is town".Well...... ##vote raynpelikoneet for now. I wasn't really liking a Vivax lynch anyway (based on the first 4 pages of Vivax's filter and Damdred's case). Raynpelikoneet's filter feels weaker. I would never have decided to lynch Toadesstern there. Toadesstern counter-claimed when that would be a poor play for mafia to do. He was very forceful about pushing the lynch, as well, and I had a light townread on him for his push on Palmar (despite disagreeing with the Palmar scumread). After both you and Toadesstern claimed, Toadesstern was never a lynch possibility. It was either you or someone else. And your play made me confident that you were the best lynch (in addition to not liking the Bill Murray push). I know I said I wasn't going to interact, but I'm going to get shot.... and I can't allow that to happen. | ||
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On March 22 2015 00:54 Vivax wrote: Yes, I voted for you before you elaborated on the multiple vigilante possibility. I referred to the reasons I ultimately voted you, not initially. I think that's where this whole confusion starts from....This is generic bullshit about inconsistency and illogical play. You voted for me before asking me out about the inconsistency so it can't have existed previously but now you bring it up. The inconsistency was that I reconsidered on the 2 x vig version? Well, you decided I was scum before, and tried to push me more afterwards. You claimed my push on Toad was illogical when I kept posting about him through almost the entire day. Much of the reason I voted for you initially was because I needed to have my vote somewhere (the deadline was getting close). With Toadesstern's counterclaim, I felt you were the best choice at that time. I tried to search for alternative wagons, however without me having read the game, and no one else being willing to discuss alternatives, that wasn't really possible. Your actions were rather scummy, and so I kept my vote on you. I don't understand what exactly you are scumreading me for. | ||
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So, now you want to shoot me, because I made an error and wanted to lynch you. Despite a bunch of other people who think I am town. If you really are town, you shouldn't be using your vigilante bullet for personal grudges. You are experienced, you know very well that people are wrong a whole lot in mafia. You can shoot me here, but that won't gain you anything other than getting rid of someone who wanted to lynch you. And it will lose you your chance to kill mafia, and it will remove one more town from the game. | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:01 raynpelikoneet wrote: Look, it's not the best vote progression. But from someone who didn't read the game?"Much of the reason I voted for you initially was because I needed to have my vote somewhere" "I felt you were the best choice at that time." "I tried to search for alternative wagons" " Your actions were rather scummy, and so I kept my vote on you."  1. Vivax was counterclaimed, thus I vote for Vivax. While recognizing the possibility of multiple vigilantes, there is also a very distinct possibility that there is only one. In addition, some experienced players (specifically Vivax and Toadesstern themselves) were very convinced that there was only one vigilante. Vivax was very stubborn towards Toadesstern, and this played a reasonable role in my initial decision to vote for Vivax. 2. I searched for alternative wagons to Vivax and Toadesstern. This is exactly what a townie would do? And what a townie did? 3. Vivax continued to be stubborn and inconsistent, so I kept my vote on Vivax. I don't see how you can convincingly refute this at all. You can say that Vivax was frustrated because of the counterclaim and not thinking clearly and with complete logic, and that's acceptable from a town point of view. However, I don't think it's more likely than Vivax being a scrambling scum. | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:06 Holyflare wrote: As I said, I tried to look for alternative wagons by asking people for summaries of the wagons. I specifically remember asking about sicklucker and LightningStrike. But no one was interested at all, no one responded, so I let that drop.trfel how can anyone discuss things with you if you just said you hadn't read the game? if you "tried" to look for alternative wagons, how did you go about that? have you read anything yet? I've read the first 40 pages of the game carefully. I read from some page before the claims through the lynch, and I've read the last few pages. I've glanced through a few filters and cases that people said were important. I did what I thought was best with the information I had. Being well over 50 pages down when the lynch was happening, I thought it would be better to get summaries from other players and reread key parts of the game than trying to read the entire game or just reading filters and making my decisions 100% on my own (no context that way). I do want to go read the game, but if I get shot, there isn't much point of that. If town!Vivax shoots me, that would be extremely bad for town, so unfortunately that takes precedence over trying to read the game. If Vivax agrees not to shoot me, the first thing I will do is stop posting and go read the game properly. I don't have any reads on anyone at the moment, it would be premature for me to do so until I read the entire game, and then reread several filters more carefully. + Show Spoiler [If you must have reads...] + Here's what I'm thinking right now, though again, my reads are quite likely to change once I get some more time. I still lean mafia on Vivax, although it seems that his actions post-lynch were townie, and I haven't read that part of the game. Artanis[Xp] switched to townread on Vivax, so that indicates that Vivax is probably town, even though I don't know why and my own, limited read says he is mafia. I'm still skeptical of raynpelikoneet. Not sold on the tracker claim, not sold on his level of play. It seems noticeably below his play in Mini Mafia Down Under 1. But the night actions ought to help with raynpelikoneet. I'm somewhat suspicious of Holyflare as well. I like how he was very aggressive to start wagons, notably his early pushes on Alakaslam and sicklucker. However, I don't think the sicklucker push was terribly alignment indicative (of sicklucker), and the Alakaslam push boiled down to a few misunderstandings (as both Holyflare and Alakaslam later realized). In addition, Holyflare is aggressive as mafia as well (Linux Mafia). The one strange thing about Holyflare is his push onto Bill Murray. That was a pretty bad push. In a critical stage of the game (two claimed vigilantes up for lynch), Holyflare made a (self admitted) terrible push against a fairly inactive player. And now he blames it on being drunk. Were it not for the Bill Murray push, I would put Holyflare as town, but now I'm not so sure.... | ||
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On March 21 2015 04:36 Trfel wrote: This is me trying to figure out what the main wagons are, so I can be more focused. I obviously wasn't in a position to start a wagon of my own. I did the same thing in my first Newbie Mafia game (third game ever, as town), and I think it's better than trying to read the whole game when the lynch is near.Sorry, real life jumped up and got frustrating.... Based on the voting, it seems that Vivax and LightningStrike are most likely to be lynched. Are there any other commonly accepted lynch targets? Damdred wrote a case on Vivax, so I will go read that. Whose filter should I read to see the LightningStrike case? Thanks. I considered a raynpelikoneet lynch several times, but people didn't seem to like it, so I let it drop. On March 21 2015 06:18 Trfel wrote: No one responded to this.What about potentially a sicklucker or LightningStrike lynch? Palmar, why did you switch to Vivax from Toadesstern? From here, Holyflare started his Bill Murray push, but by this time I was more confident in my Vivax scumread and I didn't see why years-old meta would make Bill Murray scum at all. | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:26 Holyflare wrote: The Bill Murray push was bad. Do you want to argue with this?The bill murray lynch MAKES me town btw. No idea why nobody sees that piece of obviousness. Always get scum read for making a wagon and never the sheep that follow Also. Why are you saying my push on bm is scummy WHEN YOU WERE TRYING TO LOOK FOR ALTERNATIVES???? That just boggles my mind. If I were to scumread anyone right now, it would be you and several of the people that followed your wagon. Why does the Bill Murray lynch make you town? I don't see that logic, unless you're treating Vivax and Toadesstern as extremely likely to be town. | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:28 Vivax wrote: I maintain that your lynch was good. Your play doesn't make sense from a town perspective.The other way around please. Wtf??? Why should I show any understanding for a guy who almost lynched me and then says "lol didn't read". Though your continual stubbornness says otherwise. If I go and spend a ton of time reading the game, I'll get shot. And how does that benefit anyone? | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:37 Holyflare wrote: Bill Murray had a fairly small filter and inactivity excuses. But at the same time, many of his posts showed analysis and scumhunting. You decided to push him for not being extremely crazy and for being away for large portions of time. This is based on years-old meta, and so I don't think it is a good push. Basically a policy lynch.It wasn't actually bad by conventional lynch standards. Obviously he flipped town and it was bad but it's easy to call it bad after the matter. What was bad about it? Like I just don't understand. How on earth can you say you wanted to search for other wagons than vivax/toad but then scum read me for pushing other wagons?????? I'm not thinking that it's suspicious that you searched for an alternative wagon, just that you decided to lynch Bill Murray for the reasons you did. Had you pushed for sicklucker or someone with more reasons that they could be scum, I wouldn't have minded in the slightest. | ||
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On March 22 2015 01:44 Holyflare wrote: I looked in your filter and control-f'd mason, and didn't see anything about Onegu at all.and you don't even mention me and onegu combined which is just absolutely silly since if I was mafia he would have been too So this claim hasn't really gone into my consideration at all. I'll get to it eventually. I do think I sort-of get what you're saying, though. Thanks for explaining it. I need to go get lunch. And after lunch I will try my best to refrain from posting to read the game. | ||
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And to answer Vivax from a few pages back, I never townread raynpelikoneet, and I still don't. | ||
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On March 22 2015 04:28 Toadesstern wrote: Uh, you aren't making much sense to me right now.trust me man. I know what I'm doing | ||
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(not what should happen, what is happening) | ||
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On March 22 2015 08:06 Toadesstern wrote: Yes, this rule frustrated me as well XDI did not get to change my shot... I shot VE Apologies in advance for bad orb usage. | ||
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Thoughts? | ||
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Unless breaking the "change target in the last 20 minutes" rule causes you to get no result instead of just using your previous target. It's confirmed that I did in fact have the orb. You need to take my word for it that I got no result. | ||
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Vivax shot his mafia partner Toadesstern. I would think that implies that as mafia, Vivax is willing to go to extreme lengths. Is this correct? And do you really think that mafia has two roleblockers, or are you challenging my claim of being roleblocked? | ||
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On March 22 2015 08:17 Vivax wrote: Sorry, I refer to a previous game. And Artanis[Xp]'s explanation makes sense.Why does he even say I shot my scum teammate? That's like the greatest bullshit that has ever been posted so far. I shot Alakaslam and he's still alive. Thus, I retract my accusation. I have a very good reason for not revealing who I targeted with the orb at this time. I will make it clear soon enough. | ||
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On March 22 2015 08:19 rsoultin wrote: I'm well aware.truffle you are going to have to hard claim bud cause you don't get an rb notification in this game What would you think if you used the orb, and then didn't get any response? Anyway, I retract the roleblock claim, because I have a result now. Apologies for the confusion. | ||
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I tracked someone who visited Holyflare. By my look at the role list in the OP, this person must either be scum or alignment cop. And for obvious reasons, I don't want to out the alignment cop. Would you accept it if someone alignment checked Holyflare, or would claiming such be considered claiming scum? | ||
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On March 22 2015 08:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote: But mafia already knows who it is?Don't tell us who it is until the second half of the day though because otherwise the day turns into an autolynch and everyone goes afk. | ||
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Is now the right time to admit that I still haven't really read the thread? XD | ||
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LightningStrike Also note that jailkeeper protection blocks from ALL kp, so I think that double stacking is pretty darn stupid. | ||
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Also, rsoultin, what the heck? That's a really, really, stupid claim. Anyway, it looks like we either have five mafia (and a lot of blue roles) or at least one of our claimed blues is lying. | ||
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On March 22 2015 09:00 rsoultin wrote: Well, that doesn't really mean anything.one of the "tracker's" scumreads was selected to carry KP? lolol that or it says scum is dumb xP 1. LightningStrike said that he wanted to quit playing already. 2. Raynpelikoneet might have been roleblocked. 3. Scum could have just given LightningStrike up for dead already. | ||
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Why did you claim? It's not like Onegu was going to get lynched today. | ||
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Two vigilantes, one tracker, and one jailkeeper. Is this too many blues, or is this reasonable? | ||
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On March 22 2015 09:14 Onegu wrote: This is stupid.If there is a vet they need to claim now so we can lynch Rsoultin. Until then ill bite the claim even though it's bad choice If rsoultin is mafia, then she would know that either she is going to get counterclaimed, or that the mafia shot a veteran. Please, no more claims. | ||
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On March 22 2015 09:15 Toadesstern wrote: Are you still scumreading Vivax here?if rayn is scum on top of that, that means the d1 votes are all useless because mafia voted whatever they wanted to vote, implying all of BM. Vivax and me are town. I had some 4 or 5 votes at some point as well, including Rayn's vote and he pushed me really hard.... so what's that if we now know there was mafia on Vivax as well as most likely on BM because he already flipped town? We'd probably have to scrap everything at this point and assume we went wrong bigtime somewhere early during d1 with a lot of reads if mafia tried to push all three of Vivax, BM and me. | ||
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On March 22 2015 09:56 raynpelikoneet wrote: Does anyone else want to lynch this guy?/unconfirsm. | ||
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On March 22 2015 10:07 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Why would you ever not believe that Onegu is fake-claiming, especially after the Holyflare flip?Because he's a mason and I don't believe he's fakeclaiming. To be honest, I kind of doubted the mason claim even before Holyflare flipped... | ||
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On March 22 2015 10:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Oh, never mind, Artanis[Xp] can find it XDOh yes, I hosted it. I remember reading the scumQT where BH went on about how he was going to fakeclaim it. Don't remember the game name by heart though but it was fantastic. | ||
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On March 22 2015 10:58 Damdred wrote: But if it's a 5 scum in 20 player setup, couldn't we have a lot of blues to compensate?Actually a vet in this setup is almost impossible with the amount of blues. You, 2 vig, 2 masons. That should be all of the blues unless one of you are lying obviously. I didn't think rayn could be tracker with masons in game << I was hoping... | ||
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I really see no reason to believe it. My guess is that Onegu is vanilla town here. | ||
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On March 22 2015 11:12 ExO_ wrote: This game doesn't have a doctor.Why is me confirming which role you're claiming scaring you? I'm trying to determine what exactly happened last night and I wanna make sure I get it right Does that answer your question? | ||
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On March 22 2015 11:41 Alakaslam wrote: You don't have anyone else you would like to see lynched?Oh wow I am this badly SCUMREAD Lynch me then j probably shouldn't have signed up. | ||
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It's safe to assume that Vivax was in fact roleblocked, and that he is in fact a town vigilante. My question is, why didn't mafia kill the tracker (raynpelikoneet)? I suppose they could have roleblocked him, but two roleblockers seems strange for mafia. Killing Onegu instead of claimed tracker raynpelikoneet seems particularly strange, especially given that mafia killed Holyflare, the other part of the supposed mason pair. | ||
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I'm inclined to trust Onegu, he makes a lot of sense, but I'm not so inclined to trust raynpelikoneet, I suppose... ugh. Otherwise I guess I'll have to actually do some work. And that wouldn't be fun. | ||
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I truly am sorry about your Grandpa. That is extremely unfortunate. I hope you don't mind being lynched too much, especially since you already said that you didn't want to play this game any more. | ||
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On March 22 2015 12:33 LightningStrike wrote: I tracked you, not Holyflare. That would have been watching Holyflare.Ya I'm sorry I rolled Scum on you Trfel and I wish I didn't have to roll scum with you after Student IV  What made you track Holyflare?Also thanks for the condolences everyone from the thread! To be honest, and this probably isn't going to make you happy, but.... It was a complete and total accident. First I submitted Vivax (as a placeholder), then I changed it to Superbia, then I changed it to you, and then I changed it to VisceraEyes (but that was within 20 minutes of End of Day, so by the rules it didn't count). And I just happened to get the track role (though I suppose a bullet would have done the job as well). Honestly, I didn't see how the rolecheck would be of much use, so I was trying to go for a more outside chance at mafia, one that was more likely to carry KP. You fit as a player who was suspicious, but not overly so, thus a very good chance at carrying KP. A lot of it was based on Damdred's analysis having you as scum, and Superbia's filter not looking that bad to me. So I'm sorry, it was largely an accident. And had it not worked out for me, you guys would be in a much better spot, since I would be an easy mislynch. | ||
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If so, can I request silence until the end of the day such that we can catch up? XD + Show Spoiler + Yes, of course I'm joking, but it would be really nice for me.... Not that you guys need me anyway, I haven't provided any useful reads except for the orb. | ||
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On March 22 2015 12:50 Fecalfeast wrote: Well, I've just embarked on a quest to read the entire game, starting from page 13....I've honestly just been skipping pages to keep up Wish me luck. Maybe I'll catch up with you guys at like Day 10 or something. | ||
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On March 22 2015 12:54 Eden1892 wrote: Whattttt???Good luck town. Bout time I was n1'd again | ||
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On March 22 2015 13:02 Eden1892 wrote: Eden. Help.Wait. I wasn't n1'd????? THE DISRESPECT Are Onegu and raynpelikoneet masons or scum? | ||
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So slow...... I'm on page 26 of my reading. | ||
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Why do you think that mafia will shoot one of the masons? | ||
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Eden, why wouldn't you believe any more claims? | ||
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But I'll need to take another look at that later. There's an extremely good chance I'm wrong on that. | ||
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Oh, and I don't think I ever thanked Damdred for his analysis earlier, either. I was probably pretending to not be reading the thread. So, thanks to Damdred as well. I'll be going to sleep really soon, looking forward to seeing what people come up with. I made it to page 32, so yeah, real stuff from me will be a while in coming. Just, please, keep an eye on the claimed masons. | ||
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On March 22 2015 15:05 Toadesstern wrote: You mean like intentionally mislynching people to mess with their stats?Well one of your reads is wrong at least so there's that. But I don't think we lose with 1 ML I think we can have some fun here. Hi Artanis[Xp] + Show Spoiler + And before rsoultin chews me apart again for this, yes I'm joking.... | ||
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On March 22 2015 15:25 Toadesstern wrote: (I'm sorry too)I was pretty damn close to getting Vivax lynched on d1 I'd say. Did you think about that one? (I'm sorry Vivax) I agree that Vivax is extremely likely to be town here. | ||
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On March 22 2015 15:36 Breshke wrote: If someone tries to counterclaim the orb I'm going to laugh so hard....Yeah true and they couldn't have known who would have the orb and it might have been one of the super towns so it would have also killed trefel. So i have no idea what exo is talking about then. In a few days, it will become absolutely apparent that I didn't like (ie, when the tracker ability never comes up again). | ||
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On March 22 2015 16:51 ExO_ wrote: I've seen it been done before.I really dislike the fake claiming, espicially as VT. Do you think anybody besides HF could pull it off? Right now, there is a small chance that Onegu is fake claiming and is actually VT. Everyone else is either the role they claim or mafia, simple as that. | ||
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But believe me, I'm right on this. I assume that all of the following people are town. Vivax fake-claiming vigilante is not actually a 100% terrible move. As the leading lynch, fakeclaiming wouldn't be too horrible. Still, I really doubt he is fake-claiming as VT here. He is either going to be scum or vigilante, with high probability. Toadesstern is either vigilante or mafia, there is no middle ground at all. Town simply doesn't fake counter claim to get someone lynched. Onegu might be fake claiming here, small chance. Rsoultin wouldn't fake claim as VT here, there is no incentive for that, and it would provide false information for town. Basically, if any one of these people is fake claiming, I would be very likely to try and lynch them. Nothing is for certain, and people are stupid, but if one of the claims is fake, the chances are far greater that the person in question is mafia than VT. | ||
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But, if you are planning on claiming, it could be wise to wait until Day 3. That way, mafia has less idea of what to do with their night kills. If you are town, you can think through this and decide what is best. No one else really knows the situation you seem to be hinting at. | ||
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The cop is an alignment cop, not a rolecop. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:21 Eden1892 wrote: Hahahahhaahahaha XDI counterclaim role cop I checked ExO_, he's Tanaleer Tivan the Collector ExO_, do you have an explanation? | ||
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What check are you claiming on rsoultin, and what conclusions do you draw from this result? | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:25 ExO_ wrote: ExO_......Eden you'll die when I flip cop. So at worst its 1 for 1. Odd that you would've checked me night 1 though I think. I doubt lll be able to convince anybody but I am the cop. Remember eden was lying when I flip Oh my....... | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:27 ExO_ wrote: To the best of my knowledge, you are allowed to say everything in the PM, but you should probably wait for someone who knows what they are doing to be sure.Before I do, what exactly am I allowed to say from the PM I got. Im under the impression I can't say anything at all about it. itll be hard to explain without revealing a keyword from the pm | ||
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If you change this claim, you will be lynched. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:43 Trfel wrote: Please claim immediately. Then I can explain the rest.Raynpelikoneet, please hard claim your role at this time. If you change this claim, you will be lynched. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:44 raynpelikoneet wrote: No, you are going to claim first.You hard claim first. I have been pushing your red check all fucking D1. I guarantee that the entire thread will support me in this. | ||
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Good to know you aren't a mason. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:48 Eden1892 wrote: If he is mafia, he would know that Vivax was roleblocked....ray obviously hasn't caught up with the thread, or else is convincingly faking as much which means he wouldn't know to fake a result that's consistent with vivax's story not that as mason he'd have an incentive to do it anyway... | ||
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2 vigilantes 1 tracker 1 alignment cop 1 jailkeeper I think it's pretty clear that at least one of these claims is fake. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:48 raynpelikoneet wrote: I tracked LightningStrike to Holyflare using the orb. Holyflare was killed at night. LightningStrike has claimed scum.Do you or do you not have a red check on LS as you claim? I am essentially confirmed town. | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:51 Eden1892 wrote: Which is precisely why I said that one of ExO_ and raynpelikoneet is definitely mafia.well yes, the alignment cop one is fake and honestly if you take that out... and i guess assume onegu is lying about being a mason... 2 vigs, 1 tracker, 1 jk vs 5 mafia with an rb and a couple extra kills isn't unreasonable | ||
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On March 22 2015 17:56 raynpelikoneet wrote: You realize that rsoultin has claimed jailkeeper, right?stfu, you are scum. you literally refused to read LS mafia and read me town for my best case ever. so scum. so scummy scum. | ||
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If raynpelikoneet isn't town, this basically means that mafia didn't kill and didn't roleblock a claimed tracker? Which doesn't make sense to me at all. I'm going to sleep, good night. Definitely rereading this later, I'm quite tired. | ||
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On March 22 2015 18:05 rsoultin wrote: Or perhaps they're just terribly uncoordinated?lol >< my instinct says ExO_ claiming here is not a good scum move...but i can't reconcile it with the alignment cop thing onegu has to be scum. just has to, or he's the stupidest townie in the world here >< and if he's scum, rayn coming in saying he's not a mason, confuses the hell out of me. cause he should already know that onegu claimed that if they're scum together. unless that's the point...distancing basically i have a headache and it's not going to get any better -_- | ||
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On March 22 2015 18:13 raynpelikoneet wrote: Hm... You weren't there when rsoultin switched votes from Alakaslam to prplhz, were you? Her reason was to get a better read on two other players. The result was hammering town instead of the scum she pushed all game long.I don't know. What i do know is that rsoultin would ever jail you oer HF if she thinks you are both town (masons). Here's something else. If ExO_ is town, he has a green check on rsoultin. If ExO_ is scum, he wouldn't bus rsoultin here. | ||
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And I laugh at everyone who believed Onegu's second mason claim. Good night all. | ||
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Rsoultin's alignment is not related to Toadesstern's, and is not related to Onegu's. Rsoultin is town because of ExO_, who is claiming a green check on her (regardless of ExO_'s alignment, rsoultin is town). The only way that rsoultin is mafia here is if she is the godfather, and this is even more unlikely (given the multitude of other reasons to townread her). While it is somewhat unlikely, I suppose it is possible that Toadesstern is mafia here. I just think he's much more likely to be town. Artanis[Xp], if you really think that I am mafia here, you still have to believe that I actually did have the orb. Otherwise, someone would have counterclaimed it. And then, you have to believe that I used the tracking ability. Otherwise, it would come up later, and that would make me look more suspicious. If my plan was to bus LightningStrike, I needed to point the orb at him, that way the KP option would be a successful bus. Thus, there is only a 50% chance that I would be able to incriminate LightningStrike using the orb, as the rolecheck and roleblock options wouldn't do much (and roleblocking has the extreme danger of keeping Holyflare alive...). Vivax, why do you think that raynpelikoneet is town? | ||
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If Toadesstern is town here, which is quite likely, I am very suspicious of Onegu. I think it's simply much more likely that Onegu was carrying KP and it got roleblocked than mafia deciding to shoot both masons. This might also explain why raynpelikoneet is alive and not roleblocked (assuming he is town...), since Onegu could have been sent to kill him. Furthermore, Onegu would have been a natural choice to carry the scum KP. | ||
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I'm honestly quite surprised that ExO_ is alive and not roleblocked, but that's another possibility for where Onegu's KP was headed. Rsoultin, I'm disappointed I didn't make your list of people trying to solve the game | ||
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From the rules description of the Orb. "The Infinity Orb is a special mechanic to aid the Nova Corps and the forces of good against the forces of evil." In case people still doubt ExO_'s claim. | ||
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I suppose I was accepting Artanis[Xp] as town because everyone else was willing to. Apparently that is no longer true. I'll take a look when I have time (which probably won't be for a while...). | ||
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Everyone be nice, please? Particularly looking at Toadesstern/Vivax here... Again, while it is possible that Toadesstern is mafia, it is unlikely. Everyone else has explained this better than I could... Artanis[Xp] could be mafia here, but I still find that unlikely due to his filter length. I shadowed Artanis[Xp] in Imperial Mafia. He revealed that he really doesn't like playing as scum, and he said that the next time he got scum, he would just not care and let himself get lynched (this happened in Student Mafia VI, fairly recently). I can't argue that Artanis[Xp] isn't possible of playing at this level as mafia, he certainly is. But I don't think that he would in this situation, especially given that before the game began he was talking about the frustrations of playing in large games and how he would only portions of the game. I looked at what Holyflare and VisceraEyes said about Artanis[Xp]. And I have a few problems with just blindly sheeping dead people. The first one is that new information changes reads. Second, Holyflare pushes suspicion at a wide range of people in his games, and I would be pretty surprised to see Holyflare not scumread Artanis[Xp] at some point. Furthermore, Artanis[Xp]'s statements in question don't seem good from a town perspective, but I don't see much motivation from them coming from a mafia perspective, either. The main reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be scum are inconsistency between words and actions, and not providing very many original reads. I'll check this later, but for now, I think that Artanis[Xp] is probably town. Raynpelikoneet and Onegu are going to have to do something impressive to make me not want to lynch them. Of course, the night results should shed a lot of light on this (and the claimfests in general). So I won't discuss this until tomorrow. I suppose I could see Artanis[Xp] and Toadesstern being mafia together. And I could see raynpelikoneet and Onegu being mafia together. At this point, those feel like the most likely possibilities to me (though there is an extremely high chance I am wildly wrong). | ||
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On March 23 2015 07:20 Eden1892 wrote: It's probably false.Trfel, what's your view on ray's claim? By this point, I've read the majority of this game. I mostly know what I'm talking about. I have read the first 40 pages of the game, and from a point shortly before the vigilante claims through here. Unfortunately, I missed stuff in between, which includes the reasons why raynpelikoneet was scumread, but I'm assuming those reasons were good. Vivax claimed vigilante, which puts raynpelikoneet as a high suspect for the lynch. I can see town!raynpelikoneet claiming here, if he really is tracker. That makes sense to me. However, I would also expect mafia!raynpelikoneet to claim here. Tracker is a good claim, because as a niche role, it's not likely to get counterclaimed. So, I'm still suspicious of him, because his claim does little to dissuade the initial reasons to scumread him (whatever they may be). Raynpelikoneet tracking his townread, Vivax, makes little sense to me. However, I'm not sure that it says that much about raynpelikoneet's alignment (perhaps someone else can explain this eventually). However, if raynpelikoneet is fake-claiming, tracking Vivax makes a lot of sense, as Vivax was roleblocked, so raynpelikoneet knew he wasn't going anywhere. And Onegu (who I scumread for being roleblocked by rsoultin, while mafia is missing a KP) claimed mason with raynpelikoneet. Which makes me a little more suspicious of raynpelikoneet. Raynpelikoneet's play since his claim has been less than impressive. He's pushed scum on a ton of different people, for very illogical reasons, generally just attacking people who disagree with him. That doesn't help his case, but apparently he's like that when he's mad, so I suppose that can probably come from town!raynpelikoneet as well. | ||
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On March 23 2015 07:46 Artanis[Xp] wrote: One of the people I most want to talk to, right when I need to leave....Hi guys, just got back from festival. Eardrums still pounding. Did Vivax remove the pants from his head yet? Hopefully you'll discuss everything I'm interested in. | ||
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Primarly, what do you think about raynpelikoneet and Onegu? | ||
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On March 23 2015 08:22 Trfel wrote: Sorry, you already answered the part about raynpelikoneet.Artanis[Xp]... I wanted to ask you about other people's alignments as well. Primarly, what do you think about raynpelikoneet and Onegu? Still interested in Onegu. | ||
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I think it is reasonable that Onegu saw raynpelikoneet in trouble and claimed mason with him without asking first. Then, raynpelikoneet didnt accept the mason claim (either because it risks revealing both of them as mafia or because he didn't read the thread and didn't see what Onegu was doing, which seems quite likely). Is it an uncoordinated play? Yes. But I think it's still reasonable. I don't think their alignments are tied together. But I still think that it is very likely that Onegu was carrying KP and rsoultin roleblocked it. I don't see mafia shooting Onegu here when they were already shooting his mason buddy Holyflare, and leaving claimed tracker raynpelikoneet and obvious blue ExO_ alive. | ||
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If you don't want to answer, I understand. | ||
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Did I miss something? | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:31 sicklucker wrote: VisceraEyes' opening post had absolutely no relevance to his role.Im fairly sure mafia shot ve. Let me explain. A few games ago with ve when he subbed in he claimed medic for no reason at night. Then mafia asap shot him. This game he subtle tried to take a rolebullit and It makes sense mafia feel for it. Toad how har ddid you telegraph your shot I forget? Like if you telegraphed who you were shooting like I said you shouldnt theres 0% chance your town unless mafia did some sort of ridiculous double stack to frame you. If mafia was bluehunting, they would have hit ExO_ or the claimed tracker raynpelikoneet. I'm sorry, this makes no sense to me. | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:39 Eden1892 wrote: Four....hey, wait a sec assuming all kills processed without interference and both vigs shot, how many kills should there have been? | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:40 sicklucker wrote: Mafia KP is two.3... Two claimed vigilantes. 2 + 2 = 4 | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:42 sicklucker wrote: Sicklucker, Eden asked for the number of kills without interference. And assuming every mafia shot.2+2-1=3 Would you like to argue that blocking a shot with a roleblock doesn't count as interfering with it? | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:45 sicklucker wrote: There are several of possibilities.So onegu was saved or toads mafia basically. So hes pretty likely mafia I doubt we have a vet we seem to have are roles capped out 1. Onegu was shot 2. Onegu was carrying the KP himself (and was roleblocked) 3. Veteran was shot 4. Toadesstern is mafia 5. Mafia double-stacked to incriminate Toadesstern | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:48 Eden1892 wrote: What is the downside to doing this?damn i'm itching to force onegu to claim with his partner and force his partner to claim I am heavily scumreading Onegu currently. | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:49 sicklucker wrote: And if this is true, you just gave it away. Congratulations.Actually rstoul is 100% a vet for that horrid claim. Well played Hint: it's not. | ||
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On March 23 2015 10:52 sicklucker wrote: + Show Spoiler +Trefel + Show Spoiler + Maybe im trying to trick mafia its all wifmo bro your rly bad at this part of the game That would never work, everyone and their mother knows it. | ||
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I have reasons for my actions, but it's not worth going into them. If you would like, we can discuss the right/wrong thing to do after the game. Eden, you are currently scumreading raynpelikoneet, right? If he isn't tracker, that leaves us with 2 vigilantes, 1 jailkeeper, and 1 cop (assuming no masons). You don't think it's possible for there to be a veteran in addition to this? | ||
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Raynpelikoneet's claim aside, any mafia reading the thread would realize that ExO_ was extremely likely to be a blue. He was leaving hints to being blue all over the place, and furthermore, I commented on it twice. It was kind of impossible to miss. I don't think shooting mason Onegu (when partner Holyflare is getting shot already) or shooting VisceraEyes (who was often scumread and made one sentence saying he may or may not be blue) can be at all considered better than shooting ExO_ in this case. Do others agree with this analysis? | ||
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On March 23 2015 11:39 Damdred wrote: Hm...Actually its possible rayn is the scum obviously oneg is mason with someone and hf in retrospect left a last will in mason qt to be posted if he died or something crazy mafia wifom. And besides that you can't leave 100% confirmed townies alive it gives the thread to much to work with. If oneg doesn't claim tommorow we either lynch him or orb him. That makes a lot of sense. Fair enough. I'm still suspicious of Onegu, but I suppose it's not confirmed by any stretch. | ||
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On March 23 2015 12:53 Onegu wrote: Who are you mason with?You dumb dumbs lynch me before Rayn. When I flip mason you lynch toad when he flips scum you lynch rsoul. Why should we not lynch raynpelikoneet? | ||
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On March 23 2015 12:57 Damdred wrote: Why do you townread Onegu....Rayns scum though. oneg not so much He just seems to be flailing wildly to me. | ||
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On March 23 2015 15:47 Eden1892 wrote: I read it.>anybody is still reading this monstrosity | ||
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On March 24 2015 01:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: From my perspective, tracking one of the claimed vigilantes seems pointless.I said i would track one of Vivax/Toad and i rng'd it. If they really are vigilante, then they either got roleblocked (went nowhere) or visited their target. If they are mafia, then they either lied (went nowhere) or visited their target. You only gain information if one of the vigilantes visited someone other than the claimed to, which would be extremely stupid for them to do, unless they were framer/roleblocker. So I'm assuming that you were checking to see if Vivax was actually framer or roleblocker? Or am I missing something? | ||
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On March 24 2015 01:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: So what you're saying is, because you weren't roleblocked, that means that mafia wasn't worried about the results of your tracking.You are half right. It doesn't matter which one i track if i tell i track one of them. If mafia has an way out they probably will not roleblock me. That means they will probably roleblock the vigi who is not mafia (yes, and i assume Toad is mafia -- so that would be Vivax here). Most likely the scum that is not a vigi (assuming there is one between them) is not going to do anything or is going to claim they shot mafia night kill. So it really does not matter which one of them i track, but it will give a 100% confirmation what one of the CLAIMED BLUES did. Had i tracked someone else they can just claim vanilla (or rather, i would not have claimed my check at all until later) and if i miss mafia/town PR i get no info at all. And your conclusion is that Vivax is town and Toadesstern is mafia. I'm sorry, I just don't understand. You don't need to explain it again, hopefully enough other people understand it so it's a non-issue. | ||
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Rsoultin, what conclusions are you drawing from your voting analysis? You seem to be saying that voting suggests that Palmar and Onegu are town. Anything else? | ||
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In the same way, I don't see Onegu voting for LightningStrike as saying much about Onegu, since while he did push LightningStrike into the voting lead, he did so with seven hours remaining, and the votes still very spread out and fluctuating. I think voting a partner into the lead is a fine play for scum to do here, as the risk is rather small. And I don't townread people who are staying out of the main wagons with several hours to go before the deadline. There is plenty of time for stuff to happen, plenty of time to save LightningStrike if things go bad. In fact, I think it makes sense for scum to push the counterwagon to LightningStrike with something more like three hours left to the deadline, and not earlier. Especially in a large game like this. And I don't see what the switch to Bill Murray provides, except those who switched to Bill Murray instead of the vigilante Vivax are more likely to be town (sorry Vivax!). But even that isn't confirmed, as scum was readily willing to roleblock Vivax, solving that problem. Palmar wasn't in a position to hammer Vivax, so I don't townread him for hammering Bill Murray instead. Same with raynpelikoneet. So I don't townread them for doing so. LightningStrike's vote even further cements Vivax as town. And that's the only thing I really see in the voting analysis at this time, unfortunately. What am I missing? However, this obviously ignores what players were actually doing in the thread, and is based on votes alone. | ||
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But please, calm down and explain it. There are a lot of people who think this way. It's not worth yelling about. | ||
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On March 24 2015 04:28 raynpelikoneet wrote: Who were you punching? Toadesstern?No. I claimed because i wanted to be listened. I was puching fucking mafia. You are all terrible. AND DIDN'T LISTEN TO ME! | ||
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On March 09 2015 12:18 Half the Sky wrote: Raynpelikoneet, it's effectively cleared right here. This is a quote from the rules, the Infinity Orb section, where the town is referred to as the Nova Corps (the same name as the vanilla town).The Infinity Orb is a special mechanic to aid the Nova Corps and the forces of good against the forces of evil. | ||
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Toadesstern is an extremely capable mafia player, and there was incentive for him to fake claim vigilante where he did as mafia. First benefit is securing the mislynch on the vigilante, Vivax. The negative to this is that Toadesstern would be heavily suspected on Day 2, but there is still a reasonable chance of Toadesstern being able to avoid the lynch with good play (not guaranteed, but it is possible). Second, after Vivax's claim, the most likely lynch targets were raynpelikoneet (who claimed tracker to avoid the lynch) and LightningStrike. LightningStrike has already flipped scum, so Toadesstern had additional motivation of protecting LightningStrike. Finally, Toadesstern was a high risk of being shot by the vigilante Vivax. I can see mafia!Toadesstern making tihs play. I also note that Toadesstern stated that if Vivax flipped town vigilante, Toadesstern should automatically be the next lynch. This simply isn't true, but is a good incentive for people to vote for Vivax. This suggests that perhaps Toadesstern was more interested in lynching Vivax than solving the game. As for Artanis[Xp]'s confirmed town list in general, it's extremely good. I feel that Toadesstern is the weakest link. I also highly doubt that the game really is this easy, since I've never yet played in a "solved" game where this was actually correct (though you could argue that we were right in Linux when we thought the game was over, but that's questionable...). While the list makes a lot of sense, and I want it to be true, and it probably is true, I can't give a free town pass to everyone on it. Note that suspicion on Artanis[Xp] somewhat increases if he is proven wrong on any in this town list (but I won't discuss my small suspicions of Artanis[Xp] at this time). Eden gets a 95+% townread purely for gameplay. Vivax gets a 95+% townread for gameplay and his vigilante claim. Rsoultin and ExO_ are 99% town for claiming jailkeeper and cop, respectively. I'm willing to essentially confirm these people as town. The rest of the people on the list are extremely likely to be town, but at some point there might be a small chance I would lynch them. I don't think there can be any argument about townreading the four names I listed, and also myself (more on that later). Fecalfeast could possibly be added to the list depending on the quality of his case on LightningStrike and the circumstances of it, but I haven't read that part of the game yet Damdred, if it makes you feel better, I read your analysis posts and used them as my summary of the pages I missed. They are extremely helpful. And it's the quality and the quantity that makes you town. Honestly, if people skip well-constructed posts like that, they shouldn't be playing mafia in my opinion. Hi, ritoky! Remember last game? I sure do. You won't beat me again. Ritoky claiming VT right away seems like a terrible move as town. If he knows nothing about the game, claiming VT right away seems extremely stupid. I wonder if he went to the scum qt and someone yelled at him to claim VT right away, and he did so. Also, did you guys really have any doubt that someone who claimed scum and posted a baby seal would flip scum? I suppose it's possible that I am mafia here. But this is extremely unlikely. Here's why. It's in spoilers because it's long, and not terribly important unless someone actually wants to lynch me, but I already typed it up, so I might as well post it. + Show Spoiler + I have claimed to have the orb on Night 1, and this hasn't been counterclaimed. Therefore, the orb went to me or one of my scumbuddies. Due to tracking, and coming up with this crazy idea in the first place, it can be safely assumed that I had the orb. I bussed LightningStrike completely. This basically means that LightningStrike asked to be bussed, and the mafia team decided that I would do it. This actually isn't terribly unlikely, as LightningStrike did (before End of Night) say that he was not wanting to play any more, and after end of night he said that he was disappointed at being caught. And I wasn't in the best of spots before this. Still, the chances of this happening aren't amazing. Third, I used the orb. And I got the tracking ability. Each ability can only be used once, and my guess is that even if roleblocked, you are informed what ability was chosen (even if it doesn't go through). So, if I didn't use the orb, I put myself at extreme risk of someone else getting the tracker ability and claiming it. It is possible that the orb will exist for only three nights, and thus not all four abilities will be used, but mafia wouldn't want to count on this. + Show Spoiler + On a somewhat unrelated note, if anyone does counterclaim the orb tracker ability, I accept a lynch if town is not at LYLO or MYLO. The reason for this is upon my flip, the person who counterclaimed can be lynched, and I will 2 for 1 mafia, which is quite good. If you are town and lie to lynch me in this way, you get the "worst player ever" award. If it is LYLO or MYLO, I would refuse to be lynched, for obvious reasons, and whoever counterclaimed me would be free scum (to me, if not to everyone else). But that's a problem I hope doesn't arise. From here, two possibilities arise. LightningStrike killed Holyflare himself, or he didn't. Note that I assume mafia didn't double stack Holyflare, as he was a likely jailkeeper target, and jailkeeper blocks all KP. If LightningStrike didn't kill Holyflare: Despite us already assuming that LightningStrike wanted to quit, and the entire mafia team was willing to bus him, and him being a flipped goon (thus being the best KP carrier ever), mafia was so confident in this plan that mafia didn't have him carry KP. At this point, there's a 50% chance that I can use the orb to bus LightningStrike (rolecheck and roleblock would do nothing to let me bus him, and I can't claim a false ability). By not having LightningStrike kill Holyflare, and by having me use the orb on LightningStrike, mafia is very committed to having me use the orb to bus Holyflare. And right here, we hit a 50% chance that it doesn't work. From here, mafia would probably abort the plan of having me bus LightningStrike. I'm a miserable mafia player, and I don't think I mentioned LightningStrike (or many players, for that matter) a single time in my filter by that point. I would have had to generate a read on LightningStrike from nowhere, and I probably wouldn't have gotten that much town credit from it (assuming I pulled it off with reasonable success, which is unlikely). The better play for mafia would be to have someone else bus LightningStrike and leave me to fend for myself, quite likely resulting in me dying on Day 3 (I don't think I can avoid the lynch as mafia at all, and having not read the thread and already being scumread, there would have been no chance I survived). So mafia was willing to sacrifice the orb and the better KP carrier to end up at a 50% chance of no gain whatsoever. If LightningStrike did kill Holyflare: I didn't target LightningStrike with the orb. This is because of the roleblock ability. Mafia would refuse to take the 25% chance of roleblocking their kill on Holyflare, thus keeping Holyflare alive. Targeting LightningStrike with the orb is far too big of a risk for scum to take here. I put myself at extreme risk of being tracked (because I didn't visit LightningStrike). If I was tracked, two mafia die for free. If I had gotten any of the other three abilities, I couldn't have bussed LightningStrike. For reasons stated above, the best alternative plan for mafia would be to have someone else bus LightningStrike, still leaving me to try and defend myself. Basically, there is an extremely specific sequence of events that must have happened for me to be mafia. I think it's extremely unlikely, but I admit it's possible. If you're wondering why I typed this up to arrive at a conclusion other than me being 100% confirmed town, I thought it would make me 100% confirmed town, but I need to be honest. I'm definitely 95+% town, which is my threshold for giving people a free pass for the game, but that's for everyone else to decide. | ||
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On March 24 2015 13:36 Toadesstern wrote: Fine, I must be tired XDTrfel, your whole point about how I might claim in that spot as mafia comes down to being scared of vivax? I had no vote on me except for Rayn&Palmar (both very likely scum and I scumread them both) so I wasn't really afraid myself. In fact all the votes that I DID get came AFTER I calimed so if you're trying to sell it that way it's just factually wrong. I think we can both agree that I would have never been lynched d1 no matter what, right? We already know mafia have a roleblocker unless Vivax is mafia because Vivax got roleblocked. Why would I be afraid to get shot by Vivax if I know I have a mate that can just roleblock him? I could have just let him be roleblocked without having claimed myself? I retract those points. So if you are mafia, your claim was made to save your partner(s). Which I suppose is possible, but extremely unlikely. Not out of the question, though. | ||
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On March 24 2015 13:42 Toadesstern wrote: None, actually?how much conspiracy from Vivax do I have to walk through this time? | ||
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In the Holyflare read, LightningStrike says that he can't find a post where raynpelikoneet is being useless. This seems suspicious to me, based on both the statement itself and raynpelikoneet's filter (though I haven't looked at it closely). Perhaps Artanis[Xp] looks a bit worse because of LightningStrike's read. LightningStrike feels really reluctant to read Artanis[Xp] here, and makes sure to specify when he will be confident in this read. Seems a bit off. The read on Superbia is really bad. It's weak, and it's pure meta (LightningStrike only provided one pure meta read with an actual conclusion, and that was Superbia). | ||
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I would rather you analyzed LightningStrike's list post, and/or people's responses to it. That is more concrete, more useful, and has no downside. | ||
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Raynpelikoneet was scumread by mostly everyone, and with good reasons. He left more questions than answers and was probably the most abrasive person in the thread. I apologize for being biased against you, but after 285 pages, raynpelikoneet was quite scummy (especially with the tracker claim proven false). About raynpelikoneet's claim. He claimed tracker on Day 1 in a scenario where he was potentially the leading lynch candidate. Then he typed /unconfirm (spelled incorrectly), which was widely assumed to be a rescind of the tracker claim. Then claimed to track someone who was roleblocked. I think basically everyone agreed that if he changed his claim, he would be automatically lynched (though this wasn't said, of course, but I know that I certainly felt that way). And now you come in and claim vanilla town. I'm sorry, but especially given your scumplay last game, you're going to have to do something incredible for me to not want to lynch you (due to raynpelikoneet looking so bad). I don't need to lynch you tomorrow, but raynpelikoneet left you in a really bad spot. | ||
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On March 24 2015 14:26 rsoultin wrote: Oh, that's what you meant XDlol he knows what i'm talking about ^^ presents and claiming early Glad it's one of the parts of the game I'm familiar with. I feel sad for actually having a big effect on that game and not actually knowing the majority of what happened in it. Eden, it's not relevant, just a bit of banter. | ||
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I have no clue if you actually have the orb or not. And I'm going to ignore it entirely until Day 3. | ||
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On March 24 2015 15:14 Toadesstern wrote: Because I'm assuming mafia will kill the cop with a 100% certain shot, not a random thing.@Trfel Why wouldn't he just shut up about it as mafia and point it at the Cop? He's probably town for it, but with more information coming in less than 18 hours on the subject, I'd rather just leave it alone until then. You guys can analyze it as much as you want, and I'll read it, I just don't feel like thinking about it at the moment. Plus, you've already proved your analysis far superior to mine, so I'll trust you. | ||
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On March 24 2015 15:23 sicklucker wrote: I would say that rsoultin knows what she is doing, but then again she did save Onegu instead of Holyflare, so....If they rb me kill rstou and exo. There risking a save on exo. Yo should probably save exo tonight btw... | ||
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On March 24 2015 15:39 sicklucker wrote: Toadesstern and rsoultin are right.Rstoulin if your a j/k you only have 1 night action to submit let me explain why. + Show Spoiler + They will only roleblock me or you. If they roleblock you who cares what you submit. BUT If they roleblock me that means they cant rb exo so they have to kill him. SO YOU SAVE HIM. Do you understand? If they rb me they have to kill exo or he can get a check. SO HES THE ONLY SAVE YOU SUBMIT It's best for you (sicklucker) and rsoultin to not say much until end of night. Please don't try to argue this. Please. | ||
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Ow ow ow, my eyes, they burn!.... I knew I shouldn't have opened that spoiler. | ||
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On March 24 2015 17:05 Eden1892 wrote: This XDif i'm onegu's mason partner i'm gonna flip a huge shit | ||
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I'm actually not really sold on a Superbia lynch. When I look at his filter, it seems pretty good to me. It seems better than his play in Mini Mafia Down Under 2 (though that game probably isn't very representative of his skill), so I'm not confident that he is mafia yet. Why are people scumreading Superbia? (quotes are perfectly fine) | ||
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On March 25 2015 01:57 Vivax wrote: Long hiatus?The fact super comes in after a long hiatus and starts posting so carefree is actually a towntell. FF's tryhard case on LS after VE called him scum and LS wagon was picking up some steam is a scumtell. Artanis pretending to scumhunt in regards to FF is a scumtell. He just played in Mini Mafia Down Under games 1 and 2. | ||
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On March 25 2015 02:08 Trfel wrote: Whoops, sorry.[font=2]test[/font] Trying to experiment with different ways to change font Meant to preview that. Looks like it didn't work. Does anyone know how to change font? | ||
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Superbia is a good lynch. | ||
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On March 25 2015 02:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I just don't see how the game can be this easy...I'd be fine with either at this point. I think I can narrow down my PoE list to 6 after Onegu claims and I make up my mind on FF, so carpet bombing into the rest would secure a victory either way. | ||
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Onegu claimed mason - Holyflare and Onegu claimed masons together Vivax claimed vigilante raynpelikoneet claimed tracker Toadesstern counterclaimed vigilante Holyflare flipped vanilla town, not mason rsoultin claimed jailkeeper Onegu claimed mason with raynpelikoneet - raynpelikoneet stuck to tracker claim instead of mason ExO_ claimed cop ritoky (raynpelikoneet's replacement) claimed vanilla town (instead of tracker) So we're currently left with: ExO_: cop rsoultin: jailkeeper Vivax: vigilante Toadesstern: vigilante Onegu: mason | ||
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On March 25 2015 05:56 Eden1892 wrote: Or rather, counterclaimed ExO_ while confirming his claim XDI claimed rolecop Anyway, come the resolution period, I'm going to shake things up a bit. | ||
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On March 25 2015 05:58 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Then I'm counterclaiming fake vet. Would you care to fake rescind?Also since everyone's claiming I'm fakeclaiming vet. | ||
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On March 25 2015 06:12 Superbia wrote: Toadesstern did.Which vigi claimed the shot on VE again? Vivax claimed a roleblock on a shot on Alakaslam. ExO_ claimed a green check on rsoultin. Raynpelikoneet claimed a track on Vivax stating Vivax went nowhere, but ritoky claimed VT, so | ||
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On March 25 2015 06:50 Superbia wrote: If Vivax was to be roleblocked, I would have expected KP to go to ExO_ or raynpelikoneet (if he was town).I was expecting KP to go on Vivax if Onegu was mafia for some reason. Too much speculation. | ||
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He tried far harder than everyone else in the game, and continued to do so throughout. The only tell I am currently aware of that he was scum in that game was the way he waffled on his scum partners. I'm hesitant to town read him at this time. | ||
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Everything You Know is Wrong! Does anyone else find it suspicious that rsoultin claimed jailkeeper when she did? I think it's very suspicious. On March 22 2015 08:53 rsoultin wrote: Look at this. Rsoultin claims jailkeeper while under zero pressure from the thread. And the reasons she provides are:nah, honestly i think it's best that i just claim right here tbh, cause it helps shed light on the night actions i JKd Onegu, and the breadcrumb was so damn obvious they'll prob shoot me tonight anyway lol
On March 22 2015 07:27 rsoultin wrote: And here is the breadcrumb the size of a galaxy. I don't think so. It mentions Onegu's name, but with nothing whatsoever that indicates a night action. And rsoultin is guaranteed to die on Night 2 because of this?gonna emulate onegu now (sorry for the 21pg spammage :/) no more posties from me for awhile Rsoultin is not this bad of a player. Here is evidence why. Student Mafia V On January 28 2015 07:00 Blazinghand wrote: End Game rsoultin the VT has been lynched! Geript has been endgamed! Damdred has been endgamed! Breshke has been endgamed! Scum is victorious! DarthPunk is victorious! The Shining is victorious! Trfel is victorious! Rsoultin's play is absolutely brilliant. She would never be so bad as to claim jailkeeper in this scenario.... Unless she isn't the jailkeeper. This begs the question, what would town!rsoultin gain from fake-claiming jailkeeper? The answer is a myriad of confusion. Town has been operating based on false premises for the past 72 hours. The night kills aren't explained at all. And town really has no clue, since this changes everything. With no benefit from fake-claiming and the confusion caused to town, even the very worst mafia players would not make this terrible of a play. And as shown above, rsoultin is a very capable and intelligent player. Therefore, rsoultin must be mafia. This is the only play that makes sense. The positives that rsoultin will never be lynched, and the chaos and confusion she has already caused (and intended to continue causing) are well worth the risk of being lynched. If you need more proof, I have it. For obvious reasons, was imperative for me to wait until the resolution period, to prevent the mafia from changing their night actions in response. I am the actual jailkeeper. Given what I've stated above, I don't think this can be in doubt any longer. But as further evidence, here are my night actions.
Do the right thing. Don't let people survive on fake claims! PS I'm pretty sure that raynpelikoneet's fake tracker claim makes ritoky confirmed town | ||
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On March 25 2015 07:43 Eden1892 wrote: But then, they would just kill me. This way, I get another day to make sure I can force rsoultin's lynch through.you were supposed to post that before the mafia's nightkills were locked trfel | ||
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You even admitted it. | ||
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On March 25 2015 07:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It's okay, because I'm fake vet. And I think we're allowed to have both a fake vet and a real vet in the game.People have already forgotten about my Vet fakeclaim into Vet claim, I'm so sad Otherwise, you're getting lynched. So you only really have one answer. | ||
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On March 25 2015 07:52 Eden1892 wrote: I suppose maybe it's possible we have three jailkeepers.... Maybe if there's six mafia? Would that be balanced?Eden's Legacy Post fuck y'all and your shitty claims I'm the jailer | ||
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I claimed my role at the optimal time. | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:04 Eden1892 wrote: Huh? Explain this?Oh thank God Trfel wasn't killed. I saw his post and I was like ![[image loading]](http://media.giphy.com/media/12XMGIWtrHBl5e/giphy.gif) | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:06 Eden1892 wrote: Oh, Half the Sky specifically makes an exception for you posted after deadline before flip i guess is okay and i'm DEFINITELY NOT COMPLAINING HTS DON'T U DARE PUSH THAT BUTTON U HEER ME being posted after the deadline.And vigilante bullets are not refunded if roleblocked. | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:08 Eden1892 wrote: About that Sooooo Trfel Jailer? | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:10 Eden1892 wrote: Well, we are dealing with a semi-open setup.Am I supposed to believe that two different roles with flavor names implying they're one person ended up having duplicates...? | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:12 Eden1892 wrote: Haha, it's a joke XDHelp me out Trfel because: (1) You claimed after night actions were finalized thereby preventing you from being able to take a bullet by fakeclaiming (2) No other explanation makes sense from a town role to me (3) No explanation makes sense at all from a mafia role to me ????????? Does that make sense? | ||
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On March 25 2015 08:13 Eden1892 wrote: Wait, Eden, what's with this?ok, refer to my big blue message in my legacy post then How could my post possibly have had a negative impact on the game? | ||
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Does this cast more doubt on our "sea of blue" theory? | ||
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Good shot sicklucker! Nicely done. | ||
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Eden, I have a challenge for you. You need to read my mind. Reread my filter a little more carefully (particularly the parts in Day 1). Then share your thoughts. If you don't want to, I understand, but it would be great if you could. | ||
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Everyone believes these people are town Eden1892 Vivax Toadesstern sicklucker (pending Orb claim) Generally accepted as town Artanis[Xp] Damdred Fecalfeast ritoky Trfel Other Alakaslam Breshke Onegu Superbia Is this a fair assessment? | ||
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Read it again and imagine you're mafia. | ||
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On March 25 2015 12:44 Damdred wrote: It's not really credit if the roleblock potentially incriminates him....Also btw I don't think scum oneg goes crazy on rso for saving him instead of hf. I think scum oneg would ride and die with that cred instead of calling RS out | ||
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On March 25 2015 12:47 Eden1892 wrote: It doesn't matter. Just, the mindset of mafia who is actually trying, not the afk mafia.like me specifically mafia or as a generic mafioso reading | ||
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If Onegu wasn't scumreading both of the vigilantes, this seems rather disconnected and suspicious. | ||
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On March 25 2015 12:52 Eden1892 wrote: Nope, you completely missed the point.i feel like i'd scumread you early for self-vote / not having a lot of reads / asking about #s of scumteam but once you started posting for real idt it would be worth to try to push you too hard and i'd probably just glide with the emerging townreads on you and move to something else i also don't think i would be reading that carefully even if i tried hard lol i'm not really getting to what you're looking for, am i Oh well, it was worth a try. Thanks for humoring me. | ||
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What does rsoultin say her best quality (as scum) is? | ||
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On March 25 2015 12:53 Damdred wrote: I think he could do this.Like seriously tell me why scum oneg rocks the voat and foes full on one of the hardest read town people I. The thread? He's taking a unique stance. However, this stance has no negative ramification on himself. Rsoultin, despite having a massive filter, wasn't all that aggressive with pushing her reads, thus she wasn't going to tunnel Onegu into oblivion here. He would never get rsoultin lynched, or cast doubt, but he's taking a unique stance with little downside. | ||
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Superbia, that actually looks really good. But I have a few problems with it. Some of the quotes are out of context. I'll check that tomorrow. That could have a huge effect. I felt exactly the same way as Artanis did through the claims and Night 1 (and I'm town). However, Artanis is better than me, so it's fair to expect more from him. (obligatory sorry Vivax!) At this point I don't think I can townread Artanis purely for filter length. I think it's very possible that Artanis is improving his scum play, and isn't giving up any more. The fact that he didn't give up in Student Mafia VI (when he insisted he would give up his next scum game after Imperial immediately) until he got sick hints at this. As for the significant posting increase, it's this game. This game is extremely conversational, and everyone has massive filters in it. I don't know. I could go for this, but if Artanis is town, I don't want to mislynch him (because I want him around). I need to double check this carefully, but probably not tonight. | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:08 Superbia wrote: The pre-claimfest quotes (before his wagon analysis).Which quotes are out of context? I mean, Artanis didn't do anything that I can't see from a town perspective. Rsoultin and I combined made all of the same errors (and many, many more). The main problem is, what would make Artanis post this much? The Palmar flip sheds some light on this, I suppose. | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:16 Superbia wrote: Yeah, I kind of get the same impression.Like yeah, that's what made me pay attention to his filter. Like town can be wrong on people, but it's important to look at shit post-flip, and he was mafia siding pretty hard d1. Also he has posted a lot, but I really feel like he has contributed very little, especially given his filter length. Just feels like he wants to look townie. Artanis is a great conversational player, of course he thrives in a conversational game like this one. In fact, that's one reason to keep him alive, I enjoy having him around. In this game, with Palmar as scumbuddy, if there was ever a game where mafia!Artanis would post this much, this would be it. His confirmed town list is suspicious. Buddying, a great excuse to sneak a mafia in, and an excuse to partially avoid scumhunting. I don't think he's done many original pushes. And now, as you pointed out, he was heavily mafia siding. I have one or two potential good town explanations for this, but I'll keep to myself for now. You know, I'll go with this for now. Definitely could move off, though. Looking forward to Artanis's response. ##vote Artanis[Xp] | ||
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Urgh, I'll leave my vote on Alakaslam for now. I shouldn't vote before I check this in detail. Am I scum for waffling? XD | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:23 Eden1892 wrote: I do agree that I don't think reading super heavily into the Night 1 kills is a great idea. There are too many uncertainties, question marks, and unknowns.already answered, ok. So why do you believe all that? Your entire basis for your ritoky AND Onegu reads is the idea that mafia rb'd and shot Vivax. What is the basis for that idea? | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:25 Superbia wrote: See, I don't think it's completely unjustified. Vivax's play was a bit lackluster leading up to his claim, but after the Bill Murray lynch, Vivax looked extremely townie.The basis is Artanis' flip on Vivax on EoN1 from scum to town. Which is completely unjustified. I believe this is mafia setting up for a night town flip. Maybe part of it is I sheeped Artanis throughout his thinking here. And if he's scum, I look really, really stupid. | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:24 Trfel wrote: Superbia, thoughts on this? If you don't believe it, I think can support it easily.Do note that I think Artanis always uses fluid reads. And he's perfectly happy to base his strongest reads off of a single event (such as switching Toadesstern from scum to guaranteed town based on counterclaiming vigilante). I can see this from town!Artanis[Xp]. | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:29 Eden1892 wrote: Eden, now that ritoky and Onegu have claimed VT...I'm not sure yet that he's a better lynch than other people in my pile. Although Superbia is doing a good job of getting himself off the list... What do you think about the game's power role balance? 2 vigilantes 1 jailkeeper 1 cop Is that fair for a 15 town vs 5 scum game? Thanks! | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:32 Superbia wrote: I'll let Artanis answer for himself.He was confident enough in his scum read on Vivax to vote a possible town PR. How the hell does this change before Vivax's night actions go through. Like he's literally calling him town before flips, and then when Vivax claims being roleblocked, he hard reads him town based on filter-length. ???? I've got to stop defending people for no reason. Sorry everyone. Anyway, does anyone know off the top of their head what Holyflare's reads were by the time he died? Like, was mafia killing him because he's Holyflare, or did they want to shut him up desperately enough to hit Onegu and completely silence him? | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:37 sicklucker wrote: I'm here.Yo catching up interesting things have happened anyone here Are you standing by that orb claim? | ||
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On March 25 2015 13:38 sicklucker wrote: Nope, and both have posted since then.Did either vegies claim a shot on palmer? | ||
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If you shot him, you shot him. | ||
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Use the OP. Half the Sky is really good about keeping it updated. (Thanks Half the Sky, best host ^^) | ||
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And the more the game goes on, the more I feel wholly responsible if we end up losing. | ||
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Choosing to fake mason with Holyflare makes sense. He gets basic towncredit, and it gives him room to rescind his mason claim later. This didn't affect mafia's night kill, if anything this would have affected Onegu's initial decision. It's not like Holyflare was going to let Onegu slide on a mason claim if it became detrimental to town anyway. Basically, Onegu gets a little towncredit and gives him room to pull out of mason claims later in the game. And I'm still worried about ritoky. I think his scumplay was extremely solid in Down Under 2. I don't see him doing anything so far that he couldn't do as scum. The only reason to townread him was Palmar being suspicious of raynpelikoneet, but apparently a lot of people were suspicious of him, so some pressure doesn't seem that unlikely. That said, I didn't read this part of the game. Please correct me if I'm wrong on any of this. | ||
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I still don't see it. I actually have a toneread on him, and a meta read. I know, my tonereads are terrible. The main problem is, since his push on Holyflare, he hasn't done very much. But he blames activity. Does inactivity ever keep town!Alakaslam from truly playing? I've never played with town!Alakaslam. But I really feel he is town here, even if it's hard to explain. | ||
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I'm saying, if this is what the facts are, here is a conclusion. You have claimed the opposite, thus my conclusion is invalid. I'm assuming someone will correct you if you are wrong here. That's all. Thanks for answering, though. | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:26 sicklucker wrote: Over a check? What do you mean?So mafia choose me orbing them over a check thats good info right there. And it might suggest supers town tbh because lets be real we all thought I was orbing him... Mafia probably roleblocked rsoultin to prevent the save from working. This means that they really wanted the cop, ExO_ dead, not that they weren't worried about your orb. Plus, it's fair to assume that you tricked mafia and they didn't think you actually had the orb. | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:29 Onegu wrote: That's how to play the game, look at how someone's plays make sense from a mafia perspective.... Ideally, the reasons that everyone's plays make sense from a town perspective are obvious.Why are you assuming I'm mafia? What are talking about NK? I really don't uderstand what you are saying about the NK part. What I'm saying is that if you are mafia, killing Holyflare really has no effect on your alignment being known. That's the point. | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:34 Onegu wrote: No, but there was no real reason to. If he died, who cares who he was checking?Did exo claim who he was checking during the 15 min? | ||
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Why is Alakaslam scum? Why is Onegu town? Why is ritoky town? (given how he crushed town as scum in Down Under 2) | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:39 Onegu wrote: There was no reason for Holyflare not claiming mason partner with you. Before the game started, I actually considered plenty of ways to fake claim mason. Holyflare claiming mason with you had no downside, and had the benefit of being interesting and fun. I'm sure Holyflare had a lot of fun pretending to be mason with you. I don't see why Holyflare claiming mason makes him veteran. Though I suppose I can see mafia thinking this if they know Holyflare isn't actually a mason, but I would expect them to risk shooting him anyway.here is the problem with that, why did HF claim to be my partner? I came to the conclusion as town that he was vet. If I was scum I would think the same thing and not shoot him. The fact he was shot and a KP missing points more toward scum believing I am town and scum believed the mason claims and shot us both. | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:46 Onegu wrote: It doesn't hurt town all that much if you're smart about it. As scum, it potentially keeps you alive for longer, and I could see scum risking claiming mason with a scumbuddy (yes, I'm still suspicious of raynpelikoneet/ritoky).Like how did a fake mason claim hurt town if I'm town, and how is it smart as scum. Therefor it's not BS. I think you ought to be read independent of your claim. And I don't see much that suggests you are town, though I haven't taken a close look yet. | ||
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On March 25 2015 14:55 Onegu wrote: I know you say that, but it seems like a very reasonable thing to happen in my opinion. And I can't take your word for it, for obvious reasons.See this is fine. But If I am scum with Rayn why wouldn't Rayn confirm? I have already said this and you can check I have rolled mafia and mason with Rayn and I don't do anything without letting Rayn know and ok it. | ||
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Rsoultin had a very good metric for reading Alakaslam, and it worked in Down Under 2. Boring Alakaslam is scum, interesting and creative Alakaslam is town. This game, we see Alakaslam with an evolving, and interesting scumread of Holyflare. I am not inclined to lynch him? | ||
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You crushed me last game. Have you done anything you are incapable of as scum yet? Is there something I missed in your scumplay last game? | ||
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On March 25 2015 15:52 Onegu wrote: And this is exactly why Alakaslam is playing like he is this game. I don't think he likes his play being reduced to a formula. Is that enough incentive to be serious as town? I certainly think so. FOR THE LAST TIME, THAT WAS MY READ AND MY LYNCH, I WAS FIRST TO VOTE HIM, MY REASONS WERE BETTER AND MY FORMULA WORKS. | ||
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On March 25 2015 15:54 Eden1892 wrote: I don't really understand the point of OMGUS.meh sorry can't take Damdred out as of yet. But if everyone else on that list is someone you're cool with then I'm sure you'll have time to convince me otherwise, yeah? and trfel... how is slam interesting this game? his 'evolving' read on holyflare is omgus, then dropping it when no one wanted to do anything with it. other than that he's done naught but excuse his inactivity, post off-topic and make bizarro world martyr posts about killing him so we can figure out we're wrong like you have a really really low bar set for interesting if slam's play this game is interesting lmao Town uses OMGUS a bunch. Alakaslam shows why Holyflare is scum, and that is because Holyflare's push on Alakaslam is bad. I would have put Holyflare at scum lean for it, except it was early in the game and caused discussion, and the rest of Holyflare's play was towny. Thus, I can see what Alakaslam is getting it. He dropped it due to looking at the other things Holyflare was doing, which were townie (this makes sense). He also shared some unique reads on other players (iirc scumread on rsoultin). It's likely that Alakaslam is town, and can't keep up with the thread. I see it as a policy lynch. And when I use the word interesting for Alakaslam: Last game, Down Under 2, all he did was sheep Palmar the entire game, and didn't even bother defending himself. This game, he's at least caring, and being independent. I can't and won't effectively argue Alakaslam to town. But I can argue him to null. And I don't want to lynch null. I'm sleepy. Good night. | ||
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And so I don't want to lynch him yet. | ||
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On March 25 2015 16:02 ritoky wrote: I didn't have anything to say.how u just ignore my response trfel? ROOD As to you being actively willing to try and solve the game, you were the most tryhard player in Down Under 2. And here, we're fatigued from this 300+ page game, and you're just starting. You would be obvious scum if you weren't trying harder than everyone else. The other point requires a few careful filter dives from a fully awake Trfel. Not happening at 3 AM. Good night. And really, thanks for the response, that wasn't an easy question to answer. | ||
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Unfortunately, I was gone by that point, so I couldn't interact with him. But I actually put him at a town lead at this point. His play is just so markedly different from his scum play last game. If Alakaslam is lynched, it should be due to interactions with flipped mafia. | ||
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Vivax is generally considered town due to the number of posts and the effort he has been putting into this game. Eden is town because he has also been putting a ton of effort into this game, and he has been constantly thinking critically and willing to discuss with anyone. He's the only certain townread that I'm willing to give for gameplay alone. | ||
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However, overall, all lynches carry equal weight. If you get mislynched now, that's one mislynch, the same as if you were mislyched at LYLO. And that's why it doesn't help town to mislynch you now. So asking to be lynched now or never isn't something that town can comply with. I want to delay your lynch for one day, and preferably for much more than that. If you are town, it would be nice to see you read over the last 5-10 pages (or however much you are willing to read and have time for) and then post your thoughts based on those pages. No one expects you to read the entire thread, in fact most people here have not done so. The nice thing is that by talking with people who have read the entire thread, you can sort of get okay reads. | ||
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After that, do you agree that this game is more conversational than most games, including Imperial Mafia, thereby encouraging everyone to post more? | ||
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Eden, Alakaslam seems to be gone, and I can talk to you about why you might townread him, if you wish. | ||
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Mini Mafia Down Under 2 Alakaslam's play was uninspired. He started out by seeing Palmar pretending to be two or three different people (I forget how many). He stated that because Palmar was practicing a greater form of CHUPAZI, he would sheep Palmar. So, he voted with Palmar's scum target and left for a while. At this point, people started showing suspicions of Alakaslam (rsoultin, ritoky, and Onegu, with me sort of following behind in thought, I forget if I expressed these sentiments in the thread). Alakaslam never moved his vote from ritoky. He came back to the thread and had minor interactions, but he never actually did anything other than say he was sheeping Palmar. He did ask what the case on him was, and we responded that he hadn't done anything creative. And he never responded to that. TL Mafia LXX Alakaslam hasn't sheeped anyone. His reads have been at odds with most of the thread at basically all times. He started out with a push on Holyflare. He's been providing several reads. When scumread this game, he shows a drastically different reaction. He's been willing to argue and defend himself, which I didn't notice at all last game (where he didn't even vote to save himself). | ||
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On March 26 2015 03:10 Alakaslam wrote: Actually, this is a really good point...Yes. Been so behind on thread and yet "refused to ask my teammates to help" If Alakaslam is scum here, his partners are readily willing to bus him. Unless Superbia and Alakaslam are both scum, but I'll ignore that for now. And if Alakaslam is being bussed, I guarantee he wouldn't try to defend himself in a near-hopeless situation, when he didn't bother trying to defend himself last game (when he wasn't even getting bussed) and it was a post-restricted game, so he could have easily read the entire game. | ||
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On March 26 2015 02:26 Trfel wrote: Alakaslam, this is why it doesn't make sense for town to decide to lynch you early or never.Alakaslam, if you are town, it's obvious that you don't want to be lynched later in the game. I'm assuming this is because later lynches feel more importance, particularly LYLO. And you would feel more guilty being lynched later as opposed to right now. However, overall, all lynches carry equal weight. If you get mislynched now, that's one mislynch, the same as if you were mislyched at LYLO. And that's why it doesn't help town to mislynch you now. So asking to be lynched now or never isn't something that town can comply with. I want to delay your lynch for one day, and preferably for much more than that. If you are town, it would be nice to see you read over the last 5-10 pages (or however much you are willing to read and have time for) and then post your thoughts based on those pages. No one expects you to read the entire thread, in fact most people here have not done so. The nice thing is that by talking with people who have read the entire thread, you can sort of get okay reads. | ||
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On March 26 2015 03:48 ritoky wrote: I mean, if you want me to go in depth about why Eden is town, I can do so. I just don't think it has a point. That's the best two sentence summary I have.I don't really think eden is scum as of now, but be wary of this as a justification for your read for now and future games. It bit you in the ass once. | ||
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You were very active early on, and then when after LightningStrike (who you posted a case on) flipped, your activity significantly dropped. | ||
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On March 26 2015 03:21 Alakaslam wrote: Any response to this, Alakaslam?Show me. Artanis has been in tandem with Eden and calling Vivax bs, but Eden has been calling auperbia scum. This could be very telling about Superbia for me. Just tell me the page or if it is recent so I can check his filter | ||
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On March 26 2015 04:20 Eden1892 wrote: Eden!dang putting a bunk bed together is tough Talk to me. I want to lynch Onegu. Why is this a bad idea, and who do you want to lynch, and why? | ||
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On March 26 2015 04:34 Trfel wrote: That's what I get for not thinking and posting in the vote thread by accident.Does this vote say anything about Onegu's alignment? My thinking is not much. This is because there are still seven hours to the lynch, and a lot is still undermined. The final vote counts were 8 to 7, indicating that if the game consolidates on two wagons (likely), there are still half of the votes still to come down, and of course a ton of time (and therefore things to happen) before the lynch. Furthermore, Onegu never pushed LightningStrike at all, in fact he never mentioned LightningStrike. The only reason he voted in this way is to sheep Vivax, which he committed to before Vivax voted. My conclusion is that this vote says nothing about Onegu's alignment. Never done that one before. I guess there's a first time for everything. | ||
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Imagine if Onegu claimed mason with Holyflare on Day 1, and then Holyflare responded "What? I'm not a mason." That would say nothing at all about Onegu's alignment. So, Onegu's mason claim with Holyflare has no downside. And Onegu has two potential positives for doing this. If Holyflare accepts, Onegu gets a free pass through Day 1 and Night 1. And regardless of what Holyflare does, Onegu shows that he is willing to fake-claim mason, thereby giving him an out from all mason claims he makes for the rest of the game. Then Onegu claimed mason with raynpelikoneet. Regardless of raynpelikoneet's alignment, I think this is a poor move for town here. Rereading Onegu's filter in this section, he seems very determined in this statement. And he provided a false breadcrumb. He is much more determined about this mason claim than he was with his previous mason claim with Holyflare. His explanation for this is that he was certain of raynpelikoneet being town, and was defending him in this way. If he is this certain of raynpelikoneet being town, then he ought to explain this read, instead of just claiming mason. And Onegu I don't think Onegu ever explains this read. Basically, this is a bad play for town, as it provides false information. I also note that Onegu said he hadn't read over half the game, so how is he sure enough in his townread of raynpelikoneet that he claimed in such a convincing manner, while most people were very suspicious of raynpelikoneet at this time? Since then, Onegu rescinded his mason claim. I don't recall Onegu doing much else of note. My conclusion is that Onegu is scum here. I don't see why his play has any benefit for town, and claiming mason is a very low-risk play for scum. Ignoring his claims, Onegu hasn't done very much. I'm scumreading Onegu right now regardless of raynpelikoneet/ritoky's alignment, but I think there's a good chance that they are scum together. | ||
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I need to go. I retract my scumread on Onegu for now, I'll check again later. I forgot about his scumread of rsoultin, that is rather interesting as well. | ||
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Ritoky and rsoultin are reasonably good at it, I don't think I'm terrible at it. I want to lynch mafia, and Alakaslam seems like a slight town lean. Thus, I don't want to lynch him. | ||
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On March 26 2015 08:49 Vivax wrote: Joined? I started the "I don't want to lynch Alakaslam" group.Okay, and now that you've joined the choir of naysayers, what do you suggest? I suggested Onegu, however I forgot that his son is in surgery. And I actually feel terrible about that now (Onegu, I'm sorry!). So I need to completely redo that, with this in mind. But I'm not sure if it's even right to consider lynching Onegu today. Fecalfeast might be an okay lynch. I need to take another look at the implications that Palmar's flip has on raynpelikoneet/ritoky, and I would be willing to lynch ritoky. And there's also lynching one of Superbia/Artanis. Which would be a pretty big decision. If I knew what I wanted to do right now, you would see it reflected in the voting thread. | ||
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On March 26 2015 09:03 Onegu wrote: Glad to hear. I hope he continues to recover well.Ok I'm back home my son is doing fine and sleeping now. I'm going to get some diner and relax a bit then I'll be back. | ||
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On March 26 2015 09:15 Artanis[Xp] wrote: The problem I have with this is that Artanis is really good, and I kind of expect Artanis to be right...He establishes that I've been wrong (null) and that I change my opinions a lot at the drop of a hat (town). | ||
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On March 23 2015 13:36 Onegu wrote: Onegu, can you clarify the bolded please?I think it is. Rayn claim that is. Plus with all the blue claims already why not fake claim. Like if mafia has like 4 goons they know.it's a low PR game and with multiple claims.already... | ||
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While this post failed to account for Onegu's read on rsoultin and the fact that Onegu has a soul read on raynpelikoneet, I think it is correct in that there is no real downside for mafia fake-claiming vigilante, and there is incentive to do so. | ||
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Thoughts? | ||
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Artanis, why are you townreading raynpelikoneet/ritoky again? | ||
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I have a few other reasons at this time, but I'd like to see Onegu's answer to the question I posed a few pages back first. Then I will summarize the reasons to lynch Onegu, which I am honestly not sure are strong enough to merit lynching him at this time. I have not yet taken a close look at Fecalfeast. I need sleep. Good night. | ||
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However, I'm not sure if he will be back before the deadline. And with his son recently having gone through surgery, today is the very worst day to push him. Although objectively, I think he is the best lynch, I am not sure if pushing him today is the best idea. | ||
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My first impressions from the argument between Superbia and Artanis was that Artanis had better arguments, or at least stated them better. However, Superbia's determination struck me as being very towny and geniune, while I'm actually surprised that Artanis engaged Superbia as he did. Currently, I'm inclined to think that both are town. If possible, I would like another day to read these two players, though I suppose I could be convinced to lynch here today. I guess Fecalfeast isn't a terrible lynch, I can see reasons for him being scum, but I can also see reasons for him being town. Namely, I can't expect every town player to keep scumhunting at the same level with the lynch sealed almost 48 hours in advance, especially with the thread moving at this pace. | ||
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Onegu, if you're town, please explain to me where I am wrong in reading you. | ||
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Want to lynch: Onegu ritoky Could lynch: Fecalfeast Superbia Artanis (meh) Alakaslam Breshke (though I haven't read his filter at all) | ||
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On March 27 2015 00:51 Toadesstern wrote: Superbia, compare this to Down Under 2. It's very different.thing is, he has stated multiple times that he wants to get lynched and wants to give up and yet has come back in the thread posting like he doesn't give a fuck about what people are saying about him. Especially in the conversation he had. He doesn't strike me as someone who fakes emotions as mafia at all. If he's angry he's angry. Getting a sack of sleep and comming back rejuvenated to some degree that he can just do his thing without caring all too much actually makes sense. There, Alakaslam asked for a case on him, and never defended himself, just vanished. Here, Alakaslam is yelling and arguing constantly (not in a way that logically defends him, but still, he's arguing). I don't think he would do this as scum, while he's listed in a scumlist in which everyone is set to be lynched. If he is scum, he would either concede (if no one in his team is in the town list) or let himself die (if someone from his team is in the town list). I don't see Alakaslam arguing like this. And once again, I state that Alakaslam's decision to play serious in this game is most likely a direct result of Onegu using a mathematical formula based on the number of times he says chupazi, svengali, and hijole to read him. | ||
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On March 27 2015 01:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Yeah, that's fine.I'm playing poker, saw Onegu post something and figured I could reply to it quickly. Will look into it after. I suppose it also makes sense to let Onegu reply first. | ||
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On March 27 2015 01:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I'm still not really sold on the whole "Palmar said he's scum, so he's town" thing. And I think it's reasonable that both Onegu and raynpelikoneet were mafia together. I can see Onegu doing something without asking first (I can't verify Onegu saying that he never would), and I can see raynpelikoneet checking the thread before the scum qt.Also, why do you still want to lynch Ritoky? Rayn/Palmar interactions suggest Rayn is probably town as well as Rayn/Onegu being unlikely due to Onegu claiming mason with Rayn which Rayn then refused. | ||
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On March 27 2015 01:22 Artanis[Xp] wrote: And I'm thinking that some of your townreads are a bit weak. The Onegu one being a prime example (unless there is more behind it that you didn't state).Actually you explained it at the top of the page, nvm. I just have trouble imagining a scumteam that doesn't involve slam simply through poe. That's actually why I've been told to not use POE, because it can lead to weak townreads. | ||
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On March 27 2015 01:23 Artanis[Xp] wrote: You're not really on the table. But it's more like, there are two people here who want to lynch you (Vivax and Superbia), and there is no one actively pushing for Damdred at this time. So I don't really see Damdred getting lynched today, regardless.Also, Trfel, why is Damdred off the table for you but I'm still on it? I understand if you're going the full skeptical way but putting me below Damdred at this point when he hasn't really done much in recent times is questionable. | ||
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On March 19 2015 18:52 Palmar wrote: Palmar initially treats raynpelikoneet just fine, no suspicion voiced at all.It seems wise to take this conversation somewhere private where other people can't hear. On March 19 2015 20:20 Palmar wrote: This is the first time that Palmar shows suspicion of raynpelikoneet. He's mostly joking.Same with rayn, rayn hasn't been a dick to me this game which could mean he's mafia. On March 19 2015 20:31 Palmar wrote: His vote never made it to the voting thread, clearly joking.##unvote ##vote rayn :D On March 19 2015 20:41 Palmar wrote: Emphasis mine.I vaguely suggested you may be mafia based on one parameter that by definition isn't even that good. My post didn't even imply that I actually think you are mafia. The fact you've taken that way out of context and basically treat it as me considering you guaranteed scum is an overreaction of the highest order. Then, Holyflare and Artanis vote for raynpelikoneet. And Palmar reacts as follows: On March 19 2015 22:46 Palmar wrote: And still doesn't vote for raynpelikoneet. Why does he change what he already stated was a joke into a scumread as soon as it picks up momentum? And still not actually vote with it?Is it okay that I scumread rayn for being a dick to me when I previously scumread him for not being a dick to me? I don't see how this makes raynpelikoneet town. | ||
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I'll hold off on voting until I get some more feedback regarding lynches on Onegu and ritoky, but those are my preferred lynches. I suppose if neither of those are accepted, Fecalfeast or Alakaslam could do. | ||
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On March 27 2015 02:10 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I need to eat lunch, and then I might be gone for some time. Sorry.I've read your reasons for wanting to lynch Onegu, but I've only heard you counter arguments to townread Ritoky. What makes you scumread him to the same level as you do on Onegu? The reasons I scumread ritoky are as follows:
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##vote Onegu For now, at least. | ||
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On March 27 2015 02:39 Onegu wrote: I read your filter. And I'm scumreading you anyway.Jeez I already talked about this. trfel how the fuck are you scum reading me without even reading my filter? I'll be back in a few hours. Convince me. | ||
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Whoops. Meant to vote for Superbia. ##unvote ##vote Superbia | ||
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Might as well make it look like town is united so that scum is scared. | ||
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Switch votes with me? | ||
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Eden, my problem with your analysis is that it assumes that people are smart. I agree that Superbia and Artanis were arguing for the purpose of arguing, and not to actually arrive at any useful conclusion. However, I think that the entire progression of Superbia's case on Artanis and his follow-up argument indicates that Superbia is extremely determined to push Artanis, and this makes him seem towny to me. Townies often bicker pointlessly. It doesn't make them scum. | ||
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Vivax actually is mafia and he decided to concede in frustration. And then the rest of his team said "no, I want to play!" Thus, Vivax, Superbia, Onegu scum team. | ||
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On March 27 2015 06:23 Trfel wrote: This actually makes a ton of sense, given Vivax's play today....Unless, of course.... Vivax actually is mafia and he decided to concede in frustration. And then the rest of his team said "no, I want to play!" Thus, Vivax, Superbia, Onegu scum team. He's pushed nearly everyone else. | ||
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On March 27 2015 06:29 Superbia wrote: Two different possibilities Trfel, how the fuck are you calling me mafia, but still call me and Art townies fighting. Possibility 1: Vivax is drunk and decided to concede without asking his team first. Possibility 2: Vivax. Proceed as normal. Possibility two is much more likely. Regardless, it doesn't matter for now if you are getting lynched today either way. I'm going to filter dive Artanis. | ||
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On March 27 2015 06:34 Superbia wrote: Superbia.Never before has a town been so on my dick when I'm town. Never. Like if you're town you're literally handing mafia the win on a silver platter. If you are town, please calm down and logically answer Eden's arguments. You aren't lynched yet. I'll be looking at Artanis's filter. | ||
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My hypothesis is although Artanis has a large filter, he hasn't provided much original content, and has just been following the thread sentiment. And this makes him scum. Thoughts? Oh and also, I'm going to vote Onegu again. If Superbia flips scum, I look like an idiot, but I already know that I'm an idiot, so that doesn't really matter. | ||
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On March 27 2015 06:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It's a suspicion... If you are mafia, that's my best guess at why.Trfel if you think I could actually post this much mafia AND that I actually haven't posted much original content my frustration levels demand me to tell you you're playing as bad as the people that almost lynched you in that newbie game that I coached you in. I need to check to see if this is actually true or not. But I don't have time to do so before the lynch deadline, so I am asking people for help in that matter. | ||
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On March 27 2015 06:59 sicklucker wrote: Vote for Onegu with me?When I caught super as mafia the one time he didnt try this hard. + some weird logic I forgot that says mafia would prop rb me if super was mafia. So ill be voting for the other wagon | ||
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Is Artanis scum or town? You seem to be sort of going back and forth. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:09 Damdred wrote: Not true... He basically let himself get lynched without resisting. Well, he didn't actually get lynched, but that wasn't his own doing.In mini mafia down under he was super aggressive and rawr at lynch (rsoultin....) | ||
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That is all. I don't know if I prefer an Alakaslam lynch or a Superbia lynch. At this point, probably an Alakaslam lynch, as Superbia will have an easier time verifying his towniness. And Alakaslam could be scum. I can't argue him to town, only to null. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:21 Eden1892 wrote: Would you vote Onegu?I did But I'm pretty sure Superbia is town. His reaction is hella pure And Slam seems like the only alternative people will take If we both vote Onegu, there's a good chance people would follow. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:24 Superbia wrote: This could work for me, at least.Why not rayn/ritoky? Ritoky has looked really towny, though I wouldn't expect otherwise, regardless of his alignment. But last time this happened to me (scummy player into towny replacement) I didn't pay attention to the replacement's play, and I paid for it. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It's not. The scumminess of raynpelikoneet's play has been discussed in depth. I think that's a fair reason.Paranoia without reason is useless. If you think someone looks really towny, that's not a reason to scumread them. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:27 Superbia wrote: Could see this too.I don't even know what FF is doing tbh. I think I prefer lynching Fecalfeast to lynching Alakaslam as well. Only slightly, though. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:29 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I agree, I would like more time too. But I don't really want to lynch Alakaslam here...I need more time to make my mind up on the slot at least. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:40 Superbia wrote: Alakaslam could be town because he has been far more determined in this game than I am used to him being as scum. He has a clear thought process, even if I disagree with some of the conclusions he reaches.I really want to hit scum here and confirm myself in the split vote. Halp. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:55 Onegu wrote: It's seven to four.What is the vote count? Don't worry, you're safe for today. | ||
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On March 27 2015 07:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Byebye sicklucker.Who's your strongest townread? Maybe we should lynch that person next. | ||
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I wouldn't mind people listening to me once in a while. | ||
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On March 27 2015 08:17 Vivax wrote: I think scum is in a pretty good spot.9 town vs 3 scum. It looks pretty dire for them, I think they only have 1 KP from now on. The positive atmosphere has collapsed. Town really doesn't know what to do. It would be great if the orb saved us again. At this point, a rolecheck would be extremely useful, as scum probably has two or three mafia power roles. If the rolecheck gives a non-vanilla answer, it's effectively as good as a red check. | ||
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On March 27 2015 08:18 Vivax wrote: Vivax, please don't eat me alive for saying this....Tomorrow I'd like to proceed with Fecal provided I'm still alive being quite universally townread but feel free to post your wishes. People are stupid. And they don't always agree. But that doesn't mean that emphatically insisting that they are stupid will solve the problem, as stupidity is extremely hard to fix (I know this from personal experience). I think that town would benefit if you toned it down a little bit. I also note that Fecalfeast was roleblocked by rsoultin. This means that Fecalfeast wasn't carrying KP. With two KP and four scum left, Fecalfeast would be a pretty good choice to carry KP. And this is a fair argument in his favor. | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:00 Onegu wrote: Sorry, I'm working under the assumption that rsoultin was roleblocked.Wait jk doesn't prevent KP then I'm confirmed town This wasn't true when you were jailkeeped (jailkept?). However, this seems like a rather townie post. Maybe I'm wrong on you. | ||
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Rsoultin was roleblocked. Thus, the roleblocks cancel, and the KP goes through. In your case, it blocks KP, because rsoultin wasn't roleblocked (or at least, it's basically guaranteed that she wasn't). | ||
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The argument for Fecalfeast being mafia is that his case reeks of too much information, and is caused by LightningStrike's desire to not play the game any more. Therefore, the majority of the mafia team would join in on this bus. On March 20 2015 05:25 Fecalfeast wrote: This is one minute after Fecalfeast posted his case.##unvote ##vote lightningstrike On March 20 2015 23:14 raynpelikoneet wrote: This is the next vote on LightningStrike. Nearly 18 hours later.##unvote ##vote LightningStrike On March 21 2015 03:12 Half the Sky wrote: And here's a vote count. It doesn't appear to me that mafia is bussing LightningStrike here at all (unless of course Vivax is scum...).Day 1: Current Vote Count Vivax (5): LightningStrike (4): Bill Murray, sicklucker (3): Artanis[Xp] (2): raynpelikoneet (2): Holyflare, Toadesstern (2): Palmar, Eden1892 (1): Damdred (0): Superbia (0): VisceraEyes (0): Alakaslam (0): ExO_ (0): Palmar (0): Trfel (0): Holyflare (0): Not Voting (1): Trfel Currently, Vivax [blue]is set to be executed. Day 1 ends in at 23:00 GMT (+00:00). Raynpelikoneet does show immediate support. Eventually, Eden follows on. I note that Palmar townreads LightningStrike, even after this. While it's possible that Fecalfeast actually is bussing LightningStrike here, but there is no motivation for him to do this as scum at all. If it's truly a planned bus attempt, it doesn't get the support that I would expect. Therefore, I think it's much more likely that Fecalfeast is town here. | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:44 Vivax wrote: What about town losing stamina?9 3 7 3 5 3 - > mylo, no lynch pls 4 3 Still 2 mislynches and 1 no lynch left so it isn't looking bad at all, just try to keep the activity up when the pacemaker townies get NKd and scum should start losing stamina, besides they will have inreasing trouble keeping their story consistent with earlier posts, so try to bank on that. | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:44 Vivax wrote: Well hm, you're wrong on two points.9 3 7 3 5 3 - > mylo, no lynch pls 4 3 Still 2 mislynches and 1 no lynch left so it isn't looking bad at all, just try to keep the activity up when the pacemaker townies get NKd and scum should start losing stamina, besides they will have inreasing trouble keeping their story consistent with earlier posts, so try to bank on that. It's currently 9 vs 3. But it's night. 8 vs 3 6 vs 3 4 vs 3 So don't hit MYLO, and can't no lynch. However, no lynching is disallowed anyway. | ||
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It also makes no sense that scum would decide to bus LightningStrike and then retract the bus after the claimfest (unless you think that I am scum). Or are you saying that the LightningStrike case wasn't a bus, but just a fake push? | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:49 Vivax wrote: It's currently 9 vs 3. One night kill, and one mislynch, so 7 vs 3. One night kill, and one mislynch, so 5 vs 3. Then if we no lynch (which isn't even allowed), it would be 4 vs 3, and the night kill makes it 3 vs 3, and we lose.No, one NK one mislynch, town goes from 9 to 7. One NK one mislynch. Town goes from 7 to 5 Etc. | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:58 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I agree, but I don't think this looked like a middle of the road option.Basically, the premise of your argument is that "If scum want to bus LS, they would do it strongly for maximum cred or they wouldn't do it at all" and I'm not convinced that a middle of the road option isn't possible. To me, it looks like scum had very little to do with the LightningStrike push at all. If you think Vivax is town, Onegu only followed by the RNG sheep. And there was some support given in the thread, but only from raynpelikoneet and Eden. I don't think this makes sense from a mafia!Fecalfeast perspective, though I suppose if raynpelikoneet/ritoky is scum after all, I could see this. But if raynpelikoneet was town, then scum didn't show any support for this case at all. I would think that scum would try to get towncredit for more than one person for an early Day 1 bus, so they would have at least one other person show support for it fairly early on (even if not voting for it). | ||
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On March 27 2015 10:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: This is correct.So it can only rolecheck and roleblock now? I'm presuming the roleblock would also prevent KP. Rolecheck is extremely powerful, as basically anything non-vanilla indicates scum. And all of the scum power roles are still up (except I suppose a godfather wouldn't be caught by this). Roleblock does prevent KP, but with only one scum KP and three scum, this is difficult. | ||
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On March 27 2015 10:05 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Fair enough, I'll defer to your experience.I don't see the option where scum fecal makes a case and the rest of the scumteam waits to see if townies sheep it before hopping on as unreasonable. | ||
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After I checked LightningStrike, he expressed disappointment at being caught. If I am scum, this makes sense (it makes me seem towny). However, if I am town (which I know for certain), then it is very likely that LightningStrike was telling the truth, and he was disappointed to be caught. This indicates that scum wasn't completely willing to bus LightningStrike (I don't think they would be willing to bus him when Fecalfeast did, and then change their minds, because the only good reason for Fecalfeast bussing LightningStrike there is LightningStrike's own desire to not play). Basically, because I know that LightningStrike ultimately was not bussed, and seemed to be genuinely disappointed at being lynched, I think that makes Fecalfeast more likely to be town. Does that make sense to anyone else? | ||
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On March 27 2015 09:00 Onegu wrote: Other people agree that this is a very towny post, right?Wait jk doesn't prevent KP then I'm confirmed town | ||
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On March 27 2015 11:09 Eden1892 wrote: Jailer does stop KP.Jailer stops kp... It's in the OP I have no idea what this point means But that aside, I think that Onegu's reaction hints at him being town. Do you agree? | ||
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On March 27 2015 11:10 Eden1892 wrote: Onegu sees a post that says "jailer doesn't stop KP", and he responds "that means I'm town!"Explain like I'm a 5 year old that just mislynched town I'm thinking that if Onegu is mafia, he wouldn't think to respond like that, because he would know that it is false. Obviously he could, I just think it's less likely than Onegu actually being town. Unless of course, I am wrong in this assessment, which is why I am asking. | ||
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Given the above post I mentioned, I don't really want to lynch Onegu any more. Onegu, if you are town, I would still like to see more from you. But again, if you are town, I do apologize for pushing you this past day. If ritoky is scum, I don't think I can catch him through general gameplay, only how he reacts to situations. So, I'd prefer to leave that for later tomorrow. I'd also prefer to leave Fecalfeast for later tomorrow, as I want to see how his activity goes over the course of the next cycle. Artanis could be scum here, I think he's good enough that it is possible. However, I think that this is extremely unlikely. In addition, I'm not going to lynch him out of suspicion, only proof. And though it might be possible to prove, it would take an extremely large amount of time invested. If someone would like to do the work, that's fine with me. But I'm not going to spend basically a whole day reading Artanis (that's what it would take me...) if he is very likely to be town here. Town Sicklucker Vivax Toadesstern Eden Artanis Townish Onegu Fecalfeast Damdred Superbia Other Breshke ritoky | ||
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On March 27 2015 12:58 Breshke wrote: It's an "other" list, not a "scum" list. To be honest, I don't really know who scum is right now.Trefel how are you going to feel when one of your scumreads starts pushing on the other because im about 85% sure ritoky is going to come back with the thread saying he didn;t like the way i changed my vote I'll filter dive you first, everyone else I have more reason to wait on. | ||
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Who are your top lynches for tomorrow? | ||
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On March 27 2015 15:29 Toadesstern wrote: Oh, shoot, that makes sense...Why are people claiming orb when mafia killed cop / medic last cycle when I already explained last night that people need to shut the fuck up about the orb and not let mafia know who has it / what they're doing with it? We got lucky last night because they apparently had to RB the medic to get rid of the cop but why would you claim to have the orb this night... Sorry for giving it away. | ||
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At this time, I don't know who I want to lynch. | ||
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On March 29 2015 03:17 Damdred wrote: Superbia could be a good lynch here. It depends on the quality of his case and the aftermath. At times, he's been showing good scumhunting, but I need to check and see how those times relate to when the mafia motivations for scumhunting are higher.Do you have any leanings Trfel? TEll me your thoughts Ritoky could also be a good lynch, but I need to take another look at raynpelikoneet's play and then see what ritoky has been getting at so far. I think I have a somewhat better understanding of how raynpelikoneet plays after playing voice mafia with him, so I would like to reread that. However, I'm pretty busy today, so I'll do what I can, but maybe won't get through too much. | ||
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On March 29 2015 03:30 Fecalfeast wrote: Because he hasn't done much that indicates that he is scum (I was wrong on two of my points about why he is scum).Why is onegu assumed to be town, again? Also, he misinterpreted a post about the rules in such a way that it confirmed him town, and he seemed genuinely excited for being confirmed town. If he was scum, I doubt he would have reacted in that way (though of course it is possible). | ||
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Assuming that Onegu, Vivax, and Toadesstern town, we know that Onegu was shot. At this point, I am fine with these assumptions (though Onegu could still possibly be mafia). 1. Raynpelikoneet is mafia (this is obvious, as a claimed tracker, he should have been shot) 2. Scum has two roleblockers 3. Scum was scared enough of the Holyflare/Onegu mason pair that they wanted to kill both (preventing any sort of "if I die" post from the mason QT beign posted), more scared of this than a tracker Is it likely that scum has two roleblockers in this game? And also, what were Holyflare's final stances on people? | ||
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I need a reason. Why are we lynching Fecalfeast? | ||
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Sorry, I was busy in Aperture 4. | ||
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I did the best that I could, but with zero real information. Mislynch is my fault. | ||
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Right now, I'm thinking of ritoky or Breshke being top lynches for tomorrow. I think we still have one more mislynch, is this correct? | ||
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On March 30 2015 08:13 Vivax wrote: I don't think this game has ever been very town favored.Yeah but tone wise I think ritoky is town even though I found his preference of Onegu over damdred strange. Breshke on the other hand... Actually there is need to panic as I think we're gonna lose this game. Too many needless claims at the beginning of the game. But, if we do lose, we absolutely cannot blame it on the power roles. Power roles aren't necessary to win. I know that if we lose, a huge portion of the blame goes to me for my miserable play (aka not playing) this past day. And that led to the mislynch of Superbia. Town loses due to the play of people in the game, I can't blame power roles at all. | ||
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Onegu, even if sicklucker himself didn't believe the mason claims, it's possible that the other mafia members did, and overruled sicklucker for the night kills. | ||
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I'll take a very close look at ritoky and Breshke tomorrow, if I am still alive. I should have a bunch more time to work with over the next few days. | ||
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On March 31 2015 04:59 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Sorry, I'll be out until after End of Day.Actually it's not all that cunning. The idea is pretty simple; Everyone reads up on Damdred's filter, maybe some meta as well, makes their own opinion, then posts when they're ready. Once we're all ready we post it at the same time so we have a bunch of original thoughts, then discuss it. I'd consider waiting till EoN but only having 20 minutes to discuss could be a problem, idk. I'll definitely read what you guys come up with, though. | ||
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Do I now achieve completely unlynchable status? | ||
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On March 09 2015 12:18 Half the Sky wrote: The orb dissipates when the game reaches 11 players or when the orb is used 4 times in the game, whichever should come first. | ||
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Carry on. | ||
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On March 31 2015 09:04 Fecalfeast wrote: It seems that Onegu was hoping to catch the mafia for claiming a roleblock on the Night 4 orb usage. When he realized that there was no orb for Night 4, he claimed.Can you comment on this part? Specifically about whether it is alignment indicative or not. There was no real reason to be quiet about it. Scum would never fake the orb. Furthermore, scum wouldn't fake the orb with the wrong ability, they would use the orb and then say which ability they got (maybe fake the target and/or the result). Therefore, there is no real benefit for mafia!Onegu to claim orb in this situation. It's not alignment indicative. It also doesn't say much about ritoky. At the time, I believe ritoky was a widely accepted orb target. With only one mafia KP, and three mafia members, it's likely that if ritoky is scum, he wouldn't be the one carrying the KP. | ||
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On March 31 2015 09:24 Vivax wrote: Says the person who already blamed our power roles for the loss.The reason we might lose this game is cause 50 % of the talk is about all this role related mechanic stuff instead of the oldschool simple reasons for why bresh is mafia. Sorry, I couldn't help it | ||
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If scum gets the orb, they have two possibilities.
So, Onegu's play doesn't fit with either of those possibilities. Therefore, I conclude that it is a slightly towny thing to do. | ||
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I still think that ritoky could be a very good lynch today. I hope to get through his and raynpelikoneet's filters. | ||
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I need to go get lunch, then I'll take a look at this. | ||
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I will be gone until after End of Day, though I might be able to get back shortly before it. If Breshke isn't lynched today, there had better be really good reasons why. | ||
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I can't read the last so many pages in time. Anything I need to know? | ||
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On April 02 2015 07:56 Damdred wrote: Doesn't this imply that both are scum?Everyone get on FF. He complains about not having enough time to push his top scum read in Damdred, but he has time to make an effort to show that he doesn't want to vote Breshke to save himself its all fake hes scum. | ||
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I have a feeling that whatever I do is wrong. Artanis, you should switch. | ||
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Trfel Vivax Toadesstern Artanis sicklucker Other Onegu Fecalfeast ritoky Damdred So, one of these four is town. And the rest are scum. I'm going to guess that one of Damdred and Onegu is the town. Damdred's play recently picked up, but that coincides with Artanis's look through his filter and realizing that it wasn't as solid as he had thought. This seems somewhat suspicious. I suggest Fecalfeast or ritoky for the lynch tomorrow. | ||
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That's really stupid. Anyway, I'll take another look at this game and hopefully find the scum. | ||
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On April 03 2015 09:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It's extremely obvious that I'm the veteran, it's been that way for quite some time. Here's why. Hopefully we don't have to go into this again.It has more to do with the fact that we appear to have 2 vigis, a jk, an alignment cop and a veteran which seems like a bit overkill. I can't imagine any of the claims besides yours being fake though. If Toad is somehow mafia I am nominating him for mafia player of the decade. + Show Spoiler + On March 19 2015 10:24 Trfel wrote: Approximately 4 or 5 hours into the game. Do you really think that I am that afraid of being lynched? Votes normally move a ton in the hours before the deadline, so there is absolutely no reason for a post this defensive only a few hours into the game. Also, I have ended up with town power roles on a regular basis, so I am more used to being a power role than being a vanilla townie (hosts, please fix this...). This post was intentional, in hopes that a mafia team would see it and shoot me. I'm pretty sure there are a few other unwarranted defensive posts.Look, I seem to be commonly scumread. And fine, it's warranted. Give me a chance to read the thread in detail, and actually provide thoughts. As in, I'll actually play the game correctly this time. Don't scumread me until I finish and share serious thoughts, okay? If you want a meta reason not to scumread me, last game, Mini Mafia Down Under 2, I trolled for nearly the entire game. I've also spent a ton of time talking about blue roles this game. That's a pretty obvious giveaway as well. On March 21 2015 05:19 Trfel wrote: I kept asking about blue claims, I won't bother quoting them. But there is one point of additional importance. When the claims on Day 1 occurred, I noticed one other player giving them a lot of attention and being skeptical about the number of power roles in the game. This was ExO_. And I'm the worst blue hunter ever. The reason that I identified that he was a power role was that he was thinking exactly the same things I was, and had exactly the same suspicions I was. I asked him twice if he wanted to soft-claim blue. If he did, I would have done so as well, leaving us with five power roles (making lynching into them a reasonably good idea). If ExO_ softclaimed blue in this way, since I would as well, it would help provide some cover for him, so I wasn't as concerned about this because I am the veteran.And there lies the problem.... I'm not sure if there are two vigilantes in this game or not. How many blue roles would we be expected to have in this game? Any clue? The orb sort of counts as a blue role, too... On March 21 2015 05:53 Trfel wrote: I thought about it, and in the end I don't feel that it is significant that Toadesstern claimed instead of simply night-killing Vivax. I know I'm going to get a ton of flak for this, but.... ExO_, are you soft-claiming blue? On March 21 2015 06:58 Trfel wrote: I've also been constantly asking about the power role balance in the game. Why would I be so worried about that, since I generally dislike setup speculation and don't really care about power roles? I'm not going to provide quotes, but basically every time someone claimed blue or rescinded their blue claim, I asked about the power role balance. And when I could, I tried to find out of having an extra power role would make it too strong.Oh, Holyflare claimed too? Hrmph. Almost certainly we have too many claimed power roles then, especially if ExO_ did actually softclaim blue. On March 25 2015 06:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Why did I not respond to this? I couldn't think of a response that was natural enough. Were I not the veteran, I almost certainly would have responded here.Fuck, I rescind my fakeclaim. I'm actually a vet. Finally, there was a time in the game where I asked Eden to try and read my mind. Look at my side of that conversation. On March 25 2015 12:20 Trfel wrote: + Show Spoiler [Eden] + Eden, I have a challenge for you. You need to read my mind. Reread my filter a little more carefully (particularly the parts in Day 1). Then share your thoughts. If you don't want to, I understand, but it would be great if you could. On March 25 2015 12:45 Trfel wrote: Ok Eden. I'll try one more time. Read it again and imagine you're mafia. On March 25 2015 13:32 Trfel wrote: So, I'm asking someone to reread my filter carefully, from a mafia perspective, and asking about the power role balance in the game. What do you think I'm suggesting? I think it's fairly obvious.Eden, now that ritoky and Onegu have claimed VT... What do you think about the game's power role balance? 2 vigilantes 1 jailkeeper 1 cop Is that fair for a 15 town vs 5 scum game? Thanks! | ||
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Vote is on ritoky for now. | ||
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On April 03 2015 10:25 Fecalfeast wrote: Triple. Only three scum remaining.so are we in like quadruple mylo or something? I don't want to math | ||
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You realize that before my claim, I was getting by on basically nothing and getting constantly townread. Why would I make this play and claim veteran, as scum, for a scum team carry, and continue doing nearly nothing? There's no way for that to happen. Scum would never tell me to carry the team like this if I didn't have the time to do it properly. Anyway, I'm terribly sorry for my play the last few days. I fully intend to take a break from mafia after this game and wait for my schedule to be more open, and for me to regain my motivation. I apologize, as my effort level hasn't been fair to those remaining in the game. I'm still going with definite scum as ritoky and Fecalfeast, with the third being between Onegu and Damdred. If we haven't lost by the time we must lynch one of those, and I'm still alive, hopefully I'll have time to make a more detailed analysis. | ||
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I'll go with ritoky, Fecalfeast, and Damdred. And hopefully Artanis, Toadesstern, and sicklucker are all town. Otherwise, well played. | ||
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On April 04 2015 09:45 Fecalfeast wrote: So we're basically betting on how terrible you are at this game? Everyone who thinks I'm obvious scum make a sigbet with me + Show Spoiler + In case you couldn't tell, no thanks on the bet. I like having no signature, and technically signature bets are against the rules. Plus, I fully admit to being terrible at mafia. | ||
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1. I believe that 15 vs 5 is considered scum favored, so town likel would have more power roles to compensate. 2. No offense to Half the Sky, but she isn't known for making particularly balanced setups. | ||
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Toadesstern will die tonight. We lynch Fecalfeast tomorrow, he flips mafia. Then, Artanis dies. That leaves at 4 player MYLO, with: Trfel sicklucker Onegu Damdred The scum is probably Damdred. But, Damdred and Onegu are both scumreading me. If town doesn't vote together, they lose. So this is actually a fairly realistic way that town could lose this game, by mislynching me at 4p MYLO. This is why I am not going to be night killed, and why I wasn't killed last night. It's a good plan for mafia. Alternatively, of course, they can try to mislynch one of Damdred/Onegu. This way, mafia has two potential mislynch options instead of just one (which is what it should be, as sicklucker, Toadesstern, Artanis, and I are all town). Look at my play outside of my veteran claim, even outside of my orb usage (though both suggest that I am town). Here is why I am still town.
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Night 1 Mafia shot Holyflare and Onegu, eliminating two (at the time, widely accepted) confirmed townies, as well as making sure Holyflare's reads would be shut up for good (no Onegu posting stuff from the mason QT after Holyflare's death). Night 2 Rsoultin and ExO_, the jailkeeper and cop, died. I don't think you can argue that mafia should have taken any other action. Night 3 Eden died. Eden was universally townread (well, except for ritoky) for his high level of gameplay. He was playing the best in the game, and was essentially confirmed town. Of course mafia wanted to shoot him. Night 4 I got shot. This makes sense at the time, as I was considered confirmed town. I think that mafia should have shot Toadesstern here, as he is also confirmed town (and the better player), but whatever. Night 5 Vivax was shot. I wasn't shot because people were voicing suspicions of me. Of course I wouldn't be shot here. As for shooting Vivax or Toadesstern, I'm not sure it matters that much for mafia. So, they chose one. Not suspicious. The most suspicious night kill was the night one kill on Onegu. Everything else makes perfect sense. | ||
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On April 05 2015 01:17 Toadesstern wrote: Hm, they might kill sicklucker and Artanis, and then leave both of us alive to make the whole "too many power roles" thing have as much weight as possible.Meanwhile Sicklucker getting depressions because noone consideres him a possible nightkill despite being one of the unlynchable guys... but let's be honest... he's not getting shot lol It's just Fecalfeast/Damdred, lynch them both and win. | ||
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I'm sorry. It's Easter. I'm occupied with other things, I'm busy with family, I won't be around at the deadline, I may not be on for the rest of the day, even. I wish today was a 48 hour day. I believe that the scum team is Fecalfeast and Damdred. Artanis believes that the scum team is Fecalfeast and Onegu. Artanis is an extremely good player, and I read his argument. While it is good, that isn't the same conclusion that I drew, so I need time to go back over it and check the facts again myself. Still, we are both scumreading Fecalfeast. It's best to lynch Fecalfeast now. I still have a lot of doubt that Onegu is scum. Onegu's mason claim simply isn't a clear sign that he is mafia. I can easily see town!Onegu having fun and claiming mason. While I think that it ended up being a bad play, it wasn't too detrimental to town, and it doesn't make him scum here. During the night I will read over the pages I've missed, and I'll analyze the filters. But please, lynch Fecalfeast today. Not anyone else, even Onegu. | ||
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For those of you who doubt my towniness, look at the night kills. You say that they implicate me because I'm not dead. Look further, notice how the people who townread me die, and the people who scumread me stay alive. If I were scum, that is not what I would do at all. Eden, Artanis, Vivax, they all townread me. Damdred, sicklucker, they stay alive. Ritoky kept being suspicious of me (at least, I think). I'm not scum here. Please, trust me, vote Fecalfeast. Lynching Fecalfeast is the only lynch that makes sense here. Toadesstern, sicklucker, and I are not getting lynched. Maybe you disagree with that, but at least we are not getting lynched today. That leaves Damdred, Fecalfeast, and Onegu. To my knowledge, no one is suggesting a Damdred/Onegu pair, therefore we should lynch Fecalfeast. Even if you think Onegu is scummier, just lynch Fecalfeast instead. | ||
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On April 06 2015 02:40 Toadesstern wrote: But I think that Damdred is scum. Does that make you care?that's been pretty much my argument for why I wanted FF lynched today because it's between FF+Trfel and FF+Onegu for people. I think Damdred is currently on Onegu+FF or Onegu+Trfel not sure. So from his pov Onegu is actually the lynch to go right now, from your pov it's FF, from my pov I couldn't care less because it's just Onegu+FF... Trust me for now, when the night phase hits I'll show you why. (That, or perhaps realize that I'm wrong). But I'd like to have a chance first. The remarkable thing about Onegu's play is that he has been here, but not really scummy. His actions haven't been super beneficial for town, but look through his filter, look at what he's done. He hasn't done anything that is clearly scummy, and has clear mafia motivation. I mean, he's done a lot of scummy things, but nothing that makes him scum. And in a game this long, that's pretty impressive. Before you lynch Onegu, read one of his past games. I don't think that Artanis bothered to check Onegu's meta. Toadesstern, you really, really, really ought to do so. | ||
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On April 06 2015 02:23 Damdred wrote: Yes, dismiss my arguments as being weird. That's what scum would do when someone is calling out the scum team and trying to lynch them.Trfel is acting really weird I'm trying to lynch someone who I think is scum over someone who I don't think is scum. I'm not convinced that Damdred's recent activity level is a huge sign that he is town. His play started out strong, and then dropped in the middle. It only came back at the end, when he was in danger of being lynched, when he started losing his townreads. That seems suspicious to me. It's Fecalfeast and Damdred. Don't lose the game now, when it's all figured out. | ||
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On April 06 2015 07:57 sicklucker wrote: Damdred is mafia......ok ill give you the hammer dandred | ||
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7015 Posts
What were the indicators that Toadesstern was mafia? I still don't see the mafia motivation behind his fake-claim. | ||
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Trfel
7015 Posts
I'm sorry for coming down so hard on you this past day. I was faking confidence to try and get you lynched. Now that just makes me feel even worse. Sorry. | ||
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Trfel
7015 Posts
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