The Law of The Sheriff dictates that we must shotgun the most suspicious person. I disagreed with this sentiment. Why should we kill each other after we have already lost 3 due to violence already? Will this bring justice? Will this bring back the Great Laces or Incognito? No. We will have to wait until a new world. A world with Great Laces and Incognito.
I have lived a longtime. Heed my words. If we start this practice today, it will continue. Do you think The Sheriff will be satisfied if we sacrifice the least among us? NO! His desire to shotgun us will not stop after today. He will continue his way! He won't stop tomorrow or the next day!
But how can we stop The Sheriff? Who among us has a weapon? Let him stand up against the sheriff! Let us vote for him to face The Sheriff! But if no one has a weapon... Who are we?
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
So rumor has it, There is a guy, called Kenpachi, and at the game start, he says "hi, i am Kenpachi and i am a townie."
The first guy casting doubt on that dude is always scum, that's the "Kenpachi rule"
It's a stupid rule, and has no basis to why I am reading YKZ as scum.
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
So rumor has it, There is a guy, called Kenpachi, and at the game start, he says "hi, i am Kenpachi and i am a townie."
The first guy casting doubt on that dude is always scum, that's the "Kenpachi rule"
It's a stupid rule, and has no basis to why I am reading YKZ as scum.
On June 16 2014 10:27 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:16 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
The Kenpachi rule, named after its author Kenpachi, is a TL adage reflecting the idea that without a clear and better motivation for a vote, it is almost certainly a scumtell when a player votes a player who claimed VT at the start of the game.
Kenpachi's rule, in broader form, is:
Without a blantant display of humor, a vote on a vt claim comes almost always from a scum player.
The core of Kenpachi rule is that a vt claim by its nature is not suspicious to a town player, who isn't hunting for blues. Without a clear motivation for a vt claim, it looks odd to scum, who want to attack someone safely. A corollary of the Kenpachi rule is the reverse phenomenon: the first vt claim is almost always sincere.
These definitions don't exactly match up...
You can search it on TL for urself, but it's not about claiming townie, as 27ninjabunnies asserts. The rule is about claiming vanilla townie. Basicly, scum want to jump on something, and a VT claim looks basicly not intresting to a townie who isn't hunting for blues. It looks unique though to someone who is hunting for blues: scum.
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
So rumor has it, There is a guy, called Kenpachi, and at the game start, he says "hi, i am Kenpachi and i am a townie."
The first guy casting doubt on that dude is always scum, that's the "Kenpachi rule"
It's a stupid rule, and has no basis to why I am reading YKZ as scum.
On June 16 2014 10:27 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:16 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
The Kenpachi rule, named after its author Kenpachi, is a TL adage reflecting the idea that without a clear and better motivation for a vote, it is almost certainly a scumtell when a player votes a player who claimed VT at the start of the game.
Kenpachi's rule, in broader form, is:
Without a blantant display of humor, a vote on a vt claim comes almost always from a scum player.
The core of Kenpachi rule is that a vt claim by its nature is not suspicious to a town player, who isn't hunting for blues. Without a clear motivation for a vt claim, it looks odd to scum, who want to attack someone safely. A corollary of the Kenpachi rule is the reverse phenomenon: the first vt claim is almost always sincere.
These definitions don't exactly match up...
You can search it on TL for urself, but it's not about claiming townie, as 27ninjabunnies asserts. The rule is about claiming vanilla townie. Basicly, scum want to jump on something, and a VT claim looks basicly not intresting to a townie who isn't hunting for blues. It looks unique though to someone who is hunting for blues: scum.
But knowing all of this, couldn't you say you're VT regardless of alignment, bait someone's suspicion and then claim Kenpachi rule?
I'm having trouble understanding why at the very start of the game scum would be more prone to jumping on something that looks scummy. I mean if scum's job is to blend in, why be the first to vote and make a case? There's always scrutiny that comes with doing so...
Hello there my friend,
I believe The Sheriff wants to speak with you out back. Oh and don't forget to bring your weapon.
On June 17 2014 03:22 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Chezinu, A bruised man visits the doctor. He tells the doctor that he saw the sheriff on a long stretch of road just outside of town. The sheriff was approached by two shadowed figures, a small figure and a large figure. The tall figure had its face obscured by a dark cap. The small figure was deformed, a scar running from the left side of his mouth. The rest of their figures obscured by the eclipsing sun. The man mentioned seeing a package delivered to the sheriff from these two gentlemen, whom then spotted him. He ran away as fast as he could as gunfire followed him. He fell on his face from a branch, then hid in the bushes. He overheard the two talking after they gave up their search. "It doesn't matter anyway. Operation Hyrule can no longer be stopped."
Are you familiar with the codeword Hyrule? What does it mean?
Hmm, There must be a Link. He typically throws bombs when he is faced with creatures from other worlds. Given the circumstances, it may be a shotgun. These two men must have guns... When did they visit the sheriff?
On June 17 2014 05:58 27ninjabunnies wrote: Chez, Artanis, care to share your thoughts?
I thought of a bunch of bunnies getting shotgunned by the sheriff when sleeping through your conversations.
Go ahead if one must.
Probably clear up a lot of information for town.
In my dreams! As you are totally not getting the picture here, let me draw you the picture of my dream:
**CENSORED -- DISTURBING IMAGES -- CENSORED**
Not sure if you want me dead, or want to have sex with me.
Both are quite disturbing images.
So yeah, not getting the picture here.
Its Day 1..
The center of discussion is not about Chezinu. Chezinu must do something.
riddle: sHow smany shotgun shots should sa shotgun shoot sto shred stwenty-seven sninja sbunnies?
No... That will not do... It must be bigger... like a revolution against a common enemy! The Sheriff! Listen herehear Sheriff! You cannot control everything! You make your laws saying no pictures and no free expression in Artanis! Well, let me make pictures with words!
Imagine... Facing The Sheriff.. With a flag of rebellion in hand... Saying, "No We Can!"
Marching Marching.. In the front lines of a new movement! Waving your stance high in the air but under the clouds...
NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO NONONONONONONONONONONONONO E E V V A A R R !! - - !!.../\..............................................................
On June 17 2014 02:39 Release wrote: @Lazer (and everyone else): His actions alone are bad. The repetitiveness of the badness and refusal to change his play after being corrected manifest his mafia agenda.
"blazinghand is stubborn, therefore he is mafia" and "blazinghand has scumslipped, therefore he is mafia" are both sentences that are like always super doops wrong. I certainly can be stubborn as mafia, but I'm always stubborn. And the scumslip thing, come on guys. I legit don't scumslip as scum, and scumslip all the time as town, ask like anyone who has played more than 2 games with me. Also, I'm just generally a stubborn bastard no matter what I roll; again, ask anyone who has played with me.
I will say this though: although I don't particularly like that Release is all over me like a dog on a butt-flavored biscuit, I gotta give him credit: he IS all over me. He went through my filter and tried to find anything he could possibly construe as scummy and slapped it down in a big honkin filter dive case. Now, it's a big honkin WRONG filter drive case, but it's still a lot of effort. Maybe he was explicitly dodging Kenpachi Rule Extended, but he still gets mondo credit for putting in effort imo. Is release scummy for jumping in and just repeating what other people said? Eh, maybe. It's certainly a easy move for scum to make, but it's also worth noting that it's a move town would make.
Suppose Release comes in and sees this horrible back and forth between me and 27nb, and for some weird reason becomes convinced I'm scum as a result. He wants to drop a vote on me, but also there's like no-one voting me, so he drops a hella big case. He does work, he does research. I give him credit for this, at least. Yes, it would have been good if he had an original idea, but if he didn't, he didn't. There's only so much to be said about me. Maybe you think he's scum because you think I'm scum and this is the most poorly executed bus ever, but really, 1) it would be a terrible way to do it, and 2) as SloOsh said (and he gets mucho townie points for this) you don't draw associative tells between unflipped players.
Back onto the 27nb thing, Check it out. If you look at 27nb's filter, you see the initial push on me, and you see some interactions on me in places where I directly call out 27nb, but that's it as far as interactions with me. Check out some of the posts I made after the post that set off 27nb's "flag" so to speak about me being scummy:
On June 16 2014 11:05 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:58 Snickers wrote:
Also, your posts are giving me BH vibes.
Hello everyone. I am not sure how to quote someone so if the above quote was wrong please tell me how. (I checked preview and it looked right) What does BH stand for? For awhile i thought VT stood for vigilante not vanilla town. Also this kenpachi rule is useless.
BH stands for "Blazinghand": he is a mafia-guy who is mean to newbies and throws around his "vet" status in games and thinks he is way better then everyone else. ne1 who thinks I am BH also thinks I am town tho cuz BH's favorite thing is to fake claim blue roles every game when he is scum. He would never claim vt as scum bcuz he wants to fake claim blue rofl
In this post i'm explicitly stating I'm not BH and trying to fake not being me. Even worse, I'm setting up the "bh claiming vt must be town" meme and I later "accidentally" reveal myself to be BH. If I were someone who thought YKZ was scum and saw this, I'd be all over it. I'd point out that it's awfully CONVENIENT to say that and then "accidentally" reveal yourself to be bh. I'd write a case, or at least a post, or heck, at least a SENTENCE, about this. Since I'm already suspicious of YKZ, since I supposedly have a scumread on YKZ, responding to this would be a NATURAL thing to do if I was town and voting YKZ.
And yet, no response from 27nb (who was in thread at the time)
next..
On June 16 2014 11:34 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:27 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:13 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip.
This reminds me of something you once said in Les Mafia:
On May 22 2013 15:51 Blazinghand wrote: DP, you're not bad, you're just wrong about scumslips. When I flip town, promise me this: for the next full game played, any time you mention scumslips you will say "I was wrong, BH was right, there is no such thing as a scumslip"
Did something change?
Yeah in the YKZ quote nobody thought I was blazinghand, so I thought I could get away with the fallacious "scumslip" argument, since you guys clearly aren't willing to accept the reasonable Kenpachi Rule argument. The fact of the matter is, 27nb IS scum because of Kenpachi Rule. I'm allowed to lie, cheat, steal, etc (well not cheat but you get the idea) to get you sheep to follow me and lynch him. The ends justify the means.
also, 27nb's retconned case on me that's about me saying s/he doesn't have good info is based on, you guessed it, another scumslip. Let me get it through everyone's heads: I, Blazinghand, am by far the best scum player on TL Mafia. I may not be an amazing town player, I admit, but I am a GOD of scum, I only ever scumslip as town. You can look at my past games; every time someone calls me out for a scumslip, I'm town. You know why? As town, I don't have to bother worrying about scumslips cause I know I am innocent. As scum, I play a much cleaner game in terms of slips because I have to.
So, 27nb's slip-based case on me actually proves how townie I am, and his/her hilarious backtracking on calling me potentially blue only shows how scummy 27nb is.
Look at what I'm saying here. I'm literally admitting to lying to and deceiving the thread. I then say it's okay to lie and that the ends justify the means. Jesus christ on a stick with a cherry on top, how do you not flip out over this if you're town and think I'm scum? You'd be like "look, BH is obviously willing to lie. He was trying to pretend to be someone else while smurfing, which is a CLASSIC BH move when smurfing as scum. He even admits it, right here, in an attempt to defuse the situation. You can't let this slide guys, this is proof BH is scum"
anyone who thinks I'm suspicious and has a vote on me, after reading that I admit to lying and trying to decieve the thread, would be ALL OVER this post. You want to know how 27nb responds, though?
Here, I'll show you.
On June 16 2014 11:39 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:34 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:27 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:13 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip.
This reminds me of something you once said in Les Mafia:
On May 22 2013 15:51 Blazinghand wrote: DP, you're not bad, you're just wrong about scumslips. When I flip town, promise me this: for the next full game played, any time you mention scumslips you will say "I was wrong, BH was right, there is no such thing as a scumslip"
Did something change?
Yeah in the YKZ quote nobody thought I was blazinghand, so I thought I could get away with the fallacious "scumslip" argument, since you guys clearly aren't willing to accept the reasonable Kenpachi Rule argument. The fact of the matter is, 27nb IS scum because of Kenpachi Rule. I'm allowed to lie, cheat, steal, etc (well not cheat but you get the idea) to get you sheep to follow me and lynch him. The ends justify the means.
also, 27nb's retconned case on me that's about me saying s/he doesn't have good info is based on, you guessed it, another scumslip. Let me get it through everyone's heads: I, Blazinghand, am by far the best scum player on TL Mafia. I may not be an amazing town player, I admit, but I am a GOD of scum, I only ever scumslip as town. You can look at my past games; every time someone calls me out for a scumslip, I'm town. You know why? As town, I don't have to bother worrying about scumslips cause I know I am innocent. As scum, I play a much cleaner game in terms of slips because I have to.
So, 27nb's slip-based case on me actually proves how townie I am, and his/her hilarious backtracking on calling me potentially blue only shows how scummy 27nb is.
You are soooooo wrong on me. It's super bad.
And tbh, idc what you think of yourself, but you haven't impressed me ass the "best" in TL Mafia.
I caught your mafia self d1. Get rekt!
And as I said, Kenpachi rule is useless and stupid, and it will be highly disproved this game.
I have no need to backtrack, and I had not backtracked anywhere. I'm going forward with this lynch and into the abyss you go!
All 27nb sees is the part of the post directed at her. She argues about like backtracking or whatever, and says she's going forward with this lynch while literally ignoring possibly the most damning statement a player could make. If she was really town and really thought I was scum, at this point she'd say, not "blah blah kenpachi rule backtracking, your'e so bad and i'm so good", she'd say, "ah hah! Caught you in a lie, blazinghand, this is exactly what scum do!"
You can see she's clearly not in a mindset of hunting scum, or hell, even actually PUSHING The wagon. She is putting on a big SHOW of pushing the wagon, but she's not actually doing it. She's not pointing out what I'm posting, or why I'm scum, just shouting about like one sentence in one post. She's not hunting scum. She's making noise.
This is because she lacks the town mindset, the mindset that someone who really thought I was scum would have. Because 27nb is scum.
vote her, for justice.
@ first 4 paragraphs: The first sentence is again deliberate misrepresentation of the information that I have presented. Blazinghand is stubbornly wrong even when corrected and refuses to acknowledge corrections and is therefore mafia is the complete picture. This is the same misrepresentation of information he used earlier to cause chaos and it is used to cause chaos now. And the scumslip (which to my mind is the "more information") is NOT the reason that I think you are mafia. Please stop trying to twist information to suit your agenda. I do not merely repeat what has been said. I created a case on you with greater breadth and depth than 27nb did. And maybe you should pay more attention to what SloOsh is saying because he has asked useful questions when (mostly) you and 27nb have caused havoc in the thread. Now disregarding that, my case demonstrates that your logic in your play is incorrect. A proper defense is not to say "If I were scum, I would have..." because that is meaningless. Instead, you need to demonstrates that your logic is not incorrect. Otherwise, I think we should still construe YKZ's earlier posts as deliberate chaos.
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 01:42 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
Boring, why so?
And I know I'm town, so you think Release is more likely scum defending a town here?
Or do you think it's scum defending a partner this early into the game?
I'm thinking we're both town here.
Though, i agree, he is basically just sayng everything I've already said.
Boring because you both just kept repeating the same things but in different words and it wasn't going anywhere for me to get a read on either of you.
I don't know your alignment and I'm not going to make an association between unflipped players. People did that in cell. You supported that as mafia. Why are you trying to create associations now?
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
This gives me a slight scumread on you. Wanting to be right is an easy reason to lean back on without actually saying anything.
On June 17 2014 02:38 Release wrote: Currently this is our only point of discussion, although your vote on me now introduces a discussion about me.
wordy words
Boring. You could've introduced a discussion about anyone that had an opinion on the case for bullshit reasons. You also keep repeating yourself in the post as well. If you want me to actually read your posts thoroughly, be more to the point. I'm not interested in your description of what you provided and what you want. It won't help me get a more accurate read on you.
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
I "repeat" myself because YKZ makes similar chaotic plays with the same agenda.
I rehashed some of the dispute because I wanted to provide a complete argument as to why YKZ is mafia and I want to be specific about my references.
On June 17 2014 03:19 Lazermonkey wrote: @Release: I'm sorry, I missread your post a little bit. Your argument is actually quite different from Bunnies. I do, however, still fail to understand how YKZ actions make him scum. Your argument seems like WIFOM to me. It's like you assume that YKZ is already scum and then try to justify his actions from that point of you. Have you even considered YKZ's actions from a town PoV?
Assuming that he is trying to create chaos by missinterpreting Bunnies is a big leap of faith.
I also do think that there is merit to the Kenpachi rule in this case. Even if Bunnies said nummerous times that the VT claim wasn't the reason she voted for YKZ, she still pointed out two times:
On June 16 2014 09:42 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
Awwwww, how rude. Don't you know you are supposed to talk to a person when they are talking to you?
Also-she.
And Why right off the bat claim vt?
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:45 slOosh wrote: Bunnies (ninja? 27?), who is smurf and why should we lynch him?
YKZ is smurf.
And at first, I just put him on the list to get conversation going.
I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
Looking at these two posts, you get the impression that Bunnies is indeed suspicious of YKZ because of the claim. Bunnies later on refutes this by saying that her suspicion of YKZ had nothing to do with the VT claim, HOWEVER:
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:50 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
This post has no substance. And why would you talk down to bunny about him having limited information? Do you have less limited information?
Also, another point to why I don't like YKZ is the bolded.
He says I have limited information. How would he know that I am town?
Well, if he was mafia he would know that I am town.
So ##Vote: YKZ
Note the bolded part. It doesn't say "look, this is a really scummy thing YKZ said", it says "look, this is another point I don't like". If she didn't care about him claiming VT, why say that it was another part she didn't like? If there is something that I find null in someones filter I don't say "Hey, this is wierd". I just don't say a thing about it. And the thing is that Bunnies doesn't say anything about this untill YKZ votes her with because of the Kenpachi rule. It is therefore impossible for us to know whether she is talking the truth or not about not caring about the VT thing. Her actions in the thread does, however, indicate that this was something she cared about. Which makes me belive that all this was just a massive backpaddle by Bunnies after she got caught doing scummy stuff.
##Vote: 27ninjabunnies
Here is a very concise argument train of thought for you: YKZ claims vt 27 questions claim and in a SEPARATE post votes for "limited information" YKZ repeatedly claims that the vote is for the "vt" claim (incorrect/bad play, currently not particularly indicative of alignment) 27 states the vote is not for the claim, but for the "limited information" (lots of back and forth) but ultimately, YKZ insists that 27 is scum because of vote due to her vote due to vt claim (incorrect again while being corrected). here we consider: if YKZ were town, he would recognize his mistake and reevaluate the situation, and conclude that he was incorrect and therefore 27 is not mafia, and YKZ should unvote. However, YKZ doesn't and, therefore, YKZ has made a conscious choice to ignore corrections to his play, which is indicative of mafia.
---------------------------------------
But you should consider the magnitude of the reasoning. You are correct in sayi ng that "another" implies the vt is relevant. However, the next two sentences and the vote form an independently logical sequence of events (and the vt claim alone did not procure a vote). This implies that "limited information" is the main reason for the vote. Care about it? somewhat. Enough to merit use of Kenpachi rule? doubt it.
On June 17 2014 03:22 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:13 slOosh wrote: Hmm, not quite feeling the flaming spears of logic and justice yet.
On June 16 2014 12:46 slOosh wrote: I can see a somewhat reasonable case to be made that bunnies is not a stellar townie, but I don't see the case being made that she must be scum. Why isn't she "bad" town?
I think my most recent post demonstrates that 27nb's attention is drawn towards statements about her, rather than incriminating things I say-- even a bad townie would naturally respond to me saying things like "I lied to decieve town because I thought I could get away with it", whereas scum regardless of badness would naturally respond to me saying kenpachi rule but NOT respond to additional evidence. It's not a matter of skill, it's a matter of mindset. A townie, even a new townie (I remember being one), when thyey have a scumread on someone and that person does something really scummy, they RESPOND to it. they add it to their case. It's the natural thought process of a town player REGARDLESS of skill.
27nb is not showing this natural thought process. Look at her responses to my posts. Is she responding to things I say that are scummy or inconsistent and pointing out their inconsistency? Or is she just shouting about my first post whenever she gets the chance, and not actually trying to convince people to lynch me based on new evidence that emerges? A townie who was really tunnelled on me would LOVE to point out new scummy things I say, because he's still trying to formulate and develop a case. 27nb is always talking about me, sure, but look at WHAT she's responding to. Not the stuff a townie would.
This is always your argument. 'Not one specific town agenda and therefore mafia." There are multiple ways to play town (since you clearly claim to enjoy pretending to scumslip and most others do not).
On June 17 2014 03:48 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:40 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:33 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:28 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:21 slOosh wrote: Lazermonkey, what is the "scummy stuff" that bunnies is backpedaling from?
The quick version: 1. Bunnies says that YKZ's VT claim is wierd and that she doesn't like it. 2. Bunnies says that ANOTHER thing the she doesn't like about YKZ is his "scum slip". Bunnes votes for YKZ. 3. YKZ votes Bunnies because Kenpachi rule. 4. Bunnies claims that the VT claim wasn't a reason she voted YKZ.
4. It wasn't the MAIN reason I voted YKZ.
Okay, I'm not really interested in discussing this further with you. My goal isn't to make you confess in the thread. Its to convince the others.
It is basically that it is impossible for us to know that what you are claiming is true or not. Based on what you wrote earlier I do find it more likely that you are scum than that you are town though.
Understandable:
also ##Unvote
I know this is not going to get votes off of me, and I'm fine with that.
But YKZ's last few posts have been a bit towny, especially his read on Artansis.
I'm starting to worry we are two town fighting. I also don't want my judgement clouded by my vote on YKZ and would like to hear more from other people.
His posting has mostly been to say that town (a very specific town) would have done X but did Y and therefore mafia. Do you guys agree with this kind of arguement? Because I certainly do not. I urge you to reconsider you unvote on YKZ.
On June 17 2014 07:05 goodkarma wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
Hmm? How does it make him scum?
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
Where's the inconsistency? Leaning may not be indicative of degree of conviction, but merely the direction of it.
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
You are starting to make associations here and I don't think that's a good idea. Focus on them as individuals.
I'm not really sure what else to say here except that there's a large variance of degrees. How I see it, you have release saying "I'm leaning YKZ scum" on first quote and saying "I am unequivocally convinced YKZ is scum" on second one. Release has since posted something in disagreement, but this is what I see when looking at that post. What's more, when would town ever say "...what needs to be said to incriminate..."? That's some super-scummy wording. Town looks to determine who's scum, not to make someone look like scum.
Further, when thinking back on my own games the way Release has posted is almost exactly how I handled my first mafia game. I posted a huge case on an easy target then AFK'ed, only posting when I felt I had to. Looking at a few of his past games (when he was town), he had a much easier to follow flow with his posts. Every post in this game feels very calculated, and given how I personally liked to post in previous games as scum, it's easy for me to see how as an insecure newbie scum he would feel inclined to stack as much together as he could into a few very carefully planted posts.
Incriminate: " To cause to appear guilty of a crime or fault; implicate" I believe that YKZ is guilty of a crime of fault, but others do not share that opinion with me. Therefore, it is my duty to convince others (you) of his guilt by causing him to appear to be guilty. I see nothing wrong with the use of the word. It is an apt choice. (would you have preferred implicate? same meaning)
OP says to reduce spam / one-liners and I play the game fitfully (about an hour each time).
On June 17 2014 07:29 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 17 2014 04:46 slOosh wrote: Yea I so I think Artanis is scum.
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
Here is his first post, top of page 8. There are many unnatural things about this post.
First is his complaining tone. We are only 5 pages in, and yet he calls it all "bullshit". It's totally out of place and unnatural.
Then he moves away from it and blames Release. Two things here. One is that he does nothing to either comment on, or figure out said "bullshit". No reads or questions on either YKZ / 27nb. Nothing to try to figure either one out. Just a straight up dismissal of the whole thing, and moving on to someone else.
Next is how he blames Release for it all. When I press him on this issue:
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
Nothing but fluff. He doesn't offer any meaningful reason why Release is scum. Look at the backpedaling. "oh yea I guess he added content. I could argue that wordiness isn't alignment null but I won't".
He doesn't really care to convince me or others why he finds Release scum. He just wants to put his vote somewhere to look like he is contributing.
He dodges the question the first time around so I ask him again:
On June 17 2014 03:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:17 slOosh wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
How is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He's the perpetrator of the conversation continuing about that specific topic.
Ridiculous. Release is trying to make sense of the debacle, and Artanis is overexaggerating, blaming him for "perpetrating" this "bullshit", while making no effort to either figure out the YKZ / bunnies thing himself, nor make clear how Release is scum for it. Just vague handwaving and avoiding the biggest discussion topic at the time.
Artanis is unnatural, Artanis is apathetic, Artanis is scum.
##Vote Artanis[Xp]
I think this post makes slOosh scum. DETAILS AT ELEVEN!!!
Really? Because he has been the one asking clarifying questions, obviously with a purpose behind them. That fits townie agenda of forwarding the game in my book.
Currently, I feel confident in SloOsh and Lazer as town for candid presentation of information and quetions. I feel that 27nb is town but to a lesser extent. I feel confident in YKZ as mafia.
I have 100% corrected you and you did not respond to me at all. You had two main points in your first post. 1. Bunnies connection with YKZ's VT claim. 2. "limited information".
I questioned you about the VT claim and even after going back to check yourself you still reported false information. Then i said you were still wrong and you still have not responding. You are not even following your own guidelines to not look like scum.
Also this "limited information" this has a detail we all missed. I have never read anywhere in the rules where you have to read your role pm before starting play. Obviously u should (have to?) before day one ends. So we all had "equal info" unless we assume someone has read his role pm. It seems like a weird tactic but i still believe this "limited information" thing has very little value.
So one of the two things your first post was based on was just wrong and you still did not correct it. The other thing has very little value in my opinion.
I am leaning pretty hard to vote for you. Especially when two people have posted how your post had such a great timing.
Also i would really like to hear from oats and hear more for the world cup watcher.
Mafia is so chill that they are not even coming after me. *stretch* Looks like the game is about to start. You guys got to ask yo selves, who loves Chez?
On June 18 2014 07:35 27ninjabunnies wrote: I am definitely not active. Sorry. Could give you a million excuses as to why, but Im pretty sure you don't gaf.
Basically, family issues. Pretty bad things happened last night. Won't get into it.
But I am back. Let me read up on the last few pages I have missed. If there is anything specific you want me to look at, I'll keep this page open and answer questions as I go along.
On June 18 2014 07:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I can't lynch you though, I've already said that in my first post. Ninjabunnies is looking scummy enough that I can justify it too!
On June 18 2014 07:46 VisceraEyes wrote: Okay so GK agrees with me about basically everything all day, then decides that I'm a good lynch at the end of the day. Yeah, good luck guys.
On June 18 2014 07:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I can't lynch you though, I've already said that in my first post. Ninjabunnies is looking scummy enough that I can justify it too!
Operation Yes Sire Cave tomorrow?
Remind me what this operation entails, I've forgotten the code.
It is something that cannot be done today. The many characters lead to one.
I'm sorry for not spamming the thread enough. I have been pretty busy. The Sheriff wants me to spam the thread more, because I was violating his policy by not spamming enough. I am saying all this to say that I may or may not have been roleblocked.
On June 20 2014 01:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Is anyone else wondering why Goodkarma got shot over slOosh? I think slOosh is townread by more people and had a more active role.
Also, Snickers, are you calling 27nb scum?
Yesterday, I was thinking that if they didn't kill slOosh tonight, he might be mafia. He was one of the only one playing Day 1.
On June 19 2014 10:39 slOosh wrote: Chezinu, operation Yes Sire Cave may need to be put on hold, as I believe a spy has infiltrated our ranks! Is this true?
Do this mean we are going to perform operation Eel Ears?
The Sheriff is watching. We must act in disguise in order not to be shotgunned. If we say the wrong things The Sheriff will kill us. Sorry for wasting your time, The Sheriff demands it.
On June 19 2014 10:39 slOosh wrote: Chezinu, operation Yes Sire Cave may need to be put on hold, as I believe a spy has infiltrated our ranks! Is this true?
Do this mean we are going to perform operation Eel Ears?
The Sheriff is watching. We must act in disguise in order not to be shotgunned. If we say the wrong things The Sheriff will kill us. Sorry for wasting your time, The Sheriff demands it.
Chez you seem reticent this game, even for you. Can you hook us up with some actual content? I'd even settle for Chez content (content shrouded in mystery and intrigue) over what I'm presently getting from you.
I'm sorry once again, I am being for to write such nonsense. The Sheriff demands it. There were whispers from The Sheriff yesterday. I must follow The Sheriff's command if I don't want to die.
On June 19 2014 10:39 slOosh wrote: Chezinu, operation Yes Sire Cave may need to be put on hold, as I believe a spy has infiltrated our ranks! Is this true?
Do this mean we are going to perform operation Eel Ears?
The Sheriff is watching. We must act in disguise in order not to be shotgunned. If we say the wrong things The Sheriff will kill us. Sorry for wasting your time, The Sheriff demands it.
*chzzzz*
" .... lacking funds ...."
" ... vigil on picture #300 ... possible theft by The Sheriff ..."
" ... in case of emergency .... Countermeasure: ¿Donde Romeo? ..."
*chzzzz*
Oh Loss, you are not getting it are you?
May The Sheriff spare me. See me following thy rules by creating this meaningless spam. All according to your decrees.
On June 20 2014 06:48 Snickers wrote: Yo ykz and chezinu. Care to explain how you are playing to win.
I think the only way you are playing to win is if your mafia.
You guys must get a high off of being confusing.
I was playing bad to prove the VE was mafia, but it doesn't seem like town cares about me. The mafia love me more than the town does. It is hard to lynch friends.
On June 20 2014 13:36 VisceraEyes wrote: Encryption is disallowed explicitly in the rules.
Original Message From Kurumi: It is in regards to all those sweet sites that let you encrypt your message. You can't do any of these, even basic ROT-13. Chezinu style is not banned.
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
So rumor has it, There is a guy, called Kenpachi, and at the game start, he says "hi, i am Kenpachi and i am a townie."
The first guy casting doubt on that dude is always scum, that's the "Kenpachi rule"
It's a stupid rule, and has no basis to why I am reading YKZ as scum.
On June 16 2014 10:27 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:16 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote: I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote: So ##Vote: YKZ
Kenpachi Rule
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Kenpachi rule?
The Kenpachi rule, named after its author Kenpachi, is a TL adage reflecting the idea that without a clear and better motivation for a vote, it is almost certainly a scumtell when a player votes a player who claimed VT at the start of the game.
Kenpachi's rule, in broader form, is:
Without a blantant display of humor, a vote on a vt claim comes almost always from a scum player.
The core of Kenpachi rule is that a vt claim by its nature is not suspicious to a town player, who isn't hunting for blues. Without a clear motivation for a vt claim, it looks odd to scum, who want to attack someone safely. A corollary of the Kenpachi rule is the reverse phenomenon: the first vt claim is almost always sincere.
These definitions don't exactly match up...
You can search it on TL for urself, but it's not about claiming townie, as 27ninjabunnies asserts. The rule is about claiming vanilla townie. Basicly, scum want to jump on something, and a VT claim looks basicly not intresting to a townie who isn't hunting for blues. It looks unique though to someone who is hunting for blues: scum.
But knowing all of this, couldn't you say you're VT regardless of alignment, bait someone's suspicion and then claim Kenpachi rule?
I'm having trouble understanding why at the very start of the game scum would be more prone to jumping on something that looks scummy. I mean if scum's job is to blend in, why be the first to vote and make a case? There's always scrutiny that comes with doing so...
Hello there my friend,
I believe The Sheriff wants to speak with you out back. Oh and don't forget to bring your weapon.
The People's Committee has decided. 27ninjabunnies had a short walk with the Sheriff, confessing her sins. Burning dolls, stealing change from the laundromats, eating pie before it was cool. Nothing bad. Was it all? + Show Spoiler +
27ninjabunnies the Vanilla Townie has died to lynch!
It was eerily quiet during the night. People were trying to have quick naps to offset the stress. It was late into the night when a crow cawed. Many people were woken up by the strange noise of a bird well regarded as Devil's eyes on Earth. People were very slowly gathering at the Village Hall in the morning.
goodkarma the Vanilla Townie was found dead. His eyes and mouth were full of terror. He was lying on his back under the blanket. Smell of sulfur was noticeable.
You have 48 hours to decide who gets lynched.
What have I become?.. My dearest friend Everyone I know goes away in the end And you can have it all My empire of brown I will let you down I will make you fall
Beneath The Sheriff's shotgun Full of fragmented thoughts I cannot repair Beneath The Sheriff's barrel The colors disappear You are someone else I am still right here
What have I become?.. My dearest friend Everyone I know goes away in the end And you can have it all My empire of brown I will let you down I will make you fall
If I could start again, in a new world I would whisper to someone else I would fine a way..
On June 21 2014 01:41 VisceraEyes wrote: Plz lynch BH or mderg thx. Consolidation ftw. slOosh disappearing makes me sad. We had much to discuss.
Chezinu voting for me is confusing. Make him tell you why he's doing it. Lazermonkey and Snickers are disappeared too. But hey, at least I'm back and posting and townie as fuck right?
Thank Sinatra for Day 1. It really spoke to me. But today is a new day. We know we were reserved for this world. We know Chez was loved much this game. Especially by the Mafia. Never has the Mafia interacted so peacefully with Chezinu Day 1. They know. You know, the Chezinu Rule. Who loves Chez?
Who leads in the shadows? The ashamed. Who leads in the light? The righteous.
I look into your eyes and ask, do you love me? My dearest friend, what have I become? The Sheriff demands bloodshed. Day 1 you were spared. But at what cost? All the dead bodies.. all those bunnies... All good karma is dead...
But I am not leaving you... As I have also spoken to the sheriff.
Let us go together. What does it matter if we win the whole world, but lose our style?
The "conflicts" of Sinatra and Yes Sire Cave were adorable. As there are friendships disguised as conflicts. There are conflicts disguised as friendships. Recently The Sheriff called me a qtpie... and <3,ed me... But I know what it really means. He threaten to kill me... He may talk sweet, but when I see the barrel, all else changes.
So here I am, my dearest friend. Standing with you, together we will face the sheriff. Will we die together? Or will The Sheriff shoot one us of first. It is all up to The Sheriff. The Mastermind behind it all. Who can stop The Sheriff?
I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
On June 21 2014 07:15 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I'm still on the market for lynching Koshi. A triple lynch today would be nice honestly.
Do you know why VE thinks release and sloosh are town?
I can tell from the way he's interacted with slOosh in his filter why he does. He's also made it explicit why he likes Release. I'm not sure how he got the initial reads of me being towny and those two being scummy though as he flipped all three of those reads throughout the day in a very linear fashion, but I'm willing to scribble that up to not reading properly the first time around.
Are you afraid of what people will think about you and slOosh after the flip?
On June 21 2014 07:22 YouKnowZhou wrote: Chezinu, I have a question for you about Snickers. What do you think of the most recent case posted against him by Release, and what do you think about Snickers explicitly leaving the thread and declining to contribute for the rest of the day?
Also, I'm having trouble finding a mention of my case on mderg in your filter. Can you point me towwards it, or offer some input?
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
I know, but I consider him to have replaced in at the 27nb lynch. He didn't really have time to formulate reads or do anything D1. After D2 ends, then he's fair game, but that's just the policy I roll with. It works. It could entirely be true that Koshi is scum, but on the whole it makes sense to not lynch people for a full cycle after they get in, and that doesn't mean "not lynch him until 3 hours before the end of the day, then lynch him" because that's BSey. The point is, the guy gets a free pass on a lynch for one day. I understand you disagree, but don't worry, Koshi isn't getting lynched today anyways. Once I'm gone, who will oppose you?
On June 21 2014 07:22 YouKnowZhou wrote: Chezinu, I have a question for you about Snickers. What do you think of the most recent case posted against him by Release, and what do you think about Snickers explicitly leaving the thread and declining to contribute for the rest of the day?
Also, I'm having trouble finding a mention of my case on mderg in your filter. Can you point me towwards it, or offer some input?
On June 21 2014 07:08 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
I know, but I consider him to have replaced in at the 27nb lynch. He didn't really have time to formulate reads or do anything D1. After D2 ends, then he's fair game, but that's just the policy I roll with. It works. It could entirely be true that Koshi is scum, but on the whole it makes sense to not lynch people for a full cycle after they get in, and that doesn't mean "not lynch him until 3 hours before the end of the day, then lynch him" because that's BSey. The point is, the guy gets a free pass on a lynch for one day. I understand you disagree, but don't worry, Koshi isn't getting lynched today anyways. Once I'm gone, who will oppose you?
Why would I read cases? Who do you think I am?
super duper chezinu tier tldr
mderg's first post is a bunch of relevant townreads. he votes a townread in that post, 27nb.
On June 21 2014 07:22 YouKnowZhou wrote: Chezinu, I have a question for you about Snickers. What do you think of the most recent case posted against him by Release, and what do you think about Snickers explicitly leaving the thread and declining to contribute for the rest of the day?
Also, I'm having trouble finding a mention of my case on mderg in your filter. Can you point me towwards it, or offer some input?
On June 21 2014 07:08 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
I know, but I consider him to have replaced in at the 27nb lynch. He didn't really have time to formulate reads or do anything D1. After D2 ends, then he's fair game, but that's just the policy I roll with. It works. It could entirely be true that Koshi is scum, but on the whole it makes sense to not lynch people for a full cycle after they get in, and that doesn't mean "not lynch him until 3 hours before the end of the day, then lynch him" because that's BSey. The point is, the guy gets a free pass on a lynch for one day. I understand you disagree, but don't worry, Koshi isn't getting lynched today anyways. Once I'm gone, who will oppose you?
Why would I read cases? Who do you think I am?
super duper chezinu tier tldr
mderg's first post is a bunch of relevant townreads. he votes a townread in that post, 27nb.
what do you think of mderg
mderg is bad
okay. snickers does the same thing, but with nullreads. then he votes and peaces out of the thread d2.
On June 21 2014 07:55 mderg wrote: I can definitely get behind a Snickers lynch. Since VE is will not be lynched today my vote on him would just be wasted. I don´t want bh to be lynched either because I had a townread on him and, he´s not as townie to me anymore but he is driving discussion forward. Snickers on the other hand I´ve found suspicious for some time. The case Release made is also bringing up some good points. This seems like a way better lynch than bh.
On June 21 2014 08:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote: mderg, does the fact that no one other than Chezinu scumread VE after his case on you not give you pause to re-evaluate VE's lynch or ask questions about why other people aren't scumreading him? Why do you not care about your main scumread getting lynched and only drop in to vote for an easy lynch on Snickers now?
On June 21 2014 08:20 YouKnowZhou wrote: So I don't WANT to lynch VE, but right now if I don't vote him, I'm gonna get lynched. Can we please consolidate onto mderg or snickers?
This panic means that either YouKnowZhou is town or VE and himself are both scum.
PS: VE YouKnowZhou loves you, why you hatin on him?
On June 21 2014 07:55 mderg wrote: I can definitely get behind a Snickers lynch. Since VE is will not be lynched today my vote on him would just be wasted. I don´t want bh to be lynched either because I had a townread on him and, he´s not as townie to me anymore but he is driving discussion forward. Snickers on the other hand I´ve found suspicious for some time. The case Release made is also bringing up some good points. This seems like a way better lynch than bh.
On June 21 2014 08:43 Chezinu wrote: mderg, if you are special - now is the time to say it. If your just a regular townie, now is the time to accept your fate.
or... he's scum?
but but I want to see a funny roleclaim!!! That is one of the made reasons to play mafia. To make up crazy roles!
On June 21 2014 08:56 VisceraEyes wrote: It's strong enough to lynch him over other people Artanis, that's about as certain as I can be. Same with mderg, but as I said before the people I'm townreading are more inclined to lynch BH. The difference between this lynch and the last was A) I wasn't around in the waning hours of the day last cycle and B) I'm not SUPER TOWN on the opposing wagon this cycle, in fact the opposite.
So you have a townread on SloOsh and Snickers, the other two voters on my wagon?
On June 21 2014 08:56 VisceraEyes wrote: It's strong enough to lynch him over other people Artanis, that's about as certain as I can be. Same with mderg, but as I said before the people I'm townreading are more inclined to lynch BH. The difference between this lynch and the last was A) I wasn't around in the waning hours of the day last cycle and B) I'm not SUPER TOWN on the opposing wagon this cycle, in fact the opposite.
So you have a townread on SloOsh and Snickers, the other two voters on my wagon?
Release was on you earlier, that's who I was referring to.
And now he's not. Now he's voting WITH me. And yeah, Sloosh you like, but you think snickers is scum
On June 21 2014 08:48 VisceraEyes wrote: Specifically I like slOosh and Release on your wagon and I disliked Snickers and you on the mderg wagon. I'm not really reading Koshi as supertown yet which concerns me, but I dislike him less than I dislike you and Snickers.
So what's the deal VE? Why me over mderg? Or are your explanations as fallacious as your timing?
If you're willing to extend to me the courtesy of assuming I'm town for a moment, let me explain what this lynch looked like to me.
It looked like I had caught scum and finally forced town to accept it. You were hedghing your bets, calling both me and mderg scum. If you are in fact scum, this isn't a bad move. Now, things are close and it looks like you could get me lynched instead of your scumbuddy, so you vote me. You need a good reason, so you say you like the people on my wagon better. When I say "okay, fine, I'm getting lynched, let's interact a bit beforehand so I can develop reads and leave something for town", everyone interacts with me, except you, who snaps at me and goes afk.
Now, finally I manage to convince people to lynch mderg. After it becomes clear my life is no longer in danger, you return to the thread and respond to my questions. You can no longer afford to just ignore me until the lynch deadline. Then, when I ask you about your vote on me, you talk about the people on my wagon. 1 of the 2 people you had a townread on is now voting with me instead of against me, and of the 2 people left, one of them is Snickers, on whom you have a scumread.
And yet your vote stays on me.
What this looks like to me is a poorly rationalized vote on the counterwagon to a scumbuddy. I think you were trying to defend mderg, kill me, and ignore my attempts to form reads until the lynch ended and I was dead. Then, when I turned things around, you came back to do damage control. It looks to me like you're scum with mderg. You had him pegged as scum and voted me instead of him, which would have been fine since you had me for scum, but your reasoning didn't add up, and your timing was very, very oppotunistic.
So here's my question for you, VE. Do you see how I, as town, perceive this? What is your response to the issues I've raised in this post, issues to which you didn't respond in the previous post I raised them in?
Oh and don't forget that unlike you. VE loves me. That's why I'm confirmed town and mafia love me.
On June 21 2014 12:51 VisceraEyes wrote: Snickers is now probably town. But if he posts anymore I might reverse that read.
Care to elaborate?
If he posts too much, I'm not going to read it. Actually, I not going to read it anyways. Big blocks of text is indicative of mafia. Don't you know almost every behavior can be linked to a mafia play? Well, if you are mafia - you better not waste people's time... too much. You got to get people to love you. For example, Everyone loves Chezinu. No one wants to lynch Chezinu. Mafia don't want to shoot Chezinu. Uh oh... Mafia beware, If you shoot me... There will be mourning! wait.. it all makes sense now.. I have spoken to The Sheriff. Everyone else who has spoken to The Sheriff has died... Am I the chosen one? Little oh chez? Who am I kidding? Chezinu has always been the best! ... but what if that ends here... What if mafia kill me to spite me? What if they try and fulfill the prophecy and kill Chez tonight to secure the lynch of VE? Then.. Chezinu would get shot first..
The truth about brown. Brown is simply red and green all the time. In fact there are many different types of brown. Brown is in its true sense dirty. To understand what I mean, let us examine the color brown in terms of RGB (red,green,blue). If all of red, green, and blue are of equal value - you get grey. The extremes being black and white. Brown is a mix and uneven mixture. But what it contains is a mystery. That which our eyes fail to see. If you were to zoom in on grey.. you will see ones in zeros.. tons of black and white situations that are evenly distributed. All those white situation are display a maximum amount of red, green, blue -- where black shows no of it. So a gray issue is in reality quite easily discernible to one with a sharp eye that can zoom in to see the contrast. Brown... from far away we have the same issue as the gray issue. but this time when we zoom in... it is a mystery! We can't expect to see a uniform distribution of black and white. For the RGB is displayed in different intensities. Brown could be red + green, orange + blue, or yellow + purple. But one thing is for sure about brown, you need all colors. You see, in truth.. every green has a bit of blue in it. For green is blue + yellow. orange is red + yellow, and purple is red + blue... BUT WAIT!!! This system seems to be base on red, yellow, and blue instead of red, green, and blue. We are now talking about mixing paint instead of mixing light. With paint mixing colors leads to darkness whereas mixing light leads to brightness. Absorbing versus reflecting is the key. But let us not stray too far from our discussion of the brown. Brown is mysterious for you never know what to expect until you zoom in. Will red be dominate in the RYB (case red+green) or will yellow (purple + yellow), or blue (case orange +blue). So in RYB one primary has to stand twice as tall as the other primaries to make it brown. So next time you face a gray issue, you will know it is truly a uniform display of black and white. But Brown... That is a mystery full of surprises.
Too sum everything up, huge blocks of text can be quite intimidating. If you write too much, many will miss your key points. Especially if you are cryptic in your writing using code numbers like snickers. But as for catching mafia, it is a brown issue. You never know what type of mafia you are hunting down, as the personalities of people are quite brown and require dedication to unlock the mysteries. If you want to understand more about personalities I recommend reading a book called Please Understand Me.
On June 18 2014 07:35 27ninjabunnies wrote: I am definitely not active. Sorry. Could give you a million excuses as to why, but Im pretty sure you don't gaf.
Basically, family issues. Pretty bad things happened last night. Won't get into it.
But I am back. Let me read up on the last few pages I have missed. If there is anything specific you want me to look at, I'll keep this page open and answer questions as I go along.
Why do you think slOosh reordered the votes?
Speaking of votes Why did you reorder the votes?? OH WAIT!! You reordered them again today! Order matters.
On June 20 2014 01:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Is anyone else wondering why Goodkarma got shot over slOosh? I think slOosh is townread by more people and had a more active role.
Also, Snickers, are you calling 27nb scum?
Yesterday, I was thinking that if they didn't kill slOosh tonight, he might be mafia. He was one of the only one playing Day 1.
On June 22 2014 07:52 Snickers wrote: Also just calling that I am probably going to be targeted tonight.
I'm going to estimate the chance of this being similar to the chance of England winning this year's world cup.
Snickers is probably going to be targeted by... a cop check, or a vigi shot if for some reason we have one. But certainly not by scum.
No, no no no no no. Snickers is town. Cop checks or vigi shots would be wasted on him. There are much much better targets.
Honestly, if people think I'm scum it would be better if the cop would check me, were it not for peoples' opinion of me. Since I claimed VT D1, though, I'm sure this request will result in noises from the usual suspects that I'm the Godfather and I chose VT or some other ridiculousness. Even if the cop claimed just before deadline and said "bh is green" or something and then got shot and flipped cop, people would still make noises that I'm playing some kind of really long game with all kinds of amazing plans that result in all this happening. In a way, I'm gratified that people think this of my scumgame, but it is at times annoying.
This from a guy who touts his own scum game as "GODLY". Maybe that pass was premature, considering you've spent all day doing exactly what I requested you not do.
You can be next brah, I don't mind.
I remember the first time I played with BH. He was mafia and broke the Chezinu Rule. He pretty much started the rule. He couldn't even get Chezinu lynched. He got lynched btw. Unfortunately, it wasn't day one.. actually I'm a bit fuzzy on my fragmented memories..Top line, Chez win and BH broke the Chez Rule, which means he lost and got lynched before Chezinu Rule was made public.
PS: I didn't realize mderg broke the Chezinu Rule earlier.. I wasn't really reading the thread. I thought everyone loved me and failed to see his evil remark about me. Only scum think I'm confusing.
Everyone noticed that VE asked to get killed by the vigilante. In order to fulfill the prophecy the most awesomely coolest, the mafia must killed me if AND ONLY if the vigi kills VE. Don't want any doc/medics messing with VE. I also don't want to see a body armored VE. VE must be announced dead, the same time as me. For VE and I must die together!!!! If you want the most awesomely coolest prophecy to come true.
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
I'm not sure why you're confirmed town.
Cause they said so..
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
I believe I need to refresh your memory.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:11 Chezinu wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
Oh and one more think Art... VE would have died. So obv I'm town. oh wait, are you saying you protects VE last night? Trolololololo
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
I thought you loved me...
On June 22 2014 10:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:08 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
I believe I need to refresh your memory.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:11 Chezinu wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
I'm not sure why you're confirmed town.
Cause they said so..
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
I have never stated that I have a strong townread on you. I'm only mildly reading you as town because your votes have been in the right place in the end and because mderg has pushed you. You haven't really provided much so it's difficult for anyone to get a read on you, town or scum.
On June 22 2014 10:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Must have missed that.
On June 17 2014 22:37 goodkarma wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:23 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 20:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 18:21 VisceraEyes wrote: So I wrote this big post about why I think slOosh is mafia because he thinks Artanis is mafia, but then as I started picking apart slOosh's reasoning I find that I'm really not so strongly feeling townie on Artanis, and that slOosh's reasoning is as bad as it was at first glance. So I removed the bit about Artanis and frankly it's not nearly as impressive. I've included it in a spoiler because I'm still tentatively scummy on slOosh, but the crux of my argument is garbage and the rest can possibly be just me misreading slOosh's intention or whatever.
Would probably vote for slOosh if he said nothing more today, but right now I'm looking elsewhere because I don't really find my case super convincing myself. I maintain that he doesn't /feel/ town to me, but concede that it's quite possible that I'm just wrong here.
Early on his play can be categorized as asking a lot of questions. A lot of questions. This is okay I guess, if you take his probing as a means to get reads on players. However, the problem I have is that all through his filter, ne'ry is there a read on anyone involved in the early game. He can be seen defending a couple of players...which I don't find to be particularly indicative either way, but it always seems to come with an out too so meh.
Ultimately we've got:
+- Asking a lot of early questions that don't seem to go anywhere. +- Defending players before they can defend themselves. - Never gives reads on players involved in early game, in spite of interacting with many of them through various questions. - In spite of posting a fair amount, doesn't feel town
For now I want to hear what slOosh has to say before voting for him, but we'll call him my top scumread for the sake of argument.
As for other players, as always I absolutely refuse to read BH this cycle. Chez seems to be Chez, which means he'll be alive until we lynch him regardless of his alignment. I'd like to see where this Artanis/slOosh stuff goes. I'm now kinda townreading Release now that he's proven a proclivity toward verbosity in all matters. mgerg is more guilty of rehashing than Release ever was, and in a way I find to be far more scummy. I think based on his (presumably only) D1 post that he's my favorite lynch today. I find his entire post to be wishywashy and diplomatic and scummy, and considering it may be all we get from him this cycle I'm fine with lynching him.
##Vote: mderg
That´s some solid reasoning there. At least be specific in some way. Right now your case on me is basically that my post feels kinda scummy. Also I can assure you that it´s not all you get from me this cycle. "You may theoretically not post any more in this cycle, so I´m fine lynching you". Like you´re not even interested in my play and just want me lynched for starting the game a bit late. Overall a really lazy vote on me without much to back it up.
Wait a minute. If his case on you is that your posts feel kinda scummy then it makes perfect sense. If you agree with his reasoning, however, is another story.
It would make sense to read someone as scum, if his posts feel scummy. But that´s not why you vote someone. The case sucks because it´s highly subjective and has no real substance. I think making a case just based on a post feeling scummy is terrible.
It is worth mentioning that a vote on you up until you suddenly came to life was a lurker vote. Like magic, a vote is cast on you and you come alive not to pursue any of your reads, but to defend yourself.
Would you mind clarifying your read on Release? This is the point you're most wishy-washy about in your opening post. Like apparently unflipped people piling on him gives you townie vibes, while a virtually nonexistent case made by Artansis makes you think he's looking scummy? And said nonexistent case is stronger than sloosh's case? Please do explain.
This was the post that solidified my read on mderg - he mentioned something I also noticed (and mentioned actually) and he ended up dying in the night. However beyond this you're right, at the end of the day he ended up on the "mderg town" side of things. :/
Frankly the only thing I can see GK being killed for is either a busted role-hunt or to implicate me somehow (he ended up scummy on me at the end of the day). Good to know.
Yeah, I don't think he was killed because he had a strong read on mderg. He might've simply been killed because his critical thinking was strong and I did explicitly point out a strong post of his, which might've cemented his fate. His death incriminates YKZ and Release more than you, I feel, as he was on their asses for more of the game.
On June 21 2014 18:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote: No Release, I'm desperate to give someone bonus points. Now stop focussing on Snickers, he's not scum. Your attention is better suited for just about anyone that isn't me/snickers/lazer.
On June 21 2014 21:43 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 21 2014 21:14 Koshi wrote: Artanis probably meant the mderg vote. If it brought Snickers in the lead it looks pretty good for Snickers. Snickers was on mderg his ass so mderg might have gotten greedy. Mderg didnt move to bh when he could, so why move to a teammate?
I am back condemned to phone posting for today.
My fav lynch for tomorrkw is VE or lazermonkey. I agree that the vote put it him the spotlight but it was so obviously extremely strange. I dont see why town would do it.
Ding ding ding, we have a winner. I think your lynch targets are bad though. Also, the town reasoning should be obvious; he thought YKZ was more scummy than mderg, so he tried to get YKZ lynched.
Please explain like I'm 5 why Snickers (and you and lazer) were supposed to be confirmed town. Also, why lazer is no longer in such a position.
Snickers is confirmed town because Mderg delurked to vote him last minute which put him over the edge in votes. I'm confirmed town because read the game. Lazer was confirmed town because of his late vote that felt too scummy to be scum, but I'm rescinding that because other things in his filter ring some alarms that make me uncertain if that is true.
I'm going to bed now.
Good, you were getting a bit sleep deprived with your reads on me.
Operaton End FISH RIP is over! Unless you wake up feeling better about me.
On June 23 2014 08:33 Chezinu wrote: We need more drama in this thread.
##Vote VisceraEyes
"Excuse me, sir, I've been asked to deliver a package to you, from a Dr. Ama."
*Hands over brown paper box. Serial Number: 451MS. Model Number: 23UC*
Would you please sign your signature here? X: _______________
Thank you!
Have a nice day sir
Hmm, it must be Skorupi by the serial number..
It must be the answer to the ask me anything from earlier...
"Excuse me, sir, I've been asked to deliver a package to you, from a Dr. Ama."
*Hands over brown paper box. Serial Number: 451MS. Model Number: 23UC*
Would you please sign your signature here? X: _Chezinu Isunizehc__
Thank you!
Have a nice day sir
Tell the Good doctor that he is right about the lazermonkey comments. He broke the Rule and he will know which one. No one calls Chez bad over bunnies.
On June 23 2014 10:50 YouKnowZhou wrote: ._. Man don't really know how to address that cause I'm not sure what it is. I'll check out the other case on VE but chez would you mind explaining your vote a little bit more, just for old time's sake?
A surprise is coming or has it already come? There was a rolecheck last night. Don't you see it? VE and me help draws them out.
You know I love you. It's sad that you neglected to mention how VE had been spreading the lie that there were only 2 mafia this game. It is like he was saying that to cope with only have two active mafia and I thought I only trolled the hosts.
I cannot wait until the cop reveals that rolecheck from last night. Are you as excited as I am Koshi?
On June 24 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote: Why did the thread suddenly die? I quite dislike the thought of me dying ; (
Then why don't you save yourself and kills VE?
You have the power to vote.
Or you can keep VE alive and die in his place, so that VE and me can die tonight together to fullfill the prophecy! Best ending EVER!!!!
I can vote VE but since he was first at 4 votes it doesn't make much of a diference. Why do you think I am scum? Also why am I a BETTER target than say VE or Koshi.
On June 24 2014 06:54 Snickers wrote: Koshi is town because of how bad his play continual is. Look at his first scum reads as me release and somebody else because we did not vote together. He's not pushing the thread or helping much but what do you expect from a bad town player. More on this later.
You can just say: Koshi is town because his reads evolve to solving the game. Also, he is a pretty cool guy.
What do you think about VE not voting to save himself?
On June 24 2014 06:54 Snickers wrote: Koshi is town because of how bad his play continual is. Look at his first scum reads as me release and somebody else because we did not vote together. He's not pushing the thread or helping much but what do you expect from a bad town player. More on this later.
You can just say: Koshi is town because his reads evolve to solving the game. Also, he is a pretty cool guy.
What do you think about VE not voting to save himself?
On June 25 2014 08:59 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Reads Town Chezinu - The way the game has developed makes no sense for him to be mafia. There's also one comment in his filter that makes me near certain that he's town. Release - Has been pushing the game forward since the start, even though I didn't always agree with the means. Was on the right wagon for the right reasons on D2. Snickers - Flipped mafia joined a bandwagon on him at the last moment to save his own skin. slOosh - His D1 was really strong and he's asking questions and pushing the game forward rather than just his own reads. If I'm wrong on any of my town reads, I think it's slOosh though.
? Koshi - Koshi's alignment gives me headaches. In the first day he was active he actually asked a lot of questions and interacted. He's also tried engaging me when I scumread him, but the problem is that for a large part of D3 he played a very defensive game, just stating that he's town and appealing to emotion when faced with pressure. I'm torn between him and Lazermonkey. I believe that a town Koshi can show that he's town errygame. I'm not convinced he's town yet.
BH - BH's play is a complete opposite to Koshi; He played awfully on D1, then really stepped it up after antagonizing everyone on N1. Built a case on mderg and pushed him, but the problem is that he's also tunneled two townies to death. Three dead townies (VE, 27nb, goodkarma) suspected BH. BH's also known for legendary scumplay and he tried the antagonistic route first. I can see him being scum here despite everything that's happened.
Scum Lazermonkey Lazer's arguments have felt shallow for a while now. It feels like he's barely scratching the surface with his questions. He's been active yet he's never actually tried to push his targets in a meaningful manner and just ends up sheeping. His Koshi read is ill-constructed and he jumped to pressure me with slOosh, and backed off when he did as well. Lazer is my #1 candidate for scum atm.
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
I thought you loved me...
On June 22 2014 10:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:08 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
I believe I need to refresh your memory.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:11 Chezinu wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
I'm not sure why you're confirmed town.
Cause they said so..
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
Oh and one more think Art... VE would have died. So obv I'm town. oh wait, are you saying you protects VE last night? Trolololololo
Hey guys... I have more flavor than Vanilla as some of you have predicted.
OK, So this is a not so normal game. We have a busy paramedic, a regular medic, and a mafia medic. This is a game for Legendary. Cause, You Know - it has self protects.
On June 18 2014 04:24 Lazermonkey wrote: Mderg is just... Look through this part of his first post for example.
On June 17 2014 09:11 mderg wrote:
SNIP
The whole thing with YKZ and bunnies is really strange. It feels like they´re both wrong, bunnies more so thab YKZ, though. I don´t think bunnies case was well substantiated at all, scumslips just almost never happen in forum mafia. I also don´t think the Kenpachi rule is as foolproof as YKZ said. It has some solid reasoning behind it but claiming that it always works seems stupid. They´ve kinda been repeating themselves quite often, so there´s not that much to get from this.
I think YKZ is town because of the follow up on bunnies
On June 16 2014 12:30 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:16 slOosh wrote: Alright, let's cut it out with the "Kenpachi Rule" and associated nomenclature. It isn't immediately clear to everyone and is muddling up the discussion.
Let's get this straight.
Bunnies, you think YKZ is scum because of the phrase "limited information"? His post paraphrased as "I'm not listening to you because you are town"?
YKZ, you think bunnies is scum for her initial call out of your post "I'm vt"?
Please try to be a bit more clear with your posts please.
Look at all the scummy stuff I've posted since my original post. Any real townie would be all over me for things like "I'm allowed to lie" and my blanatant lying etc but all YKZ is on is my OG post because he is scum. Any real townie would be all up on dis, think about it
I don´t think scum would so blatantly say that he acted scummy and someone should have pointed it out. This feels like a trap made by town. He´s also claimed vt early on which I find weird but unlikely to be scum play.
So I think out of bunnies and YKZ only bunnies can really be scum. It certainly is possible. Especially the heavy focus on YKZ´s "scumslip" seems suspicious. Not calling out YKZ´s scummy posts is not really alignment indicative. Not immediately noticing things that might look scummy to some can happen as both alignments. I also dislike how she agrees with Artanis that Release is scummy but doesn´t think he´s scum because she wants to be right about YKZ and her association read.
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
SNIP
##vote 27ninjabunnies
So his logic is something like this: 1. Since YKZ are battling each other they cannot both be scum. 2. And YKZ is probably town (for some really wierd reasoning). 3. Its possible that Bunnies is scum, points out several stuff that Bunnies that is alignment unindicative. 4. Dislikes that Bunnies says that Release is scummy but doesn't want him to be scum. This is like the only part that makes sense.
Then he proceeds to vote him. This vote is so out of place that I cannot even describe it with words. Pointing out several things that he even himself says isn't alignment indicative is just unnecessary. Yes, he said he disliked one of Bunnies posts. But he also said that he disliked Snickers and Release posting. Why vote Bunnies? Because it was the current wagon?
This shit just seem to careless to be scum. You don't see scum posting posts liek this because that's all scum care about, looking good. I'm calling bad town here.
##Unvote
My logic was different. I never said that they cannot both be scum. I also didn´t point out several things out that were alignment unindicative, it was one point made by YKZ that I don´t think is actually scummy. The things I didn´t like about her were the focus on the "scumslip" by YKZ, the thing about Release and townreading Artanis. Clearly more things that I think are scummy than things not alignment indicative.
The thing(s) I pointed out that weren´t alignment indicative were points brought up by YKZ which I didn´t really agree with. That´s the reason for bringing it up.
I think you´re "defending" me for the wrong reasons.
On June 17 2014 09:11 mderg wrote: I almost forgot about this due to the world cup
The whole thing with YKZ and bunnies is really strange. It feels like they´re both wrong, bunnies more so thab YKZ, though. I don´t think bunnies case was well substantiated at all, scumslips just almost never happen in forum mafia. I also don´t think the Kenpachi rule is as foolproof as YKZ said. It has some solid reasoning behind it but claiming that it always works seems stupid. They´ve kinda been repeating themselves quite often, so there´s not that much to get from this.
I think YKZ is town because of the follow up on bunnies
On June 16 2014 12:30 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:16 slOosh wrote: Alright, let's cut it out with the "Kenpachi Rule" and associated nomenclature. It isn't immediately clear to everyone and is muddling up the discussion.
Let's get this straight.
Bunnies, you think YKZ is scum because of the phrase "limited information"? His post paraphrased as "I'm not listening to you because you are town"?
YKZ, you think bunnies is scum for her initial call out of your post "I'm vt"?
Please try to be a bit more clear with your posts please.
Look at all the scummy stuff I've posted since my original post. Any real townie would be all over me for things like "I'm allowed to lie" and my blanatant lying etc but all YKZ is on is my OG post because he is scum. Any real townie would be all up on dis, think about it
I don´t think scum would so blatantly say that he acted scummy and someone should have pointed it out. This feels like a trap made by town. He´s also claimed vt early on which I find weird but unlikely to be scum play.
So I think out of bunnies and YKZ only bunnies can really be scum. It certainly is possible. Especially the heavy focus on YKZ´s "scumslip" seems suspicious. Not calling out YKZ´s scummy posts is not really alignment indicative. Not immediately noticing things that might look scummy to some can happen as both alignments. I also dislike how she agrees with Artanis that Release is scummy but doesn´t think he´s scum because she wants to be right about YKZ and her association read.
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
It also feels like townreading Artanis is some kind of "You´re scumreading me, so I´ll townread you".
I think Snickers has been posting strangely. As if he wanted to play the newbie card without stating that he´s new. His general thought process doesn´t show a scum mindset, though. I didn´t really like where he talked about associations between bunnies and VKZ. IMO pre-flip associations are bad most of the time.
Release had a not so perfect entrance to this thread. At first glance his case on YKZ seemed good but it basically comes down to the few points bunnies has made on YKZ and that he stuck to the Kenpachi rule for so long. That´s not very much considering the length of his posts. What kinda speaks in his favor is how suddenly several people jumped on him after Artanis made his case on him. Still kinda neutral on him, maybe a bit scummy.
I´m having a townread on sloosh right now. Mainly because his posting feels different from Detention where we were scum together. He´s asking questions and seems to be trying to get behind the reasons from the others.
I think Artanis´case on Release made sense but slooshs case on him also made sense even though it´s not that strong. The fact that he almost completely ignored the back and forth between YKZ and bunnies is slightly suspicious. But it´s true that the back and forth was repetitive and I don´t think there was anything that´s really scummy in it. I agree with his reason for scumreading bunnies, it´s something I´m also sumreading her for. Slight townread on him.
Not much on the others, yet. I´ll hopefully post more tomorrow.
##vote 27ninjabunnies
Yea it seems really strange that you are only leaning towards somebody and you vote for them. Saying that you are not 100% sure you will return to the game to reevaluate the situation. It would be terrible for a town to vote for someone with only about half the information we have. Then say he may not change it until the lynch. So you were leaning towards bunnies but felt she was scum enough that if you did not make it to a computer she could be lynched because of this vote.
##Unvote
##Vote mderg
I still think Release is scum but I am more confident that mderg is at this time. Also we have to consolidate our posts and i think it would be easier for people to see this slip. Also more people on mderg atm than release.
I was pretty heavily leaning scum on bunnies, so voting her seems logical, doesn´t it? I was also pretty sure that I´d be here today, just not how much time I could invest. Your reasoning that she could be lynched because of this one vote is flawed. Even in the case that I could not get to a computer today placing the vote would have been the correct choice. Taking the risk that bunnies is potentially mislynched when I think she´s more likely scum than town is better than risk being modkilled.
On June 18 2014 01:34 mderg wrote: I generally don´t ask that many direct questions, I rather point things out that I find strange and most of the time people respond to these things. So it should have about the same effect as asking questions.
Just scrolled through your Cell Mini (Town) and Detention (Mafia) games. You actually asked a lot more questions as mafia. Interesting.
Carry on.
EBWOP
What do you take from this, though?
Also, what the hell is it with Chezinu? He doesn´t even try to make sense.
On June 21 2014 07:22 YouKnowZhou wrote: Chezinu, I have a question for you about Snickers. What do you think of the most recent case posted against him by Release, and what do you think about Snickers explicitly leaving the thread and declining to contribute for the rest of the day?
Also, I'm having trouble finding a mention of my case on mderg in your filter. Can you point me towwards it, or offer some input?
On June 21 2014 07:08 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
I know, but I consider him to have replaced in at the 27nb lynch. He didn't really have time to formulate reads or do anything D1. After D2 ends, then he's fair game, but that's just the policy I roll with. It works. It could entirely be true that Koshi is scum, but on the whole it makes sense to not lynch people for a full cycle after they get in, and that doesn't mean "not lynch him until 3 hours before the end of the day, then lynch him" because that's BSey. The point is, the guy gets a free pass on a lynch for one day. I understand you disagree, but don't worry, Koshi isn't getting lynched today anyways. Once I'm gone, who will oppose you?
Why would I read cases? Who do you think I am?
super duper chezinu tier tldr
mderg's first post is a bunch of relevant townreads. he votes a townread in that post, 27nb.
On June 17 2014 05:58 27ninjabunnies wrote: Chez, Artanis, care to share your thoughts?
I thought of a bunch of bunnies getting shotgunned by the sheriff when sleeping through your conversations.
Go ahead if one must.
Probably clear up a lot of information for town.
In my dreams! As you are totally not getting the picture here, let me draw you the picture of my dream:
**CENSORED -- DISTURBING IMAGES -- CENSORED**
Not sure if you want me dead, or want to have sex with me.
Both are quite disturbing images.
So yeah, not getting the picture here.
Well, Chezinu is Chezinu. But I think he wants to kill you.
On June 19 2014 04:39 Lazermonkey wrote: If I understand it correctly, this is how Chezinu always plays. How the fuck are we suposed to get a decent read of him if the only thing he ever posts is riddles and votes? Him voting for Bunnies makes him look quite bad.
On June 19 2014 06:20 Lazermonkey wrote: Well, going to bed now.
I'm probably going to be less active the comming 2-3 days. But for now
VE and Koshi are my top scum reads. I'm giving Koshi a minor benefit of the doubt because he entered the game yesterday.
I think Snickers is a confused townie. I could be wrong about this but since I feel that there is a certain possibility that he will get lynched tomorrow and I urge everyone to question what his motives really are.
Mderg I'm uncertain on. Leaning confused town here as well.
On June 21 2014 03:09 VisceraEyes wrote: Do duo something with it Chez.
ok, lazermonkey is scum. I did something!
On June 24 2014 05:15 Koshi wrote: How hard can this be. There are still 5 people in the running for scum. BH/Release/Artanis look town. Or shot not be considered for the mderg lynch today. Artanis is a little fucker but who cares. Snickers/VE/Lazermonkey/Chezinu/SloOsh are left.
Snickers can be excused due to mderg filter. Very unlikely that he is scum with mderg. Not a good lynch. Chezinu is Chezinu and was on mderg. I guess we have a doc and not a cop so that's unfortunate but even then I wouldn't lynch Chezinu because he isn't harmful to town in any way. He isn't pushing an agenda he is just being around.
VE is away on the wrong moments, pushes scum but then doesn't vote scum, can't be tied to anybody in case he flips scum because his reads are all neutral, and is currently just showing activity. Lazermonkey is just trying to get me lynched. Even when his top scumreads were SloOsh and VE he was pushing me the hardest. Look at D2, he just came in to push me while IGNORING the mderg/BH wagons. I am pretty sure that scumtactics were to get BH lynched (who was main candidate back then) and then myself.
On June 20 2014 19:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote: BH, I'm not a newbie player. I know that similarities does not necessarily mean the same alignment, but previous games can give you insights into their mind. Particularly a scum qt can be enlightening. It told me mderg is someone that thinks before he posts as scum, which is a point against him being scum this game.
I'm not up for a mderg lynch at this point in time. I am up for a Koshi lynch though. ##Unvote ##Vote Koshi
This is also a good point brought up. Everyone that is voting mderg should explain why they vote him very very clearly and why the reason you vote him makes him scum. Explain how that action isn't likely to have come out of a newbie town player also.
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
All these posts indicate that Lazermonkey is actually following the thread. Nowhere it looks like he is lagging behind so he can't give an opinion on Mderg/BH. Clearly it was a choice from Lazermonkey to not comment on it. Why not? Because BH was going to get lynched and Lazermonkey was setting up the next misslynch. That's why. There is enough time between these posts to catch up with the thread. Are you going to believe he just came in once an hour and just looked at my filter and pushes me? Why wouldn't scum be superlazy on D2 with BH playing suicidal?
btw, looking in Lazermonkies filter I think VE is town. reasons: 1) Lazermonkies case on D3 is based on VE not defending bunnies enough D1. Knowing that Lazermonkey wasn't "able" to follow the game D2/N2 it is pretty insane he remembered all this from D1. ScumMonkey however could have planned this case as soon as bunnies was lynched D1. 2) As soon as I moved off LM and on VE today LM called me sensible. This means he got a pretty strong scumread on VE right? But as soon as VE enters the thread with null posts LM seems to have VE as town and starts to push Koshi/SloOsh. This could be because they are scumbuddies but could just as easily be because townVE was in the thread and is more active and has more influance than SloOsh and me.
On June 26 2014 05:49 Snickers wrote: Ok so why is chezinu cop. And why do Lazermonkey and name dropper rhyme with double standard but chunky and whopper do not rhyme with each other.
On June 26 2014 05:51 Snickers wrote: Lazer if u want to look town to me, look at the questions sloosh ask during day one and analyze them. He asks ykz and me and somebody else about reads. They could be pointless though and just attempts to look townie. I do not have a computer to reference them to the rest of the thread.
He knows he got checked, so don't expect much of a response.
On June 26 2014 05:51 Snickers wrote: Lazer if u want to look town to me, look at the questions sloosh ask during day one and analyze them. He asks ykz and me and somebody else about reads. They could be pointless though and just attempts to look townie. I do not have a computer to reference them to the rest of the thread.
He knows he got checked, so don't expect much of a response.
Waitwat. Did you really check me? What did you get for result?
On June 26 2014 05:51 Snickers wrote: Lazer if u want to look town to me, look at the questions sloosh ask during day one and analyze them. He asks ykz and me and somebody else about reads. They could be pointless though and just attempts to look townie. I do not have a computer to reference them to the rest of the thread.
He knows he got checked, so don't expect much of a response.
Waitwat. Did you really check me? What did you get for result?
Mafia obv.
Que? Weren't you a cop? I mean the one that checks roles?
On June 26 2014 05:51 Snickers wrote: Lazer if u want to look town to me, look at the questions sloosh ask during day one and analyze them. He asks ykz and me and somebody else about reads. They could be pointless though and just attempts to look townie. I do not have a computer to reference them to the rest of the thread.
He knows he got checked, so don't expect much of a response.
Waitwat. Did you really check me? What did you get for result?
Mafia obv.
Que? Weren't you a cop? I mean the one that checks roles?
Yup. The good medic be deads.
But you only get back roles, not alignments. As cop that is.
Release, I know I haven't talked to you directly all game. But I have something very important to ask you. Why do you think there is a roleblocker in this game?
On June 26 2014 06:51 Lazermonkey wrote: I actually urge you to look at SlOosh filter. I mean, Also look at my filter and look for stuff about SlOosh. Even if you are 100% sure I'm scum you still need to figure out the other scum. I've explained several times why I think he is scum already, including:
- Defends mderg alot. Yet he gives very weak/no reasoning on why he is defending mderg. It boils down to him saying that he doesn't like the mderg lynch.
- ALL of his major pushes has been on people that are town (Artanis, VE, Bunnies, me) except for YKZ. And since I think YKZ supertown, this also implies that SlOosh has only really pushed town this game. I'm aware of the fact that you don't know my alignment nor do you know YKZ's alignment but keep this point in mind when I flip since this should also increase your townread on YKZ.
- Is very eager to vote YKZ over me D3. Yet now he completly drops his read on YKZ to focus only on me. Isn't this convenient given that I am the number 1 lynch target?
I'd also like to point out, once again, that I think Release's reason for thinking that SlOosh is town is BS. While asking question IS good, it is very non-commital. Telling people to stop creating chaos is also good but once again, non-commital.
Look LM what I'm trying to get at here is that if you're dead anyways, let's just make the best of it. I still think you have a decent chance of flipping town, but let's be real here: there's a red check on you. You have to be lynched. So I'm not 100% sure you're scum, but I *am* 100% sure you're getting lynched today. The first step to being productive with the next 24 hours is going to be you accepting that you're getting lynched and making the best of it.
So when it comes down to it, your case on sloOsh consists of him pushing townies and defending mderg with faulty reasoning, and on D4 focusing you over me (I'm assuming you're talking about before chez claimed a goon check on you). Does this accurately characterize your reasons for wanting to lynch him?
Are you for realz!?!??! I never said I got a goon check!!! ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOU FRAMES HIMS WITH THE GOON CHECK?!?!?
On June 26 2014 06:51 Lazermonkey wrote: I actually urge you to look at SlOosh filter. I mean, Also look at my filter and look for stuff about SlOosh. Even if you are 100% sure I'm scum you still need to figure out the other scum. I've explained several times why I think he is scum already, including:
- Defends mderg alot. Yet he gives very weak/no reasoning on why he is defending mderg. It boils down to him saying that he doesn't like the mderg lynch.
- ALL of his major pushes has been on people that are town (Artanis, VE, Bunnies, me) except for YKZ. And since I think YKZ supertown, this also implies that SlOosh has only really pushed town this game. I'm aware of the fact that you don't know my alignment nor do you know YKZ's alignment but keep this point in mind when I flip since this should also increase your townread on YKZ.
- Is very eager to vote YKZ over me D3. Yet now he completly drops his read on YKZ to focus only on me. Isn't this convenient given that I am the number 1 lynch target?
I'd also like to point out, once again, that I think Release's reason for thinking that SlOosh is town is BS. While asking question IS good, it is very non-commital. Telling people to stop creating chaos is also good but once again, non-commital.
Look LM what I'm trying to get at here is that if you're dead anyways, let's just make the best of it. I still think you have a decent chance of flipping town, but let's be real here: there's a red check on you. You have to be lynched. So I'm not 100% sure you're scum, but I *am* 100% sure you're getting lynched today. The first step to being productive with the next 24 hours is going to be you accepting that you're getting lynched and making the best of it.
So when it comes down to it, your case on sloOsh consists of him pushing townies and defending mderg with faulty reasoning, and on D4 focusing you over me (I'm assuming you're talking about before chez claimed a goon check on you). Does this accurately characterize your reasons for wanting to lynch him?
Are you for realz!?!??! I never said I got a goon check!!! ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOU FRAMES HIMS WITH THE GOON CHECK?!?!?
You obviously didn't get medic, you can't get godfather, and if there was a roleblocker scum would have roleblocked artanis last night and shot you (remember, you didn't specify his medic type, so they'd need to RB him to be sure he didnt' save you again) so there wouldn't be a live chezinu to clarify his checks. Admittedly you could have gotten back framer, which I didn't consider.
Wow, you really did think through about killing me, didn't you?
On June 26 2014 07:46 Lazermonkey wrote: Went back and analyzed both Artanis's and GK's filter. While we can only speculate on why they got shot we do know that they got shot for a reason
People have already tried to get a grip of the GK-shot. Most people had him as townie after D1 IIRC so it makes a bit of sense to shoot him none the less. He was also suspcious of mderg. What I haven't seen someone say (and this may be because I simply missed it, CBA to look through all pages really...) is that he was pushing Release quite a bit. This makes Release look a little worse IMO.
As for Artanis's filter its kinda hard. I think he got shot simply for the fact that he was a town read for basically everyone.
I was basically a town read for everyone for Days... They refuse to lynch me and refuse the kill me!! I mean it isn't that hard to make a case against Chezinu. You know what to prove my point I'm going to show you what I would of done if I was you.
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
I thought you loved me...
On June 22 2014 10:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:08 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
I believe I need to refresh your memory.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:11 Chezinu wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
I'm not sure why you're confirmed town.
Cause they said so..
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
I have never stated that I have a strong townread on you. I'm only mildly reading you as town because your votes have been in the right place in the end and because mderg has pushed you. You haven't really provided much so it's difficult for anyone to get a read on you, town or scum.
On June 22 2014 10:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Must have missed that.
On June 17 2014 22:37 goodkarma wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:23 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 20:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 18:21 VisceraEyes wrote: So I wrote this big post about why I think slOosh is mafia because he thinks Artanis is mafia, but then as I started picking apart slOosh's reasoning I find that I'm really not so strongly feeling townie on Artanis, and that slOosh's reasoning is as bad as it was at first glance. So I removed the bit about Artanis and frankly it's not nearly as impressive. I've included it in a spoiler because I'm still tentatively scummy on slOosh, but the crux of my argument is garbage and the rest can possibly be just me misreading slOosh's intention or whatever.
Would probably vote for slOosh if he said nothing more today, but right now I'm looking elsewhere because I don't really find my case super convincing myself. I maintain that he doesn't /feel/ town to me, but concede that it's quite possible that I'm just wrong here.
Early on his play can be categorized as asking a lot of questions. A lot of questions. This is okay I guess, if you take his probing as a means to get reads on players. However, the problem I have is that all through his filter, ne'ry is there a read on anyone involved in the early game. He can be seen defending a couple of players...which I don't find to be particularly indicative either way, but it always seems to come with an out too so meh.
Ultimately we've got:
+- Asking a lot of early questions that don't seem to go anywhere. +- Defending players before they can defend themselves. - Never gives reads on players involved in early game, in spite of interacting with many of them through various questions. - In spite of posting a fair amount, doesn't feel town
For now I want to hear what slOosh has to say before voting for him, but we'll call him my top scumread for the sake of argument.
As for other players, as always I absolutely refuse to read BH this cycle. Chez seems to be Chez, which means he'll be alive until we lynch him regardless of his alignment. I'd like to see where this Artanis/slOosh stuff goes. I'm now kinda townreading Release now that he's proven a proclivity toward verbosity in all matters. mgerg is more guilty of rehashing than Release ever was, and in a way I find to be far more scummy. I think based on his (presumably only) D1 post that he's my favorite lynch today. I find his entire post to be wishywashy and diplomatic and scummy, and considering it may be all we get from him this cycle I'm fine with lynching him.
##Vote: mderg
That´s some solid reasoning there. At least be specific in some way. Right now your case on me is basically that my post feels kinda scummy. Also I can assure you that it´s not all you get from me this cycle. "You may theoretically not post any more in this cycle, so I´m fine lynching you". Like you´re not even interested in my play and just want me lynched for starting the game a bit late. Overall a really lazy vote on me without much to back it up.
Wait a minute. If his case on you is that your posts feel kinda scummy then it makes perfect sense. If you agree with his reasoning, however, is another story.
It would make sense to read someone as scum, if his posts feel scummy. But that´s not why you vote someone. The case sucks because it´s highly subjective and has no real substance. I think making a case just based on a post feeling scummy is terrible.
It is worth mentioning that a vote on you up until you suddenly came to life was a lurker vote. Like magic, a vote is cast on you and you come alive not to pursue any of your reads, but to defend yourself.
Would you mind clarifying your read on Release? This is the point you're most wishy-washy about in your opening post. Like apparently unflipped people piling on him gives you townie vibes, while a virtually nonexistent case made by Artansis makes you think he's looking scummy? And said nonexistent case is stronger than sloosh's case? Please do explain.
This was the post that solidified my read on mderg - he mentioned something I also noticed (and mentioned actually) and he ended up dying in the night. However beyond this you're right, at the end of the day he ended up on the "mderg town" side of things. :/
Frankly the only thing I can see GK being killed for is either a busted role-hunt or to implicate me somehow (he ended up scummy on me at the end of the day). Good to know.
Yeah, I don't think he was killed because he had a strong read on mderg. He might've simply been killed because his critical thinking was strong and I did explicitly point out a strong post of his, which might've cemented his fate. His death incriminates YKZ and Release more than you, I feel, as he was on their asses for more of the game.
On June 22 2014 10:19 Release wrote:
On June 21 2014 18:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote: No Release, I'm desperate to give someone bonus points. Now stop focussing on Snickers, he's not scum. Your attention is better suited for just about anyone that isn't me/snickers/lazer.
On June 21 2014 21:43 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 21 2014 21:14 Koshi wrote: Artanis probably meant the mderg vote. If it brought Snickers in the lead it looks pretty good for Snickers. Snickers was on mderg his ass so mderg might have gotten greedy. Mderg didnt move to bh when he could, so why move to a teammate?
I am back condemned to phone posting for today.
My fav lynch for tomorrkw is VE or lazermonkey. I agree that the vote put it him the spotlight but it was so obviously extremely strange. I dont see why town would do it.
Ding ding ding, we have a winner. I think your lynch targets are bad though. Also, the town reasoning should be obvious; he thought YKZ was more scummy than mderg, so he tried to get YKZ lynched.
Please explain like I'm 5 why Snickers (and you and lazer) were supposed to be confirmed town. Also, why lazer is no longer in such a position.
Snickers is confirmed town because Mderg delurked to vote him last minute which put him over the edge in votes. I'm confirmed town because read the game. Lazer was confirmed town because of his late vote that felt too scummy to be scum, but I'm rescinding that because other things in his filter ring some alarms that make me uncertain if that is true.
I'm going to bed now.
Good, you were getting a bit sleep deprived with your reads on me.
Operaton End FISH RIP is over! Unless you wake up feeling better about me.
PS: Day 5 is the key.
He told him that operation "End FISH RIP" aka "Friendship" is over. You know what happened next? Yeah, he died..
Now, look at Chez today...
On June 26 2014 05:42 Chezinu wrote: ##Vote Lazermonkey
ezpz.
I'm totally going to day tonight right? Well, at least VE died first. I did say I was talk to The Sheriff with him. GG
Smilie face... A STINKING SMILIE FACE!! Do you know what this means?!?!? If Lazermonkey is scum, then Chezinu is totally bussing him and in his arrogance Trolling with all of town!!
Oh wait.. nm.. I guess that wouldn't work for you LM.... I guess you couldn't possibly make a fake case against me.. All those smilies... all the cryptic messages.. what is town to do?
Thank you!!! You totally help my red/blue blindness. I had a red/blue read on Koshi this game. YKZ is possible godfather. Sorry for wanting the vigi to shoot you earlier... I'm a bit red/blue blind.
Question: Game balance wise, how many blue roles do you think town has? Based on how many we have now, I'm pretty sure the other two mafia are special roles.
I was going to wait until tomorrow, but I was joking about role checking Lazermonkey in order to get more reads. Wanted to see his reaction if he believe me or not to decipher if he was really mafia or not. Guess who I really did check?
On June 26 2014 14:44 Snickers wrote: But chezinu, if I follow you now and for some reason cannot change my vote.... You are too confusing. Anyway , why do you believe me, does my info match you perfectly or have my actions proved me town.
Mafia Framer You can change yours or someone's appearance to the investigative roles as you see fit for a night.
Mafia Godfather Can change his appearance to the investigative roles as he sees fit. During N1 you need to PM me what role you want to appear as for the rest of the game. If you do not you shall be Vanilla Townie.
With these two, your role is meaningless. Plus, you never breadcrumbed any check info.. I think I understand where you are coming from now.. It's ok if I die, you don't have to take my place. VE has already died.
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote: Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.
I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.
Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote: Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.
I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.
Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote: Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.
I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.
Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.
Holy fuck...
Lynch this dude please...
##Unvote ##Vote: Chez
LOL
The luxuries of being confirmed town
Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?
Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote: Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.
I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.
Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.
Holy fuck...
Lynch this dude please...
##Unvote ##Vote: Chez
LOL
The luxuries of being confirmed town
Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?
Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.
So, to be clear, you are not the rolecop, and therefore do not have a check on LM?
Yup! Couldn't resist the troll... but unlike Caller I will tell you before lynch goes through.
On June 27 2014 08:34 Snickers wrote: So anyone thought that YKZ is trying to save Lazer so much because if lazer flips scum we would all most likely go after him. His push style has found a weakness. Also the comment sloosh made about we will take about it later is prty scummy. One of the many reasons I am lynching Lazer.
Do you honestly think I wouldn't have bussed Lazer by this point as scum? ._. Look man, I'm here to talk with Lazer because I have a townread on him. I'm pretty sure he's gonna flip town and tomorrow we're at LYLO. We need to pump this guy for all the info we can get out of him in the next half hour before he flips. Obviously none of you are even remotely interested in saving him, and if my goal was simply to look good, I'd find great reasons to vote LM. If I were scum with him, I'd bus him, win solo, and then spend every game bragging about how good I am at scum and how I'm willing to bus awful teammates. When it comes down to it, LM is likely to flip town. You guys are all just wrong and I'm right.
This lynch is my fault for failing to convince you guys, since I'm the smartest player here. The responsibility falls solely on me, the town leader, for failing to corral the necessary votes to save LM.
LM: I am sorry. I really am. But you can't afford to dispair now. Keep talking.
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
Chez ur on the table today. Unless you can coherently tell me why you're suspicious of...whoever, then I'd consider lynching you today.
I thought you loved me...
On June 22 2014 10:12 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:08 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Woop woop. From those two I prefer BH. I think BH's scum capabilities are far stronger than slOosh and I think slOosh has played a good game on D1 and N2.
I tend to agree, though I can't just let go of the fact that he went absent during a scum lynch.
What do you make of my observation right at the outset of N2, I'll quote to refresh ur memory.
On June 21 2014 23:16 VisceraEyes wrote: So I have been thinking about it lying in bed. If GK was killed for being so close to the truth where mderg is concerned, then I think a mafia BH would probably follow up the GK kill with a push on VE to ensure that mderg isn't targeted. A GK kill doesn't make sense followed up with a hard mderg push from a mafiaBH perspective I think. GK was getting suspicious of me before he was killed, so it makes sense from my perspective.
BH this means I'm giving you a pass tomorrow. I don't mean to offend, but PLEASE don't waste 90% of it blathering on about how confirmed town you are and how godly you are and shit. That's annoying and doesn't help anyone find mafia, not even you.
I believe I need to refresh your memory.
On June 22 2014 02:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Actually VE, I went through goodkarma's filter and he's not really suspecting mderg in my opinion. There were other people that he definitely pushed harder like BH and Release. Where do you get it from that he died because he was close to finding out mderg?
On June 22 2014 10:11 Chezinu wrote:
On June 22 2014 10:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: List of people we're not lynching today: Artanis Snickers VisceraEyes Release
Probably not lynching slOosh or Chez either, so that leaves BH, Lazer and Koshi. Those three candidates are the people I want to focus on, though slOosh and Chez are fair game too if you have a good case.
Why would you even consider lynching a confirmed town?
I'm not sure why you're confirmed town.
Cause they said so..
On June 21 2014 03:01 Chezinu wrote: I have looked at everyone posts and came to a conclusion.
People who think Chezinu is town: 2. VisceraEyes 3. YouKnowZhou 5. Snickers 7. Lazermonkey 8. Release 9. mderg 10. Artanis[Xp] 11. Koshi 12. slOosh
Chezinu is town
The mafia are never wrong when it comes to knowing who is town. They are too scared to risk stating that I am Mafia. So, I just your untypical lunatic. It's Great to be Confirmed Town!
I have never stated that I have a strong townread on you. I'm only mildly reading you as town because your votes have been in the right place in the end and because mderg has pushed you. You haven't really provided much so it's difficult for anyone to get a read on you, town or scum.
On June 22 2014 10:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Must have missed that.
On June 17 2014 22:37 goodkarma wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 21:23 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 20:42 mderg wrote:
On June 17 2014 18:21 VisceraEyes wrote: So I wrote this big post about why I think slOosh is mafia because he thinks Artanis is mafia, but then as I started picking apart slOosh's reasoning I find that I'm really not so strongly feeling townie on Artanis, and that slOosh's reasoning is as bad as it was at first glance. So I removed the bit about Artanis and frankly it's not nearly as impressive. I've included it in a spoiler because I'm still tentatively scummy on slOosh, but the crux of my argument is garbage and the rest can possibly be just me misreading slOosh's intention or whatever.
Would probably vote for slOosh if he said nothing more today, but right now I'm looking elsewhere because I don't really find my case super convincing myself. I maintain that he doesn't /feel/ town to me, but concede that it's quite possible that I'm just wrong here.
Early on his play can be categorized as asking a lot of questions. A lot of questions. This is okay I guess, if you take his probing as a means to get reads on players. However, the problem I have is that all through his filter, ne'ry is there a read on anyone involved in the early game. He can be seen defending a couple of players...which I don't find to be particularly indicative either way, but it always seems to come with an out too so meh.
Ultimately we've got:
+- Asking a lot of early questions that don't seem to go anywhere. +- Defending players before they can defend themselves. - Never gives reads on players involved in early game, in spite of interacting with many of them through various questions. - In spite of posting a fair amount, doesn't feel town
For now I want to hear what slOosh has to say before voting for him, but we'll call him my top scumread for the sake of argument.
As for other players, as always I absolutely refuse to read BH this cycle. Chez seems to be Chez, which means he'll be alive until we lynch him regardless of his alignment. I'd like to see where this Artanis/slOosh stuff goes. I'm now kinda townreading Release now that he's proven a proclivity toward verbosity in all matters. mgerg is more guilty of rehashing than Release ever was, and in a way I find to be far more scummy. I think based on his (presumably only) D1 post that he's my favorite lynch today. I find his entire post to be wishywashy and diplomatic and scummy, and considering it may be all we get from him this cycle I'm fine with lynching him.
##Vote: mderg
That´s some solid reasoning there. At least be specific in some way. Right now your case on me is basically that my post feels kinda scummy. Also I can assure you that it´s not all you get from me this cycle. "You may theoretically not post any more in this cycle, so I´m fine lynching you". Like you´re not even interested in my play and just want me lynched for starting the game a bit late. Overall a really lazy vote on me without much to back it up.
Wait a minute. If his case on you is that your posts feel kinda scummy then it makes perfect sense. If you agree with his reasoning, however, is another story.
It would make sense to read someone as scum, if his posts feel scummy. But that´s not why you vote someone. The case sucks because it´s highly subjective and has no real substance. I think making a case just based on a post feeling scummy is terrible.
It is worth mentioning that a vote on you up until you suddenly came to life was a lurker vote. Like magic, a vote is cast on you and you come alive not to pursue any of your reads, but to defend yourself.
Would you mind clarifying your read on Release? This is the point you're most wishy-washy about in your opening post. Like apparently unflipped people piling on him gives you townie vibes, while a virtually nonexistent case made by Artansis makes you think he's looking scummy? And said nonexistent case is stronger than sloosh's case? Please do explain.
This was the post that solidified my read on mderg - he mentioned something I also noticed (and mentioned actually) and he ended up dying in the night. However beyond this you're right, at the end of the day he ended up on the "mderg town" side of things. :/
Frankly the only thing I can see GK being killed for is either a busted role-hunt or to implicate me somehow (he ended up scummy on me at the end of the day). Good to know.
Yeah, I don't think he was killed because he had a strong read on mderg. He might've simply been killed because his critical thinking was strong and I did explicitly point out a strong post of his, which might've cemented his fate. His death incriminates YKZ and Release more than you, I feel, as he was on their asses for more of the game.
On June 22 2014 10:19 Release wrote:
On June 21 2014 18:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote: No Release, I'm desperate to give someone bonus points. Now stop focussing on Snickers, he's not scum. Your attention is better suited for just about anyone that isn't me/snickers/lazer.
On June 21 2014 21:43 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 21 2014 21:14 Koshi wrote: Artanis probably meant the mderg vote. If it brought Snickers in the lead it looks pretty good for Snickers. Snickers was on mderg his ass so mderg might have gotten greedy. Mderg didnt move to bh when he could, so why move to a teammate?
I am back condemned to phone posting for today.
My fav lynch for tomorrkw is VE or lazermonkey. I agree that the vote put it him the spotlight but it was so obviously extremely strange. I dont see why town would do it.
Ding ding ding, we have a winner. I think your lynch targets are bad though. Also, the town reasoning should be obvious; he thought YKZ was more scummy than mderg, so he tried to get YKZ lynched.
Please explain like I'm 5 why Snickers (and you and lazer) were supposed to be confirmed town. Also, why lazer is no longer in such a position.
Snickers is confirmed town because Mderg delurked to vote him last minute which put him over the edge in votes. I'm confirmed town because read the game. Lazer was confirmed town because of his late vote that felt too scummy to be scum, but I'm rescinding that because other things in his filter ring some alarms that make me uncertain if that is true.
I'm going to bed now.
Good, you were getting a bit sleep deprived with your reads on me.
Operaton End FISH RIP is over! Unless you wake up feeling better about me.
PS: Day 5 is the key.
Tonight I must die to fulfill what has been spoken.
On June 27 2014 08:41 Lazermonkey wrote: The fact that Release and SlOosh simply did nothing is also telling I'd say. No matter how much scum you think I am, there is still a point in keeping up the work. It seemed like SlOosh even wanted to apear contributing by pushing me when it was obvious I was getting lynched. I said numerous times that I was cool with dying. I was giving out reads and asked them to ask question but SlOosh (and Release) just didn't give a fuck at all.
OK, but at least these guys are actively not giving a fuck. Look at it like this. Koshi in the past 24 hours has:
asked chez for checks, defended against my case on him, voted you, said he was a vt, asked a question, and that's it. That's all he's done. sloosh and release may be grating on the nerves but at least they're playing the game. Koshi seems less suspicious simply because he's posting less; an excellent strategem
On June 27 2014 09:08 Snickers wrote: Well if release was a smart scum, he would actually kill someone besides me so he could live. So many mysteries. Oh well. Funny how NameDropper starts Dropping names on me..... BAM! dead. MeanMonkey starts going ape shit in the thread.... BAM! he is dead. Apparently mafia know how to be gm. Clap Clap. This game is so messed up if Chezinu and Koshi are scum.
No, VE said it was be crazy if it was Chez and BH!!!
Before I go to sleep, I just want to compliment the mafia for this game. This is the first mafia game I have EVER, I mean EVER played where I was not a lynch suspect. Besides when I was godfather that one game in Plexa's world and sniped out the word gosu. That was before I went insane. I won, but it was lame besides from the gosu part.
Given that I had been a reactionary reader for quite some time. I was confused on what to do. All I had left was the troll within me. At this point, we must chose who we would hate to lose from the most. That bring us to YKZ and Koshi.
On June 28 2014 10:21 YouKnowZhou wrote: Chez what's your read on release? Your rarely mention him. What do you think of my case re: him
Never try to read him, perhaps that's why I couldn't find scum? I don't want to lose against Koshi. hehe
Ok IF Mafia has GF and IF they get to chose who is GF, it won't be Koshi. Cause he wasn't around. Day1.
Koshi replaced Oatsmaster.
Based on Big Name Theory, either you or koshi are mafia. However, does Kurumi choose big names for teams? He reserved two players for this game. VE and I. Both are townie. This is untypical for most hosts. So, it seems he doesn't follow Big Name Theory. Perhaps he truly is a random selector... which would lead to Release being mafia. BUT if release is mafia and Koshi is not.. Koshi should be playing better... But it seems all Big Names have been failing this game. Perhaps, we should have went with lynch a stranger Day 1. Which is the typical plan, but it was spoiled by a fail smurf and rage..
At this point, the BH and Sloosh team would be GG as well as the BH + Chez team. I will vote between release and Koshi.
PS: Can I have another tldr Chez tier? Cause yeah... I won't read.. I never read snicker's block either.
On June 20 2014 22:54 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm busy today as well but will hopefully at least be able to post during the lynch. I don't really get the BH wagon yet though. Well, I do get it but I don't get how people would rather vote for BH than they would vote for VE or Koshi.
Untill his reason vote he didn't have a single scum read what so ever. And it IS very convinient that he votes that number 1 lynchbait...
I am voting for the only person who has a case made against him. Two even. Do you disagree with the cases? I don't so I vote Mderg.
What do you mean with you don't understand why people are voting BH? BH pushed bunnies like a mofo and then disappeared, only to come back do nothing and taunt everybody, so he got votes. I am only doing the do nothing part, so I got less votes than BH.
Now that BH did something everybody should comment on that. Is the case legit or is it not? For me the case is very legit and well made so I am ok with BH. Somewhere I should look at the meta of BH in djinn game and in Ver game because he tunneled town D1 in both those games. I will do that later.
Voting me is pretty boring btw. I pinkysweared I was town when I entered the game. That should be enough. On top of that I am voting for the best cases in the thread, I am not pushing my own agenda in the thread, and I do not hide any of my reasoning from the thread.
I already told you people to look at the people who didn't vote Mderg D1. Scum never votes together. It simply doesn't happen ever. If I had to guess I would say Snickers is the scummer between the 4 but he is on Mderg ass since D1 so meh. Snickers hasn't been answering any of my questions and is just ignoring everything and pushing Release/Mderg.
But I am not pushing anything this game.
People that lie frequently. 1.Koshi 2.Release
People that play this game annoyingly (regardless of alignment most likely) 1.YKZ 2.Chezinu
Mderg do you have a question. My filter will answer it for you. Also funny how i commented on Release's whole "case" on me and he still "thinks" i did not. Do not think it is a case since he summarizes stuff and does not quote.
Also lets see who is the first to find out that YKZ's case on mderg is repeating what me and another person said. Then he completely takes the post i quoted and says the exact same thing. He even says he is sure somebody said this.
You ask and I guess you will receive. (It is a case. A summary of mafia play means mafia play was there).
At the beginning of the game, he casts suspsicion on 27nb following YKZ, supports the Kenpachi rule and encourages further discussion of it. + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 12:26 Snickers wrote: So far I am leaning towards 27nb as scum. Although i said the kenpachi rule is useless, now that i understand it better, it does have some merit. It seems like for a scum to claim VT first day would be a tactic that would be stupidly selfish, since it would most likely hurt the whole scum team. It seems like a tactic only a bad scum team would use. (But how would a scum team know it had a disadvantage. Maybe with poor roles? Maybe by meta? I do not think a scum team would plan to use the kenpachi rule to their favor.) 27nb has not really commented on the kenpachi rule and is just dismissing it.
Also i am not voting for her yet. Only eight out of the twelve players have posted so far, so it seems too early.
My reads for other players so far. Artanis, sloosh and Ve have not said much so no read. goodkarma seems to be playing standard. Nothing really sticking out at me for now. Maybe I will reread his posts. Chezinu has a high ratio of text to information. Seems weird but it only the first day. I do not think this information is sufficient enough to even mention the s word. YKZ seems to be a very knowledgeable player.
It seems for a stupid tactic for two scum to call each other out day 1. It seems like something that would be a risk that would be hard to get payed back on. Am i right about this? Another reason i am leaning towards 27nb, is if she is shown as scum, YKZ would then almost be proven as a town player and we would have a knowledgeable town player and only two more scum to hunt. Hopefully we could then protect him. I would not like to lynch someone with one of my two points being. "If we lynch her and shes a scum it will help a lot" because she still has a fair chance of not being scum. Also time is really precious for town so voting for such a long shot reason would show that town has bad chances after day one.
Please comment on my thoughts
This is already well into the day and YKZ has detailed his application of the kenpachi rule. Despite initially disliking the use of the Kenpachi rule + Show Spoiler +
Hello everyone. I am not sure how to quote someone so if the above quote was wrong please tell me how. (I checked preview and it looked right) What does BH stand for? For awhile i thought VT stood for vigilante not vanilla town. Also this kenpachi rule is useless.
he now claims that it has merit. Bandwagon play. 27nb dismisses the reasoning for the Kenpachi (which again is the mention of VT; I'm pretty certain incorrect). Misrep. of information by Snickers. + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 11:59 slOosh wrote: What is this "limited information" that you guys are getting at?
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
What's truly amazing here is what an awesome example this is for Kenpachi Rule Extended. Even after I call it you're still doing it. Assuming you do in fact flip scum I'll have to write a post game analysis just on the first few pages of this game. Maybe I could tie it in with a general Kenpachi and Kenpachi Rule Extended / Zephirdd Rule tutorial. I'm getting more excited by the minute!
BH I thought you were some amazing mafia player?
Obviously not because YOU ARE WRONG ON ME!
And I'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game.
See the statement is suspicious to me "i'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game." why the end of the game. It could easily be prove "wrong" the first night. "wrong" as in if your lynched and shown as town. Or if YKZ is lynched and showed scum.
I am just trying to show where I think 27nb is thinking in a strange way. Maybe she just thinks that way normally.
I do not think the kenpachi rule can be proven wrong. I think it can be proven to not be 100% right though. I think saying it is wrong is stating it has no merit at all. I already explained why i thought a scum could potentially claim VT day one to attempt for an advantage.
Also sloosh thanks for posting. I think this kenpachi rule should still be discussed a little more, but I see where you think we should stop the seeming rigmarole.
Focuses to narrowly on the phrasing of game vs day. The idea of bunny's wish to survive to the end of the game is very clear. And he adds a completely wrong scietific interpretation of the Kenpachi rule, and supports the Kenpachi rule discussion which has caused nothing but havoc in the thread.
Then he makes some slightly unclear buddy up to YKZ posts. The last quoted post does exactly that. Bad reasoning to support YKZ's incorrect claims. Let's also go back to this + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 12:26 Snickers wrote: It seems for a stupid tactic for two scum to call each other out day 1. It seems like something that would be a risk that would be hard to get payed back on. Am i right about this? Another reason i am leaning towards 27nb, is if she is shown as scum, YKZ would then almost be proven as a town player and we would have a knowledgeable town player and only two more scum to hunt. Hopefully we could then protect him. I would not like to lynch someone with one of my two points being. "If we lynch her and shes a scum it will help a lot" because she still has a fair chance of not being scum. Also time is really precious for town so voting for such a long shot reason would show that town has bad chances after day one.
in which he supports YKZ's towniness by saying that he would prefer to have a knowledgable player. Later claims that this was an unlikely outcome, but if that were the case, there would be no point in making a post like this. Therefore, I conclude that Snickers is lying and that the intention of this post is to half-defend but moreso align himself with the "towny" YKZ (from his perspective).
Then he supports me, the he flipflops on me following a not so good case on me by artansis. + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 13:49 Snickers wrote: Good post release, I wanted to comment on some of your points.
1.I think it should be stated that 27nb mentioned VT in a post before her vote post.
2.Also this "limited information" we all have different levels of information. This is a semi open game so we know what roles are possible but not the quantity. I am assuming that we all could be goons and VT? but even if we were not, information is simply not on the level of scum or town. A PR has more information that a VT because he knows his respective role exists in the game. So i think generally information goes scum>PR>Vt.
Also this "limited information" does not seem like a slip. 27nb was just trying to get the game going and I think two of the people she mentioned did not post. Even now three people have not posted so I would say we all have limited information.
3.Your point on YKZ claiming he only slips as mafia while playing town. I think this is 10000x more worthy than the "limited information" post. Is YKZ's slip the "limited information" post? I still think this point is very important even though I do not think YKZ slipped with the kenpachi rule or the "limited information"
4. I do not think talk about blue would lead to mafia finding out the blue players. Although it seems bad to claim blue players day one right? If I was scum and said I was vigilante and there was actually someone vigilante, they would shoot me the first night. If I was VT and claimed vigilante, it would help lead scum to target a "less worthy player". But the risk seems to high for that tactic to be valuable. Also i used "less worthy player" because a smart VT would obviously be more worthy than an unintelligent vigilante that shot a PR.
5. Also that speculate post was really ambiguous and I think i may have caused that. I was not speculating that YKZ was a blue. I was trying to show a possibility that was being overlooked by a player. Then 27nb said "I wouldnt speculate" well is she telling me not to speculate or saying she would not personally speculate.
On June 16 2014 12:26 Snickers wrote: So far I am leaning towards 27nb as scum. Although i said the kenpachi rule is useless, now that i understand it better, it does have some merit. It seems like for a scum to claim VT first day would be a tactic that would be stupidly selfish, since it would most likely hurt the whole scum team. It seems like a tactic only a bad scum team would use. (But how would a scum team know it had a disadvantage. Maybe with poor roles? Maybe by meta? I do not think a scum team would plan to use the kenpachi rule to their favor.) 27nb has not really commented on the kenpachi rule and is just dismissing it.
Also i am not voting for her yet. Only eight out of the twelve players have posted so far, so it seems too early.
My reads for other players so far. Artanis, sloosh and Ve have not said much so no read. goodkarma seems to be playing standard. Nothing really sticking out at me for now. Maybe I will reread his posts. Chezinu has a high ratio of text to information. Seems weird but it only the first day. I do not think this information is sufficient enough to even mention the s word. YKZ seems to be a very knowledgeable player.
It seems for a stupid tactic for two scum to call each other out day 1. It seems like something that would be a risk that would be hard to get payed back on. Am i right about this? Another reason i am leaning towards 27nb, is if she is shown as scum, YKZ would then almost be proven as a town player and we would have a knowledgeable town player and only two more scum to hunt. Hopefully we could then protect him. I would not like to lynch someone with one of my two points being. "If we lynch her and shes a scum it will help a lot" because she still has a fair chance of not being scum. Also time is really precious for town so voting for such a long shot reason would show that town has bad chances after day one.
Please comment on my thoughts
First bold is incorrect. YKZ has been acted stubbornly incorrectly and has misrepresented information in a manner that implies that he is correct and 27nb is wrong (whereas the opposite is true).
So you essentially have no reads? I doubt anyone has any solid reads except for/against 27nb and YKZ. Weird to include an entire paragraph about null.
The above implies bad/useless town but the next paragraph changes my read completely (as it did for 27nb).
Second bold: You would prefer that YKZ be town and therefore believe that 27nb is scum? The roles have already been determined. That is a complete lack of reasoning for wanting a lynch but still being swayed? That reeks of scum trying to jump on the bandwagon.
On June 16 2014 12:32 Snickers wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:14 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:03 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:59 slOosh wrote: What is this "limited information" that you guys are getting at?
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
What's truly amazing here is what an awesome example this is for Kenpachi Rule Extended. Even after I call it you're still doing it. Assuming you do in fact flip scum I'll have to write a post game analysis just on the first few pages of this game. Maybe I could tie it in with a general Kenpachi and Kenpachi Rule Extended / Zephirdd Rule tutorial. I'm getting more excited by the minute!
BH I thought you were some amazing mafia player?
Obviously not because YOU ARE WRONG ON ME!
And I'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game.
See the statement is suspicious to me "i'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game." why the end of the game. It could easily be prove "wrong" the first night. "wrong" as in if your lynched and shown as town. Or if YKZ is lynched and showed scum.
I am just trying to show where I think 27nb is thinking in a strange way. Maybe she just thinks that way normally.
I do not think the kenpachi rule can be proven wrong. I think it can be proven to not be 100% right though. I think saying it is wrong is stating it has no merit at all. I already explained why i thought a scum could potentially claim VT day one to attempt for an advantage.
Also sloosh thanks for posting. I think this kenpachi rule should still be discussed a little more, but I see where you think we should stop the seeming rigmarole.
That is a strange statement because asking for town to die to prove something is ridiculous, and is against our goal to kill mafia. However, the second part is correct. Why would you include the first part in this statement? Reeks of mafia.
Also quick note on Scientific Method: Nothing can be proven correct, but 1 counterexample demonstrates a need to change the hypothesis.
And from 27nb's perspective, I take a neutral stance on what she said. By the end of the game sounds like she was saying that she would be revealed as town when the game conclude, assuming that she would survive the entire game. As opposed to end of the day by getting a lynch of YKZ, but, at that point, not many people had taken a stance on the situation. It's passive but focussed on moving the game forward (as opposed to YKZ's comments which were designed to draw attention to himself and his survival).
-----------------------Line for separation--------------------------
On June 16 2014 13:49 Snickers wrote: Good post release, I wanted to comment on some of your points.
1.I think it should be stated that 27nb mentioned VT in a post before her vote post.
2.Also this "limited information" we all have different levels of information. This is a semi open game so we know what roles are possible but not the quantity. I am assuming that we all could be goons and VT? but even if we were not, information is simply not on the level of scum or town. A PR has more information that a VT because he knows his respective role exists in the game. So i think generally information goes scum>PR>Vt.
Also this "limited information" does not seem like a slip. 27nb was just trying to get the game going and I think two of the people she mentioned did not post. Even now three people have not posted so I would say we all have limited information. On day 1, information :: Mafia > Town.
3.Your point on YKZ claiming he only slips as mafia while playing town. I think this is 10000x more worthy than the "limited information" post. Is YKZ's slip the "limited information" post? I still think this point is very important even though I do not think YKZ slipped with the kenpachi rule or the "limited information"
4. I do not think talk about blue would lead to mafia finding out the blue players. Although it seems bad to claim blue players day one right? If I was scum and said I was vigilante and there was actually someone vigilante, they would shoot me the first night. If I was VT and claimed vigilante, it would help lead scum to target a "less worthy player". But the risk seems to high for that tactic to be valuable. Also i used "less worthy player" because a smart VT would obviously be more worthy than an unintelligent vigilante that shot a PR.
5. Also that speculate post was really ambiguous and I think i may have caused that. I was not speculating that YKZ was a blue. I was trying to show a possibility that was being overlooked by a player. Then 27nb said "I wouldnt speculate" well is she telling me not to speculate or saying she would not personally speculate.
@1: That was a question, separate from her vote.
@2: I'm pretty sure we don't use roles on "night 0." (check the Godfather role on the OP)
@3: Not too sure what you're asking but I can clarify: "Limited information" indicates scum because on Day 1, no one has any information except for the mafia, so assuming that YKZ is town, he should have less than or equal information to everyone else. Clearly, "limited information" implies that he has more and therefore cannot be town. next point: The Kenpachi rule does not apply but he insisted repeatedly and incorrectly that it did apply, causing chaos in town and trying to lead a mislynch.
@4: That sounds really scummy. On day 1, blues have no information more than town so we need to keep them alive. Talking about blues can only increase that chance that mafia corrects identifies blue so talking about blue on day 1 favors mafia.
@5: "You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip." this is incorrect. 27nb who thinks YKZ is scum does not speculate whether YKZ is blue because 27nb believes that YKZ is red. YKZ presents information as though 27nb is speculating which is the complete opposite of what is actually happening. Read the second part closely. Speculation only occurs if town is the hypothesis, which is not the case, so again, YKZ makes an incorrect statement and misleads us. 27nb's statement is not a scum slip by any stretch of the imagination.
See below:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: Snickers, you need to work a bit on your quoting, but not bad.
Just hit quote in the upper right corner of the post. It works better!
Also, pr means power role, so yes means same as blue.
I think coming out like that puts yourself in the spotlight.
i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
On June 16 2014 11:22 27ninjabunnies wrote: OMG Bh<3
WTG buddy!
hahaha. im laughing my ass off right now.
So what I'm saying here is that I think you are scum, and I'm not removing my vote from you..
But in the offchance you are town- which I don't believe one bit- town shouldnt speculate this early in the game whether or not a person is blue or just vt. That gives tooooo much information for mafia. That's what I was saying in sayng we shouldnt speculate whether or not you are blue.
That was definitely not a slip, so stop trying to grasp at straws because I caught you d1.
Overall, this sounds like a soft defense of YKZ, and such a defense is untenable.\
So i do not think you guys should pick a statement and bold it when right after that statement i said why it would be terrible to do that.
I was not asking for 27nb to die, I was saying it was strange for her to act super confident and not mention how she could prove him wrong less than 48 hours than now.
1.In my above post i showed where it was linked to her vote post. Also Her first post about VT was a question. The second one was not. It was then linked to the Vote Post.
2.and 3. Last time I am explaining this unless someone one new to the thread does not understand this.
"no one has any information except for the mafia,"
Since this is a semi open game the knowledge of a PR and a VT is different. Pr knows that his respective role exists. Also we all have information through the posts.
4.So this actually makes sense why talking about blue would be bad day one. (Same logic applies for why we try to get scrum to speak on day one). But i do not think what i said was scummy. I think you said I was scummy then put a true statement after it to try and fool somebody.
5. I still do not understand this speculation idea.
I do not think you understand me and are twisting my words a lot to hurt me. You also seem to be twisting 27nb's words a lot to protect her. You seemed to have missed the part where she mentions VT without the question mark.
Claims I do not understand and that I twist his words, when I'm pretty sure I understood what he meant. He just doesn't want others to read his statements as mafia so he misrepresents his own ideas to make them appear town, when they are not. Misleading the town --> mafia agenda. + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
Artanis case OP. I disagreed with it and so did slo0sh. + Show Spoiler +
On June 17 2014 02:17 Snickers wrote: Ok I'm on a mobile phone ATM and will not have a proper keyboard 9 hours from now.
First off. 27nb i will try to be more clear in nine hours with examples. My overall feelings on you is this. You were being super confident but did not use all the smack talk available to you. Again I will try to be more clear later.
Somebody wanted to know my thoughts on release.
For awhile I started to think that neither he , 27nb or ykz was scum. I think 27nb is most likely town now.
I think release is actually scum. He has aligned himself with bunnies and defended her but I think she was not in need of defense . I do not see a reason to defend someone not in trouble unless u know they are town. I think release saw a good time to cause confusion while also looking extremly town. It is good to align with a town as scum as a future defense, right?
Some people think I am siding with YKZ. I do not think it is smart to be siding with someone so early unless u know his or her role. I would argue I was going after 27 nab rather than defending YKZ. Also i said he seems knowledgable. I think he def still is because of his knowledge on the lenpachi rule. You guys have been saying his use of it was wrong but not his definition of it. Also he is bh which u guys know him so he has played a lot. It seems weird for a player that has played a lot to slip so early. ( I know it sounds life I'm defending him now) I think he is knowledgable regardless of his role.
His posts do seem weird tho. He adds on little joking phrases to the end of some posts. Also why create a smurf then show ur actual self. I think he was reacting strongly to something.
Flip. Claims defending a suspected towny is scummy. What I had been doing was more attacking YKZ and defending 27nb as a corollary. I said even said that 27nb is not necessarily towny because I thought town 27nb would have made my points already. It should be noted that this post is made after Artanis OP case on me. (sequence: he says I have good post, artanis case, misleading response from snickers, snickers firm flip)
He harps quite a bit on the "information" and blue talk even after I try multiple times to dissuade him from doing so. Read the thread. You should be able to find it. + Show Spoiler +
On June 16 2014 13:49 Snickers wrote: Good post release, I wanted to comment on some of your points.
1.I think it should be stated that 27nb mentioned VT in a post before her vote post.
2.Also this "limited information" we all have different levels of information. This is a semi open game so we know what roles are possible but not the quantity. I am assuming that we all could be goons and VT? but even if we were not, information is simply not on the level of scum or town. A PR has more information that a VT because he knows his respective role exists in the game. So i think generally information goes scum>PR>Vt.
Also this "limited information" does not seem like a slip. 27nb was just trying to get the game going and I think two of the people she mentioned did not post. Even now three people have not posted so I would say we all have limited information.
3.Your point on YKZ claiming he only slips as mafia while playing town. I think this is 10000x more worthy than the "limited information" post. Is YKZ's slip the "limited information" post? I still think this point is very important even though I do not think YKZ slipped with the kenpachi rule or the "limited information"
4. I do not think talk about blue would lead to mafia finding out the blue players. Although it seems bad to claim blue players day one right? If I was scum and said I was vigilante and there was actually someone vigilante, they would shoot me the first night. If I was VT and claimed vigilante, it would help lead scum to target a "less worthy player". But the risk seems to high for that tactic to be valuable. Also i used "less worthy player" because a smart VT would obviously be more worthy than an unintelligent vigilante that shot a PR.
5. Also that speculate post was really ambiguous and I think i may have caused that. I was not speculating that YKZ was a blue. I was trying to show a possibility that was being overlooked by a player. Then 27nb said "I wouldnt speculate" well is she telling me not to speculate or saying she would not personally speculate.
On June 16 2014 12:26 Snickers wrote: So far I am leaning towards 27nb as scum. Although i said the kenpachi rule is useless, now that i understand it better, it does have some merit. It seems like for a scum to claim VT first day would be a tactic that would be stupidly selfish, since it would most likely hurt the whole scum team. It seems like a tactic only a bad scum team would use. (But how would a scum team know it had a disadvantage. Maybe with poor roles? Maybe by meta? I do not think a scum team would plan to use the kenpachi rule to their favor.) 27nb has not really commented on the kenpachi rule and is just dismissing it.
Also i am not voting for her yet. Only eight out of the twelve players have posted so far, so it seems too early.
My reads for other players so far. Artanis, sloosh and Ve have not said much so no read. goodkarma seems to be playing standard. Nothing really sticking out at me for now. Maybe I will reread his posts. Chezinu has a high ratio of text to information. Seems weird but it only the first day. I do not think this information is sufficient enough to even mention the s word. YKZ seems to be a very knowledgeable player.
It seems for a stupid tactic for two scum to call each other out day 1. It seems like something that would be a risk that would be hard to get payed back on. Am i right about this? Another reason i am leaning towards 27nb, is if she is shown as scum, YKZ would then almost be proven as a town player and we would have a knowledgeable town player and only two more scum to hunt. Hopefully we could then protect him. I would not like to lynch someone with one of my two points being. "If we lynch her and shes a scum it will help a lot" because she still has a fair chance of not being scum. Also time is really precious for town so voting for such a long shot reason would show that town has bad chances after day one.
Please comment on my thoughts
First bold is incorrect. YKZ has been acted stubbornly incorrectly and has misrepresented information in a manner that implies that he is correct and 27nb is wrong (whereas the opposite is true).
So you essentially have no reads? I doubt anyone has any solid reads except for/against 27nb and YKZ. Weird to include an entire paragraph about null.
The above implies bad/useless town but the next paragraph changes my read completely (as it did for 27nb).
Second bold: You would prefer that YKZ be town and therefore believe that 27nb is scum? The roles have already been determined. That is a complete lack of reasoning for wanting a lynch but still being swayed? That reeks of scum trying to jump on the bandwagon.
On June 16 2014 12:32 Snickers wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:14 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:03 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:59 slOosh wrote: What is this "limited information" that you guys are getting at?
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
What's truly amazing here is what an awesome example this is for Kenpachi Rule Extended. Even after I call it you're still doing it. Assuming you do in fact flip scum I'll have to write a post game analysis just on the first few pages of this game. Maybe I could tie it in with a general Kenpachi and Kenpachi Rule Extended / Zephirdd Rule tutorial. I'm getting more excited by the minute!
BH I thought you were some amazing mafia player?
Obviously not because YOU ARE WRONG ON ME!
And I'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game.
See the statement is suspicious to me "i'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game." why the end of the game. It could easily be prove "wrong" the first night. "wrong" as in if your lynched and shown as town. Or if YKZ is lynched and showed scum.
I am just trying to show where I think 27nb is thinking in a strange way. Maybe she just thinks that way normally.
I do not think the kenpachi rule can be proven wrong. I think it can be proven to not be 100% right though. I think saying it is wrong is stating it has no merit at all. I already explained why i thought a scum could potentially claim VT day one to attempt for an advantage.
Also sloosh thanks for posting. I think this kenpachi rule should still be discussed a little more, but I see where you think we should stop the seeming rigmarole.
That is a strange statement because asking for town to die to prove something is ridiculous, and is against our goal to kill mafia. However, the second part is correct. Why would you include the first part in this statement? Reeks of mafia.
Also quick note on Scientific Method: Nothing can be proven correct, but 1 counterexample demonstrates a need to change the hypothesis.
And from 27nb's perspective, I take a neutral stance on what she said. By the end of the game sounds like she was saying that she would be revealed as town when the game conclude, assuming that she would survive the entire game. As opposed to end of the day by getting a lynch of YKZ, but, at that point, not many people had taken a stance on the situation. It's passive but focussed on moving the game forward (as opposed to YKZ's comments which were designed to draw attention to himself and his survival).
-----------------------Line for separation--------------------------
On June 16 2014 13:49 Snickers wrote: Good post release, I wanted to comment on some of your points.
1.I think it should be stated that 27nb mentioned VT in a post before her vote post.
2.Also this "limited information" we all have different levels of information. This is a semi open game so we know what roles are possible but not the quantity. I am assuming that we all could be goons and VT? but even if we were not, information is simply not on the level of scum or town. A PR has more information that a VT because he knows his respective role exists in the game. So i think generally information goes scum>PR>Vt.
Also this "limited information" does not seem like a slip. 27nb was just trying to get the game going and I think two of the people she mentioned did not post. Even now three people have not posted so I would say we all have limited information. On day 1, information :: Mafia > Town.
3.Your point on YKZ claiming he only slips as mafia while playing town. I think this is 10000x more worthy than the "limited information" post. Is YKZ's slip the "limited information" post? I still think this point is very important even though I do not think YKZ slipped with the kenpachi rule or the "limited information"
4. I do not think talk about blue would lead to mafia finding out the blue players. Although it seems bad to claim blue players day one right? If I was scum and said I was vigilante and there was actually someone vigilante, they would shoot me the first night. If I was VT and claimed vigilante, it would help lead scum to target a "less worthy player". But the risk seems to high for that tactic to be valuable. Also i used "less worthy player" because a smart VT would obviously be more worthy than an unintelligent vigilante that shot a PR.
5. Also that speculate post was really ambiguous and I think i may have caused that. I was not speculating that YKZ was a blue. I was trying to show a possibility that was being overlooked by a player. Then 27nb said "I wouldnt speculate" well is she telling me not to speculate or saying she would not personally speculate.
@1: That was a question, separate from her vote.
@2: I'm pretty sure we don't use roles on "night 0." (check the Godfather role on the OP)
@3: Not too sure what you're asking but I can clarify: "Limited information" indicates scum because on Day 1, no one has any information except for the mafia, so assuming that YKZ is town, he should have less than or equal information to everyone else. Clearly, "limited information" implies that he has more and therefore cannot be town. next point: The Kenpachi rule does not apply but he insisted repeatedly and incorrectly that it did apply, causing chaos in town and trying to lead a mislynch.
@4: That sounds really scummy. On day 1, blues have no information more than town so we need to keep them alive. Talking about blues can only increase that chance that mafia corrects identifies blue so talking about blue on day 1 favors mafia.
@5: "You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip." this is incorrect. 27nb who thinks YKZ is scum does not speculate whether YKZ is blue because 27nb believes that YKZ is red. YKZ presents information as though 27nb is speculating which is the complete opposite of what is actually happening. Read the second part closely. Speculation only occurs if town is the hypothesis, which is not the case, so again, YKZ makes an incorrect statement and misleads us. 27nb's statement is not a scum slip by any stretch of the imagination.
See below:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: Snickers, you need to work a bit on your quoting, but not bad.
Just hit quote in the upper right corner of the post. It works better!
Also, pr means power role, so yes means same as blue.
I think coming out like that puts yourself in the spotlight.
i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
On June 16 2014 11:22 27ninjabunnies wrote: OMG Bh<3
WTG buddy!
hahaha. im laughing my ass off right now.
So what I'm saying here is that I think you are scum, and I'm not removing my vote from you..
But in the offchance you are town- which I don't believe one bit- town shouldnt speculate this early in the game whether or not a person is blue or just vt. That gives tooooo much information for mafia. That's what I was saying in sayng we shouldnt speculate whether or not you are blue.
That was definitely not a slip, so stop trying to grasp at straws because I caught you d1.
Overall, this sounds like a soft defense of YKZ, and such a defense is untenable.\
So i do not think you guys should pick a statement and bold it when right after that statement i said why it would be terrible to do that.
I was not asking for 27nb to die, I was saying it was strange for her to act super confident and not mention how she could prove him wrong less than 48 hours than now.
1.In my above post i showed where it was linked to her vote post. Also Her first post about VT was a question. The second one was not. It was then linked to the Vote Post.
2.and 3. Last time I am explaining this unless someone one new to the thread does not understand this.
"no one has any information except for the mafia,"
Since this is a semi open game the knowledge of a PR and a VT is different. Pr knows that his respective role exists. Also we all have information through the posts.
4.So this actually makes sense why talking about blue would be bad day one. (Same logic applies for why we try to get scrum to speak on day one). But i do not think what i said was scummy. I think you said I was scummy then put a true statement after it to try and fool somebody.
5. I still do not understand this speculation idea.
I do not think you understand me and are twisting my words a lot to hurt me. You also seem to be twisting 27nb's words a lot to protect her. You seemed to have missed the part where she mentions VT without the question mark.
On June 17 2014 02:39 Release wrote: @Lazer (and everyone else): His actions alone are bad. The repetitiveness of the badness and refusal to change his play after being corrected manifest his mafia agenda.
"blazinghand is stubborn, therefore he is mafia" and "blazinghand has scumslipped, therefore he is mafia" are both sentences that are like always super doops wrong. I certainly can be stubborn as mafia, but I'm always stubborn. And the scumslip thing, come on guys. I legit don't scumslip as scum, and scumslip all the time as town, ask like anyone who has played more than 2 games with me. Also, I'm just generally a stubborn bastard no matter what I roll; again, ask anyone who has played with me.
I will say this though: although I don't particularly like that Release is all over me like a dog on a butt-flavored biscuit, I gotta give him credit: he IS all over me. He went through my filter and tried to find anything he could possibly construe as scummy and slapped it down in a big honkin filter dive case. Now, it's a big honkin WRONG filter drive case, but it's still a lot of effort. Maybe he was explicitly dodging Kenpachi Rule Extended, but he still gets mondo credit for putting in effort imo. Is release scummy for jumping in and just repeating what other people said? Eh, maybe. It's certainly a easy move for scum to make, but it's also worth noting that it's a move town would make.
Suppose Release comes in and sees this horrible back and forth between me and 27nb, and for some weird reason becomes convinced I'm scum as a result. He wants to drop a vote on me, but also there's like no-one voting me, so he drops a hella big case. He does work, he does research. I give him credit for this, at least. Yes, it would have been good if he had an original idea, but if he didn't, he didn't. There's only so much to be said about me. Maybe you think he's scum because you think I'm scum and this is the most poorly executed bus ever, but really, 1) it would be a terrible way to do it, and 2) as SloOsh said (and he gets mucho townie points for this) you don't draw associative tells between unflipped players.
Back onto the 27nb thing, Check it out. If you look at 27nb's filter, you see the initial push on me, and you see some interactions on me in places where I directly call out 27nb, but that's it as far as interactions with me. Check out some of the posts I made after the post that set off 27nb's "flag" so to speak about me being scummy:
On June 16 2014 11:05 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 10:58 Snickers wrote:
Also, your posts are giving me BH vibes.
Hello everyone. I am not sure how to quote someone so if the above quote was wrong please tell me how. (I checked preview and it looked right) What does BH stand for? For awhile i thought VT stood for vigilante not vanilla town. Also this kenpachi rule is useless.
BH stands for "Blazinghand": he is a mafia-guy who is mean to newbies and throws around his "vet" status in games and thinks he is way better then everyone else. ne1 who thinks I am BH also thinks I am town tho cuz BH's favorite thing is to fake claim blue roles every game when he is scum. He would never claim vt as scum bcuz he wants to fake claim blue rofl
In this post i'm explicitly stating I'm not BH and trying to fake not being me. Even worse, I'm setting up the "bh claiming vt must be town" meme and I later "accidentally" reveal myself to be BH. If I were someone who thought YKZ was scum and saw this, I'd be all over it. I'd point out that it's awfully CONVENIENT to say that and then "accidentally" reveal yourself to be bh. I'd write a case, or at least a post, or heck, at least a SENTENCE, about this. Since I'm already suspicious of YKZ, since I supposedly have a scumread on YKZ, responding to this would be a NATURAL thing to do if I was town and voting YKZ.
And yet, no response from 27nb (who was in thread at the time)
next..
On June 16 2014 11:34 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:27 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:13 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip.
This reminds me of something you once said in Les Mafia:
On May 22 2013 15:51 Blazinghand wrote: DP, you're not bad, you're just wrong about scumslips. When I flip town, promise me this: for the next full game played, any time you mention scumslips you will say "I was wrong, BH was right, there is no such thing as a scumslip"
Did something change?
Yeah in the YKZ quote nobody thought I was blazinghand, so I thought I could get away with the fallacious "scumslip" argument, since you guys clearly aren't willing to accept the reasonable Kenpachi Rule argument. The fact of the matter is, 27nb IS scum because of Kenpachi Rule. I'm allowed to lie, cheat, steal, etc (well not cheat but you get the idea) to get you sheep to follow me and lynch him. The ends justify the means.
also, 27nb's retconned case on me that's about me saying s/he doesn't have good info is based on, you guessed it, another scumslip. Let me get it through everyone's heads: I, Blazinghand, am by far the best scum player on TL Mafia. I may not be an amazing town player, I admit, but I am a GOD of scum, I only ever scumslip as town. You can look at my past games; every time someone calls me out for a scumslip, I'm town. You know why? As town, I don't have to bother worrying about scumslips cause I know I am innocent. As scum, I play a much cleaner game in terms of slips because I have to.
So, 27nb's slip-based case on me actually proves how townie I am, and his/her hilarious backtracking on calling me potentially blue only shows how scummy 27nb is.
Look at what I'm saying here. I'm literally admitting to lying to and deceiving the thread. I then say it's okay to lie and that the ends justify the means. Jesus christ on a stick with a cherry on top, how do you not flip out over this if you're town and think I'm scum? You'd be like "look, BH is obviously willing to lie. He was trying to pretend to be someone else while smurfing, which is a CLASSIC BH move when smurfing as scum. He even admits it, right here, in an attempt to defuse the situation. You can't let this slide guys, this is proof BH is scum"
anyone who thinks I'm suspicious and has a vote on me, after reading that I admit to lying and trying to decieve the thread, would be ALL OVER this post. You want to know how 27nb responds, though?
Here, I'll show you.
On June 16 2014 11:39 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:34 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:27 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:13 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip.
This reminds me of something you once said in Les Mafia:
On May 22 2013 15:51 Blazinghand wrote: DP, you're not bad, you're just wrong about scumslips. When I flip town, promise me this: for the next full game played, any time you mention scumslips you will say "I was wrong, BH was right, there is no such thing as a scumslip"
Did something change?
Yeah in the YKZ quote nobody thought I was blazinghand, so I thought I could get away with the fallacious "scumslip" argument, since you guys clearly aren't willing to accept the reasonable Kenpachi Rule argument. The fact of the matter is, 27nb IS scum because of Kenpachi Rule. I'm allowed to lie, cheat, steal, etc (well not cheat but you get the idea) to get you sheep to follow me and lynch him. The ends justify the means.
also, 27nb's retconned case on me that's about me saying s/he doesn't have good info is based on, you guessed it, another scumslip. Let me get it through everyone's heads: I, Blazinghand, am by far the best scum player on TL Mafia. I may not be an amazing town player, I admit, but I am a GOD of scum, I only ever scumslip as town. You can look at my past games; every time someone calls me out for a scumslip, I'm town. You know why? As town, I don't have to bother worrying about scumslips cause I know I am innocent. As scum, I play a much cleaner game in terms of slips because I have to.
So, 27nb's slip-based case on me actually proves how townie I am, and his/her hilarious backtracking on calling me potentially blue only shows how scummy 27nb is.
You are soooooo wrong on me. It's super bad.
And tbh, idc what you think of yourself, but you haven't impressed me ass the "best" in TL Mafia.
I caught your mafia self d1. Get rekt!
And as I said, Kenpachi rule is useless and stupid, and it will be highly disproved this game.
I have no need to backtrack, and I had not backtracked anywhere. I'm going forward with this lynch and into the abyss you go!
All 27nb sees is the part of the post directed at her. She argues about like backtracking or whatever, and says she's going forward with this lynch while literally ignoring possibly the most damning statement a player could make. If she was really town and really thought I was scum, at this point she'd say, not "blah blah kenpachi rule backtracking, your'e so bad and i'm so good", she'd say, "ah hah! Caught you in a lie, blazinghand, this is exactly what scum do!"
You can see she's clearly not in a mindset of hunting scum, or hell, even actually PUSHING The wagon. She is putting on a big SHOW of pushing the wagon, but she's not actually doing it. She's not pointing out what I'm posting, or why I'm scum, just shouting about like one sentence in one post. She's not hunting scum. She's making noise.
This is because she lacks the town mindset, the mindset that someone who really thought I was scum would have. Because 27nb is scum.
vote her, for justice.
@ first 4 paragraphs: The first sentence is again deliberate misrepresentation of the information that I have presented. Blazinghand is stubbornly wrong even when corrected and refuses to acknowledge corrections and is therefore mafia is the complete picture. This is the same misrepresentation of information he used earlier to cause chaos and it is used to cause chaos now. And the scumslip (which to my mind is the "more information") is NOT the reason that I think you are mafia. Please stop trying to twist information to suit your agenda. I do not merely repeat what has been said. I created a case on you with greater breadth and depth than 27nb did. And maybe you should pay more attention to what SloOsh is saying because he has asked useful questions when (mostly) you and 27nb have caused havoc in the thread. Now disregarding that, my case demonstrates that your logic in your play is incorrect. A proper defense is not to say "If I were scum, I would have..." because that is meaningless. Instead, you need to demonstrates that your logic is not incorrect. Otherwise, I think we should still construe YKZ's earlier posts as deliberate chaos.
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 01:42 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
Boring, why so?
And I know I'm town, so you think Release is more likely scum defending a town here?
Or do you think it's scum defending a partner this early into the game?
I'm thinking we're both town here.
Though, i agree, he is basically just sayng everything I've already said.
Boring because you both just kept repeating the same things but in different words and it wasn't going anywhere for me to get a read on either of you.
I don't know your alignment and I'm not going to make an association between unflipped players. People did that in cell. You supported that as mafia. Why are you trying to create associations now?
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
This gives me a slight scumread on you. Wanting to be right is an easy reason to lean back on without actually saying anything.
On June 17 2014 02:38 Release wrote: Currently this is our only point of discussion, although your vote on me now introduces a discussion about me.
wordy words
Boring. You could've introduced a discussion about anyone that had an opinion on the case for bullshit reasons. You also keep repeating yourself in the post as well. If you want me to actually read your posts thoroughly, be more to the point. I'm not interested in your description of what you provided and what you want. It won't help me get a more accurate read on you.
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
I "repeat" myself because YKZ makes similar chaotic plays with the same agenda.
I rehashed some of the dispute because I wanted to provide a complete argument as to why YKZ is mafia and I want to be specific about my references.
On June 17 2014 03:19 Lazermonkey wrote: @Release: I'm sorry, I missread your post a little bit. Your argument is actually quite different from Bunnies. I do, however, still fail to understand how YKZ actions make him scum. Your argument seems like WIFOM to me. It's like you assume that YKZ is already scum and then try to justify his actions from that point of you. Have you even considered YKZ's actions from a town PoV?
Assuming that he is trying to create chaos by missinterpreting Bunnies is a big leap of faith.
I also do think that there is merit to the Kenpachi rule in this case. Even if Bunnies said nummerous times that the VT claim wasn't the reason she voted for YKZ, she still pointed out two times:
On June 16 2014 09:42 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
Awwwww, how rude. Don't you know you are supposed to talk to a person when they are talking to you?
Also-she.
And Why right off the bat claim vt?
On June 16 2014 09:50 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:45 slOosh wrote: Bunnies (ninja? 27?), who is smurf and why should we lynch him?
YKZ is smurf.
And at first, I just put him on the list to get conversation going.
I don't like that he wants to ignore me completely. And that he has to immediately come out and say he is vt.
Looking at these two posts, you get the impression that Bunnies is indeed suspicious of YKZ because of the claim. Bunnies later on refutes this by saying that her suspicion of YKZ had nothing to do with the VT claim, HOWEVER:
On June 16 2014 09:52 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:50 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
This post has no substance. And why would you talk down to bunny about him having limited information? Do you have less limited information?
Also, another point to why I don't like YKZ is the bolded.
He says I have limited information. How would he know that I am town?
Well, if he was mafia he would know that I am town.
So ##Vote: YKZ
Note the bolded part. It doesn't say "look, this is a really scummy thing YKZ said", it says "look, this is another point I don't like". If she didn't care about him claiming VT, why say that it was another part she didn't like? If there is something that I find null in someones filter I don't say "Hey, this is wierd". I just don't say a thing about it. And the thing is that Bunnies doesn't say anything about this untill YKZ votes her with because of the Kenpachi rule. It is therefore impossible for us to know whether she is talking the truth or not about not caring about the VT thing. Her actions in the thread does, however, indicate that this was something she cared about. Which makes me belive that all this was just a massive backpaddle by Bunnies after she got caught doing scummy stuff.
##Vote: 27ninjabunnies
Here is a very concise argument train of thought for you: YKZ claims vt 27 questions claim and in a SEPARATE post votes for "limited information" YKZ repeatedly claims that the vote is for the "vt" claim (incorrect/bad play, currently not particularly indicative of alignment) 27 states the vote is not for the claim, but for the "limited information" (lots of back and forth) but ultimately, YKZ insists that 27 is scum because of vote due to her vote due to vt claim (incorrect again while being corrected). here we consider: if YKZ were town, he would recognize his mistake and reevaluate the situation, and conclude that he was incorrect and therefore 27 is not mafia, and YKZ should unvote. However, YKZ doesn't and, therefore, YKZ has made a conscious choice to ignore corrections to his play, which is indicative of mafia.
---------------------------------------
But you should consider the magnitude of the reasoning. You are correct in sayi ng that "another" implies the vt is relevant. However, the next two sentences and the vote form an independently logical sequence of events (and the vt claim alone did not procure a vote). This implies that "limited information" is the main reason for the vote. Care about it? somewhat. Enough to merit use of Kenpachi rule? doubt it.
On June 17 2014 03:22 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:13 slOosh wrote: Hmm, not quite feeling the flaming spears of logic and justice yet.
On June 16 2014 12:46 slOosh wrote: I can see a somewhat reasonable case to be made that bunnies is not a stellar townie, but I don't see the case being made that she must be scum. Why isn't she "bad" town?
I think my most recent post demonstrates that 27nb's attention is drawn towards statements about her, rather than incriminating things I say-- even a bad townie would naturally respond to me saying things like "I lied to decieve town because I thought I could get away with it", whereas scum regardless of badness would naturally respond to me saying kenpachi rule but NOT respond to additional evidence. It's not a matter of skill, it's a matter of mindset. A townie, even a new townie (I remember being one), when thyey have a scumread on someone and that person does something really scummy, they RESPOND to it. they add it to their case. It's the natural thought process of a town player REGARDLESS of skill.
27nb is not showing this natural thought process. Look at her responses to my posts. Is she responding to things I say that are scummy or inconsistent and pointing out their inconsistency? Or is she just shouting about my first post whenever she gets the chance, and not actually trying to convince people to lynch me based on new evidence that emerges? A townie who was really tunnelled on me would LOVE to point out new scummy things I say, because he's still trying to formulate and develop a case. 27nb is always talking about me, sure, but look at WHAT she's responding to. Not the stuff a townie would.
This is always your argument. 'Not one specific town agenda and therefore mafia." There are multiple ways to play town (since you clearly claim to enjoy pretending to scumslip and most others do not).
On June 17 2014 03:48 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:40 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:33 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:28 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:21 slOosh wrote: Lazermonkey, what is the "scummy stuff" that bunnies is backpedaling from?
The quick version: 1. Bunnies says that YKZ's VT claim is wierd and that she doesn't like it. 2. Bunnies says that ANOTHER thing the she doesn't like about YKZ is his "scum slip". Bunnes votes for YKZ. 3. YKZ votes Bunnies because Kenpachi rule. 4. Bunnies claims that the VT claim wasn't a reason she voted YKZ.
4. It wasn't the MAIN reason I voted YKZ.
Okay, I'm not really interested in discussing this further with you. My goal isn't to make you confess in the thread. Its to convince the others.
It is basically that it is impossible for us to know that what you are claiming is true or not. Based on what you wrote earlier I do find it more likely that you are scum than that you are town though.
Understandable:
also ##Unvote
I know this is not going to get votes off of me, and I'm fine with that.
But YKZ's last few posts have been a bit towny, especially his read on Artansis.
I'm starting to worry we are two town fighting. I also don't want my judgement clouded by my vote on YKZ and would like to hear more from other people.
His posting has mostly been to say that town (a very specific town) would have done X but did Y and therefore mafia. Do you guys agree with this kind of arguement? Because I certainly do not. I urge you to reconsider you unvote on YKZ.
On June 17 2014 07:05 goodkarma wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
Hmm? How does it make him scum?
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
Where's the inconsistency? Leaning may not be indicative of degree of conviction, but merely the direction of it.
On June 17 2014 01:45 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:45 goodkarma wrote:
On June 16 2014 22:11 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I kinda like this vote. And I kinda like Artanis' face.
Release sounds a lot like he's trying to justify feeling the way he does rather than explaining honestly WHY he feels the way he does. Does anyone else think so?
I agree Release is looking scummy, but I wouldn't use that exact wording. He seems heavily invested in his case, but is only leaning towards ninja's side of this debate. These two statements especially didn't sit right with me from Release's post on 21:10 15 June 2014:
"As the situation between 27bunnies and YKZ currently stands, I am leaning on the side of 27bunnies."
And yet he ends this same post:
"I think 27bunnie has the right idea, but has not manifested clearly (or in enough detail) what needs to be said to properly incriminate YKZ."
Release doesn't seem that interested in what may develop from YKZ. He already has the verdict in mind... This is a HUGE inconsistency from how he starts his post.
You have a point here I really like.
Which makes me wonder if scum defending a town here.
He's not even considering in what YKZ could or could not do.
But then if that's the case, and Release is scum, then YKZ is town, and I don't like that.
I really really want to be right that YKZ is scum.
You are starting to make associations here and I don't think that's a good idea. Focus on them as individuals.
I'm not really sure what else to say here except that there's a large variance of degrees. How I see it, you have release saying "I'm leaning YKZ scum" on first quote and saying "I am unequivocally convinced YKZ is scum" on second one. Release has since posted something in disagreement, but this is what I see when looking at that post. What's more, when would town ever say "...what needs to be said to incriminate..."? That's some super-scummy wording. Town looks to determine who's scum, not to make someone look like scum.
Further, when thinking back on my own games the way Release has posted is almost exactly how I handled my first mafia game. I posted a huge case on an easy target then AFK'ed, only posting when I felt I had to. Looking at a few of his past games (when he was town), he had a much easier to follow flow with his posts. Every post in this game feels very calculated, and given how I personally liked to post in previous games as scum, it's easy for me to see how as an insecure newbie scum he would feel inclined to stack as much together as he could into a few very carefully planted posts.
Incriminate: " To cause to appear guilty of a crime or fault; implicate" I believe that YKZ is guilty of a crime of fault, but others do not share that opinion with me. Therefore, it is my duty to convince others (you) of his guilt by causing him to appear to be guilty. I see nothing wrong with the use of the word. It is an apt choice. (would you have preferred implicate? same meaning)
OP says to reduce spam / one-liners and I play the game fitfully (about an hour each time).
On June 17 2014 07:29 VisceraEyes wrote:
On June 17 2014 04:46 slOosh wrote: Yea I so I think Artanis is scum.
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
Here is his first post, top of page 8. There are many unnatural things about this post.
First is his complaining tone. We are only 5 pages in, and yet he calls it all "bullshit". It's totally out of place and unnatural.
Then he moves away from it and blames Release. Two things here. One is that he does nothing to either comment on, or figure out said "bullshit". No reads or questions on either YKZ / 27nb. Nothing to try to figure either one out. Just a straight up dismissal of the whole thing, and moving on to someone else.
Next is how he blames Release for it all. When I press him on this issue:
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
Nothing but fluff. He doesn't offer any meaningful reason why Release is scum. Look at the backpedaling. "oh yea I guess he added content. I could argue that wordiness isn't alignment null but I won't".
He doesn't really care to convince me or others why he finds Release scum. He just wants to put his vote somewhere to look like he is contributing.
He dodges the question the first time around so I ask him again:
On June 17 2014 03:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:17 slOosh wrote:
On June 17 2014 03:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 17 2014 02:38 slOosh wrote:
On June 16 2014 17:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I find this discussion about YKZ/27nb and its origins really boring and I can't believe we've written so much about such bullshit. Biggest perpetrator of it is Release. He's just rehashed everything that's already said but made it more wordy. ##Vote Release
I'm sorry, how is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He hasn't rehashed anything, it's original content and wordiness is alignment null.
Release made a giant post about stuff that was really boring so I didn't get very far in it. The first part is definitely rehash. You're right in that he did add some original content afterwards though. Wordiness being alignment null is debatable but that debate wouldn't go anywhere so let's agree to disagree on that.
How is Release the perpetrator if it started as a spat between YKZ and 27nb?
He's the perpetrator of the conversation continuing about that specific topic.
Ridiculous. Release is trying to make sense of the debacle, and Artanis is overexaggerating, blaming him for "perpetrating" this "bullshit", while making no effort to either figure out the YKZ / bunnies thing himself, nor make clear how Release is scum for it. Just vague handwaving and avoiding the biggest discussion topic at the time.
Artanis is unnatural, Artanis is apathetic, Artanis is scum.
##Vote Artanis[Xp]
I think this post makes slOosh scum. DETAILS AT ELEVEN!!!
Really? Because he has been the one asking clarifying questions, obviously with a purpose behind them. That fits townie agenda of forwarding the game in my book.
Currently, I feel confident in SloOsh and Lazer as town for candid presentation of information and quetions. I feel that 27nb is town but to a lesser extent. I feel confident in YKZ as mafia.
I have 100% corrected you and you did not respond to me at all. You had two main points in your first post. 1. Bunnies connection with YKZ's VT claim. 2. "limited information".
I questioned you about the VT claim and even after going back to check yourself you still reported false information. Then i said you were still wrong and you still have not responding. You are not even following your own guidelines to not look like scum.
Also this "limited information" this has a detail we all missed. I have never read anywhere in the rules where you have to read your role pm before starting play. Obviously u should (have to?) before day one ends. So we all had "equal info" unless we assume someone has read his role pm. It seems like a weird tactic but i still believe this "limited information" thing has very little value.
So one of the two things your first post was based on was just wrong and you still did not correct it. The other thing has very little value in my opinion.
I am leaning pretty hard to vote for you. Especially when two people have posted how your post had such a great timing.
Also i would really like to hear from oats and hear more for the world cup watcher.
On June 16 2014 12:26 Snickers wrote: So far I am leaning towards 27nb as scum. Although i said the kenpachi rule is useless, now that i understand it better, it does have some merit. It seems like for a scum to claim VT first day would be a tactic that would be stupidly selfish, since it would most likely hurt the whole scum team. It seems like a tactic only a bad scum team would use. (But how would a scum team know it had a disadvantage. Maybe with poor roles? Maybe by meta? I do not think a scum team would plan to use the kenpachi rule to their favor.) 27nb has not really commented on the kenpachi rule and is just dismissing it.
Also i am not voting for her yet. Only eight out of the twelve players have posted so far, so it seems too early.
My reads for other players so far. Artanis, sloosh and Ve have not said much so no read. goodkarma seems to be playing standard. Nothing really sticking out at me for now. Maybe I will reread his posts. Chezinu has a high ratio of text to information. Seems weird but it only the first day. I do not think this information is sufficient enough to even mention the s word. YKZ seems to be a very knowledgeable player.
It seems for a stupid tactic for two scum to call each other out day 1. It seems like something that would be a risk that would be hard to get payed back on. Am i right about this? Another reason i am leaning towards 27nb, is if she is shown as scum, YKZ would then almost be proven as a town player and we would have a knowledgeable town player and only two more scum to hunt. Hopefully we could then protect him. I would not like to lynch someone with one of my two points being. "If we lynch her and shes a scum it will help a lot" because she still has a fair chance of not being scum. Also time is really precious for town so voting for such a long shot reason would show that town has bad chances after day one.
Please comment on my thoughts
First bold is incorrect. YKZ has been acted stubbornly incorrectly and has misrepresented information in a manner that implies that he is correct and 27nb is wrong (whereas the opposite is true).
So you essentially have no reads? I doubt anyone has any solid reads except for/against 27nb and YKZ. Weird to include an entire paragraph about null.
The above implies bad/useless town but the next paragraph changes my read completely (as it did for 27nb).
Second bold: You would prefer that YKZ be town and therefore believe that 27nb is scum? The roles have already been determined. That is a complete lack of reasoning for wanting a lynch but still being swayed? That reeks of scum trying to jump on the bandwagon.
On June 16 2014 12:32 Snickers wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:14 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:12 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 16 2014 12:03 27ninjabunnies wrote:
On June 16 2014 11:59 slOosh wrote: What is this "limited information" that you guys are getting at?
On June 16 2014 09:37 YouKnowZhou wrote: I'm a vt.
I'm not really replying to 27ninjabunnies for making a bad judgement call about any of the lynches. That would be unfair since he has limited information. I will be just trying to clarify some things so you, and everyone else here, could get a better impression about me. Of course, you would have to trust me on that.
What I'm trying to say is, YKZ good, lynching YKZ bad, mmkay?
What's truly amazing here is what an awesome example this is for Kenpachi Rule Extended. Even after I call it you're still doing it. Assuming you do in fact flip scum I'll have to write a post game analysis just on the first few pages of this game. Maybe I could tie it in with a general Kenpachi and Kenpachi Rule Extended / Zephirdd Rule tutorial. I'm getting more excited by the minute!
BH I thought you were some amazing mafia player?
Obviously not because YOU ARE WRONG ON ME!
And I'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game.
See the statement is suspicious to me "i'll disprove your kenpachi rule by the end of the game." why the end of the game. It could easily be prove "wrong" the first night. "wrong" as in if your lynched and shown as town. Or if YKZ is lynched and showed scum.
I am just trying to show where I think 27nb is thinking in a strange way. Maybe she just thinks that way normally.
I do not think the kenpachi rule can be proven wrong. I think it can be proven to not be 100% right though. I think saying it is wrong is stating it has no merit at all. I already explained why i thought a scum could potentially claim VT day one to attempt for an advantage.
Also sloosh thanks for posting. I think this kenpachi rule should still be discussed a little more, but I see where you think we should stop the seeming rigmarole.
That is a strange statement because asking for town to die to prove something is ridiculous, and is against our goal to kill mafia. However, the second part is correct. Why would you include the first part in this statement? Reeks of mafia.
Also quick note on Scientific Method: Nothing can be proven correct, but 1 counterexample demonstrates a need to change the hypothesis.
And from 27nb's perspective, I take a neutral stance on what she said. By the end of the game sounds like she was saying that she would be revealed as town when the game conclude, assuming that she would survive the entire game. As opposed to end of the day by getting a lynch of YKZ, but, at that point, not many people had taken a stance on the situation. It's passive but focussed on moving the game forward (as opposed to YKZ's comments which were designed to draw attention to himself and his survival).
-----------------------Line for separation--------------------------
On June 16 2014 13:49 Snickers wrote: Good post release, I wanted to comment on some of your points.
1.I think it should be stated that 27nb mentioned VT in a post before her vote post.
2.Also this "limited information" we all have different levels of information. This is a semi open game so we know what roles are possible but not the quantity. I am assuming that we all could be goons and VT? but even if we were not, information is simply not on the level of scum or town. A PR has more information that a VT because he knows his respective role exists in the game. So i think generally information goes scum>PR>Vt.
Also this "limited information" does not seem like a slip. 27nb was just trying to get the game going and I think two of the people she mentioned did not post. Even now three people have not posted so I would say we all have limited information. On day 1, information :: Mafia > Town.
3.Your point on YKZ claiming he only slips as mafia while playing town. I think this is 10000x more worthy than the "limited information" post. Is YKZ's slip the "limited information" post? I still think this point is very important even though I do not think YKZ slipped with the kenpachi rule or the "limited information"
4. I do not think talk about blue would lead to mafia finding out the blue players. Although it seems bad to claim blue players day one right? If I was scum and said I was vigilante and there was actually someone vigilante, they would shoot me the first night. If I was VT and claimed vigilante, it would help lead scum to target a "less worthy player". But the risk seems to high for that tactic to be valuable. Also i used "less worthy player" because a smart VT would obviously be more worthy than an unintelligent vigilante that shot a PR.
5. Also that speculate post was really ambiguous and I think i may have caused that. I was not speculating that YKZ was a blue. I was trying to show a possibility that was being overlooked by a player. Then 27nb said "I wouldnt speculate" well is she telling me not to speculate or saying she would not personally speculate.
@1: That was a question, separate from her vote.
@2: I'm pretty sure we don't use roles on "night 0." (check the Godfather role on the OP)
@3: Not too sure what you're asking but I can clarify: "Limited information" indicates scum because on Day 1, no one has any information except for the mafia, so assuming that YKZ is town, he should have less than or equal information to everyone else. Clearly, "limited information" implies that he has more and therefore cannot be town. next point: The Kenpachi rule does not apply but he insisted repeatedly and incorrectly that it did apply, causing chaos in town and trying to lead a mislynch.
@4: That sounds really scummy. On day 1, blues have no information more than town so we need to keep them alive. Talking about blues can only increase that chance that mafia corrects identifies blue so talking about blue on day 1 favors mafia.
@5: "You wouldnt speculate bcuz you think i am scum. Unless of cours u kno i am not scum. So I caught u in scum slip." this is incorrect. 27nb who thinks YKZ is scum does not speculate whether YKZ is blue because 27nb believes that YKZ is red. YKZ presents information as though 27nb is speculating which is the complete opposite of what is actually happening. Read the second part closely. Speculation only occurs if town is the hypothesis, which is not the case, so again, YKZ makes an incorrect statement and misleads us. 27nb's statement is not a scum slip by any stretch of the imagination.
See below:
On June 16 2014 11:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: Snickers, you need to work a bit on your quoting, but not bad.
Just hit quote in the upper right corner of the post. It works better!
Also, pr means power role, so yes means same as blue.
I think coming out like that puts yourself in the spotlight.
i wouldnt speculate whether or not he is blue right now.
On June 16 2014 11:22 27ninjabunnies wrote: OMG Bh<3
WTG buddy!
hahaha. im laughing my ass off right now.
So what I'm saying here is that I think you are scum, and I'm not removing my vote from you..
But in the offchance you are town- which I don't believe one bit- town shouldnt speculate this early in the game whether or not a person is blue or just vt. That gives tooooo much information for mafia. That's what I was saying in sayng we shouldnt speculate whether or not you are blue.
That was definitely not a slip, so stop trying to grasp at straws because I caught you d1.
Overall, this sounds like a soft defense of YKZ, and such a defense is untenable.\
So i do not think you guys should pick a statement and bold it when right after that statement i said why it would be terrible to do that.
I was not asking for 27nb to die, I was saying it was strange for her to act super confident and not mention how she could prove him wrong less than 48 hours than now.
1.In my above post i showed where it was linked to her vote post. Also Her first post about VT was a question. The second one was not. It was then linked to the Vote Post.
2.and 3. Last time I am explaining this unless someone one new to the thread does not understand this.
"no one has any information except for the mafia,"
Since this is a semi open game the knowledge of a PR and a VT is different. Pr knows that his respective role exists. Also we all have information through the posts.
4.So this actually makes sense why talking about blue would be bad day one. (Same logic applies for why we try to get scrum to speak on day one). But i do not think what i said was scummy. I think you said I was scummy then put a true statement after it to try and fool somebody.
5. I still do not understand this speculation idea.
I do not think you understand me and are twisting my words a lot to hurt me. You also seem to be twisting 27nb's words a lot to protect her. You seemed to have missed the part where she mentions VT without the question mark.
you never responded to this post.
Also you seem to not understand the fact that pr have more info than VT.
Also you keep highlighting the same thing i did but have you read what i wrote right after that.
On June 17 2014 12:44 Release wrote: Not on day 1 and there is no point in talking about it on day 1.
I read it and it does not excuse illogical play. Regardless of 0/1/2 of 2 scum, you wish does not affect their roles. You soft retract your statement by saying it's a bad reason, but why say it in the first place if that is the case?
ok start quoting because i have no clue what "it" is.
It is a bad reason why? because we had such little information at the time. I was providing the most detail i could of why i thought 27nb was scum. It was a "long shot" but it still gave me another reason to.
I do not understand two thirds of your above post.
Why would I not say a bad reason. By bad reason i meant the game was probably going to end up with a lot better reasons for a scum. I am voting you know. I already showed multiple reasons why.
##Vote Release
And admit that you are wrong about information. PR has more information than VT. This is a semi open game. PR know if his role exists. VT does not know if any or what PR exists. PR does not know if even one VT exists?(Do not know if this is 100% right because i am new) VT knows at least one VT exists.
Both said VT and PR know there is three mafia.
Knowing there is a pr is more info than knowing there is a VT.
On June 17 2014 13:05 Release wrote: If you read the original situation in which the information is said, the information relates to 27nb calling out 3 purported mafia and YKZ saying she has less information. It pertains to knowing who and who isn't mafia, and in this case, VT and PR are equally informed (since it is day 1). Knowing there is a pr does not in any way help call out 3 mafia. Therefore it is the same and we should stop talking about PRs.
limited does not equal less.
Also you do have a point with at the very start of the game PR and VT have the same chance of randomly guessing mafia.
But even on day one it could matter. If u were a cop and somebody claimed cop... for example.
On June 24 2014 07:00 Release wrote: "If we assume that Koshi is town, how could you justify his actions?" "If we assume that Koshi is town, how could you justify his actions?"
same game?
On June 25 2014 08:48 Release wrote: I said SloOsh is town, and I stand by that statement.
Ya Know,
Let's have some Fun Art! *cries* This is for you man!!!
"Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall."
Today is Day 5. It was once said that Day 5 is key. But is it key to destruction or key to victory?
It is the key to the locked closet of my heart. Tell me, Chezinu, what exactly about VE flipping town indicated to you that all scum were on 27nb? I am having trouble making the connection.
"Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall."
Today is Day 5. It was once said that Day 5 is key. But is it key to destruction or key to victory?
It is the key to the locked closet of my heart. Tell me, Chezinu, what exactly about VE flipping town indicated to you that all scum were on 27nb? I am having trouble making the connection.
Nothing absolutely nothing. MUHAHAHHAHAHHA!!!
Ok. Then, let's talk about release, the only living non-voter of 27nb.
On June 28 2014 10:33 Chezinu wrote: PS: Can I have another tldr Chez tier? Cause yeah... I won't read.. I never read snicker's block either.
>Release' D1 vote opts out of the discourse. It's also unlikely all scum voted 27nb D1. Release voted "not 27nb" but also voted "not mderg" (you'd expect at least 1 scum not to be on that 27nb wagon, since not all 3 were needed to save mderg; every player currently alive voted for 27nb day 1 except release, who voted ykz)
>Release vote on mderg D2 makes sense as a bus. Release voted YKZ D1, but on D2 he moves to mderg even though it's between YKZ and mderg. Also, for a while it was between YKZ and all kinds of other players
>Release ignores and basically doesn't engage with the dying LM despite being in thread
>Some Process of Elimination stuff: Don't lynch BH/Sloosh because of green checks; don't lynch chez. Between Koshi and Release Release makes more sense since he wasn't on the 27nb wagon D1
I never knowingly played with release before. But I have played with Koshi. I had red/blue read on Koshi earlier in the game. Especially, when he mentioned the comment about town only having a doctor. I then fakeclaimed to draw him out. He didn't call me out.
"Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall."
Today is Day 5. It was once said that Day 5 is key. But is it key to destruction or key to victory?
It is the key to the locked closet of my heart. Tell me, Chezinu, what exactly about VE flipping town indicated to you that all scum were on 27nb? I am having trouble making the connection.
Nothing absolutely nothing. MUHAHAHHAHAHHA!!!
Ok. Then, let's talk about release, the only living non-voter of 27nb.
Here's my chez tier tldr:
On June 28 2014 14:55 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 28 2014 10:33 Chezinu wrote: PS: Can I have another tldr Chez tier? Cause yeah... I won't read.. I never read snicker's block either.
>Release' D1 vote opts out of the discourse. It's also unlikely all scum voted 27nb D1. Release voted "not 27nb" but also voted "not mderg" (you'd expect at least 1 scum not to be on that 27nb wagon, since not all 3 were needed to save mderg; every player currently alive voted for 27nb day 1 except release, who voted ykz)
>Release vote on mderg D2 makes sense as a bus. Release voted YKZ D1, but on D2 he moves to mderg even though it's between YKZ and mderg. Also, for a while it was between YKZ and all kinds of other players
>Release ignores and basically doesn't engage with the dying LM despite being in thread
>Some Process of Elimination stuff: Don't lynch BH/Sloosh because of green checks; don't lynch chez. Between Koshi and Release Release makes more sense since he wasn't on the 27nb wagon D1
I never knowingly played with release before. But I have played with Koshi. I had red/blue read on Koshi earlier in the game. Especially, when he mentioned the comment about town only having a doctor. I then fakeclaimed to draw him out. He didn't call me out.
Koshi's lurkiness and silence then in your opinion was either an attempt to dodge shots (as a blue) or because he was scum, based on your experience with typical Koshi. Since after 2 cop claims and a dead doc he didn't cc, it means he's not blue, so he must be scum. the Red/Blue read is based on his lack of contribution in general?
Yeah. I have a special ability to know who is special. Like Art is medic.. snickers is red/blue - when he stated there could be multiple medics, I thought perhaps he was mafia medic. I had an impress Koshi was blue this game. but then snickers claimed. I was still paraniod, cause I'm read/blue blind. I'm only good at reactionary reading mafia or finding out who is special. Koshi seemed special. Then he was quite and not contributing his typical good reads. But it seemed everyone else was doing poor as well. I gave him time in case he was blue. Now that time is up.
On June 19 2014 21:07 Koshi wrote: Your further Evidence section is wrong. mderg says first "VE is really scummy" then he says "I have no other scumreads but snickers...".
VE do you think all scum voted for Ninjabunnies?
On June 19 2014 03:22 Koshi wrote: The 3 I named are my best guesses for scum. Scum never votes together. And you look pretty town. Just go from there.
On June 21 2014 00:47 mderg wrote: Koshi... that´s so incredibly lazy.
Lazy or scummy?
Definitely lazy, possibly scummy.
There is actually nothing scummy about it. It is only scummy when I don't follow my own rules. At this point I am nothing more than a plynch. A terrible bad one.
The power to control the colors, Chezinu stands among the last survivors. But will he realize his true potential or rather where the true power to control the colors come from?
On June 24 2014 04:25 VisceraEyes wrote: I could lynch Koshi too. slOosh what say you about a Koshi lynch? Release? Is anyone that isn't a part of BH's Wrong Of The Month Club OPPOSED to a Koshi lynch?
I'm opposed because his read on Lazer's D2 apathy was spot on. I am planning on dialoguing with Lazermonkey right now to see what's going on here.
On June 24 2014 04:28 Koshi wrote: How are you people even considering lynching me?
You're sheeping BH who is confirmed bad at this game.
On June 24 2014 04:36 slOosh wrote: I don't like how Lazer keeps ditching whatever to get at Koshi.
He says I'm scum for being on the wrong wagon twice, but doesn't seem to consider that Koshi was on the correct wagon D2 the whole time.
All in all, lynching Lazermonkey > Koshi.
Thank you for your considerations.
On June 24 2014 04:41 slOosh wrote: Also expecting two special packages, if you know what I mean. Or I guess 3? Like 3 related packages.
WHERE IS MY PACKAGE!!! Oh yeah, I lived that night. TROLOLOLOLOLOL
Btw, the clues in smiles to vote for lazermonkey were wrong that your timing was awesome... we were such a team... WHYYYYYYY WHYYYY WHYYYY!!!!
Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently!!!!!
On June 24 2014 05:15 Koshi wrote: How hard can this be. There are still 5 people in the running for scum. BH/Release/Artanis look town. Or shot not be considered for the mderg lynch today. Artanis is a little fucker but who cares. Snickers/VE/Lazermonkey/Chezinu/SloOsh are left.
Snickers can be excused due to mderg filter. Very unlikely that he is scum with mderg. Not a good lynch. Chezinu is Chezinu and was on mderg. I guess we have a doc and not a cop so that's unfortunate but even then I wouldn't lynch Chezinu because he isn't harmful to town in any way. He isn't pushing an agenda he is just being around.
VE is away on the wrong moments, pushes scum but then doesn't vote scum, can't be tied to anybody in case he flips scum because his reads are all neutral, and is currently just showing activity. Lazermonkey is just trying to get me lynched. Even when his top scumreads were SloOsh and VE he was pushing me the hardest. Look at D2, he just came in to push me while IGNORING the mderg/BH wagons. I am pretty sure that scumtactics were to get BH lynched (who was main candidate back then) and then myself.
On June 20 2014 19:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote: BH, I'm not a newbie player. I know that similarities does not necessarily mean the same alignment, but previous games can give you insights into their mind. Particularly a scum qt can be enlightening. It told me mderg is someone that thinks before he posts as scum, which is a point against him being scum this game.
I'm not up for a mderg lynch at this point in time. I am up for a Koshi lynch though. ##Unvote ##Vote Koshi
This is also a good point brought up. Everyone that is voting mderg should explain why they vote him very very clearly and why the reason you vote him makes him scum. Explain how that action isn't likely to have come out of a newbie town player also.
On June 21 2014 06:02 Lazermonkey wrote: Please look at Koshi's filter and look ät all thé scum hunting he has done... Owait.
Vote him.
As a matter of policy, I do not lynch players right after they replace in. I leave them alone for a full cycle. I find this typically works pretty well; people need time to get their shit together usually.
Its been a full cycle now. Not even kidding.
All these posts indicate that Lazermonkey is actually following the thread. Nowhere it looks like he is lagging behind so he can't give an opinion on Mderg/BH. Clearly it was a choice from Lazermonkey to not comment on it. Why not? Because BH was going to get lynched and Lazermonkey was setting up the next misslynch. That's why. There is enough time between these posts to catch up with the thread. Are you going to believe he just came in once an hour and just looked at my filter and pushes me? Why wouldn't scum be superlazy on D2 with BH playing suicidal?
btw, looking in Lazermonkies filter I think VE is town. reasons: 1) Lazermonkies case on D3 is based on VE not defending bunnies enough D1. Knowing that Lazermonkey wasn't "able" to follow the game D2/N2 it is pretty insane he remembered all this from D1. ScumMonkey however could have planned this case as soon as bunnies was lynched D1. 2) As soon as I moved off LM and on VE today LM called me sensible. This means he got a pretty strong scumread on VE right? But as soon as VE enters the thread with null posts LM seems to have VE as town and starts to push Koshi/SloOsh. This could be because they are scumbuddies but could just as easily be because townVE was in the thread and is more active and has more influance than SloOsh and me.
I really want to lynch LM.
On June 24 2014 05:19 Koshi wrote: I forgot to add that SloOsh could be mafia because nobody wants to lynch him and he is not really being super town. Also PoE.
On June 24 2014 06:54 Snickers wrote: Koshi is town because of how bad his play continual is. Look at his first scum reads as me release and somebody else because we did not vote together. He's not pushing the thread or helping much but what do you expect from a bad town player. More on this later.
That propaganda! Great job Koshi GREAT JOB. I mean, you haven't been talking that much this game and you really got the whole not all mafia vote together spreading like crazy.
Yay! Also, I was just kidding about you being mafia. I was hoping the stuff I showed you would make you see Koshi a bit differently. Fun fact: Do you know what players have said plz in this game? Cause I don't remember. Would be interesting to know though. Also, Why didn't mafia kill you night 1?
On June 30 2014 09:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I saved myself on N2 you numbnuggets.
I was fully prepared to make a case on how "Artanis must have saved Release" N2. Never cam to that.
My initial read on you was right. Stupid town consensus townreading you leading to me townreading you as well Did get you from the grave though! PMed this to Kurumi 30 min before deadline.
Original Message From Artanis[Xp]: Going with a Koshi/Release scumteam. Honestly hope Koshi is scum more than anything because this'd be a really sad display of his towngame if it is.
On June 30 2014 09:12 Koshi wrote: Who did you safe on N1 Artanis?
I saved GK until 30 min before deadline when I switched to SlOosh even though my townread on him was weaker just because I thought he was more likely to get shot.
You attacked me and reconsidered. I felt that a VT would have gone ham and probed for information (like Snickers, who actually turned out to be Detective) for longer than 1 post before changing their mind.
I don't think my role was related to that honestly. I noticed a town consensus against it and felt my read wasn't strong enough to continue, but I might be biased in it. I've changed my opinions a lot this game.
On D1 I decided to go for a different style this time. Usually I just spout all my reads into the thread but I tried asking questions more now to see who had similar thought processes as me. Landed me a townread on GK, but eventually I just fell back into my usual routine after D1
I felt the VE and Lazer lynches were easily avoidable. VE played to his current town meta to a tee and BH should be ashamed of lynching him. Lazer shit townie bricks on D4 whereas Koshi went afk and I can't believe you guys lynched Lazer over Koshi that day.
Yeah my original plan was to fakeclaim that I checked lazer and then 24 hours later said I was faking it and then say the real check was Koshi. I wasn't expecting snickers to claim. Then I was thinking about switching sooner, but then realized town was adamant to lynching lazer (to determine sanity-which some say was unaviodable cause it was most likely true cause numbers of green checks) then I got busy in RL.
mderg broke Chezinu Rule and I missed it - sloosh caught it though. So it still stands. He was first to accuse me/call me scum/scummy.
I really struggled with reaction reading. I guessed you were medic/mafia. I thought snickers was red/blue and koshi red/blue as said in thread. Earlier I thought VE was mafia cause no one was accusing me, so I thought mafia loved me. Sorry VE. After VE died, I thought about Koshi cause of absence/big name rule and then snickers roleclaim/death confirmed. Release... I just didn't read any of his posts.. I didn't read much this game. TY BH tldr chez tier!! HELPED A LOT!!!
Other than that I got bored and trolled a lot.. oh and if you didn't figure it out from me or day posts. The Sheriff was the Kurumi and I was being a rebel.
To bring back an old and forgotten tradition: THANK YOU KURUMI FOR HOSTING!!!
On June 30 2014 09:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I saved myself on N2 you numbnuggets.
I was fully prepared to make a case on how "Artanis must have saved Release" N2. Never cam to that.
My initial read on you was right. Stupid town consensus townreading you leading to me townreading you as well Did get you from the grave though! PMed this to Kurumi 30 min before deadline.
Original Message From Artanis[Xp]: Going with a Koshi/Release scumteam. Honestly hope Koshi is scum more than anything because this'd be a really sad display of his towngame if it is.
On June 30 2014 09:12 Koshi wrote: Who did you safe on N1 Artanis?
I saved GK until 30 min before deadline when I switched to SlOosh even though my townread on him was weaker just because I thought he was more likely to get shot.
You attacked me and reconsidered. I felt that a VT would have gone ham and probed for information (like Snickers, who actually turned out to be Detective) for longer than 1 post before changing their mind.
I don't think my role was related to that honestly. I noticed a town consensus against it and felt my read wasn't strong enough to continue, but I might be biased in it. I've changed my opinions a lot this game.
On D1 I decided to go for a different style this time. Usually I just spout all my reads into the thread but I tried asking questions more now to see who had similar thought processes as me. Landed me a townread on GK, but eventually I just fell back into my usual routine after D1
I felt the VE and Lazer lynches were easily avoidable. VE played to his current town meta to a tee and BH should be ashamed of lynching him. Lazer shit townie bricks on D4 whereas Koshi went afk and I can't believe you guys lynched Lazer over Koshi that day.
Yeah my original plan was to fakeclaim that I checked lazer and then 24 hours later said I was faking it and then say the real check was Koshi. I wasn't expecting snickers to claim. Then I was thinking about switching sooner, but then realized town was adamant to lynching lazer (to determine sanity-which some say was unaviodable cause it was most likely true cause numbers of green checks) then I got busy in RL.
mderg broke Chezinu Rule and I missed it - sloosh caught it though. So it still stands. He was first to accuse me/call me scum/scummy.
I really struggled with reaction reading. I guessed you were medic/mafia. I thought snickers was red/blue and koshi red/blue as said in thread. Earlier I thought VE was mafia cause no one was accusing me, so I thought mafia loved me. Sorry VE. After VE died, I thought about Koshi cause of absence/big name rule and then snickers roleclaim/death confirmed. Release... I just didn't read any of his posts.. I didn't read much this game. TY BH tldr chez tier!! HELPED A LOT!!!
Other than that I got bored and trolled a lot.. oh and if you didn't figure it out from me or day posts. The Sheriff was the Kurumi and I was being a rebel.
To bring back an old and forgotten tradition: THANK YOU KURUMI FOR HOSTING!!!
oh at the time of fakeclaiming I was suspecting lazer/koshi mafia team. fakecheck on lazer was to test his reaction. initial reaction I thought was town, but then anger part confused me.then snickers. Day 1 and Day 2 I was lost pointing them fingers.
On June 30 2014 12:04 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I wonder if anyone knows why I read Chez as confirmed town.
I thank you for the opportunity for me to twist it and fake claim. It was fun. It would have worked, if it wasn't for the snickers. I would have switched to Koshi and then admit I faked it all an hour before the lynch.
PS: Chez didn't get shot by The Sheriff and the game is officially over so The Sheriff can never shoot Chez. GG
On June 20 2014 22:54 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm busy today as well but will hopefully at least be able to post during the lynch. I don't really get the BH wagon yet though. Well, I do get it but I don't get how people would rather vote for BH than they would vote for VE or Koshi.
Untill his reason vote he didn't have a single scum read what so ever. And it IS very convinient that he votes that number 1 lynchbait...
I am voting for the only person who has a case made against him. Two even. Do you disagree with the cases? I don't so I vote Mderg.
What do you mean with you don't understand why people are voting BH? BH pushed bunnies like a mofo and then disappeared, only to come back do nothing and taunt everybody, so he got votes. I am only doing the do nothing part, so I got less votes than BH.
Now that BH did something everybody should comment on that. Is the case legit or is it not? For me the case is very legit and well made so I am ok with BH. Somewhere I should look at the meta of BH in djinn game and in Ver game because he tunneled town D1 in both those games. I will do that later.
Voting me is pretty boring btw. I pinkysweared I was town when I entered the game. That should be enough. On top of that I am voting for the best cases in the thread, I am not pushing my own agenda in the thread, and I do not hide any of my reasoning from the thread.
I already told you people to look at the people who didn't vote Mderg D1. Scum never votes together. It simply doesn't happen ever. If I had to guess I would say Snickers is the scummer between the 4 but he is on Mderg ass since D1 so meh. Snickers hasn't been answering any of my questions and is just ignoring everything and pushing Release/Mderg.
But I am not pushing anything this game.
People that lie frequently. 1.Koshi 2.Release
People that play this game annoyingly (regardless of alignment most likely) 1.YKZ 2.Chezinu
Mderg do you have a question. My filter will answer it for you. Also funny how i commented on Release's whole "case" on me and he still "thinks" i did not. Do not think it is a case since he summarizes stuff and does not quote.
Also lets see who is the first to find out that YKZ's case on mderg is repeating what me and another person said. Then he completely takes the post i quoted and says the exact same thing. He even says he is sure somebody said this.
Ace would not be proud. For his motto, "Lynch all liars"
On June 30 2014 12:25 Snickers wrote: Can I get multiple views on this.
Did I claim role at the right time? I think one of the criteria is be confirmed town. I will also try to bread crumb better.
Breadcrumb. WHAT IF YOU WOULD HAVE DIED!!!! KOSHI AND RELEASE MIGHT HAVE DIED CAUSE OF YOU!!! WITH YOU CALLING THEM SCUM AND ALL!!!
lol
Unlucky for me, you claimed when I was playing a risky game. Sorry, for exposing you. I was trying to draw out koshi. But your read did point me the right direction with Koshi. The anger from lazer confused me, plus I got busy in RL - wasn't around never lynch time. I would have joined you to switch to Koshi. Overall, you did great. As blue, you want to be reddish. That's how I role. + Show Spoiler +
On June 30 2014 12:25 Snickers wrote: Can I get multiple views on this.
Did I claim role at the right time? I think one of the criteria is be confirmed town. I will also try to bread crumb better.
Your claim timing was fine. You don't need to be confirmed town to claim. All you have to do is be convincing. Breadcrumbs are okay I guess but I don't bother with them myself. I feel that if I'm in a position where I need to claim I can prove it's real anyway, and it's always possible to forge fake breadcrumbs later out of posts you've made if you were scum.
On June 30 2014 12:25 Snickers wrote: Can I get multiple views on this.
Did I claim role at the right time? I think one of the criteria is be confirmed town. I will also try to bread crumb better.
Your claim timing was fine. You don't need to be confirmed town to claim. All you have to do is be convincing. Breadcrumbs are okay I guess but I don't bother with them myself. I feel that if I'm in a position where I need to claim I can prove it's real anyway, and it's always possible to forge fake breadcrumbs later out of posts you've made if you were scum.
On June 30 2014 12:26 Chezinu wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:08 Release wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:04 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I wonder if anyone knows why I read Chez as confirmed town.
I'll spoil you. I was sure you were town when your first response to a VE lynch was looking at the votes and calling me scum. I knew scum shot me the night before so for a scum Chezinu have the first reaction to a town lynch be to check the votes and call someone they just shot scum was inconceivably unlikely to me.
Thanks Doc. Maybe next time, I may fake mourn your death.
On June 30 2014 12:25 Snickers wrote: Can I get multiple views on this.
Did I claim role at the right time? I think one of the criteria is be confirmed town. I will also try to bread crumb better.
Your claim timing was fine. You don't need to be confirmed town to claim. All you have to do is be convincing. Breadcrumbs are okay I guess but I don't bother with them myself. I feel that if I'm in a position where I need to claim I can prove it's real anyway, and it's always possible to forge fake breadcrumbs later out of posts you've made if you were scum.
On June 30 2014 12:26 Chezinu wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:08 Release wrote:
On June 30 2014 12:04 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I wonder if anyone knows why I read Chez as confirmed town.
I'll spoil you. I was sure you were town when your first response to a VE lynch was looking at the votes and calling me scum. I knew scum shot me the night before so for a scum Chezinu have the first reaction to a town lynch be to check the votes and call someone they just shot scum was inconceivably unlikely to me.
why you and not slOosh?
Red/Blue blindness. I don't know how. I just know who is special.
EPT
- 
no bunny hops...
