|
On April 30 2014 04:44 ahswtini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2014 02:27 Amiko wrote:
@ashwtini:
We don't know how many mafia there are. In 13 player games, my guess would be 3 mafia, maybe also a serial killer. This is just based on knowing a popular 13-player setups is C9++ (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=C9%2B%2B#Setup_Determination) typically has 3 mafia.
There's no certainty, though, since our setup is different (there's no medic/doctor, for instance). 2 mafia seems too few, though, so I would say 3>4>2. We can make some better guesses after n1 - based on the number of kills it can indicate if there's a vigilante or serial killer.
You haven't talked much in thread yet, so here's a few questions:
- Any thoughts on sweetfrost at this point in the game?
- What is your current position on yell0w? Also, do you feel joking is indicative of being scum? Why? Sorry I didn't catch this post. My thoughts on sweetfrost are completely on the fence. They've pretty much been gunning for yellow all game, which is justifiable in a way. I posted my position on yellow a few posts ago, but basically, I don't like the joking or sarcasm because it causes confusion and is really something town could do without.
The fact that he(she?) found this proves that ahs reread the thread. That shows introspection. Which gives me a slight town read on him/her.
|
On April 30 2014 04:40 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Other than your yellow read, what are your reads, @sweetfrost?
Well as I stated I suspect Bunny being scum for his efforts of trying very hard to build up a positive relationship with everyone. See my previous posts.
As for the rest I'm very unsure and still don't want to give a public opinion on anyone since it would just be misleading, I don't have an opinion on the rest yet. So the only thing I'm willing to say right now is that I don't trust Bunny and Yellow.
|
Sweet, I want to call attention to what I was talking about earlier. I noticed you have not responded to either of my posts to you, and I want to get your thoughts on this.
@Sweetfrost: I want to point out to you that in no way I was defending the vote on you. Please reread what I posted. I was curious as to why my initial vote on Yell0w, given with reason as to why I thought he was scum, was scummy when eden was just throwing random votes left and right, and not getting called scum for it. I'm trying to find who the mafia are, and Eden, well, not sure what Eden was doing except maybe get conversation going. I think he could have gone about it a better way, but yeah.
On April 30 2014 03:11 27ninjabunnies wrote:Show nested quote +On April 29 2014 23:29 Sweetfrost wrote:
I also checked ninjabunnies filter and it seems you try way to hard to act the role of a Helix worshipper. Trying hard to win people to his side and even defending me when I get random voted which I appriciate but it also makes me suspicous that he is actually trying to win my trust. As soon as Yell0w became a suspect he has been pushing his guiltiness hard.
I'm not sure what to make of this yet but I have a feeling that either Yell0w or ninjabunnies could be scum. But only one of them. I want to also comment on this. I stated in previous post I was not defending your vote, you can read that for yourself. I don't see how I have been pushing guiltiness hard. I have claimed multiple times in this forum I pushed to get reads, and I got them. I even then went as far as changing my vote off of Yell0w. If I was pushing hard, don't you think my vote would still be on him?
|
On April 30 2014 04:57 Sweetfrost wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2014 04:40 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Other than your yellow read, what are your reads, @sweetfrost? Well as I stated I suspect Bunny being scum for his efforts of trying very hard to build up a positive relationship with everyone. See my previous posts. As for the rest I'm very unsure and still don't want to give a public opinion on anyone since it would just be misleading, I don't have an opinion on the rest yet. So the only thing I'm willing to say right now is that I don't trust Bunny and Yellow.
Also, you say you don't trust either me or Yell0w.
Do you think Yell0w and I are mafia partners, and if so what has pointed you towards that direction?
|
@bunnies
He actually previously stated that you or me were mafia, but not both.
|
On April 30 2014 04:52 27ninjabunnies wrote:Show nested quote +On April 29 2014 23:54 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Okay, it's morning now.
After a brief read-through of the whole thread, this is what I've come up with.
I've cleared bunnies, epishade, eden, yellow.
Amiko came in, but left abruptly. He's more active in the other games. Possible scum.
Tambo scum read, but stronger than amiko.
Meat possibly town, he didn't talk much, but I think I'll chalk that up to first game.
Rit & drav haven't talked enough for me to get a read on them.
Dfs seems maf because of a little thing - he calls everybody scum until cleared, which is contradictory since he calls some people towny beforehand.
Ash and frost haven't talked enough for me to get a read on them.
Current reads: Tambo scum, Dfs possible scum, Amiko possible scum, Bunnies, eden, epishade, yellow town in that order. Okay, sqrt, seeing as you want to get conversation going, I'm going to address you here. I hve read through your filter, and I see you haven't contributed much the first pages. Then you come back, say you are going to dig a bit deeper, and these are the reads you give. I want to talk about a few of them. One: Why have you cleared yellow? You have stated you don't THINK he is mafia, and a few reasons why, but why is he absolutely cleared? You also claimed you liked what yell0w wrote in one of his posts. But that's all you said. What about Yell0w post did you specifically like? I see you have cleared amiko for talking more, but what about Amiko's reads do you like? Also, specifically what do you think about the pointing out of the interaction between me, Eden and Epishade? Why is tamburini a stronger scum read than Amiko?
Yellow is cleared for the reason I stated earlier.
On April 30 2014 02:36 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
I've cleared yellow as town, but at the bottom of the scale. Why? It's because I have greater suspicions on other people, and those other people are pushing yellow.
I liked yellow's post here:
On April 30 2014 02:39 Yell0w wrote:
And about the whole "why do I think bunnies is town" situation, it's just because Occam's razor, she might be mafia, and made a good play to make us think she's town, it's a possibility, but it's unlikely. But there is a red flag next to her name in my head. And I was never really suspicious of her, I kind of implied she might be mafia, it was mostly just to see her reaction to that, she pretty much just ignored it so I don't think I got anything from that, but overall I believe her, for now. Mostly because she kept pushing even though nobody seemed to really agree with her, it took a little bit before she unvoted me.
And about Epishade, I think it's just because he was the first to defend me, which would make no sense as a mafia play, why wouldn't he just jump on the BW of an easy lynch? The possibility raised by dravernor that they're both mafia and made this plot so both of them would look town is, I think, unlikely, because, again, Occam's razor.
But I'm not sure on either of them, it's just the most likely scenario is that they're both town, by a pretty wide margin, I think.
And about Eden, I was asked, though I was planning on talking about it a little bit anyways, he was actually the person I thought was the most suspicious last night, I just don't think his behavior made sense. I didn't have time to analyse it fully though and I will probably talk about it some more, but I am glad someone brought it up.
I liked how he thought about Epishade and you. You two are pushing him. You might be both mafia. If one of you flips mafia, it would imply that the other one is also mafia, as you two are the ones pushing him the most. But I've cleared both of you. He cleared both of you in this post, for the simple reason that you guys can't be mafia together because it would be too obvious.
I liked how he thought of this.
I liked the fact that Amiko made reads. It made me think he's trying to figure this out, so I cleared him for it.
Eden hasn't been interacting much, but you and epishade are kind of in the same boat. Possible masons? Not sure. I think both town.
|
@Sweet, this doesn't make sense. Mafia wouldn't bus D1. Bunnies and yellow together as mafia doesn't make sense.
|
On April 30 2014 05:06 Yell0w wrote:
@bunnies
He actually previously stated that you or me were mafia, but not both.
Oh yes, I know, I read that. But he jst said that he doesn't trust either of us.
hence my questioning to him.
|
Well, I'm willing to bet that scum team isn't bunnies + yellow or epishade + yellow.
|
Wait, is it possible that there's 3 mafia? All the other newbie games had 2.
|
@Sqrt, and your thoughts on tamburini?
|
On April 30 2014 05:09 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
@Sweet, this doesn't make sense. Mafia wouldn't bus D1. Bunnies and yellow together as mafia doesn't make sense.
If you would have read my previous posts you would have noticted that I said that if one of them is scum the other is not.
|
If everyone would have payed attenion to my question, Sweet had said he didn't trust either Yell0w or myself. He thinks one of us is scum, but not the other. I understand that.
What I want to know is which one he thinks is more scummy? Why?
Also, the fact that sweet doesn't want to talk about anyone else puts me in suspicion.
@Sweet- There have been many contributors to this conversation. Amiko, Ahs, Epishade, Eden, Tamburini, Sqrt. Can you give any reads on any of them from how they have talked, interacted, etc?
|
So Eden voted against me in the voting thread and didn't say why here, so I'm pretty curious.
|
On April 30 2014 05:11 27ninjabunnies wrote:
@Sqrt, and your thoughts on tamburini?
{Possibly mafia. He pushed yellow first. His whole case against yellow is just strange. I don't like him.
|
Yeah, eden's starting to look a lot fishy. He isn't contributing anything really. I'm voting him.
|
@Yell0w, I was just about to point that out, but you beat me to it.
So yes, Eden silent voted in the vote forum, and never placed his vote here.
I also want to point out he hasn't said anything since I answered him about tamburini and my suspect on him.
|
On April 30 2014 05:20 sqrtofneg1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2014 05:11 27ninjabunnies wrote:
@Sqrt, and your thoughts on tamburini? {Possibly mafia. He pushed yellow first. His whole case against yellow is just strange. I don't like him.
Actually I pushed Yell0w first.
When I got off of Yell0w, tamburini jumped back on him
What do you think about this?
|
##UNVOTE
##VOTE Yell0w
I reread his filter and I don't like it at all. I put my vote down while I was writing this. Here's what I've got.
N.B.: I've only thoroughly read his filter so far, haven't fully caught up in the thread proper. I've read a few things here and there to get context on his posts, but that's about it.
- Initial interactions with bunnies: Upon rereading his filter, I don't like the tone of this post:
On April 29 2014 12:18 Yell0w wrote:
Well I am glad this issue got resolved rather peacefully, I now unfortunately have to sleep, but I will see you all tomorrow.
Also I'm pretty convinced bunnies is town now, probably epishade too, the rest I don't know.
bunnies certainly didn't seem to think the issue was resolved, for one. Seems like he's a little eager to sweep aside bunnies's initial prodding. His reaction also doesn't line up with his words before. He called bunnies "insane" for her line of questioning, then is immediately okay with her 20 minutes later.
There's some other stuff that's wrong too, namely...
On April 29 2014 11:33 Yell0w wrote:
And in how many games have you been where somebody claim town and ends up being mafia? I think that happens more often than people who claim mafia and are mafia, therefore I'm statistically innocent.
Please. "I think X is more likely than Y, X clears me, therefore I'm statistically innocent" is a self-evidently terrible argument.
On April 29 2014 11:46 Yell0w wrote:
@bunnies: Why would I need luck? Are you that convinced I'm mafia? Or is it that you just want to lynch me anyways for other reasons? Like, you actually are mafia and you're just jumping on any reason to lynch a town?
This an agonizing 30 minutes before townclearing her, and 10 minutes before telling Amiko that he thinks she's town. This guy is way too defensive in the face of a bad initial argument from bunnies.
- Worrying Way Too Much About Being Suspicious: I'm of course referring to this post. Who cares? What good does it do to know what rikory wanted to hear? If you're town you shouldn't care. It gets worse in his next post:
On April 29 2014 21:47 Yell0w wrote:
Just woke up, first thing I see is clearly the discussion on me restarted because I asked a question to ritoky( I think I got your name right this time), and just to make it clear here, I wasn't asking how to be more towny, I was asking him how he would have responded, because he said my response wasn't ideal, so I was curious what the ideal response, in his opinion, was, didn't know asking questions was frowned upon.
I was actually really happy with my response and wouldn't have changed it in any way, I think it created a big conversation really early in day 1, which is pretty great. And I have a coach if I have questions like "how to be more town?", I wouldn't ask that in the thread.
Still catching up though, will probably post more.
So for one, straw men like "didn't know asking questions was frowned upon" raise my red flags immediately. This isn't a genuine question or remark at all. Secondly, again, why is he so worried about what ritoky thinks? This is silly if he's town (as it's distracting from scumhunting with useless conversation) and sensible if he's scum (as it's attempting to gauge why ritoky finds it suspicious in order to change behavior and become less suspicious).
It gets better, believe it or not...
On April 29 2014 21:55 Yell0w wrote:
Just to point it out, how is this question better? She's basically asking the same thing, wondering what she did that was scummy so she can stop doing it.
I'm just saying.
Now he's whining about how bunnies isn't getting asked about the same thing, as though (a) both questions are the same in the first place and (b) in all other respects their play has been identical. I think the questions are similar but coming from different places -- bunnies is wanting to know why I'm not getting negative attention for my votes when people are calling pressure voting suspicious (town-motivated), Yell0w is just whining about how people are paying attention to him (scum-motivated or at best not-pro-town). bunnies has also separately been very proactive, Yell0w isn't (see next point).
- Reactive Behavior: Yell0w hasn't done anything to be proactive this game. Part of it is being on the defensive early, but he's had plenty of time since then to build his own cases or even question people without being questioned first. This hasn't happened as an overall trend. He's hopped on the "Eden is weird" bandwagon, conveniently mentioning that he thought me "most suspicious" last night without doing any questioning either to develop his suspicions into a coherent case or to dispel them. Just like his "suspicion" of bunnies which was dropped in about a half hour (see above), he goes from "Eden was my top suspect last night" to "His behavior was really... weird [...] but it doesn't necessarily strike me as being mafia plays, so I don't know" in about an hour.
Then immediately afterwards he jumps on "Sweetfrost is weird" when Epishade said it. This post is terrible:
On April 30 2014 04:25 Yell0w wrote:@Epishade Just wanted to say that I agree about everything you said on Sweetfrost, and I also wanted to add that I feel like he didn't even read the entire thread when he says something like: Show nested quote +On April 29 2014 23:21 Sweetfrost wrote:
I must agree that Yell0ws joking claims makes him a prime suspect. I feel he tries way to hard to convince everyone that he's not scum with his joking and sarcastic remarks. When I really don't think I made any sarcastic or joking remarks since I became a suspect, I think he just went with what tamburini said to say I'm the prime suspect without actually reading what I said. Also, unrelated, but that is actually something I wanted to talk about and forgot, I do think it's really important to act town if you're town, so other townies know you're town too, if no one believes you're town, they won't listen to you, won't lynch with you, it can lead to a mafia win just because the townies weren't being obvious townies so nobody trusted anybody.
He "wanted to add" this factoid about Sweetfrost not reading the thread, but at the same time he doesn't actually do it until someone else expresses suspicion of Sweetfrost. OK. And then this passage at the end is just full of applause lights.
tl;dr:
- interaction with bunnies isn't good at all
- way too defensive
- not proactive or scumhunting at all
Vote Yell0w.
|
Okay, I see what you're getting at. Other than Yellow, who else do you suspect, and who have you cleared?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
