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PYP: League of Legends Mafia - Page 14

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geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 00:54 GMT
#4486
On December 06 2013 15:47 geript wrote:
@Austin. Honestly I'm frustratingly mixed on MZ. Like I think you have a great point that he doesn't push his scumreads half as forcefully as he does his VE townread. Like that's you're best point. But I feel like I have a really good grasp on WoS (<3 you wubbybumpkins--except you know making my player Uzi is totally a bastard host move), so I can understand his faith in that read.

But there's a point in the game where on D1 I'm a huge topic of issue but he doesn't follow up on it. It's like the perfect time to push me as scum and push me pretty hard as he likely could completely get away with it. On the reverse side, there's this post
Show nested quote +
On December 04 2013 16:13 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
here's what I got out of geript:

never once does he properly analyze oats and is content to simply lean on his "gut read"

he constantly talks about both oats and jay but never really tries to get people to join him and instead simply tells people to vote them because his targets are guaranteed scum.

The biggest thing I get out of geript is a bunch of noise and posts without doing anything substantial. For instance, he has his main targets but he brings up others on the side and never follows up. He's in that twilight zone where you can't blame him for the bum mislynch but he was definitely involved.

Probably the biggest thing in geript's favor is calling out people like austin and coag, both of whom are low content lurkers. If he's scum he could be bussing his teammates but it's a point in his favor that he doesn't let them fall through the cracks. However the reason why this doesn't clear him is because he never follows up with any of this. It's easy enough to call out lurkers as scum but he never actually follows through which makes me think this was an effort to appear protown.

geript is frustratingly inconclusive for me. He's done things I feel are scummy (hence my gutread) but I couldn't put it into a coherent analysis. This is the problem I was running into earlier in the game when I was looking at geript and sadly bum's death hasn't really made it any easier. He could be scum but I'd rather look into bum's other suspects right now.

Which I really don't like. He comes to a similar-ish conclusion to Prome (who gave me a stronger townie lean), like I don't like the thought process like this coming out of a vet. As a counter point:
Show nested quote +
On December 04 2013 20:29 Promethelax wrote:
geript hard defends Rayn d0 and really puts his foot down about it. He takes a hard stance which I rather like. Its odd, everything I'm seeing seems to objectively point to scum but I don't find it convincing. There is something in how geript is thinking that seems silly but not scummy maybe? I can't explain it right. He is ringing all the scum bells but it feels like he is ringing them for the wrong reasons. He has all this ill founded bravado that I think would be hard for him to do as scum. He is very in your face and it seems townie.

I like geript's day one play, he is all around the place. Starts on jay but doesn't stick. Has gotten over his bad tunnel. HIts oats.

People who are all over the place, to me, tend to read as town. Like it's very hard to bounce between reads as scum and continue to juggle that. This is a "tell" that I've seen be so true so often and, iirc, many "pros" tend to share.

Next this is going to seem really weird to bring up, but I seem to have skimmed some important stuff.
[insert Jay's post on VE]
Here's 3 near instantaneous reactions
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2013 02:17 VisceraEyes wrote:
Jay where were posts like that one like...all game long?

Show nested quote +
On December 05 2013 02:17 Koshi wrote:
That post makes jay town in my book. Don't know if it makes VE more scum but delurk is delurky.

Show nested quote +
On December 05 2013 02:24 marvellosity wrote:
[i]I sat there and thought huh, that's interesting. Let's look in these spoilers. Oh yeah, VE did do that stuff jay said. He's actually gone and researched this. Hmm, this is an interesting perspective which gave some thought. *goes to move jay back from scummy to null in spreadsheet*. I wonder if it genuinely makes VE scummy or if it's just coincidence? Probably just coincidence for now, but it's interesting at any rate.

Like when I saw MZ and Marv's interaction and had to go back and reread Jay's post, my reaction was literally just like Koshi's. "wow that makes jay look towny."
MZ's reaction to Koshi seems really out of place and wrong. When good players read things completely differently that tends to be a warning flag for me.

Another thing that really bothers me is this:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2013 01:30 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
...you made kurumi get himself modkilled... have you ever seen a scum do that?

This seems like a really weird reaction to me. It's always been true that I've seen town get other town modkilled. Perhaps MZ's experience is different, but LIX is a good example of where Toadestern and somebody else ended up getting modkilled because other town brought up the rules and stuff and pushed it. In general, town tends to push other town to get modkilled and not the other way around so it seems really weird to me that this is his reaction.

In summary after looking and thinking more about his filter, I'd be down for a MZ lynch but not for most of the reasons you posted.
[/b]
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 01:15 GMT
#4504
On December 07 2013 10:12 jaybrundage wrote:
KK lets talk on consolidating on Roffles or austin. If your town you should get off the MZ wagon. Letting there be three wagons lets scum manipulate it much easier. We should narrow this down between 2 people. I'm still on the fence regarding the two.

But MZ should NOT be a lynch candidate today.

Saying it does not make it so. Make a point that we can read/discuss. Otherwise I'm going with the reasons I've posted.

As a matter of fact, the fact that MZ didn't know why I was voting him shows me he isn't/hasn't read the thread.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 01:53 GMT
#4529
On December 07 2013 10:24 jaybrundage wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 07 2013 10:15 geript wrote:
On December 07 2013 10:12 jaybrundage wrote:
KK lets talk on consolidating on Roffles or austin. If your town you should get off the MZ wagon. Letting there be three wagons lets scum manipulate it much easier. We should narrow this down between 2 people. I'm still on the fence regarding the two.

But MZ should NOT be a lynch candidate today.

Saying it does not make it so. Make a point that we can read/discuss. Otherwise I'm going with the reasons I've posted.

As a matter of fact, the fact that MZ didn't know why I was voting him shows me he isn't/hasn't read the thread.

Geript do you have anything to add to the case supersoft posted on MZ. Before you say I haven't been reading the thread I stated that I was 20 pages behind. Do you agree with the SS summary or do you have a post or something you would like me to read.

I made a post on MZ that I've quoted twice I think. Also posted it recently to MZ.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 02:34 GMT
#4575
MZ could you address my points plz.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 02:49 GMT
#4606
MZ the crux of my arguments I feel are based on the fact that you seem to come to wildly different conclusions or reactions than I'd expect town to have. The point of the Koshi thing isn't you jumping on Koshi, it's the fact that, while Jay's analysis wasn't great, it showed towny mentality. You're response was "sure give a free pass to everyone". Like that comes more from scum losing a mislynch to me more than town frustration. Plus, if you thought his conclusion was wrong it makes more sense to point it out and pressure Jay more.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 02:52 GMT
#4615
On December 07 2013 11:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
I don't want you dead bbygrl

8 minutes explain who you want dead then.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 02:55 GMT
#4626
On December 07 2013 11:49 geript wrote:
MZ the crux of my arguments I feel are based on the fact that you seem to come to wildly different conclusions or reactions than I'd expect town to have. The point of the Koshi thing isn't you jumping on Koshi, it's the fact that, while Jay's analysis wasn't great, it showed towny mentality. You're response was "sure give a free pass to everyone". Like that comes more from scum losing a mislynch to me more than town frustration. Plus, if you thought his conclusion was wrong it makes more sense to point it out and pressure Jay more.

geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 03:00 GMT
#4638
I'm going to b really mad if I took the hammer off scum.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 03:16 GMT
#4658
Were lynch Coag tomorrow. Period. Ryan's you were wrong. I'm not trusting you as town anymore.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 03:53 GMT
#4670
I'm done I'm not going to play this anymore. Coagulation not getting mod killed for inactivity or for obviously only "playing for his on enjoyment by lessening the enjoyment of the group" is unacceptable to me. There no point to play a game to have fun that has Coag in it. I'm not having fun. The people in this game aren't making it fun to play. The mods have chosen not to take action. There's no point for me to play.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 07 2013 04:10 GMT
#4672
On December 07 2013 13:05 Coagulation wrote:
I clearly havnt done anything.

Well this part is as least true.
The fact that you're happy to flaunt that you are doing the exact minimum to not get mod killed is reason enough. Congratulations though, you're the primary reason why I'm leaving the community. You must be proud of yourself.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 23 2013 20:16 GMT
#8374
On December 24 2013 03:57 Koshi wrote:
geript was interesting. Vote change and kill townie over scum and then ragequit cuz he was annoyed by a scummer -_-*

Sure Coag pissed me the hell off, but I was honestly far more pissed off by the fact that the mods hadn't taken care of him before then. That type of play is 100% unacceptable imo and if I had been the mod I would've MK'd him on D1 when he had 2 posts for the whole day regardless of any reason he gives/gave. If you /in or /replace in a game and are selected to play, then I expect you to try regardless of alignment. I find it exceptionally ironic that his play has been deemed "acceptable" and my play not (as clearly evidence by mod ban request choices).
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 23 2013 20:40 GMT
#8378
On December 24 2013 05:25 Dandel Ion wrote:
So policy lynch him.

Hosts are not your free policy lynches on players that didn't even break any rules.

Ok. Then I will specifically join games you join and make mandatory posts and nothing more just to force you to policy lynch me. You will see how "fun" that becomes.

On December 24 2013 05:27 jaybrundage wrote:
Lurking is a strategy as scum. Granted not a great one.

There's a difference between "lurking" and not playing. Coag did the latter.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 23 2013 20:47 GMT
#8381
On December 24 2013 05:43 Kurumi wrote:
Coagulation has played like this since I remember, as I talked with people on TS I would've told you that he is probably scum, but in a fit of rage I decided to kill myself. Sorry guys. He either posts cryptic stuff/laid back stuff when he has a cool role, does nothing if he is town OR annoys people who he thinks are scum, if he is scum he just goes "gonna cruise to victory because town never policy lynches".

Just because that type of play has been around since the Stone Age it doesn't mean that type of play should be allowed. It doesn't matter it it were Coag or Marv or god herself.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 23 2013 20:57 GMT
#8383
On December 24 2013 05:54 justanothertownie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 24 2013 05:47 geript wrote:
On December 24 2013 05:43 Kurumi wrote:
Coagulation has played like this since I remember, as I talked with people on TS I would've told you that he is probably scum, but in a fit of rage I decided to kill myself. Sorry guys. He either posts cryptic stuff/laid back stuff when he has a cool role, does nothing if he is town OR annoys people who he thinks are scum, if he is scum he just goes "gonna cruise to victory because town never policy lynches".

Just because that type of play has been around since the Stone Age it doesn't mean that type of play should be allowed. It doesn't matter it it were Coag or Marv or god herself.

Then try to lynch him for it. What you did was way worse and much more frustrating to me than coags playstyle.

So you're saying I should improve up to Coag's style. Thank you for proving my point. Ask and ye shall receive.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 23 2013 21:08 GMT
#8388
On December 24 2013 05:59 kitaman27 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 24 2013 05:16 geript wrote:
On December 24 2013 03:57 Koshi wrote:
geript was interesting. Vote change and kill townie over scum and then ragequit cuz he was annoyed by a scummer -_-*

Sure Coag pissed me the hell off, but I was honestly far more pissed off by the fact that the mods hadn't taken care of him before then. That type of play is 100% unacceptable imo and if I had been the mod I would've MK'd him on D1 when he had 2 posts for the whole day regardless of any reason he gives/gave. If you /in or /replace in a game and are selected to play, then I expect you to try regardless of alignment. I find it exceptionally ironic that his play has been deemed "acceptable" and my play not (as clearly evidence by mod ban request choices).


I don't think it's reasonable to expect the hosts to enforce rules that don't exist. The rule for this game was one post per cycle. Coag did not violate this rule. While I agree that the activity rules may need to be reevaluated, that's something that should be discussed regarding future games, not the current one. Furthermore, coag was mafia and extreme lurking is a viable strategy if he is playing towards his win condition. Whether or not it should be an accepted strategy can be up for discussion, but it has been accepted in the past and there is certainly no reason to expect a modkill for it this game.

Play to win.
This means you play your best to help your team win while you are alive and in the game. This does not mean, for example, that you should try to win by being a jerk to the other players so they all want to quit playing. If you're not playing to win you risk a modkill. This also means that you cannot leave the game without a good reason without a ban. These situations will be dealt with on a case by case basis. PM your host if you need to leave the game; I will attempt to accommodate.

So this wasn't in the OP? So "playing to win" doesn't include playing the game? I firmly disagree with you. There's a clear difference between Lurking and not fucking posting at all ever. In the ~150-200 pages that Coag played the game, he had a page and a half of filter. Being 3.33% to 4.54% of the player but posting < 1% of the discourse while having 0 content whatsoever, that's playing to win as scum? That's not playing to win as any alignment. Expect me to come back as fast as I can to implement this "winning strategy" regardless of alignment.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
December 24 2013 08:42 GMT
#8426
Yup from here on out I will never have more than 5 posts per cycle. Probly less.
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