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On September 15 2013 06:30 Old Partner wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 06:29 Pandain wrote:
So was I right or not in that disregarding OP's vote, who I didn't see because it literally came at the last second, OP was going to be lynched? And that only switching to blubbers would change to outcome? Not to be contrary here because I like you being alive pandain, but blubbers got lynched anyways. if I had voted blubbdavid instead of zealos, nothing would have changed. I voted Zealos because I was freaking out and saw what I thought was a last-minute swap to him, and wanted to make sure it would work.
I didn't see your vote.
Note when I was like "well this was interesting" after I voted because I then saw your vote, which was amusing in more ways than one because you just suddenly appeared and also I didn't know exactly was the outcome then.
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On September 15 2013 06:31 Papa_Smurf wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 06:29 Pandain wrote:
So was I right or not in that disregarding OP's vote, who I didn't see because it literally came at the last second, OP was going to be lynched? And that only switching to blubbers would change to outcome? If you did the same process as I did, you would have thought OP was behind zealos by 2 votes. If you did math based on correcting the votecount yourself, you would have had OP behind zealos by 1 vote
What do you mean?
Where was the vote count incorrect?
Again I don't think any of this matters because townies make mistakes but it was OP 4, Zealos 4. And since OP was there first, he would've gotten lynched.
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On September 15 2013 06:31 Pandain wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 06:30 Old Partner wrote:On September 15 2013 06:29 Pandain wrote:
So was I right or not in that disregarding OP's vote, who I didn't see because it literally came at the last second, OP was going to be lynched? And that only switching to blubbers would change to outcome? Not to be contrary here because I like you being alive pandain, but blubbers got lynched anyways. if I had voted blubbdavid instead of zealos, nothing would have changed. I voted Zealos because I was freaking out and saw what I thought was a last-minute swap to him, and wanted to make sure it would work. I didn't see your vote. Note when I was like "well this was interesting" after I voted because I then saw your vote, which was amusing in more ways than one because you just suddenly appeared and also I didn't know exactly was the outcome then.
Pandain please answer, how did you calculate your votecount?
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It wasn't really calculating, and my memory is hazy because it happened last night and then someone woke me up at 4 am and really disrupted my memory of events before(basically something big happened), and I wasn't thinking I would have to defend myself.
Basically here:
I paniced, didn't think we would get votes for OP. By my reasoning(which I forget how I did because I didn't think it would matter), OP was going to be lynched. Given that I didn't think he was scum or that we would get another vote, I voted blubber who was more likely.
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But my reasoning was correct anyway so all of your assumptions are really failing, I'll look into Grack's post now though as I think he brought up something else he thought was suspicious.
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On September 15 2013 06:35 Pandain wrote:
It wasn't really calculating, and my memory is hazy because it happened last night and then someone woke me up at 4 am and really disrupted my memory of events before(basically something big happened), and I wasn't thinking I would have to defend myself.
Basically here:
I paniced, didn't think we would get votes for OP. By my reasoning(which I forget how I did because I didn't think it would matter), OP was going to be lynched. Given that I didn't think he was scum or that we would get another vote, I voted blubber who was more likely.
So you didn't look at this votecount
On September 14 2013 06:38 ShiaoPi wrote:
Day 1 Votecount:
strongandbig(0): Koshi, Papa_Smurf, Koshi, raynpelikoneet, Zealos, blubbdavid, raynpelikoneet
VayneAuthority(0): Papa_Smurf
WaveofShadow(0): kushm4sta
Grackaroni(0): WaveofShadow
kushm4sta(4): Papa_Smurf, Pandain, Old Partner, Papa_Smurf, Zealos
Pandain(0): Grackaroni
Old Partner(6): raynpelikoneet Grackaroni, Oatsmaster, blubbdavid, Umasi, raynpelikoneet, WaveofShadow
Koshi(0): blubbdavid
blubbdavid(4): VayneAuthority, Grackaroni, Sn0_man, Umasi, Papa_Smurf, raynpelikoneet, kushm4sta, Koshi
Zealos(1): blubbdavid, strongandbig
raynpelikoneet(0): strongandbig
Currently Old Partner is set to be lynched! Remember, voting is mandatory!
Next deadline:
Deadline date: Friday, Sep 13 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)
and then use addition and subtraction for the next three vote switches?
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ok Pandain i'm not really sure what you're getting at here with sn0_man. He was one of the earlier BD votes, and he made some poorly-founded accusatory statements about you (like scum blue-hunting publically makes sense, lol), and he makes some weird noises about not wanting me lynched near the deadline (scum setting up the BD lynch for D2? maybe) but ultimately, it's not like he was that upset with me getting lynched. sn0 seemed happy with the following lynches
BD
pandain
OP
in that order, D1. And with it being a tossup between OP and BD, he certainly COULD have pushed harder for a BD lynch, but I don't see what's scummy about that. Are you worried about his accusations against you?
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Oh yeah, he assumed that I thought Zealos was a better lynch than Blubbers.
I don't know if that even really matters, I think he probably was in context to that time. But it was between Blubbers and OP and not OP and Zealos.
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Let me put it this way
I 'm pretty sure sn0_man won't get shot unless he's getting bluesniped. if he's town he's not really threatening anyone with strong analysis or good plays. That being said-- he acted kind of like a lazy town would when there are two competing wagons both of which he is ok with. BD happened to flip town, yes. But that doesn't make sn0_man scum. If he's scum, he's scum for other reasons.
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Never said he was scum, to be honest I haven't really looked into him. Which is why I wanted you to.
I only gave a quick read-through which didn't really bring me up any useful information, which is why I wanted you to help bring any insights.
I honestly don't see any actual accusations. And I don't feel like going through all my actions when I don't even remember all of them.
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On September 15 2013 06:37 Papa_Smurf wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 06:35 Pandain wrote:
It wasn't really calculating, and my memory is hazy because it happened last night and then someone woke me up at 4 am and really disrupted my memory of events before(basically something big happened), and I wasn't thinking I would have to defend myself.
Basically here:
I paniced, didn't think we would get votes for OP. By my reasoning(which I forget how I did because I didn't think it would matter), OP was going to be lynched. Given that I didn't think he was scum or that we would get another vote, I voted blubber who was more likely. So you didn't look at this votecount Show nested quote +On September 14 2013 06:38 ShiaoPi wrote:
Day 1 Votecount:
strongandbig(0): Koshi, Papa_Smurf, Koshi, raynpelikoneet, Zealos, blubbdavid, raynpelikoneet
VayneAuthority(0): Papa_Smurf
WaveofShadow(0): kushm4sta
Grackaroni(0): WaveofShadow
kushm4sta(4): Papa_Smurf, Pandain, Old Partner, Papa_Smurf, Zealos
Pandain(0): Grackaroni
Old Partner(6): raynpelikoneet Grackaroni, Oatsmaster, blubbdavid, Umasi, raynpelikoneet, WaveofShadow
Koshi(0): blubbdavid
blubbdavid(4): VayneAuthority, Grackaroni, Sn0_man, Umasi, Papa_Smurf, raynpelikoneet, kushm4sta, Koshi
Zealos(1): blubbdavid, strongandbig
raynpelikoneet(0): strongandbig
Currently Old Partner is set to be lynched! Remember, voting is mandatory!
Next deadline:
Deadline date: Friday, Sep 13 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00)
and then use addition and subtraction for the next three vote switches?
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This is all getting to be spam. You guys can consolidate your posts and then say why you think I'm scum and I'll address them. Otherwise this is getting confusing to read and will be more usefully addressed after the flips.
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On September 15 2013 06:40 Pandain wrote:
Never said he was scum, to be honest I haven't really looked into him. Which is why I wanted you to.
I only gave a quick read-through which didn't really bring me up any useful information, which is why I wanted you to help bring any insights.
I honestly don't see any actual accusations. And I don't feel like going through all my actions when I don't even remember all of them.
Oh,
On September 13 2013 06:34 Sn0_Man wrote:
Pandain is only understandable if you assume he is scum. Then it starts to make sense.
On September 13 2013 05:40 Sn0_Man wrote:
Since you have yet to learn to read rayn,
1) Pandain is blue hunting. This is 100% unarguably SCUM MOTIVATED.
2) Pandain wants to lynch kush. His reason? we can't hit scum. YEAH RIGHT. SCUM MOTIVATED.
3) Pandain sees pressuring himself as townie. THATS IMPLIED GUILT. SCUMMY.
4) this one is dumber but pandain literally claims "nobody has reasons for lynching blubbers just gut" after everybody explained why blubbers was looking like scum. This one could be explained as Pandain merely lacking a brain but I was going with scum.
This is entirely apart from his awful thread entry and other crap like "I'm the towniest guy in the thread" like what bollocks.
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On September 15 2013 06:28 Pandain wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2013 06:25 Grackaroni wrote:On September 15 2013 05:59 Pandain wrote:The talking about whether OP is SK or Survivor is useless and doesn't affect us. There's no way to definitely tell the difference as they're both third party and have the same motives (survive at all costs), as well as help get rid of people who threaten them. I don't think there's much use in the speculation, I agree with vayne's analysis of leave him as a back-up lynch in case we're uncertain on who to lynch. As for me Furthermore anyone who thinks I'm scum ignores the fact that I have been suspicious of Zealos before and even posted this here. Also quote of mine: SnB isn't scum, blubbers seems bad but not certain enough for scum. Zealos also seems scum but again I think we need more information.
I was like the first one(I think, or at least significant one) to actually analyze Zealos and point out suspicious behaviors besides just generic "being useless." I had switched to Zealos(why even encourage that bandwagon in the first place if I never wanted him to be lynched, it easily could have gone out of my control if I was scum.) In fact, I hadn't realized OP had voted, and thought that he was going to be lynched instead of zealous. I would rather have had blubbers lynched instead of OP which is why I changed my vote. I don't know how I would have voted between blubbers and zealous. Furthermore you assume Zealos is scum which isn't certain. Even if he is, it wouldn't mean I would be scum. As I mentioned before, I had thought it was between OP and Blubbers and made sure my vote counted and chose blubbers. I know you were suspicious of Zealos that's the crux of my argument. you indicated time and time again that Zealos was suspicious. You believed blub could be mafia but was not as good of a lynch as Zealos and that you wanted to leave him alive because you can read him more easily later. You did vote between Zealos and Blubbers, you unvoted Zealos and voted for Blubbers. You posted your reasoning at the time for not wanting to lynch Zealos once people started actually pushing on him and it was shady. It looks to me a lot like you were soft bussing Zealos and then when people actually started moving on to him you got cold feet and panicked. When did I say Zealos was a better lynch than Blub?
You say it several times in your filter, including in the quote you posted in your defense saying I was wrong because you were suspicious of Zealos.
I get your point about not knowing BH's vote count. without that vote Zealos wouldn't have been lynched. But I have no way of knowing though if you switched your vote because you didn't see BH's post and OP was going to be lynched if you didn't or if you switched your vote because you actually did see BH's last second vote and realized that Zealos was the person getting lynched and moved to Blubbers.
The reasons you were using to discourage people from voting Zealos at the end of the day were suspicious.
He might be blue?? Who backs off on a scumread because they might be blue?
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This is retarded. I don't even feel like even addressing these arguments.
Even if I was wrong in any way, it doesn't mean anything and doesn't say I'm scum. If anything how active I was proves I wasn't scum.
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Gotta leave early. Here are my reads thus far.
Vayne
Things I don't like
strong town read SnB early game and hard defend
Lack of activity close to lynch
Goes "vote blubb" ---> won't keep my vote on blubb ---> keeps vote on blubb
Things I do like
The "aha" moment when he realized I was debears>>>>>>oh shit "I got you cornered scum" reaction because you just played with me
Overall read: Slight Town
Grackaroni
Things I don't like
inactivity near lynch
Things I like
His general thought process this game (we've been on the same page)
His analysis on Pandain in terms of voting zealos
Overall: Town, my strongest town read
Pandain
Things I don't like
That vote on blubb over zealos
Things I like
His overall logic and approach to the game
Overall: Null leaning slightly scum. The blubb vote was sooooo weird. I would be voting him if I didn't have a strong town read on him before that. If zealos is scum, Panda is likely scum
Raynp
Things I don't like
How emotional and dickish he got on the second half of d1 (see him badgering me on the kush case, just how much of an ass he was to everyone in general that didn't agree with his SnB read)
How much he was unwilling to budge in his reasoning
How he just gave up on his "sure scum read" in SnB, despite how convinced he was.
Things I like
Not really anything
Overall: Null. I have thought he is scum in both games I played with. His town meta is scummy as shit. Don't push him d2. Look at his voting and voting reasoning for best read. His overly emotional play this game IS quite different from his town games if I'm correct, but I'll have to double check.
Zealos
Things I don't like
Everything about him
Pandain not voting him when Pandain said he's scum
Things I like
Nothing
Overall: Kill it with fire status
BH
Things I don't like
He switched his vote when he was actually safe if he didn't
He still seems unwilling to help town (which means he thing mafia will win, or he is mafia)
Things I like
Just BH in general :D
Overall: I'm willing to believe his claim for now. I don't really want to lynch him d2. I think his true alignment will be clarified through nk analysis and such
SnB
Things I don't like
His general inactivity after the start
Things I like
His posting near deadline on zealos and against pandain not voting zealos
Overall: Slight town. The reasoning for his lynch earlier seemed pretty poor at best and the wagon came out of nowhere from Ryanp and Koshi
Kush
Things I don't like
Everything
How everyone soft defends him "he'll become readable" when he has shown he will not read or post reads and based off on good town game
Things I like
Nothing
Overall: Kill it with fire. God I hope he gets vigged.
Umasi
Overall: No idea. Probably won't care until d3 (if i even make it there o.O)
Oats
Overall: Reading this dude based on his posting doesn't really happen for me. Need dat votes analysis.
WoS
Things I don't like
Him saying "I won't be here friday and saturday" ----> proceeds to lurk most of d1. Only kind of read is on grack the whole time
His reasoning on Grack seemed ultimately flawed
Things I like
Nothing
Overall: Slight scum. I wouldn't argue against his lynch.
Koshi
Things I don't like
He seems to be flipflopping (like he said I was 4th on his scumlist before lynch then suddenly he keeps asking me to join a zealos/op/pand/someone else voting wagon. That doesn't make sense).
His agreement and hard defense of Raynp's SnB read
His association between me and Blubb (the reasoning was god awful)
Things I like
His early posting
Overall: Null leaning scum. Need to really take a close look at him to sure up the read.
sn0
Things I don't like
He's flown way under the radar since the beginning of the game
How sure he is that I'm town
Things I like
Nothing pops out
Overall: Null leaning scum. Pressure him if I'm not alive
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PS since there is a non-zero chance you got shot could you indicate which NKs tonight would indicate town shouldn't lynch me kkthxbai
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If I die, lynch Kush. If he is then scum, lynch Rayn.
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There's a non-trivial case for lynching Kush regardless.
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Quick thoughts on Rayn as for the connection:
Utterly not considering Kush at ALL for scum, despite how active he is in trying to find any reason why anyone is scum.
Trying to plant suspicion on literally everyone I think is town(this is omgus, I know, but when it's to this large degree I think it means something).
Not really reacting to my thinking he's scum.
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EPT
