• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:36
CET 09:36
KST 17:36
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros0[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win42025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales!9BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION1Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams10Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest4
StarCraft 2
General
RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" DreamHack Open 2013 revealed Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win
Tourneys
Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $3,500 WardiTV Korean Royale S4
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment
Brood War
General
Ladder Map Matchup Stats BW General Discussion BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION ASL final tickets help
Strategy
How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
MLB/Baseball 2023 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Analysis of the Trump-Lee S…
Peanutsc
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
The Benefits Of Limited Comm…
TrAiDoS
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Certified Crazy
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1529 users

Newbie Mini Mafia XLIII - Page 99

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 97 98 99
Aquanim
Profile Joined November 2012
Australia2849 Posts
July 08 2013 03:21 GMT
#1961
I see what you're saying about the rest of the situation (particularly why Onegu had to claim as scum too), but personally I think a scum Alakaslam would almost have had no choice other than to counterclaim at that point...

If you look at the playerlist at that point:
+ Show Spoiler +

FirmTofu
Hurricane Sponge
hzflank
Aquanim

Onegu
Alakaslam
Spicydinosaur
LoneMeow
StiMaDDict

The green indicates the people who I think scum could not reasonably count on mislynching (if Alakaslam was scum). If Onegu goes uncounterclaimed he's almost certain not to be lynched, and after that there aren't enough mislynches in the town for scum to win. If they secure an Onegu mislynch, even if Alakaslam is lynched afterwards, they only need to make sure the last null-zone townie is lynched before both of them - a reasonable proposition.

You said that scum can't trade 1 for 1 because the numbers aren't in their favour, but if you look at the math in this way:
- Scum need two mislynches to win
- Town need three scum lynches to win
a 1 for 1 trade might actually benefit scum.

Also, momentum was building for an Alakaslam lynch prior to his claim - without that claim, I think we'd have either lynched him or (possible) policy-lynched StiM. Trading his likely lynch for a chance of a lynch into a town PR would have been worthwhile IMO.

The whole thing about not understanding the ramifications of his claim should have been a tell but I've always been mistrustful of such tells, even though they generally turn out to be correct :/

This is pretty much a repeat of the argument I made at the time. Obviously it turned out not to be correct, but I think it offers a reasonable justification for why a scum Alakaslam would have "counterclaimed" Onegu. Is there some flaw with this argument I've missed?
Adam4167
Profile Joined June 2011
Australia1426 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-08 05:04:06
July 08 2013 05:01 GMT
#1962
As you pointed out, hes counterclaiming to get a chance at a 1-1 trade with a town powerrole. You cant ever be sure who the town is going to side with in these situations, even if you have an answer for every question and seem to be making sense, sometimes, someone says the right thing at the right time and you end up dead first anyway. The town lynches him first, confirms Onegu as town, things start looking very dire - if not a complete throw of the game. I'd suspect scum might be trying to deflect onto someone else instead of stepping in to claim here - Stim, the afk, for example.

I don't think hurricane would have been above lynching if Alakaslam flipped scum. He would have to explain what he was doing visiting a scum player, making it equal parts likely that he is the scum Framer himself or NN. Considering he opened the game with a plan asking the NN to claim, yet never did himself, if he claimed NN on D2 when everything went sideways, id want to lynch him on the spot.

The biggest problem with Onegu's story was simply: 'what the hell was he doing by watching someone like Alakaslam'. Watcher is a defensive role, it goes on your town reads. I know it was thrown around this game that he might have been hunting for the framer, but that wasn't even confirmed to be in the game. You know there are scum in the game, watch your biggest town read so that when he dies, you have caught the scum that delivers the KP. Fundamentally this is where the story fell down and why he should have been lynched first. When Onegu claimed he said 'I saw my biggest town read visit Alakaslam', why in all-good-christ would you out your biggest town read as also being a blue if you were town. Alakaslam tracking Onegu makes sense considering thread sentiment at the time. You cant always count on someone to use their powers correctly, but when claims come forward with such sub-optimal usage, be very wary.

Yes, anything is possible, but you need to look at what is probable. That's what this game is about, nothing is certain except what comes from your hosts.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-16 22:39:20
July 16 2013 22:39 GMT
#1963
Prev 1 97 98 99
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
23:00
Crank Gathers S2: Playoffs D2
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SortOf 113
Nina 62
StarCraft: Brood War
Hyuk 2821
Flash 2319
Killer 1280
Sea 1258
Bisu 354
Hyun 326
Larva 185
Stork 94
Shinee 57
ToSsGirL 43
[ Show more ]
EffOrt 40
yabsab 25
Sharp 11
Dota 2
XaKoH 652
NeuroSwarm112
ODPixel43
League of Legends
JimRising 724
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 152
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King193
Other Games
summit1g13633
ceh9318
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL6157
Other Games
gamesdonequick674
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 23
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH272
• LUISG 3
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2128
• Lourlo847
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
24m
OSC
3h 24m
Harstem vs SKillous
Gerald vs Spirit
Krystianer vs TriGGeR
Cham vs Ryung
CrankTV Team League
4h 24m
Team Liquid vs Team Falcon
Replay Cast
1d 1h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 3h
ByuN vs Spirit
herO vs Solar
MaNa vs Gerald
Rogue vs GuMiho
Epic.LAN
1d 3h
CrankTV Team League
1d 4h
BASILISK vs TBD
Replay Cast
2 days
Epic.LAN
2 days
BSL Team A[vengers]
2 days
Dewalt vs Shine
UltrA vs ZeLoT
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
BSL Team A[vengers]
3 days
Cross vs Motive
Sziky vs HiyA
BSL 21
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
WardiTV TLMC #15
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
BSL 21 Team A
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.