EPT##Vote ShiaoPi
Until further notice.
Catch 22 Mafia - Page 25
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yamato77
11589 Posts
##Vote ShiaoPi Until further notice. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
Got some good posting going on, and I'mma gonna catch up shortly. But first... @ GK I don't understand the first part of your case against Shaio. You identify two of his posts about his suspicions of you and state that they "contradict", however I can't see at all how that's the case: On June 21 2013 23:02 ShiaoPi wrote: gk's case on oats is pretty trash. Gut feeling says scum to me at the moment, maybe because it feels a lot like his posting last game, where we both were scum. ##vote: goodkarma oh yamato is nullish dude who looks scummy if that clarification was needed Despite you screaming about how the case is "solely on meta", that's simply not true. The bolded makes clear motive for his vote, and the meta seems very secondary. The second quote you list is perfectly consistent with this. This is basic reading GK, and the second case from you I'm reading as forced and logically-flawed. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:41 Hapahauli wrote: Yamato, I look forward to the explanation. Shaio's more recent posting moved him more back to null for me, and I really don't see what's similar about those two quotes you pointed out. 1) He makes a terrible opening post that he tries to brush off as meaningless 2) He goes on to divert attention to someone else ScumShiao | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:42 yamato77 wrote: 1) He makes a terrible opening post that he tries to brush off as meaningless 2) He goes on to divert attention to someone else ScumShiao Hah. The architecture is uncannily similar. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:47 Hapahauli wrote: Hah. The architecture is uncannily similar. And wouldn't you think that this kind of "architecture" is exactly the kind of tell that gives away scum? Note that his terrible initial posting came under fire both games, indicating that he generally has a hard time making opening posts as mafia. As a tried and true tactic for getting out of it, he explains away his posts and chooses to divert attention to someone else he can quickly come up with a case on. The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. If he's pulled this exact maneuver as scum before, why wouldn't he do it again? | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:52 yamato77 wrote: And wouldn't you think that this kind of "architecture" is exactly the kind of tell that gives away scum? Note that his terrible initial posting came under fire both games, indicating that he generally has a hard time making opening posts as mafia. As a tried and true tactic for getting out of it, he explains away his posts and chooses to divert attention to someone else he can quickly come up with a case on. The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. If he's pulled this exact maneuver as scum before, why wouldn't he do it again? No, I think it's precisely stuff like 'architecture' that's how meta is totally misapplied. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:54 marvellosity wrote: No, I think it's precisely stuff like 'architecture' that's how meta is totally misapplied. So you don't think that I'm at all accurate in my analysis of what has gone on in this game and that game? | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:55 yamato77 wrote: So you don't think that I'm at all accurate in my analysis of what has gone on in this game and that game? The problem is, yamato, "diverting attention" also translates to "talking about something else and potentially scumhunting". Say he's town for a moment, and made a dumb opening post. How should he proceed? Probably by looking for suspicious stuff and commenting on it, right? | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
On June 22 2013 03:52 yamato77 wrote: And wouldn't you think that this kind of "architecture" is exactly the kind of tell that gives away scum? It puts me on higher alert about him, but that's about it. It's definitely not damning on it's own. The main reason being that your case doesn't preclude the possibility of it being a general, non-alignment indicative posting style. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
##unvote Notably, he is on my watch list still. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
His first post/entrance on Oats was pretty bad, and his second case on Shiao is based on him clearly not reading Shiao's posts. @ Rayn Current thoughts on Yamato? @ GK Ditto on Oats? | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 04:13 Hapahauli wrote: Anyway, GK is still my top-scumread. His first post/entrance on Oats was pretty bad, and his second case on Shiao is based on him clearly not reading Shiao's posts. @ Rayn Current thoughts on Yamato? @ GK Ditto on Oats? You're not reading very hard if you think GK believes Shiao's case on him is totally meta. He says it is partly meta, which is absolutely true. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 00:58 goodkarma wrote: If your case isn't based on meta, then why are you drawing on your experience with me from last game to incorrectly reach the conclusion that I'm scum this game? You in fact are relying in part on meta here... And without any kind of understanding of my townplay as a baseline to work from at that... I would be very interested in knowing who else you think is scum, or if I'm your one and only scumread atm? | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
On June 22 2013 04:13 yamato77 wrote: I'm not entirely sold on this GK thing, though. It doesn't seem all that out of the ordinary to be confused by how Oats plays. Aside from that, I believe everything he is writing is from a town perspective. If it was GK's first time seeing Oats play, I'd understand a bit more. But he saw him in action as town last-game and should expect this wild, random behavior. Other than that, his cases just read very forced. He's harping on individual points that are incorrect (Shaio's case on GK being all meta) or non-allignment indicative (Oats moving on from his Hapa/DP scum-line) and calling people scum for it. | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=417453¤tpage=24#479 Selections: And yet your opening post that highlights why you’re voting me says it’s based on how I played last game, which is the very definition of a meta-case. Yet… Your case is in fact literally based solely on meta… Need I continue? | ||
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
On June 21 2013 23:02 ShiaoPi wrote: gk's case on oats is pretty trash. Gut feeling says scum to me at the moment, maybe because it feels a lot like his posting last game, where we both were scum. ##vote: goodkarma oh yamato is nullish dude who looks scummy if that clarification was needed Yet GK completely skips this over and screams "meta-case! meta-case!" and calls ShiaoPi scum for it. I don't buy it, and it reads as forced. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On June 22 2013 04:16 Hapahauli wrote: If it was GK's first time seeing Oats play, I'd understand a bit more. But he saw him in action as town last-game and should expect this wild, random behavior. Other than that, his cases just read very forced. He's harping on individual points that are incorrect (Shaio's case on GK being all meta) or non-allignment indicative (Oats moving on from his Hapa/DP scum-line) and calling people scum for it. The first point I've obviously proven demonstrably false. The second point is also unrepresentative of what went on, he specifically made the point multiple times that it was Oats' jump onto my wagon along with his abandonment of his other reads that made him suspicious, which I also thought was odd at the time. Later on it becomes clearer what is going on with Oats, and GK obviously realizes that as well. This is all in his filter, Hapa. | ||
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