TL Mafia LXI - Page 289

On May 16 2013 09:53 Palmar wrote:


Do you stand by your assessment that I have done no analysis or refused to give reasoning this game? Is this opinion of yours based on extensive read of my filter?

On May 16 2013 10:10 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
geript, town has played horribly to the point of appearing as scum. Given that + how quickly the first few days went with auto raping of scum its no surprise we are in this state -_-


One of WoS and palmar is likely mafia. The other is geript/giggles.

Now I say this for one simple reason. Given how many flipped roles we have of fucking with our dts (which we seem to have a bunch of) it seems unlikely to have 1 framer, 1 unaware miller, 1 aware miller, and a paranoid dt. That screams bastard hosts far to much. As such one of the two is likely mafia (having 3 roles to fuck with dts not as asshattish).

Given that I know I am town. I also think the removal of marv seems unlikely if he was mafia. As such I am inclined to say giggles mafia.

Of WoS and Palmar I would need to take a closer look at their filters.

On April 21 2013 19:36 Palmar wrote:


I think the absurdity and yet strange value of this heuristic makes Vivax very likely to be town. To the point that almost nothing would make me want to lynch him today.

Discuss.

On April 21 2013 20:00 Palmar wrote:


There are two ways of looking at your post. First option is that you're town and legitimately think I'm scum. The second is you're scum and know I'm town and thus want to discredit me.

Since you didn't present any arguments to back up your conclusion, I am inclined to think you must be scum.

So until you present a believable motivation for your accusations...

##vote Oatsmaster

On April 23 2013 00:33 Palmar wrote:
lazy ve is scum ve

##Vote VisceraEyes

On April 22 2013 08:43 Palmar wrote:
Just for the record I would be pretty heavily leaning scum on geript if it wasn't for the QT thing.

The most alarming thing is not actually the random town-read on me, but his explanation of sylencia's alignment:



When this read was made Sylencia had posted the following:








This "read" is based on absolutely nothing, and whether or not Sylencia is a noob has almost nothing to do with his read. I don't understand this read and why on earth it's part of his "analysis".

On April 27 2013 18:58 Palmar wrote:
Still think VE is the best lynch.

But I do agree with a clarity lynch. I still don't understand how he entered the thread "catching up" and then had a fully fledged case within an hour. There was additionally no interest in pushing that lynch any harder. There is literally not a single "sharrant" in his filter after the case.

It just doesn't feel natural. He didn't ask Sharrant anything to try to determine his alignment, no "hey sharrant, explain this" or "what do you think about this". Just a straight up case with no build-up and no follow-up. Which basically tells me his heart wasn't really in it.

So with that I'm switching my vote to Clarity.

Lessgo.

On April 28 2013 05:54 Palmar wrote:
btw cheesecake and grush confirmed town because they were excited enough to break game rules because they wanted the flip so badly.

not many scumspects left.

On May 03 2013 23:36 Palmar wrote:
By the way Artanis looks pretty town based on how he backtracked on the Ace thing.

On May 04 2013 06:42 Palmar wrote:
Let's talk about Artanis. I had him pretty strongly as town based on how he reacted to the Ace thing, it just seems to me scum would've more carefully chosen their position on the issue, and not be persuaded so easily to just go "oh well, I'm an idiot, let's do what I said we shouldn't do".

here's the post I mentioned him being town: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18487429

here's the backtrack (within a page):

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18482210

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18482256

What do you think about him?

On May 04 2013 06:37 Palmar wrote:


Even then he very quickly took a stance on shiaopi and clarity, in both cases calling them scum. I'm not sure, it could've been been bus, but it's a pretty hard bus if it is.

He even rejected both the VE and Palmar attempts on day 2 in favor of trying to lynch shiaopi


This is not even the first time he mentions shiaopi. At least he was aware of cases being made against shiaopi, as demonstrated by this port here:



While I'm not going to go as far as give a townread on him, I'd say he's unlikely to be scum.

On May 04 2013 07:04 Palmar wrote:
Few things about kush. I haven't played with him enough to know if he's an asshole as any alignment, but generally the aggressive moves (like demanding those essays) are more townielike.

He also made a few posts that just don't add perfectly up if he's scum. The first one being the misconception about the scum night kill, because it's hard to feign the idea so casually:



Also, this read of his on VE:



Means he's thinking about the game from a townie perspective. No one else (I can remember) pointed out this idea that VE was town based on this.

The last point has an obvious bias, knowing I am town:



Kush basically understands that this post cannot be made by a scum palmar as it's too legit and too in line with what I had been saying all day. Maybe he's a scummer giving me a warm fuzzy feeling about the posts, but it's just too many little things that kush has done throughout the game for me to call him scum.

On May 06 2013 02:20 Palmar wrote:
btw to everyone who got confused about what happened tonight between me and BC.

I'm not as certain as I used to be that BC is scum... but look at what he did and how he did it last night. I'm somewhat conflicted but it certainly looks like he had some sort of questions regarding the targets he selected, only to immediately drop them when I explained my stance.







By my count he has like 6 serious suspicions (including me) before we started our back and forth.

It just doesn't look right.

Also I feel like the effort put into that back-and-forth was somewhat uneven. (me doing a lot, BC doing little).

But I need to think on it.

On May 06 2013 03:42 Palmar wrote:
This basically confirms sharrant as town when I flip town. If scum realized that I could be insane they'd shoot me out of fear that I would stumble upon one of them. Scum sharrant would have shot me last night

On May 07 2013 08:11 Palmar wrote:
To drive the point home. Yamato has almost no reasoning for any of his reads, he shared in his reads posts basically no concrete evidence for any of his reads, even when there's plenty of it, he didn't try to demonstrate any of his reads, simply posted them and called people various buzzwords. "involved" or "trying hard"

I certainly agree with many of his reads, although he seems fairly flippy floppy on for example kush who is one of my strongest town reads.

The BC point is the worst, he literally has no reason to think I'm scum above BC.

Let's kill yamato guys.

On May 09 2013 07:41 Palmar wrote:


I actually have a meta reason for being almost certain that BM is town. In PYP I made a case on him on day one as to being scum:



so I had BM's meta very freshly in my mind. So what I did was simply compare these two games and his involvement early on:

Arkham City (Town BM): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305850&user=54241

Boardwalk-PYP (Scum BM): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403766&user=54241

and then this game.

I actually thought it was BM who was the JK for a long time, based on this:



and the excitement about roles reminded me of his AC play (not being able to shut up about roles)




In addition, just look at how terrible his PYP filter is, it's basically aggressive oneliners, stark contrast with his attempts at figuring things out day 1 here.

On May 09 2013 08:25 Palmar wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=408855&user=208813

This dude actually has yet to vote scum... ever.

But to be fair his lone ranger vote on me during the Shiaopi lynch would be strange if he's scum since he the next vote is shiaopi's self-hammer (i think it was).

On May 10 2013 19:04 Palmar wrote:
when in doubt I guess we go with the basics.

Townies seem to think giggles is town, and giggles is more active than hopeless (although not by much)

simple postcount reveals hopeless has about 30 posts 4-10 may. He has shown less interest than most people.

So yeah, I don't have good reasons for this, I'm too confused by this game and I'm not kidding when I say it completely fucks me over when people call me scum for no reasons.

So yes, I'm proposing we lynch hopeless over giggles because yamato (and wos) seem to think giggles is town, and hopeless has less sheer activity.

It's not good reasoning, which is somewhat ironic I suppose. But I'm resigned to the fact that I just don't know this game. So I'm using a measurable metric that's freely available.

Seeing as I have no clue anyway, if people still want to kill me, I suppose you guys can. Just remember that you did it with absolutely no good reasoning. There is not a single logical reason to think I'm scum. The only possible reasons I can think of is a) people wanting to be dicks, or b) people being afraid that somehow I'm amazing at playing scum.

For once I'd love to play the role of a clueless but obvious town. Because I don't know the solution to this game I've spent a lot of time trying to explain why I should be obvious town, but I think reason b) is getting in the way of people. Hell, yamato said something in the lieu of "you haven't done anything scummy but you're still scum". Which is almost certainly some kind of fear.

I'm very willing to be convinced for an alternative lynch (and I still would take a geript lynch), but until such time that I am, I'm parking my vote on hopeless, based on activity and interest.

##Unvote
##Vote Hopeless1der

On May 16 2013 10:15 getmoript wrote:

Your reasoning for voting for people has pretty consistently been that they called you scum aside from clarity and that was well after clarity was already going to happen. You've failed to produce analysis which actually has lead to a scum lynch. So yah.

On May 16 2013 10:19 WaveofShadow wrote:

Except how can you be sure?
I found myself doubting the fact that TRN was town simply because I don't understand why you'd have 2 town masons and no scum mason (The Game's mason roles were balanced). I refuse to go on host bullshit any longer, and I'm going to be real pissed at the town and real pissed at myself for believing them if Geript is scum for letting him go on for so long doing absolutely dick all because 'modconfirmed town u guise.'

On May 16 2013 10:24 Palmar wrote:
@Geript, can you please give your reasons as to why you thought Kush was scum. You hammered him without much analysis at all, even after I asked people to relax.

On May 16 2013 10:10 getmoript wrote:
I'm not a mind reader WoS. And no, the fact that there are not 2 votes on Palmar means either that I'm scum, Palmar is scum or Giygas and BC are scum.

On May 16 2013 10:25 BloodyC0bbler wrote:


Geript does nothing as town basically ever. I also just can't see marv getting modkilled as scum over something stupid as refusing to use a host made qt. He can just refuse to post in the scum qt anyway if he just wanted to talk to geript. This seems completely like a marv was happy talking to his hydra buddy in his own qt and the hosts gave him one later and said he had to use it. He was like "wtf no yo"

In a situation where he was on a team I think he would be less likely to get himself modkilled as it fucks his team. Obviously its speculation but its also based on how he has interacted with me in the past.

As such I can only conclude of him and giggles giggles is the scum.

On May 17 2013 01:38 getmoript wrote:
@BC could you explain your separations (me/Giygas, WoS/palmar) more?

On May 16 2013 10:19 WaveofShadow wrote:

Except how can you be sure?
I found myself doubting the fact that TRN was town simply because I don't understand why you'd have 2 town masons and no scum mason (The Game's mason roles were balanced). I refuse to go on host bullshit any longer, and I'm going to be real pissed at the town and real pissed at myself for believing them if Geript is scum for letting him go on for so long doing absolutely dick all because 'modconfirmed town u guise.'