EPTowned.
Bureaucracy Mafia! - Page 151
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
owned. | ||
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Katina
United States454 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Do you want me to tell town your secret? Really? Because I was totally going to wait until we flipped Chez... | ||
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Probulous
Australia3894 Posts
On July 24 2012 10:49 VisceraEyes wrote: Probulous, explain your comment to marv immediately. What do you mean by "VE is being tricksy"? Do you want me to tell town your secret? Really? Because I was totally going to wait until we flipped Chez... Ok, since you asked. I assumed you are pushing Chez because you want mafia to spare him. Of course that is no longer an option because you outed it. If you seriously think Chez is getting lynched tomorrow then you will need to be more persuasive than you have been. I have found Chez quite useful actually. His trolling is just his style of play and using that as an excuse to lynch makes 0 sense. I also note that the people most annoyed with his trolling have been scum. In addition his questions around Sandroba were good ones, we didn't have enough information to resolve the PM stuff so there is no harm is positing an alternate explanation. As you say, all it took was a single PM. Build a case and I'll reconsider but right now he is one of my stronger town reads. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On July 24 2012 08:07 marvellosity wrote: Alright, as people are around and hopefully can answer me instead of shouting at me to read... I see plenty of people don't like slOosh's claim. If the claim is fake, what was its agenda in making it? was there anything on this? | ||
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HiroPro
United States2624 Posts
Yea, that's what I'm reading through right now. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
What do you make of the fact that Chezinu hasn't outted who he's messaged and no one has claimed receiving a message from him Probulous? | ||
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Chezinu
United States7447 Posts
On July 24 2012 11:02 VisceraEyes wrote: I have no desire to save Chez from mafia. On the contrary, I want them to shoot the piss out of him so A) the thread is sane and B) my theory can be further proven/disproven. What do you make of the fact that Chezinu hasn't outted who he's messaged and no one has claimed receiving a message from him Probulous? What if I didn't send a message? | ||
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Probulous
Australia3894 Posts
On July 24 2012 11:02 VisceraEyes wrote: I have no desire to save Chez from mafia. On the contrary, I want them to shoot the piss out of him so A) the thread is sane and B) my theory can be further proven/disproven. What do you make of the fact that Chezinu hasn't outted who he's messaged and no one has claimed receiving a message from him Probulous? It means he didn't send a message  Or that he was bussing his scum mates earlier like you suspected sandroba of doing. Or he sent a message to a dead guy. Or the person who received it doesn't want to post it. I need to recheck what messages come from where because it still confuses me. Shooting/lynching Chez because of his posting style is dumb. If that is part of your case, why have you not mentioned QBertz? Chez is making an effort at least. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
so with regards to this, the theory is that someone else picked up on what Chez wrote and made it into a PM for BH?? | ||
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Probulous
Australia3894 Posts
My running theory is to distance himself as much as possible from his original Foolishness defense. Night 1 had no vigs so mafia assume there are no vigs, or they are delayed. Then when Foolishness flips they know someone will claim that shot, so they claim first. Remember this is a closed setup so we don't know if there are multiple vigs, his claims adds nothing to the discussion because we cannot verify it. All it does it give him a shot at town cred. Unfortunately for him, it was supersoft not someone like Zealos, who counter claimed. The claim itself is my sticking point as well and anyway I look at it, I come up with a null. It doesn't say anything really. What does the rest of his filter say? | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
Well damn, I guess I was wrong :/ Might as well sheep town next time (no before you ask I won't sheep) I also thought the deadline was later On July 24 2012 10:43 Katina wrote: So let's try this again =.= Tomorrow we should lynch sloosh or gonzaw... No, tomorrow we lynch Zealos. I wouldn't even accept a sloosh lynch. His claim doesn't make sense from a scum perspective, and other than "he flip-flopped on Foolishness" I haven't seen any case on him at all. I actually thought he made sense with some of his posts initially, like he usually plays in big games (lurks but makes good posts every once and then). Until I hear from someone why Zealos is town then I don't see why we shouldn't lynch him. If he flips scum (most likely) then this last day seemed like wasted (with all the baseless accusations and stuff). Hmm, although I'll have to check my reads again, I usually read Palmar alright (at least taking into account iGrok's game) so this is kind of a shock to me. I guess I won't get shot tonight though, seems scum stopped shooting me as town these past few games for some reason  | ||
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HiroPro
United States2624 Posts
On July 24 2012 11:11 Probulous wrote: My running theory is to distance himself as much as possible from his original Foolishness defense. Night 1 had no vigs so mafia assume there are no vigs, or they are delayed. Then when Foolishness flips they know someone will claim that shot, so they claim first. Remember this is a closed setup so we don't know if there are multiple vigs, his claims adds nothing to the discussion because we cannot verify it. All it does it give him a shot at town cred. Unfortunately for him, it was supersoft not someone like Zealos, who counter claimed. The claim itself is my sticking point as well and anyway I look at it, I come up with a null. It doesn't say anything really. What does the rest of his filter say? Yea, this is kinda what I was thinking initally too. But thinking about it now, no one knew that Foolishness was the CEO. So defending him isn't really much of a connection - I don't think that alone would be enough for slOosh to decide to fakeclaim. And I don't remember Foolishness ever talking really about slOosh (other than that mass useless list), so not much connection there either to damn slOosh. Don't see why as mafia he would really feel extreme pressure. I say, wait and see on slOosh. Lynch Zealos tomorrow. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On July 24 2012 11:08 marvellosity wrote: BH flipped mafia. So mafia including fake PMs in their messages (whether they came from Chez or from another party, saying "Someone will be claiming messenger in thread. Confirm he can message by posting this: ") could explain the PM. so with regards to this, the theory is that someone else picked up on what Chez wrote and made it into a PM for BH?? Really the only troubling PM is the one that VE got, as far as I can tell? WBG got that weird one that hasn't been identified but that chez claimed not to send, BH's flip makes his message untrustworthy, leaving us with the message Chez claimed to send D1 and the message VE received. | ||
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HiroPro
United States2624 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
I find that extraordinarily unlikely given how much you like playing with your power. On July 24 2012 11:06 Probulous wrote: It means he didn't send a message Or that he was bussing his scum mates earlier like you suspected sandroba of doing. Or he sent a message to a dead guy. Or the person who received it doesn't want to post it. I need to recheck what messages come from where because it still confuses me. Shooting/lynching Chez because of his posting style is dumb. If that is part of your case, why have you not mentioned QBertz? Chez is making an effort at least. Did I ever say that his "style" is the reason I want him lynched? EVER? I want him lynched because I think he's the scum counterpart to Sandroba's role and because he was the genesis of why I was suspicious of Sandroba in the first place. For starters, Sandroba was "obvTown" because of the way he was using his messages...to try and out scum. Zealos dies tomorrow (assuming the momentum continues building) because of something Sandroba did with his powers. However, all Chezinu has done with his powers is troll and introduce confusion into the thread. Take the message he sent me: Kill sand if you want to know the truth... there be some communicahtions that are goingz about... these messages takes a lots of the times to get to where they be the be going... so you beetter bees the living when you the gets this! or your gonna have to the protect the Director of the Communication! He was the genesis of the idea that scum roles were mirrored in town - yet when sandroba flips this idea no longer holds any weight with him. Why? Well because it implicates him as scum of course! And of course, his style does into it. It's bad for town, makes the thread a chore to read, yadda yadda. I'm not staying long here because it has almost nothing to do with why I want him lynched. But it IS a point in favor of lynching him, so there you have it. You're not typically this....obtuse, Probulous. Considering the scum flip, I'd think you'd be pretty excited and happy. But your super-serious tone is sticking out like a sore thumb. You weren't pleased with that flip. Why? | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On July 24 2012 11:11 Probulous wrote: My running theory is to distance himself as much as possible from his original Foolishness defense. Night 1 had no vigs so mafia assume there are no vigs, or they are delayed. Then when Foolishness flips they know someone will claim that shot, so they claim first. Remember this is a closed setup so we don't know if there are multiple vigs, his claims adds nothing to the discussion because we cannot verify it. All it does it give him a shot at town cred. Unfortunately for him, it was supersoft not someone like Zealos, who counter claimed. The claim itself is my sticking point as well and anyway I look at it, I come up with a null. It doesn't say anything really. What does the rest of his filter say? So hard when that post with pretty colours in is so demanding. Everything lines up so incorrectly, it's so hard to believe his read on Foolish flip-flopped so heavily. town-read -> confident enough to shoot? Initially neutral to the BM case, then wishes Foolish made something other than a BM case, and then HIMSELF goes on to look at BM. "I'm going to shoot you Foolish, but I am both going to agree and expand upon your case on this guy we agree is mafia". ??? My feeling then is that the claim was the play of someone who knew they might be in trouble for their reads previously so thought they may as well try something. I don't buy the validity of the "why would I do this" defence. that said, i would be more confident in either a rastaban or zealos lynch atm. i am more sure with them. | ||
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
Chezinu may be "crazy" and all that, but he's too active in discussions to be scum. Unless someone can show me he does this as scum as well in previous games I'm inclined to say he's likely town. | ||
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Probulous
Australia3894 Posts
You're not typically this....obtuse, Probulous. Considering the scum flip, I'd think you'd be pretty excited and happy. But your super-serious tone is sticking out like a sore thumb. You weren't pleased with that flip. Why? Because I expected it  I trust my reads. I was almost 100% certain palmar was scum, no need to jump around. Remember, this is a big game, my small game play is very different because it is typically much easier to prove your aligment (for me at aleast). You say Chez is trolling, how is that alignment indicative? It isn't and so I am ignoring it. Now yes Chez did put the idea of a scum Sandroba into your head. As you found out it was easy to resolve. The purpose of this as far as I can see from a scum Chez point of view is just to fuck with you. I mean he must have known Sandroba could clear himself and besides if he was bussing his team mates he would run out of messages and team mates. He knew that a Sandroba flip would implicate him based on his own theory so why push for his lynch? | ||
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