Pick Your Poison Mafia - Page 20

On June 02 2012 08:09 Toadesstern wrote:
Ok we need to get people in here. It's 1 am for me and I don't know how long I'll be awake.

A zephird lynch still looks awful for me. Hiros voting him, risk is voting him, navillus is voting him. There's bound to be a mafia within those 3 and Kurumi and talis are nulls for me. That's really not as convincing as people make it look and we have 3 hours left...

On May 30 2012 20:01 prplhz wrote:
Since the mafia role selection is done in PMs and we're not going to have the voting results or the role itself revealed, scum is free to do whatever. There are only two ways to know for sure what role mafia got and that is 1) to get majority+3 voting for a single role and 2) flip the scum who got the role. talismania's encrypted vote idea should be implemented because it's never going to hurt and it will create some content that we can use for analysis.

Regarding the roles: Godfather is the safest because scum can only use it in two ways (have Godfather carry out night kills or not), this will make for the least confusion among potential town blues. Framer is the worst to give them because it will allow scum (and also townies and blues) to question all checks made by cop/tracker. Role blocker is also potentially useful for scum, especially in connection with claims (and counterclaims and fake claims) which I think could become very important this game.

Will anybody get told if they are roleblocked?

I think it's more beneficial for town to reach majority+3 consensus on a role than it is for mafia that we do it. So I think we should all agree that Godfather is the safest thing we can do because it allows for the least manipulation by scum and the simplest logic always applying for town. The only down side is that potential cop can't always trust town checks but that's very much acceptable. I don't think scum will focus much on the role that they get when they consider the roles that they give us.

Can scum pick two of the same role to give to town or do they have to pick two different roles?

As for the poison, my thoughts have already been stated. We should try to eliminate poisons that get stronger as early as possible. Majority+1 and secret vote are the best candidates for this. Here are my thoughts (list is malleable):

Use first: Majority+1, secret vote, secret ballot
Use in the mid game: Mayoral election, lynch lock
Use at LYLO or late game: No flip, 24 hour lynch

Some people already said that we will be at even number players all game long baring medic saves, but vigilantes could also screw this up. Also, the no flip is not only alignment, it is also role which may suck since we cannot know if we killed the Godfather or just a goon.

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@Kurumi Could you give us the reason behind your thoughts?

On June 01 2012 04:55 talismania wrote:
Did mafia get voting results in real time or after the deadline?

I'm assuming it was after the deadline but if it was real time then I guess my encryption thing was pretty pointless.

On June 02 2012 02:15 talismania wrote:


This hurts my head - first,

Does mafia getting the voting results mean that they got the results of who everyone voted for? Just the totals? Just the winner?

Second, if they did get full results, how could that have any bearing on hiro's play? He voted GF before the deadline no matter what, therefore he would have to explain it no matter what. How does he modify that knowing that prp didn't vote?

I think there are less convoluted reasons to vote Hiro that people have already raised, if you're going to vote Hiro.

(On a sidenote toad I think I owe you an apology because it looks like you were right about the difficulty in getting to a majority day one.)

___________________


@Radfield

Of course I would also vote Zephirdd (and probably will unless we need a 6th/7th vote somewhere else - avoiding no lynch is the top priority) - it's not just that he's been vacillating, it's that it feels like he's been doing it to see if anyone he pushes will get momentum in the town. He's playing it pretty out in the open as well (owning up to it with his last "I change my mind too much" post) which is brazen but probably the correct play if he's scum.

I'm curious about how you're thinking about the game as a whole - you've also been throwing some names out as though to see what sticks (sloosh, sbrubbles, zephirdd) but I haven't seen anything like the analysis you did to parse apart Blazinghand and tunkeg in I'm a cop you Idiot. For instance, is your consideration of voting zephirdd based on what hiro said, what I said, what you thought yourself, etc?

On June 03 2012 08:05 prplhz wrote:
@talismania Because if town doesn't know what role that scum has then it very much opens up the possibility of scum arguing for whatever role that benefits them (and townies would argue along with them). You got a check? Well watch 1 mafia and 2 townies say that scum probably got framer and framed whoever. I've said this several times already. Also, if we decided that it was more important that scum didn't know what role they got than that we elected some specific role then we would kill a lot of discussion on day0.

@Kurumi

Dearest Kurumi,

No I'm not afraid that I'll get shot tonight. I don't think it's all that likely that there is a vigilante and I think it's very unlikely that he would listen to your "case". And I didn't ask why you wanted to shoot me 'cause you actually already wrote your "case" in this thread, I even responded to it! Don't know what's so interesting about me not asking for something you already gave me, but in case you have more then just go ahead and post it.

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If there really is a vigilante he should shoot risk.nuke tonight 'cause that guy doesn't give a shit about this game. He's acted nonchalantly like this in other games, but I've never seen him not actually care about a game. In Death Factory Mafia 2 he kind of did something like this but he was blue and had a powerful role so he didn't need to get all analytic, in Space Station he was also a bit like this in thread but he was very much invested in the game in PMs. Even if he is town then you'd just be taking out the god damn trash.

I'm exceedingly tipsy and I can't think all too straight right now. If anybody thinks I should vote something for poison then tell me. Otherwise, I'm going to vote for majority+1 'cause I think I remember agreeing with myself on this yesterday.

On June 03 2012 08:18 Radfield wrote:
Oh yeah, it's really important obviously that if someone gets roleblocked they should announce it immediately, as it gives our potential tracker more info. Not to mention letting us know the mafia setup.

Medics, cops and trackers can do their own thing. Innocent child obviously does nothing until it is pertinent. Vigilante should probably be shooting.

Prplhz, majority +1 is probably the hardest poison unless we have an obvious lynch. It should be the one that we don't use,or only use situationally. Right now we have very little focus and very little galvinization of potential lynch targets. Majority +1 is a bad choice.

On June 03 2012 08:31 prplhz wrote:
@Radfield If the vigilante is like "Should I shoot prplhz or should I shoot risk.nuke?" then what would you advice him to do?

I thought about how a 3-1 endgame situation could turn out if scum just keeps doing no night actions, he could force us into poisons he liked if we no-lynch in response. I'm just going to do waht you said though 'cause it doesn't look like it matters all too much what I vote and hopefully we'll not get into a bad endgame situation.

@Kurumi I'm ignoring you until you write something new. I decided last mini that I wouldn't let tunnelers get on my nerves again and I really don't think you have anything to contribute if the only thing you can say is "I'm vigilante and I'm shooting you". If you're doing some crazy plan counting on a potential roleblocker to roleblock you in case they picked vigilante and I'm scum then you're even more out of your mind than I feared.

@Zephirdd Why are Radfield and Kurumi the two mayor candidates?

On June 03 2012 08:05 prplhz wrote:
@talismania Because if town doesn't know what role that scum has then it very much opens up the possibility of scum arguing for whatever role that benefits them (and townies would argue along with them). You got a check? Well watch 1 mafia and 2 townies say that scum probably got framer and framed whoever. I've said this several times already. Also, if we decided that it was more important that scum didn't know what role they got than that we elected some specific role then we would kill a lot of discussion on day0.

[...]

On June 03 2012 08:53 HiroPro wrote:
I am voting for lynch lock. Day 3 must absolutely be mayoral election though, I won't accept anything else.

Kurumi, if you really are the vig, please don't shoot prplhz.

Zephirdd, it would be nice if you actually did say something about the people you looked. You went through a lot of filters. Surely you have something to say even if you don't necessarily have a strong mafia read on someone. What specifically made you suspicious of WBG? I would say that both he and Radfield led the lynch on Navillus equally, but for WBG you say that you are suspicious of him for leading the Navillus lynch, while the only thing you say about Radfield is "If Radfield is mafia I am doomed anyways."

On June 03 2012 08:32 Kurumi wrote:

Why do you speak like you don't care about being shot but you try to swing my opinion the heck

On June 03 2012 08:58 prplhz wrote:

How do I speak like I don't care about being shot? I just, in that very post, asked Radfield about his opinion on this whole vigilante thing. How is that not caring? How is arguing with you and you inexistant case all night1 not caring? Even though I shouldn't care because you have no case and no vigilante with a brain and eyes to read would shoot me, I argue with you.

Are you seriously asking me why I don't want you to tunnel a townie and yell for a vigilante to shoot him?

I'm done with you for now. Take a step back and then take a deep breath. I'm not responding to you unless you have something new or substantial to say.