EPTJust so you know.
Wheel of Fortune Mini Mafia
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
Just so you know. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 22 2012 07:08 prplhz wrote: [...] SamuelLJackson needs to sign their posts and you need to show that you're actually two people playing for town. You're likely going to be the strongest town player and I expect that to show in your play and I'm gonna complain about any weird stuff from you because, no. Am I the only one that reads this a little bit like he's treating me as a nice townie already (read: a little more "confirmed" than I should be at the start of a game) when he should have no idea about my alignment yet? + Show Spoiler [rnd hilarious stuff] + On April 22 2012 07:27 prplhz wrote: , Toadesstern knows that this game essentially revolves around him. That's a troll, right? I'm going to be around for an hour or something like that, maybe two more hours, it's saturday after all. ---Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 22 2012 20:22 Forumite wrote: Please don´t tell me you are town, and don´t tell me you think I am town, the first I can´t trust, the second only make me a target for scum. Explain, why is MrZentor town? If he acts scum and disrupts the thread, that makes him look scum. I know most scum wouldn´t start the game like he does, because it´s too obvious, but that can´t be a defence of those who actually do. Agree. Why are you calling everyone who's posting town right now? Why do you feel the need to drop the town-bomb so early? You know yourself that telling people your townreads without a reason (a reason to tell people, not the reason why you think so in the first place) is not something that's helping town at all because of what Forumite said. Therefore I'd like to hear the reasoning behind that instead of trying to guess what's going on in VE-land. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 22 2012 21:25 SamuelLJackson wrote: Agree. Why are you calling everyone who's posting town right now? Why do you feel the need to drop the town-bomb so early? You know yourself that telling people your townreads without a reason (a reason to tell people, not the reason why you think so in the first place) is not something that's helping town at all because of what Forumite said. Therefore I'd like to hear the reasoning behind that instead of trying to guess what's going on in VE-land. EBWOP That was Toad posting. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 22 2012 21:53 VisceraEyes wrote: It was mostly me disagreeing with Forumite's case. Zentor seems like a lurky-scum kinda player, and doubt as scum he'd enter the game voting for himself. That's kinda an advanced scum move and (no offense Zentor) not one I see MrZentor making. I could have just said "I don't agree with a MrZentor vote" but the way I said it gets more people to trust me faster...or so I thought.  No, it was just my entry into the game after drinking at my sister's bday party guys, nothing to see here. However, let's try that again with less alcohol in my bloodstream :D @Forumite So it is your opinion that MrZentor, as scum, voted for himself only to "get responses from people" and then, as scum, singled out prplhz? In the name of....what? Furthering his scum agenda? I don't know, I see it more as a townZentor move myself. That's why I disagree. Yeah figured. Still, what was the reason you told people you think he's town. I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with forumites case, hell I do as well but I don't run around telling everyone I think he's a townie when there's no need to stop the discussion like that. If he is a reasonable lynch candidate and you think he's town, be my guest and tell everyone you think the guy is town, but now? He's on 2 votes, one of those is his own vote (wtf?). Why not chill a bit, see how he reacts nevertheless and how everyone else is reacting (people appearing with cheap reasoning or whatever) or are you already so sure about your 12 hours into the game read that you do no longer need to read him anymore? I agree with you, I just don't agree with you posting like that when there was no need to step in like that telling people to stop accusing each other just because you think he's town. ---Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 22 2012 22:26 VisceraEyes wrote: Because he did react - by Forumite's estimation he reacted poorly and by my estimation he reacted in the manner I'd expect. In any case, I don't think he's a good vote and won't support it. *shrug* Do I tell you how to play? Oh wait...yeah...I do....... Okay, whatever. I won't do it again. Good enough? and that one reaction is enough to make your read final? I just don't get why you would want to step in here, it's d1 with VERY few things to talk about, even less than usually because there's so few people talking. I just don't understand why you would want to end the discussion in that situation from a town perspective while I can think of 2 different possibilites for a mafia-VE to say something like that. Even if he's town and I'm inclined to believe so there's no harm in people argueing about what he and forumite said so far, at least as long as there's nothing else. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
Anyways, that was another Toad-post. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
The difference here is that I know VE knows that as well. I'm not so sure about you so please stop it. And townreads are really easy to do for mafia. They know who is town (aka not mafia) and who's not so they can 24/7 waltz around, tell people who they think is town and are perfectly right about and don't even have to make up some bullshit while when they're doing cases or scumreads they have to make up some shit because they know it's wrong. So dishing out townreads is a) hurting town (imo) b) not helping town judge you because you could do that as mafia as well ---Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 01:35 Radfield wrote: If it makes you feel any better, I don't think you are town Toad  Where's Sandro? Yeah I know. Sad thing WBG is hosting this and not playing himself. He could be your wingman and constantly tell people how unreadable I am, especially after LII :p That's the reason I'm not raging mad but just a little upset about blue so far. Sandro said pregame that he won't have time to post the first day (RL day I guess?) as well when I told him I'm trying to post less hypno-Toad-ish and therefore am going to post less. So I guess he's still not here. On April 23 2012 01:35 Radfield wrote: I don't actually see the benefit to the quick claim. However, I am assuming that the masons are good enough to leave a trail of clues which will point to their partner if they die, yet is impossible to find if they are alive. Since they can talk together, it really shouldn't be that hard. If that's the case, then there is no reason for them to claim, as once they claim they will become instant targets. The longer they stay alive, the higher towns chance of winning is. I guess I just don't see the actual benefit of them claiming. This assumes we have any masons at all. I'm not sure how bugs is generating the mason roles, as a normal C9++ has the option of an Innocent Child(mod confirmed townie), which is not in the OP. For those who don't really know how the setup is generated: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=C9++ Did you read wbg's first C9++? The fast mason claim is incredible strong and frankly it was one of the reasons town won that game without a problem because they had a VERY strong town player who was basicly confirmed town, forcing mafia to deal with that problem as well as the other "confirmed" mason and other people who just looked incredible good themselves. That being said I wouldn't be suprised if wbg tweaked the balance a little bit and is treating mason as a stronger PR than he did in his first game. That's of course just speculation. But yeah I'd still say insta claiming as mason is the way to go for town. Mafia has BIG issues dealing with that because it's really hard to claim something like that themselves and on top of that there's no mafia Masons. The real issue with the insta-claim is that it does give mafia targets but way more than they can deal with early on therefore making it really much easier for town. ---Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
However we really need people to start and get in here. I am doing my best to not be the hypno-Toad that ends up having 25% of thread-posts. However, with so little contribution I am again one of the guys who's posting a little bit more than most people which is just an incredible bad sign for those who aren't posting considering that I have to really hold myself back here... --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 03:26 Ace wrote: I didn't. I said both of your posts were saying what I would, then went on to clarify. I explicitly stated I'm for Masons claiming Day 2. strongandbig: That is really a lot of what ifs you're going through there. I do agree that a framer would mess things up - if we were trying to confirm the Masons. It's more likely that 2 players claiming Masons are Town. If neither one of them died for 2 days I'm sure we'd know whats up. You don't really need the Cop to investigate them. I'm back \o/ And yeah exactly that. Claiming mason is INCREDIBLE risky for mafia, they'd insta-lose 2 (!) players in a mini game if something goes wrong. That's straight up gg if something happens. Yeah, us talking about how unlikely it is for mafia to claim mason probably makes it a little more tempting for mafia to actually do that but I'd say I'm perfectly happy with mafia giving us 2 free kills even if they are delayed. And I hope noone has to talk about why two VTs fakeclaiming mason shouldn't be an issue at all or a mafia fakeclaiming mason with a townie. If someone ends up fakeclaiming mason as a VT or saying "yeah that guy is mason with me" when he really is not I will punch them in the face. And that's an euphemism for "vote and push your lynch" so no worries there! That's kind of the reason I don't want masons to claim later because if we're 2 days into the game, they claim and get another 2 days on top of that because we're not sure if it's a mafia or a town I'd say that could very well end up being to late. So if someone claims mason something like d3 I am going to completly ignore that. If they claim d1 however they're a high priority target for mafia and mafia can't realy do that themselves d1 because of what I just said. D3 gets tricky because if we only start thinking about lynching one of the masons by d5 mafia might be willing to claim that. That being said. What about talking about something else? Feels like we're wasting d1 just because there MIGHT BE a pair of masons like in the last game which was a complete demolition for mafia the moment the mason claimed d1 and therefore I'd say it's not that unlikely that WBG tweaked the balance a little bit. I still got a very bad feeling about VE. Yeah I know, I have that feeling every game but I still don't understand why town-VE should do what he did earlier on and he's quite silent right now. Town-VE is the kind of guy who is VERY confident about his own skills because of his most recent results in the last dozen of games and because a lot of people said he played very well recently. So I think Town-VE would be in this thread telling people what to do, trying to lead town even with a stacked playerfield like we have. Just look at the first C9++ for example. That oviously makes me think VE is not town this game. Thoughts? ---Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 05:33 Ace wrote: Well I didn't read wbg's last game, but s&b has a point Forumite. I've said it many times in the past that a pair of Masons are the most dangerous roles that a Scum team has to deal with in most games. He also alluded to Masons fast claiming Day 1 in the last game and wrecking shit. I'd be suspicious of any player that doesn't even want to talk about going this route also. As for your encryption plan that makes sense S&B but Samuel brings up a good point: They aren't guaranteed to be in the game. Let's not make ourselves do extra work that probably won't pay off. For now the fact that anyone even lazily reading the thread knows that a Mason claim is very likely by Day 2 is good enough. So, you want us to discuss the mason thing but you're not willing to do something like generate a random 16-char-long string because the chances that there are no masons are to high and therefore it's not worth doing to do something that's SO much work? That sounds a little bit weird, doesn't it? Why do we need to talk about the mason thing in the first place if that's what you think? --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 05:46 Ace wrote: Why would we be generating encrypted strings when both Masons can just claim Day 2? We're doing extra work for nothing. If they aren't in the game then we just move on. If I understood correctly what strongandbig said he is pretty much against masons claiming at all. He doesn't want masons to claim unless the other counterpart of their mason role is dead, therefore giving us less advantages but also less risks because it's only one confirmed townie but it's just impossible for the 2nd guy to be mafia when the first one already flipped town AND mason. My point is that it's not impossible for both masons to be mafia if they claim before one of them dies but it is REALLY unlikely, therefore I don't think we need to be that cautious and I'd like them to claim before one of them dies if we have masons because that doubles the advantages and with every passing day it's more likely for mafia to claim mason because they might think "well it's already d3, if we don't win by d7 [we need 1 or 2 days according to you to judge wether it's mafia or not and 2 more days to get them lynched] we already lost, so whatever let's claim mason". That being said I really don't think there's masons in here because of what I said earlier and would rather talk about scumreads instead. No responses about what I said about VE? | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 05:59 Forumite wrote: I don´t have the same experience with masons as you. In the games I´ve played, confirmed townies die soon after getting confirmed. In that light, it might be better to wait until day 3 to claim, and breadcrumb in a foolproof way so that if one mason die before the claim, the other one can confirm himself. During D3, when there are fewer people alive, one confirmed makes a much bigger difference. the thing is that it's 2 confirmed townies. On top of that there might be some guy or some guys who are looking really townish themselves that mafia have to deal with. On top of that there are probably a bunch of townies that mafia wants to get rid of, just look at the playerlist. That's an enormous list of "problems" for mafia, way more than they can deal with. I'd say it's either claim early (d1, I'd be fine with d2 as well) or don't claim at all. As Ace pointed out, without a cop and even with a cop we have issues figuring them out because they're most likely to be framed if mafia has a framer and that's not an unreasonable assumption in a DT-setup at all. So our way to figure out masons is to look at them, probably give them the benefit of the doubt and figure out what's going on with them. As you mentioned, mafia wants to hit that and if they're still alive 2 days after the claim (especially if it's a late claim) it's probably a mafia fakeclaim. So if we have someone claim mason d3 we're screwed big time as town. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 23 2012 06:51 Forumite wrote: I think I see what you mean, giving scum 2 more targets will give them way too many to shoot down with all the veterans here, especially if one or two in the mason pair are newbies who would never normally attract bullets. In that case, why wait until tomorrow? Why not claim now in that case? Why tomorrow? We are most likely one less player tomorrow, maybe 2. 2 confirmed among 12 is not far from 2 confirmed among 14, it´s not enough to single out scum. The way I see it, either we give scum more targets, or we make sure to get as many confirmed town as possible. If the first, then the masons should claim now, if the second, then we wait until day 3 and have the masons and DTs claim all at once. Exactly and that's it for me talking about the mason topic. I mentioned C9++ A LOT, so everyone should know where to look at if you're not sure about the mason topic. I'd really rather have people talk about scumreads. We need to lynch someone. I said I think VE is a nice option. Noone commented on that one. Radfield said he thinks I'm not town with a oneliner and noone commented on that except for blue dropping the town-bomb. Forumite said he thinks zentor looks scummy and noone said anything about that one. That's essentially everything we've got so far if I recall correctly and this mason talk is hurting us if we keep on talking about that. It's giving everyone and their dog a chance to not talk about scumreads at all. I don't think we have masons but if we do I'm sure we talked enough about it and they made their mind clear about that topic themselves, so it's up to them. That being said I'm voting VE because of what I said earlier and going to bed now. You guys really need to start talking about the lynch as well and ignore masons for the time being... They'll do whatever they think is best for town anyways IF we got some. ##vote VisceraEyes --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
1) His Town-bomb + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 14:46 VisceraEyes wrote: I think everyone who has posted so far is town. + Show Spoiler + Yes, this is me soft-claiming town. I look forward to hearing from Ace - after his untimely demise in SSM I didn't expect him to be back in a game so quickly. ^^ This is an incredible bad post for 2 reasons. Firstly because I already mentioned dropping the town-bomb like that is not helpful at all. Secondly it's totally useless. There's nothing in there. No explanations, it's along the lines "sup guyses, I think everyone is town, that's all". There is no use for that post unless he is mafia trying to get towncred by saying "hey guys, I told you they're all town" after the flip. It is literally nothing but VE trying to end the non-existing discussion. If it would be usual spam or trolling with no content I'd have no problem with that but that is a bunch of nothing with an agenda behind it and imo stopping the discussion like that, especially with so little else going on is a mafia agenda. And I am pretty sure Town-VE would have known that that post is not good making me think it's mafia-VE who screwed up while trying to get town-cred for calling guys town who will end up being town. 2) Whatever you want to call it + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 22:26 VisceraEyes wrote: Because he did react - by Forumite's estimation he reacted poorly and by my estimation he reacted in the manner I'd expect. In any case, I don't think he's a good vote and won't support it. *shrug* Do I tell you how to play? Oh wait...yeah...I do....... Okay, whatever. I won't do it again. Good enough? As mentioned I don't see a reason why a townie should do such a thing. He said he said he thinks zentor is town because he basicly wanted to stop forumite accusing / tunneling him (yeah he never said that, but that's what it comes down to). Why would a townie want to stop seeing reactiongs after only one "clash" of the two guys? Is his read already so sure that he no longer needs more info / reactions? Let's compare the situation with what I did 30 mins in the game: + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 07:37 SamuelLJackson wrote: Hey forumite, what's your opinion on: Am I the only one that reads this a little bit like he's treating me as a nice townie already (read: a little more "confirmed" than I should be at the start of a game) when he should have no idea about my alignment yet? + Show Spoiler [rnd hilarious stuff] + On April 22 2012 07:27 prplhz wrote: , Toadesstern knows that this game essentially revolves around him. That's a troll, right? I'm going to be around for an hour or something like that, maybe two more hours, it's saturday after all. ---Toad That's me accusing prpl. I knew that the accusation is weak and probably means nothing, I thought about not posting that at all because he probably meant something else. I still ended up posting it because I thought, whatever, it's d1 maybe I'm getting a nice reaction and I did get a reaction from prpl. However I did not end up running around telling people "IT'S FINE, I'VE GOT THIS 1 REACTION, THERE'S NO WAY HE IS MAFIA" because it's just one reaction. Prpls reaction to me looked fine but frankly he's still a null read to me because that could very well be faked, me being wrong or whatever. Why is VE not thinking about those possibilites and why is he fine with stopping the discussion after such a short amount of time without a reason (aka the guy was not about to be lynched). I'd say he doesn't need to try and figure out who's mafia and who's town. 3) His meta He tends to try and lead town. His post count can not be a reason to think of him as mafia or town because of LII. Most people saw that game and most people still remember how disruptive VE and I used to be that game. That being said posting less and trying to be not disruptive at all seems like the way to go for mafia. He could easily point at LII and tell people "see people? That's how I play mafia! This time I am posting way less and I'm not disruptive/hurting town at all!". However, as mentioned that can not be a reason for judging his alignment, because frankly I hope he'd do the same as town as well and try to not be as disruptive :p So all we've got on meta is his style of playing the game and I think he is not playing his usual town style at all. As town he is trying to lead town lately. He has a lot of confidence due to his last dozen of games and people told him he's very good nowadays. I came into this game thinking "well VE will probably use this game as another platform, another piece in the puzzle to finally show everyone that he's not just one of the big names but also able to be one of the really big names. He's probably going to try and lead town hardcore to show people that he's that kind of player no matter of players who singed up". That's what I anticipated VE doing. I don't see that happening and even worse, I don't see him caring at all, not even slightly trying to show that he's an important player in this game. Imo that's not Town-VE but instead a mafia-VE trying to put on a farce, trying to look like he's modest or whatever. Therefore I voted VE and I am going to university right now. So I'll be back in something like 2 or 2,5 hours to answer questions I guess. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
-sandroba | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
Reasons other than him possibly being scum? And you want to lynch him for those reasons? How about you stop telling me what you are not saying and actually tell me wtf you ARE saying. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 01:04 Radfield wrote: I'm not going to have time to post now, and likely won't be around until an hour or two before the deadline. Don't expect much from me in the way of leading a lynch. As far as VE goes, he still has not commented since I put my vote down. My intention was simply to apply pressure and see how he reacted, but he has not posted/reacted at all. At this point I'm willing to keep my vote there. I don't think zentor is scum. On April 24 2012 01:18 strongandbig wrote: Not true. I was caught by BC using the Kenpachi method in SS mafia. I'm starting to really wonder what's up with VE, it seems very out of character for it to take him this long to respond to this set of accusations, whether he's town or scum. I actually feel like we should not lynch him for lurking, but we maybe should wait and see what his explanation is. He has to post his vote sometime in the next six hours or risk a modkill anyway. Here's a post VE did in our mafia QT in LI and we both were mafia. Context is the following: Katina does a case on me that imo was and still is bullshit. Nothin she pointed out was alignment indicating. She basicly said "Toad is posting walls of texts and is weird". I said in our Mafia QT that I don't care, noone listens to Katina and what she says. Here's how VE responded in our mafia QT: Like look at it this way: if "no one listens to Katina" and what she said was "utter bullshit" and "doesn't make you look scummy at all"....then why did it take THREE paragraphs for you to say that? Why go to the trouble if you're town? She's wrong and seeing your effort in scumhunting, she'll see that she's wrong if you just ignore her nonsense and look for scum. This is a townie mindset. Punching her in the face and saying "You're wrong I'm town bitch!" isn't. Now please - just watch how you post. Whether or not Katina can argue that you're scum, she NOTICED that you're scum. If she can, Bugs can. And so can Jackal. And they can both get you lynched. This is the last time I'm going to ask you before I bus you and earn infinity town-cred. You have been warned. That's really important because the big part has 2 major phrases in there: 1) People saying "I don't think VE would ignore what's going on for so long if he's mafia". I think I just showed that he would if he thinks there's no danger. He even told me to do that last game. Agree anyone? 2) Scumhunting. I don't see that at all. So I really think he's mafia at this point and nothing that was presented is a towntell at all because frankly he DOES that as mafia as well. On the signing matter, Sandrobas and my style really are pretty easy to distinguish howver if you see a post that's not signed just assume it's Sandroba because I'm trying to do that every time and will do an EBWOP if I forget to sign my post. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
-sandroba | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 01:57 VisceraEyes wrote: Toad....oh hypnoToad. Toad's case (that he has asked multiple people to comment on) is based on my desire to take up a leadership role "based on my recent successes"...but what Toad isn't taking into account is my recent failures as well (prplhz in Space Station Mafia and Cyber_Cheese in SoAF come to mind). I have NO desire to lead town at this juncture, because I don't feel like my play qualifies me anymore. Not to mention, look at the playerlist bro. LOOK AT IT!!! Do you think I even COULD lead this town anywhere? Nah dude. Not happening. You want comment - your case is abysmal Toad, and it's based on how you think I want to play mafia. You'd better think again pal...I'm not scum. Now, scum. VisceraEyes Lynch-List of Lurking Lethargy Sbrubbles - Where the dicks is Sbrubbles anyway? Ace - Ace has shown decent activity this game, but very little actual scumhunting. Concerned about his plan for D2, but doesn't seem very interested in what's going on today, D1. Radfield - Radfield's really only here because not only was his vote for me not explained (verily, even when requested), but justifies it by my lack of response. Sounds like an excuse to park his vote and not scumhunt to me, and I don't like it. ##Vote: Ace Unless we decide that we'd rather lynch a lurker, in which case I prefer Sbrubbles. I wouldn't mind that actually, because between the two I think I prefer Sbrubbles...but I don't think I can get a wagon rolling on a lurker at this point. Based on the fact that my scumreads are weak as hell after rereading (those who know me will notice a distinct lack of red text), I think scum are putting in way less effort than most everyone who's posting. As an aside, if voting is done in this thread, could we trouble the hosts for periodic vote-counts? I'm fine with that for now. I still think you're suspicious but I don't really think you're the best option for now. Still considering what the best course of action is right now. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
@VE not really, I prefer optimal play specially day1 when evidence is flimsy. I actually would rather lynch rad then the other 2, but it's again non optimal. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 03:49 VisceraEyes wrote: But optimal play was lynching me? Whatever mang. Here, let me entice you further. ##Unvote: Ace ##Vote: Sbrubbles I actually feel better about this. no optimal play was getting town away from discussing masons over and over again, to finally get people talking about their reads instead. Especially make Ace and forumite stop talking about masons all the time while pressuring you to force you into caring about the game :p I wasn't sure if I should vote forumite or VE at that time to get that and ended up voting you because I already mentioned you before and also mentioned what I thought about you. You know, more to discuss than "btw forumite looks like mafia". That being said a Sbrubbles lynch is not going to happen imo, I don't even see why you think he is scummy other than being a lurker when I think there's other players around who are somewhat lurkish themselves (hey there marv) and actually look way different then the last game. Why sbrubbles of all the people? Also if I am correct the deadline is already in 3 hours. At least that's what the OP tells me. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
 Marv is the best Plan B we have imo. Not really sure about him but he definitely looks really bad. If a Rad or forumite lynch is possible as well I'd swap for that, but pretty much nothing else right now. Ace would be a decent option as well as he basicly stopped posting ever since we stopped posting about the mason thing. Remember, that's a topic that's really easy to talk about for mafia as well but I have no idea what Sandroba thinks about Ace right now. ##vote marvellosity If Sandroba gets in here we might talk this over together but it's only 1,5 hours left --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 05:36 marvellosity wrote: I knew the end of the day would go this way. Every single Day 1 I've had I've looked bad; apparently this is something I'm seriously going to have to work on - I just haven't mastered the knack of manufacturing content when there is little material yet. We're gonna drift into that lovely situation where town's gonna lynch me although no-one really thinks I'm scum, and everyone will be like "well, that kinda sucks, but hey ho whatcha gonna do" Come on with posts like On April 24 2012 04:21 marvellosity wrote: s&b's effort on Snarfs is the best I've seen so far, and due to my own failure to make good scum-reads, that will be where my vote will rest atm. ##Vote: Snarfs it really isn't looking good for you because you look really weird. I don't think you're the best lynch for today but you're basicly refusing to do something yourself. Look at zentor for example. That guy is terrible but I'm not going to lynch him (at least not today). It's not the fact that you're not posting. According to VE that's the reason you're up for the lynch but there's stuff within your posts (just like i mentioned) tmaking you a way better lynch than people like Sbrubbles. And it just feels odd what you're showing. Not as odd and as much of a farce as forumite is pulling on, but I'm fine with what I'm seeing here. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 06:03 marvellosity wrote: I would like to note that there has been no opposition to the growing bandwagon of my lynch when clearly scum has had the options to direct the vote almost anywhere with a maximum of 2 votes on any one person. I still think VE is suspicious however I think he's not the best lynch for today and I want to read more of him. That being said he posted a list of lurkers telling people to lynch into Sbrubbles and when asked about you he basicly said nothing but "yeah I agree marv is as much of a nullread as sbrubbles is, so I would have no issue voting him or zentor [did he actually mention zentor or was that someone else?] as well". Well it was something along those lines. That's an incredible amount of nothing while soft-defending you because frankly he tells people to lynch Sbrubbles instead of you, for no particular reason as far as I can see and only agrees to lynch you when being forced / asked about it. Also what about yourself. You're one of the lurkers, yet you are one of the guys who barely got a mention (if at all) through the first 1,5 days. According to Sandroba that makes you somewhat more likely to be mafia, because frankly, mafia love to point out lurkers or scummy behavior but noone was talking about you. Also I don't see VE voting you although he said he doesn't want a no-lynch and is willing to get you lynched as well. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 06:20 VisceraEyes wrote: Rad made me rethink voting marv - I went back and reread the beginning of his newbie game that I read and he did find himself the victim of early suspicion. I'm willing to no-lynch in this situation. In my opinion a no-lynch is better than a mislynch in this situation and I'm not confident enough in any of the lurkers anymore - there has been a lot of activity here toward the end, and it's hard to tell if it's because there's a scum candidate or because no one wants a no-lynch or what. What do you think Toad? Do you think we should lynch a lurker or no-lynch? I'm okay with no-lynching to be frank. Marv is the way to go if you want a lynch happening. I'm generally in favor of a lynch happening if I think we have a somewhat scummy option and marv is scummy. Just think of what we were talking about in LI in our mafia QT or irc about a no-lynch. Do you want that because you're not 100% certain although you've got a good guess? I'd say he's a decent Plan-B lynch if we can't get Plan-A to work and surely we can't get Plan-A working. Man where's Sandroba when you need him --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 06:29 VisceraEyes wrote: I think sandro would advocate a no-lynch in this situation - I could be wrong. He strikes me as a "nolynch>mislynch" kind of guy and marv is looking like mislynch bait to me. :S doubt the Sandroba part but yeah I could be wrong as well :p Also Marv is not a mislynch bait. No one was talking about him until just recently because everyone else was aiming for optimal play. Sandroba and I tried to get forumite or Rad lynched. You tried to get Ace lynched. And everyone was pushing for someone else. Marv is like the one guy who never got a mention although he has been suspicious all game long and lurking all game long while other people (Sbrubbles & Zentor) have been a huge issue troughout the day although I think both are incredible stupid lynches. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
However, VE is not up for lynch right now and you are voting a no-lynch Ace --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
I'm going to be the guy that yells postgame "TOLD YA" | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 06:58 marvellosity wrote: Toad, your point is just terrible. The fact that I wasn't mentioned earlier in the game is extremely circumstancial. There were many non-posters and lurkers at the start of the game The thing that ISN'T circumstancial is the fact that the lynch on me gently drifted into being without anyone trying to prevent it. You should be able to discern the difference between the two. Engage logic please. Although Snarfs only has one vote less than me, I'm going to unvote him and vote for the no-lynch. It has good grounding and with no-one being certain of anything it seems a decent option at this point. ##Unvote ##Vote: No Lynch Ok I said I'm going to bed but I can't stand this... Think about C9++. How much people did that game have trying to prevent a Jackal lynch on d1? 0. What did Jackal flip? Mafia People trying to prevent or not trying to prevent a lynch is not an alignment tell at all and actually there's a SHITLOAD of people trying to prevent your lynch right now ALTHOUGH they said they'd be up for a marv lynch. What kind of mofo action is that supposed to be. And it's not the point that you weren't mentioned earlier in the game but the fact that you did not get a single mention until 2 hours before the lynch or something like that. That's not "earlier in the game", that basicly the whole day1. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 07:05 marvellosity wrote: Considerably more people trying to prevent my lynch than there are scum, in fact... Nah. I'd say VE, forumite and Rad are the ones preventing your lynch. The new guys who unvoted whoever they voted before that are sheeping after seeing 3 vets saying no-lynch is the best course of action and Ace comming in here having no clue at all what happened the whole damn day. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
--- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 07:11 Ace wrote: Just because I was late and didn't agree with a quick lynch of marvellosity/Zentor doesn't mean I didn't understand what I read. Are you telling me you preparded that post earlier the day to only post it 10 mins before the deadline? Or are you pissed about me calling you clueless or whatever I called you yesterday, when you arrived 10 mins before deadline making it look like you have not read the last couple of pages before that happened, forcing you to read through them really quick, post something really quick, which was after all a suprisingly big post considering your "fuck, need to post, need to vote, no modkill, fast"-situation you were in and vote something really quick. Anyways have to leave again really quick :p --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 20:14 Bluelightz wrote: Right now, I REALLY want to believe marv is scum, but I believe he is town, look at this: Would mafia be posting THAT unsafe? I feel like that marv didn't fear ANYTHING, so therefore he is town, Mafia wouldn't go like that (straightly pulling the newbie card) after being accused. Here's the interesting part about you: You say that about every guy in this game and I already told you d1 I don't care about your townreads, that's a null. Scum can do that themselves because they know who is mafia and who is not. so WHO do you think is mafia. You are against every lynch because EVERY guy is a townie according to you. Do you think this is some kind of 13 jester troll set-up done by Igrok or do you actually believe there are mafias within the 13 players? Why do you always keep on telling us how everyone is town but completly ignore the fact that there are bound to be some mafias, yet you completly ignore that part of the game as far as I recall. I haven't read your filter most recently because it was a bunch of nothing with some townreads every now and than mixed in but that's what I remember you for the most. A guy who keeps on telling everyone that everyone is town in this game. How is that possible. Are you actually that much of a paranoid (well more the opposite of paranoid I guess?) townie or are you a mafia dodging accusations, talking only about your (easy to do) townreads who's not willing to give a single mafiaread? --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
I basicly disagree with everyone on there except for my own name being green 8( And no I was not exaggerating I probably just wasn't clear on what I was saying. You are not calling everyone a townie but you are calling everyone a townie you're talking about. Obviously you're not calling everyone ins this game a townie because you're not talking about everyone and I am totally fine with that method of scumhunting. I am doing the very same thing (apparently with a completly different result) just that I don't tell people about everyone and why I think so because I want mafia to shoot those people I'm not sure about and not those I think to be town very strongly, which would render my work useless. Also I don't want to tell people why I think people are town because for the offchance that I am wrong I am giving mafia the key to manipulate me because they know what to do to make me think someone is town. Remember LI? Wherebugs said I am pretty sure to be town because I am making mistakes and I am being honest about those, telling people I don't have a case and I was transparent while VE was not. That was the best moment ever for me (although wbg had to do it at that point in time if he thought I am town because it was quite scarce between VE and myself). I figured that's the reason he thought so strongly about me as town but at that point in time I no longer cared about making sense at all, I only needed to look like that and I'm fine. Therefore I am not running around like a mad man telling everyone who is town and who is not. Your 2 "scumreads" are something we can work with if you elaborate why you think so, so that we can actually understand what's going on in blue-Land. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 24 2012 22:07 Bluelightz wrote: Toad, could you elaborate in why you disagree with my reads? <3 nope | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 01:33 Radfield wrote: I was saying I was ok with a marvellosity or bluelightz lynch, but didn't really see either of them as particularly likely to flip scum. ie, I was not going to push either, but I was willing to be swayed. My comments regarding no-lynch is that we don't get any truly tangible benefits from a no-lynch. For instance, imagine if by no lynching yesterday we would give ourselves an extra mislynch down the stretch(ie, push lylo from Day 4 to Day 5). In that situation, a no-lynch has tangible real benefits. When I said " it doesn't really do us any good", I did not mean that a no-lynch is bad. Simply that it literally doesn't do us a lot of good. In this situation, I think a no-lynch was better than a mislynch(which is not always the case). Not to mention that I was voting 5 minutes before the deadline in an obvious no-lynch situation  I don't think it was that obvious. We had 4 votes on marv with all three of VE, prpl and yourself saying that you are willing to lynch marv. VE voted Sbrubbles to prove his willingness to lynch a lurker / marv (?!?!) and said he was fine with lynching marv. You because you were fine with it for whatever reason, I don't recall something specific there (!) and prpl because he wanted to avoid a no-lynch and out of nowhere 15 minutes before the deadline VE gets in here telling people he had a change of heart, you get in here voting a no-lynch as well, Ace gets in who had no proper clue about what was going on either, therefore voting some random guy who never was up for lynch. You understand that I think the last 30 or so minutes before the deadline yesterday were pretty weird, don't you? Not to mention that I still think marv is / was a good plan B, at least better than a no-lynch. So basicly we were in a Situation were you (rad) tell people it's stupid to lynch a vet because they could be a strong town asset. Next thing happening is VE posting some crap like this: On April 24 2012 06:20 VisceraEyes wrote: Rad made me rethink voting marv - I went back and reread the beginning of his newbie game that I read and he did find himself the victim of early suspicion. I'm willing to no-lynch in this situation. In my opinion a no-lynch is better than a mislynch in this situation and I'm not confident enough in any of the lurkers anymore - there has been a lot of activity here toward the end, and it's hard to tell if it's because there's a scum candidate or because no one wants a no-lynch or what. What do you think Toad? Do you think we should lynch a lurker or no-lynch? I'm okay with no-lynching to be frank. which basicly tells us that we don't lynch lurkers either, which brings me to the question: Are you the bad guy manipulating VE when he is uncertain or is VE the bad guy using your uncertainty to get out of this for whatever reason (hint: in this explanation marv would be mafia) It feels a little like you're behaving like blue, who's most recent post has to be the biggest troll ever, because I told him to stop calling EVERY SINGLE GUY in this game a townie and that we eventually have to lynch someone to get rid of mafia which finally gets him to post a scumread just to answer that one with another "yeah I guess I was wrong, that guy is a townie as well". The difference here is that you are not blue. Neither is VE and one or the other is being manipulative imo. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 02:20 Sbrubbles wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 25 2012 02:00 SamuelLJackson wrote: I don't think it was that obvious. We had 4 votes on marv with all three of VE, prpl and yourself saying that you are willing to lynch marv. VE voted Sbrubbles to prove his willingness to lynch a lurker / marv (?!?!) and said he was fine with lynching marv. You because you were fine with it for whatever reason, I don't recall something specific there (!) and prpl because he wanted to avoid a no-lynch and out of nowhere 15 minutes before the deadline VE gets in here telling people he had a change of heart, you get in here voting a no-lynch as well, Ace gets in who had no proper clue about what was going on either, therefore voting some random guy who never was up for lynch. You understand that I think the last 30 or so minutes before the deadline yesterday were pretty weird, don't you? Not to mention that I still think marv is / was a good plan B, at least better than a no-lynch. So basicly we were in a Situation were you (rad) tell people it's stupid to lynch a vet because they could be a strong town asset. Next thing happening is VE posting some crap like this: which basicly tells us that we don't lynch lurkers either, which brings me to the question: Are you the bad guy manipulating VE when he is uncertain or is VE the bad guy using your uncertainty to get out of this for whatever reason (hint: in this explanation marv would be mafia) It feels a little like you're behaving like blue, who's most recent post has to be the biggest troll ever, because I told him to stop calling EVERY SINGLE GUY in this game a townie and that we eventually have to lynch someone to get rid of mafia which finally gets him to post a scumread just to answer that one with another "yeah I guess I was wrong, that guy is a townie as well". The difference here is that you are not blue. Neither is VE and one or the other is being manipulative imo. --- Toad Toad, I've been wondering this myself. VE says he's up for lynching lurkers, votes me -> Rad says me and snarfs would be a bad lynch but would accept lynching marv or blue -> VE is convinced by that post that a no-lynch is better (huh?), votes no lynch -> Rad votes no lynch -> marv doesn't get lynched by 3 votes The thing is, even though I can see both of them as suspicious, I was getting the vibe (from the interactions between them) that they couldn't both be mafia, but I'm starting to rethink that. If one of them flipped red, do would think that would clear the other? Disagree with you rethinking. It's like you (and I) just said, probably one of them is mafia and the other guy is town but yeah, both are suspicious and I'm not sure who's the townie and who's the mafia. Both being mafia just makes no sense for some other reasons. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:31 Forumite wrote: Do you two want to discuss anything before the deadline? I´ve been spacing out since the lynch, got to get back into the game. what do you think happened yesterday --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
--- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
Not to begin with the fact that I was referring to the fact that we had 4 people voting marv and at least 3 more people saying they will vote marv and suddenly out of nowhere everyone screams no-lynch is the way to go. Sadly there's probably not enough mafia in this game to call everyone mafia who were defending their buddy which leaves me with the problem that either a couple of guys are manipulative and the rest is town or I am wrong about marv. However, even if I am wrong that situation was highly strange. Why did everyone back off like that? Anyways. Your turn of asking a question or turning the discussion somewhere else if you like. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 06:16 Forumite wrote: To clarify, you think what happened was that Marvel is scum, he got too close to getting lynched, and everyone changed their mind and went for a no-lynch? I don´t know, it was very close to the lynch and we didn´t have a clear candidate, going for a no-lynch felt right at the time. I don't know if marv is scum but I think some of the guys changing their mind last second seem pretty suspicious to me. I just don't know which of those. Radfield sounds like the best bet for tomorrow to me. He's basicly involved as mafia in every scenario I can think of. But that's all under the assumption that we don't have 3 to 4 vets, all being town and all chickening out last second for their own reasons. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 06:39 Forumite wrote: Snarf went after you for soft-defending? Meh, you are not the only one called out for soft-defending. Was the case on Marvel that strong? What I saw at the time felt like it was more about him staying under the radar than him actually doing anything weird, on the other hand my readthrough was kind of rushed with just an hour before the lynch. There were a few players up for a lynch. If there were scum voting for a no-lynch, then it could have been to defend anyone of the frontrunners. no the case wasn't strong, it was a Plan-B lynch. A "lynch the lurker" and I thought the other lurkers that were an option (zentor and sbrubbles) were more likely to be town than marv because they have stuff in their filter that makes them look townish. Marv on the other hand had not imo and kind of in Sandros opinion. Don't know what he thought about marv because he wasn't around at that time and still isn't but he thought the other 2 guys are town as well. I think marv's a little weird but I wasn't sure about him being mafia, neither am I right now, still thought it's a decent shot for a lurker. Also he was the only lurker that never got some action. People attacked Zentor for being weird, people (VE) attacked Sbrubbles (god I have to c&p that name every time...) for being a lurker but noone attacked Marv. Why wasn't mafia using that opportunity at all, unless you think I am mafia. That being said: fact that everyone was backing off like crazy paranoid people is weird above anything, no matter of marvs alignment. And no, there were not a couple of guys taking votes. Marv had 4 votes and 3 people saying they're willing to vote him. the next guy had 3 votes and everyone else said they're not going to vote him followed by a bunch of 2 or 1 voters who noone was willing to support either. Marv was the only one who was at danger yesterday. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
Just in case of preemptive faceloseage. --- Toad | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
On April 25 2012 06:55 wherebugsgo wrote: Freezing all night actions/action changes. Daypost in 5. Please do not post after the hour if the post is delayed. | ||
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SamuelLJackson
223 Posts
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