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BC's Arkham Asylum - Page 27

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Sevryn
Profile Joined September 2010
698 Posts
July 18 2011 14:31 GMT
#521
On July 18 2011 23:17 Curu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:16 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 16:05 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:33 Coagulation wrote:
Heres the list of newbs and vets in the game.
1. snotboogie Newb
2. Deconduo Vet
3. Kurumi NEWB LOL
4. curu Newb
5. RebirthofLegend Vet
6. Amber[LighT] Vet
7. hiro protagonist Newb
8. nisani201 Newb
9. Pyo Newb
10.Drazerk Newb
11. supersoft Newb
12. Jackal58 LOL
13. Mr. Wiggles Vet
14. prplhz Newb
15. mig Newb
16. notasmurf Newb
17. kenpachi LOL
18. Syllogism Newb
19. Palmar Newb
20. Sevryn Newb
21. ghrur Vet
22. Varysthespider Newb
23. node Vet
24, coagulation Vet
25. kavdragon Vet
26. Lucidity Newb
27. ketomai Newb
28. creamybutter Newb
29. redff Vet
30. youngminii Vet
31. liquid`nazgul Newb
32. Shraft Newb
33. cjrninja Newb
34. visceraeyes Newb
35. theawesomeall Newb
36. eternalmisfit Newb
37. zona Vet
38. gtrsrs Newb
39. ribboo Newb
40. sinani206 Newb

This list was pointless and all it served to do was belittle and intimidate the newer players from posting.
To that end, what is your agenda? The only objective this post served was to discourage newer players from posting which helps mafia force sheeping, which in a game this size is a considerable problem. To this end, I am voting for you.

##Vote Coagulation

I feel like this post is trying to make a coag bandwagon while coag probably should not have marked all the newbs but only the vets anyone he didnt mark as a vet would just assume newb so to even just make a list of vets isn't very different from the list that got made. I feel like RoL is exaggerating how discouraging this post was to newbs. As a new player the list made me want to read the thread closely and try to think about it for myself instead of just relying on older players to make all the decisions and just bandwagon on them.
##vote RebirthOfLeGenD


Hi Sevryn nice of you to join us.

What's your opinion on supersoft?

The main thing with supersoft is he seems to be acting pretty newbish for from looking at his post history having played a few games and it seems pretty obvious that claiming VT is pointless and only helps mafia so If he is town I don't understand why he would do so.
Curu
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada2817 Posts
July 18 2011 14:33 GMT
#522
On July 18 2011 23:31 Sevryn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:17 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:16 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 16:05 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:33 Coagulation wrote:
Heres the list of newbs and vets in the game.
1. snotboogie Newb
2. Deconduo Vet
3. Kurumi NEWB LOL
4. curu Newb
5. RebirthofLegend Vet
6. Amber[LighT] Vet
7. hiro protagonist Newb
8. nisani201 Newb
9. Pyo Newb
10.Drazerk Newb
11. supersoft Newb
12. Jackal58 LOL
13. Mr. Wiggles Vet
14. prplhz Newb
15. mig Newb
16. notasmurf Newb
17. kenpachi LOL
18. Syllogism Newb
19. Palmar Newb
20. Sevryn Newb
21. ghrur Vet
22. Varysthespider Newb
23. node Vet
24, coagulation Vet
25. kavdragon Vet
26. Lucidity Newb
27. ketomai Newb
28. creamybutter Newb
29. redff Vet
30. youngminii Vet
31. liquid`nazgul Newb
32. Shraft Newb
33. cjrninja Newb
34. visceraeyes Newb
35. theawesomeall Newb
36. eternalmisfit Newb
37. zona Vet
38. gtrsrs Newb
39. ribboo Newb
40. sinani206 Newb

This list was pointless and all it served to do was belittle and intimidate the newer players from posting.
To that end, what is your agenda? The only objective this post served was to discourage newer players from posting which helps mafia force sheeping, which in a game this size is a considerable problem. To this end, I am voting for you.

##Vote Coagulation

I feel like this post is trying to make a coag bandwagon while coag probably should not have marked all the newbs but only the vets anyone he didnt mark as a vet would just assume newb so to even just make a list of vets isn't very different from the list that got made. I feel like RoL is exaggerating how discouraging this post was to newbs. As a new player the list made me want to read the thread closely and try to think about it for myself instead of just relying on older players to make all the decisions and just bandwagon on them.
##vote RebirthOfLeGenD


Hi Sevryn nice of you to join us.

What's your opinion on supersoft?

The main thing with supersoft is he seems to be acting pretty newbish for from looking at his post history having played a few games and it seems pretty obvious that claiming VT is pointless and only helps mafia so If he is town I don't understand why he would do so.


So who do you find more scummy

supersoft the innocent newb who is accidentally hurting town
Or RebirthofLegend the big bad meanie who drives the bandwagon >
wat
Sevryn
Profile Joined September 2010
698 Posts
July 18 2011 14:35 GMT
#523
Well I def don't trust either of them and they both need looking into I would like RoL to make some more posts before I could say which i think i scummier.
Sevryn
Profile Joined September 2010
698 Posts
July 18 2011 14:41 GMT
#524
On July 18 2011 23:33 Curu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:31 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:17 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:16 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 16:05 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:33 Coagulation wrote:
Heres the list of newbs and vets in the game.
1. snotboogie Newb
2. Deconduo Vet
3. Kurumi NEWB LOL
4. curu Newb
5. RebirthofLegend Vet
6. Amber[LighT] Vet
7. hiro protagonist Newb
8. nisani201 Newb
9. Pyo Newb
10.Drazerk Newb
11. supersoft Newb
12. Jackal58 LOL
13. Mr. Wiggles Vet
14. prplhz Newb
15. mig Newb
16. notasmurf Newb
17. kenpachi LOL
18. Syllogism Newb
19. Palmar Newb
20. Sevryn Newb
21. ghrur Vet
22. Varysthespider Newb
23. node Vet
24, coagulation Vet
25. kavdragon Vet
26. Lucidity Newb
27. ketomai Newb
28. creamybutter Newb
29. redff Vet
30. youngminii Vet
31. liquid`nazgul Newb
32. Shraft Newb
33. cjrninja Newb
34. visceraeyes Newb
35. theawesomeall Newb
36. eternalmisfit Newb
37. zona Vet
38. gtrsrs Newb
39. ribboo Newb
40. sinani206 Newb

This list was pointless and all it served to do was belittle and intimidate the newer players from posting.
To that end, what is your agenda? The only objective this post served was to discourage newer players from posting which helps mafia force sheeping, which in a game this size is a considerable problem. To this end, I am voting for you.

##Vote Coagulation

I feel like this post is trying to make a coag bandwagon while coag probably should not have marked all the newbs but only the vets anyone he didnt mark as a vet would just assume newb so to even just make a list of vets isn't very different from the list that got made. I feel like RoL is exaggerating how discouraging this post was to newbs. As a new player the list made me want to read the thread closely and try to think about it for myself instead of just relying on older players to make all the decisions and just bandwagon on them.
##vote RebirthOfLeGenD


Hi Sevryn nice of you to join us.

What's your opinion on supersoft?

The main thing with supersoft is he seems to be acting pretty newbish for from looking at his post history having played a few games and it seems pretty obvious that claiming VT is pointless and only helps mafia so If he is town I don't understand why he would do so.


So who do you find more scummy

supersoft the innocent newb who is accidentally hurting town
Or RebirthofLegend the big bad meanie who drives the bandwagon >

Also i don't think supersoft is an "innocent newb" as i said before this isn't his first game and he should know better. that combined with not wanted to lynch mig just because he was the only one to PM him seems scummy.
##unvote
##vote supersoft
Curu
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada2817 Posts
July 18 2011 14:43 GMT
#525
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?
wat
Sevryn
Profile Joined September 2010
698 Posts
July 18 2011 14:47 GMT
#526
On July 18 2011 23:43 Curu wrote:
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?

Your post saying he was the innocent newb made me think about his history more and he has played enough games in my opinion to know not to claim VT.
I'm not saying we should stop looking at RoL but i would like to see RoL post some more before we lynch him over supersoft.
Curu
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada2817 Posts
July 18 2011 14:49 GMT
#527
On July 18 2011 23:47 Sevryn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:43 Curu wrote:
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?

Your post saying he was the innocent newb made me think about his history more and he has played enough games in my opinion to know not to claim VT.
I'm not saying we should stop looking at RoL but i would like to see RoL post some more before we lynch him over supersoft.


Alright buddy.

You said you wanted to build your own opinions. just make sure you can articulate them as well. Go forth and scumhunt!

I task you with finding one more person you think is scummy and building a nice articulate case against them.
wat
redFF
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States3910 Posts
July 18 2011 15:15 GMT
#528
There's a difference between spamming and making short posts with content.
On July 18 2011 23:49 Curu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:47 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:43 Curu wrote:
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?

Your post saying he was the innocent newb made me think about his history more and he has played enough games in my opinion to know not to claim VT.
I'm not saying we should stop looking at RoL but i would like to see RoL post some more before we lynch him over supersoft.


Alright buddy.

You said you wanted to build your own opinions. just make sure you can articulate them as well. Go forth and scumhunt!

I task you with finding one more person you think is scummy and building a nice articulate case against them.

adds nothing to the discussion, trying to look like he's contributing without actually saying anything.
A lot of his posts are like this. I would say he has been the spammiest player by far.
Plus asking how scum should play this is really scummy to me imo.
And the tunneling on Supersoft with little evidence to back it up is dumb too. Imo mafia saw a weakness/easy lynch and capitalised.

Also every game i have seen gtrsrs play he has been the same, just ignore his insults and general rudeness, maybe he will go away.

##Vote Curu
sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
July 18 2011 15:22 GMT
#529
Please keep it civil, personal atacks will not be tolerated.
Lucidity
Profile Joined July 2010
South Africa603 Posts
July 18 2011 15:34 GMT
#530
Oh my. 11 pages to catch up.

I was at a job interview today, sorry for my absence so far!

*starts reading*
Valar Morghulis
Curu
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada2817 Posts
July 18 2011 15:34 GMT
#531
On July 19 2011 00:15 redFF wrote:
There's a difference between spamming and making short posts with content.
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 23:49 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:47 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:43 Curu wrote:
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?

Your post saying he was the innocent newb made me think about his history more and he has played enough games in my opinion to know not to claim VT.
I'm not saying we should stop looking at RoL but i would like to see RoL post some more before we lynch him over supersoft.


Alright buddy.

You said you wanted to build your own opinions. just make sure you can articulate them as well. Go forth and scumhunt!

I task you with finding one more person you think is scummy and building a nice articulate case against them.

adds nothing to the discussion, trying to look like he's contributing without actually saying anything.
A lot of his posts are like this. I would say he has been the spammiest player by far.
Plus asking how scum should play this is really scummy to me imo.
And the tunneling on Supersoft with little evidence to back it up is dumb too. Imo mafia saw a weakness/easy lynch and capitalised.

Also every game i have seen gtrsrs play he has been the same, just ignore his insults and general rudeness, maybe he will go away.

##Vote Curu



Little evidence? What are your thoughts on supersoft then? Hey look, the lynch I led actually has a lot of votes on it and more than just me contributing analysis. I'd say I'm contributing despite my spamminess.

What's the point of the vote on me? Do you really think you can make a great case against me besides my "spamminess" and asking how Mafia should play (LOL, you really see this as a scumtell?)? Am I really more scummy to you because of these two things than anyone else in this thread? I love how you ignored everything else I've posted because of my "spam" posts. And fyi, they weren't spam posts, they've told me what I need to know about Sevyrn.

If I really wanted to attack the easy bandwagon, why was I not on RoL's?

If you want to lynch me for no content posts, maybe you should vote for yourself first:

On July 18 2011 14:29 redFF wrote:
SILENCE NEWB


On July 18 2011 14:37 redFF wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 14:34 Curu wrote:
lol, so you basically dropped in to tell us you're going to be useless?

Great. A VT claim doesn't help Town at all either. You're just introducing yourself as mislynch bait or gambiting Mafia now or a whole load of other WIFOM crap. Can you provide a single pro Town reason why you would claim VT?

I hope you're just drunk and not really going to be a destructive force like this if you really are Town.

lol read XL


On July 18 2011 13:31 redFF wrote:
To be fair there are a lot of new players, people trying to guide and teach aren't auto scum. EG kav in 38 getting lynched day 1 by drh.


On July 18 2011 12:43 redFF wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 10:37 Curu wrote:
CreamyButter, a question for you if I may. Taking the setup into consideration, how would you propose to play as Mafia this game if you were indeed to receive such a role?

What is the point of this question? Is it scumhunting? I don't think so. All it looks like to me is scum asking for tips but idk


On July 18 2011 12:38 redFF wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 12:34 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:03 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 11:17 notasmurf wrote:
Hello.

Now, before we go off and venture forth, I'd like us to take a look at another recent game that ended quiet badly for the town, Closed Casket Mafia.

The town lost Closed Casket Mafia because of two reasons
  • People lied. Do not lie. There is absolutely no reason to lie to the town. Do not fakeclaim to ‘draw a hit’. Two of the mislynches in Closed Casket Mafia were directly caused by lies
  • The town killed itself. The mafia didn't do much; the town just went around shooting each other until everyone died. People were lynched more of emotion than what the facts were. Consider lylo Chezinu was lynched in spite of the fact that 1) DT returned a green check 2) Chezinu was playing considerably more pro town than before 3) Radfied somehow survived night one.


What we need to do as town this game is to agree on two things in public.

1. Do not fakeclaim Show me a game with a townie fakeclaiming publically or lying about their checks, and I’ll show you a game where the same townie could have achieved a much better result telling the truth
2. Do your own analysis Just cause three people say Bloodycobbler is skummy doesn’t mean that he actually is scum. Before you vote for someone, please read over their posts and develop an opinion for yourself.

Keep in mind this just applies in public. In PMs go have fun guys
+ Show Spoiler +
I know that people like clicking on spoilers, so I put this here to encourage you to read this post


Do not lie he says, but his very name itself is a lie. Oh ho ho.

On July 18 2011 11:43 redFF wrote:
Vigs shoot lurkers and liars unless you are good at scumhunting, which very few people are.



redFF, would you consider yourself one of those good scumhunters that are oh so very elusive? I would like to know how confident you are good sir.

His name was done before the game so use use the fact that hes a smurf to argue against the common sense advice that he's giving seems pretty anti-town.


I think it was a joke...


I'm trying to get gtrsrs to play in a Pro-Town manner because I think he actually is Town. You want him to just go away?
wat
Nisani201
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1400 Posts
July 18 2011 15:58 GMT
#532
Before I read through the thread, Sinani206 has told me that he needs to be replaced.
Enjoy your day.
Kavdragon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States1251 Posts
July 18 2011 15:59 GMT
#533
Ok, sorry if this has already been mentioned, but I want this said asap, and I'm not caught up on the thread:

This is a PM game. This is can help or hurt the town depending on how we use them. This can make or break the game, so it's very important that we don't mess it up early. (See Salem Mafia if you doubt)

#1: DO NOT CLAIM
This goes for in the thread as well, obviously. There are some here who are very, very good at manipulating people through pms when they are mafia.

Uh..I'm sure there are more good rules, but let me cut to the good part:

Create small (2-4) PM circles with people. Use them to do analysis on suspects, events, and each other. It is IMPERATIVE that you do not trust each other just because you are in a circle. The circle is not a place to claim, it's not a place to give out secret information. Chances are, you will have a scum in your circle, so treat it as such.

I'm sure most vets will agree that this is by far the most effective and safe way of using PM's, and I'd highly recommend that people try this as it is MUCH easier to catch Mafia by PM than it is in thread.

The key thing is to get everyone in small circles, and for those people NOT to trust each other. At least not right off the bat. I'm not going to assign people groups as that got the person who suggested it almost lynched last time, but I will say that I've already started this, and I hope others will too.
I'm currently on an indefinite hiatus from TL =(
Sevryn
Profile Joined September 2010
698 Posts
July 18 2011 16:02 GMT
#534
On July 19 2011 00:34 Curu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 19 2011 00:15 redFF wrote:
There's a difference between spamming and making short posts with content.
On July 18 2011 23:49 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:47 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 23:43 Curu wrote:
Huh, why'd you change your vote to supersoft? I don't think there's been any new evidence against him and last page you seemed to think RoL was more scummy and worthy of your vote.

What changed your mind?

Your post saying he was the innocent newb made me think about his history more and he has played enough games in my opinion to know not to claim VT.
I'm not saying we should stop looking at RoL but i would like to see RoL post some more before we lynch him over supersoft.


Alright buddy.

You said you wanted to build your own opinions. just make sure you can articulate them as well. Go forth and scumhunt!

I task you with finding one more person you think is scummy and building a nice articulate case against them.

adds nothing to the discussion, trying to look like he's contributing without actually saying anything.
A lot of his posts are like this. I would say he has been the spammiest player by far.
Plus asking how scum should play this is really scummy to me imo.
And the tunneling on Supersoft with little evidence to back it up is dumb too. Imo mafia saw a weakness/easy lynch and capitalised.

Also every game i have seen gtrsrs play he has been the same, just ignore his insults and general rudeness, maybe he will go away.

##Vote Curu



Little evidence? What are your thoughts on supersoft then? Hey look, the lynch I led actually has a lot of votes on it and more than just me contributing analysis. I'd say I'm contributing despite my spamminess.

What's the point of the vote on me? Do you really think you can make a great case against me besides my "spamminess" and asking how Mafia should play (LOL, you really see this as a scumtell?)? Am I really more scummy to you because of these two things than anyone else in this thread? I love how you ignored everything else I've posted because of my "spam" posts. And fyi, they weren't spam posts, they've told me what I need to know about Sevyrn.

If I really wanted to attack the easy bandwagon, why was I not on RoL's?

If you want to lynch me for no content posts, maybe you should vote for yourself first:

Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 14:29 redFF wrote:
SILENCE NEWB


Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 14:37 redFF wrote:
On July 18 2011 14:34 Curu wrote:
lol, so you basically dropped in to tell us you're going to be useless?

Great. A VT claim doesn't help Town at all either. You're just introducing yourself as mislynch bait or gambiting Mafia now or a whole load of other WIFOM crap. Can you provide a single pro Town reason why you would claim VT?

I hope you're just drunk and not really going to be a destructive force like this if you really are Town.

lol read XL


Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 13:31 redFF wrote:
To be fair there are a lot of new players, people trying to guide and teach aren't auto scum. EG kav in 38 getting lynched day 1 by drh.


Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 12:43 redFF wrote:
On July 18 2011 10:37 Curu wrote:
CreamyButter, a question for you if I may. Taking the setup into consideration, how would you propose to play as Mafia this game if you were indeed to receive such a role?

What is the point of this question? Is it scumhunting? I don't think so. All it looks like to me is scum asking for tips but idk


Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 12:38 redFF wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:34 Sevryn wrote:
On July 18 2011 12:03 Curu wrote:
On July 18 2011 11:17 notasmurf wrote:
Hello.

Now, before we go off and venture forth, I'd like us to take a look at another recent game that ended quiet badly for the town, Closed Casket Mafia.

The town lost Closed Casket Mafia because of two reasons
  • People lied. Do not lie. There is absolutely no reason to lie to the town. Do not fakeclaim to ‘draw a hit’. Two of the mislynches in Closed Casket Mafia were directly caused by lies
  • The town killed itself. The mafia didn't do much; the town just went around shooting each other until everyone died. People were lynched more of emotion than what the facts were. Consider lylo Chezinu was lynched in spite of the fact that 1) DT returned a green check 2) Chezinu was playing considerably more pro town than before 3) Radfied somehow survived night one.


What we need to do as town this game is to agree on two things in public.

1. Do not fakeclaim Show me a game with a townie fakeclaiming publically or lying about their checks, and I’ll show you a game where the same townie could have achieved a much better result telling the truth
2. Do your own analysis Just cause three people say Bloodycobbler is skummy doesn’t mean that he actually is scum. Before you vote for someone, please read over their posts and develop an opinion for yourself.

Keep in mind this just applies in public. In PMs go have fun guys
+ Show Spoiler +
I know that people like clicking on spoilers, so I put this here to encourage you to read this post


Do not lie he says, but his very name itself is a lie. Oh ho ho.

On July 18 2011 11:43 redFF wrote:
Vigs shoot lurkers and liars unless you are good at scumhunting, which very few people are.



redFF, would you consider yourself one of those good scumhunters that are oh so very elusive? I would like to know how confident you are good sir.

His name was done before the game so use use the fact that hes a smurf to argue against the common sense advice that he's giving seems pretty anti-town.


I think it was a joke...


I'm trying to get gtrsrs to play in a Pro-Town manner because I think he actually is Town. You want him to just go away?

So what do you know about me?
Eternalmisfit
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States643 Posts
July 18 2011 16:12 GMT
#535
Just finished catching up with the thread and here is my thoughts on the game thus far.

1. As with most Day1 posting and analysis, I have yet to see any clear scum-slips so far. There has been some light scum-tells but nothing so far makes me confident and someone is definitely scum. Something that needs to be remembered is that Day1 lynch is a crap-shoot and most likely results in a lynch of a townie (Read last 8-10 games and you will see this pattern). Pretty much any post can be thought of as a scum tell via a weird convoluted way and I do not believe in lynching purely based on WIFOM analysis.

For e.g. Drazerk's analysis on Mr. Wiggles
Mr. Wiggles made some good points about a pro-town environment and also organizing the town. His early discussion with decon and couple others regarding getting the black roles out of the game asap also makes a lot of sense. However, Drazerk votes on him on the basis of meta arguments. The posts by themselves are reasonable contributions and can either be a townie or a scum hiding as a townie. It is at best a null tell and most likely pro-town behavior.


2. Regarding Coagulation
Coag posted the vet/newb list since Wiggles and (Mig??) asked for someone to post such a list. I do find him posting such a list scummy since people was asking for it to be done. I can agree he hasn't contributed much apart from that list but that can be said about the majority of the people in this game.


3. Regarding Lurkers
In a larger game such as this one, it is easy for mafia to lurk if people are not pressured to post. 5 posts/day should alleviate this issue but we should keep an eye out on people who are barely keeping the minimum posting requirements. There are several people who have not posted (not necessarily lurking as it has been 12 hrs since the game start) who should be pressured to post their thoughts on the game.


4. My current suspicions include: Supersoft and CreamyButter
Supersoft - His posting has been inconsistent. Claims VT and then claims it was a fake claim and so on.
CreamyButter - His posts are not too shabby but the fact that he is over-playing the noob card makes me suspicious. The players here in a general are a healthy mix of veterans and it is not like that he is the only new player. In fact, there are probably more relatively inexperienced players than vets and thus prefacing every post with 'I am a noob but' is not required.

-> Neither of these activities merit a vote on them by themselves but I plan to keep an eye on them to see.

5. Lastly, since out of game contact is allowed beyond PM's as well, feel free to add me on skype and talk to me if you want to. If you do not prefer that, feel free to msg me in PM-land as well.
Skype id: loony_surfer
Lucidity
Profile Joined July 2010
South Africa603 Posts
July 18 2011 16:32 GMT
#536
On July 18 2011 11:42 ketomai wrote:
In my opinion you shouldn't dig around too much into clues unless you have some specific reason to do so. Having everyone being accused a few times because of how clues are twisted will create confusion/chaos, which is never good.

I don't really agree with this. Although we can all agree that chaos isn't good for town, you need to look at the possible benefits that the chaos can bring too. In this case, accusing some people a few times to see how they react can give us valuable information - freudian slips, overly defensive scum etc. The chaos should also be minimal if you think about it and only last a few posts. We'll get our info and move on. I think the net result is positive for town. I'm by no means an experienced player - I've only been in about 10 games and I've hosted 2 - but that's been my experience. Pressuring players usually benefits town more.

Which brings me to my next point. I think we should be careful of looking at everything in black and white. "Chaos is bad" as above. Each case should be evaluated on its own merits. Policy lynches for example. While it is true that scum try to give away as little information as possible, "Lynch All Lurkers" doesn't really make sense. Every scum player knows that this policy lynch exists and thus they don't lurk. The only people you'll end up lynching with this strategy are bad/lazy/inactive players. That is, bad town or bad scum. Seeing that there are more town than scum players, you're more likely to be lynching a townie t_t

Now I'm not saying lurkers should be ignored, but they shouldn't be lynched outright. I've personally been in a game where we won the game on the last day thanks to a lurker who became very active O:

On July 18 2011 13:14 Pyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 10:25 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Ok, so let's get this started!

First things first, let's lay out some things we want to achieve, and some guidelines.

A pro-town atmosphere

This normally goes without saying, but it often bears repeating. If we want to catch scum, we need to have the proper environment for scum hunting and for communicating with each other. This means a couple things:

  • Promoting scum hunting.
  • Not having pointless arguments
  • Actively contributing
  • All that jazz


Basically, we want to keep the thread as clean as possible, because chaos best serves mafia, not town. If you really don't know what to do, there's town guides. I'm not going to write one here, because I'm too lazy, and don't consider myself experienced enough to try. However, I am going to go through the three points above, as I think they are very important.

We always want people to scum-hunt. There's never an excuse not to scum-hunt; everyone can do it. This provides us with many benefits. First, it's the primary method for actually finding scum. It also means that people have to give their actual thoughts, and have to come up with things beyond "I agree". This gives us information, and information is good. It lets us know what you're thinking, and it puts pressure on mafia to have to contribute. Also, forcing mafia to scum-hunt means that there's a good chance of catching them just based on their analysis, because it's hard to find people who are scummy, when you know they aren't scum.

Next, we want to avoid bickering. This goes hand in hand with keeping the thread clean. This is different from actually debating with people, and you should be able to tell the difference between rationality, and NO U. If anyone is having a pointless argument, they will be asked to stop. It doesn't help town, only mafia.

Lastly, we want people to contribute. There's a posting limit of 5 posts per day/night, but that doesn't give you permission to skirt that limit. It's easy for mafia to hide amongst lurkers, and beyond that, lurkers are nearly impossible to analyze. So, contribute. This doesn't mean make tons of pointless one-liners, it means providing actual thoughts, analysis, and content. You can do it, I believe in you. And if you don't, we can always just ask a vig to shoot you. We don't want people to lurk.

Clues

There's clues in this game. However, all clue analysis MUST MUST MUST be backed up by post analysis. Before you post the clue analysis too. The reason for this, is that clues will most likely point to all kills. this means that some of the clues are going to point to vigs, some will point to third parties, and the others will point to mafia. Accidentally outing a vig because you solved the clues about them is bad. So, if you think someone's attached to a clue, go back and re-read their posts. If you think they look scummy, then post an analysis that contains the clue analysis. If you think they're town, just hold onto your analysis. Clue-analysis should always be used to supplement an actual behavioural analysis. It should never be the main point for calling someone scummy. In other words: Clues pointing towards a person does not equal scum.

Third Parties

Looking at the third parties, here's what we want:

-We want Joker to die.
-We want Batman to kill Joker.
-This means that Batman wins, and should hopefully be removed from the game, also removing Ra’as Al Ghul who can no longer achieve his victory condition.

This is the optimal way the third party part of the game will go. We want Batman to kill Joker before Ra'as can kill Batman, so that we don't have to deal with Joker ourselves. So, if you think someone's acting like an SK, don't be afraid to point it out, as this should help Batman achieve his win-con, and let us get on with the rest of the game.

If Joker is lynched, is Batman removed from the game?
If Batman is removed from the game, is Ra'as removed from the game?


Thoughts? Disagreements? Let's get this rolling.


Show nested quote +
On July 18 2011 12:39 CreamyButter wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On July 18 2011 10:37 Curu wrote:

CreamyButter, a question for you if I may. Taking the setup into consideration, how would you propose to play as Mafia this game if you were indeed to receive such a role?


Ummm. Well. First order of business is of course ensuring that all mafia members are actively contributing to the thread. For the newer players, I might consider giving them a talking point, or else assigning one mafia to make an inconsequential "slip" in the thread, so that the less experienced mafia members can analyze properly without feeling guilty and without actually slipping up. I would pick the newest players and make sure they know what they're doing, basically, and if not I would help them compose their posts before they post them. After all mafia members are actively posting, I would try to shift the demographic being targeted in the thread to something less dangerous, such as lynching all lurkers.

Also, since there seems to be a zodiac/veteran list going up, I would make sure to elect a figurehead boss, so that the boss doesn't end up on the list.

From there, use PMs to harass/poke people and figure out what roles they have/infiltrate their circles >.> Avoid hitting vets, figure out where the hatter's bombs are before killing them, hit medics, boring stuff etc. I would be actively PMing, to make sure the town doesn't get up to anything worthwhile. Possibly coordinate PMs with other mafia members.

A priority is reaching out to the insane inmates, and integrating them into the mafia circle. With no rolechecker, though, I'm not sure how mafia would do this. I guess they would get the DT to check on someone who isn't in the known mafia circle, and if the DT claims that he's seeing red, then the guy being checked is probably insane because no 3rd party would set themselves as red. For this reason I might consider not killing DTs right away as long as he's being properly manipulated. Batman is useless because he can't claim and he can't reveal his findings, though.

From what I can tell, it is in mafia's best interest to get the 3rd parties lynched. The 3rd parties might randomly kill a mafia member at night, and might eat up night hits, and it is impossible to cooperate with them since they can't claim. I guess I would just leave random hints everywhere that someone (someone who isn't mafia) is Batman and hope he dies.

As a 3rd party player:
It seems to be in Joker's best interest for the game to end as quickly as possible, so he would keep mafia alive at first, so that their KP is higher. Batman and Ra'as, on the other hand, want to keep the game running longer, so that they have time to hunt. As Batman I would default to rolechecking, and killing only when either confirmed or if one side seems like it's winning. As Ra'as I would target lurkers/useless seeming people until I get a read.

There seems to be enough vigilante advice, so maybe it's time to stop with that. As for DT advice though,
On July 18 2011 11:32 notasmurf wrote:

It's not who the veteran players are that we should be concerned about. It's who the new players are.
These are the people that we should focus our DT check on, and take a closer look during scumhunting.
By no means am I saying we should lynch new players instead of old ones. Obviously we need to lynch the best person possible. But what I'm saying is that they tend to get overlooked.

I agree that DTs should check the newer, more easy ignorable players, instead of the vets. Since as a DT you can only trust a red reading, there's no way to try and build a circle around yourself. It would also be much easier to get a newer, inactive, partially illiterate player lynched than an old one. So check people that you think yourself capable of actually getting lynched i guess.

I have to study/class, will be back later today. I don't really know how to give/identify good analysis, but I'm fully open to being tested/asked stupid questions to see if I screw up, so feel free to send me PMs.



I might be a "newb" but from my limited experience, pretty much every time someone comes out with one of these massive long policy spam posts, they've been scum. Just sayin'

Haha, so true Oo It's almost as if scum try too hard to appear pro-town by posting generic guides. Care to comment CreamyButter?

Only on page 20, but posting so long.
Valar Morghulis
Lucidity
Profile Joined July 2010
South Africa603 Posts
July 18 2011 16:38 GMT
#537
edit: I mean Mr Wiggles!

Although feel free to comment CreamyButter ^_^
Valar Morghulis
Lucidity
Profile Joined July 2010
South Africa603 Posts
July 18 2011 16:40 GMT
#538
On July 19 2011 00:34 Curu wrote:
I'm trying to get gtrsrs to play in a Pro-Town manner because I think he actually is Town. You want him to just go away?

Why do you think someone who isn't playing in a pro-town manner is town?
Valar Morghulis
Shraft
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden701 Posts
July 18 2011 16:45 GMT
#539
I think you're misunderstanding ketonai. His point was that you shouldn't base cases on clue more than him not wanting people to accuse each other.
BloodyC0bbler
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
Canada7875 Posts
July 18 2011 16:55 GMT
#540
On July 19 2011 00:58 Nisani201 wrote:
Before I read through the thread, Sinani206 has told me that he needs to be replaced.



For administrative purposes I need him to do the one posting to be subbed our, or pm me please. I will look for a replacement while waiting, but cannot actually sub him out until he specifically asks.
#3 Member of the Chill Fanclub / Rhaegar fought nobly. Rhaegar fought valiantly. Rhaegar fought honorably. And Rhaeger died. --Ser Jorah Mormont TL MAFIA FORUM http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31 go go !
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