United States22154 Posts
On April 12 2011 16:06 bumatlarge wrote:GMarshal Analysis I'm going to focus on how GM goes about the first day, as I feel that it's the clearest indication of his play and his meta.
Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 03:01 GMarshal wrote:Ok, my thoughts on this: I actualy seriously considered the possibility of lynching the pardoner as the day one lynch, but then I realized something, the Pardoner is more pro-town a role than it at first seems. Why? Because its the only person who can singlehandedly shut down a scummy last minute vote switch, where all the scum switch over to their preferred target, and potentially win the game. Also, as long as the pardoner is level headed he'll save his power for a situation where its obviously beneficial to the town (e.g. save a player who is obviously town from a sudden and unexpected wagon). As to the day 1 lynch, I think a lurker is absolutely 100% the best call, I've said it before, I *hate* lurkers, they make the endgame hellish. The benefit of having the mayor lead that lynch is that its almost entirely immune to scum influence, since (if we voted right) the mayor will be pro town. Furthermore, since the pardoner/mayor knows who the bodyguards are, meaning that the mafia could hit those roles easier. but if this happens we immediately cast suspicion on the pardoner and the mayor, so in that sense we force the scum to walk a dangerous line, if they snipe the bg too quickly then we know that one of them is the mayor or pardoner, if they leave them then they are leaving a powerful role in play in the form of the mayor or the pardoner GM immediately establishes himself as a policy person, which is understandable. I can't really consider this post scummy alone. He talks about relevant things early in the game, but it's way too forced. Paragraphs to explain simple ideas. Pardoners are strong but they can be pro-town, being able to do exactly what their role entails. Bam first paragraph done. Lurkers are the best lynch. Last part is so WIFOMy. I find if you come across something that leads to WIFOM, the best course of action is describe the situation and how it leads to WIFOM, and then drop it until it rears its ugly head in the game. Gmarshal is setting it in stone. No good. How is anything I said there untrue again? yes there is a certain level of wifom involved if a mafia gets elected, however I think its safe to say that if the BG's died night one there would be suspicion cast on everyone elected, is that unreasonable? Also, yes I agree, I do establish myself as a policy person, because I realize that town keeps losing because it allows people to get away with stuff it shouldn't
Show nested quote +Also Kav, my comment about waiting till day 1 to plan and do crap was more out of frustration at the wait than anything else  I died in insane night 1, i thought the game started 24 hours earlier than it did, I was ready to start, yes, yes I was frustrated, problem? Ha, mock frustration, this one line is worse then everything he said before. Kav is already on board. In fact let me show you what GM's post should have been. Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 01:27 Kavdragon wrote:On April 09 2011 08:58 GMarshal wrote:On April 09 2011 08:57 OriginalName wrote:
So broskis whats the plan? Wait till Day1 and then start actually being able to plan and do crap... I disagree on the basis of your argument for talking at night. Also, once the day does start, chances are the discussion will be taken over by mayoral discussions. Let's use this time that we are forced not to talk about the other conversation starter: Do we lynch an inactive day one? My thoughts: I think that we should lynch an inactive. People who are active can actually be read/analyzed later on, but inactives will always be an there in the back of our mind. This also pressures inactive players to become more active. Since we have a pardoner and traditionally Day one lynches are wrong, do we want to lynch day one? My thoughts: The pardoner only gets to pardon one lynch and while I've never played with a pardoner before, I don't think that that power should be use that lightly. In addition, not lynching on day one takes away our ability to pressure people. Straightforward. Even though I disagree with things, this is so easy to respond to. I think we should lynch a lurker rather then an inactive Kav. I see your point on the pardoner Kav. DONE AND DONE. You really lynched Kav? 
But let me continue, Gmarshal could have gotten unlucky, he didn't know how to put those words out properly. Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 03:15 GMarshal wrote:On April 10 2011 03:02 kitaman27 wrote:On April 10 2011 02:44 TranceStorm wrote:
Furthermore, since the pardoner/mayor knows who the bodyguards are, meaning that the mafia could hit those roles easier. This part gives the mafia more incentive to run as mayor than usual. The last thing they want is two town running around causing trouble, with no way to kill them. The fact that they are rewarded for running, but coming in second also gives them a nice bonus. The pardon ability is an awesome way to completely derail town focus when mafia is in a tough spot. I would feel real unwary having a pardoner around late game if I wasn't sure of his alignment. This means we should focus our attentions on people who run and on really analyzing the hell out of our mayor/pardoner. Also I think that the mayor's power is being understated, he has a triple vote, in the hands of scum that would be lethally dangerous, bringing lylo much, much closer than it should be. Personally I think we should only vote for players we think are probably town, because the idea of having one or both of those power roles in the hands of the mafia is pretty worrying. So yeah, let me state the obvious, make damn sure you are voting for pro town players, as these roles are pretty damn powerful. It reminds me of when I would get assigned a 500-word-essay in elementary school, and I'd do my best to say as much as possible while repeating the same idea different ways. If anyone does not see the evidence here, please inform me so I can clarify. I will do it with everyone of GM's posts if I have to. Because there was sooo much to talk about night 0, you are right the post says nothing truly new, but kav wanted night 0 discussion, and I saw no reason to avoid it simply because it was obvious to me, a newer player might not see it as clearly Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 04:02 GMarshal wrote:
wow, that was a mess of a post. What I intended to say was that assassins will not necessarily act anti-town but they certainly wont act to pro town either, as they want to both avoid being lynched and avoid being killed by the mafia. The only occasion where I expect to see an extremely pro town Assassin if if one tries to grab the mayorship/pardoner. Seeing these posts as well does not win me over in the "Gm is obvious town" department. It seems fairly clear that GM is well aware of what he is doing. I fail to see your point here, I made a relevant post, this makes me scum how?Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 04:56 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
kavdragon is saying a lot of useless bullshit trying to appear protown and basically his posts are this:
words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words
obviously no mafia would say THIS much "pro-town" stuff that everyone already knows amirite ;o????
i'm not buying it. you did this same thing in pokemafia which i hosted I don't mean to divert, but are you serious Dr.H? You've defintely been reading Kav's posts, but I find it hard to believe you missed GM's. Massive FoS Doctor Mayor. This only helps my case. Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 05:00 GMarshal wrote:On April 10 2011 04:57 DoctorHelvetica wrote:On April 10 2011 03:15 GMarshal wrote:On April 10 2011 03:02 kitaman27 wrote:On April 10 2011 02:44 TranceStorm wrote:
Furthermore, since the pardoner/mayor knows who the bodyguards are, meaning that the mafia could hit those roles easier. This part gives the mafia more incentive to run as mayor than usual. The last thing they want is two town running around causing trouble, with no way to kill them. The fact that they are rewarded for running, but coming in second also gives them a nice bonus. The pardon ability is an awesome way to completely derail town focus when mafia is in a tough spot. I would feel real unwary having a pardoner around late game if I wasn't sure of his alignment. This means we should focus our attentions on people who run and on really analyzing the hell out of our mayor/pardoner. Also I think that the mayor's power is being understated, he has a triple vote, in the hands of scum that would be lethally dangerous, bringing lylo much, much closer than it should be. Personally I think we should only vote for players we think are probably town, because the idea of having one or both of those power roles in the hands of the mafia is pretty worrying. So yeah, let me state the obvious, make damn sure you are voting for pro town players, as these roles are pretty damn powerful. what happens if the mafia doesn't run Then its a win/win situation for us, mafia just gave up a shot at two really, really useful roles. I'm having a hard time envisioning a scenario where the scumteam dosn't run for mayorship. If for nothing else, if they get a guy up there he is DT proof for a while and they get the names of the BGs recall what I said about how town should approach WIFOM. Textbook.
Dr.h asked a stupid question, I awnsered, what did you want me to reply to him? "uh... magic?"
Running For Mayor I'm not going to be accusing anyone based on the fact that they ran for mayor. I did that before when I was scum. Easiest mislynch ever. But of course I will focus on how they did it! Let's rip this to pieces. Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 11:39 GMarshal wrote:I died, and I came back, now I'm changed, I live, but only destroy the enemies of the town ![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/bBSKV.jpg) tremble mafia for GM is here to destroy youNow, I know there are going to be plenty of other candidates running on platforms of cookies and puppies and flowers and even cats in tophats and monocles. Unfortunately I'm not going to offer you cookies or cats in tophats and monocles, only dead scum, swinging, swinging from a tree. Now why would you vote for GMarshal? Cute, if you ended your campaign there, I would have dropped my entire argument. Seriously, but you didn't. You need to TRY to be mayor, but you don't need to be mayor. Let's see why that matters. Once again I applaud you, correct I didn't need to be mayor, but why not? I'm confident I can do a better job than the people who ran, and frankly I'm not impressed with the results either way, this way at least I ensured I would deny the role to mafiaShow nested quote +1.) I am the most pro-town player, just look at my play, I do nothing but help town, scumhunt and make the town think. My death in insane was the crumbling point that lead to scum and stupid townies getting Tack lynched. You guys will have no issue seeing if I am town, as if I am I will be posting every five minutes or so, at the very least to berate inactives. If I'm not playing my townie style then by all means hang me. Hardly a fair argument GM, your only mafia play was in Death Factory, which is not right to include, no offense to Ace. And two minimafia games, if you want to do research, both of which I lurked through btw
Show nested quote +2.) Despite the fiasco of XXXVII, I am a decent scum hunter, I died in insane because I had 3/6 scum pegged day 1. I fully intend to analyze the scum team into the ground. I might not be Ver, but I'll do my damndest to kill scum. If you've watched me play at all you know I'll stand by my convictions, even if I am the only townie doing so. Not that I disagree, but you've stated your point from #1 on how you're always town, and when you are mafia, you sit there quiet and wait for town to lynch you. I don't see much difference here, because every townie should be doing this anyway, but you need to remind us of it. Very well, I am reminded of a townie's purpose. no, the point of this is to remind you that when I'm town I dont pull a Pandian and roleclaim for shits and giggles, or just lurk stupidly, I actualy try, much like I am doing now Show nested quote +3.) I know what I am going to do with my lynch, Im going to use it on the most inactive/lurking player around to make an example, the best part of this is that unlike regular inactive lynches this one is 100% guaranteed to be scum influence free . Because of what we concluded from points 1 and 2! Basic assumptions that are assumed. Oh dear that sentence was useless, hope no one notices that the previous sentence was useless like this useless sentence. 
Sorry, I like verbose sentences, but I've always liked verbose sentences feel free to read my other games for evidence. And honestly what do you want me to say about the fact that I'm going to lynch a lurker other than I know I'm going to choose it and that scum won't be influencing my decision? I fail to see how any of this makes me scum Show nested quote +4.) Inactives I am going to kill inactive with fiery vengeance, inactives are one of the number one reasons town loses, people who don't post because being a townie is “boring” and allow scum to hide in their midst. Not this game. Not on my watch. Leave this point out next time it overlaps with #3. Fair enoughShow nested quote +5.) Policy. I'm not going to tolerate any plans that rely on “trust me guys, I'm pro” or “my gut is why you should lynch Qatol!” and I'm going to lynch players who try to make arguments into mudslinging fests that allow scum to happily hide under the spam (See Insane mafia 2). So if you want to make an argument, do so with good points, analysis and in a respectful manner, or I will either ignore you, or make sure you get lynched. You've made your Policy policy apparent, you're just explaining what it is to have a policy. GMarshal is encouraging not flaming! Scum!Show nested quote +6.) Plans and town direction. The lack of PMs this game means that many plans that rely on circles and claims dont work. However that dosn't mean we can't think about the roles we have at our disposal. For example we have watchers, trackers and DT's thats three different information roles that from day 1 should be threatening scum. “Threatening scum” you ask “dont you mean catching scum?”. Well yes and no. Detectives should most certainly be checking players who are playing off their usual meta and players who they think are acting scummy, but not enough to be called out on, however be aware that with the presence of a godfather nothing is certain. Watchers need to watch whoever they think are going to be hit. Watchers should think of themselves as medics who catch scum, instead of protecting the person, so if you think someone is a target then watch them. Trackers should track who you think is likely scum, if they visit a someone and they die, you know you got something, if they visit and someone dosn't die then you probably have a blue or a mafia roleblocker. if you vote for me I can keep giving us this type of direction, including lists of who I think needs to be Dted, Vigied, Med protected, etc. Im going to do this regardless of whether I am elected or not, but if I'm dead my ability to post helpful lists is going to be greatly diminished This should have been your first post in the game. Make sure you do that next time GM, so you can beat everyone to that particular punchline, so it actually looks like you are town. Right, becuase me trying to give blues direction and give a point for discussion is *also* a clear sign of scum, however did I miss this. Hey, Dr.H the posts where you do this exact same thing must also make you scum! Seriously, you are right, the advice is kind of generic, but we were less than an hour into the game, I promised I would provide lists later, and I didShow nested quote +7.) I don’t lie, ever, I may perform gambits, but I don’t lie (with the exception of about my role, I do reserve the right to tell blatant untruths about that), and I endorse the LaL policy, in fact if I am mayor I’ll make sure we follow it as much as possible. Awful policy. Vets have already explained how wrong LaL is, and I should know considering I am going to host a game named after it. LaL is awesome, or at least viging liars, liars cannot be trusted, see the Pandian fake claim later on. Show nested quote +8.) I'm an easy read, you want me as mayor because frankly it doesn't matter if you can role check me or not, you can just look at my posts and say “town” or “scum”. Unlike other players who play a really good game as mafia, I am obviously scum when I am scum and obviously town when I am town. This means that the fact that I cannot be Dted as mayor is irrelevant It's so blatant, at least someone call GM out on repeating what not only everyone else has said, but what he has said. Maybe they have already? Guess I should finish the thread... sorry, you are right, I didn't realize 1 and 9 overlapped, next time I'll proofread betterShow nested quote +9.) I'm GMarshal, the towniest townie and I'm here from beyond the grave to kick the mafia teams ass for killing me in insane :/ leave out 1-8 and use this as your campaign next time. Ok, lets compare this to Kav the townie! Show nested quote +On April 10 2011 12:03 Kavdragon wrote:
I would also like to announce my campaign for mayor. I didn't write up anything fancy this game for my platform, nor will I copy-past it from a previous game.
I offer the experience that I have gained from previously being mayor.
I offer strong leadership, something that already demonstrated in XXXVI, but I have worked on and further improved on since then.
I offer my skills as an analyst. My analysis in XXXVI was key to the town's victory, and while I have not had the chance to demonstrate it since then, I have been talking with veteran players (Ver, BC, and Foolishness) constantly since then about how I can improve my play, and analysis.
I will be offering my ideas, opinions, and thoughts openly to make my alignment clear to the town.
I offer victory for the town.
Vote for Kav! Completely different approach from usual Kav. But what is hilarious is he has said everything GM stated and more. I almost can't stop myself on droning on about Kav being lynched. In fact, I couldn't. I DIDNT EVEN KNOW MY ALIGNMENT YET. God people. Gm is scum. Dr.H's play SO FAR has been completely unimpressive and damning for both GM and dr.H. I may have confused chaoser and Dr.H before, I need to go back and see what I read, because Chaoser was switching his In-thread vote (not the on in the vote thread) and it seemed too off-key for me, but Dr.H is so much more apparent.
my commentary in bold
I can't wait till you reach last night Bum, where I was drunk off my ass and raging at the town for trying to vote in an assassin (apologies to anyone who I might have offended by the way, theres a reason I don't usually post and drink)
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