Team Melee Mini Mafia - Page 35

Oh my, what do we have here

Actually I don't get the DT role that often. I don't really like the role that much because most people are terrible when they get it.

I think you guys are makign a mistake. Just because a team has two people doesn't mean they will generate more or less content, or that sharing a role means they will act a certain way. I think almost everyone is going to play standard because sharing a role doesn't imply a change in posting behavior.

I don't even mind seeing bandwagons this early since if YellowInk gets lynched and flips town the DT know exactly where to look.

However I do have a problem with bandwagons formed off of stupid logic. Looking at Bill's arguments against YI they are pretty terrible. Saying that since we are out of the RVS (blatantly false), him voting for bumatlarge makes no sense. Doesn't help that him and Chezinu are typing in morse code in the thread when there isn't anything to breadcrumb on Day 1 of this setup. To kick things off I'm voting for them. I want everyone's opinion on this: - Are we voting on the most useless people? Imo we should because inactivity should not be a problem. With the 2 worst players on the same team I view it as getting rid of distractions early.

How so. Please give us an actual logical breakdown of how you arrived at this conclusion. Every game you and your ally post nonsense and get away with it because everyone thinks you are useless, ignoring the fact you may be scum.

I've said that you were useless for like what, the past 8 months now? This isn't a new opinion at all.

That doesn't mean it's them telling on themselves that they are blue. Both of them aren't typical dumb players that ask questions leading to them being outted. Besides just because someone talks about a power role is not a good basis on putting them in the Mafia or Blue camp. Otherwise for all the games you've played you would have a better scum hunting rank don't you think?

Agreed. I also think the way it works is that Teams check Teams, not players checking players. So checking 1 person out a 3 person team isn't really a significant advantage or disadvantage.

L and BM: an OMGUS vote doesn't mean someone is scum. Newbie townies do it a lot.

well yes if someone is always known for revenge voting it may be a null tell but it also means they should probably be at the top of the suspect list. Also it depends on the nature of the vote: If you're doing it while building a case then it's fine. If you do it just because you have nothing else to do and crap reasoning then you come off looking squirmish and guilty.

Also there isn't that much information flowing around. A lot of it is people poking holes around to see what people say. Like L claiming my team or Radfield's team must be Mafia because his top target sucks: thats ridiculous logic. I'm not sure if it's obnoxious L being sincere or he's faking it but either way it's dumb.

No such thing. If X, then Y doesn't apply here unless we have process of elimination. There's also no such thing as a too risky play unless you have perfect information. You don't know their roles so you can't claim what they may possibly do is too risky. Both teams could be scum because no one has been cleared via DT or behavior at all.

So you accuse people of possibly being scum, they address your argument so therefore something must be fishy?

Explain this more.

Also you can't assume the host balanced teams. If that's the case then you and Caller would just as likely be Scum if we're going by experience and some level of skill here. It also hinges on the fact that YI/Durak have to flip red. If they don't then your entire argument falls to shambles and we've seen that happen before.

We do not know you are green. Everyone is going to claim green. That's irrelevant.

I addressed your argument. I said you suspecting the host of balancing teams is a fallacy, especially when the host claimed to use a RNG. If you still do then your entire argument hinges on the host lying right?

Your argument was that Yi/Durak are a weak team. If they are red, then the other mafia team must be a strong team. You then say it's up to my team or Radfield's team. I told you that IF you argument was sound then you'd also have to include yourself. The rest of the town has no idea about your alignment and saying "my PM says I'm green" doesn't make it any clearer. This is what I keep bringing up : the LOGIC in your arguments don't add up.

Also what does Radfield/Korynne being silent have to do with my stance on them? Them not responding to you doesn't make them scummy. Once again your saying I'm taking an odd defensive stance when all I've done is address why your logic doesn't add up. Seems more to me that you are trying to forcefully characterize my stance on your argument into a position which doesn't exist.

Your argument with YI? I viewed it as you (my strongest scum read so far) arguing with someone I don't have a read on. Only thing I could say about YI was he was trying to start discussion.

I can't believe you of all people are accusing someone of circular logic. I'm trying to illustrate to you that saying "I'm green" doesn't remove you from the pool of "strong teams" in your own argument. I know you'll claim green, no shit. I'm telling you it isn't convincing anyone that you aren't scum and repeating it doesn't help either.

no problem. I was planning on talking a lot anyway this game so you don't lead the town to depths of hell like you normally do.

In general, however, this has been a fantastic way to make you talk more than you would have otherwise, so thank you for taking part on that fishing expedition.

Hey I can't stop people from doing what they want. But if you want to argue about who's a better player we both know that won't last long ^_^

I'm scumhunting. I already said I don't believe BM/Chez to be townies. If that's not a blatant accusation along with my matching vote in the thread I don't know what game you're reading.

why do I even bother

I think the reason you two aren't getting a lot of flak is because a couple of players are setting off everyone's radar.

no its not. It's pretty bad theory and only pans in the most simple of newbie games. The "third" vote idea doesn't even make sense because BM doesn't understand what it meant. It had nothing to do with the 3rd player voting - it had everything to do with trying to catch where a scum would vote without drawing attention aka getting on the wagon but without being blamed for tipping it.

Being that scum will vote wherever they think will allow them to escape scrutiny that statement is nonsense.

Don't worry, I think L is just as scummy as you are.

calm down. Like I said I think L is just as scummy as you are. I just refuse to vote for Team 7 because I don't think them being inactive = them being scum. Your team and Ls team just come off as better candidates for a lynch so far.

Oh trust me I've considered it. While I pegged you as scummy, and chezinu as doing his brain dead act - L has been causing confusion, pointing tons of fingers while Caller has been pretty much lurking. I'm really close to switching my vote trust me.

I think you're the only one that read bum/lax as scummy. What did they do that was so bad anyway? They aren't inactive and they haven't really thrown around many FOSs.

Also hanging BM/Chez and them not flipping red gives you more information how? Be specific because everyone uses that line. Killing people for the sake of information is one of the scummiest arguments we've seen on this forum (looking at you L).

Radfield I don't know how you can go after team 9 when BM/Chez have played more scummy than they have. Yea they aren't posting a lot but the BM/Chez are posting garbage. Lack of effort doesn't mean someone is scummy. Playing like scum usually means the person really is scum.

@YI: No it doesn't. That logic does not hold up. Bm/Chez flipping red/green don't have any basis on bum/laxer flipping red/green. There is nothing to compare between the 2 teams.

I actually get clueless newbie vibes from Team 9. In fact they are like a clone of Team 7 just less aggressive when confronted so far. I think they really are just not going to post a lot until at he point of damn near inevitable lynch.

So no one else has a problem with blatant vote manipulation plans?

It's empty statements like that that make me keep my vote on you.

BM stop using terms you do not understand. Seriously, just stop.

Ok if anyone has any fucking sense about what RVS is, and the dumb "3rd voter on a wagon is scum" theory then read Bill Murray's latest posts. Forget bum/laxer - we've got some straight up ridiculous logic right in front of us.

I haven't even pushed a single policy lynch this game. Why are you making stuff up? Find an instance of me calling for a policy lynch. I dare you.

I haven't demanded anyone to play a certain way. Once again you are lying about my play this game. My vote on you stays.

this much vote switching = an innocent is getting killed. No way actual townies have any reason to switch around votes if their minds are already made up.

I don't see what the big deal is. She explicitly stated she was going to vote for Chez/BM so they couldn't save themselves - obviously at that point she made up her mind.

Secondly the wagon on T9 never really got going. If you subscribe to the idea that they must be scum because of the vote switch then you should ask yourself why didn't they vote for the other teams that were also in hot water. I think the only reason this is a big deal is because BM/Chez flipped town even though lots of people thought they were scum. I said it like 4 times but the only person even close to their scum level is L.

Also saying Chez had the chance to save himself is ludicrous. If he did then he should have voted/persuaded others ages before the deadline. I don't know what he was waiting for but it's just as ridiculous to blame someone for another person's death while said person has the chance to save themselves.

On June 25 2010 04:26 Ace wrote:


Yes they were. BM spent the entire time of Day 1 pointing multiple fingers at a ton of players. He also elected to talk in code with his partner who was being equally silly. Seriously if those don't scream scum to you it's no wonder why you have a reputation as a terrible player. Then again since you like to accuse multiple people every day I guess you would consider that decent play.



The wagon on T9 was never going to tip. Look at how it formed: We went through 3 teams being on the hot box to toward the end of the Day people voting on T9 because they were quiet - not because they were scum. It was a pressure vote. If you honestly think they were going to be killed then I have no idea what thread you are reading.



If telling everyone "I'm town because I said so" counts as arguing (it doesn't) then sure. They had no shot at convincing anyone they weren't scummy as you clearly see they got lynched.

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I thought they were scum. "No one really thought they were scum" is a weak premise. If it were true then obviously BM/Chez would still be alive. Do you really think all those people voted them off just because?

Then you even say teams 7,8,9,myself and Korynne all had a hand in the lynch. If thats the case then surely some of us really thought they were scum.

Also I had to bold the last part to show people how your poor logic works.

Team 2 flips innocent. So therefore the people Team 2 "targeted" (which was almost everyone) 7 and 9 somehow get thrown out of the equation and now it's Team 1, myself and 8 sticking out?

Do better. Seriously in your conspiracy theories you implicate multiple players without anything to stand on. You pop up after everything goes down to lay the blame on teams while also saying no one really thought they were scum - ignoring how badly BM/Chez played. Like I said you are just as scummy as they were.

Don't worry that's Ls terrible style of play. If someone that everyone but himself thinks is scummy and playing badly when they flip innocent L will come in turning a blind eye to why the players were lynched and start pointing fingers at everyone. Like I said there's a reason he has a reputation of being a bad player.

On June 25 2010 04:52 Ace wrote:
1.) I don't care if their standard play when they are town is to play like idiots. If you play badly and play scummy you get lynched - this is not a hard concept to understand.

2.) It wasn't going to tip. If it was going to tip then surely SOMEBODY would have voted to tip them right? You're trying to create a scenario that wasn't there. If you want to speak for Chez saying he could have saved himself then speak for him and explain to us why he didn't. You can't. Thanks.

3.)

What? This doesn't even make sense. Who are these people that voted for other reasons than believe that T2 were mafia. If you truly believe those people then I'm asking you again what game are you playing. You also forget a vast majority doesn't decide the vote here. So that point is null. Once again you are spouting nonsense to make it seem as if T2 deserved to live despite their scummy play.

4.) Korynne's vote wasn't random - she explained what she was going to do WELL in advance of the deadline. Stop falsifying people's actions. It's not worth looking at because it didn't change anything. T2 had more than enough time - hours - to convince people they weren't scum. They failed. Chez also had a chance to use his vote right? He failed. Don't blame someone else for their death when they had all time in the world to save themselves.

Emotional reaction? where are you pulling this shit from? I never even implied that you said teams 7 and 9 are innocent. I specifically said you threw them out of the equation and pointed at the rest of us. How does that even compute?

I said I had a pre-game grudge against them? Did I use that as the basis for my vote or did I say BM was throwing around terms he saw on mafiascum.net incorrectly to justify his vote, threw around several accusations wily nilly, spammed the thread, switched votes several times in the day and had no clear idea on who he thought was guilty? Or how about when I said BM and Chez were playing badly by talking nonsense. Oh how about when I called him out for his "theory" on the 3rd voter on a wagon being scum and showed how it was wrong?

See once again you are blatantly lying about what's going on in the game. Now you even try to play the "your bad" card that no one will believe. So far I've caught you making shit up, misrepresenting myself and other players' positions on day 1 and trying to stave off T2s bad play as everyone else's fault.

Yup, my scumdar is beeping again.

Bill your dead. Delete your posts and move on.

I don't want to call him scummy yet because right now L is definitely #1 in my book. DCLXVI is along the same veins of making up conspiracy theories and motives that don't support what actually happened. Really he could just be confused.

The problem here is players don't look at the game as a whole and just isolate events. So they don't understand why certain things have played out the way they did so far. The result? Said players end up jumping into specific points of the game ignoring everything and getting into arguments because they just don't want to understand what has happened so far.

I've illustrated my case on L the past few pages. If you need it to be more clear let me know.

I wasn't surprised at all. I think you are making a big mistake about my play here: I don't care what a player's supposed normal behavior is. If you play scummy and do ridiculous things I will vote for you. There is no excuse such as "I always play bad when I'm town" and thats how I made my decision.

Of course if L flips green/blue you can do whatever you please.

Not at all. Players that always play scummy usually always end up getting killed. Remember the goal of the game is to find scum: In the absence of overwhelming evidence against another team the scummiest players get lynched.

But don't think I ignored every other player in the game so far. Just because I don't say anything about other players doesn't mean I'm not paying attention. Better to solve 1 piece of the puzzle at a time.

On June 26 2010 09:01 Ace wrote:
I don't think it's fair to claim that my team being alive means were scum. There's a lot of WIFOM in that assumption and no one knows for sure why T1 was popped except scum. Instead of trying to attribute the possibility or us being scum to our survival maybe you should realize if we're that good there's a chance the people doing the hits were scared of medic prots.

Lastly bumatlarge I don't know where this came from:



Who are these people? So far the only person who has made more than a passing remark that we may be scum is L. No one else has so how did you even come to that conclusion?