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On October 22 2009 11:06 Tricode wrote:
Going by your definition, anyone who has been involved in this stupid argument with me and L, would fit your definition.
So thus i suggest we drop L's stupid idea and look at the tards who tried to bandwagon with it with out proof or reasoning.
Yeah, pretty much so, but that's excusable at this point of the game when there really isn't that much to work with. If I was to actually pick someone to lynch, I'd put inactives to RNG.
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On October 22 2009 11:07 Incognito wrote:
DT Medic Lists:
Some people are suggesting a single DT medic list. This way, the DTs could check the prime players while at the same time the Medics deterred hits on them. The DTs would also deter the hits somewhat because dead RCed people = more info for town, as I've said. However, the point of the original medic list was that the people on the list would be under heavy scrutiny and that DT checks on them would be wasteful in the long run (correct me if I'm wrong?).
Which leads us to the two separate lists idea. We could cover more people since the mafia would not want to hit either the medic list or the potentially RCed people list. For this list though, we would rotate the people on the list to cover more people. Perhaps beginning with a 2-3 person list and replacing one member with a new player every day. This way, the mafia don't know if the person who was removed from the list was checked the night before, giving us a growing list of dangerous players to hit. Obviously the mafia would eventually either have to hit the potentially RCed players or the DTs if they get lucky/can blue snipe. But I think that overall this increases our early game chances for both survival and organization, both of which are key.
Thoughts?
Mmm yes, it's a bad idea to combine the lists because the DTs want the people they checked to actually die. So seperate lists should be good. Still though, it'd protect the people they check although the DTs really would like to gain more information via the death of the person they checked. But it definitely is better than a single list.
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On October 22 2009 11:52 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 10:13 Shikyo wrote:On October 22 2009 09:38 SugiuraMidori wrote:
Shikyo isn't acting like his normally green self, he must be mafia.
Now I must eat dinner, I await your responses my dear Shikyo~ Nice logic, but if you read the game where I was mafia, I was avoiding attention a lot more. I'm gonna explain a concept here that needs to be addressed. Wine In Front of Me (hereon out referred to as "WIFOM"). It's a bad, garbage defense that you should not use, because it's really scummy. It's basically saying "I can't be mafia now, because if I was mafia, I would do the opposite." It's a terrible defense because it's real easy to say one thing and do another. Thus this defense has as many holes as swiss cheese.
Hey I've heard of that definition before, it was used against me before as well! I think I got linked to a mafiawiki or something. And know what? I still don't know what it means, and just for the record, when someone suspected me of that I was innocent. It's good if you always try to use that against me, that way I can actually utilize it while I'm mafia without being suspicious. About 53789th time in a row where people think I'm a mafia. I think the only game where I wasn't accused early was the one where I was mafia.
Make what you want out of that.
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On October 22 2009 12:04 Qatol wrote:
There is a bit of confusion so I'll say this here too (as reflected in the OP):
Mafia do not get to convert a player to be their godfather. They elect the godfather from among their own members.
Is it possible to know which people were confused about this so that I'm able to form a good list of potential day1 lynches for my RNG?
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Motbob? I guess I'll get into trouble if he ends up being town but who cares, always happens. Would be my first choice because he's been around everywhere but this thread.
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On October 22 2009 12:17 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 12:07 Shikyo wrote:On October 22 2009 12:04 Qatol wrote:
There is a bit of confusion so I'll say this here too (as reflected in the OP):
Mafia do not get to convert a player to be their godfather. They elect the godfather from among their own members. Is it possible to know which people were confused about this so that I'm able to form a good list of potential day1 lynches for my RNG? Yep here you go: LTT, Chuiu, Shikyo, Fakesteve
I wasn't, so that's incorrect. Others make no sense.
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On October 22 2009 12:20 Tricode wrote:
L, can we consider people who have very minimal post like 3 and under to be near inactive range?
Of course, you don't need L to answer that. Content is also important.
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I dont see it as trying to get a bandwagon going. I also am going to sleep.
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On October 22 2009 18:13 Ace wrote:
As for those of you thinking mafia usually just sit back and let shit happen - lol. That only works when the town is doing enough to kill themselves for you. Last time I was on the Mafia side I was actively planning out scenarios with Pyrr so we could stay a step ahead.
Don't kill active, contributing players. Even if you think Tricode is worthless right now with no clues to go on killing actives will hurt even more at this point.
Foolishness really is bad, and so is Shikyo based on that other game with JeeJee (lol). No one in their right mind would count the smurf game as credible to someone playing well since that entire game was a big cluster fuck of nonsense and half the people not even really trying.
And you really are bad based on the game where the town lynched their electees, right?
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On October 22 2009 23:27 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 19:44 Shikyo wrote:On October 22 2009 18:13 Ace wrote:
As for those of you thinking mafia usually just sit back and let shit happen - lol. That only works when the town is doing enough to kill themselves for you. Last time I was on the Mafia side I was actively planning out scenarios with Pyrr so we could stay a step ahead.
Don't kill active, contributing players. Even if you think Tricode is worthless right now with no clues to go on killing actives will hurt even more at this point.
Foolishness really is bad, and so is Shikyo based on that other game with JeeJee (lol). No one in their right mind would count the smurf game as credible to someone playing well since that entire game was a big cluster fuck of nonsense and half the people not even really trying. And you really are bad based on the game where the town lynched their electees, right? huh? whats that? pulling random games I don't even remember out of your ass to try and sound credible? It's ok, you're bad. You'll get better eventually when you stop doing things like reading posts by guys named Foolishness and especially anyone named Vivi57.
I sounded credible? Or tried... well I was just being sarcastic, basically it means that people have bad games, although you had quite a bit of unwelcome effect on the game even though you weren't playing.
Tricode: Two lynches of different colors are enough. One lynch gives it a 50/50.
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On October 23 2009 01:27 L wrote:
So, does anyone remember a game in which Scamp played the silent clueless newbie part and had a role other than mafia?
Umm actually no, only been mafia.
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Oh right, I don't think WC8 has posted anything other thant the wine drinking comment. I don't think he's voted either.
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On October 23 2009 02:23 redtooth wrote:
i don't know if doing incognito's plan for two nights is a good idea. mafia games don't last too long and wasting 2 nights so DT can just figure out his sanity is not an efficient use of time. if you look back at one of my previous posts, i outline the three scenarios DT faces after the first lynch. DT should then check suspicious people and base their judgment on their present scenario (they can either correctly identify a person or determine that a person is one of the two other colors). otherwise, we waste 2+ (remember the lynches HAVE to flip two different colors for the DT to perfectly identify their sanity) nights just to have DT find out their sanity but they do not get any information because all the people they checked are now dead. DTs aren't invincible and have a high chance of dying before they can be of any use at all.
We could, after this first DT lynch thing, figure out the possible mafia early and decide to lynch them the next day so that the DTs have the time to check him. But I don't know how significant the one day delay is going to be. And as soon as we've lynched people with two different colors, we'd obviously stop this and start lynching normally instead of delaying. I think I explained it pretty badly but I think it'd help.
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Basically my suggestion would be that if we're able to figure out early who we want to lynch, for example if we find an almost certain mafia, it might be worth it delaying the lynch for a day so that DTs can check them. This naturally works the best when there are still 4 mafia left, since lynching them sooner wouldn't help with KP. I think that this would be the best thing we could do assuming we miss both of our first lynches, since that would basically guarantee the DTs to check 2 people who are lynched and hence find out their sanity. The problem with this is is we lynch two of the same color. It's always a risk, so are we willing to take it? I think it should be worth it.
Another possibilities are 1. guessing with the 50% chance and hoping you get it right 2. DT-checking some people and seeing which of the 2 roles would make more sense for them and you can always narrow it down to at least the 1/2 chance, and you will be able to guarantee 1/3 of the roles(not including GF).
Wonder if there's something I missed while thinking about this, since there always seems to be something I fail to take into consideration.
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On October 23 2009 03:42 Amber[LighT] wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 01:49 Shikyo wrote:
Oh right, I don't think WC8 has posted anything other thant the wine drinking comment. I don't think he's voted either. Where's this wine you speak of and why do I not have a glass or box of?
You haven't used the wine-in-front-of-me defense enough, it seems. Find out everything about it on mafiawiki.
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On October 23 2009 03:46 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Yeah L, I noticed most of the time I come up with ideas in the shower. I had this one just a little while ago. I am surprised I didn't think of it earlier, this plan is also more or less godfather proof.
So today we go ahead and mayoral kill Motbob hes an inactive and we need to do something with our lynch, it might as well be that.
The next step is for the Day 2 lynch we kill Tricode. As of now I think Tricode is either a Red or a Green. Either way this works out (However if hes a blue, hes a moron and this doesn't work so well) But I think that is a relatively low chance.
Now the DT's have checked Tricode and have gotten a result lets pretend he is Green for all intensive purposes.
Now we have the Vet's role call, I think in this game there is probably 1-2 Vet's, I can't see anymore than that. Since the mafia KP is only two, it wouldn't be worthwhile to try to kill one, especially with medics around. Lets say we get 2 Veteran's who role call and we have 2 DT's now, the next check that the DT's get they use on these role called Veteran's, with that we now know that the DT's have checked 1 Green/red in Tricode and now a Blue in the RC'd Veteran. They now have their sanity determined theoretically if it all goes well.
The Veteran's will ANNOUNCE when the DT has role called to them (since they should be more or less confirmed now) with this if a DT dies we know who to look at, so if the mafia tries pulling some fast shit they lose a member which they can't afford to do. If a DT role calls to the "Vet" and he doesn't go public before night, you tell us what you did. Chances are he is a mafia if he didn't announce that he had you role claimed.
From there we now have the Vet's and the DT's working together with sanity secured hopefully, and very little that the mafia can actually do about it except killing the DT's before any of this even happens. In the case that there is only a single Veteran the medics can be used to scare off/save that Vet. If only 1 Veteran role calls we can be almost 100% sure they are legit.
With that we can coordinate well and identify who is NOT mafia and then narrow down suspect lists.
Some stuff that seems problematic to me:
1. We don't know the amount of veterans, so we can't even know if there's a mafia amongst them. I think that if 3 vets claim, it's highly likely, though. But with 2 vets claiming, one of them can very well be mafia. It's true that if only one vet calls he's most likely legit, but I just don't see why a mafia member wouldn't claim vet in a situation like this. Maybe he's afraid of a third person calling vet after him? Still, we can't guarantee that the vet is actually a vet.
2. If the DTs check tricode and he's green, when they check the vet he'll show up as a mafia or a blue, but the DT can't know which. He might contact a mafia and he has no way at all of knowing wether the vet is actually vet or a mafia. Also, they won't get hit by mafia in either case, so we can't even use the fact that they weren't hit as a reason for suspicion.
Also, I don't understand why the mafia wouldn't announce that a DT claimed to them, they already put themselves into the open as vets to begin with. That'd be really stupid. But maybe the mafia actually is that stupid, who knows.
Of course, if Tricode or whoever else we lynch turns out to be mafia instead, this all would work out perfectly and to me seems like the best way to go about things.
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Oh right, and GF can fake to be vet. I always forget this, but that would totally ruin this plan, indeed.
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I'm sorry to hear about that, motbob. May he rest in peace. It still doesn't quite explain why you actively posted from around 13.00 to 18.00 KST but didn't respond to this thread, though.
Now let's talk about the medics a little bit, shall we? So, they're extremely powerful in this kind of a game, being able to completely prevent a person from dying after the amount of mafia is reduced to 2. After this point, 2 medics are able to keep each other alive until the end of the time and roleclaim with no worries and become an autowin. That's why I believe that there is only one medic in the game. Could be two, but that would be really, really overpowered in my opinion.
Also, the medic shouldn't role claim since they'd be immediately killed by mafia. This means that they'd have to kind of act from the shadows for most of the time. I also think that our medic list or whatever we're planning on doing should be relatively short, since with 8 names and 1 medic, the mafia will most likely just completely ignore the list.
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On October 23 2009 04:02 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 03:51 L wrote:
Issue: we don't know how many vets we have, and there's a godfather than can make his role 'vet'. If two vet's claim we kill them both and trade off for GF. Who cares? 2 actual Vet's would be broken with 2 KP.
5 townies, one of which is a vet, for one mafia? Assuming we carry out the first 2 day plans and miss with both, that means one mafia on the fourth day, which means that we pretty much lose. GF doesn't matter at that point. Although that might be worth considering if we manage to lynch a mafia on the first two days.
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EPT
