EPTProbably not as strong as any other start, but just thinking of it.
[Champion] Nunu - Page 7
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
Probably not as strong as any other start, but just thinking of it. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On July 11 2012 04:45 Requizen wrote: I'm probably reaching here, but with the changes to Nunu, do you think there's such thing as a DRing jungle start for him? Maybe if you're playing a more aggressive style and constantly poking in with Snowball? The health is nothing to scoff at either, imo. Probably not as strong as any other start, but just thinking of it. What exactly are you trying to ask. Is it possible? Sure. You could start literally almost anything on jungle Nunu and it would be playable. Is it good? Probably not. What possible advantages could it have over any other start? | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On July 11 2012 04:53 TheYango wrote: What exactly are you trying to ask. Is it possible? Sure. You could start literally almost anything on jungle Nunu and it would be playable. Is it good? Probably not. What possible advantages could it have over any other start? Don't know, I'm just bored and spitballing. Stronger snowballs are nice for two reasons: since they are your only other damaging move aside from consume so it helps your clear, and it can let you semi-chunk a squishy lane when running in to gank. Plus, high health start which is nice against mixed damage teams. The Mp5 is kind of meh, since while farming you can abuse your passive to never run oom, but I guess it can help in ganks/skirmishes/teamfights where you're spamming W and E and use R. It's probably not that good, but I'm just in a Nunu kind of mood. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
As far as ganks, there's simply no start that can outweigh 50 extra base MS for ganking power. | ||
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bmn
886 Posts
I tend to do a lot better as jungler going for tank(-ish) than as Ap-heavy top though. It feels like building AP is really good for many lanes, but I just can't seem to make it work well after the laning phase. Is this normal or am I doing it wrong? Compared to just about any other typical AP champ, the damage output from Nunu against multiple target seems very lackluster, simply because Q and W don't scale with AP, and E is single-target with significant cooldown. I rarely get any good ults off in team fights (though it's all the more satisfying when it does happen). e.g. I feel much stronger in team fights as Rumble or even Kennen, as far as sheer damage output is concerned. Going for tank-ish builds seems much easier; the slow from E and buffs from W do not depend on AP, and being alive longer is useful because you can keep W and E up constantly. Also, the AP heal from consume isn't as useful in team fights because I can't always rely on having nearby minions to consume (in contrast to the laning phase). I do want to play Nunu more; what are the typical builds that work for people? For jungling, aspd runes seem great, and philo/hog make sense as they build into shurelyas/randuin's, both good items on Nunu (I think?). Beyond that, is RoA too late/expensive? I saw someone mention wit's end and wriggles, are those commonly built on Nunu? I can see wit's appeal more so than that of Wriggles; I typically have full health clears well into mid-game even with just boots. Wit's sounds good for the aspd (with Nunu's passive) and mres; lifesteal on wriggles doesn't sound as useful unless you build more AD. I've still been running lifesteal quints, but that's because I was too lazy to change my Jax runepage. Move speed sounds like the best choice for jungling Nunu. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On July 11 2012 05:08 TheYango wrote: With regard to the very small damage that you gain from AP on snowballs, they only help your clear speed insofar as they reduce the number of autoattacks it takes to kill a jungle minion. If such a breakpoint was attainable by the 15 AP from a DRing, then people would have figured it out by now and used runes to get that 15 AP. As far as ganks, there's simply no start that can outweigh 50 extra base MS for ganking power. True, true, probably just one of those things that sounds better in my head than actually in practice. | ||
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brolaf
291 Posts
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
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bmn
886 Posts
But is SV + revolver/WotA really worth it on AP Nunu? You have a 1.0 ap ratio on Q's heal anyway, and E also scales with a 1.0 ratio. Is there any specific situation when you decide to go for spellvamp over pure ap items? Unless you're having massive trouble sustaining yourself in lane, I'd have thought that building more AP helps you more than additional sustain from SV/Visage. And while CDR is nice, can you actually make use of it in lane? Even with the passive I usually have to watch my skill usage to avoid running out of mana. | ||
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armed_
Canada443 Posts
On July 11 2012 09:22 bmn wrote: But is SV + revolver/WotA really worth it on AP Nunu? You have a 1.0 ap ratio on Q's heal anyway, and E also scales with a 1.0 ratio. Is there any specific situation when you decide to go for spellvamp over pure ap items? Buying revolver means you're spending 340g on spellvamp. This is 15 AP worth of gold - on a level 1 consume(which is presumably all you'll have in lane), 12% spell vamp is 4x as much healing as the AP would give you. That's super good value unless you're in some matchup where you don't need more than your baseline sustain. Spirit visage I don't necessarily agree with as an early item - % healing and CDR are both multiplicative bonuses that are good on Nunu but better in midgame once you have high level snowball + other sources of AP and spell vamp. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
I'd post a video but Sony Vegas is constantly crashing on startup.  | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
Furthermore, I saw a jungle nunu running onhiit (went something like vamp scep -> malady -> Madreds). I'm pretty sure the build is god awful, or at least ill conceived, but I haven't tried it out myself, so I thought I'd throw these couple ideas out there for improvement / critique. Triforce just seems really alluring on top lane nunu, sheen proc from snowball or bloodboil, snowballing them means u def get to proc the sheen, and maybe phage as well, which is just gravy on top of your snowball. Undoubtedly it would have some problems come later game, and 'get triforce' isn't much of a build, so I'm not sure what else to put with it, tanky cdr i spose? | ||
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icemanzdoinwork
447 Posts
On July 12 2012 15:39 Seuss wrote: btw with a hard leash Nunu can hit level 3 with pretty much any Small Camp -> Buff -> Buff combo and be in a lane ganking by 2:55 game time. I'd post a video but Sony Vegas is constantly crashing on startup. This is what I've been doing and usually picking him vs mumu/malph/naut. Wolves>blue>their red gank top or mid. If you're going too steal save smite and get a very good leash. If you don't get a good leash you might get caught. I know the window isn't very large like a few seconds, so the hard leash is vital. 0-21-9 full ms in both. Arp/as mixture. I haven't been going Cdr blues but will try it. | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
On July 11 2012 05:29 bmn wrote: So I've started playing nunu, just blind pick normals in jungle or top for now, and it's kinda fun. I tend to do a lot better as jungler going for tank(-ish) than as Ap-heavy top though. It feels like building AP is really good for many lanes, but I just can't seem to make it work well after the laning phase. Is this normal or am I doing it wrong? Compared to just about any other typical AP champ, the damage output from Nunu against multiple target seems very lackluster, simply because Q and W don't scale with AP, and E is single-target with significant cooldown. I rarely get any good ults off in team fights (though it's all the more satisfying when it does happen). e.g. I feel much stronger in team fights as Rumble or even Kennen, as far as sheer damage output is concerned. Going for tank-ish builds seems much easier; the slow from E and buffs from W do not depend on AP, and being alive longer is useful because you can keep W and E up constantly. Also, the AP heal from consume isn't as useful in team fights because I can't always rely on having nearby minions to consume (in contrast to the laning phase). I do want to play Nunu more; what are the typical builds that work for people? For jungling, aspd runes seem great, and philo/hog make sense as they build into shurelyas/randuin's, both good items on Nunu (I think?). Beyond that, is RoA too late/expensive? I saw someone mention wit's end and wriggles, are those commonly built on Nunu? I can see wit's appeal more so than that of Wriggles; I typically have full health clears well into mid-game even with just boots. Wit's sounds good for the aspd (with Nunu's passive) and mres; lifesteal on wriggles doesn't sound as useful unless you build more AD. I've still been running lifesteal quints, but that's because I was too lazy to change my Jax runepage. Move speed sounds like the best choice for jungling Nunu. building AP Nunu is a bad idea. Tanky nunu does more damage and gives more utility, simply because he lives long enough. Suggested build: Philo(shurelya), heart of gold(randiuns), mercuries, frozen heart, aegis. End game/situational: force of nature, atmogs, sunfire cape, thornmail, banshee's veil. Game plan: stick to your carry/bruiser, give as much support as you can. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
On July 12 2012 15:53 Sufficiency wrote: For CDR I think Shroud is better. Maybe it's just me. The extra armor obviously helps, too. HURR YOU MEANT GLACIAL SHROUD I'M A GENIUS Yes glacial is a great item. While AP Nunu is bad, picking up a few AP items, particularly supportish ones, is not a bad idea. If you don't already hit the CDR cap, you should strongly consider picking up a DFG or Morellos; Nunu's also one of the best candidates for an Abyssal Scepter or a WotA. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On July 14 2012 06:16 Tooplark wrote: HURR YOU MEANT GLACIAL SHROUD I'M A GENIUS Yes glacial is a great item. While AP Nunu is bad, picking up a few AP items, particularly supportish ones, is not a bad idea. If you don't already hit the CDR cap, you should strongly consider picking up a DFG or Morellos; Nunu's also one of the best candidates for an Abyssal Scepter or a WotA. If you're looking at DFG, is Kage's a viable pick for support Nunu? Especially with the Philo/HoG nerfs coming. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
On July 14 2012 06:21 Requizen wrote: If you're looking at DFG, is Kage's a viable pick for support Nunu? Especially with the Philo/HoG nerfs coming. I dunno, since support is for chumps, but if you're winning your SOLO TOP LANE, then yes, Kage's is a great way to make up for the fact that you're zoning the other guy so hard that you're at his nexus tower and he's stuck in base. You can safely get it against anyone that you're really far ahead of, but if you think there's a chance the lane could turn around, then go for SV/Cata/Glacial -> WotA. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On July 14 2012 06:16 Tooplark wrote: HURR YOU MEANT GLACIAL SHROUD I'M A GENIUS Yes glacial is a great item. While AP Nunu is bad, picking up a few AP items, particularly supportish ones, is not a bad idea. If you don't already hit the CDR cap, you should strongly consider picking up a DFG or Morellos; Nunu's also one of the best candidates for an Abyssal Scepter or a WotA. I been playing the shit out of top nunu and I'm just gonna go ahead and say that Unholy Grail and WotA are beast on Nunu. Slap on a glacial shroud and the enemy team better keep vision of baron at all times or you can solo that shit no problem. | ||
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