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On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution.
Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs.
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On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs.
All of these macro mechanics were a reason for comebacks. A fast 3CC could replenish, lots of larva mean lots of drones, and chroonoboost could alleviate tech disadvantages and probe losses.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
well, not buying LotV
nice job
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On August 15 2015 23:41 Temeter wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs. All of these macro mechanics were a reason for comebacks. A fast 3CC could replenish, lots of larva mean lots of drones, and chroonoboost could alleviate tech disadvantages and probe losses.
These mechanics were responsible for high advantage vs. disadvantage scaling mostly. Look at 2 hatch vs. 3 hatch ZvZ. Compare at 2 oc vs. 3 oc TvT.
The same applies to mixed matchups: compare 3 OC T vs. 4 hatch Z with 2 OC vs. 4 hatch zerg and with 3 OC vs. 3 hatch zerg. Losing a base or having an additional hatch/oc out only a bit late can auto lose you the game or force you unwillingly on all-in-mode due to the high scaling.
Exactly this is what narrows down sc2's strategical and tactical diversity.
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On August 15 2015 23:50 LSN wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:41 Temeter wrote:On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs. All of these macro mechanics were a reason for comebacks. A fast 3CC could replenish, lots of larva mean lots of drones, and chroonoboost could alleviate tech disadvantages and probe losses. These mechanics were responsible for high advantage vs. disadvantage scaling mostly. Look at 2 hatch vs. 3 hatch ZvZ. Compare at 2 oc vs. 3 oc TvT. The same applies to mixed matchups: compare 3 OC T vs. 4 hatch Z with 2 OC vs. 4 hatch zerg and with 3 OC vs. 3 hatch zerg. Losing a base or having an additional hatch/oc out only a bit late can auto lose you the game or force you unwillingly on all-in-mode due to the high scaling. Exactly this is what narrows down sc2's strategic and tactical diversity.
What narrows down ZvZs diversity are mostly roaches, which are incredibly efficient earlygame and snowball everything.
TvT always had lots of uncertainities and comebacks, lots of potential for positional play and economical damage.
Removing macro will never add to the games diversity. Suddenly the game gets easier, suddenly the game gets less punishing, suddenly comebacks are more possible, suddenly there is more complexity.
That's a pipe dream.
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SoCal8908 Posts
On August 15 2015 23:15 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 22:54 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 22:10 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 19:39 Thinh123456 wrote:
this autoinject will make zerg in lotv can't be able to remax as fast as in hots. Zerg army supply is always smaller than terran and protoss due to higher worker count. They must depend on high larva count to rebuild his army fast and send immidiately to the battlefied to overwhelm the enemy. Especially in Lotv, with Lurker-3 supply unit in the combination, zerg army is even smaller. Unless there are some ways to buff the efficiency of zerg army, or at least increasing the max supply cap of the zerg, then i don't think people will consider to play zerg. The zerg is getting far away from its identity of being a swarmy race!!! Fuck that! They could reduce the supply of all zerg units by 1 across the board with few exceptions. That would make a zerg 200/200 supply army way better than it needs to be. I honestly think that with macro hatches zerg will be ok, but if they're not, it's more likely gonna be a buff to the speed at which larva spawn. The problem is, zerg still has alot of supply in drones and queens... now they will have even less supply to work with. ( more queens on macro hatches ) Did i mention we still dont have a 1 supply unit ? I do agree they might buff the larva spawn but Zergs needs a 1 supply unit and/or reduced supply on other units. Zerg is the swarm for god sake and everytime it has less units then a terran.... its such bad design and a really bad joke.
terran and protoss have just as much supply in probes and scvs, though. yes, you want to be ahead, but with more workers, comes more production, comes more units. you don't necessarily need queens on your macro hatches either. an extra hatch per expansion is what will likely become the norm to make up for the missing larva. minerals are easy for a zerg to come by too, so im not too upset.
On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
There is no way ever that Blizzard would have created a queen with autocast injects from the start. The only reason it exists is that the game is designed around injects and now they want to remove it, but they can't because it is too important, and they don't know what to replace it with. Try explaining the rational of the suggested queen to someone that never played sc2, how would it add something to the game?
I mean... what if we suggest a unit for protoss that has a spell that casts chronoboost on a warpgate for 10 seconds. costs 50 minerals. 10 second cooldown on the spell. Oh, and it's autocast. Sounds like a great unit? My point is: there is NO WAY the suggested queen would have made it through if suggested as a new unit as it is now. The other devs would have looked at the person suggesting it in a strange way and stop inviting him to after-work beers.
I'm a bit upset at this change... I am personally pretty emotionally against removing manual inject to start with, and then they choose to not even remove it, but rather add more mechanics that cancels it out? Well, cudos for testing, but this is a plain lazy solution.
dude we get 2 less larva than we did before..this is actually a nerf. it makes zerg production choices super important and building that extra round of drones instead of units is even more punishing. i understand that the autocast thing is a little lame, but realistically with all of hte micro options for the other races, injecting perfectly is almost impossible. even the koreans thought it was hard.
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On August 15 2015 23:56 Temeter wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:50 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:41 Temeter wrote:On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs. All of these macro mechanics were a reason for comebacks. A fast 3CC could replenish, lots of larva mean lots of drones, and chroonoboost could alleviate tech disadvantages and probe losses. These mechanics were responsible for high advantage vs. disadvantage scaling mostly. Look at 2 hatch vs. 3 hatch ZvZ. Compare at 2 oc vs. 3 oc TvT. The same applies to mixed matchups: compare 3 OC T vs. 4 hatch Z with 2 OC vs. 4 hatch zerg and with 3 OC vs. 3 hatch zerg. Losing a base or having an additional hatch/oc out only a bit late can auto lose you the game or force you unwillingly on all-in-mode due to the high scaling. Exactly this is what narrows down sc2's strategic and tactical diversity. What narrows down ZvZs diversity are mostly roaches, which are incredibly efficient earlygame and snowball everything. TvT always had lots of uncertainities and comebacks, lots of potential for positional play and economical damage. Removing macro will never add to the games diversity. Suddenly the game gets easier, suddenly the game gets less punishing, suddenly comebacks are more possible, suddenly there is more complexity. That's a pipe dream.
Sure it will. And you will be one of the guys that hasn't seen it coming but will have to admit it later on when it becomes obvious for everyone.
And you know what becomes obvious about your post? You just dislike that zergs will have an easier life with auto injects. You don't even understand the global context and impact of these changes nor want to know them. I am sorry to say.
Less 3vs2 base (etc.) scaling is exactly what Sc2 needs.
Some other effects:
- Less larvas per inject is what I suggested already like 1-2 years ago in balance discussion (and ppl told me its design). Goes without saying that it was just too much with 4 per inject. It was the only thing that matters and forgetting it in important situations or losing 1-2 major queens at times ends the game.
- The ability of terran to lose almost all its economy but have about 15 free scv replacements from 3 OC had to go, it made every committment on attacking the terran early on without killing him a complete waste and therefore narrowed down the strategical diversity to pure all-in or pure defensive macro against terran (compare introduction of oracles: that was nothing else than giving protoss an effective ability to harrass terran at all early on). Now there will be more shades of grey and committing on different levels of pressure on terran can pay off without the drawback of mules making your efforts invisible. The game will become more skill heavy due to this for everyone included.
- Replacing lategame economy almost completely with supplyless mules is one of the dumbest things Sc2 has seen, it had to go. Rather make terran stronger overall (e.g. scv back to 55-60hp).
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Ppl still talk about numbers at this stage... Why is that. Must be psychological pressure that they feel when "their" race has been touched. No one wants a balance talk right now...
I don't like that it's only 1 month of design changes. I am really disappointed. I guess the management floor wants the game to be released asap. There goes the quality : (
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On August 15 2015 23:58 BluemoonSC wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:15 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 22:54 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 22:10 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 19:39 Thinh123456 wrote:
this autoinject will make zerg in lotv can't be able to remax as fast as in hots. Zerg army supply is always smaller than terran and protoss due to higher worker count. They must depend on high larva count to rebuild his army fast and send immidiately to the battlefied to overwhelm the enemy. Especially in Lotv, with Lurker-3 supply unit in the combination, zerg army is even smaller. Unless there are some ways to buff the efficiency of zerg army, or at least increasing the max supply cap of the zerg, then i don't think people will consider to play zerg. The zerg is getting far away from its identity of being a swarmy race!!! Fuck that! They could reduce the supply of all zerg units by 1 across the board with few exceptions. That would make a zerg 200/200 supply army way better than it needs to be. I honestly think that with macro hatches zerg will be ok, but if they're not, it's more likely gonna be a buff to the speed at which larva spawn. The problem is, zerg still has alot of supply in drones and queens... now they will have even less supply to work with. ( more queens on macro hatches ) Did i mention we still dont have a 1 supply unit ? I do agree they might buff the larva spawn but Zergs needs a 1 supply unit and/or reduced supply on other units. Zerg is the swarm for god sake and everytime it has less units then a terran.... its such bad design and a really bad joke. terran and protoss have just as much supply in probes and scvs, though. yes, you want to be ahead, but with more workers, comes more production, comes more units. you don't necessarily need queens on your macro hatches either. an extra hatch per expansion is what will likely become the norm to make up for the missing larva. minerals are easy for a zerg to come by too, so im not too upset. Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
There is no way ever that Blizzard would have created a queen with autocast injects from the start. The only reason it exists is that the game is designed around injects and now they want to remove it, but they can't because it is too important, and they don't know what to replace it with. Try explaining the rational of the suggested queen to someone that never played sc2, how would it add something to the game?
I mean... what if we suggest a unit for protoss that has a spell that casts chronoboost on a warpgate for 10 seconds. costs 50 minerals. 10 second cooldown on the spell. Oh, and it's autocast. Sounds like a great unit? My point is: there is NO WAY the suggested queen would have made it through if suggested as a new unit as it is now. The other devs would have looked at the person suggesting it in a strange way and stop inviting him to after-work beers.
I'm a bit upset at this change... I am personally pretty emotionally against removing manual inject to start with, and then they choose to not even remove it, but rather add more mechanics that cancels it out? Well, cudos for testing, but this is a plain lazy solution. dude we get 2 less larva than we did before..this is actually a nerf. it makes zerg production choices super important and building that extra round of drones instead of units is even more punishing. i understand that the autocast thing is a little lame, but realistically with all of hte micro options for the other races, injecting perfectly is almost impossible. even the koreans thought it was hard.
I think you missed the point, you will need 8 hatches and 6 queens to balance out the current 5 hatches with 3-4 queens injecting.
You will lose supply, early timings will be impossible... not to mention holding a hellbat push that comes just a bit latter.
Zerg will need some buffs to early and mid game while Terran will need late game buffs.
Protoss doesnt change much... they can revert some research timings and their good to go.
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SoCal8908 Posts
On August 16 2015 00:11 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:58 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 23:15 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 22:54 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 22:10 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 19:39 Thinh123456 wrote:
this autoinject will make zerg in lotv can't be able to remax as fast as in hots. Zerg army supply is always smaller than terran and protoss due to higher worker count. They must depend on high larva count to rebuild his army fast and send immidiately to the battlefied to overwhelm the enemy. Especially in Lotv, with Lurker-3 supply unit in the combination, zerg army is even smaller. Unless there are some ways to buff the efficiency of zerg army, or at least increasing the max supply cap of the zerg, then i don't think people will consider to play zerg. The zerg is getting far away from its identity of being a swarmy race!!! Fuck that! They could reduce the supply of all zerg units by 1 across the board with few exceptions. That would make a zerg 200/200 supply army way better than it needs to be. I honestly think that with macro hatches zerg will be ok, but if they're not, it's more likely gonna be a buff to the speed at which larva spawn. The problem is, zerg still has alot of supply in drones and queens... now they will have even less supply to work with. ( more queens on macro hatches ) Did i mention we still dont have a 1 supply unit ? I do agree they might buff the larva spawn but Zergs needs a 1 supply unit and/or reduced supply on other units. Zerg is the swarm for god sake and everytime it has less units then a terran.... its such bad design and a really bad joke. terran and protoss have just as much supply in probes and scvs, though. yes, you want to be ahead, but with more workers, comes more production, comes more units. you don't necessarily need queens on your macro hatches either. an extra hatch per expansion is what will likely become the norm to make up for the missing larva. minerals are easy for a zerg to come by too, so im not too upset. On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
There is no way ever that Blizzard would have created a queen with autocast injects from the start. The only reason it exists is that the game is designed around injects and now they want to remove it, but they can't because it is too important, and they don't know what to replace it with. Try explaining the rational of the suggested queen to someone that never played sc2, how would it add something to the game?
I mean... what if we suggest a unit for protoss that has a spell that casts chronoboost on a warpgate for 10 seconds. costs 50 minerals. 10 second cooldown on the spell. Oh, and it's autocast. Sounds like a great unit? My point is: there is NO WAY the suggested queen would have made it through if suggested as a new unit as it is now. The other devs would have looked at the person suggesting it in a strange way and stop inviting him to after-work beers.
I'm a bit upset at this change... I am personally pretty emotionally against removing manual inject to start with, and then they choose to not even remove it, but rather add more mechanics that cancels it out? Well, cudos for testing, but this is a plain lazy solution. dude we get 2 less larva than we did before..this is actually a nerf. it makes zerg production choices super important and building that extra round of drones instead of units is even more punishing. i understand that the autocast thing is a little lame, but realistically with all of hte micro options for the other races, injecting perfectly is almost impossible. even the koreans thought it was hard. I think you missed the point, you will need 8 hatches and 6 queens to balance out the current 5 hatches with 3-4 queens injecting. You will lose supply, early timings will be impossible. Zerg will need some buffs to early and mid game while Terran will need late game buffs. Protoss doesnt change much... they can revert some research timings and their good to go.
if you're on 3 bases, you lose 6 larva with this nerf. you only need 2 macro hatcheries to account for the missing larva and for most players, they won't be floating too much because they will obviously be injecting on time and your saturation will come much slower. im interested to see what happens when zergs take a 4th and go into the late-late game though.
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On August 16 2015 00:14 BluemoonSC wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2015 00:11 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 23:58 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 23:15 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 22:54 BluemoonSC wrote:On August 15 2015 22:10 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:On August 15 2015 19:39 Thinh123456 wrote:
this autoinject will make zerg in lotv can't be able to remax as fast as in hots. Zerg army supply is always smaller than terran and protoss due to higher worker count. They must depend on high larva count to rebuild his army fast and send immidiately to the battlefied to overwhelm the enemy. Especially in Lotv, with Lurker-3 supply unit in the combination, zerg army is even smaller. Unless there are some ways to buff the efficiency of zerg army, or at least increasing the max supply cap of the zerg, then i don't think people will consider to play zerg. The zerg is getting far away from its identity of being a swarmy race!!! Fuck that! They could reduce the supply of all zerg units by 1 across the board with few exceptions. That would make a zerg 200/200 supply army way better than it needs to be. I honestly think that with macro hatches zerg will be ok, but if they're not, it's more likely gonna be a buff to the speed at which larva spawn. The problem is, zerg still has alot of supply in drones and queens... now they will have even less supply to work with. ( more queens on macro hatches ) Did i mention we still dont have a 1 supply unit ? I do agree they might buff the larva spawn but Zergs needs a 1 supply unit and/or reduced supply on other units. Zerg is the swarm for god sake and everytime it has less units then a terran.... its such bad design and a really bad joke. terran and protoss have just as much supply in probes and scvs, though. yes, you want to be ahead, but with more workers, comes more production, comes more units. you don't necessarily need queens on your macro hatches either. an extra hatch per expansion is what will likely become the norm to make up for the missing larva. minerals are easy for a zerg to come by too, so im not too upset. On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
There is no way ever that Blizzard would have created a queen with autocast injects from the start. The only reason it exists is that the game is designed around injects and now they want to remove it, but they can't because it is too important, and they don't know what to replace it with. Try explaining the rational of the suggested queen to someone that never played sc2, how would it add something to the game?
I mean... what if we suggest a unit for protoss that has a spell that casts chronoboost on a warpgate for 10 seconds. costs 50 minerals. 10 second cooldown on the spell. Oh, and it's autocast. Sounds like a great unit? My point is: there is NO WAY the suggested queen would have made it through if suggested as a new unit as it is now. The other devs would have looked at the person suggesting it in a strange way and stop inviting him to after-work beers.
I'm a bit upset at this change... I am personally pretty emotionally against removing manual inject to start with, and then they choose to not even remove it, but rather add more mechanics that cancels it out? Well, cudos for testing, but this is a plain lazy solution. dude we get 2 less larva than we did before..this is actually a nerf. it makes zerg production choices super important and building that extra round of drones instead of units is even more punishing. i understand that the autocast thing is a little lame, but realistically with all of hte micro options for the other races, injecting perfectly is almost impossible. even the koreans thought it was hard. I think you missed the point, you will need 8 hatches and 6 queens to balance out the current 5 hatches with 3-4 queens injecting. You will lose supply, early timings will be impossible. Zerg will need some buffs to early and mid game while Terran will need late game buffs. Protoss doesnt change much... they can revert some research timings and their good to go. if you're on 3 bases, you lose 6 larva with this nerf. you only need 2 macro hatcheries to account for the missing larva and for most players, they won't be floating too much because they will obviously be injecting on time and your saturation will come much slower. im interested to see what happens when zergs take a 4th and go into the late-late game though.
Will see how it goes... but i suspect that will need macro hatches at all bases until we take the 5 base.
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On August 15 2015 23:41 Temeter wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs. All of these macro mechanics were a reason for comebacks. A fast 3CC could replenish, lots of larva mean lots of drones, and chroonoboost could alleviate tech disadvantages and probe losses.
If macro mechanics can be used for comebacks they can be also be used to get ahead. Any boosters for economy, unit production, upgrades can be used by either player and will always favour the one who is ahead. It is at best a bad comeback mechanic imo..
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On August 15 2015 23:48 KelsierSC wrote:
well, not buying LotV
nice job
I didn't buy HotS but if all these changes go into release I will be buying LotV.
So nice job
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On August 16 2015 00:34 -Archangel- wrote:I didn't buy HotS but if all these changes go into release I will be buying LotV. So nice job
I'm buying lotv either way.
blizz is making a good product that I will enjoy, they deserve some of my disposable income.
keep doing good blizz 
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
On August 16 2015 00:34 -Archangel- wrote:I didn't buy HotS but if all these changes go into release I will be buying LotV. So nice job
meh there's plenty of casual games for free, clearly that is the direction Blizzard want to move in.
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Why does zerg retain the "macro" mechaics and why is it automatically done? Why not just hatcheries 5 larva to produce from?
I hate how they are making the game so easy with the automation of the zerg macro mechanic.
And why is David Kim a game designer? Being good at the game doesn't automatically mean you are a great balancer and even if you were a good balancer, that doesn't mean you are a good designer.
Clearly David Kim lacks any sort of game design skills.
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On August 15 2015 03:26 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
Nevertheless, having a more visible result from players’ macro looks to be a much cooler direction rather than just having the forced/needed clicks found in things like Inject Larva.
NO. FUCKING. SHIT!!!
I swear to god, five freaking years of screaming at blizzard about how fucking boring inject is and what do you fucking know, removing it makes the game better!!!
Aghggaaaa!!!!
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On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs.
I think the removal of Macro mechanics actually reduces the opportunity for comeback, especially in the case of Terran. Because those mechanics were the most forgiving part of the Macro. They also buffed harassment to insane degrees, because killing workers had little effect because of Macro mechanics.
Killing drones just depleted the Larva of the Zerg a little. Killing probes just slowed the upgrades of Protoss. Killing SCVs just made Terran Scan less.
Thinking about it, killing a full workerline hurts so much with this change. It might actually help spreading out expansions. Well unless you are Terran, thanks to Neo Steel and no need for Orbitals, you can have your 15 workers hide inside the CC on your expansions now XD.
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On August 16 2015 01:38 FeyFey wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2015 23:27 LSN wrote:On August 15 2015 23:21 Cascade wrote:
Auto-inject is the laziest solution ever seen... If you don't want players to have to do injects, then remove the ability ffs.
Killing an auto-inject queen remains a tactical option in battles and harrassments but it wont have that high effect anymore. It's the best solution. Blizzard is perfectly right with its current decisionmaking. They reduce "terrible terrible damage" as well as scaling of advantages and disadvantages. More opportunities for comebacks will be created etc. It is what this game needs. I think the removal of Macro mechanics actually reduces the opportunity for comeback, especially in the case of Terran. Because those mechanics were the most forgiving part of the Macro. They also buffed harassment to insane degrees, because killing workers had little effect because of Macro mechanics. Killing drones just depleted the Larva of the Zerg a little. Killing probes just slowed the upgrades of Protoss. Killing SCVs just made Terran Scan less. Thinking about it, killing a full workerline hurts so much with this change. It might actually help spreading out expansions. Well unless you are Terran, thanks to Neo Steel and no need for Orbitals, you can have your 15 workers hide inside the CC on your expansions now XD.
I understand where you are coming from but again I wanna emphasize the major aspects of these changes for me.
1. These changes reduce scaling. Scaling always helps the player that has the advantage. Therefore the reduction of scaling will help to make comebacks possible more oftenly as the player with the advantage will gain less benefits from his advantage.
2. Terran's ability to come back with mules can't be even considered as that. It was more kind of a metagame factor that everyone knew and had to count in. It lead to the fact that attacking the terran was almost only worth it when you could kill the terran completely. In PvT and ZvT any extra committement on harrassing the terran was negated by the fact that he could make up for major eco losses with only dropping mules, terran basically just had to survive and p/z were behind with their committment even when they did comparetively large amounts of damage. That again lead to the fact that play against terran almost only was either full all-in with the only objective to kill terran or passive/defensive macro play - there was hardly anything inbetween aside of oracles that only for these reasons were introduced to the game.
Now with these changes this is going to change. A Z/P can committ on different levels and only has to deal damage that is corresponding to the level of his committment. Only this is going to take Sc2 to a new level!
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On August 15 2015 23:48 KelsierSC wrote:
well, not buying LotV
nice job
Well, no one fucking cares.
Great, original post about LOTV. This one will really help Blizzard make the game the best it can be!
Nice job.
User was warned for this post
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EPT
