EPT[Patch 6.4] Ammo for Everyone General Discussion - Page 11
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On March 05 2016 10:42 JimmiC wrote: Are they more fun and more unique then before? More interesting? If you hit at least 2 of the three they are a success to me Agreed. New Morde is definitely more fun and interesting than Old Morde, both to play as and and to play against. Darius... I suppose people found him the most fun back when he was just released and was broken as hell and just killed his lane opponent over and over 1v1 and it was impossible to itemize against him (physical damage, magical damage, true damage... WTF were they thinking), but with relatively balanced numbers he feels a lot better now, with clearly defined strengths and weaknesses. The Darius Pentakill dunkfest reset fantasy used to be just that... a fantasy. It never actually happened because even if the situation arose where he could chain-execute the enemy team, Darius just ran out of mana after a couple of ults. It reminds me of the (in retrospect) hilarious promise of resetting Lucian's dash a bunch of times as he got a bunch of kills with The Culling (back when getting a kill with it reset his dash): + Show Spoiler [Only in the Champion Spotlight] + But now? The Darius pentadunk promise is real. And whatever his viability at pro play may be, that feels _fantastic_ | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
Outside of the dragon he was not given any tools to make getting his damage down easier, like people who didn't play old morde don't seem to understand, old Morde did a LOT of damage, and he was actually pretty tanky naturally even with full ap builds, his problem was it was very hard to realize his damage, now, by breaking up his q into 3 hits they made it even harder for him to do less damage than he did before in exchange for some weird dragon mechanic that has no cohesion with the rest of his kit. I'm curious if his playrate is higher or lower if you ignore the period where he was broken, because old morde was actually a decent counterpick in some situations. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On March 05 2016 10:11 killerdog wrote: So if they'd all been so overtuned that they dominated proplay unabated for months, and were pickban in soloq until a patch or two ago, then you'd categorize them as success's? That seems like a rather weird interpretation of a well made champion. Not what I said at all. I said its harder to tell if a champion is well made if Riot just leaves them OP for a long time. The way you tell is once they get nerfed to not be able to body most champs in pro/solo (like how we see Darius now). By way of example, the Kog rework seems like mostly a failure. He was trash, buffed a little and became totally OP, nerfed and seems mediocre but doesn't seem dynamic in any way, and doesn't appear to have much of a niche once he can't entire teams in his face without kiting (which should have been impossible because old Kog had the most clearly defined niche in LOL). On March 05 2016 11:21 Zato-1 wrote: Agreed. New Morde is definitely more fun and interesting than Old Morde, both to play as and and to play against. Darius... I suppose people found him the most fun back when he was just released and was broken as hell and just killed his lane opponent over and over 1v1 and it was impossible to itemize against him (physical damage, magical damage, true damage... WTF were they thinking), but with relatively balanced numbers he feels a lot better now, with clearly defined strengths and weaknesses. The Darius Pentakill dunkfest reset fantasy used to be just that... a fantasy. It never actually happened because even if the situation arose where he could chain-execute the enemy team, Darius just ran out of mana after a couple of ults. It reminds me of the (in retrospect) hilarious promise of resetting Lucian's dash a bunch of times as he got a bunch of kills with The Culling (back when getting a kill with it reset his dash): + Show Spoiler [Only in the Champion Spotlight] + https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rIiuLXXGEg&t=2m50s But now? The Darius pentadunk promise is real. And whatever his viability at pro play may be, that feels _fantastic_ Thats all subjective, but really I'd argue Darius, Skarner, and Garen were barely changed. And if you wanted pentadunk to be "real" you could have done that without a rework and make it refund mana on kill, or give a period of time after first use where subsequent casts are free. I actually just find all the reworks to be "meh" aside from Skarner's which is "WTF this is the opposite of what I would ever have wanted." Morde's has potential, but is just unrealized on the first iteration, and I don't know if it ever will be. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/V5.7 | ||
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Bladeorade
United States1898 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On March 05 2016 16:23 Bladeorade wrote: Thoughts on Jhin? I feel like he is actually very strong he is just not a traditional adc. More of an AD Caster. That snare is just op in team fights deathfire touch makes his 4th shot always get a kill if the opponent is like 1/3rd life or lower. it's insanity | ||
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
Wow, he's garbage. I mean even when you get to just stand next to people and get three full qs in they don't die. I mean if the enemy in this game where everyone and their mother has slows, stuns and dashes actually lets you q them three times and they don't die, what exactly is the point of this champ? Makes me sad. | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On March 05 2016 13:53 cLutZ wrote: Not what I said at all. I said its harder to tell if a champion is well made if Riot just leaves them OP for a long time. The way you tell is once they get nerfed to not be able to body most champs in pro/solo (like how we see Darius now). By way of example, the Kog rework seems like mostly a failure. He was trash, buffed a little and became totally OP, nerfed and seems mediocre but doesn't seem dynamic in any way, and doesn't appear to have much of a niche once he can't entire teams in his face without kiting (which should have been impossible because old Kog had the most clearly defined niche in LOL). Thats all subjective, but really I'd argue Darius, Skarner, and Garen were barely changed. And if you wanted pentadunk to be "real" you could have done that without a rework and make it refund mana on kill, or give a period of time after first use where subsequent casts are free. I actually just find all the reworks to be "meh" aside from Skarner's which is "WTF this is the opposite of what I would ever have wanted." Morde's has potential, but is just unrealized on the first iteration, and I don't know if it ever will be. Meh, you tried to get an anti-Riot circlejerk going, but sadly you failed even harder than the juggernaut reworks since you tried to nitpick something that everyone agrees actually worked out pretty well. Put it this way - by your logic Riot should actually just undo those changes and bring back Oldarius, Oldren, Oldekaiser, and Oldarner? Pretty sure everyone would agree that'd be worse. Sorry, try again later? I hear bitching about death timers is popular on Reddit right now. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
Only Darius is improved, Garen is a wash and the other two are worse to me. | ||
739
Bearded Elder29905 Posts
LoL updated client Alpha Leak, almost confirmed not to be fake. Pretty decent stuff, the old client is so outdated I can't even say... <3 changes | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On March 06 2016 09:58 Slusher wrote: Actually I'd vote for a reversion for the record. Only Darius is improved, Garen is a wash and the other two are worse to me. Skarner is a pretty big fuckup. Don't know who thought that spire mechanic was ever going to work well or be fun. I'd honestly prefer the real old skarner. Think there're enough strong abilities in this game for him to be fine. Although was the issue more the ulti-flash bug where pulled regardless of being in range? | ||
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
I honestly don't care how the client looks as long as it works and doesn't go back to home page if someone dodges. | ||
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Amui
Canada10567 Posts
On March 06 2016 20:20 nafta wrote: Both the old and new versions of those 4 champs suck. Old skarner is probably the closest to a good champion out of all 8. I honestly don't care how the client looks as long as it works and doesn't go back to home page if someone dodges. I think darius is fine. Better than before, and definitely does have a place. Maybe not competitive, but certainly viable. The rest just suck. Garen - really binary. Combo's people who are villains, and is pretty bad outside of that. Skarner - fucking destroys people when in zones, sucks outside of it. Morde - Failure. Old morde didn't have any gimmicks and was arguably more viable than the current morde. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
On March 06 2016 20:15 Numy wrote: Think there're enough strong abilities in this game for him to be fine. Although was the issue more the ulti-flash bug where pulled regardless of being in range? how old do you mean?? old perma slow q version of Skarner was by far his best version, not sure if people would consider his original q to ever be acceptable though. I mean I'm down to try it, but Riot didn't fuck around when Skarner was perma ban for like 1 week after the jugg patch, so I doubt we'd be able to gather much data before he got taken out back by Morello. actually thats what bothered me the most about this whole thing, I don't really mind that they tried the juggernaut patch even though I might not prefer the new versions, but it goes back to the whole I don't understand why you ever nerf two abilities at once when you patch every two weeks. but thats another topic entirely. | ||
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Fildun
Netherlands4124 Posts
Same for old Skarner, the spires feel like a random mechanic which only results in balance problems. Same for Morde as well. I do think Darius was a success though. Also, GrandInquisitor, stop making baseless assumptions please. | ||
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On March 06 2016 20:51 Slusher wrote: all I want for the new client is for play again to remember my roles and just q me up. how old do you mean?? old perma slow q version of Skarner was by far his best version, not sure if people would consider his original q to ever be acceptable though. I mean I'm down to try it, but Riot didn't fuck around when Skarner was perma ban for like 1 week after the jugg patch, so I doubt we'd be able to gather much data before he got taken out back by Morello. actually thats what bothered me the most about this whole thing, I don't really mind that they tried the juggernaut patch even though I might not prefer the new versions, but it goes back to the whole I don't understand why you ever nerf two abilities at once when you patch every two weeks. but thats another topic entirely. I'm talking about his perma slow q version where he was a real pick in competitive for awhile. Think I remember Cloudtemplar owning with him if that helps. Yea Riot was a bit quick on pulling the trigger but I always feel they too quick. Especially when they introduce new items then gut the guys that use them the best only to gut the item later. I also like the old morde. He was a bit silly but that style of mage can be fun to play every now and then. Sad they removed his potential as a mage to make this gimmick which understandably got gutted right away. Hell I liked the old Sion too. It was dumb as hell but fun to play mid lane. | ||
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