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739
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Bearded Elder29903 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-20 21:55:42
November 20 2014 21:55 GMT
#81
On November 21 2014 06:34 krndandaman wrote:
not sure if bug but i'm spectating my friend's ranked game with 0 delay. if it's not a bug this can be abused (albeit preseason)

lol. Who wants some ghosting and counterjungling? :D
Anyway, I really do love new jungle, it's so refreshing.

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
WriterSalty oldboy that loves memes | One and only back-to-back Liquibet Winner
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-20 22:09:42
November 20 2014 21:56 GMT
#82
That Udyr portrait is so cancerous.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-20 22:15:32
November 20 2014 22:14 GMT
#83
devourer is so stupid. did kayle jungle. i shouldnt be doing that much magic damage per hit. the strategic diversity of jungle items: play nunu, or use devourer.
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35143 Posts
November 20 2014 22:16 GMT
#84
On November 21 2014 07:14 PrinceXizor wrote:
devourer is so stupid. did kayle jungle. i shouldnt be doing that much magic damage per hit. the strategic diversity of jungle items: play nunu, or use devourer.

Fuck that. Do both.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
November 20 2014 22:17 GMT
#85
Man you guys talk like Riot isn't going to be changing a bunch of shit, there's a reason this is the preseason and not Season 5.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
TheHumanSensation
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada1210 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-20 22:32:35
November 20 2014 22:26 GMT
#86
My quick notes on ranged junglers (from only three games, Twitch/Kalista/Gnar):

The pathing AI feels slightly different than before, but is still abusable for invincibility. Maybe it's just the SR update, but it feels like the abuse spots shifted 0.5cm over, most noticeable on blue buff. I didn't encounter any issues with stuff resetting differently but I have heard as such from other players? Maybe they didn't do it often. Not a problem with the three champs I tried, anyway.

Ranged junglers can generally clear the vision crab pretty easy, gnar has the easiest time due to re-occuring slows from Q. Side note of that it provides easy stacks for things like Aatrox's W for health, but Kalista building stacks on it and passing them onto something with Q is like impossible to set up. I wanted it, though.

New dragon is hell. Maybe I haven't figured it out yet, but right now it's the biggest reason not to take a ranged / ADC-esque jungler imo. Other than the obvious stuff, I mean.

Counter-jungling is super easy atm because people get low and have to back more, so although it's harder to take the non-melee camps (especially wraiths) it's easier to steal the melee ones now. Didn't test early counter jungling much.

Twitch clears about the same as before. Abuse range on melee camps (golems, red, and blue (wolves are too fast to make it reliable but can still be kited to reduce damage)) to avoid taking damage. Very reliant on red buff first for increased damage output, and won't take damage in the process making the red-smite a waste. Maybe the frog buff first can work if you get a leash (I didn't), but Red is important for early ganks. I did [Red -> golems -> wraiths -> gank] for a start and had no problem with it. I'd recommend not fighting the frog or wraiths without the the golem buff due to their high damage output. Always get red before ganks (as before). The wraiths buff isn't as important for Twitch as it is for most junglers, so I'd recommend smiting golem instead. Has all the same problems as it did before, but with more time between camp respawns I felt less punished for ganking lots. Probably mediocre, maybe strong?.

Kalista is similar, but can clear wolves (better kiting) and frog (E stacks help a lot) more reliably than Twitch. Doesn't rely on early ganks / Red buff nearly as much, and can clear alright. Red helps clear the most, but frog is comparable. Blue buff makes E-spam pretty solid for clearing small things at the same time as big things. I did [Red -> Golems -> Blue -> Frog], which was super inefficient and I'd recommend golems first instead at minimum. Good power spike at 6, but felt pretty bleh later on imo. Still learning the champ ofc. Ult ganks are hard to co-ordinate with your team, so maybe reserve it for duoing with a mid who wants to make plays top and bot? Feels good to get one lane ahead, and then soulbind with them (don't do it at the beginning of the game, I mean), but needs more testing. Probably mediocre.

Gnar feels way less fun and strong. Losing the burn on Q from SotEL brings teamfight poke way down as well as gets rid of fun / neat rage control (throw boomerangs at things over walls just for the rage while walking), and it also causes the AoE on Q to not become a solid mid/late clearing tool. Gnar tends to go mega at the end of your second camp (with leash) or at the beginning-middle of your second camp (no leash). Golem buffs help mega gnar a lot, which is significant as before it was mostly useful for just clearing wolves / wraiths. Golem -> red is bad though, since you want to be mini to clear red and take no damage. Blue is obviously useless and without the exp benefits you may as well pass it onto your midlaner. Frog still wrecks gnar, but maybe it's alright first with a leash. This needs a lot more testing. Probably weak.

Want to try Kayle next.
Osmoses
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Sweden5302 Posts
November 20 2014 22:34 GMT
#87
Gangplank clears really well from the getgo, and morde takes basically no damage after first back, it's great. I think if I ever actually get to jungle in a real game I'll either go counter jungle gp or homeguard tp morde. Both are just too troll for words.
Excuse me hun, but what is your name? Vivian? I woke up next to you naked and, uh, did we, um?
ahswtini
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
November 20 2014 22:35 GMT
#88
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me
"As I've said, balance isn't about strategies or counters, it's about probability and statistics." - paralleluniverse
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
November 20 2014 22:41 GMT
#89
On November 21 2014 07:35 ahswtini wrote:
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me


Do you have smite? You need it
ahswtini
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
November 20 2014 22:43 GMT
#90
On November 21 2014 07:41 iCanada wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2014 07:35 ahswtini wrote:
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me


Do you have smite? You need it

im level 7, i had smite, now i dont.

wtf is this gated content crap
"As I've said, balance isn't about strategies or counters, it's about probability and statistics." - paralleluniverse
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
November 20 2014 22:51 GMT
#91
On November 21 2014 07:43 ahswtini wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2014 07:41 iCanada wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:35 ahswtini wrote:
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me


Do you have smite? You need it

im level 7, i had smite, now i dont.

wtf is this gated content crap


Is not gated. You get smite level 1. You need to have smite to be a jungler and you need to be a jungler to use jungle items.

It's ham fisted, but its not the worst thing in the world.
ahswtini
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
November 20 2014 22:54 GMT
#92
On November 21 2014 07:51 iCanada wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2014 07:43 ahswtini wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:41 iCanada wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:35 ahswtini wrote:
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me


Do you have smite? You need it

im level 7, i had smite, now i dont.

wtf is this gated content crap


Is not gated. You get smite level 1. You need to have smite to be a jungler and you need to be a jungler to use jungle items.

It's ham fisted, but its not the worst thing in the world.

???

I'm seeing smite locked until lvl 10 now
"As I've said, balance isn't about strategies or counters, it's about probability and statistics." - paralleluniverse
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
November 20 2014 22:57 GMT
#93
Read the patch notes, Smite unlocks at Summoner level 10 now.
Moderator
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-20 23:01:25
November 20 2014 22:58 GMT
#94
On November 21 2014 07:54 ahswtini wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2014 07:51 iCanada wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:43 ahswtini wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:41 iCanada wrote:
On November 21 2014 07:35 ahswtini wrote:
why the fuck are jungling items disabled for me


Do you have smite? You need it

im level 7, i had smite, now i dont.

wtf is this gated content crap


Is not gated. You get smite level 1. You need to have smite to be a jungler and you need to be a jungler to use jungle items.

It's ham fisted, but its not the worst thing in the world.

???

I'm seeing smite locked until lvl 10 now


Oh they must have stealth changed it. Well it doesn't matter anyway, before you have runes jungling is like kicking a hibernating bear in the testicles... you probably just shouldn't do it ever.
chalice
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1945 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-21 00:37:34
November 20 2014 23:10 GMT
#95
On November 21 2014 07:26 TheHumanSensation wrote:
My quick notes on ranged junglers (from only three games, Twitch/Kalista/Gnar):

The pathing AI feels slightly different than before, but is still abusable for invincibility. Maybe it's just the SR update, but it feels like the abuse spots shifted 0.5cm over, most noticeable on blue buff. I didn't encounter any issues with stuff resetting differently but I have heard as such from other players? Maybe they didn't do it often. Not a problem with the three champs I tried, anyway.

Ranged junglers can generally clear the vision crab pretty easy, gnar has the easiest time due to re-occuring slows from Q. Side note of that it provides easy stacks for things like Aatrox's W for health, but Kalista building stacks on it and passing them onto something with Q is like impossible to set up. I wanted it, though.

New dragon is hell. Maybe I haven't figured it out yet, but right now it's the biggest reason not to take a ranged / ADC-esque jungler imo. Other than the obvious stuff, I mean.

Counter-jungling is super easy atm because people get low and have to back more, so although it's harder to take the non-melee camps (especially wraiths) it's easier to steal the melee ones now. Didn't test early counter jungling much.

Twitch clears about the same as before. Abuse range on melee camps (golems, red, and blue (wolves are too fast to make it reliable but can still be kited to reduce damage)) to avoid taking damage. Very reliant on red buff first for increased damage output, and won't take damage in the process making the red-smite a waste. Maybe the frog buff first can work if you get a leash (I didn't), but Red is important for early ganks. I did [Red -> golems -> wraiths -> gank] for a start and had no problem with it. I'd recommend not fighting the frog or wraiths without the the golem buff due to their high damage output. Always get red before ganks (as before). The wraiths buff isn't as important for Twitch as it is for most junglers, so I'd recommend smiting golem instead. Has all the same problems as it did before, but with more time between camp respawns I felt less punished for ganking lots. Probably mediocre, maybe strong?.

Kalista is similar, but can clear wolves (better kiting) and frog (E stacks help a lot) more reliably than Twitch. Doesn't rely on early ganks / Red buff nearly as much, and can clear alright. Red helps clear the most, but frog is comparable. Blue buff makes E-spam pretty solid for clearing small things at the same time as big things. I did [Red -> Golems -> Blue -> Frog], which was super inefficient and I'd recommend golems first instead at minimum. Good power spike at 6, but felt pretty bleh later on imo. Still learning the champ ofc. Ult ganks are hard to co-ordinate with your team, so maybe reserve it for duoing with a mid who wants to make plays top and bot? Feels good to get one lane ahead, and then soulbind with them (don't do it at the beginning of the game, I mean), but needs more testing. Probably mediocre.

Gnar feels way less fun and strong. Losing the burn on Q from SotEL brings teamfight poke way down as well as gets rid of fun / neat rage control (throw boomerangs at things over walls just for the rage while walking), and it also causes the AoE on Q to not become a solid mid/late clearing tool. Gnar tends to go mega at the end of your second camp (with leash) or at the beginning-middle of your second camp (no leash). Golem buffs help mega gnar a lot, which is significant as before it was mostly useful for just clearing wolves / wraiths. Golem -> red is bad though, since you want to be mini to clear red and take no damage. Blue is obviously useless and without the exp benefits you may as well pass it onto your midlaner. Frog still wrecks gnar, but maybe it's alright first with a leash. This needs a lot more testing. Probably weak.

Want to try Kayle next.

[spoiler]wraiths/birds are all melee now. edit: or not, animation just hard to see i guess
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
November 21 2014 00:21 GMT
#96
People who don't read patch notes and don't check on the new champion are pretty fun on Qtpie's stream. On the other hand, seeing Kalista jump inside J4's ult to finish someone off, then jump out with the next auto is kind of... well, poor J4.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
M2
Profile Joined December 2002
Bulgaria4116 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-21 01:06:27
November 21 2014 01:05 GMT
#97
an issue I see with the smites and the new jungle is that jungle is pretty hard and you need smite to clear, thus,the dueling smites become pointless. What I am trying to say is that you want to use smite in the jungle, coz its fuckin hard there and then smite has big cooldown so you cannot use it to gank or duel,hence only the counter jungling and farming smite make any sense.
Knife kitty, night kitty, put you on a slab. Stealthy kitty, hunter kitty, stab stab stab :-)
chalice
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1945 Posts
November 21 2014 01:21 GMT
#98
On November 21 2014 10:05 M2 wrote:
an issue I see with the smites and the new jungle is that jungle is pretty hard and you need smite to clear, thus,the dueling smites become pointless. What I am trying to say is that you want to use smite in the jungle, coz its fuckin hard there and then smite has big cooldown so you cannot use it to gank or duel,hence only the counter jungling and farming smite make any sense.

this is champion dependent and i'm guessing what riot was going for, the champs that don't need smite as much to clear get some more dueling power while the strong 1v1 junglers that need some help with camps have to take the ranger smite.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-21 01:36:41
November 21 2014 01:30 GMT
#99
Also kind of funny that we are back to bot lane doing golems.It's not as big of a problem as it used to be but some particular combos that have a lot of damage lvl 1 are real terror.

Riot need to make that camp impossible to kite already it has been too long.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
November 21 2014 01:33 GMT
#100
On November 21 2014 10:05 M2 wrote:
an issue I see with the smites and the new jungle is that jungle is pretty hard and you need smite to clear, thus,the dueling smites become pointless. What I am trying to say is that you want to use smite in the jungle, coz its fuckin hard there and then smite has big cooldown so you cannot use it to gank or duel,hence only the counter jungling and farming smite make any sense.

I liked that they increased spawn timers, so hopefully past the 2nd clear, you can smite camp -> gank -> farm camp
liftlift > tsm
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