|
On June 30 2014 12:31 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 12:13 sob3k wrote:
It's like all chalice/nonchalice builds.....
chalice came out and wasn't very commonly built at high level because "you don't need chalice just L2manage mana"
a year later everyone realizes that literally spamming every ability on CD is far stronger than never casting anything That has almost nothing to do with anything...People always knew Chalice was a great item for cost. The problem was it had no upgrade that was slot efficient + the old blue buff was much better, so it was kinda redundant once you got to that point. Then Athenes came out (because people were complaining about Chalice and Vlad) and was a little expensive for its stats, then Athenes got buffed and was built by everyone and everything AP, then blue got nerfed, and both got nerfed, etc. The misrepresentation of the evolution of post S2 LOL is increasingly becoming a pet peeve of mine...
I'm sorry, I meant athenes.
On release it gave 80ap,15mp5, 36mr, and 15% CDR, with same passives. It cost 2950.
At this stage it was ~%130 gold efficient without passives
At its OP stage before the current nerf it gave 60ap, 15mp5, 40mr, and 20%CDR and cost 2600
At this stage it was ~%140 gold efficient without passives.
Currently it gives 60ap, 10mp5, 25mr and 20%CDR and costs 2600
Currently ~116% gold efficient without passives.
I think I would rather have the original.
The only blue buff change that occured while the item existed was a decrease of the blue buff CDR from 20% to 10%. I don't think this makes athenes any better, in fact since athens is the only CDR you'll have at this point, then 20% CDR blue combined with 20% athenes seems better.
on a side note blue on release used to give 40% CDR and then was nerfed to 35% lol.
|
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
|
On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes
|
On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes
Lol really? its not random? First time I hear that it has a pattern..
|
On June 30 2014 16:45 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes Lol really? its not random? First time I hear that it has a pattern..
Its been over a year since riot has said that publicly, i'm not surprised people have forgotten. purple team has an advantage in matchmaking, blue team in the structure of the map. no idea if duo queue makes you more or less likely to be on the higher MMR purple side.
|
On June 30 2014 16:51 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:45 M2 wrote:On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes Lol really? its not random? First time I hear that it has a pattern.. Its been over a year since riot has said that publicly, i'm not surprised people have forgotten. purple team has an advantage in matchmaking, blue team in the structure of the map. no idea if duo queue makes you more or less likely to be on the higher MMR purple side.
Duo queue doesn't affect anything since you'll be matched with another duo queue.
|
Not necessarily. A duo just raises the team's average Elo, it doesn't try to actively put them against another (it does that in normals though, but I'm not sure in which capacity; 5-man premades at least tend to end up against other 5-man premades and it takes priority on Elo gap).
On June 30 2014 11:04 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 10:46 arb wrote:On June 30 2014 10:40 wei2coolman wrote:
TF got nerfed in recent patch cuz of chalice nerf. You never needed chalice on Tf. l0l. I still never get it and do fine. It's okay but i dont think its anywhere close to needed/necessary on him liek it is some other mids I was oldschool TF and thought TF was fine too, until I try ogn chalice build. Normally TF has to use almost all W on blue card in lane to sustain mana, but with chalice, he can red card+Q all days to clear the wave. He clears the wave so fast that it's hard for people to gank him. Moreover, the other mid is forced to stay in lane because the constant pressure, so TF has better chance to ultimate and help out other lane too. Chalice+soc boot can clear the wave pretty fast.
Eh, that was the reason why I heavily disliked playing against TF (as well as Anivia, Lux, then Ziggs once he got out and even more now, etc.), he never needed chalice to mindlessly keep pushing mid lane. Worst case he uses a blue card from time to time but can red card+Q most of the waves, and with blue buff he can do that every single wave, just telling you "I want to play alone, don't try to interact with me" from afar.
|
On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes
It's higher average, but nowhere close to enough to balance the disadvantage atm between blue and purple. As a guess, it's maybe a 20-50 elo difference. Easily within variance. While you do get some silly games during promo's where you'll be matched up against a team with more than 200 difference(plat1/d5 v d2-d4 for promo games on blue side), most of the time it's fair.
|
On June 30 2014 17:37 Amui wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes It's higher average, but nowhere close to enough to balance the disadvantage atm between blue and purple. As a guess, it's maybe a 20-50 elo difference. Easily within variance. While you do get some silly games during promo's where you'll be matched up against a team with more than 200 difference(plat1/d5 v d2-d4 for promo games on blue side), most of the time it's fair.
I'm pretty sure the system tries to find 10 evenly matched players, puts them in teams and then whatever team is incidentally higher MMR will be on purple. though its possible its systemic and intentionally selects better players for purple.
|
How would it judge which players are better
|
On June 30 2014 17:57 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
How would it judge which players are better
the system i assume views players with higher MMR to be better players. as thats the only metric it really has for doing so.
I guess what i was saying is that i see two ways it could match make. find 10 players of similar skill and try to balance the teams as best it can, and then put whichever one is lower MMR on blue and the higher MMR on purple.
or find two teams of 5 players that have similarish MMR and put the higher one on purple and the lower one of blue. its kind of different. if only slightly.
the second one would probably produce faster matchmaking at the increased risk of one sided games. but i have no way of knowing which way, or if there is a third way i can't think of that is used.
|
I wonder if it is actually true that purple team has higher elo.
I say this because challenger players have 50% chance to be on blue or purple. Remember these players are on top of the standings and they win 55% of the their games. So if the purple team has higher elo, Riot needs a special algorithm to balance things out.
|
On June 30 2014 20:38 Sufficiency wrote:
I wonder if it is actually true that purple team has higher elo.
I say this because challenger players have 50% chance to be on blue or purple. Remember these players are on top of the standings and they win 55% of the their games. So if the purple team has higher elo, Riot needs a special algorithm to balance things out.
Everything I've seen from MMR guessers is that it's only 1-2 wins higher.
|
Am I the only one that doesn't really care what side they're on?
|
On June 30 2014 17:46 PrinceXizor wrote:
I'm pretty sure the system tries to find 10 evenly matched players, puts them in teams and then whatever team is incidentally higher MMR will be on purple. though its possible its systemic and intentionally selects better players for purple.
I guess what I'm saying is that there's no difference between the two scenarios you just described except for mens rea which is dumb because algorithms don't have intent.
|
On June 30 2014 20:52 GolemMadness wrote:
Am I the only one that doesn't really care what side they're on?
Nope, I don't mind being on either side. Minimizing HUD size helps a lot though.
|
On June 30 2014 17:37 Amui wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes It's higher average, but nowhere close to enough to balance the disadvantage atm between blue and purple. As a guess, it's maybe a 20-50 elo difference. Easily within variance. While you do get some silly games during promo's where you'll be matched up against a team with more than 200 difference(plat1/d5 v d2-d4 for promo games on blue side), most of the time it's fair.
I thought in ranked purple tends to win more than the blue side because of the (small) MMR imbalance?
|
On June 30 2014 21:14 FairForever wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 17:37 Amui wrote:On June 30 2014 16:10 MooMooMugi wrote:On June 30 2014 16:09 canikizu wrote:
What is the condition in soloqueue to put you in blue or purple side?
I was put in purple side 31 times out of 35 games recently. This is just stupid.
Purple team is supposed to be the team with the "higher average MMR" but I question it too sometimes It's higher average, but nowhere close to enough to balance the disadvantage atm between blue and purple. As a guess, it's maybe a 20-50 elo difference. Easily within variance. While you do get some silly games during promo's where you'll be matched up against a team with more than 200 difference(plat1/d5 v d2-d4 for promo games on blue side), most of the time it's fair. I thought in ranked purple tends to win more than the blue side because of the (small) MMR imbalance?
Quite the opposite. Blue has something, if I remember correctly, like a 55% win rate. It's been the source of much conjecture, particularly why it's the case. E.g. camera angle, favourable map layout etc.
|
hey guys im trying to write a paper for school about korean team gaming houses and im having trouble finding sources
do you guys know where i can find some? (can be videos or written)
|
On June 30 2014 21:11 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2014 17:46 PrinceXizor wrote:
I'm pretty sure the system tries to find 10 evenly matched players, puts them in teams and then whatever team is incidentally higher MMR will be on purple. though its possible its systemic and intentionally selects better players for purple. I guess what I'm saying is that there's no difference between the two scenarios you just described except for mens rea which is dumb because algorithms don't have intent.
well think of it this way.
if the acceptable variance in MMR between players when matchmaking is say 20, then 1380 and 1400 could be matched together, the first method would try to find 10 players between those values and match them, and whichever side incidentally ended up with more MMR goes purple.
in the second method, they find two teams who each within themselves fall within that 20 variance. say a team from 1370-1390 that averages 1380, and a team that varies from 1390-1410 that averages 1400. they could be matched up with eachother in the second system, despite the overall variance between players being double that which is the "acceptable" variance because the variance within the teams and between the TEAMS is within the acceptable limits.
The difference may not be great. but it is certainly a difference.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
