EPTAlso Fizz is an excellent Swain match up.
[Patch 4.10] Nidalee/Skarner Rework General Discussion - P…
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JazzVortical
Australia1825 Posts
Also Fizz is an excellent Swain match up. | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
I kind of agree, in the fact that I thought ADCs were in a good spot item-wise and that maybe Riot needs to look at the base damage or AD scaling on some ADC abilities (cough Lucian cough) than the items. I will say though, new BT is pretty nice on Riven, if you can get max shield before a fight. Hell, even during a fight it helps. Plus, if you go Hydra + BT the life swings are insane, I've gone from 3% HP to like 45% due to Hydra active + Riven's kit + BT shield, along with dangerous game mastery, not to mention that the build path felt pretty smooth (I went BT into Hydra, though I could see it being better with Tiamat into BT then finishing Hydra off). | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On June 22 2014 16:07 Frudgey wrote: Hi guys, So Urgot is my ADC of choice but I've wanted to pick up Caitlyn. What is her build order? What items does she like to get? Also the appeal behind Caitlyn is that her laning phase is strong, correct? From my understanding she isn't a great duelist, but what she likes to do is to have a great laning phase so that when team fights occur she's ahead of the other ADC so being a weaker duelist isn't as relevant. Is this sort of the idea behind Caitlyn or am I crazy? Sorry if these are obvious questions but ADC isn't a role that I play very often and I was looking for a champion that can help me understand the fundamentals of ADC. Unless Urgot is completely fine in which case I can keep playing him as my ADC!  Go doran>ie(if slower game might have to get 2nd doran before finishing ie or you cna just grab boots)>pd>lw and then bork if enemy has shit that you can't possibly kite otherwise bt. You pick caitlyn so you win lane.If you don't you are going to be weak compared to enemy ad especially now(you can always pray to rng gods now unlike before so there is that at least).She can win pretty much any lane almost no matter of supports. Don't really consider urgot an adc but if you like him just keep playing him.You might enjoy corki I think.He is also kind of similar to urgot that you have to land your abilities to actually do stuff but he has really good waveclear and probably the at least top 3 damage of any ad right now.Also he is the only ad with a fat model which is really frustrating.... | ||
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loSleb
Austria1389 Posts
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
As well as what I said earlier, try to learn how to do an EQ combo. That was one of the best things to learn when I mained Cait. She has problems dueling with Q because during the windup people can just auto you, but if you E first you get out of range of their autos and get a free Q that takes like no animation time and applies on a slowed target. I could go on about Cait. Placing good traps is important to fighting against melees. Her ult's cooldown isn't that long so often you can just use it for damage eg. your opponent has no lifesteal and you want to back anyways. This can leave you with no ult later though when you need it. Some players are really good at hitting Qs in lane. When I watch doublelift use Q, he reads the enemy ADC as they go for CS. That's scary. It's like he's in your head. I used to Q right after entering the brush as it would break line of sight giving them almost no time to dodge. Trinkets make this harder unless you get a sweeper though. This is all basic Caitlyn knowledge: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Caitlyn/Strategy | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
What is there to learn about caitlyn eq combo?Bork first on caitlyn is probably the worst first damage item in the game for her lol.You can also e/w behind you if you are trying to escape. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On June 22 2014 21:16 nafta wrote: Feels smaller to me.Could be just my brain messing with me though LOL What is there to learn about caitlyn eq combo?Bork first on caitlyn is probably the worst first damage item in the game for her lol. Really worse than Deathcap? Shit... The build path is good on botrk because nothing costs more than 1k gold. There's not much to learn but it takes some practice just like Alistar WQ. It takes like one bot game to get good at lol. | ||
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
On June 22 2014 21:16 obesechicken13 wrote: I personally think you can get other items like botrk on Caitlyn as a first item. Your end game build is always going to include IE, and Last Whisper though and will almost definitely have a PD as well. The choice of boots and final item is really up to the player. As well as what I said earlier, try to learn how to do an EQ combo. That was one of the best things to learn when I mained Cait. She has problems dueling with Q because during the windup people can just auto you, but if you E first you get out of range of their autos and get a free Q that takes like no animation time and applies on a slowed target. I could go on about Cait. Placing good traps is important to fighting against melees. Her ult's cooldown isn't that long so often you can just use it for damage eg. your opponent has no lifesteal and you want to back anyways. This can leave you with no ult later though when you need it. Some players are really good at hitting Qs in lane. When I watch doublelift use Q, he reads the enemy ADC as they go for CS. That's scary. It's like he's in your head. I used to Q right after entering the brush as it would break line of sight giving them almost no time to dodge. Trinkets make this harder unless you get a sweeper though. This is all basic Caitlyn knowledge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJTcf1BC9Dk http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Caitlyn/Strategy I would strongly recommend against BotRK on Caitlyn. Your DPS is significantly higher when you go double dorans -> IE and BotRK doesn't synergize as well with her kit. You should basically never be in range for the active, and you simply put out more damage with an Infinity Edge on a champ that is extremely safe and strong at farming. Also, that headshot crit with IE is massive. BotRK doesn't really play into that at all and it doesn't help you push faster, either. If you want the lifesteal, go BT, but Cait's best first item path right now is hands down IE. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
Granted, this game they had Fiddlesticks+Karthus+Vayne+Leona and our Lucian was a complete shitter (feeding in lane, whining, going back into fights with 300 HP when we could (and should, considering their comp) back off, basically dead weight), so obviously a diving champion will have issues regardless, but her damage output between traps (fairly short range and long animation) and javelins is pretty low now. Her midgame if put ahead and you can afford to chase is really good though. But she looks like a champion who would benefit more from splitpushing (not mandatorily from her) and playing for picks and vision control in the jungle if she can't win by midgame. | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On June 22 2014 22:08 Alaric wrote: Yeah, Nidalee falls off pretty hard later on. Granted, this game they had Fiddlesticks+Karthus+Vayne+Leona and our Lucian was a complete shitter (feeding in lane, whining, going back into fights with 300 HP when we could (and should, considering their comp) back off, basically dead weight), so obviously a diving champion will have issues regardless, but her damage output between traps (fairly short range and long animation) and javelins is pretty low now. Her midgame if put ahead and you can afford to chase is really good though. But she looks like a champion who would benefit more from splitpushing (not mandatorily from her) and playing for picks and vision control in the jungle if she can't win by midgame. I think nidalee needs more penetration than AP late game now, those bushwhacks are going to be key to zoning people out of towers combine with spears. you aren't looking to bushwhack the adc anyway since they have range and lifesteal to negate it. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 22 2014 20:16 Kinie wrote: Double lift thinks this patch "shit on ADCs" due to how you generally go double dorans into sitting on a billion gold until IE, whereas previously you had a slightly smoother build path with BT. Now unless you can cs like him it'll take forever to get relevant, and you are then relying on RNG to get max damage that early on, whereas BT was slightly stronger but didn't have the random power spikes of damage due to crits. I kind of agree, in the fact that I thought ADCs were in a good spot item-wise and that maybe Riot needs to look at the base damage or AD scaling on some ADC abilities (cough Lucian cough) than the items. I will say though, new BT is pretty nice on Riven, if you can get max shield before a fight. Hell, even during a fight it helps. Plus, if you go Hydra + BT the life swings are insane, I've gone from 3% HP to like 45% due to Hydra active + Riven's kit + BT shield, along with dangerous game mastery, not to mention that the build path felt pretty smooth (I went BT into Hydra, though I could see it being better with Tiamat into BT then finishing Hydra off). What? In travis interview he pretty much says adc are so much stronger now at all points in the game except before ie...... | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On June 22 2014 23:58 wei2coolman wrote: What? In travis interview he pretty much says adc are so much stronger now at all points in the game except before ie...... Last night on stream.Was talking about how it takes 3 items or 25/30 minutes to get strong.Also a lot of tristana whine. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 23 2014 00:19 nafta wrote: Last night on stream.Was talking about how it takes 3 items or 25/30 minutes to get strong.Also a lot of tristana whine. If he's playing tristana that's a trist problem. Not an adc one.... | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On June 23 2014 00:21 wei2coolman wrote: If he's playing tristana that's a trist problem. Not an adc one.... No it was more of she is a dumb character that is boring to play against/with.She definitely is pretty stronk this patch but still not top tier I feel. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 23 2014 00:23 nafta wrote: No it was more of she is a dumb character that is boring to play against/with.She definitely is pretty stronk this patch but still not top tier I feel. I'm talking about the "takes 3 items to get strong" part. that is not an ADC problem, that is tristana problem. That has always been her problem. | ||
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miicah
Australia2470 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On June 23 2014 00:34 miicah wrote: Do you guys think that giving barrier an actual untimed shield would make it a viable pick instead of heal? So basically if you cast barrier it would give you an X hp shield that lasted until the enemy damaged through it. It would be literally the same as it is now.Nobody would use it prematurely. | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
On June 23 2014 00:40 nafta wrote: It would be literally the same as it is now.Nobody would use it prematurely. no it wouldnt. almost allways people can stop attacking/nuking you if you use barrier at an appropriate moment, especially if they are right at the edge of your attacking range and can decide to stop the attack. the pressure is then entirely on the barrier user to make the cooldown worth the usage. this is much less true for other combat summoners such as heal and ignite which can only be countered by very spefic countermeasures such as healing reduction or cleansing and not just by positioning. the use case for exhaust is somewhere in the middle because you can wait it out before you use a major damaging spell or steroid but you can't counter it by positioning without using flash or flashlike spells. | ||
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Klonere
Ireland4123 Posts
Its funny how Corki and Kog are switched out between the NA and Korean scene in terms of pick priority although once NA starts playing on the new patch I expect that to change. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
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