EPT[Patch 4.7] Braum General Discussion - Page 58
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
Not knowing the pro scene or how LoL even played at this point I assumed pro teams played as a 5 man team in solo que. I did not know you about Solo Que/Ranked Teams. Right away "HOLY SHIT THESE GUYS ARE SO FUCKING BAD. FUCKING IDIOT TEAM!!!! ETC..." I was like "WTF this dude is basing his own team he is a part of, this is wild. WTF?" Luckily someone on Twitter explained solo que/ranked 5's to me. I have not stopped watching since. I literally had 0 idea how to jungle to at that point but had always wanted to. I learned a great deal about jungle from his stream and often mirroring his current champ pool/builds/runes/masteries still to this day. The little things he is good at teaching are very helpful I think to almost any player. He's funny too imo so that helps. He's not the best mechanical jungler, makes really stupid decisions often in solo que (very yolo), and blames a bit too often, however there is so much to be learned from watching him imo that you can take a jungler from 800 elo to mid Gold off his stream/pro games. I am one of them. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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tokicheese
Canada739 Posts
On May 16 2014 05:31 Ketara wrote: Yeah I can play a mage and beat him, but that often doesn't really work with the rest of your team comp. I'm wondering what in terms of "top lane" champions do the job. Renekton has worked well for me. Renek can just jump on your face early and trade well and then once he gets some MR you don't really hurt him. | ||
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FinestHour
United States18466 Posts
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Celial
2602 Posts
On May 16 2014 05:27 Ketara wrote: I need to learn a "top lane" champ to play against Ryze top. I was thinking top Jarvan? Who absolutely wrecks Ryze, I need it to be ez because I'm bad. I'm probably the worst top laner in the history of the game, but Riven level 2 and 3 all-in always fucks me for the rest of the game. If I don't fuck up right there - her Q combo has a much much lower cooldown than Ryze's Rune Prison. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
i just clicked on oddone's stream, he's making jokes and he sees a bot lane sort of almost diving and he comes from behind with kayle and tries to super force the gank and it ends up with a 4 v 4 and his whole team ends up dying because he tried too hard to force a gank to work and didnt focus enough to understand it would be better to not take the risk and keep farming. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
On May 16 2014 05:43 Slayer91 wrote: except 800 to goldish elo is the sort of level you expect a regular player to get to. you'd probably have figured out shit on your own if you didnt have oddone to watch. Thinking and trying to understand things for yourself is definitely the best way. Even if a pro player is pointing out things he does that gives you the illusion you know what you're doing when what they explain is the top level of things and like inception you need to go deeper Not really. As a direct comparison I started playing around the same time as a group of my friends. The one that watches streams with me and we analyze shit, watch LCS, etc is in Plat 3 with me in G4 currently. He played about double-triple what I do but we are both always going up and up slowly. All the rest don't, they play more and all are in low low silver (most S4-S5). Some people ofc will just progress on their own, but most I have seen don't without outside help. Streams being one of the most accessible ways. On May 16 2014 05:51 Slayer91 wrote: also the thing is oddone making jokes and talking distracts him from focusing on the game, and thats fine for a stream because nobody watching is paying attention from the finer details of the game either. i just clicked on oddone's stream, he's making jokes and he sees a bot lane sort of almost diving and he comes from behind with kayle and tries to super force the gank and it ends up with a 4 v 4 and his whole team ends up dying because he tried too hard to force a gank to work and didnt focus enough to understand it would be better to not take the risk and keep farming. Please point me to a streamer that makes no mistakes. Ofc he's not the best, but he's entertaining and informational imo. Edit: Also that game has had d/c's all game, right now all 10 lagging out. Not really a solid example. | ||
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
Also we are playing a very big game on a very big ranked ladder, there are lots of resources avalaible to everyone and the game requires a lot of knowledge - I think it's pretty self-explanatory that people who use other learning tools than game itself will usually be better. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
the reaosn most people dont progress is because they 1: play to win the game or with sort term goals like get a promotion from gold 4 to gold 3 or something 2: have too much ego and it makes them ignore their own mistakes and blame their teammates playing to improve is a very specific mindset and thinking gold 4 is an achievement is sort of you self justifying that what you're doing is effective and your methods of passively watching other players is also effective. if you played with the proper mindset you could easily get diamond 5 within a month or two and with a reasonable amount of games per week with regards to the oddone play, it happened before the lag happened and it was the only play i saw and it was a mistake and it was a mistake i make when im playing with the wrong mindset. Everything I see about oddone screams a player who was good once and is just maintaining that level and not improving. His ongoing retirement despite actively practicing is testament to this analysis. it was just an example and i notice it whenever i turn on his stream. I see trick2g make weird and selfish plays but I don't see him make those kinds of trying too hard to make a play mistakes. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On May 16 2014 05:27 Ketara wrote: I need to learn a "top lane" champ to play against Ryze top. I was thinking top Jarvan? Who absolutely wrecks Ryze, I need it to be ez because I'm bad. J4 is good. Also, this is what happens when Ryze doesn't bring Flash to Faker's Riven. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
1: its not really a stupid build, it might be sub optimal but i could easily boost his account past your elo playing nocturne and going madreds spirit stone every game 2: focusing on the outer level obvious things like item builds and jungle paths is exactly the type of shallow analysis that keeps most people shitty and flaming because they feel like they understand the game but don't understand why they are playing with all these terrible players. its the situationals that are most important and it comes from trial and error and analysis that leads you to make correct decisions and understanding how to snowball advantages. its the same thing as the D players on Iccup extrapolating their ranks because they watch pro games so they think they understand how starcraft works. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
And there are clear differences between junglers, even FotM junglers. Of course the top ones won't mess with one another, but Nocturne clears fast enough (even without smite) to invade a slower one while Vi can't do it because she's slow till 3. I know if I'm blue side I can reach top before Elise if we both start in the bottom side of the jungle, when I have a hunch there's going to be a gank there, etc. | ||
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Fusilero
United Kingdom50293 Posts
On May 16 2014 06:03 GrandInquisitor wrote: J4 is good. Also, this is what happens when Ryze doesn't bring Flash to Faker's Riven. Faker is the only time I like riven, he just bodies everyone with her it almost makes me miss seeing riven as a viable champion. Almost | ||
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Fildun
Netherlands4123 Posts
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On May 16 2014 06:06 Alaric wrote: Geez, Teut. I was giving examples, that's different from "everything". And there are clear differences between junglers, even FotM junglers. Of course the top ones won't mess with one another, but Nocturne clears fast enough (even without smite) to invade a slower one while Vi can't do it because she's slow till 3. I know if I'm blue side I can reach top before Elise if we both start in the bottom side of the jungle, when I have a hunch there's going to be a gank there, etc. except these details are a minor part of the game. You can use that as part of a specific strategy if you decide camping the brush top lane against elise will net you a succesful countergank often you can do that and maybe it'll net you an advantage in 10% of overall games but discrepancies like this are rarely big enough to matter and worrying too much about what the other jungler is doing is usually a bad idea in nearly all cases what you should be worrying about is how all hte lanes are currently looking and where you predict a good gank opportunity is going to be and jungling toward that area | ||
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Gahlo
United States35173 Posts
On May 16 2014 06:07 Fusilero wrote: Faker is the only time I like riven, he just bodies everyone with her it almost makes me miss seeing riven as a viable champion. Almost I hate Faker's Riven because he ruined it. | ||
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Fusilero
United Kingdom50293 Posts
Your riven tears sustain me | ||
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