EPT[Patch 3.13] Heimer Rework General Discussion - Page 6
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RagequitBM
Canada2270 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
They listed the abilities that it changed in the notes. Only affects Gragas, Malphite, and Wardens/Randuins. | ||
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LaM
United States1321 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:04 RagequitBM wrote: I'm not sure if anyone is talking about this, but did Lucian get a gigantic buff against Nasus? If his dash can now cleanse the attack speed part of wither too.. I don't think they changed how Lucian's dash works. | ||
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RagequitBM
Canada2270 Posts
Summary: Attack speed slows (IE: Nasus' Wither) were immune to cleanse or other forms of debuff removal unless attached to a movement impairing effect. Now all attack speed slows can be cleansed and are treated like movement speed slows. I thought the dash only cleansed the movement speed slow, and when they said they wanted to make all slows whether attack or movement the same I thought it would mean Lucian. Rather than changing Lucians dash, I read it as them changing attack speed slows in general. However I re-read what they were saying, and understand more clearly. | ||
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LaM
United States1321 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:07 RagequitBM wrote: Oh this part confused me Summary: Attack speed slows (IE: Nasus' Wither) were immune to cleanse or other forms of debuff removal unless attached to a movement impairing effect. Now all attack speed slows can be cleansed and are treated like movement speed slows. I thought the dash only cleansed the movement speed slow, and when they said they wanted to make all slows whether attack or movement the same I thought it would mean Lucian. Rather than changing Lucians dash, I read it as them changing attack speed slows in general. I interpreted it as only being cleanse changes but I think your interpretation is actually much closer to what they wrote (they do clearly say "other forms of debuff removal"). I still would be surprised if it affected Lucian. Although now that I look at his skill description it says slowing effects, so that could be attack slowing as well as movement slowing. Huh. I have no clue man, but I would be excited if it did. Lucian is prolly my favorite AD right now. | ||
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TheLink
Australia2725 Posts
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Ethelis
United States2400 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:04 Ketara wrote: Wither already got cleansed. They listed the abilities that it changed in the notes. Only affects Gragas, Malphite, and Wardens/Randuins. I mentioned it on an IH and i was certain i posted it in GD (i think), Lucian hard counters Nasus stupidly hard it's really sad. | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
The players should be the main attraction of the stream but instead only the casters have their twitters on screen, along with half of the screen worth of their face. I don't care about those guys, I care about the players (not really), why is the advertisement focused on those 2 guys instead of the teams and players? | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
Actually, plenty of mana-based champions are mana-restricted. On Syndra it's extremely easy to run out of mana even in the first 2 levels if you just spam your skills practically on cooldown / when the opportunity arrives. Even Cassiopeia has this issue if you use E for lasthitting and harrass with Q often. Leblanc also has large mana issues. I think the last 3 Lissandra's I've played against ran OOM very early on and she even has a mana passive. I don't think that they've removed mana management from the game at all. Darius might be a champion with whom it doesn't seem to be an issue, but even so, if you do stuff like QRW -> autos -> Q, you're oom after like 2 repetitions. He still does require mana management. There's very very few champions I can think of that actually do not require mana management. In the late game this does change somewhat, but it is still difficult staying out on the map without basing without any mana regeneration(As in, if your blue gets denied). In fact, on most mids I cannot even spam everything while having bluebuff, much less without. There's just about no mana-based champion that is able to spam every skill without concern like Riven is able to, which means that they all do require mana management. Just because you don't run OOM after 2 spells like some heroes in DotA do doesn't change this. Zed nerf was huge, in my opion. Ult shadow is a big part of his burst, it gives him a slow and it gives him the shuriken bonus dmg, which is now much easier to dodge. He practically needs to use his W instantly and it's still only going to amount to just one 50% bonus for shuriken as I the ult's one shouldn't be in range unless he ults while practically in melee. It should lower his burst damage but also gives him a possible escape method via utilizing the R shadow. I don't really like the living shadow change at all. It hurts his fluidity and most of what's fun about him. It probably won't be fast enough to dodge skillshots anymore. I'd rather have had them nerf his damage, or just make E deal 66% dmg to minions and monsters, for example. | ||
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ketchup
14521 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:25 SagaZ wrote: I figured out what bothers me about the NACL stream. The players should be the main attraction of the stream but instead only the casters have their twitters on screen, along with half of the screen worth of their face. I don't care about those guys, I care about the players (not really), why is the advertisement focused on those 2 guys instead of the teams and players? Isn't that only during champ select that they use that layout? I agree I'm not a fan of it either, but I don't think they have it during the whole game. The bigger problem is the amount of pauses that teams seem to use. Worse is that these teams don't seem to be penalized in any form for the overly long pauses. It really highlights the "amateur" aspect of it, and diminishes the quality of the games sometimes. | ||
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Leeto
United States1320 Posts
I do this because I don't have time to play full games and because it only takes 7 minutes a day to get free 162 (150+12) IP. It used to be even faster but now Riot has a 7 minute minimum in order to receive IP. Don't judge me lol | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
General Attack Speed per level reduced to 1.6 (from 3.28) To me, this makes this rework thing seem like mostly a nerf... I guess she will be based around bursts of 3 attacks and moving around otherwise, but this concept makes little to no sense on a champion without an escape. If they added a small Riven-like dash on her spell shield, it would make far more sense. There also seems to be an error in the TL version of the patch notes. Ricochet damage doesn't decrease for the secondary targets. According to the patch notes, the damage dealt to the first target and the 15th target hit is the same. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:15 TheLink wrote: I feel like everyone should be forced to read Mark Rosewaters articles on game design before they're allowed to bitch about it. Ketara said it right earlier really high ult mana costs just create stupid feel-bad moments at level 6. I think a world in which spamming spells runs you low so you only have 1 spell left is much better than a world in which spamming spells suddenly leaves you without your ult when you really need it. If thats how you feel, you should advocate for 0 Mana ults. Because, after all, that is what every energy champion has now. The problem, in reality, is that Riot's design philosophy does not allow for mana and manaless champions to live in harmony. Because that would require meaningful power curves. Just look at Shen/Renekton vs. Jax/Irelia. For this to make sense, the manaless champions should need a huge lead earlygame to have parity at, say, lvl 11, and a monstrous lead to maintain parity at 18 (like a 3 item irelia should crush a 4 item Renekton). But Riot doesn't do things like that. Hell, even look at Manamune, Athene's, and AA, they are all really good items WITHOUT the mana stats. That is the problem: A manaless champ should be crippled lategame, but thats not how LOL works. | ||
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TheLink
Australia2725 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:45 TheLink wrote: Yeah the Sivir changes work out to be a massive nerf overall. Pretty funny how incompetently that was handled but Riot'll prob fix it up a bit next patch, "Sivir should attack slowly, lets obliterate her natural attack speed" is the same retarded logic as "Ezreal W does game-breaking levels of damage, lets buff his Q to emphasise that without lowering the W in exchange". Funny thing is, she never gets played because she has shitty range and no escapes. Riot responds by just lowering her burst and making her need to be more in the fight because W isn't bursty anymore. Cool story bro. | ||
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UnKooL
Korea (South)1667 Posts
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TheLink
Australia2725 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:43 cLutZ wrote: If thats how you feel, you should advocate for 0 Mana ults. Because, after all, that is what every energy champion has now. You need to remember our goal is "create a fun, competitive and profitable game". Our goal is NOT "how can we make mana a more significant drawback". If the best choice is to remove mana then by all means do so. Basically it comes down to accidently going from 300 mana to 200 without noticing and not being able to ult sucks. Going from 100 to 0 accidently and not being able to ult doesn't suck because you should have noticed that you only had 1 spell left and you are being punished for mismanaging things that severely. | ||
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ketchup
14521 Posts
On October 30 2013 12:58 UnKooL wrote: Is the Heimer change big enough to warrant an actually reading of his patch notes and to be aware of what to do against him solo q? Yes, it is. The patch notes aren't that big as well | ||
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GhandiEAGLE
United States20754 Posts
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