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On June 23 2013 20:08 mr_tolkien wrote:
Speaking of Nunu, if you see one, there's a solution : pick Nocturne.
Your Q allows you to run faster than him and your W counters his only offensive spell 1v1. He can't counter jungle you without risking his life, and even with a level disadvantage you'll win 1v1.
Lee is the best solution to Nunu. Unpredictable jungle paths, very good kit to peel off nunu, his R can fuck up Nunu's R etc.
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On June 23 2013 20:18 Scip wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 05:59 KissBlade wrote:
Well Scip (And Slayer if you got some tips), I will tell you I flat out would like more tips on how to jungle at a higher level.
I have some major issues in understanding when is a lane is optimal for ganking. (For example, what should I expect in terms of how the lane waves look)
I also don't think I have optimal gank pathing. I know the standard route of going through enemy jungle, etc but that's it really. Lane ganks seem very 50/50 and mid seems nigh impossible half the time.
I also fall behind in farm compared to better junglers as I feel I roam entirely too much and tax way too little. I often buff control/objective control far better than my opponent (usually 1-2 level adv vs enemy jungler early mid) but don't take enough advantage of it IMO.
Also I have no idea what to do when the game feels "neutral" such as lanes are even, etc. I feel like I should be predicting ganks to counter gank more while I'm farming but I either get too low in my jungle while I farm or I run OOM.
My main junglers are Eve and J4. I feel more confident with Eve but I have better results with J4 since I just feel his role suits more solo q jungler style for some reason. (Tanky intiator who can switch to dueling without issues). lane works like this: one side has more creeps = the lane will push for that side (how much depends on how laners play it though) same amount of creeps but they are closer to one side = the side that it is close to will push in 2-3 waves (reinforcements arrive faster) IF neither champion pushes the lane same amount of creeps in the middle of the lane = you don't know If you fall behind, it's probably not due to not taxing enough, but not farming enough. I gave an advice on EU LP once, that if you want to get platinum, you just don't gank before lvl6, and that is especially true for Eve, whose ganks before 6 are really quite mediocre. What I'd reccomend doing is just not ganking before 6 for a few games, just clearing golems-wraiths-wolves over and over, maybe holding a lane that dies or really going to help if someone gets dived and you are nearby by a chance. That is your baseline, how you play if no opportunities come up, and then you can try to look for opportunities. That is a lot harder to do, naturally. Not much better than a fortune cookie answer, I know, but it's hard to just do a short guide on this :3
That helps a lot tbh. Thanks. In hindsight that explains why I always felt very farmed as Nocturne since I tend to farm a lot more pre 6 than Eve/J4 who I tend to roam till my red runs out. I also feel I should get a better read of when "all in's" are about to occur in a lane. I try to sniff them out sometimes or when I think a lane is getting baited really hard and I need to stand by just in case. Sometimes it works but other times I feel like I'm wasting a massive amount of time/presence.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
You also steal xp from your laner doing that
Probably better to watch replays/progames and see when enemy laners allin and try to reason out why they did that, then you can watch out for similiar situations.
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On June 23 2013 20:38 Scip wrote:
You also steal xp from your laner doing that
Probably better to watch replays/progames and see when enemy laners allin and try to reason out why they did that, then you can watch out for similiar situations.
Good point. Thanks again. =)
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What do you guys think about starting red buff as a jungler and giving this red buff to your top laner or ad carry depending on which side you are on? I reckon this would help the lane tremendously while setting you a bit behind but could this be worth it (mostly assuming you have a cc jungler such as Sejuani or Nautilus)?
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The worse your mmr is the easier is to get early ganks. I think not ganking before 6 is a bad idea, however, trying to force ganks pre 6 is usually bad. There are lots of situations where a guy isnt paying attention and goes agressive without wards and its an easy kill. However if you are too stubborn and try to gank when its not that clear thats when you get counter ganked, or your laner wasts his cds or you do a bad dive or you camp a brush and waste time etc.
After 6, you and laners have ults and its ok to plan for ganks then sometimes, but generally playing reactively is more than enough to get fed anyway
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Pootie too good!4331 Posts
On June 23 2013 21:06 Slayer91 wrote:
The worse your mmr is the easier is to get early ganks. I think not ganking before 6 is a bad idea, however, trying to force ganks pre 6 is usually bad. There are lots of situations where a guy isnt paying attention and goes agressive without wards and its an easy kill. However if you are too stubborn and try to gank when its not that clear thats when you get counter ganked, or your laner wasts his cds or you do a bad dive or you camp a brush and waste time etc.
After 6, you and laners have ults and its ok to plan for ganks then sometimes, but generally playing reactively is more than enough to get fed anyway
Asking your lanes to watch where the enemy warded helps a lot as well.
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Korea (South)11232 Posts
That Sejuani skin is really dope
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On June 23 2013 21:30 JonGalt wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 21:06 Slayer91 wrote:
The worse your mmr is the easier is to get early ganks. I think not ganking before 6 is a bad idea, however, trying to force ganks pre 6 is usually bad. There are lots of situations where a guy isnt paying attention and goes agressive without wards and its an easy kill. However if you are too stubborn and try to gank when its not that clear thats when you get counter ganked, or your laner wasts his cds or you do a bad dive or you camp a brush and waste time etc.
After 6, you and laners have ults and its ok to plan for ganks then sometimes, but generally playing reactively is more than enough to get fed anyway Asking your lanes to watch where the enemy warded helps a lot as well.
its usually pretty obvious and you can watch yourself
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Pootie too good!4331 Posts
www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=418428
For those of you who don't venture near the SC2 section, FBH streamed and says he will stream again. Wish I could watch 
I really miss the Morgana and Kararina comps that Fear used to run. I feel like Morgana could do well in the current meta. She's got good safe wave clear, black shield is awesome, make the plays with best bindings NA, and an ult that makes everyone spaz out and forget what good positioning means.
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Diamond prox will definitely start playing Sej in LCS with that skin...
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Her waveclear is shit against moving waves, so even though she can kill the wave fast once it reaches the tower, she has virtually no way of preventing that from happening in the first place against hard-shovers. It also tends to makes it pretty impossible for her to farm in the midgame, because once teams group up unless she goes to the side most champs will farm the waves before she can kill it (since she doesn't have burst like Annie or Lux for example). Less of a problem in arranged play, but she'll still lack farm if you need to counter a push/siege from the enemy team.
She's hugely ult-reliant while not having a non-Flash reliable way of engaging herself and a bunch of champs (even more so amongst the popular ones) having dashes and mobility spells to get out of it, especially if she uses Zhonya's. Considering how good a teamfighting asset it can be (and the long-ish cooldown) you can't really expand it on a single person the way Xerath/Lux/Ahri would, and removing her shield, the rest of her kit works in a rather awkward way (W is basically useless if you don't it a Q because it's periodic AoE damage: you'll get 1, maybe 2 ticks if you're lucky, while Q itself has a significant wind-up time that makes it rather easy to avoid if she casts in vision).
(The spells are still very powerful to make up for it, with high damage, good range and good utility (up to 3s root or 40 MR AoE reduction), it's just that they're unreliable and more interdependant compared to, say, Lux, Gragas, etc.)
Edit: which skin are you all talking about? @_@
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Why did you guys have to have the huge discussion of new jungle strategies, TROLLS, and why I am an evil villain who led the proletariat masses to overthrow the Diamond bourgeois while I was busy moving and unable to post?
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On June 23 2013 20:36 KissBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 20:18 Scip wrote:On June 23 2013 05:59 KissBlade wrote:
Well Scip (And Slayer if you got some tips), I will tell you I flat out would like more tips on how to jungle at a higher level.
I have some major issues in understanding when is a lane is optimal for ganking. (For example, what should I expect in terms of how the lane waves look)
I also don't think I have optimal gank pathing. I know the standard route of going through enemy jungle, etc but that's it really. Lane ganks seem very 50/50 and mid seems nigh impossible half the time.
I also fall behind in farm compared to better junglers as I feel I roam entirely too much and tax way too little. I often buff control/objective control far better than my opponent (usually 1-2 level adv vs enemy jungler early mid) but don't take enough advantage of it IMO.
Also I have no idea what to do when the game feels "neutral" such as lanes are even, etc. I feel like I should be predicting ganks to counter gank more while I'm farming but I either get too low in my jungle while I farm or I run OOM.
My main junglers are Eve and J4. I feel more confident with Eve but I have better results with J4 since I just feel his role suits more solo q jungler style for some reason. (Tanky intiator who can switch to dueling without issues). lane works like this: one side has more creeps = the lane will push for that side (how much depends on how laners play it though) same amount of creeps but they are closer to one side = the side that it is close to will push in 2-3 waves (reinforcements arrive faster) IF neither champion pushes the lane same amount of creeps in the middle of the lane = you don't know If you fall behind, it's probably not due to not taxing enough, but not farming enough. I gave an advice on EU LP once, that if you want to get platinum, you just don't gank before lvl6, and that is especially true for Eve, whose ganks before 6 are really quite mediocre. What I'd reccomend doing is just not ganking before 6 for a few games, just clearing golems-wraiths-wolves over and over, maybe holding a lane that dies or really going to help if someone gets dived and you are nearby by a chance. That is your baseline, how you play if no opportunities come up, and then you can try to look for opportunities. That is a lot harder to do, naturally. Not much better than a fortune cookie answer, I know, but it's hard to just do a short guide on this :3 That helps a lot tbh. Thanks. In hindsight that explains why I always felt very farmed as Nocturne since I tend to farm a lot more pre 6 than Eve/J4 who I tend to roam till my red runs out. I also feel I should get a better read of when "all in's" are about to occur in a lane. I try to sniff them out sometimes or when I think a lane is getting baited really hard and I need to stand by just in case. Sometimes it works but other times I feel like I'm wasting a massive amount of time/presence.
When I jungle I try to look at the lanes from the enemies point of view and if I see one and think "If I was on the other team I would definitely gank that lane" then there is a good chance that the enemy jungler has seen it to which means you can go and prepare for a counter gank.
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On June 23 2013 22:14 Seuss wrote:
Why did you guys have to have the huge discussion of new jungle strategies, TROLLS, and why I am an evil villain who led the proletariat masses to overthrow the Diamond bourgeois while I was busy moving and unable to post?
So you could further assert your evil aura with the use of necromancy, or something along those lines, probably. 
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On June 23 2013 22:06 Alaric wrote:
Edit: which skin are you all talking about? @_@
Announced at the CIS Tournament in Moscow as celebration for the start of the Russian server
+ Show Spoiler +
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Can someone tell me why so many people think BORK is a good item on everyone? I've seen things like BORK on MF, Graves etc. is there a special reasoning behind this or is it just about as dumb as I think it is lol.
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On June 23 2013 22:26 discator wrote:
Can someone tell me why so many people think BORK is a good item on everyone? I've seen things like BORK on MF, Graves etc. is there a special reasoning behind this or is it just about as dumb as I think it is lol.
this item is just OP for lane phase
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On June 23 2013 12:13 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 11:42 onlywonderboy wrote:On June 23 2013 11:27 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
look u guys summoned bly! It wasn't even to shut down someone's misguided opinions on the game, that's the really astounding part. Well it was to shut down someone's misguided opinions about himself, so sort of the same thing.
Ya but in the end it strengthens my point, so I'm happy to have him clear up his disappearance from the forum and my opinion of why he had done so.
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Ocelote definetly knows how to play the game outside the game.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/b5Mr04e.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BjFTyhwJXWE/Ucbl1J33M1I/AAAAAAAAFB4/C_BiXqOIjB0/s1600/sejuani_bearcavalry.jpg)
