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On February 16 2013 07:37 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 07:32 Purge wrote:On February 16 2013 03:05 Seuss wrote:On February 16 2013 01:53 Purge wrote:On February 15 2013 22:03 barbsq wrote:On February 15 2013 18:22 RagequitBM wrote:
I wish there was a Day[9]-esque person for League. Improving feels so arbitrary to me. Like I know I'm a better player than I used to be, because I used to get out-laned regularly, but now I can win lane against almost any below Silver I ADC. However, I'm not sure why I'm better.
My teamfighting is still iffy too. I'll plug monte's series on the off chance he hasn't seen this post ;o https://www.youtube.com/user/MontegomeryLoLimo, monte is well on his way to becoming the day9 of LoL. His mondays with monte series has already helped me a ton. He literally comes off as a Day9 league clone. There can only be 1. Ill try and watch him som'more though. I am Monte. I find the "Day[9] league clone" criticism interesting because it makes me wonder what, exactly, people really want. On the one hand you have people clamoring for a "Day[9]-esque person for League." On the other hand whoever tries fill that role is written off as a "clone". As far as I can tell the only way everyone would be satisfied is if Day[9] himself switched to League. I'm not above criticism, I just find this one in particular to be odd. Wow. 0.o. What I meant by that is that you honestly sound very much like Day9, from sort of the way you talk (obviously what you talk about as well in genre), to your charm. Its very uncanny. Also, Id like to make the point that I only watched the first like 5 mins of your most recent video, so It was literally a first impression (of which I have been incorrect before) - which is why I said Id watch more. I also had been awake for 20+ Hrs @ the time, but that is also no reason to come off as a bit of a douche. Just keep doing what you do. On a completely seperate note, once Ive dealt with a few things (midterms) and finished watching through your videos, Id love to help the community by doing something that you might already be doing (role analysis, champion picking, practice advice and the like). That being said Id have alot to do to make it work. some pointers. The biggest thing you can do to help, and most misunderstood aspect of lol is how to actually play out a game. The biggest difference between people who are terrible and people who are just bad is understanding what needs to be done at various stages of the game, how to maximize opportunity in mid-late game, and how to actually end a game. People are very caught up in laning, which is where a lot of the Elo hell thing comes from: "I go 4-0 in my lane and still lose" etc. In all honesty, if you go 4-0 and lose the game you are WORSE than the dude who you killed 4 times and still managed to win the game. Its just most people get tied viscerally in that 4-0 and dont understand how the game actually works. Thats why I want to wait for replays to come out so I can gather a bunch of games where I dont do well or one of my teammates doesnt but we still win to demonstrate HOW the game needs to be played.
I think you are correct. People take their lane advantages and squander them because they play mid-game incorrectly. LoL is only a twitchy game during laning and teamfights. Outside of this, there are very little technical requirements. Midgame should be about patient decision making that everyone should be able to do. Midgame throws mostly boil down to impatience. Low-level players take these downtimes and try to make things happen because they're impatient. By the time late-game comes, people are afraid enough of each other's teams that they are trained to be more patient. You still get random impatient scrubs that leeroy's into unwarded territory at all stages of the game though.
The game can be won at mid-game onward purely by patient decision making. Push this lane, defend that lane, dragon, gank. Not: Dive, all mid, or worst: chase and overextend low hp characters. Kills can always be made up for with patience and opportunity. CS and dead towers cannot.
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On February 16 2013 07:09 Mensol wrote:
i would like to see Afro skins on all champions.
Afro Darius, TOO much SWAG.
Afro Samurai Yi?
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On February 16 2013 07:33 Koenig99 wrote:
Played a few games on PBE as Quinn. She's looking like a much better top laner than bottom, her blind and passive will allow her to abuse certain matchups top, but her range is too short for bottom lane.
Her passives and abilities are pretty badass. This might be the first ADC I actually like.
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On February 16 2013 07:56 willoc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 07:09 Mensol wrote:
i would like to see Afro skins on all champions.
Afro Darius, TOO much SWAG. Afro Samurai Yi?
Pfft, Afro Fate.
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On February 16 2013 07:37 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 07:32 Purge wrote:On February 16 2013 03:05 Seuss wrote:On February 16 2013 01:53 Purge wrote:On February 15 2013 22:03 barbsq wrote:On February 15 2013 18:22 RagequitBM wrote:
I wish there was a Day[9]-esque person for League. Improving feels so arbitrary to me. Like I know I'm a better player than I used to be, because I used to get out-laned regularly, but now I can win lane against almost any below Silver I ADC. However, I'm not sure why I'm better.
My teamfighting is still iffy too. I'll plug monte's series on the off chance he hasn't seen this post ;o https://www.youtube.com/user/MontegomeryLoLimo, monte is well on his way to becoming the day9 of LoL. His mondays with monte series has already helped me a ton. He literally comes off as a Day9 league clone. There can only be 1. Ill try and watch him som'more though. I am Monte. I find the "Day[9] league clone" criticism interesting because it makes me wonder what, exactly, people really want. On the one hand you have people clamoring for a "Day[9]-esque person for League." On the other hand whoever tries fill that role is written off as a "clone". As far as I can tell the only way everyone would be satisfied is if Day[9] himself switched to League. I'm not above criticism, I just find this one in particular to be odd. Wow. 0.o. What I meant by that is that you honestly sound very much like Day9, from sort of the way you talk (obviously what you talk about as well in genre), to your charm. Its very uncanny. Also, Id like to make the point that I only watched the first like 5 mins of your most recent video, so It was literally a first impression (of which I have been incorrect before) - which is why I said Id watch more. I also had been awake for 20+ Hrs @ the time, but that is also no reason to come off as a bit of a douche. Just keep doing what you do. On a completely seperate note, once Ive dealt with a few things (midterms) and finished watching through your videos, Id love to help the community by doing something that you might already be doing (role analysis, champion picking, practice advice and the like). That being said Id have alot to do to make it work. some pointers. The biggest thing you can do to help, and most misunderstood aspect of lol is how to actually play out a game. The biggest difference between people who are terrible and people who are just bad is understanding what needs to be done at various stages of the game, how to maximize opportunity in mid-late game, and how to actually end a game. People are very caught up in laning, which is where a lot of the Elo hell thing comes from: "I go 4-0 in my lane and still lose" etc. In all honesty, if you go 4-0 and lose the game you are WORSE than the dude who you killed 4 times and still managed to win the game. Its just most people get tied viscerally in that 4-0 and dont understand how the game actually works. Thats why I want to wait for replays to come out so I can gather a bunch of games where I dont do well or one of my teammates doesnt but we still win to demonstrate HOW the game needs to be played.
Good points. Thats a probably a very big part of it that I didnt consider.
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On February 16 2013 07:37 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 07:32 Purge wrote:On February 16 2013 03:05 Seuss wrote:On February 16 2013 01:53 Purge wrote:On February 15 2013 22:03 barbsq wrote:On February 15 2013 18:22 RagequitBM wrote:
I wish there was a Day[9]-esque person for League. Improving feels so arbitrary to me. Like I know I'm a better player than I used to be, because I used to get out-laned regularly, but now I can win lane against almost any below Silver I ADC. However, I'm not sure why I'm better.
My teamfighting is still iffy too. I'll plug monte's series on the off chance he hasn't seen this post ;o https://www.youtube.com/user/MontegomeryLoLimo, monte is well on his way to becoming the day9 of LoL. His mondays with monte series has already helped me a ton. He literally comes off as a Day9 league clone. There can only be 1. Ill try and watch him som'more though. I am Monte. I find the "Day[9] league clone" criticism interesting because it makes me wonder what, exactly, people really want. On the one hand you have people clamoring for a "Day[9]-esque person for League." On the other hand whoever tries fill that role is written off as a "clone". As far as I can tell the only way everyone would be satisfied is if Day[9] himself switched to League. I'm not above criticism, I just find this one in particular to be odd. Wow. 0.o. What I meant by that is that you honestly sound very much like Day9, from sort of the way you talk (obviously what you talk about as well in genre), to your charm. Its very uncanny. Also, Id like to make the point that I only watched the first like 5 mins of your most recent video, so It was literally a first impression (of which I have been incorrect before) - which is why I said Id watch more. I also had been awake for 20+ Hrs @ the time, but that is also no reason to come off as a bit of a douche. Just keep doing what you do. On a completely seperate note, once Ive dealt with a few things (midterms) and finished watching through your videos, Id love to help the community by doing something that you might already be doing (role analysis, champion picking, practice advice and the like). That being said Id have alot to do to make it work. some pointers. "I go 4-0 in my lane and still lose" etc. In all honesty, if you go 4-0 and lose the game you are WORSE than the dude who you killed 4 times and still managed to win the game. Its just most people get tied viscerally in that 4-0 and dont understand how the game actually works.
I think this is half true. It's possible that you could simply be better at laning than the guy you're against and the guy you're against has a better team. Malphite who goes 0-4 in lane can still do his job fine in midgame but there are games that 4-0 Pantheon can't carry if his team doesn't help with objectives and/or does stupid shit. Midgame is a lot more team reliant than your laning phase.
It's possible to be better at this game and have a better understanding of the game than your lane opponent but not be as much of a team player or get a team of dudes who doesn't give a shit about helping you (or is oblivious to midgame/lategame objectives).
I think that league is still too young to determine whether being a team player, game knowledge, or laning skill is most important. I can guarantee you that there are pro teams that have players who are great laners but who have shit game knowledge as well as players who have good game sense but are shit laners. In a lot of ways I'd consider Doublelift to be a player who has an amazing lane phase but a very mediocre game sense and I'd personally consider someone like Reginald to have a bad lane phase but a pretty decent amount of game knowledge (imo his shot calling is the biggest reason TSM was strong in S2). And while I'm using NA examples because I've seen more NA players I'm 100% certain that there are pro players with the same skillsets in Korea, China, and EU.
I don't think it's necessarily a problem to have someone who's great at laning but bad at midgame so long as they're willing to listen to the player or players who have great game knowledge. The problem is that in solo queue you are likely to get a very unbalanced team (and play against an unbalanced team). I think it's fair to say that in solo queue being a better laner is superior to having a great understanding of the game since I'd argue that most solo queue games are actually won in lane phase (frankly a lot of pro games are still won in lane phase to this day too).
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It's usually not a case of picking a hero that can't do well later (said heroes dont really exist if you play them right, at least not to a huge extent) against someone who can without farm, more that your bot or mid or jungle might be just as behind or more (its worse with bto since its 2 ppl feeding) and it's up to you to use your advantage to make up the gap and if you can't do that then you don't deserve to win the game. Winning those types of games might bring your win % up 10 or 20% which means you're too good for that elo if you can maintain that performance all the time.
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On February 16 2013 08:19 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 07:37 Two_DoWn wrote:On February 16 2013 07:32 Purge wrote:On February 16 2013 03:05 Seuss wrote:On February 16 2013 01:53 Purge wrote:On February 15 2013 22:03 barbsq wrote:On February 15 2013 18:22 RagequitBM wrote:
I wish there was a Day[9]-esque person for League. Improving feels so arbitrary to me. Like I know I'm a better player than I used to be, because I used to get out-laned regularly, but now I can win lane against almost any below Silver I ADC. However, I'm not sure why I'm better.
My teamfighting is still iffy too. I'll plug monte's series on the off chance he hasn't seen this post ;o https://www.youtube.com/user/MontegomeryLoLimo, monte is well on his way to becoming the day9 of LoL. His mondays with monte series has already helped me a ton. He literally comes off as a Day9 league clone. There can only be 1. Ill try and watch him som'more though. I am Monte. I find the "Day[9] league clone" criticism interesting because it makes me wonder what, exactly, people really want. On the one hand you have people clamoring for a "Day[9]-esque person for League." On the other hand whoever tries fill that role is written off as a "clone". As far as I can tell the only way everyone would be satisfied is if Day[9] himself switched to League. I'm not above criticism, I just find this one in particular to be odd. Wow. 0.o. What I meant by that is that you honestly sound very much like Day9, from sort of the way you talk (obviously what you talk about as well in genre), to your charm. Its very uncanny. Also, Id like to make the point that I only watched the first like 5 mins of your most recent video, so It was literally a first impression (of which I have been incorrect before) - which is why I said Id watch more. I also had been awake for 20+ Hrs @ the time, but that is also no reason to come off as a bit of a douche. Just keep doing what you do. On a completely seperate note, once Ive dealt with a few things (midterms) and finished watching through your videos, Id love to help the community by doing something that you might already be doing (role analysis, champion picking, practice advice and the like). That being said Id have alot to do to make it work. some pointers. "I go 4-0 in my lane and still lose" etc. In all honesty, if you go 4-0 and lose the game you are WORSE than the dude who you killed 4 times and still managed to win the game. Its just most people get tied viscerally in that 4-0 and dont understand how the game actually works. I think this is half true. It's possible that you could simply be better at laning than the guy you're against and the guy you're against has a better team. Malphite who goes 0-4 in lane can still do his job fine in midgame but there are games that 4-0 Pantheon can't carry if his team doesn't help with objectives and/or does stupid shit. Midgame is a lot more team reliant than your laning phase. It's possible to be better at this game and have a better understanding of the game than your lane opponent but not be as much of a team player or get a team of dudes who doesn't give a shit about helping you (or is oblivious to midgame/lategame objectives). I think that league is still too young to determine whether being a team player, game knowledge, or laning skill is most important. I can guarantee you that there are pro teams that have players who are great laners but who have shit game knowledge as well as players who have good game sense but are shit laners. In a lot of ways I'd consider Doublelift to be a player who has an amazing lane phase but a very mediocre game sense and I'd personally consider someone like Reginald to have a bad lane phase but a pretty decent amount of game knowledge (imo his shot calling is the biggest reason TSM was strong in S2). And while I'm using NA examples because I've seen more NA players I'm 100% certain that there are pro players with the same skillsets in Korea, China, and EU. I don't think it's necessarily a problem to have someone who's great at laning but bad at midgame so long as they're willing to listen to the player or players who have great game knowledge. The problem is that in solo queue you are likely to get a very unbalanced team (and play against an unbalanced team). I think it's fair to say that in solo queue being a better laner is superior to having a great understanding of the game since I'd argue that most solo queue games are actually won in lane phase (frankly a lot of pro games are still won in lane phase to this day too).
I agree that getting an advantage through laning is priority to get in solo Q(because laning is the first phase), but what you do with it is different for each roles. For example bot lane - if you got 4/0, then I think you should keep smashing your lane into the ground while denying them and maximize your cs, then take the tower when its convienent. If you are playing midlane though, being 4/0 means that you should be pushing the wave to turret, getting boots 2 and roaming to force teamfights/counterganks/objectives. A 4/0 jungler can invade and ambush, and can force ganks even with the threat of counterganks. A 4/0 top lane should take turret immediately then either splitpush nonstop and force someone to deal with them (nidalee, singed) or force midgame teamfights by going b (then going to drag) or roaming.
If you can do stuff like that reliably, then your elo will go up if you just midgame push dragon -> mid to inhib -> bot to inhib->baron -> mid inhib -> top to inhib-> bot inhib->nexus because by then you are so far ahead that you can just push and they cant stop you. But getting that midgame advantage is key in solo Q methinks.
Any other opinions?
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United States23745 Posts
Anyone tried Quinn out on the PBE yet? Played a few custom games and liked her kit well enough. Not sure what people are going to max first. Tried Q but wasn't that impressed, liked maxing W for the bonus attack speed on the Vulnerability procs. Procing Vulnerability and then E-ing in for a second proc does a pretty good amount of burst. Not sure how to use her ult effectively without exposing myself to too much danger though.
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People just don't understand obectives. You see plays where you ace and there are 3 open turrets and everyone backs to buy, top's opponent will leave to do dragon and they will sit up there and practice their last hitting. Lategame people refuse to group, everyone goes to clear the 12 cs at bot lane. Midgame three people will go to kill someone overextending top over taking t2mid. Junglers will ignore someone pushing a tower down in favor of doing wraiths.
I had a normal this morning where we ended up against a premade who sent 4 players mid vs me on Cass. I maxed Q and held the tower solo for 17 minutes while dodging everything, I couldn't even chat I was so busy. When I finally have to let the tower go i look up and realize that both their top and bottom towers are still up.
Its a fundamental lack of understanding of the objective of the game. Bad players are completely focused on killing the enemy team as if that were the win condition of the game.
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On February 16 2013 09:09 sob3k wrote:
People just don't understand obectives. You see plays where you ace and there are 3 open turrets and everyone backs to buy, top's opponent will leave to do dragon and they will sit up there and practice their last hitting. Lategame people refuse to group, everyone goes to clear the 12 cs at bot lane. Midgame three people will go to kill someone overextending top over taking t2mid. Junglers will ignore someone pushing a tower down in favor of doing wraiths.
I had a normal this morning where we ended up against a premade who sent 4 players mid vs me on Cass. I maxed Q and held the tower solo for 17 minutes while dodging everything, I couldn't even chat I was so busy. When I finally have to let the tower go i look up and realize that both their top and bottom towers are still up.
Its a fundamental lack of understanding of the objective of the game. Bad players are completely focused on killing the enemy team as if that were the win condition of the game.
This makes me want to let gp put a bullet in my brain half the time. The complete and total lack of ability for people to complete objectives boggles my mind. Not to mention the number of 40 minute dragons that have cost me the game. I don't know why, but when its super late and we're pushing for the win people love to take dragon and die on it/get the rest of their team killed while going there or give up baron trying for it. When the 190gold isn't relevant or wont be spent dont go after the damn thing.
People also need to understand their choice of champion a lot better as well. Some Champs are just easier to lane on, but then offer very little effect on the late game. Going 4-2 in lane on Garen against a malphite who goes 2-4 doesn't really mean you won your lane because malphite is going to be much more impactful on teamfights (all things being equal). It's the same with junglers like Warwick, when you pick him you put an immense amount of pressure on the rest of your team as the other team simply wont be afraid of getting ganked. Running through the jungle and killing the creeps in it is really easy on warwick, you can do it with no runes/masteries but at the same time you're not helping your team at all if that's what you're doing.
Then there's the list of champions you can build completely the wrong items on and still do okay for most of the game, but then fail horribly at teamfights. Champions like Darius and Jax could roll dice to buy their items and still be reasonably effective, but it doesn't mean you're doing it right.
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The 2nd phase of understanding warding is the one that most people miss and fail in the midgame. What I mean is, everybody starts out bad and doesn't ward. They get better eventually and realize the importance of warding to avoid getting ganked and occasionally warding enemy's buffs + dragon/baron. They do this to look for opportunities.
The next evolution is where people fall off. It becomes about warding to create your own plays. You begin to ward their jungle aggressively, knowing that the minute you see their 2 of them up top and 1 recently B you can get a free dragon. You begin warding and laying traps in certain areas to catch opponents unaware and then take baron/dragon/tower/whatever. People who fail at this simply fall into the mindset in the midgame of simply hoping for a 5v5 teamfight (or catching somebody stupidly) and then take objectives off of a won teamfight. Any bronze player knows they can take objectives if you ace the enemy team and too often players think that's the only way to move the midgame forward, by forcing a 5v5 fight.
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Do people like the Warring Kingdoms Xin skin? I am considering buying it looking for opinions
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On February 16 2013 10:08 Bladeorade wrote:
Do people like the Warring Kingdoms Xin skin? I am considering buying it looking for opinions
I think it looks really good, I really like it. I got the Jarvan one myself.
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On February 16 2013 10:08 Bladeorade wrote:
Do people like the Warring Kingdoms Xin skin? I am considering buying it looking for opinions
I like it better than Museum Artifact Winged Hussar Xin
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On February 16 2013 10:08 Bladeorade wrote:
Do people like the Warring Kingdoms Xin skin? I am considering buying it looking for opinions
Eh, I think it's okay. Random tornados and lightning effects on it. but the model is nice. I think I still like Winged Hussar most.
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On February 16 2013 10:16 xes wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 10:08 Bladeorade wrote:
Do people like the Warring Kingdoms Xin skin? I am considering buying it looking for opinions I like it better than Museum Artifact Winged Hussar Xin
The story behind the winged hussars makes the skin so much cooler then it looks.
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frommaplestreet just got a pentakill v FXO in r5s as AD kennen
BotRK rush into PD LW BT
i'm a convert
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On February 16 2013 11:00 gtrsrs wrote:
frommaplestreet just got a pentakill v FXO in r5s as AD kennen
BotRK rush into PD LW BT
i'm a convert
its strong for sure, just cant let it get to super late
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On February 16 2013 11:02 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 11:00 gtrsrs wrote:
frommaplestreet just got a pentakill v FXO in r5s as AD kennen
BotRK rush into PD LW BT
i'm a convert its strong for sure, just cant let it get to super late
http://imgur.com/bXgCLBf
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EPT
