• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:25
CEST 20:25
KST 03:25
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon100Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?179Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9
StarCraft 2
General
SC4ALL II: StarCraft 2 Player Announcement 8/8 Yamato Cup Series StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Has online-only competition during the pandemic changed your enjoyment of pro SC2?
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 SC2 AI Tournament 2026 Fall KSL Week #92
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 542 The Ascended Mutation # 541 Binary Choice
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery! Syncronization issues and can't find games Remastered crash fix suggestions BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro16 Group D [Megathread] Daily Proleagues The Casual Games of the Week Thread Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation Diablo IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Post Your Watch!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Virtual Romance, Real-Life C…
TrAiDoS
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8445 users

[Patch 1.0.0.152: Preseason 3] General Discussion - Page 60

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 58 59 60 61 62 212 Next
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
December 06 2012 05:14 GMT
#1181
who should win the rengar-teemo matchup?
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:15 GMT
#1182
On December 06 2012 13:22 Alaric wrote:
The order is the same for MPen.


Thanks That means that abyssal is still calculated before void staff then, good to know.

So, damage wise, both Voidstaff/HG/sorcs and Abyssal/HG/sorcs deal true damage at (or below) ~65 MR. Anything above that, void staff will come out ahead of abyssal.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
December 06 2012 05:18 GMT
#1183
On December 06 2012 13:24 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 13:14 cLutZ wrote:
Brutalizer upgrades being not terrible is dumb. It was already very good and the only thing keeping it down was ghostblade being MEH and it not being that relevant lategame.

I'd say Guise->Liandry's is a much bigger problem case than Bruta.


The problem is the same: Excellent Early-Midgame items should not have Good-Excellent lategame items.

On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


Rengar should not have a heal. No manaless champion should.
Freeeeeeedom
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
December 06 2012 05:20 GMT
#1184
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Pinith
Profile Joined September 2010
651 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 05:23:02
December 06 2012 05:22 GMT
#1185
On December 06 2012 14:00 Telegnosis wrote:
I'm so confused right now, I just watched Hotshot build more sensible items than Doublelift. Also Jiji won mid lane.


Jiji gets underrated about as much as scarra gets overrated. They're both top mid players in NA, and not up to the level of top EU or Asian mids. Jiji just has a lot more televised games against Asian mids where he loses.
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:23 GMT
#1186
You can get both Muramana and Seraphs Embrace btw, the "only" problem is stacking one tear, upgrading it, then buying another tear and get that to max stack ;D Probably not useful in anything that resembles a real game, but still pretty cool to test out on Ryze. 4k+ mana and those passives is so broken.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 05:25:17
December 06 2012 05:24 GMT
#1187
On December 06 2012 14:18 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 13:24 TheYango wrote:
On December 06 2012 13:14 cLutZ wrote:
Brutalizer upgrades being not terrible is dumb. It was already very good and the only thing keeping it down was ghostblade being MEH and it not being that relevant lategame.

I'd say Guise->Liandry's is a much bigger problem case than Bruta.


The problem is the same: Excellent Early-Midgame items should not have Good-Excellent lategame items.

Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


Rengar should not have a heal. No manaless champion should.

In that case I think they should tone down the effectiveness of Guise and Bruta then. Personally I'm not a fan of the dead end builds.

Edit: Totally agree about Rengar haha.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
chalice
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1945 Posts
December 06 2012 05:26 GMT
#1188
so disappointed, liandry's doesn't proc on the extra damage from either naut's passive or his W shield , could have been amazing with the movement impaired double damage.
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 06 2012 05:26 GMT
#1189
On December 06 2012 14:20 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.

I think rengar's w problem is similar to rivens. W was the highest dps, and best utility. They had to move rivens stuff around. Rengar's w is his biggest damage and wave clear and a heal. They need to nerf something so you can't just level the obvious skill.

They've removed heals from champions before (remember ez?).
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:31 GMT
#1190
On December 06 2012 14:26 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:20 Seuss wrote:
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.

I think rengar's w problem is similar to rivens. W was the highest dps, and best utility. They had to move rivens stuff around. Rengar's w is his biggest damage and wave clear and a heal. They need to nerf something so you can't just level the obvious skill.

They've removed heals from champions before (remember ez?).


Wow, just googled that, how far back did they remove his heal? :O
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1191
Twin Shadows Taric sup?

Always stun, never not stun.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1192
At one point in time, ezreal had the best heal in the game. Highest ap ratio.
thenexusp
Profile Joined May 2009
United States3721 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1193
ez's W used to be this super elegant, somewhat whacky thing. It did to your allies exactly the opposite of what it did to enemies: It damaged enemies and lowered their attack speed, and healed allies and increased their attack speed.

Now it's this really weird thing that damages enemies and increases allies' attack speed.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
December 06 2012 05:36 GMT
#1194
I don't think the heal is the problem with Rengar, I think it's Savagery.

He can do such crazy damage while building absolutely no damage items. He can take down towers I think possibly faster than any other champion in the game.

Rengar can be really sustainy if he builds tank items and Spirit Visage, but a lot of champions can do that, and that's fine really. The issue is that he can do that and still kill people.

His ult also gives him a magical free escape if he decides to split push, but if he wasn't doing such crazy damage to towers that wouldn't be so big a deal, and it's his ult that makes his jungling so cool.

I think Savagery is the issue.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
December 06 2012 05:42 GMT
#1195
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
December 06 2012 05:47 GMT
#1196
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
December 06 2012 05:49 GMT
#1197
On December 06 2012 14:47 MooMooMugi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir

Just recently started looking at base stats a lot more, and i don't get why she has to be the best in every trade oriented base stat, her kit ALREADY does that for her. hell even her AS gain is top 5.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
December 06 2012 05:49 GMT
#1198
On December 06 2012 14:36 Ketara wrote:
I don't think the heal is the problem with Rengar, I think it's Savagery.

He can do such crazy damage while building absolutely no damage items. He can take down towers I think possibly faster than any other champion in the game.

Rengar can be really sustainy if he builds tank items and Spirit Visage, but a lot of champions can do that, and that's fine really. The issue is that he can do that and still kill people.

His ult also gives him a magical free escape if he decides to split push, but if he wasn't doing such crazy damage to towers that wouldn't be so big a deal, and it's his ult that makes his jungling so cool.

I think Savagery is the issue.

A lot of other champions build sustain, but they don't get a 15% total health burst heal haha, but yeah, it all works in conjunction. He can heal for that absurd amount and do tons of damage. It's his total kit that makes him too strong.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
December 06 2012 05:51 GMT
#1199
her base regen used to be a lot higher, they nerfed it by like 30% in the Jan 2012 "riven nerfs"
Carrilord has arrived.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 06:01:07
December 06 2012 06:00 GMT
#1200
On December 06 2012 14:49 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:47 MooMooMugi wrote:
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir

Just recently started looking at base stats a lot more, and i don't get why she has to be the best in every trade oriented base stat, her kit ALREADY does that for her. hell even her AS gain is top 5.

Cool lil facts, Darius highest base Armor, Nunu highest lvl18 HP, Orianna like 48 AD lvl1
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
Prev 1 58 59 60 61 62 212 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
RotterdaM Event
16:15
Rotti's PatchesSC Open #4
RotterdaM751
IndyStarCraft 199
TKL 180
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 751
ByuN 629
IndyStarCraft 199
TKL 180
EmSc Tv 10
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 21349
Shuttle 1190
Dewaltoss 163
firebathero 83
Barracks 51
Sexy 43
Mong 26
scan(afreeca) 24
Shine 19
Trap 14
Dota 2
BananaSlamJamma515
Fuzer 196
Heroes of the Storm
MindelVK17
Grubby0
Other Games
FrodaN1775
Beastyqt546
B2W.Neo302
Dendi251
KnowMe133
Liquid`LucifroN119
C9.Mang0113
ArmadaUGS95
QueenE75
Livibee45
Trikslyr41
hiko0
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1370
StarCraft 2
TaKeTV 165
EmSc Tv 10
EmSc2Tv 10
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 7
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 15
• 80smullet 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 3732
League of Legends
• Jankos1661
Other Games
• imaqtpie597
• Shiphtur126
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
5h 35m
GSL
16h 35m
AI Arena Tournament
22h 35m
Replay Cast
1d 5h
GSL
1d 16h
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
1d 20h
Spirit vs Mixu
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Shine vs Rush
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Light vs EffOrt
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Calamity Invitational
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.