• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:03
CEST 09:03
KST 16:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced11Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid21
StarCraft 2
General
MaNa leaves Team Liquid 2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding 2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Gypsy to Korea ASL21 General Discussion Pros React To: Tulbo in Ro.16 Group A Data needed
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro16 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1466 users

[Patch 1.0.0.152: Preseason 3] General Discussion - Page 60

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 58 59 60 61 62 212 Next
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
December 06 2012 05:14 GMT
#1181
who should win the rengar-teemo matchup?
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:15 GMT
#1182
On December 06 2012 13:22 Alaric wrote:
The order is the same for MPen.


Thanks That means that abyssal is still calculated before void staff then, good to know.

So, damage wise, both Voidstaff/HG/sorcs and Abyssal/HG/sorcs deal true damage at (or below) ~65 MR. Anything above that, void staff will come out ahead of abyssal.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
December 06 2012 05:18 GMT
#1183
On December 06 2012 13:24 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 13:14 cLutZ wrote:
Brutalizer upgrades being not terrible is dumb. It was already very good and the only thing keeping it down was ghostblade being MEH and it not being that relevant lategame.

I'd say Guise->Liandry's is a much bigger problem case than Bruta.


The problem is the same: Excellent Early-Midgame items should not have Good-Excellent lategame items.

On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


Rengar should not have a heal. No manaless champion should.
Freeeeeeedom
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
December 06 2012 05:20 GMT
#1184
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Pinith
Profile Joined September 2010
651 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 05:23:02
December 06 2012 05:22 GMT
#1185
On December 06 2012 14:00 Telegnosis wrote:
I'm so confused right now, I just watched Hotshot build more sensible items than Doublelift. Also Jiji won mid lane.


Jiji gets underrated about as much as scarra gets overrated. They're both top mid players in NA, and not up to the level of top EU or Asian mids. Jiji just has a lot more televised games against Asian mids where he loses.
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:23 GMT
#1186
You can get both Muramana and Seraphs Embrace btw, the "only" problem is stacking one tear, upgrading it, then buying another tear and get that to max stack ;D Probably not useful in anything that resembles a real game, but still pretty cool to test out on Ryze. 4k+ mana and those passives is so broken.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 05:25:17
December 06 2012 05:24 GMT
#1187
On December 06 2012 14:18 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 13:24 TheYango wrote:
On December 06 2012 13:14 cLutZ wrote:
Brutalizer upgrades being not terrible is dumb. It was already very good and the only thing keeping it down was ghostblade being MEH and it not being that relevant lategame.

I'd say Guise->Liandry's is a much bigger problem case than Bruta.


The problem is the same: Excellent Early-Midgame items should not have Good-Excellent lategame items.

Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


Rengar should not have a heal. No manaless champion should.

In that case I think they should tone down the effectiveness of Guise and Bruta then. Personally I'm not a fan of the dead end builds.

Edit: Totally agree about Rengar haha.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
chalice
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1945 Posts
December 06 2012 05:26 GMT
#1188
so disappointed, liandry's doesn't proc on the extra damage from either naut's passive or his W shield , could have been amazing with the movement impaired double damage.
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 06 2012 05:26 GMT
#1189
On December 06 2012 14:20 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.

I think rengar's w problem is similar to rivens. W was the highest dps, and best utility. They had to move rivens stuff around. Rengar's w is his biggest damage and wave clear and a heal. They need to nerf something so you can't just level the obvious skill.

They've removed heals from champions before (remember ez?).
zodde
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1908 Posts
December 06 2012 05:31 GMT
#1190
On December 06 2012 14:26 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:20 Seuss wrote:
On December 06 2012 14:14 ChaoSbringer wrote:
Rengar's heal should just start at 5% and scale 2.5 per level.


That doesn't really solve the problem since Rengar maxes W first anyway. It might hurt his early laning slightly, but it won't stop him from becoming a raid boss.

It also puts too many eggs in one basket in terms of game-design. If there was any reason to max anything other than W before, there would be zero afterward.

I think rengar's w problem is similar to rivens. W was the highest dps, and best utility. They had to move rivens stuff around. Rengar's w is his biggest damage and wave clear and a heal. They need to nerf something so you can't just level the obvious skill.

They've removed heals from champions before (remember ez?).


Wow, just googled that, how far back did they remove his heal? :O
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1191
Twin Shadows Taric sup?

Always stun, never not stun.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1192
At one point in time, ezreal had the best heal in the game. Highest ap ratio.
thenexusp
Profile Joined May 2009
United States3721 Posts
December 06 2012 05:35 GMT
#1193
ez's W used to be this super elegant, somewhat whacky thing. It did to your allies exactly the opposite of what it did to enemies: It damaged enemies and lowered their attack speed, and healed allies and increased their attack speed.

Now it's this really weird thing that damages enemies and increases allies' attack speed.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
December 06 2012 05:36 GMT
#1194
I don't think the heal is the problem with Rengar, I think it's Savagery.

He can do such crazy damage while building absolutely no damage items. He can take down towers I think possibly faster than any other champion in the game.

Rengar can be really sustainy if he builds tank items and Spirit Visage, but a lot of champions can do that, and that's fine really. The issue is that he can do that and still kill people.

His ult also gives him a magical free escape if he decides to split push, but if he wasn't doing such crazy damage to towers that wouldn't be so big a deal, and it's his ult that makes his jungling so cool.

I think Savagery is the issue.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
December 06 2012 05:42 GMT
#1195
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
December 06 2012 05:47 GMT
#1196
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
December 06 2012 05:49 GMT
#1197
On December 06 2012 14:47 MooMooMugi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir

Just recently started looking at base stats a lot more, and i don't get why she has to be the best in every trade oriented base stat, her kit ALREADY does that for her. hell even her AS gain is top 5.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
December 06 2012 05:49 GMT
#1198
On December 06 2012 14:36 Ketara wrote:
I don't think the heal is the problem with Rengar, I think it's Savagery.

He can do such crazy damage while building absolutely no damage items. He can take down towers I think possibly faster than any other champion in the game.

Rengar can be really sustainy if he builds tank items and Spirit Visage, but a lot of champions can do that, and that's fine really. The issue is that he can do that and still kill people.

His ult also gives him a magical free escape if he decides to split push, but if he wasn't doing such crazy damage to towers that wouldn't be so big a deal, and it's his ult that makes his jungling so cool.

I think Savagery is the issue.

A lot of other champions build sustain, but they don't get a 15% total health burst heal haha, but yeah, it all works in conjunction. He can heal for that absurd amount and do tons of damage. It's his total kit that makes him too strong.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
December 06 2012 05:51 GMT
#1199
her base regen used to be a lot higher, they nerfed it by like 30% in the Jan 2012 "riven nerfs"
Carrilord has arrived.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-06 06:01:07
December 06 2012 06:00 GMT
#1200
On December 06 2012 14:49 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2012 14:47 MooMooMugi wrote:
On December 06 2012 14:42 PrinceXizor wrote:
Why does riven have the best laning stats of any character? Kind of ridiculous.

Base 2 HP/sec Regen with + .2 hp/sec per level.
Gets Scaling Mres
345 MS
AND manaless? dumb.

Welcome back sir

Just recently started looking at base stats a lot more, and i don't get why she has to be the best in every trade oriented base stat, her kit ALREADY does that for her. hell even her AS gain is top 5.

Cool lil facts, Darius highest base Armor, Nunu highest lvl18 HP, Orianna like 48 AD lvl1
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
Prev 1 58 59 60 61 62 212 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 57m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
actioN 837
ggaemo 217
sSak 74
Nal_rA 50
PianO 24
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm159
League of Legends
JimRising 723
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox595
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor192
Other Games
summit1g8532
WinterStarcraft507
PiGStarcraft202
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream2994
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream300
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH231
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2h 57m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3h 57m
Ladder Legends
7h 57m
IPSL
8h 57m
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
BSL
11h 57m
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
CranKy Ducklings
16h 57m
Replay Cast
1d 1h
Wardi Open
1d 2h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 2h
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 8h
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
1d 18h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Escore
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
6 days
Ladder Legends
6 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W3
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.