EPT[Patch 1.0.0.139: Spectator Mode] General Discussion - Pag…
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MooMooMugi
United States10531 Posts
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Soloside
United States1238 Posts
SHOTS FIRED On that note, has anyone on TL tried out AP Naut? I accidentally randomed him and pretty much stomped mid with his lvl 6 burst...It was easier to execute than Ahri's level 6 to be honest. | ||
Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
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0123456789
United States3216 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:59 Soloside wrote: SHOTS FIRED On that note, has anyone on TL tried out AP Naut? I accidentally randomed him and pretty much stomped mid with his lvl 6 burst...It was easier to execute than Ahri's level 6 to be honest. U really want to be chu9 dont ya. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:19 OreoBoi wrote: - Saint went for a week buying dorans shields on shyv and mundo, it's not horrible but not optimal. - He hates GP5 because everyone was like "Hotshot why you build GP5, they terrible rofl" - Saint is also terrible mechaniclly, doesn't like to gank and doesn't take timers and people consider him to be top jungler IMO Hotshots problems are: - He still has a terrible champion pool so he won't be able to adapt - He's coming into the jungler role with top lane bias, meaning he will camp top all the time because that's what happened to him. Experimenting with different item builds (e.g. Doran's) isn't a terrible idea when you're an experienced jungler. It's a good way to break down assumptions and keep you on top of potential developments and ideas. Experimenting is horrible when you're new to something. | ||
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
Saint takes ganks he knows he get get, HSGG just doesn't gank. Which is fine, because voyboy is manly on toplane. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:19 OreoBoi wrote: - Saint went for a week buying dorans shields on shyv and mundo, it's not horrible but not optimal. - He hates GP5 because everyone was like "Hotshot why you build GP5, they terrible rofl" - Saint is also terrible mechaniclly, doesn't like to gank and doesn't take timers and people consider him to be top jungler IMO Hotshots problems are: - He still has a terrible champion pool so he won't be able to adapt - He's coming into the jungler role with top lane bias, meaning he will camp top all the time because that's what happened to him. That's not it at all but okay. | ||
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beefhamburger
United States3962 Posts
On May 23 2012 02:48 wei2coolman wrote: Saint takes ganks he knows he get get, HSGG just doesn't gank. Which is fine, because voyboy is manly on toplane. HSGG's problem is that he ganks TOO MUCH and never farms. Now maybe it was just that one game you saw where he decided to farm but from the past few days, he's like 95% gank/camp lanes and fails because he doesn't farm. | ||
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phyvo
United States5635 Posts
On May 22 2012 23:45 Schwopzi wrote: I was just sad I couldn't get his W to 0 second cd with max cdr/5 stack. What nerfs are on the pbe? I just thought the ad scaling on ult was kinda redonculous They increased ult CD to 100/90/80 but more importantly reduced the range on his Q from 425 to 270. For perspective, his W range is 300. I'm not really concerned about the nerfs themselves but more his kit as a whole. On May 23 2012 00:05 Seuss wrote: I don't mind the idea of champions like Darius who might only be viable in the context of a team built around them. The problem is Riot routinely gives these sorts of champions kits which snowball hard (in either direction). On-kill refreshes are definitely strong, but I don't think necessarily wrong. The insanity is putting that mechanic on a scaling true damage nuke. Bro, I don't think that your entire team can build around a melee who lacks major consistency tools without giving up something else. Maybe a team could be built around him but frankly when I've seen teams built around one champ it's been Kog Maw and Kog is a pretty consistent late game ranged AD (who just lacks a real escape), not the most kiteable melee champion in the game. Besides, I'm not complaining about the ulti refresh becasue I think ulti refresh is always wrong. I just think it's terrible on someone who already lacks all the standard reliability tools. Even without his ultimate Darius is *more* snowbally by nature of being a melee with zero range and a bad gap closer. When you look at snowballiness a scaling true damage nuke is still linear but a refreshing ultimate adds a whole other layer of scaling since your scaling and your team's scaling = more ultimates. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:19 OreoBoi wrote: - Saint went for a week buying dorans shields on shyv and mundo, it's not horrible but not optimal. - He hates GP5 because everyone was like "Hotshot why you build GP5, they terrible rofl" - Saint is also terrible mechaniclly, doesn't like to gank and doesn't take timers and people consider him to be top jungler IMO Hotshots problems are: - He still has a terrible champion pool so he won't be able to adapt - He's coming into the jungler role with top lane bias, meaning he will camp top all the time because that's what happened to him. I do not like Hotshot. As a fan of CLG I think they pretty much have zero chance of even qualifying for season 2 finals in September. If they somehow manage to qualify there is almost no way they can win it. With that said, I think that Hotshot's logic is that he's going to influence the game early and have his lanes snowball from there. Which would explain why he forgoes GP5 and builds Dshields. However, as someone who isn't even a pro at this game I think that's a horrible way to play jungler because if you don't win the lanes for your team then the game is basically going to turn into a 4v5 since you'll have zero gold. I don't think his mechanics are even necessary in this conversation. As you said, saint's mechanics are awful. But you don't need fucking mechanics to jungle. You need game sense, map awareness, and really good decision making. I don't think Hotshot has any of that. | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:59 Soloside wrote: SHOTS FIRED On that note, has anyone on TL tried out AP Naut? I accidentally randomed him and pretty much stomped mid with his lvl 6 burst...It was easier to execute than Ahri's level 6 to be honest. i am thoroughly entranced by cata -> phage -> roa -> triforce builds. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On May 23 2012 03:37 phyvo wrote: They increased ult CD to 100/90/80 but more importantly reduced the range on his Q from 425 to 270. For perspective, his W range is 300. I'm not really concerned about the nerfs themselves but more his kit as a whole. Bro, I don't think that your entire team can build around a melee who lacks major consistency tools without giving up something else. Maybe a team could be built around him but frankly when I've seen teams built around one champ it's been Kog Maw and Kog is a pretty consistent late game ranged AD (who just lacks a real escape), not the most kiteable melee champion in the game. Besides, I'm not complaining about the ulti refresh becasue I think ulti refresh is always wrong. I just think it's terrible on someone who already lacks all the standard reliability tools. Even without his ultimate Darius is *more* snowbally by nature of being a melee with zero range and a bad gap closer. When you look at snowballiness a scaling true damage nuke is still linear but a refreshing ultimate adds a whole other layer of scaling since your scaling and your team's scaling = more ultimates. There are many different ways of building a team composition around a champion. While a Kog'maw style "Protect the Darius" composition might or might not give up too much for too little, that's only one approach. The problem is that most champions are almost entirely self-sufficient by design, so thinking about ways of incorporating those that aren't is often a waste of time. Why bother when Riot will just buff/remake them later (or, in Xin/Eve's case, relegate them to the dustbin)? Fair point on the ultimate. On May 23 2012 04:00 overt wrote: I do not like Hotshot. As a fan of CLG I think they pretty much have zero chance of even qualifying for season 2 finals in September. If they somehow manage to qualify there is almost no way they can win it. With that said, I think that Hotshot's logic is that he's going to influence the game early and have his lanes snowball from there. Which would explain why he forgoes GP5 and builds Dshields. However, as someone who isn't even a pro at this game I think that's a horrible way to play jungler because if you don't win the lanes for your team then the game is basically going to turn into a 4v5 since you'll have zero gold. I don't think his mechanics are even necessary in this conversation. As you said, saint's mechanics are awful. But you don't need fucking mechanics to jungle. You need game sense, map awareness, and really good decision making. I don't think Hotshot has any of that. Your attempt to explain Hotshot's logic breaks down when you remember he's doing this on champions like Shyvana and Udyr. If you want to influence the early game like crazy through winning lanes you go Nautilus, Alistar, Lee Sin, or another jungler with strong ganks. You don't pick a farmy jungler if you want to gank constantly. | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On May 23 2012 00:05 Seuss wrote: The insanity is putting that mechanic on a scaling true damage nuke. i agree 100% it's things like this (and vayne, %-health-based TRUE DAMAGE with no mana cost LOL) and some of the other absurdly OP skills in the game (riven shield, rumble entire kit, kennen entire kit) that make me wonder like who pushed for that final touch i bet their discussions were like this: reasonable designer: "... okay guys i think that wraps it up. vayne's autos will apply magic damage every couple of hits. it'll make her very strong when built with AS intead of pure AD like all the other ranged carries. you like?" the conference room: "yeah that sounds good man, she's slightly different because of her mobility and this adds a nice touch! let's go for dri-" deranged maniac: "WAIT. WAIT. HOLD ON. instead of just applying magic damage, let's do magic damage that scales with the enemy health! this way you can't stack health against her, only MR!" reasonable designer: "ehhhh i don't know, i think that's a bit much. kogmaw already has a similar concept but he's balanced by lack of mobility, on vayne i don't think that'll wo-" deranged maniac: "you're right, that won't do at all. if enemies can build MR against her, she'll still be stoppable... it'll be TRUE DAMAGE. %-HEALTH-BASED TRUE DAMAGE" *draws a gun, locks the door* "...write this down. WRITE IT DOWN" then a year and change later: reasonable designer: "alright guys we're building another melee champ, we need to give him something to stick to his enemies. i've proposed a short hook and a weak slow. this should let him single out ranged carries to do his job without being too silly. any objections?" satan, disguised as a designer: "HOW ABOUT A GAP CLOSER" reasonable designer: "hmmm i guess that wouldn't be terrible. okay we'll make his ult a gap closer. he's starting to look pretty strong at this point, let's not go overbo-" satan, disguised as a designer: "HOW ABOUT IT REFRESHES ON KILL" reasonable designer: "uhhh... well i mean okay that should only come into play in lower level games, i guess that's not entirely dumb. he's definitely a strong champ now though. maybe we should take a look at adding some of these ideas to karma or katar-" satan, disguised as a designer: "IT WILL DO TRUE DAMAGE" reasonable designer: "wow! okay! i think that's enough man! this skill is starting to get a bit silly" *titters nervously* satan, disguised as a designer: "ONE LAST THING" *reveals himself to be the devil* reasonable designer: "please no! please! we already made that mistake with riveennnnnn!!!" satan: "THE TRUE DAMAGE WILL SCALE OFF AD" *laughs maniacally* the conference room: "jesus have mercy" | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On May 23 2012 01:59 Soloside wrote: SHOTS FIRED On that note, has anyone on TL tried out AP Naut? I accidentally randomed him and pretty much stomped mid with his lvl 6 burst...It was easier to execute than Ahri's level 6 to be honest. Friend of mine loved playing AP Nautilus mid. I've also had the pleasure of getting 100-0'd by one once as well. I stomped one when I went Rumble mid one day though... Forget what the circumstances were tbh. btw, how is Darius? Is he as broken as the LoL forums made him out to be? | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
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Misder
United States1557 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + xPeke making big plays with backdoor TF and Lamia playing phenomenally with Ashe. Haven't seen a game that exciting in a while... | ||
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Haasts
New Zealand4445 Posts
On May 23 2012 05:19 Misder wrote: Anybody watch SK vs Fnatic in the Dreamhack Qualifiers just now? + Show Spoiler + xPeke making big plays with backdoor TF and Lamia playing phenomenally with Ashe. Haven't seen a game that exciting in a while... Yeah, just came to here to post about that. + Show Spoiler + Amazing, amazing plays by xPeke's TF - ridiculous jukes with Zhonyas, Flash & Destiny, huge backdoor plays, great fight cleanup, yeah. Shame Shushei's Gragas is a little rusty, oy. And yeah, Lami's Ashe wasn't flashy, but pretty much perfect AD play. Had to laugh at SK's Alistar getting murdered by baron after getting hit by DFG/Explosive Cask burst through the wall when he came to clear a ward, ulting to escape/survive, but Trample aggroing baron just as he got stunned by Enchanted Crystal Arrow ... poor cow. | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
However, I realize I really like solo top and need to learn some other champions. Who are some other champions that I should learn solo top that have good ability to harass and kill in lane, and scale well into the late game? | ||
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