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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
Much like the Feedback thread for OGN The Champions, this will be the Feedback thread for IPL4. Rest assured that IGN staff will be interested in knowing what users from TeamLiquid think of their event come Monday morning and the following week. Same parameters apply: - use the form below - constructive criticism only - temp bans will be issued for infractions [b]Positives[/b] | ||
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HeroHenry
United States1723 Posts
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
Really liked the showmatches. Entertaining way to fill the downtime in between scheduled matches. (Minus Pobelter tryharding) Negatives Commentators shouting into mic would kill my ears. Pretty much only complaint I have | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
Maybe more tournaments should consider doing group stages? I dunno, but it'd be nice if organizers were to ask pro teams about what formats they'd prefer. Having to potentially play 9 games in one day for loser finals and grand finals seems a bit much for a team. edit: Personally, I think group stages is vastly superior. It means that teams can make mistakes and lose games early on and it also lets you invite more teams. Then after group stages just do a standard like 8 team single elimination bo3 tournament. I believe this is how IEM does it and I think their format is really great for both spectators and players. Not to mention I love group stages, so much more exciting than having a losers bracket. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
I really enjoyed the live sotl segment they did at the end of day 1. I have other comments but I'm fairly sure someone else will cover them all. | ||
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fantasticoranges
1327 Posts
Giving the crowd thundersticks. Negatives Having to make them not use them. Made the game really exciting, | ||
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SgtSquiglz
United States668 Posts
+ Liked the format of the tournament. All Bo3 series and double elim works well imo. + Fun hosts, loved the awkwardness (though not the kpop  )+ Really liked them filling in the time between series with the showmatches. Entertaining way to fill the time. Negatives - Only one stream, so we missed many series (though I believe they said they were fixing this for IPL5?) - Player cams just don't work well with a 3 minute spectator delay. - Crowd noise getting in the way of team communication. I think its cool when the crowd gets to make lots of noise, adds to the atmosphere. Maybe find some way where this wouldn't be an issue. -Casters shouting into the mic sometimes was a bit too loud. Not sure if it was a mic quality issue or what, but it did not sound good at times. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
Negatives:
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scribedsk
United States2 Posts
A much better choice for that role would have been Rachel Quirico who was actually at the event. She has experience with interviews directly related to gaming with numerous pro gamers inside this genre. Casting her as MC really was an amateur move and I think hurt the overall production value when considering the effort of both Riot and IGN here was to help progress the eSports scene to be on a platform of equal value as conventional sports. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
-Actually giving the crowd tools to make some noise. -The kpop/commercials are actually decent Negatives - 2 Sets for grand finals kinda long, best of 5 with 1 game advantage would've been slightly faster. Clg had to play lots of games, tsm played their first game that day, could've easily dragged out the first set to tire clg. - Interviews with Travis, it felt like he just asked a question and didn't even listen/care for the answer, just constantly nodding, the interviews just weren't enjoyable this way. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:10 Roffles wrote: Negatives Commentators shouting into mic would kill my ears. Pretty much only complaint I have Not sure how to adjust volumes to where you can hear the casters when they speak normally and still not kill eardrums when they get excited during major fights. But at least they know that some people were bothered by the volume. On April 09 2012 11:12 overt wrote: I think that tournament organizers should sit down with players and have a serious discussion about tournament format. Maybe I'll just end up coming across as someone mad that CLG lost but I don't think that double elimination is really conducive to LoL. Having a finals that can potentially last 6 hours isn't good for spectators or the players. I'm not sure what format would be superior, single elimination might not be that great of an option for example. Or even a modified finals for a normally double elim (as we've had in the past) might not be the best way to go about it either. Regardless, I think this conversation should be had because being up an entire set in LoL is not only a really huge advantage but it means you're playing so many games and since LoL matches last so much longer than RTS or FPS game matches it just doesn't make sense to me. Maybe more tournaments should consider doing group stages? I dunno, but it'd be nice if organizers were to ask pro teams about what formats they'd prefer. Having to potentially play 9 games in one day for loser finals and grand finals seems a bit much for a team. Someone explained the reasoning for the extended series to me in the LR thread and I came around and decided it was fair. But it still feels like a drag for the team coming out of the losers bracket because of the number of games they have to play on the final day. General question to all: what formats could you suggest if not the one used at IPL4? On April 09 2012 11:14 fantasticoranges wrote: Positives Giving the crowd thundersticks. Negatives Having to make them not use them. Made the game really exciting, Thundersticks are fine but IGN needs to stipulate to the audience not to use them during games. Pre/post game, it's ok. During, it becomes distracting to the players (Pobelter said as much on r/LoL) Not sure how IGN would go about enforcing this rule. | ||
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unichan
United States4223 Posts
+ awkwardness is funny + very organized + kpop Negatives - only one stream! and max 480p free... but i don't think it would be money wasted unlike if you spent money on the earlier LoL tournaments - HA - commentators were basically just shouting about what was happening, said dumb stuff a lot. minor slip ups are ok, major ones just make them look bad (minor: triple advance instead of twisted advanced, major: and no one even used their ult!... except cass and soraka). except dan dinh. commentators should be able to give some analysis also, not sit there and just scream about what is happening and break my ears off. their style generates excitement i guess, but it isn't very interesting to listen to. should hire/invite more well known good players like dan dinh (a former pro!) to cast. - stream sometimes laggy, maybe just me though | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:20 NeoIllusions wrote: General question to all: what formats could you suggest if not the one used at IPL4? Bo5 with 1 game advantage for the finals makes sense to me, as opposed to 2x Bo3 with 1 set advantage. Bo5: Winner's Bracket finalist needs to win 2 games, can drop 2 games anywhere during the finals. Loser's Bracket finalist needs to win 3 games, can drop 1 game anywhere during the finals. Maximum number of games: 4 2xBo3: Winner's Bracket finalist needs to win 2 games, can drop 2 games, but can't be in the same set. Loser's Bracket finalist needs to win 4 games, can drop 2 games, but can't be in the same set. Maximum number of games: 6 In terms of being "fair" to the loser's/winner's bracket finalists they're similar, but a Bo5 with 1 game advantage is much less likely to produce a such a grueling number of games. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
But I do think that they need to send the casters through LoL bootcamp. They don't have to be pros, but even doing something like make them read the TL gd thread would be a good (necessary) way to improve their game knowledge and keep it up to date. And they need to just subscribe to the T_D school of statements. If you are going to say something, just SAY it. Don't qualify every statement you make. Some of it will be wrong. Some of it will be stupid. But at least say it confidently. It gets really annoying to hear "I feel" "I believe" and "I think" over and over again. And redbaron needs to work on casting with pros: dont ask questions constantly: say what is happening on stream and let the pro jump in to expound on a fact that they find needs to be expounded on. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:26 Two_DoWn wrote: And redbaron needs to work on casting with pros: dont ask questions constantly: say what is happening on stream and let the pro jump in to expound on a fact that they find needs to be expounded on. This. Casters need to cast. Commentators need to commentate. Casting/commentating works most smoothly when this happens, and gets very muddled when casters try too hard to commentate (redbaron) or commentators try too hard to cast (Phreak). | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:26 Two_DoWn wrote: Just about the only thing that I have a real complaint about is that we STILL don't have a Tobi Wan for LoL. But I do think that they need to send the casters through LoL bootcamp. They don't have to be pros, but even doing something like make them read the TL gd thread would be a good (necessary) way to improve their game knowledge and keep it up to date. And they need to just subscribe to the T_D school of statements. If you are going to say something, just SAY it. Don't qualify every statement you make. Some of it will be wrong. Some of it will be stupid. But at least say it confidently. It gets really annoying to hear "I feel" "I believe" and "I think" over and over again. And redbaron needs to work on casting with pros: dont ask questions constantly: say what is happening on stream and let the pro jump in to expound on a fact that they find needs to be expounded on. Negatives - Don't preface your casting with "I feel" "I believe" and "I think" - Dan and RedBaron needs to stop being a Q&A session, makes for very awkward casting | ||
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unichan
United States4223 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:26 Two_DoWn wrote: Just about the only thing that I have a real complaint about is that we STILL don't have a Tobi Wan for LoL. But I do think that they need to send the casters through LoL bootcamp. They don't have to be pros, but even doing something like make them read the TL gd thread would be a good (necessary) way to improve their game knowledge and keep it up to date. And they need to just subscribe to the T_D school of statements. If you are going to say something, just SAY it. Don't qualify every statement you make. Some of it will be wrong. Some of it will be stupid. But at least say it confidently. It gets really annoying to hear "I feel" "I believe" and "I think" over and over again. And redbaron needs to work on casting with pros: dont ask questions constantly: say what is happening on stream and let the pro jump in to expound on a fact that they find needs to be expounded on. and don't interrupt him when he's answering your question even if you're really excited | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:28 TheYango wrote: This. Casters need to cast. Commentators need to commentate. Casting/commentating works most smoothly when this happens, and gets very muddled when casters try too hard to commentate (redbaron) or commentators try too hard to cast (Phreak). That confused me a bit. What's the difference between "cast" and "commentate"? | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
I honestly think that giving the WB winner the ability to chose side and wether they want first ban (Ie you can have both if you want) for every game is a big enough advantage to where you dont need to give away a game and you can just run a standard Bo5. It isnt as visceral as a game or set advantage, but it is HUGE. | ||
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mrgerry
United States1508 Posts
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:29 NeoIllusions wrote: That confused me a bit. What's the difference between "cast" and "commentate"? Think play by play and color. Caster is play by play (ie Tobi Wan, Totalbiscut) and commentator is the color guy (Day9, Jatt, ect) | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:20 NeoIllusions wrote: Someone explained the reasoning for the extended series to me in the LR thread and I came around and decided it was fair. But it still feels like a drag for the team coming out of the losers bracket because of the number of games they have to play on the final day. General question to all: what formats could you suggest if not the one used at IPL4? I think that it's 100% fair for the team that didn't drop a series to have an advantage. However, I don't think that this format works as well for LoL as it does for SC2 or Counter-Strike or other games. Just because of the fact that other games tend to end at 30 minutes whereas in LoL professional matches generally last 40-50 minutes. I think that group stages work a lot better for the kind of game that LoL is while allowing teams to have equal footing all tournament long. It also removes the possibility of having 2-2 finals or a 2-2 in losers finals (like assume Dig won semifinals 2-0 but then lost 2-0 to CLG in losers finals, the two teams went 2-2 throughout the tournament but because CLG won the 2-0 later on they advance). I realize that CLG vs Dig this tournament was 3-2 in favor of CLG but there's still the possibility that those two teams could've gone "even" on games. I dunno, maybe it's not that big of a deal but I don't really like double elim for LoL personally. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:29 NeoIllusions wrote: That confused me a bit. What's the difference between "cast" and "commentate"? Maybe I'm splitting hairs with the names, but I've always viewed a caster as someone who explains the play-by-play for the less-acquainted audience so that people can understand what's going on, points of excitement, etc. The commentator gives in-depth analysis and has insight into the thought process of the players. If the caster tries too hard to commentate, you get someone with not a lot of game knowledge saying things that are wrong. If the commentator tries too hard to cast, you get him muddled up in his analysis and following the game, like Phreak missing kills or spending too long looking at things that are uninteresting to a lot of people (like cs counts). | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
+ The venue created a great atmosphere, excellent fans. Accentuation by the multitude of hosts and activities to get the crowd involved. Good mix of personalities and + Kpop! <3 + Great job filling in downtime with various activities/kpop/commercials/interviews... etc. Even just sitting at home it never felt like "Gah, nothing happing.." + I really enjoyed event in general, was a good use of my easter weekend. ^_^ Negatives - We missed like half the sets of the tournament because we only got one stream. ZZzzz.... - Player Cams spoiled every game (and like every skirmish/teamfight) three minutes early. The nice, but should be delayed like the client and then have it switch to crowd/casters etc much like you see on OGN's "The Champions" tournament. - Split prize ceremony definitely kind of disrespectful to 2nd/3rd place teams. Should have big presentation then give everyone trophy, not give second third trophy, sweep them under the rug, then give first place. - Mediocre at best sound quality. Everyones Mic seemed to be different, when mic switched or ads aired or whatever often times they not the same sound level. SOmetimes mics would cut out/fluctuate randomly even sometimes just randomly killing your ears.  -Double elimination tournament not the best format for a game like league of legends where games can last long times. I much prefer the group stage system that OGN, Dreamhack, IEM, Go4LoL etc uses because it doesn't put someone who makes an early mistake at such a disadvantage while still giving teams rewards for playing well early. CLG had to play twice as many games as TSM did throughout the entirety of the tournament, and 6 hours on the day of the finals. This fine for FPS games or shorter games, but having one team play so much more is a huge disadvantage. I know for a fact I play considerably better in my first couple games of the day then I do after having a long long playtime. (And yes, I am a biased CLG fanboi. <_<) | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
having hottie christina v for eye candy. having kpop (but wish they had better kpop songs) <3 interview couch, really nice sotl was really nice. Negatives Delay, there's no need for delay for lan event. the room looked cramped, definitely needs bigger room for LoL crowd. wished for more casters, felt like caster combo was limited. Suggestions: sound booths for players. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:32 overt wrote: I think that it's 100% fair for the team that didn't drop a series to have an advantage. However, I don't think that this format works as well for LoL as it does for SC2 or Counter-Strike or other games. Just because of the fact that other games tend to end at 30 minutes whereas in LoL professional matches generally last 40-50 minutes. I think that group stages work a lot better for the kind of game that LoL is while allowing teams to have equal footing all tournament long. It also removes the possibility of having 2-2 finals or a 2-2 in losers finals (like assume Dig won semifinals 2-0 but then lost 2-0 to CLG in losers finals, the two teams went 2-2 throughout the tournament but because CLG won the 2-0 later on they advance). I realize that CLG vs Dig this tournament was 3-2 in favor of CLG but there's still the possibility that those two teams could've gone "even" on games. I dunno, maybe it's not that big of a deal but I don't really like double elim for LoL personally. Bo5 with 1 game advantage for the Winner's Bracket finalist should work. Again, it's a similar amount of "advantage" to the winner's bracket finalist as having a 1 set advantage with 2x Bo3, but you have a maximum of 4 games, instead of 6. It's also a tried and true finals format in both Western and Chinese DotA tournaments. | ||
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lethal111
Canada460 Posts
I enjoyed the teams that were there. They showed great matches Christina Vee, Future wife right there LOL The tournment was runned fine, stream was very reliable. I loved Dan Dinh casting. I love the times when the stream started The Negative Commentators too loud sometimes. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
Seriously. It needs to happen. | ||
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Ocedic
United States1808 Posts
Camera control during the games is sometimes pretty bad. It's generally accepted that it's very hard to both commentate and control the camera, so it would be wise to have someone dedicated to camera control. 720p being subscriber only is a let down, but if that's the business model you choose to go with then shrug. I personally don't think it's worth it and feel you should generate revenue in other areas. EDIT: Oh yeah, and please run dual streams in the future with this format, as it would be nice to not miss half the games. It's resource intensive, but let's face it, League is very popular. It's definitely something that IPL should shoot for. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:36 Two_DoWn wrote: Oh and its time to switch to dota style bans. Seriously. It needs to happen. There is nothing IGN can do about this. -_- | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:39 NeoIllusions wrote: There is nothing IGN can do about this. -_- Do it on paper and use a drag and drop app like they used to until riot gets their shit together. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
+Cristina Vee as host was a great idea; would like to see her host again +Kpop was lol +Great venue +Overall very well run Negatives +Cristina Vee's random quip at the very end of the tourney during awards was out-of-place and made things really awkward. I can just chalk that up to inexperience or w/e tho +Kpop +Only one stream was kinda annoying, but the games that were shown were overall very good so this is minor +Need better casters; this one's more of a statement towards pro-LoL in general tho +Do Bo5 with one game advantage instead of two Bo3's with a one set advantage. Makes more sense for LoL imo | ||
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dukethegold
Canada5645 Posts
+ Enthusiastic Crowd + Professional Set up Negatives - Mediocre to bad commentator/caster. No where near SC2 caster level. Annoying at times. | ||
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Chairman Ray
United States11903 Posts
-Camera control was done well, didn't miss many important events and focused exactly where it needed to be -Good entertainment value outside games with the interviews, showmatches, etc -Kpop Negatives -The troll faces -Christina sometimes didn't know what to say, so it became apparent that she's forcing out dialogue, making it kinda awkward. If this is her first time emceeing an event like this, I think she did a pretty good job still. -The person casting with Dan Dinh made it more like an interview rather than a duo cast. It was a nonstop question period. | ||
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King K. Rool
Canada4408 Posts
-I enjoyed the pros vs rioter/fans -Personally I thought the double elim was well spaced out with the losers finals early in the day and the grand finals later on in the day; potentially 6-hours, but that's worst, worst, worst scenario. -I enjoyed SOTL and the interviews; would've preferred more winners interviews (didn't see one for day 2's winner brackets winners), maybe a short 10-15 group interview with the entire winning team. -Christina V.'s involvement. Pretty cool having one of the voice actors in the hosting. -Redbaron improved from before, though not enough that putting him with hatperson made the casting bearable. Negatives -Hatperson; seems like a nice guy, but just doesn't add anything. Sure he yells and gets excitable, but "I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT'S GOING ON" is just annoying, and he seemed constantly not to know what was going on and would say the wrong things. It'd be nice to have someone who can do colour casting and actually have some idea what's going on. -Would prefer better casting in general; 1 color+ 1 analysis. Most combos seemed mostly color and the analysis was sort of shallow for the most part as I believe no one other than Dan Dinh plays professionally. -On the flip side, Christina V obviously did not know what to say/ask at certain points; asking HSGG "what's your favourite part of the tournament" just seemed really out of place. If you want to keep her as an MC, preferably do it so that she does co-hosting with an experienced person or give her a list of things to say/do. -Trophies were very underwhelming. | ||
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
female hosters were less annoying than in previous events doing a proper extended series instead of best of 3 and giving 1 game advantage dyrus negatives at the very least hatperson needs to stop screaming random stuff when he doesnt know what to say his cocaster needs to not just ask questions when casting with someone competent. those two casters need to learn the game more, they flat out say wrong stuff all the time casters need to improve camerawork badly microphones picking up too much noise and are too focused on the crowd to make them sound louder and more exiting than in other events, but this makes certain annoying crowd people stand out too much ingame sound was poor quality kpop is not somthing i can support also, travis is one of the very few males that looks worse in a suit  | ||
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0123456789
United States3216 Posts
The interviews in between the games with the players Negative: The people who interviewed the players sucked. Please get some people who are charismatic. The fat guy who does SOTL does not represent the E-sports image well, doesn't take care of himself, and his questions, and game knowledge suck, and he's not charismatic. Watching E-sports should be like watching basketball. You need to bring about a surreal image, give me a positive motivating reason to go pro, when I grow up, I should want to be part of E-sports. I shouldn't think that E-sports is something that only nerds do. I want to bring people into E-sports, and people are turned off by non-charismatic people. Positive: You had commentating Negative: All the commentators except Phreak and Dan Dinh were bad. Please get people who know the game/are charismatic, and have the commentating enhance the experience of watching IPL, not detract from it. Extra additions that would make watching IPL better: OGN switches cams and stuff from the dude controlling the camera, to the player's faces, to first person views, and stuff like that. It fills up dead time during the early game and makes the game more exciting to watch because most people have small attention spans. Cuts in between aka camera tricks can make the game more fun to watch. Another addition: More player knowledge. Like there should be more knowledge about the players I am watching. Honestly, I know nothing about the EU teams/players and the NA teams/players. I don't know who they are, what their elos are, what champions they play, what they look like, their history playing LoL. I have very little information about them. For a casual LoL player and viewer like me, please fill me in to everything about the people that I am actually watching and hype them up please. The players who go to live tourneys get more exposure and coverage, their sponsors are happy, and the viewers are happy. | ||
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ketchup
14521 Posts
+ Definite improvement from last time. It was very well done last time as well, and I enjoy that the IPL crew is working to make improvements. + Kpop was hilariously good. Reactions about it were entertaining. Doesn't really need to be there, BUT it was A LOT better than dead air during ads. + Great venue and crowd excitement was amazing. + It was a very well run tournament. Most games started on time. The 2nd day was delayed I believe, but I enjoyed that they started casting extra games during some down time. I believe they covered a surprisingly high amount of games played. + I'm actually a pretty big fan of 480p. It's the middle ground between paying for something or not, and I think IPL did a nice choice of it. I hope they keep a maximum of 480p(rather than 360p), and keep anything higher for sell. I find LoL to be reasonably easy to follow in 480p. Just a suggestion though, I think their advertisement for the higher quality stream was not really the best. As in, I'm not sure if people knew this was an available option. 5$ for HQ is a very decent amount, and is not too much. If I have the time to watch all of it, I'd consider buying it. + Great games by everyone that attended. I know this is more about the teams/players, but they all played so well. The games were exciting, and I enjoyed watching all I could catch. Negatives - The casting/commentating is sub-par. The worst part is not that these people are doing it, but that they don't seem to have any practice. Sometimes, I wonder if they are prepared, or if they just randomly got sucked into it. As funny as it is to see the audience shout to the observer to change to a lane, it's so embarrassing in terms of a professional environment. I feel the casters/ commentators played into it, and didn't take it seriously. It's a huge problem. Please have a third party observer who listens and can sometimes direct the casters/ commentators to where the action is. At the very least, please have a third party observer who's ONLY looking at the mini-map(for the most part), call out the plays in their headsets. People missing fights in LoL is so sad. I mean even if someone is talking, let them finish talking, but at least move the camera to the fight. It's okay if you miss some play-by-play if you get the fight on screen.(This is where a lot of the highlights come from anyways) I also believe that commentators(game analysis) are good for the overall feel of the tournament, but they are not as exciting to listen to. If you can find a good duo (commentator + caster), I think it would work well. Dan Dinh is decent at commentating, and explaining some of the more intricate decisions for the crowd is nice. The problem comes in is that Dan Dinh sometimes lessens the excitement overall. So, you need a better caster who can hype the crowd back up. RedBaron and Hatperson don't cut it at the moment. I think this issue will happen for any commentator, because they look at the game in an analytical way, and not in the "WHOA LOOK AT THAT FLASH" way. - Please get some sound-proof booths/ stage for the teams. This hurt both the players and the audience. I think the audience was amazing, and the fact that they had to keep their excitement to a minimum is a shame. There were player complaints about the noise level as well. - Sound issues throughout the event. Pretty frustrating. Smaller complaint in the sound department, I believe that one of the mics for the casters/commentators was blown out/ malfunctioning. Anytime they'd get excited, and get loud, it would kinda blow out. - Lastly, I would like it if there were multiple streams for LoL. We all have our favorites, and not being able to watch them is a shame. Hope this helps, sorry the formatting is terrible. | ||
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G3CKO
Canada1430 Posts
Great tournament overall I like the format Pretty good crowd interactions Negatives Please get better casters to go with Rivington and Phreak Stream lag was reported by multiple people Some one flashed troll face Volume inconsistent | ||
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:39 NeoIllusions wrote: There is nothing IGN can do about this. -_- i think it would be very easy for a programmer to make a little program that does this. These events seem to have a lot more complicated PC things going on, should be np. And once main events use this format, riot will change it in-game soon enough. | ||
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oxxo
988 Posts
+ Good format, much better than the weird tourneys that essentially penalize winners bracket. + Good crowd. + Pretty good game casters. + Games started on time. Negatives - Missed games being played due to 1 stream. - The non-game commentators were pretty bad (Cristina Vee, etc.) - Need sound-proof booths. - Sound problems on stream. - Sometimes staff didn't seem to know what was supposed to happen next. Would be talking while still on mic etc. | ||
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sethrakill
United States8 Posts
+ K POP + Stuck to the schedule posted in the sidebar + player interviews Negatives - unable to cast off stage matches in down time/ no highlight reel of off stage matches -limited number of interviews for down time | ||
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daemir
Finland8662 Posts
+ The crowd was interactive and awesome + Free stream quality was good enough, have no complaints about the video + Very little technical difficulties for players during matches (very few pauses) + Some awesome games + Phreak and Rivington did a pretty fine job at casting Negatives - The chicks on the stage, I don't get what it adds, but it at least it wasn't as bad as IEM - Kpop - More Kpop - Audio production. While video production was something I was really happy about whole tournament, audio was horrendous. Random volume levels, sound travelling from left to right, caster mics either bad quality or set wrong so they would break sound, crack and pop and when they got excited it would break ears. Sometimes game sounds would be on, sometimes not, sometimes too loud, often times way too quiet. I didn't hear most interviews during days 1 and 2 because of this. - The other casting duo, it was not engaging, awesome plays might happen and they would not react, some other times they'd be shouting so the mic cracks. Not really insightful commentary, game knowledge leaves a lot to desire. Obsing was horrendous, missing action, moving the screen far too much around during a fight. - Only one stream - Time for non amuricans. I was diehard for the first 2 days, staying up from 8pm to 6-7am and then on the finals day, I fell asleep at midnight, missing the finals, but good thing there's probably vods for me. Timezones are hard for any tournament though, so this is like a minor negative. - Player cams spoiled results 3 minutes ahead some games. - Kpop, it doesn't belong here, please. There was 0 connection for a LoL only viewer of why there's suddenly korean jailbaits jumping on the screen with awful music. - After watching the finals vods, this Q&A with Dan in S2G1 is soooo freaking annoying to listen to. Overall pretty nice tournament. Time was hard for a GMT +3 viewer, but such is the way it is. Audio production sucked balls, video production was nice, LoL still needs real casters, we need more bans. Dyrus wins | ||
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wussleeQ
United States3130 Posts
cons- they should delay the player reactions by 3 minutes on online stream so that we can see how they react to plays. that really is the one major issue i had during the games because we'd often times see when a game was over | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:40 Two_DoWn wrote: Do it on paper and use a drag and drop app like they used to until riot gets their shit together. I don't think a single tournament can really afford to make that kind of switch because if they're the only tournament that does it, none of the pros are going to practice it, which means it's not really going to accomplish anything. Riot really has to endorse the format for it to work. On another note, consider the following scenario for Bo5 with 1 game advantage vs. 2x Bo3 with 1 set advantage. Suppose our winner's bracket team and loser's bracket team are equally good, and have a 50% chance of winning any given game. In a Bo5 with 1 game advantage, the Winner's bracket finalist has a 0.6875 chance of winning (WW, LWW, LLWW, WLW, LWLW, WLLW). In a 2x Bo3 with 1 set advantage, the Winner's bracket finalist has a 0.75 chance of winning (WW, WLW, LWW, LLWW, LLWLW, LLLWW, LWLWW, LWLWLW, LWLLWW, WLLWW, WLLWLW, WLLLWW). So there's a slight bit less advantage for the the Winner's bracket finalist, but you finish the series in 1-2 less games in most cases. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
Otherwise I much prefer a single game in a bo5 over 2 bo3. | ||
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hasuprotoss
United States4612 Posts
Pros - The atmosphere was great, the crowd seemed genuinely excited about the matches. Made watching it from home a lot more enjoyable. For the most part, the production was very good. Cons - Although the production was good, I still don't understand the Kpop and the random troll face appearing. The kpop made me mute the stream, and the random troll face was just unprofessional. I know they can't cater to everyone's music tastes, but can we please get something more genuinely good then kpop? Audio was awful, this has been expounded on before. Casters could have been better. Hopefully the ones they use gain knowledge/they get new commentaters (I hear Jatt is good, but I've never heard him commentate so I can't really say). Timing. But I doubt that they'll get unlucky enough to put the next IPL on the same days as a major in golf  | ||
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dano101
Canada92 Posts
+Christina Vee was a cute host +The audience +Dan Dinh commentating +The interviews Negative -Christina Vee, while being a cute host, is inexperienced and needs a co-host that knows how to transition properly and create some hype -The audio: Completely random audio levels at times, bad quality, mics not working at certain times, mics being left on during commercials, commentator being too loud and shredding my ears -The commentators were just plain bad besides Dan Dinh. The Riot duo were passable. As others have said, it's really bad when the commentator keeps asking the pro questions. Just commentate then let the pro make his observations and analysis. -Award Ceremony: Just plain bad, awkward, and unprofessional. At least discuss with the players before hand how the ceremony will go rather than just bringing them on stage and expecting them to know what to do. Like others suggests, have the top dogs make their speech, then bring the teams on one at a time to shake hands and get their trophies. Don't ask the teams that just lost questions, because you know they have to be feeling down at that point... -The K-Pop: I'm more neutral on this, but at least vary song selection or put in different type of music rather than playing bubble-pop 24/7 -Audience Noise: If it's a problem for players then maybe this needs to be addressed by putting them separate from the fans who naturally want to be loud? -Video quality: Really strained my eyes to read the numbers. Maybe next patch will address making the UI more visible in low quality. -The interviews: I don't like the interviewer (Travis). It's probably a personal thing but I've noticed others say he's just not charismatic and doesn't bring much to the table so maybe that is it. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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Bluebush
United States218 Posts
+ Great crowd / venue + Good format - should have shown more of the games though. + Phreak / Rivington / Dan were all good casters Negatives - The other casters were meh. - Series were too spaced out - a Bo3 will never take four hours. It's stupid to have 2+ hour breaks. - Too many series missed - maybe half the series were off stream the first two days. They could have just run one right after another and it'd still be done in under four hours most of the time. - Cameras/audio spoiled most of the games in the last few minutes. This was my #1 biggest complaint by far - A lot of the time-fillers were awkward at best Overall a successful tournament but the downtime was a real buzzkill E: forgot the best part - the crowd yelling to the casters when a fight was going on, to make sure they didn't miss the action. God bless you for that, crowd. | ||
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
+ Alot of interviews of diferent persons that are active or were active in the scene (kobe lol) + Recap at the end of the day with numerous players + Kpop was funny and gave something to have a laught about during dead times + The audience, the cheers, the sticks, the crowd on saturday was extremely noisy but it gave the game alot more of enjoyement for me + No technical problems lag wise or hardware wise for the player that were too noticeable + Showmatches, hosts, giveaway, activitys to keep the audience awake and making break times enjoyable. + Free stream and very good quality, 480p was absolutly perfect for me Negatives - Sound management was badly done, contrast between comentator sound, comercials, kpop, other comentators, host, ingame sound... everything was uneven and required the viewers to adjust manually stream sound all the time - Camera management was going between mediocre, terrible, drunk pirate quality. Having the audience point thing to you is not good, neither is making the viewers sea sick. - Players not sound proofed from the crowd, they complained about the noise and the electrical atmosphere we had on saturday stopped like that. - In game delay and players camera, not a hudge deal but the fact that the live player feed is not in synch with the game we watch defeats the purpose of a player cam - Comentators and hosts. This will sound a little harsh but some comentators were borderline anoying to hear. From the "i think" "i feel" to the non stop flood of questions, also the poor construction of dead times made them say some completly mistaken statements more than once. Interviews always look improvised, questions seem random and usually are kind of uninteresting. - trollfaces were childish and unfunny, complete mood killer for me. Using an internet meme once can be funny, forcing it several time is just lame. - Only one stream = missed games =( Overall i enjoyed the whole event alot, i saw alot of games and it was the best LoL tournament viewing experience for me. I am definetly looking foward the next one | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
+ Dan Dinh casting, was really nice. + No 1 game advantage bo3. + Christina Vee. Negatives - Audio throughout the event. Very inconsistent sound levels which either killed your ears or had you turning your volume up to be scared to death by random advertisement. - One stream. There really should have been two. Not having some of the most anticipated games shown is a bit of a let down. - Scheduling. Primarily because I'm EU. All the biggest matches were late in the night. I was thinking about buying a HD pass until I saw the scheduling of the matches. Missed TSM vs CLG, missed CLG vs Dig, TSM vs Dig, all the highly anticipated matches. Of course there area vods, but watching live is pretty important! | ||
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shrinkmaster
Germany947 Posts
in its current state i think that 5 bucks for a weekend is the maximum you can spend on ipl without getting disappointed. the rest has already been stated multiple times, no need for me to repeat it. | ||
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Fen2
Australia51 Posts
- Games ran on schedule - Tournament seemed to run smoothly - Riot team were good casters - Showmatches were great for downtime Negatives - Lack of consistancy in professionalism When organising an event like this, you need to decide if you are going to go for a professional approach, or a fun approach. Sadly not everyone was on the same level, which resulted in many things coming across as very awkward and thus nerdy - Consistancy of clothing There should never really be a point where a girl in a cocktail dress is co-presenting with a couple of guys in jeans/tshirt. Then cutting to a fat nerdy appearing guy wearing a suit interviewing someone in a hoodie is a big wtf. There needs to be consistancy here. Either everyone goes for a professional look or no-one does. (Obviously the girls in cocktail dresses were for eyecandy, but they just look out of place when everyone else is dressed soo casually) Teams should also be asked to wear matching clothing. This is a team game, and thus players should be identfiable as a team by the way they look . They dont have to buy team clothing, but just at the least go to the same store and buy 5 of the same black shirt or something. - Kpop + Trollfaces This was an american run tournament, in Las Vegas, on a game which was produced by an american company and you're playing something that is very uniquely korean culture. All this did was reinforce that this tournament was about the nerdy asian steryotype. Trollfaces have no place in a professional event - Lack of experience/Charisma This is a minor note, but it was apparant in a few people, such as Chistina Vee, and Travis, and all this does is add to awkwardness. | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
+ Pretty smooth transition between games + Better scheduling in general + Atmosphere/crowd Negatives - casters were even worse than before. metacasting how he can't hear his cocaster and then saying how it probably wasnt' important anyways? need someone who can at least be professional enough to not make it awkward for his cocaster - extended series finals is... too long =/ | ||
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emucxg
Finland4559 Posts
+ smooth stream with good quality even with only 480p, no lags at all + alot teams, alot games, bo3 instead of bo1 + the crowd Negatives - kpop... need play more songs and add some western music - need more team, especially from europe - the ceremony sucks... | ||
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ihasaKAROT
Netherlands4730 Posts
- dyrus is a showman and works the crowd more then any 'real' presenter did. - the matches were great, upsets bigplays n baseraces negatives - the time between matches was just too long. You lose all the european fans if the final starts at 03:00 in he night - the streamquality at 480... I understand making money is needed but put that on a real hq stream. lol has lots of tiny numbers that you cant even read on 480 - the casters need something. phreak needs to calm down and let rivington speak. the other duo needs gameknowledge and some humor thats actually funny... - needs more guestcasters! Theres 8 pro teams with alot of knowledge , put more up there! | ||
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SuperFanBoy
New Zealand1068 Posts
+ Greatly run tournament + Crowd environment made it fun to watch + Riven voice girl was awesome (Christina Vee I think that's her name) Negatives - The final, CLG wins 2-0 then TSM wins 2-0 and TSM take the championship? why not just allow the 2 teams to have 1 bo5 or bo7 or something, make it a fair final.. having a team walk into the final knowing they only have to win 2 games of 3 while the other team has to win twice as many is stupid. Especially since CLG didn't get knocked down to losers bracket by TSM. - Commentators, I don't really like the current commentators.. Dan Dinh was pretty good but the others not so much. Need Tastosis or Day9 :D | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
+ Good games. + Great entertainment, as good as you can get in ESPORTS. Negatives - Player-cams showing that a game will be over soon, sometimes even spoil the result through player reactions. Retract the video to correct time, or get some soundproof booths. AKA "do what OGN does" - When the only commentator at IPL, Dan, was commentating, the casters just Q&A'd him so they don't say anything wrong. Don't do that, just do play-by-play and ask 78% less questions. Actually, casters need to go more in the play-by-play direction in general, some of their calls and "logic" should just stay at home. - downtime between games way too long, and they still didn't show all of them. I stayed up until 4am on saturday, still didn't see all the games, and regretted it severely on Sunday (Easter colliding with ESPORTS). Euro timezones suck i guess. | ||
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Takkara
United States2503 Posts
+ Interviews (when focused on the game itself and not about "what do you think about how Riot is supporting esports") + Crowd Negatives: - Tournament on Easter - Having to shush the crowd (get booths perhaps) - Delay is unnecessary. It hurts the live experience (this may be more of a Riot issue to fix) Format: Neo asked for other ways to run the tournament. I think that besides fairness you always want to create a system where a team will play more than a single set over the course of the weekend. That makes the basic investment worth it for a team, it's sponsors, and it's fans. Besides double-elim, I think best format would have to be pool stages into a 2-4 team playoff. Each 4 man round-robin pool would produce 6 sets (12 total). If using a 4 man playoff it would produce 3 sets). That's a total of 15 sets of castable LoL. Interestingly that's exactly the maximum number of sets that are produced in the double-elimination bracket as well. Therefore there's the same amount of LoL to cast and it makes more "sense" to viewers what is going on because there's no weirdness in the finals. Also, a team is guaranteed to play no fewer than 3 sets at the tournament as opposed to the 2 that they are guaranteed now. Lastly, this is a format that is used widely in other LoL tournaments and other esports tournaments so it will be generally familiar to viewers. I think they should definitely look into pools instead of double-elim. | ||
Flicky
England2657 Posts
+ I think the better organised the tournament, is, the better the games are. This event had amazing games. + The whole atmosphere and the crowd were amazing. + Essentially, all the production and that was great and it meant that we could enjoy an absolutely incredible tournament. + A brilliant merge of a casual and professional tournament made it one of the most fun events I've watched for any game. It really matches the LoL vibe. Negatives - The interviews were decent but I think you need someone that isn't Travis for them. I don't think he fits for an on-stage interview. - K-pop. Please don't, it's not linked to the LoL scene at all. It was enjoyed as a gimmick this time, don't bring it back. - No booths for the players and having players on stage with a delay. The delay is something that can't be changed by IPL right now but I think the players really want booths. I think most people will agree that Curse vs Mono game 3 was incredible and the crowd were such a huge factor there. Give the players booths and give the crowd thundersticks. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
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Jiddra
Sweden2685 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:15 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: + Show Spoiler + Positives:
Negatives:
Agree with everything. I would only add one thing... - Stop broadcasting host information and "swag" talk on stream, as a stream viewer I'm not the least interested in the fact that I can buy a poster for 15 bucks in a booth or that I can get a tshirt if I talk to ms X, Y or Z. Overall improvement on stream production is needed. PS. A second stream for the few games played off air would be nice. | ||
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PeZuY
935 Posts
+ Crowd was decent and there was quite great atmosphere + As a Starcraft 2 player I've so long tried to ignore LoL, but I gotta admit it is just as any team games there are. Of course it is different and shouldn't be compared to RTS/FPS games but I think this was the first time I really enjoyed watching LoL from stream. - K-pop, enough said? - No team booths. I just don't like the fact that there are so huge ammount of money on the line and if people will start shouting "OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" in early game it possibly will give easy firstblood if are responded correctly. Also this contains baron / dragon / buff takings. | ||
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Jiddra
Sweden2685 Posts
On April 09 2012 22:00 PeZuY wrote: + Well organized overall. + Crowd was decent and there was quite great atmosphere + As a Starcraft 2 player I've so long tried to ignore LoL, but I gotta admit it is just as any team games there are. Of course it is different and shouldn't be compared to RTS/FPS games but I think this was the first time I really enjoyed watching LoL from stream. - K-pop, enough said? - No team booths. I just don't like the fact that there are so huge ammount of money on the line and if people will start shouting "OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" in early game it possibly will give easy firstblood if are responded correctly. Also this contains baron / dragon / buff takings. There is a delay on what the crowd and viewers watch, it's built in to the spectator mode LoL is using. But they need booths or something to be able to communicate when the crowd is screaming about something that happend 3 min ago. | ||
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PeZuY
935 Posts
On April 09 2012 22:05 Jiddra wrote: There is a delay on what the crowd and viewers watch, it's built in to the spectator mode LoL is using. But they need booths or something to be able to communicate when the crowd is screaming about something that happend 3 min ago. Okey I didn't know about the delay thing: ) thats kinda good if it is implemented. How long is the delay btw? | ||
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GeorgeForeman
United States1746 Posts
On April 09 2012 11:25 TheYango wrote: Bo5 with 1 game advantage for the finals makes sense to me, as opposed to 2x Bo3 with 1 set advantage. I think this is the best way to do it. You've got to give some advantage to the team in the Winner's bracket, but I really don't like the idea of having two "potential" championship matches. Just do it as one match, hopefully with a longer-than-normal break after two games so the players aren't too, too tired. | ||
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Asshat
593 Posts
On April 09 2012 21:40 Flicky wrote: Positives + I think the better organised the tournament, is, the better the games are. This event had amazing games. + The whole atmosphere and the crowd were amazing. + Essentially, all the production and that was great and it meant that we could enjoy an absolutely incredible tournament. + A brilliant merge of a casual and professional tournament made it one of the most fun events I've watched for any game. It really matches the LoL vibe. Negatives - The interviews were decent but I think you need someone that isn't Travis for them. I don't think he fits for an on-stage interview. - K-pop. Please don't, it's not linked to the LoL scene at all. It was enjoyed as a gimmick this time, don't bring it back. - No booths for the players and having players on stage with a delay. The delay is something that can't be changed by IPL right now but I think the players really want booths. I think most people will agree that Curse vs Mono game 3 was incredible and the crowd were such a huge factor there. Give the players booths and give the crowd thundersticks. Booths for a crew of 5 aren't realistic. It's either them on stage or in a side room. The noise was partially a result of the small space given for the lol stage. | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
+ Very Entertaining. I enjoyed the casters interacting with the crowd. Even the commercials didn't suck. + The stage was decorated well, and I enjoyed the interviews. I liked the pro's who were guest commentators, as they brought a better game sense to the casting allowing for a deeper understanding. + The atmosphere of the whole tournament seemed to be focused around fun and having a good time. + Double elimination format was a plus, I had been looking for something like this in LoL for a long time. Negatives - I didn't like how there was a lack of graphics overlays. Like OGN does in there tournaments. Not a big deal, but I feel more graphic overlays would have made it like watching a superbowl or world series type of professional sporting event. - When things like the smoke was going on stage, the camera wasn't able to capture the atmosphere of the venue, I feel if a camera had been installed to get a bird's eye view from the stage looking at the crowd, it would have brought the venue and feel of being there into our living rooms. Just seeing the crowd cheering is one of those little things I thought was missing. - There were a few technical difficulties I hope would be resolved in future events. Mics not working, stream sound/video cutting out. Other than that I think it was an excellent event and look for to many more in the future. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
Thanks to everyone who have provide their thoughts and ways to improve future IPLs. I'll work on consolidating the input into the OP later today. | ||
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Sandster
United States4054 Posts
On April 09 2012 23:02 GeorgeForeman wrote: I think this is the best way to do it. You've got to give some advantage to the team in the Winner's bracket, but I really don't like the idea of having two "potential" championship matches. Just do it as one match, hopefully with a longer-than-normal break after two games so the players aren't too, too tired. This is the #1 thing. It's nuts to expect teams to play potentially 6 more games for the finals alone when there's a chance they already played each other 3 times in the tournament. | ||
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Irre
United States646 Posts
Negatives: State of the League: WTF, besides the fact that it was awful and not funny..the players really need to present themselves in a more professional manner both speaking and the way they look. It is an embarrassment to professional gaming the way the LoL community and pros present themselves, and if LoL really wants to have any kind of sustainability or attract actual legit teams and sponsors like other games have successfully done for years, the pros need to clean up their act. Seriously, some weird awkward kids that look like they rolled out of bed, no team attire, WITH PILLOWS..i just look at a team like EGs sc2 squad and look at some of those kids doing that awkward ripoff show and it just makes me /facepalm. ok //endrant Finals too long, commentary just mediocre. overall it made me a little more interested in LoL but yeah it really needs to take a step up on a professional level. I understand there are much younger kids watching and playing but compare giant kid with pillow to Leenock or Maru from SC2....yeah. | ||
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Jiddra
Sweden2685 Posts
On April 10 2012 01:04 Irre wrote: Positives: smoothly run event, nice little breaks wtih the riot vs pros thing, KPOP <3, and overall good play to watch for someone who isnt a huge LoL fan or believer. Negatives: State of the League: WTF, besides the fact that it was awful and not funny..the players really need to present themselves in a more professional manner both speaking and the way they look. It is an embarrassment to professional gaming the way the LoL community and pros present themselves, and if LoL really wants to have any kind of sustainability or attract actual legit teams and sponsors like other games have successfully done for years, the pros need to clean up their act. Seriously, some weird awkward kids that look like they rolled out of bed, no team attire, WITH PILLOWS..i just look at a team like EGs sc2 squad and look at some of those kids doing that awkward ripoff show and it just makes me /facepalm. ok //endrant Finals too long, commentary just mediocre. overall it made me a little more interested in LoL but yeah it really needs to take a step up on a professional level. I understand there are much younger kids watching and playing but compare giant kid with pillow to Leenock or Maru from SC2....yeah. The funny thing is that "kid witch pillow", Dyrus, is the most popular LoL player and always has 15 000+ watching his daily streams. So the pillow is a trademark, like it was with Huk. | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
On April 10 2012 00:49 Sandster wrote: This is the #1 thing. It's nuts to expect teams to play potentially 6 more games for the finals alone when there's a chance they already played each other 3 times in the tournament. I don't like this format, and I will show you why. Say we have 4 teams. A,B,C,D. RD 1 A vs D 2-0 B vs C 2-1 Winner's finals A vs B 2-0 Loser's rd 1 C vs D 2-1 Loser's finals B vs C 1-2 Team A is 4-0 Team C is 5-4 so team a wins game 1 loses the next 3 Team C wins with a record of 8-5 (61.5 win%) Team A gets second with a record of 5-3 (62.5 win%) Say it is a 2 bo3 format for the finals and Team C wins 2-1 both times Team A 6-4 Team C is 9-6 now they both have 60% win rates, but the having the finals going 6 games make it seem the better team became champion. | ||
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Flicky
England2657 Posts
On April 09 2012 23:58 Asshat wrote: Booths for a crew of 5 aren't realistic. It's either them on stage or in a side room. The noise was partially a result of the small space given for the lol stage. OGN have booths for 5 players. If they can do, IPL can do it. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
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nojitosunrise
United States6188 Posts
On April 10 2012 02:03 Flicky wrote: OGN have booths for 5 players. If they can do, IPL can do it. Why set up booths, when you can provide high quality sound proof headsets for casters/players? Much cheaper and much more efficient IMO. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
-premium (tho I didn't get it, we'll get into that) being $5 is a very reasonable price. -dan dinh, your best caster imo -crowd/rioter matches to fill what would otherwise be downtime -non riot employee casters in general, I actually think Phreak and Rivington are decent casters, but they spoil it with their gushing over even flaws in the game. negatives I hate to do the whole this is what sponsors want thing but I've two I'll say fast to get it over with -clearly you were not using the astro headsets, you could see the nice stage mic sticking out from underneath, the Red Baron gunnars thing was a little silly but that I can see, but with the headsets it's like use it or lose it, the teams are clearly using them so why do you have pretend the casters are? ok, viewer negatives -the fact that you quited down the crowd was really disapointing, they were creating a moment in e-sports (not even trying to be melodramatic) whatever your reasons are, I disagree. If it was too loud for the teams to communicate, then they could hear the casting anyway so you need to improve your setup. -holiday weekend, only reason I didn't chip in the $5 is I couldn't watch all of championship Sunday. -double elimination, most anti climactic format in esports. group stage + single elim just as accurate w/o the tournament being over after winners finals 80% of the time. | ||
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azndsh
United States4447 Posts
+ everything Negatives - room was smaller than SC2 room | ||
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Eppa!
Sweden4641 Posts
On April 09 2012 20:32 SuperFanBoy wrote: Positives + Greatly run tournament + Crowd environment made it fun to watch + Riven voice girl was awesome (Christina Vee I think that's her name) Negatives - The final, CLG wins 2-0 then TSM wins 2-0 and TSM take the championship? why not just allow the 2 teams to have 1 bo5 or bo7 or something, make it a fair final.. having a team walk into the final knowing they only have to win 2 games of 3 while the other team has to win twice as many is stupid. Especially since CLG didn't get knocked down to losers bracket by TSM. - Commentators, I don't really like the current commentators.. Dan Dinh was pretty good but the others not so much. Need Tastosis or Day9 :D This is standard double elimination tourny setup. The idea is you need to lose 2 sets to be out of the tournament. The casters where all good imo. They are all inexperienced in one way or another but its to be expect as lol-esports is young and standards for casting have not been set yet. Personally I like the random dudes (not DD or Riot guys) I watched some of it though but the only thing I think could improve heavily (without large costs like booths) is to have 2 streams. Missing CLG vs Dignitas was a shame. | ||
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IMABUNNEH
United Kingdom1062 Posts
+Crowd interaction (mostly through Phreak) was great +Double Elim and all best of 3s +Fun stuff during downtime such as Kpop, pros vs fans etc Negatives +Hatman is the worst caster of any game in forever. I dislike him and I think IPL need to work on getting a better casting team. +Extended Series. It's dumb. Being knocked down to losers bracket and forced to play more games is punishment enough, no need to start people a set behind. +They need to drop the playercam into the delay as well so that it's actually a relevent view. | ||
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Goragoth
New Zealand1065 Posts
+ 240p stream option. My Internet connection is pretty terrible but at least I could follow it on the lowest quality setting. GOM doesn't have a low-quality option and doesn't allow re-streaming, making the GSL impossible for me to follow. Thanks for providing an option for all of us with terrible ISPs. + Kpop filled the dead time nicely. Negatives - As many others have said the audio quality needs to be worked on. Consistent audio is a must for an event like this. - Again, as has been said before a Bo5 with a 1 game advantage for the winner's bracket team would make a much better format for the final. | ||
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MyTHicaL
France1070 Posts
+ It was free xD + Not too many advertisements +Dan Dinh replacing hatperson for a couple of games + a small plus for the much better casting duo of phreak and ??? But this needs to be fixed, it's not really that hard. I mean the formula almost never changes no matter what game it is; One enthusiastic describer (and not hatperson) and one competitive insight... Negatives -As already stated hatperson is just ridiculously bad as a caster, I do however believe that the Baron is slowly getting better. -I don't really like Grand Final format, however I'm uncertain that a 1-0 game advantage would be better (it means on average less total games) -I don't like kpop, I don't see why you need to make an American E-Sports event look like a korean one... But whatever many people seemd to enjoy it. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 10 2012 01:55 Sabin010 wrote: Team A is 4-0 Team C is 5-4 so team a wins game 1 loses the next 3 Team C wins with a record of 8-5 (61.5 win%) Team A gets second with a record of 5-3 (62.5 win%) Say it is a 2 bo3 format for the finals and Team C wins 2-1 both times Team A 6-4 Team C is 9-6 now they both have 60% win rates, but the having the finals going 6 games make it seem the better team became champion. The "problem" you raise here arises with the 2xBo3 format as well. The only reason it appears less significant or hidden here is because you chose the double elimination to extend only to the Ro8. If your tournament has an Ro32, it's just as possible for the losers' bracket finalist to win the tournament with a worse winrate by 2-1ing every set while the winner's bracket finalist wins every set 2-0. The small number of rounds simply hides this fact because it's not possible for the discrepancy to grow that large with only 3 rounds of double elimination. "Winrate" in the context of such a small sample size as this tournament is practically speaking, meaningless. And it shouldn't be used to determine the finals format. From a practical standpoint, there are only 2 factors to consider: number of games, and statistical advantage given to the Winner's bracket finalist. As I showed on the last page, the statistical advantage of being the Winner's bracket finalist is about 6%, and you get on average 1-2 less games in the finals. I consider that to be a pretty good tradeoff. On April 10 2012 18:09 MyTHicaL wrote: -I don't really like Grand Final format, however I'm uncertain that a 1-0 game advantage would be better (it means on average less total games) You realize that this is WHY people want a 1-0 game advantage format, right? A potential 6 games is grueling for the audience to watch, and even more so for the players to play (especially when the loser's bracket finalist ALREADY had to play the loser's final). Capping out at a maximum of 4 games is better, because the quality of those last 2 games isn't likely to be that good when everyone is so worn out. | ||
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wanghw008
United States6 Posts
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NoEfX
United States5 Posts
+ AMAZING player pool + Great production quality (lighting, sound, stream) + Great location for event Negatives - The caster lineup was not so strong - There was not a whole lot of free SWAG thrown into the crowd or handed out. - There were no meet-the-pros or autograph tables. If you wanted an autograph you had to just happen to run into a player - The advertisements were WAY TOO redundant. I HATED seeing the same exact AMD commercial 25+ times every day | ||
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ishboh
United States954 Posts
+ phreak and revington + kpop/interviews and other filler was good to make the downtime less boring + i liked the format. didn't mind the extra games + when freak would mention 'stats', such as common picks, how a certain champ is doing in the tournament, and more specifically, what champions are good for each player really helps add to the development of each player individually instead of just seeing a team comp against another team comp. + crowd was good, when they weren't trying to actually talk to the people talking on stage. i like the thundersticks idea, just sucks that the crowd had to tone it down. Negatives - christina V, she just really annoyed me. also, crowd interaction is good, but it seems unprofessional the way they were doing it to random people that shouted at her. - redbaron and dandinh weren't spectacular, i didn't hate them, i just think that ipl could get better casters - audio. peaking out the mic when they got excited really ruined the experience - missed some games, would like to have seen them on a 2nd stream - numbers/item builds were hard to see on the free stream's resolution Suggestions - i would really like to see what each PLAYER prefers champion-wise (like how doublelift likes vayne and corki). It would be awesome if they could come up with graphics for each team detailing what each player views their strongest 5 or so champions to be, or something like that. - statistics on most banned/played champs would be cool too, whether it just is said by players or if there is some sort of overlay with the stats on it. -2nd stream? even if uncasted would be fine by me. overall a great event and fun to watch | ||
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Deman
United Kingdom42 Posts
Positives + Great Tournament matches, not very many boring farm sessions, well done teams. + Double Elim Bracket, I always prefer this over Group Stages. + Nice location, seriously jealous of not being there for this one. + Interviews went well once Travis settled down. (Dyrus interview was great despite saying R**e) + Great atmosphere, showed and came across on the camera. Well done crowd! Negatives + 2 color commentators for the grand final, stupidest move ever. (Baron + Dan Dinh) + Bad lighting (expected in a conference room) + Horrible event sound to the point I muted it a number of times. (No balance between Interview, Casters, Adverts, Kpop) + If you're going to run double elim, show all the games, that's the point in not doing groups. + Questionable choice of game showing TSM vs Curse over Digntias vs CLG. To elaborate on the commentator thing, I read earlier people saying Caster/Commentator. I've always refered to this as Play-by-Play and Color commentator. Play-by-play is what I do, call the action as it happens in a clear and concise manor while color is typically a player/ex-player with in-depth analysis. In this case Baron is a 2k+ player as is Dan Dinh but with team experience. Therefore the commentary went from built up excitement of Phreak+Rivington to flat boring statistic overflow with Baron+Dan Dinh. Not the casters fault particularly just whoever decided to pair them up. Rivington with Dan Dinh would have been so much smoother as Riv like me is a flat out Play-by-Play guy thats done it for years. | ||
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