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On January 13 2012 16:56 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 16:50 Attakijing wrote:
op or up, viktor is awful because he is one of the shittiest character designs in a long while. his moves have absolutely zero synergy. his W E R and hexcore are just 4 ideas that riot wanted to test out, and instead of playtesting them they just put them in a champion and see who will buy him. Looking at the numbers it is really obvious that they were too scared to try to make him fill a new role and just made his E powerful with augment (.91 ap ratio)
for another example of what i am talking about look at leona. there is literally nothing interesting about her whatsoever. her passive maybe but it is literally a copy of lux's passive right down to the "light" effect. Well, leona is a failure from a design standpoint because Riot doesnt understand what a "tank" is and what a "support" is. They assumed that if you threw a bunch of cc and that passive together you would get a tank. Instead we get a champion who is realistically anything but. Actually, new champ looks like Riot take 2 at trying to put a new tank in the game. Of course, they had to lift 3 abilities from another tank to do it, plus use a bastardized version of the best initiation in the game. We shall see if they actually learned anything or not.
i appreciate your analysis and honestly you understand a whole lot more about the game than me. but again i am not talking about viability. from the perspective of someone who barely plays the game anymore what i mean is a lot of champions that come out are just sets of moves stolen from other champions. notable exception: riven, plays really fucking differently from anyone else in any moba
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On January 13 2012 17:02 Attakijing wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 16:56 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 16:50 Attakijing wrote:
op or up, viktor is awful because he is one of the shittiest character designs in a long while. his moves have absolutely zero synergy. his W E R and hexcore are just 4 ideas that riot wanted to test out, and instead of playtesting them they just put them in a champion and see who will buy him. Looking at the numbers it is really obvious that they were too scared to try to make him fill a new role and just made his E powerful with augment (.91 ap ratio)
for another example of what i am talking about look at leona. there is literally nothing interesting about her whatsoever. her passive maybe but it is literally a copy of lux's passive right down to the "light" effect. Well, leona is a failure from a design standpoint because Riot doesnt understand what a "tank" is and what a "support" is. They assumed that if you threw a bunch of cc and that passive together you would get a tank. Instead we get a champion who is realistically anything but. Actually, new champ looks like Riot take 2 at trying to put a new tank in the game. Of course, they had to lift 3 abilities from another tank to do it, plus use a bastardized version of the best initiation in the game. We shall see if they actually learned anything or not. i appreciate your analysis and honestly you understand a whole lot more about the game than me. but again i am not talking about viability. from the perspective of someone who barely plays the game anymore what i mean is a lot of champions that come out are just sets of moves stolen from other champions. notable exception: riven, plays really fucking differently from anyone else in any moba
I see what you are saying and I think we are both hitting on the same points in different ways.
To you, riven feels fun, exciting, and different because she has a role, a way of achieving a purpose, and a fun way of doing that. Riven was designed to be a mobile melee dps, only instead of the traditional movement blinks, she has a new take on how to move around the map. But most importantly she actually is capable of fulfilling her role and purpose, which leads to fulfilling game play.
But you look at leona, and things start to fall apart. Here the role, purpose, and gameplay fall apart. She was pegged for a role, but wasnt given the tools to actually fill it. She is meant to be a tank, but she doesnt really do any tanky stuff, and she doesnt feel like a tank when you play her. She feels like what she actually is, an aggressive support. She doesnt really have any moves stolen from other champs, but they dont fit together properly for either tank or really even support. So she wallows in semi uselessness.
I think this is the issue with Viktor for some people. He doesnt really have a clear role, and his kit reflects that. He is somewhere in between sustained and burst caster, with some of the abilities and playstyles of each. Where riot failed is that they could have used the augment as a way to let the player chose between how they wanted to play viktor- sustained or burst caster. For example, the q augment could reduce the cd and ap ratio on his e, making him less bursty and more sustained, while the e augment could boost the ap ratio and cd on his q to make him more of a burst caster. That way his kit fits a role, and would actually be rewarding for the player because you would be able to select his role and make sure his kit filled it.
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I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that.
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On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that.
Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either.
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On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either.
Just curious, what exactly is your definition of a tank?
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On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either.
No, it's not. You'd split farm, you're not just sitting there warding for garen. It's obsolete but that's the way it used to work and that's still how a lot of people play. It's a totally different style.
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On January 13 2012 17:16 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:02 Attakijing wrote:On January 13 2012 16:56 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 16:50 Attakijing wrote:
op or up, viktor is awful because he is one of the shittiest character designs in a long while. his moves have absolutely zero synergy. his W E R and hexcore are just 4 ideas that riot wanted to test out, and instead of playtesting them they just put them in a champion and see who will buy him. Looking at the numbers it is really obvious that they were too scared to try to make him fill a new role and just made his E powerful with augment (.91 ap ratio)
for another example of what i am talking about look at leona. there is literally nothing interesting about her whatsoever. her passive maybe but it is literally a copy of lux's passive right down to the "light" effect. Well, leona is a failure from a design standpoint because Riot doesnt understand what a "tank" is and what a "support" is. They assumed that if you threw a bunch of cc and that passive together you would get a tank. Instead we get a champion who is realistically anything but. Actually, new champ looks like Riot take 2 at trying to put a new tank in the game. Of course, they had to lift 3 abilities from another tank to do it, plus use a bastardized version of the best initiation in the game. We shall see if they actually learned anything or not. i appreciate your analysis and honestly you understand a whole lot more about the game than me. but again i am not talking about viability. from the perspective of someone who barely plays the game anymore what i mean is a lot of champions that come out are just sets of moves stolen from other champions. notable exception: riven, plays really fucking differently from anyone else in any moba I see what you are saying and I think we are both hitting on the same points in different ways. To you, riven feels fun, exciting, and different because she has a role, a way of achieving a purpose, and a fun way of doing that. Riven was designed to be a mobile melee dps, only instead of the traditional movement blinks, she has a new take on how to move around the map. But most importantly she actually is capable of fulfilling her role and purpose, which leads to fulfilling game play. But you look at leona, and things start to fall apart. Here the role, purpose, and gameplay fall apart. She was pegged for a role, but wasnt given the tools to actually fill it. She is meant to be a tank, but she doesnt really do any tanky stuff, and she doesnt feel like a tank when you play her. She feels like what she actually is, an aggressive support. She doesnt really have any moves stolen from other champs, but they dont fit together properly for either tank or really even support. So she wallows in semi uselessness. I think this is the issue with Viktor for some people. He doesnt really have a clear role, and his kit reflects that. He is somewhere in between sustained and burst caster, with some of the abilities and playstyles of each. Where riot failed is that they could have used the augment as a way to let the player chose between how they wanted to play viktor- sustained or burst caster. For example, the q augment could reduce the cd and ap ratio on his e, making him less bursty and more sustained, while the e augment could boost the ap ratio and cd on his q to make him more of a burst caster. That way his kit fits a role, and would actually be rewarding for the player because you would be able to select his role and make sure his kit filled it.
I agree on the whole leona point. Aside from her cc's, she doesn't do enough damage, nor be a nuisance enough to want to focus down. So she rarely get focused, ergo not tanking any real damage. She also doesn't peel champions off squishies too well, or that's my opinion. She's got a aoe intiate (dat ulti), which on paper is suppose to be amazing, but it only ever stuns like 1-2 targets at most, and maybe slow anohter one, and is fairly ez to dodge. Her zenith blade is like an amumu grab, except her sion esque shield doesn't do enough damage to synergies nearly as well as amumu's tears and aoe wrap damage. Also, having an autoattack stun isn't all that great, because it generally means you usually fully stun lock 1 person, zenith blade snares, then the autoattack happens right after that, which usually most players proc the 2nd stun, all the while 4 other enemy champions are just wallopping your entire team, and they just ignore you. Another problem with leona is that she's unable to do any real damage, or that's been my observation. She absolutely has no power curve, at least with a jungling/support amumu, or any other tank for that matter, still has a fairly strong midgame powercurve.
But I also feel a lot of players don't utilize her to her full extent, and that tehre's still room for improvement in leona play, before serious criticisms can be taken to say "oh she's completely non viable".
Some of the biggest things they need to change with leona, to "buff" her, is 1) increase move speed, for a character with such short range on a lot of stuff, and is almost always reliant on a short zenith blade to initiate, but often just gets out runned. 2)dat ulti needs to cast faster, a crippled cat with downsyndrome can dodge that ult. 3) make the shield beable to be casted on allies, and perhaps have nice powercurve to it.
just my 2cents.
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On January 13 2012 15:17 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 15:03 Cloud9157 wrote:On January 13 2012 14:49 Craton wrote:On January 13 2012 13:53 RogerX wrote:
I don't understand why majority of people I met says Viktor is weak...
His E is seriously amazing. With a really good CC for teamfights.
But yeah we've probably discussed this, just giving my opinons. 'cause if people can't go 10-0 every game with a champ within the first week of its release, they claim it's terrible. Or maybe its because Viktor actually isn't all that good? He does NOTHING better than any other mid. More burst? lolannie. More range? Cassio+Brand disagree. CC? Kennen and Swain have better CC than him. The main issue (for me) is his garbage range overall. Q is a really nice skill, except the missile speed is too slow. Enemy mid will be able to damage you before it returns to give you shield. My other problem is his passive. Don't get me wrong, it was a nice idea and all, but it will hurt him come late game. I would rather have another DC or a Void Staff than any of his augments. Viktor also gets a lane pushed on him super hard. All he has to clear a lane is E, and if you constantly use it, you will run out of mana. So his laning sucks imo, his mid is alright, and his late gets hurt because augments take up a spot. The one thing I can admit is that if Viktor does manage to land W for the stun, opponent will be taking a lot of damage. E+R will drain so many champs. His ult is the one thing that saves him from being awful to me. I play a lot of xerath, and I think Viktor has a few advantages. -Clearing power is much better, one E clears it all easily, xerath has to get pretty fat to do that. -Better autoattack, one of the best in the game -More consistent damage output, Xerath burst is amazing, but Viktor lazer outdamages normal Q spam in poke wars -More utility and safety in W, it can block an entire team from jumping you -ult is better in teamfights -mobility while casting (you can cast lazer while kiting) Xerath is amazing but he's more of a few target burst whereas Viktor is more of a team player, viktor severely punishes being initiated on in a way that Xerath doesn't. Obviously Xerath is better sniper and single target with better burst range, I still have no idea why pros arent all over him. Mana is fine also just get 2 Drings and no problem, same as Xerath
Viktor has one of hte cleanest attack animation of any champion. The problem I would say that sucks with viktor is that he just doesn't fit in the current meta, and therefore feels really underwhelming, at least in the current AP mid meta. I still think he can end up being an AP bruiser similar to swain, if he goes top and gets farmed extremely well. Maybe they should increase is base, tanky stats?
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On January 13 2012 17:24 JackDino wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either. Just curious, what exactly is your definition of a tank?
It isnt a definition so much as it is a role and a specific kit suited to that role.
In my opinion, there are 5 tanks in lol:
Amumu, Galio, Malphite, Rammus, and Shen.
The thing to note is that each is a tank in a specific sort of way. Amumu and Malphite tank by initiating and then sticking to someone and dealing consistent damage over time. Rammus does his Rammus thing, Galio uses his ult as an initiation and a peel, while shen uses his ult and taunt. But in each case you cant really make the argument that they are tanky dps. They arent going to burst someone down then switch targets, nor are they looking to deal a tremendous amount of sustained damage over the course of a fight and win by being the last one alive (like irelia). Realistically, their goal is to allow their team to work as freely as they possibly can.
The other thing you will note is the lack of a tremendous amount of cc. Sure, each has hard cc, but its on an ultimate, costs a lot, on a longish cooldown, or single target. But each champion has a specific best case scenario that is obvious not only to their team, but the enemy team as well. You KNOW what a rammus is trying to do and if he is doing it well.
But for each of these characters, their goal is generally the same- allow their team to act as freely as possible, but rather than doing it by killing or being super incredibly disruptive, they do it by peeling, low but constant dps, and getting in peoples faces.
Now lets look at leona. Her kit is flawed as a tank kit for a simple reason: it doesnt actually encourage you to tank. Compare leona to the rest of the tank champions. They all have significantly longer disables, but on longer cooldowns, and sources of damage that are on short cd but low overall. Leona is built more like alistar than galio. Lots of little disables that excel at catching people out of position, but no real follow up. What do you do after you e-q someone? Nothing. There is no longer a reason for you to exist. You dont get better by being alive longer, because you have, A) no follow up to that combo or an ult, and B) cooldowns that are way too long to actually be able to do another combo. The only disruption you do is run around being all shiny and gold on the screen. Riot realized this and tried to fix it with her passive, but all it does is to serve to make you feel even MORE useless, because once you apply your passive, you are, once again, useless, only this time you cant even proc it. So basically you have a combo/useful abilities once a go round in a fight, dont actually need gold to do that any better (and even if you have it, gold doesnt even make you do your job any better). All of those things are the mark of a support, not a tank.
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On January 13 2012 17:46 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:24 JackDino wrote:On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either. Just curious, what exactly is your definition of a tank? It isnt a definition so much as it is a role and a specific kit suited to that role. In my opinion, there are 5 tanks in lol: Amumu, Galio, Malphite, Rammus, and Shen. The thing to note is that each is a tank in a specific sort of way. Amumu and Malphite tank by initiating and then sticking to someone and dealing consistent damage over time. Rammus does his Rammus thing, Galio uses his ult as an initiation and a peel, while shen uses his ult and taunt. But in each case you cant really make the argument that they are tanky dps. They arent going to burst someone down then switch targets, nor are they looking to deal a tremendous amount of sustained damage over the course of a fight and win by being the last one alive (like irelia). Realistically, their goal is to allow their team to work as freely as they possibly can. The other thing you will note is the lack of a tremendous amount of cc. Sure, each has hard cc, but its on an ultimate, costs a lot, on a longish cooldown, or single target. But each champion has a specific best case scenario that is obvious not only to their team, but the enemy team as well. You KNOW what a rammus is trying to do and if he is doing it well. But for each of these characters, their goal is generally the same- allow their team to act as freely as possible, but rather than doing it by killing or being super incredibly disruptive, they do it by peeling, low but constant dps, and getting in peoples faces. Now lets look at leona. Her kit is flawed as a tank kit for a simple reason: it doesnt actually encourage you to tank. Compare leona to the rest of the tank champions. They all have significantly longer disables, but on longer cooldowns, and sources of damage that are on short cd but low overall. Leona is built more like alistar than galio. Lots of little disables that excel at catching people out of position, but no real follow up. What do you do after you e-q someone? Nothing. There is no longer a reason for you to exist. You dont get better by being alive longer, because you have, A) no follow up to that combo or an ult, and B) cooldowns that are way too long to actually be able to do another combo. The only disruption you do is run around being all shiny and gold on the screen. Riot realized this and tried to fix it with her passive, but all it does is to serve to make you feel even MORE useless, because once you apply your passive, you are, once again, useless, only this time you cant even proc it. So basically you have a combo/useful abilities once a go round in a fight, dont actually need gold to do that any better (and even if you have it, gold doesnt even make you do your job any better). All of those things are the mark of a support, not a tank.
tbh she feels like a lux that does no dmg.
and no alistar in there?
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On January 13 2012 17:25 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either. No, it's not. You'd split farm, you're not just sitting there warding for garen. It's obsolete but that's the way it used to work and that's still how a lot of people play. It's a totally different style.
In that lane, who gets the farm.
Hint: it aint leona. She doesnt need it. It doesnt make her any better.
Now ask yourself: If you were playing that lane with, say, rammus or galio, could that champion still do their job come late game if garen got all the farm?
Leona is a support, and a bad one because she isnt optimized for it.
@ wei- Ali is a support, not a tank, for the same reason leona is. No follow up power, gold doesnt make him any better, combo that is on too long a cd to actually be relied on more than once a fight.
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at level 11 her full combo if she gets two sunlight procs off does a thousand damage, most of which is aoe, plus it's stapled to triple cc. That's... pretty good, actually. The reason you don't see her at a high level has nothing to do with her skills being weak, she just doesn't support well. That's not a problem. I don't care and riot doesn't seem to either, which makes me happy. She has exactly the same problems as high level blitz, that is to say, no problems at all, she just doesn't fit and that's ok. If the game goes on long enough either riot will kill support ad or the game will actually turn out not to be solved and it'll turn away from that, in either case I'm sure she'll be one of the best heroes in the game.
On January 13 2012 17:49 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:25 UniversalSnip wrote:On January 13 2012 17:24 Two_DoWn wrote:On January 13 2012 17:22 UniversalSnip wrote:
I think leona's design is great. She would fit into a role fine if support/ad bot weren't so good, if you could run like garen + a stun or something anymore she'd be crazy. The only reason she feels like a bad support is because she IS a bad support, that's not her role just like it isn't blitzcrank's role. Im fine with that.
I don't care if riot makes champions that don't feed into the way the game has been solved, it's pretty weird to see that as a bad thing. She's fun to play with and against and her skills come together well and she's great thematically and she's fine for 80% of players at least, I don't think it's design's job to accomplish more than that. Well, the issue is that even in that scenario, she isnt a tank, you just made her a support again. Which was my point- they wanted a tank, got a support, and now she is half way in between and not great at either. No, it's not. You'd split farm, you're not just sitting there warding for garen. It's obsolete but that's the way it used to work and that's still how a lot of people play. It's a totally different style. In that lane, who gets the farm. Hint: it aint leona. She doesnt need it. It doesnt make her any better.
Get serious, once you see shushei get fed with leona you won't say she doesn't get better with items. I'm simply not willing to entertain that argument because it's empirically false. I've seen her with items, it's scary.
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I feel that way as well. She just doesn't have a place in the current meta. Kinda like fizz, anivia, poppy. all strong characters in thier own right, they just don't belong anywhere in lane or in the jungle in the current meta.
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On January 13 2012 17:57 UniversalSnip wrote:
at level 11 her full combo if she gets two sunlight procs off does a thousand damage, most of which is aoe, plus it's stapled to triple cc. That's... pretty good, actually. The reason you don't see her at a high level has nothing to do with her skills being weak, she just doesn't support well. That's not a problem. I don't care and riot doesn't seem to either, which makes me happy. She has exactly the same problems as high level blitz, that is to say, no problems at all, she just doesn't fit and that's ok. If the game goes on long enough either riot will kill support ad or the game will actually turn out not to be solved and it'll turn away from that, in either case I'm sure she'll be one of the best heroes in the game.
She's one of the funnest champions to play.
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Leona can tank just fine, if you get farm you can build tanky cdr and initiate perfectly fine, and completely lock down someone. That's not what a support does. It's just that she's bad in a sololane.
Amumu isn't a tank, all he has is his ult, when that's on cd he can bandage once every ~10? seconds and just run around crying.
The things your tanks do can be done by a lot of bruisers aswell.
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On January 13 2012 13:50 tobi9999 wrote:
what the fk.
I can't believe it
Ashe Sona bot is #1 in ranked solo queue.
2 games in a row, stand in bush at 1:30, they facecheck power chord + crit + volley= insta kill on anyone.
Then just proceed to farm and laugh as you support your jungler ganks with Ashe ult + Sona ult.
It doesn't even matter if they have cleanse, ECA CD < Cleanse CD.
would be 2-0 with it, if one of the games wasn't a 3v5 where 2 people DC'd when we were 10 kills up in the middle of the game t_T
EDIT: I'm depressed people actually fall for this shit, it makes me so sad that I'm the same ELO as these retards. I have no idea how they got past 1200 :/ let alone 1500
got a pub to do this with me in ranked. despite the fact that he went after the carry (700 HP graves wtf) and i went after the support (much easier 400 hp soraka), we almost killed both of them and had a pretty easy lane from there
gonna try to cheese this some more
reminds me of my good ol' AP support taric days
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Haters gonna hate on mah Leona.
But sadly, it seems like everything Leona does, Alistar does better, especially with dat ult.
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On January 13 2012 17:59 Kaneh wrote:
I feel that way as well. She just doesn't have a place in the current meta. Kinda like fizz, anivia, poppy. all strong characters in thier own right, they just don't belong anywhere in lane or in the jungle in the current meta.
Anivia, really? Should check out Froggen and jiji's streams more often. Anivia is the shit.
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On January 13 2012 19:05 Eishi_Ki wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 17:59 Kaneh wrote:
I feel that way as well. She just doesn't have a place in the current meta. Kinda like fizz, anivia, poppy. all strong characters in thier own right, they just don't belong anywhere in lane or in the jungle in the current meta. Anivia, really? Should check out Froggen and jiji's streams more often. Anivia is the shit.
Yeah...but something about Anivia seems lost. I remember the gold old days when Anivia just one shotted everyone.
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EPT
