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is awesome32277 Posts
On July 12 2011 15:48 Kaniol wrote:
Though i think we could lessen the post numbers at the GD forums if we had separate "current metagame" thread (we could keep our talk about how malz is suber strong laner, how unstoppable is solo top ww/udyr, etc. There's a lot of posts like that so the topic wouldn't die and at the same time moving posts related to this topic from GD wouldn't have killed the GD).
I agree with this. We should have a "Current FOTM" thread. LoL is evolving a lot, and knowing what's good currently and how to counter it is a big key to success.
I think we lack a "rune buying guide". Everyone who's new has this question. What runes to buy, what tier, etc.
Same with champions probably. Maybe a "If you want to be competitive, this is a must have champion list".
We could make a thread for masteries discussion as well. I remember there was one for gold item efficiency, etc.
We need a "proper warding" thread as well with pictures!
While the amount of people that post here is not enormous, there's a lot of people who lurk and specially lots of guys maybe scared to try the game, or that want to learn. We can definitely do better in that aspect!
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After reading everyone else's posts, I really feel that the General Discussion thread should just stay the way it is. It's pretty fun and interesting to see what people say. It's pretty much a IRC chat thread, but it's nice in that unlike an actual IRC, you can just drop a line, go do something, and come back at leisure.
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I feel like the strings of coherent content in General Discussion are too short to be worth a seperate thread in the majority of cases. There are like 10, maybe 20 posts about one topic and then that's it. By turning that into threads not only do you create many tiny threads, you also push other threads off the main page. Currently you can look at the first 20 threads and you will have patch notes, general discussion, around 10 champion threads and a couple of other threads. Those champ threads are very likely to be about a champ that is rather popular at the moment. It works out pretty nicely.
Now a suggestion that goes beyond the usual forum structure:
It would be great if we had a wiki-like (sub-)subforum. Integrated into TL. It would cover all the champs and other recurring topics like those ITW mentioned. The "main" forum would then cover general discussion etc.
Afaik TL doesn't have this functionality though; it just links a normal wiki. I don't know how much you can do to customize wikis, but if you can create a frontpage that always lists all the champs in one column and the other stuff in another one then that might be good.
The wiki link would have to be displayed similar to a sticky thread.
A way to search on BOTH TL and that wiki from within TL would be epic. (same goes for the SC/SC2 wikis btw)
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Why not just have a new general thread every week or month or something?
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I think the champion thread is god awful to be honest, most threads are not updated properly or are just way off and old.
If someone makes a champ thread they should be responsible for keeping it up to date or it will be closed. If the creator goes inactive the new mods can go in and edit the post for more accurate information.
These mods obviously have to be respected and knowledgeable players.
And like Lafali says, A general thread per month just like SC2 section has would be a much better idea than one massive thread.
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United States37500 Posts
On July 12 2011 10:20 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
Hi jerks
so, let's say hypothetically we have a little more manpower around here and we can actually organize things better. TL LoL is pretty lively these days (general discussion thread has over 20k posts rofl), and after talking to some LoL players from the boards I've been thinking that the current setup is kinda restrictive for a number of reasons. I think this game is pretty badass, so I'm looking to make some changes that will create a tidier LoL section that has a little more freedom of discussion than one thread, as well as better access to better maintained resources.
Since this is TeamLiquid, we are going to discuss this to death both here and in the staff forum (not you guys though LOL), so the sooner we have a legitimate plan the sooner we will actually see changes.
If you have any suggestions, or things you'd like to see, please post them here. In the meantime here's some specific things I'd like some feedback on:
1) The general discussion thread. We started this subforum in the first place because the old LoL discussion thread was massive. This is evidently still a problem. How should we fix this? It's not a problem in the BW and SC2 sections because there are separate subforums for discussion, strategy, and tournaments. Do we need something like that here? Is there really enough traffic to warrant it?
Is a large GD thread actually a problem? Only down side I see is that if you don't check it daily, it explodes into double digit pages to read when you eventually do come back.
If, for whatever reason, high post GD thread is not what TL wants, then we need more separate threads for discussions. Livestream thread, tourney thread, patch thread (in existence but keep talk in there from now on), metagame thread, and obviously more champion threads.
As much as I love LoL, I don't think we need/deserve subforums. Our unique posters in this section barely hits 100 imo.
2) Champion threads. These are intended to be a resource, but there are a few issues with how they're implemented right now. I think ideally we'd have specific people open specific champion threads and require those threads to be thorough and up-to-date, at least in terms of things like stats and ability changes in patches. How should we deal with champion threads that are posted before champion release? Maybe we need a new champ discussion/speculation thread.
1. New champion discussion should be limited to the Patch Discussion thread when new information is initially released. New champion threads shouldn't be created until...
2. Champion threads should be opened by mods only. Reasons are twofold: first, mods are probably very active in this section, so they'll read their own threads diligently. Second, they'll update the OP more regularly due to their activity. One of the main reasons why the champion threads don't work so well (and why it's mostly cluttering up the General Discussion thread) is because champion threads are so poorly maintained.
3. These threads need to be updated per champion patch change. e.g. Annie thread probably won't have any updates in the foreseeable future. Udyr thread should have been updated last week since his changes allowed for the resurgence of Jungle Phoenix Udyr and Lanedyr.
3) Moderation. I've heard a lot of complaints that bad advice isn't policed around here. We can moderate more thoroughly, even recruit additional LoL playing people to moderate champion threads and police bad advice, but we justify doing so in the BW and SC2 strategy sections because there's a constant flow of contribution, and a structure that makes it readable. Basically I want to know how seriously you want TL to take this game.
Ok, GO
I am all for moderators in this section. I'll go into greater detail is needed but this section could be a lot better than it currently is.
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Wow.. It seems I'm the only one that would like GD thread switch into sth like GD subforum.
It doesn't mean that it would lose this all beloved free chat feel it has.
But it would become rather more informative and easier to track for those who don't have time to read everything cluttering in there.
I like amount and diversification of information packed there but with little time I have it's sometimes frustrating to be forced to read everything.
I'd love to be able to skip some topics just by reading first post.
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If we were to get rid of some of those defunct champion threads, I could certaintly keep one or a few up to date if they are champions I'm interested in. I like that kind of stuff, I used to it on other forums a lot.
I like ITW's suggestion about the chatter too. I think most, if not all, of it should stay in GD since, I mean, I think that's what it's partially for anyway. It actually does not bother me much but it would make the place a lot cleaner this way.
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The only issue I see with asking people to moderate this forum, is that it feels like the average age and maturity of an LoL player is about 5 years behind that of Starcraft fans. A large majority of posts in this forum are nonsensical babble about qq, ^^, lololol, huehuehuehue, etc.
While we are a microcosm of the entire LoL community, the maturity level can't help but bleed into our little corner of the world even if TeamLiquid is officially the parent of this subforum.
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On July 12 2011 21:13 Psyqo wrote:
The only issue I see with asking people to moderate this forum, is that it feels like the average age and maturity of an LoL player is about 5 years behind that of Starcraft fans. A large majority of posts in this forum are nonsensical babble about qq, ^^, lololol, huehuehuehue, etc.
While we are a microcosm of the entire LoL community, the maturity level can't help but bleed into our little corner of the world even if TeamLiquid is officially the parent of this subforum.
lolllll that's not true at all. The only reason you might see less retards posting on TL is because the moderating has gotten' sharp as fuck. SC2 brought in an innumerable amount of these lololol posters. Not that it's directly SC2's fault but that's just how popular it was.
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I also think that we do need to have a few mods specific to the lol forum. Although we are part of TL, the posting culture here is a lot different from the rest of the site, and that does tend to create bans and warnings from mods that really arent worthy. A different game requires different types of discussion, and different types of moderation as well. Most of us know each other in some form or another, so there should be a bit more leeway when posting IMO.
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I'll have a rune buying guide out later today that's a good idea ITW =)
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let me moderate the forum please i guarantee 100% satisfaction or your money back
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On July 12 2011 16:18 IntoTheWow wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 15:45 locodoco wrote:On July 12 2011 13:44 Chrispy wrote:
1. Never give Locodoco moderator powers here. Ever. For the love of all that is holy, just don't do it!
2. Keep the General Discussion thread as that is the heart of our power.
That is all. ur the first on my to-ban list Not to pick on locodoco or Chrispy here, but I think these kind of off-topic jab/sdiscussions needs to go, at least from any thread but the "general / off-topic thread". It's really annoying when reading a champion thread (or basically in any thread searching for information) to have it invaded by off-topic chat between friends. You know each other on LoL, you have each other on your friend list. Poke yourselves there or in the off-topic chat.Here's a quick example I found: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=242821
Are you sure it's annoying to everyone and not just you? Like i said if you want to create a community here you will have to feed the egos of prestigious players. If you want to make an impartial subforum where anyone can talk about league of legends in with wiki-style editing and segmented discussion, that's a different goal, and one that might not sit well with the established community as it is more about recruiting new players and educating them on a central canon of information. Which do you want, a university or a community? And also, is it your place to decide? (That's not hypothetical--I don't know what TL standard practice is)
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1. As others have said, not sure there's anything to do with the GDT. In fact I sort of prefer it being there, although I'd be fine with cleaning up some of the useless posts.
2. This is a tough nut, to be honest, because by nature threads require someone to actually keep track of it, whether it's the OP or a Mod, neither of whom are necessarily going to stay forever. This game can be frustrating, and time-consuming, and it's not out of the ordinary to have someone step away for a while to recharge, and we might see an exodus of some players in the future when DotA2 hits the shelves. In a way it may simply be better to go back to a wiki system for champions, as it'd provide a much more fluid system of keeping info in place, while having champion threads remain what they are now - a place to ask questions and discuss champions as they're affected by patches. That said I come from a Japanese background and you know us, we love dem wikis.
3. This is a bit tougher than it seems, I think. To an extent I personally prefer to have some pride in the TL LoL subforum being a great place to get knowledge. But moreso than BW/SC2 it's harder to tell when a good player is wrong, and if some bizarre idea by a not-good player happens to be a diamond in the rough. It's also worth noting that the game differs SO MUCH at different play levels, and even then the play differs drastically between solo and team, that what may be good advice for some people may be dreadful advice for others. Even if it's coming from a so-called good player. There's a lot of hero-specific advice from top-end players that I wouldn't recommend to people-not-that-person (ie. Brees' GB Udyr), but does that mean it's a bad strategy, or that it wouldn't work, or whatnot? It doesn't. And so where does the line get drawn? If a 1300 player has wild success using a strategy that 1700s consider silly, does that constitute bad advice, or is it reasonable to simply view it as a 1300s strategy?
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Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
1) I think we don't need Subforums in a subforum the same way SC2 and BW have. Not yet at least. However, it would be nice if thread titles all had markers the same way the champion threads do so they are easier to find. There should also be a directory sticky thread where it lists all the champions threads so there's no need to search. This is because some champions threads have misspellings (on purpose sometimes) which means some people might not find the thread they want by searching.
2) There needs to be a way to update the OP of a thread if the creator is not around to update it. PM-ing a Mod does not seem to be an optimal solution since I don't know who to PM. Perhaps we could have our own banlings in this subforum who could do things like this?
3) I think more moderation is good. It means cleaner forums and also OPs of threads could stay updated like I mentioned above. But they would need to come from this subforum. Too many things here could be taken out of context by random mods/admins.
As for myself, I will try to keep the Tech Thread I created updated and reply often. If there's anything else you feel I could do, I can see if I can do it.
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On July 13 2011 01:40 MoonBear wrote:
1) I think we don't need Subforums in a subforum the same way SC2 and BW have. Not yet at least. However, it would be nice if thread titles all had markers the same way the champion threads do so they are easier to find. There should also be a directory sticky thread where it lists all the champions threads so there's no need to search. This is because some champions threads have misspellings (on purpose sometimes) which means some people might not find the thread they want by searching.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=166096
:D
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Fakesteve is a dirty sakura player however because i'm such a nice person I've decided to contribute.
INDEPTH RUNE GUIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that i didn't write
http://runeterra.com/forums/index.php?topic=1137.0
There is an underlying assumption here that you only care about the most cost effective runes. This being said if you go with all the "S Tier runes" you are essentially limited to an AD champion. (Which makes sense because AD champions take the longest to farm.
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1) The general discussion thread.
It's cool as it is. Maybe some event-specific threads for LR/comments, but that's about it.
2) Champion threads.
What I don't like right now is that there are quite some OPs that aren't up to date at all. Usually what I do when I want info on a certain champ is google "champname+teamliquid" which leads me to his appropriate thread. Some OPs are pure info on skills, some are huge in-depth guides, some have the tl;dr sections. In my opinion it should have to be enough to read OP and last 1-2 pages to have a solid knowledge how this champ can and should be played in the current environment.
What I miss is some way to get high quality posts in champ threads more attention. Sometimes you have the high elos here throw in great posts which get kinda not seen in a 10 page thread as much as they should be. No idea though how to implement it besides mods updating the OP with quotes at the end.
Champ threads that are posted before release (as much as I love speculating in there, too) should be reset once the champ IS released. e.g. "[Speculation] Orianna" will just run out of posts and someone who's confident in writing a guide to her will open "[Champion] Orianna" once he feels ready for it.
We could think about 2 threads for each champ, one being pure discussion/Q&A etc. and the other only and I mean only for guides. I'd love that kind of splitting, but it might get confusing. Just some food for thought there.
3) Moderation.
Treat it seriously in my opinion. Bad advice should be moderated, questionable advice should be tolerated. Usually the bad stuff get's flamed down within a few pages (I remember that high elo Irelia dude in general), stuff like that shouldn't be in champ threads at all. Personally I feel as if this sub-community moderates itself pretty well by having a high enough "solid-to-newb-ratio".
Some structure as to "How should a guide look like?" / "What to ask where?" / "If you claim things that are different, please state as to why we should believe you." (similar to "Post fucking replays in strategy discussions" in the SC part) would be nice. Guess a decent "Welcome to this subforum"-thread would the trick.
I actually think LoL threads are too heavily moderated especially by mods who don't read this forum. I've not really seen anything ban worthy here.
^---100% agree here.
Edit: If stuff like "Guide on warding" "general jungle guide" "rune-buying guide" is appreciated, just give it a short shout. I'm bored for an hour or two from time to time and it would be no problem for me to make some of those.
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On July 12 2011 16:18 IntoTheWow wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 15:45 locodoco wrote:On July 12 2011 13:44 Chrispy wrote:
1. Never give Locodoco moderator powers here. Ever. For the love of all that is holy, just don't do it!
2. Keep the General Discussion thread as that is the heart of our power.
That is all. ur the first on my to-ban list Not to pick on locodoco or Chrispy here, but I think these kind of off-topic jab/sdiscussions needs to go, at least from any thread but the "general / off-topic thread". It's really annoying when reading a champion thread (or basically in any thread searching for information) to have it invaded by off-topic chat between friends. You know each other on LoL, you have each other on your friend list. Poke yourselves there or in the off-topic chat. Here's a quick example I found: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=242821
oh c'mon is this a classical music forum?
I can understand thread derailment, but posts that brings shits and giggles for 2 seconds does not merit some type of warning.
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EPT
