EPTViability of items that nobody gets - Page 2
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Caller
Poland8075 Posts
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DarthThienAn
United States2734 Posts
On January 02 2011 05:09 spinesheath wrote: Soo Tiamat is stronger on Melee champs, that's true, but... uh, is Tiamat Garen the new troll champ? Gotta love that Mana Regen too. Ask Caller about it 8) | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On January 03 2011 23:21 Zato-1 wrote: Wit's End can win games. Super-tanky characters with low mana pools who are useless when oom (Alistar, Nunu, Rammus for example) can be easier to drain out of their mana pools (particularly if more than one person on your team gets a Wit's End, such as Xin Zhao + 1 ranged carry) than harassed / killed, depending on the damage output of your team. It's certainly a very rare situation, but a win's a win. The 40% attack speed + 30 MRes on the item are also moderately desirable stats for its cost (2150g) ever since the Last Whisper change, but ideally you're only getting it when the mana drain hurts the enemy team significantly. Yep. Wit's End is very effective vs. low mana pool tanks and it's also very effective vs. steriotypical blue buff hogs (Kassadin and Anivia come to mind). Typically, if I think Wit's End can potentially ruin 3 characters on their team I will get it on Warwick, but it's still a very small niche. | ||
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Scorcher2k
United States802 Posts
On January 04 2011 01:02 Jaksiel wrote: Yi explodes a creep wave quickly enough just from Alpha Strike and auto-attack, you don't need a TIamat. Bad example? How about the other two? | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On January 03 2011 23:21 Zato-1 wrote: Wit's End can win games. Super-tanky characters with low mana pools who are useless when oom (Alistar, Nunu, Rammus for example) can be easier to drain out of their mana pools (particularly if more than one person on your team gets a Wit's End, such as Xin Zhao + 1 ranged carry) than harassed / killed, depending on the damage output of your team. It's certainly a very rare situation, but a win's a win. The 40% attack speed + 30 MRes on the item are also moderately desirable stats for its cost (2150g) ever since the Last Whisper change, but ideally you're only getting it when the mana drain hurts the enemy team significantly. And then they build towards a frozen heart. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
1) the splash range sucks 2) the splash range absolutely friggin' sucks 3) the splash range is terrible 4) A large portion of its cost is devoted to regen - it only appears cost effective because mana regen is terribly overpriced 5) the splash range is so bad 5b) i mean really if your enemies consistently bunch up that close to each other just pick Ryze or Annie or in fact any AoE burst caster congrats you're 500x more effective 6) You're paying 400 extra gold for a weaker bf sword that doesn't build into anything and a little regen The only thing I like about it is you can open regen bead and faerie charm. To trick your opponents into thinking you're building one. | ||
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Caller
Poland8075 Posts
On January 04 2011 03:37 Tooplark wrote: The reasons why no one should ever seriously buy a Tiamat: 1) the splash range sucks 2) the splash range absolutely friggin' sucks 3) the splash range is terrible 4) A large portion of its cost is devoted to regen - it only appears cost effective because mana regen is terribly overpriced 5) the splash range is so bad 5b) i mean really if your enemies consistently bunch up that close to each other just pick Ryze or Annie or in fact any AoE burst caster congrats you're 500x more effective 6) You're paying 400 extra gold for a weaker bf sword that doesn't build into anything and a little regen The only thing I like about it is you can open regen bead and faerie charm. To trick your opponents into thinking you're building one. combine 2 tiamats get ubermat +85 damage double splash radius etc | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
the mana burn sounds good, but in reality, any auto-attack champ will never actually burn enough mana to matter before the other thing dies, leaving you with just the +42 dmg, but only on some champs. In most cases, there are better damage items. WW works with it because his ult is naturally good for proc based damage (~200 to his ult), because it doesn't depend on AS to work, and because they're guaranteed hits. That means that he can effectively use it early game when mana pools and regen are small enough to matter. Another thing being that the MR is actually useful on him. | ||
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
Also, wits end is more effective than on paper because generally champions such as ashe or AD kogmaw or even nunus. harass before team fights, and so when the fights actually start they generally have about half their mana pool. Hitting them a few times will completely eliminate their pool. Also I would have to disagree that wit's end works on anivia or kassadin. They have huge mana pools with the items they tend to get so you will never burn a significant amount. Also, if they build towards a frozen heart, keep in mind that your wit's end is about 1k gold cheaper than their frozen heart. You have 1k gold extra on your next item provided you are both on an even farm. Even if they get the frozen heart, wit's end deals magic damage, so the armor they gain will not reduce the 42 damage in any way. | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On January 04 2011 06:50 Kaneh wrote: the mana burn sounds good, but in reality, any auto-attack champ will never actually burn enough mana to matter before the other thing dies, leaving you with just the +42 dmg, but only on some champs. In most cases, there are better damage items. what? are you saying that trist is gonna kill a rammus in W-mode before she drains a significant amount of mana? of course not. what about an amumu that's running around waiting for the fight to start that she can snipe 4 hits on. do you think he's going to feel that -160 mana when he's trying to chase someone down after the fight? yeah. don't be dumb | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On January 04 2011 03:37 Tooplark wrote: 4) A large portion of its cost is devoted to regen - it only appears cost effective because mana regen is terribly overpriced To be fair, I think mana regen is actually priced fine, it's just that runes and meditation are completely broken Anivia and kassadin are the only champs I can think of that actually have to manage their mana much past the fifteen minute mark, that's just stupid | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
also its too expensive for what little it gives, not to mention it has poor buildup (4 fucking slots to build into 1 shitty midtier item? no thx) | ||
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HeavOnEarth
United States7087 Posts
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Crazazyasian1337
United States362 Posts
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On January 04 2011 09:28 HeavOnEarth wrote: why do poppys stack philo stones i never understood poppys suck at farming and like to roam around, so a fairly cheap item that gives gold/5 and hp/mp regen kinda makes sense | ||
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dignity
Canada908 Posts
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
The only time I would consider getting it is if I haven't farmed up my IE yet and they have burst casters gunning for me and killing me...and that doesn't happen very often. | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
On January 04 2011 07:17 gtrsrs wrote: what? are you saying that trist is gonna kill a rammus in W-mode before she drains a significant amount of mana? of course not. what about an amumu that's running around waiting for the fight to start that she can snipe 4 hits on. do you think he's going to feel that -160 mana when he's trying to chase someone down after the fight? yeah. don't be dumb so you're gonna focus down that rammus with W on right? let's focus tanks to make an item good! -_- don't be dumb he's def gonna feel that mana when he chases you after you lose that fight. It comes back to wtf is the point. It's an extremely back loaded effect - until they run out of mana, it's effect is exactly nil. Back loaded stuff just isn't viable. Stuff that makes you win the fight now wins. Initiating first wins. Getting that first person down before they can do anything wins. doing damage now and not later wins. EDIT:: against anivia and kass - again, if you're a realy auto-attack champ, they will die long before the mana burn has any real effect. unless they're some kinda troll tank. | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On January 04 2011 11:07 Blitzkrieg0 wrote: Completely shuts down is an exaggeration. The shield is pretty niche if it's going to be useful or not, and in almost all the games I've encountered it's the latter. Building up a banshees is almost always a better option in my opinion, and while more expensive it's so much more useful that it's worth the price tag. The only time I would consider getting it is if I haven't farmed up my IE yet and they have burst casters gunning for me and killing me...and that doesn't happen very often. you don't build hexdrinker on any hero you would build an ie on item is good | ||
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-Kato-
Spain1146 Posts
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