General Discussion/Off-topic - Page 1098

One of my major problems with the jungle right now is that due to the long respawn timers, there actually is little choice for the player - you have a set route and you gank (generally) when your jungle is clear. There are times when you vary this, but for the most part this is what you do. We'd like to make it so that at all given points, junglers have more interesting choices for what they want to do - should I level up, gank, invade, etc? Ideally they'd all be more valuable for actually doing, but have a higher opportunity cost for doing so - in other words they're all good options but you have to pick what would be most advantageous for your team.

On July 20 2011 12:28 r33k wrote:

You can balance exp tho, making rich junglers who are squishy by nature overly squishy or vice versa.


What champions were you referring to.

On July 20 2011 12:42 UniversalSnip wrote:


I listed three that could be much more effective early if weren't for the threat of being imba with red buff... shaco nunu and ww. There are a number of characters that red buff causes problems on though.

Remember when eve could jungle? She's bad for the game no matter what, but when she could freely pick up lizard it broke the character.

On July 20 2011 12:45 Brees wrote:
The TL;DR

" We already turned bottom lane into a passive ranged AD and support farm fest, we now want top lane to mimic this with a melee AD(who has a slow) and support top lane farm fest. Junglers will be no longer and the perfect team will soon be

AP carry mid

support + melee AD w/ slow top

support + ranged AD bot (ashe banned every game)

On July 20 2011 11:21 TheYango wrote:

Nerf to ganking, nerf to counterjungling. The only junglers I can see liking this are AFK-farm junglers that become super strong mid-late game off free-farm (e.g. Amumu).

On July 20 2011 12:56 LoCicero wrote:
The issue I see with this is that jungling doesn't really provide enough gold to compete with the lanes. If they're nerfing ganking they really need to be buffing the gold provided by jungle creeps.

On July 20 2011 12:50 r33k wrote:

Nunu doesn't need redbuff, neither does ww when ganking a lane where your teammate has another stun and big damage (annie, sion, malz), shaco is useless and needs a full rework. Even then, make E a more efficient slow and his ganking would be fine.

EDIT: this is referring to the current redbuff. As I said before I highly doubt Guinsoo would make redbuff into just a passive +ms buff.

On July 20 2011 12:51 Kaneh wrote:


oh man, reminds me of pulling neutrals to to deny your own.

but isn't dual stun/rape > support/AD carry? can't you just completely zone the shit out of the other side? especially if in your proposed new meta, there is no jungle?

On July 20 2011 12:58 r33k wrote:

blitzstar or something like taric/poppy can break AD/support lanes without much effort, but top US players are too busy cowering in the shadow of the EU master race to try anything they know that works. Also taric/vanye does the same thing and is an EU style lane, so you can just try and get that in the banks/picks phase.

Also they can nerf ashe like np. Just nerf her late game damage while keeping her arrow as it is now like it says in zileas' anti design patterns and pretend you don't realize it.

On July 20 2011 12:58 UniversalSnip wrote:


We're talking early game, like levels 1-5. WW is king of sustain but in straight up 1 vs 1 instead of an attrition scenario he's quite weak early without red. Good luck ganking with nunu against somebody who isn't overextended without red. etc. Basically there are a lot of characters that have to be set up so they're balanced early with red, as a result they're weak without it for the first few levels.

On July 20 2011 13:00 Seiuchi wrote:


I'm pretty sure they're too scared to do stun/rape lanes because the only times they've done it in tourneys lately it's been Taric/Garen and that's been shut down np.


Also no one plays Blitz other than Doublelift and his is always banned.

On July 20 2011 13:01 r33k wrote:

You completely lost me. Are you suggesting that jungle WW should gank before lv6 and that nunu needs a melee slow to get 2v1 kills?

On July 20 2011 13:10 Brees wrote:
stun lanes are fun for lookin cool in pubs but that shit really doesnt transfer over at all. The Bushes will get warded by supports and they will simply keep their distance and cs. Then you are left with 2 bumbling average cs characters that cant do anything past lane domination. Even if you kill support/ad carry lane once or twice with blitz/poppy, you are still only breaking even or maybe even still down.

On July 20 2011 13:09 UniversalSnip wrote:


I'm only gonna go over this one more time ok? If it still doesn't make sense I'm sorry I'm explaining it so poorly.

Because red is in the game, characters that can get red early have to SUCK BALLS at ganking and/or fighting until level 5 or 6 without it. Otherwise they would be BROKEN GOD GANKERS with it. This is what happened to eve, they basically had to remove red buff from her because she was good at ganking without it and just stupid with it.

If you remove RED BUFF, you can take these champions - most junglers - that are kinda garbage gankers without red and good ones with it and make them decent gankers without red.

On July 20 2011 13:18 r33k wrote:

3man tower kill at lv5 after a successful gank still kills a carry for the rest of the game. Especially if you have blitz+alistar to press your advantage.


Simply put, no. You can't give a slow or a stun to every champion who can't tank a tower. Every character would play exactly the same and is the worst thing that can happen to a game.