Opening Week broadcast will begin Wednesday, Oct 28 8:30pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Blizzcon Day 1 will begin Saturday, Nov 07 12:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) Blizzcon Day 2 will begin Saturday, Nov 07 5:45pm GMT (GMT+00:00)
Group A: Cloud9 vs Logi GIA Group A: Team YL vs Team Dignitas Group B: Team DK vs Tempo Storm Group B: Natus Vincere vs Brave Heart Group A Winners Match Group B Winners Match
Saturday, Nov 07 12:00am GMT (GMT+00:00)
Group A: Elimination Match Group B: Elimination Match Group A: Decider Match Group B: Decider Match
Judging from the last time Korea vs EU/NA happened (or Korea vs China a few months earlier), I expect this to be really one-sided. The Chinese teams might have stepped up their game (haven't seen them playing for quite some time, tbh); but from the EU/NA region I don't expect any competition for Team DK.
For the game as a whole, I just hope they'll get enough viewers for the game to gain some popularity. I'm still kinda worried about the scene as a whole and the Blizzcon should be a good opportunity for the scene to grow.
not sure who to bet on, since its a different meta clash. So the least open to public regions might put out a surprise. Don't expect that DK will be having an easy time as Teams have enough time to prepare now. I think DK won't make it out of the group, simply because everyone prepares just for beating them. And then someone who didn't in group A will take the victory.
Like the Caster line up, they will do nicely. Still sad Blizzard keeps ignoring Khaldor though. He is the best Heroes caster out there and did so much for Heroes popularity in Europe.
On October 29 2015 05:50 Ej_ wrote: oh wow TLV ban? I see them pop up more in pro play, but I've been under impression that Vikings are considered ass now. Anyone cares to explain?
Since objectives hit so hard now and pro teams got so good at closing out games (games often basically decided pre 20) and Warriors with super escapes not being able to waveclean in one hit. Lanesoaking early on while objective is up has become really strong again. And with Merc Lord Vikings can do insane stuff. And well Abathur gets banned often who would be the first choice for lane soaking.
But if in this game an Eric would have been in the top lane with siege camp. The Fort would have been gone.
Really cool first match wow. As if they wanna slam IGN something into their face.
On October 29 2015 06:36 Wuster wrote: Medic hype! Call me skeptical, but Leoric and Muradin are really hard to get past.
Not with the right heroes, but Medic in my opinion is solid pick here because GIA picked heroes that generally can't get to the Medic and only one isn't enough.
Waveclean is better for Valla. And they kinda need that a little. And if shit hits the fan she can go for frost shot on 13. Imo they want to conter all the slows C9 has, by slowing them as well, in case they need to disengage.
On October 29 2015 06:47 ThomasjServo wrote: GIA is getting beat up this game, Morales Troll pick?
Tyrael was banned, they kept the healer as last pick for when the enemy team was already set, to make sure the enemy has nothing that the Medic has to fear. And it's temples Medivac is like having 5 Falstads. So def no troll pick. Just surprised they show this that early. Probably a huge mind game for the next matches or they are confident like crazy.
On October 29 2015 06:47 ThomasjServo wrote: GIA is getting beat up this game, Morales Troll pick?
Tyrael was banned, they kept the healer as last pick for when the enemy team was already set, to make sure the enemy has nothing that the Medic has to fear. And it's temples Medivac is like having 5 Falstads. So def no troll pick. Just surprised they show this that early. Probably a huge mind game for the next matches or they are confident like crazy.
True enough, has been pretty decent for them now. Until the almost team wipe and shedding muradin.
I wonder if this speaks more towards GIA having a pretty solid end game or C9 just toying with their prey. Not sure. If GIA can meet a team possibly with an inferior early game they could be a real threat. They played well.
why risk it they just need one temple. And the Medivac makes it so that they had to defend both temples as 5. They basically had no chance to win. C9 just had to wait for Catapults pushing their way Bot.
I like these picks for YL, not sure about the Tyrande solo healer though. I guess they wanna be very aggressive so they don't care much about healing but Dignitas's front line might be too good.
On October 29 2015 07:27 DifuntO wrote: I like these picks for YL, not sure about the Tyrande solo healer though. I guess they wanna be very aggressive so they don't care much about healing but Dignitas's front line might be too good.
On October 29 2015 07:46 ThomasjServo wrote: Did they even mention it or are they treating this like half time.
Not a single word mentioned. Its so funny/sad
Well John, after the players go back to the locker room and talk about whats happening out there on the map, we're going to have to see if they can turn this one around mentally and get into that endzone here on Tomb of the Spider Queen.
DIG vs YL Game 1 Dig X Stitches Uther Kael'Thas X Muradin Leoric Johanna Azmodan
YL X Tassadar Jaina Kerrigan Tyrande X Sylvanas ETC Zagara
Dig loses draft. This is dumb.
YL decided not to take any healing talents. Why.
I dunno, I think that Dig has the more stable composition but YL is playing on their own terms in what I guess is just a Chinese way which could take them by surprise?
I feel like this whole weekend will be wonkier than usual with stranger hero choices because of region preference.
On October 29 2015 08:04 Gorsameth wrote: Its not like this is new territory folks. If you want to build an esports community around your game then make sure the game can handle it lol.
And your servers. Don't forget the servers. Those poor hamsters.
On October 29 2015 08:04 Gorsameth wrote: Its not like this is new territory folks. If you want to build an esports community around your game then make sure the game can handle it lol.
It would just irk me if I were the CEO Mike. You couldn't have sat down in one of the early meetings about Hots and go, ok, we want to support some amount of competition around this even if it isn't DOTA or LoL levels, what did we run into in SC2 that we know we need to avoid?
All I'm saying is I hope it was brought up in Dustin Browder's performance review this year.
I honestly always see Azmo on Tomb lose. I can't recall the last time I saw it win. You just seem to lose so hard until 16+ and then if you don't win team fights 100% past that mark you'll just get your core pushed and lose. It seems just so incredibly risky.
On October 29 2015 08:29 Tenks wrote: I honestly always see Azmo on Tomb lose. I can't recall the last time I saw it win. You just seem to lose so hard until 16+ and then if you don't win team fights 100% past that mark you'll just get your core pushed and lose. It seems just so incredibly risky.
I don't really agree. Last time I remember seeing Azmodan on Tomb was MVP.Black vs. DK finals of the Blizzcon Qualifiers and MVP.Black won there with Azmodan pick. The thing is, picking Azmodan into something like Kerrigan, Tyrande and Jaina equals suicide and that is exactly what happened in this game, last pick Azmodan against burst diving composition with a lot of damage and without real support... don't really know what they were thinking.
On October 29 2015 08:29 Tenks wrote: I honestly always see Azmo on Tomb lose. I can't recall the last time I saw it win. You just seem to lose so hard until 16+ and then if you don't win team fights 100% past that mark you'll just get your core pushed and lose. It seems just so incredibly risky.
I don't really agree. Last time I remember seeing Azmodan on Tomb was MVP.Black vs. DK finals of the Blizzcon Qualifiers and MVP.Black won there with Azmodan pick. The thing is, picking Azmodan into something like Kerrigan, Tyrande and Jaina equals suicide and that is exactly what happened in this game, last pick Azmodan against burst diving composition with a lot of damage and without real support... don't really know what they were thinking.
Super pokes like Kael and Azmo are good vs a team that lacks heals (so it compensates to some extent), i think the problem was too much late game vs a strong early game. If they held a bit longer YL would be in trouble.
On October 29 2015 08:29 Tenks wrote: I honestly always see Azmo on Tomb lose. I can't recall the last time I saw it win. You just seem to lose so hard until 16+ and then if you don't win team fights 100% past that mark you'll just get your core pushed and lose. It seems just so incredibly risky.
I don't really agree. Last time I remember seeing Azmodan on Tomb was MVP.Black vs. DK finals of the Blizzcon Qualifiers and MVP.Black won there with Azmodan pick. The thing is, picking Azmodan into something like Kerrigan, Tyrande and Jaina equals suicide and that is exactly what happened in this game, last pick Azmodan against burst diving composition with a lot of damage and without real support... don't really know what they were thinking.
Super pokes like Kael and Azmo are good vs a team that lacks heals (so it compensates to some extent), i think the problem was too much late game vs a strong early game. If they held a bit longer YL would be in trouble.
Eh? Azmodan can't really poke if he wants to stack damage nor is his poke strong without stacked damage, and Kael doesn't have range to poke, if he casts one Flame Strike Kerrigan/ETC jumps on him and he is dead. Like you have seen, there wasn't so much sustain in these fights, so poking wasn't really an option.
On October 29 2015 09:06 Superbanana wrote: Team YL more like YOLO. They are really good but damn, too agressive, costed the game.
Wut? I think its a matter of what you define as a poke. Anyway, Kaelthas is stronger against teams with little sustain, that was my the point. But as i said, it compensates only to some extent since i do agree they asked to be dived with that draft.
And azmodan is, obviously, quite useless if he stacks all game and don't hit those globes on people. He poked and is supposed to do so.
On October 29 2015 09:21 Superbanana wrote: Wut? I think its a matter of what you define as a poke.
Are there multiple definitions? It is damaging the enemy team while never being in a position to fully engage. KT is not that in his current form. A fully stacked Azmo is most definitely, however.
On October 29 2015 09:21 Superbanana wrote: Wut? I think its a matter of what you define as a poke.
Are there multiple definitions? It is damaging the enemy team while never being in a position to fully engage. KT is not that in his current form. A fully stacked Azmo is most definitely, however.
Well I would say that Azmo without stacks is a poker, fully stacked Azmo however, is a nuclear missile launcher.
On October 29 2015 10:00 Tenks wrote: The owner of the 3rd party drafting site should have pulled the plug sometime tonight just to majorly fuck with Blizzard and their stone age client
Almost surprised no DDOS or something just for people who enjoy fucking with productions.
On October 29 2015 09:21 Superbanana wrote: Wut? I think its a matter of what you define as a poke.
Are there multiple definitions? It is damaging the enemy team while never being in a position to fully engage. KT is not that in his current form. A fully stacked Azmo is most definitely, however.
Ok, i guess misunderstand that. I put things like multishot and living bomb on that bag, when its "just doing damage" and not setting up a kill or focusing a priority target. Damage that overloads the healer and is thus more valuable when the other team lacks self sustain. Stuff like lockdown and burst is not defended by standard sustain, you need stuff like divine shield, cleanse, stuff like that. So i call it poke, sometimes you throw the globe on an area and whatever it hits is good. Same goes for living bomb, if you have chain, sometimes you hit what you can and hope it spreads, better than nothing or die trying to get Valla. But i understand its prolly me getting it wrong.
On October 29 2015 10:08 FeyFey wrote: oh damn Noblesse is on team DK, then I actually have to root for em. Go Go DK ! (and use a cool Zagara skin ;_; )
Yes but Sniper, the destroyer of dreams and bringer of tears, is also on team DK.
On October 29 2015 10:08 FeyFey wrote: oh damn Noblesse is on team DK, then I actually have to root for em. Go Go DK ! (and use a cool Zagara skin ;_; )
Yes but Sniper, the destroyer of dreams and bringer of tears, is also on team DK.
On October 29 2015 10:25 Tenks wrote: Most one-sided game of the day IMO
It is, but somehow I love watching Koreans play one-sided games, it show a completely different type of preparation and discipline to the point of perfection.
On October 29 2015 10:25 Tenks wrote: Most one-sided game of the day IMO
It is, but somehow I love watching Koreans play one-sided games, it show a completely different type of preparation and discipline to the point of perfection.
It seemed less like DK playing great than TS playing poorly
I feel like DK banning the sonya is a strange choice. I associate a strong Sonya with Korea more than any other region, Let Tempo Ban it out, I don't think they would have to fear TS Sonya.
On October 29 2015 10:25 Tenks wrote: Most one-sided game of the day IMO
It is, but somehow I love watching Koreans play one-sided games, it show a completely different type of preparation and discipline to the point of perfection.
It seemed less like DK playing great than TS playing poorly
It is true, but to me it also seemed like DK were forcing mistakes that were made by Tempo Storm, like that they weren't giving them enough room to breath.
On October 29 2015 10:08 FeyFey wrote: oh damn Noblesse is on team DK, then I actually have to root for em. Go Go DK ! (and use a cool Zagara skin ;_; )
Yes but Sniper, the destroyer of dreams and bringer of tears, is also on team DK.
Yeah give me more reasons to cheer for the evil Korean Overlords. Liked Sniper before his GSL thing.
So nice to see Muradin and BW again. Always raged when I saw Illidan Abathur picked and people ignored the counter heroes. But I forgot they use Candy Muradin . Just lose hard !
DK being the favorite might ruin their chance of winning this tournament, as much as mechanics mattered in Heroes. Having most of your comfortable strategies researched by every teams, they had an uphill battle especially considering that their strength is rotation and not so much on team fighting.
Don't think Leoric is a good choice, ETC would be better. Omg Valla + Raynor, with Arthas + Mura proving the slows for executioner, nothing BW can outheal. I think Tempo Storm should have picked ETC and take Death Metal. xD
So TS can actually do well here even though Leoric isn't really a great solo tank. A bit strange that DK went for both Valla and Raynor, they are both like Paper heroes for Zeratul and Jaina, but maybe they have something in mind.
On October 29 2015 11:26 Circumstance wrote: So how close does Tempo Storm come to winning before Sniper remembers the role he's meant to play in esports history?
Maybe he want to personally eliminate all the teams from the loser bracket.
On October 29 2015 11:26 Circumstance wrote: So how close does Tempo Storm come to winning before Sniper remembers the role he's meant to play in esports history?
Well it is a bit strange to put it that way, since DK are the fan favorites and a lot of people hate TS.
On October 29 2015 11:26 Circumstance wrote: So how close does Tempo Storm come to winning before Sniper remembers the role he's meant to play in esports history?
Is he going to win this and fall into obscurity again?
On October 29 2015 11:42 ThomasjServo wrote: I think that is it, DK looking more mortal than I expected.
Indeed, but to be honest they have picked some questionable heroes and TS played amazing these two games if you take into account that their team is falling apart.
On October 29 2015 11:26 Circumstance wrote: So how close does Tempo Storm come to winning before Sniper remembers the role he's meant to play in esports history?
Well that didn't go nearly as smoothly as i would have liked. .. Normally i would excuse game two as BM, but.. they executed that comp so poorly. It should have done better than that.
Oh well DK and Pistons win. .. just both were sloppy.
On October 29 2015 11:45 DifuntO wrote: That was closer than I expected. TS vs NaVi, or a rematch vs DK(unlikely but you never know, NaVi could beat them) should be really good.
Out of all teams I would give Cloud9 and Na`Vi the best chances to beat DK. Cloud9 just have great gameplay, good rotations and solid decision making, and Na`Vi are really tricky and have surprise picks and strategies that probably no team is prepared for. We will see.
Na`Vi is looking really strong! The execution looked a bit messy at times, but they're rotating well and moving where they need to be at the rights times ^^.
On October 29 2015 13:02 Topin wrote: i really liked this game by Navi and the Diablo pick
Yeah, Diablo pick is getting more and more popular in EU teams. Virtus.Pro picked Diablo + Tyrande combo against Gamers2 and won with it. There is also a guide on Tempo Storm about that combo, it is quite sick and easy to pull, almost impossible to evade while at the same time a lot more forgiving than Tyrande + Butcher/Kerrigan.
On October 29 2015 13:02 Topin wrote: i really liked this game by Navi and the Diablo pick
Yeah, Diablo pick is getting more and more popular in EU teams. Virtus.Pro picked Diablo + Tyrande combo against Gamers2 and won with it. There is also a guide on Tempo Storm about that combo, it is quite sick and easy to pull, almost impossible to evade while at the same time a lot more forgiving than Tyrande + Butcher/Kerrigan.
My buddy loves playing Diablo and I'm getting into Tyrande lately, it's really hard to hit her E when he's throwing them left right and centre really gotta time it right. Nowhere near as easy as the Stitches or Butcher combo, for example.
Also, BHeart apparently is a hastily scrambled team. They had to borrow people from EDG to play, cuz eStar couldn't come due to visa issues, and BHeart replaced them last minute. So yeah, show these guys some support.
On October 29 2015 13:02 Topin wrote: i really liked this game by Navi and the Diablo pick
Yeah, Diablo pick is getting more and more popular in EU teams. Virtus.Pro picked Diablo + Tyrande combo against Gamers2 and won with it. There is also a guide on Tempo Storm about that combo, it is quite sick and easy to pull, almost impossible to evade while at the same time a lot more forgiving than Tyrande + Butcher/Kerrigan.
My buddy loves playing Diablo and I'm getting into Tyrande lately, it's really hard to hit her E when he's throwing them left right and centre really gotta time it right. Nowhere near as easy as the Stitches or Butcher combo, for example.
Had a Diablo in QM, he just said I ping the slam target. My Lunar precision went through the roof.
that can get messy, Dignitas are keeping enemy buildings alive, if they get curse the level advantage will be huge. And C9 has killed the easy buildings, so no easy exp to get on even level.
Thunderclap build is back ! And OP as ever against non Anubs.
I already have Tass
When was the Thunderclap build not a thing? O.o
With the tank heavy Meta people always went for the Hammer build, which makes sense. And then people continued to do the Hammer build for cleaning Merc camps really fast. Even if they faced autoattack heroes.
Thunderclap build is back ! And OP as ever against non Anubs.
I already have Tass
When was the Thunderclap build not a thing? O.o
With the tank heavy Meta people always went for the Hammer build, which makes sense. And then people continued to do the Hammer build for cleaning Merc camps really fast. Even if they faced autoattack heroes.
Interesting, I would only go for the hammer build if we severely lacked damage, though I did like the piercing hammer talent even with thunderclap talents at 1 and 4.
Incidentally, Kaelaris not mentioning the classic Cadeceus Reactor cloak banshee fake, c'mon dude
Thunderclap build is back ! And OP as ever against non Anubs.
I already have Tass
When was the Thunderclap build not a thing? O.o
With the tank heavy Meta people always went for the Hammer build, which makes sense. And then people continued to do the Hammer build for cleaning Merc camps really fast. Even if they faced autoattack heroes.
Interesting, I would only go for the hammer build if we severely lacked damage, though I did like the piercing hammer talent even with thunderclap talents at 1 and 4.
Incidentally, Kaelaris not mentioning the classic Cadeceus Reactor cloak banshee fake, c'mon dude
Piercing Bolt is currently probably better then Battle Momentum in any case, but if people take 1 and 4 Hammer talents if you have a Sonya on your side I find that super weird.
Thunderclap build is back ! And OP as ever against non Anubs.
I already have Tass
When was the Thunderclap build not a thing? O.o
With the tank heavy Meta people always went for the Hammer build, which makes sense. And then people continued to do the Hammer build for cleaning Merc camps really fast. Even if they faced autoattack heroes.
Interesting, I would only go for the hammer build if we severely lacked damage, though I did like the piercing hammer talent even with thunderclap talents at 1 and 4.
Incidentally, Kaelaris not mentioning the classic Cadeceus Reactor cloak banshee fake, c'mon dude
Piercing Bolt is currently probably better then Battle Momentum in any case, but if people take 1 and 4 Hammer talents if you have a Sonya on your side I find that super weird.
Yeah, I wouldn't if she was on my side. Usually, she's on the other side, in which case Reverb = god.
You have to protect Kael and the Medic. Thats why you can't use spear + dwarf toss to jump on someone. And thats why you just damage what you can. And Uther and Tyrande will run out of steam earlier then Tassadar and Medic. But Medic took the wrong talents Imo and no the best positioning on her. But C9 forced Medic out of position often.
Still a mistake ended that game, so its really sad. Imo Dignitas would have won if Medic could leave the Medivac again xD.
I hope they go for Death Metal. It trades Etc for Sonya/Tyrael at 20.
On October 29 2015 14:39 FeyFey wrote: You have to protect Kael and the Medic. Thats why you can't use spear + dwarf toss to jump on someone. And thats why you just damage what you can. And Uther and Tyrande will run out of steam earlier then Tassadar and Medic. But Medic took the wrong talents Imo and no the best positioning on her. But C9 forced Medic out of position often.
Still a mistake ended that game, so its really sad. Imo Dignitas would have won if Medic could leave the Medivac again xD.
I can see what you're getting at, but that comp from C9 seemed to completely negate that. They had three heroes that could go where they want and they had Uther's divine shield to bail them out (and it worked on Kerrigan a ton). Plus all their lockdown seemed to negate a lot of Dignitas' sustain capabilities.
That said, they did win most fights until the end, I could have sworn at the keep + immortal fight Tassadar zoned out his own warriors though. It just seemed like they were playing with fire and finally got burned. Maybe more experience with Medic will refine that style though.
Edit: I like Dignitas' draft, seems they want to turn the lockdown game on C9 =p.
Omg Shadowstalk Moshpit. I just saw the Terror. To bad he slided to late and missed BW, but Dignitas seems to be tired. Like me x.x 7 am. No the terror is my stream stopped working argh.
dignitas spent so long without level 20 due to that earlier lane push... needless to say if this was online, blue team would already have 3 people saying "bg" and going afk after that keep fell
Welks you need to reach level 20 for Deathmetal to work its magic though. Grats C9 for advancing. Was a really fun series. And I want to experiment with ETC and Shadowstalk now. Cloak an Moshpitting ETC D: .
You know it occurs to me that if they're going to have a pre-tournament a week before Blizzcon, they may as well do a proper round-robin group stage. We don't get many chances to see region clashes, so why can't we get more games?
On October 29 2015 15:19 Wuster wrote: You know it occurs to me that if they're going to have a pre-tournament a week before Blizzcon, they may as well do a proper round-robin group stage. We don't get many chances to see region clashes, so why can't we get more games?
Also, holy crap today has been a long stream.
I was thinking about that, but it is too many matches, a round robin with 8 teams means 28 BOX, today are being played only 6 BO3 and will take around 11 hours, 28 series would not be viable in the current amount of time available.
Maybe if not all matches were streamed or more channels or bo2 (with ties) for the round robin or more time...
hm so Jaina will go for Icy veins, if she prolongs her slow duration. Good decision.
Jep can't forget they are also doing Hearthstone matches as well. They would have to make a full 2 week Blizzcon if they would try to squeeze even more matches in.
I expected a long game with not many deaths ... damn was I wrong.
On October 29 2015 15:19 Wuster wrote: You know it occurs to me that if they're going to have a pre-tournament a week before Blizzcon, they may as well do a proper round-robin group stage. We don't get many chances to see region clashes, so why can't we get more games?
Also, holy crap today has been a long stream.
I was thinking about that, but it is too many matches, a round robin with 8 teams means 28 BOX, today are being played only 6 BO3 and will take around 11 hours, 28 series would not be viable in the current amount of time available.
Maybe if not all matches were streamed or more channels or bo2 (with ties) for the round robin or more time...
Well I was actually thinking two groups still, so 12 BOX + whatever tie breakers they decide are needed. I believe that's what Hearthstone is doing, 8 matches / day until groups are done.
Oh well, maybe next year.
Man, Navi really took it to Team DK, DK looked pretty rattled at the end there too.
On October 29 2015 15:59 Valiver wrote: The Diablo/Falstad picks confuse me.
Still do.
Well if Diablo wouldn't permantly die, he would actually be able to tank and be useful. And Falstad can splitsoak a little to get ahead, which would allow Diablo to die early in a teamfight and come back and secure the objective. And Falstad seemed to be the disengange, since they had alot of heroes with no retreat. And if not for the Ring of Frost it would have worked out really well.
On October 29 2015 16:48 Wuster wrote: Edit: Also, Sniper's really been playing a bad Sylvanas this series, or is it just me?
I think this is what let NaVi get back into it. They picked off Sylvanas so many times.
Even in the first two games he kept offensive Haunting Wave and then getting collapsed on. I'm not sure if he was tunnel visioning or he expected his team to follow him on the chase. Something just seemed off, but either way I'm sure that gave Na'vi the confidence to let Sylvanas through to them on Mines of all maps (even though it almost backfired on them).
On October 29 2015 16:48 Wuster wrote: DK seems to being diving so hard on Navi only to get foiled by sanc, how many times are they going to fall for it?
Also that ambush, holy crap such patience by Navi to wait for that.
Edit: Also, Sniper's really been playing a bad Sylvanas this series, or is it just me?
He played a good Sylv, just bad talents against the Navi Comp, so he got blown up. Nothing you can do as Sylv against that insane dive burst + Syndragosa. (apart from taking will of the forsaken). But they picked Sylv before they knew what would happen and they needed her Level 16 damage buff, which means she has to go even closer to the enemy team. So all DK could do was hoping to win early.
But what impressed me the most was the reaction to divine palm. brought them down to extreme low health while divine palm was up, the moment it went away boom. But DK used Divine Palm totally wrong. Always way to early.
Just finished the last two match-ups(C9 vs. Dig and Na`Vi vs. DK) and I am amazed how well Na`Vi was playing. Their picks and engagements and disengagements are something else. All of the games were really fun, looking forward to the 7th November!
On October 30 2015 00:26 MotherFox wrote: I am paying for staying up so late on a work night, but wow that last haunted mines game was awesome.
I went home after Brave versus Navi, ate dinner got the kid ready for bed then turned the stream back on. I honestly thought it was a rebroadcast, but nope it was just C9 - Dig and another 3 hours of action to go.
DK messed up that Mines game terribly terribly badly. Like .. honestly feel like if they just played conservatively and traded 50 skull ish golems they would have won so easily.
Their arrogance is whats going to kill them this tournament.
That said..Unlike most other teams they have played so standard. Feel like they were really just wanting to get by here with just showing traditional comps. or troll comps (Chen)
On October 30 2015 11:18 Cyanocyst wrote: SPOILER ALERT + Show Spoiler +
DK messed up that Mines game terribly terribly badly. Like .. honestly feel like if they just played conservatively and traded 50 skull ish golems they would have won so easily.
Their arrogance is whats going to kill them this tournament.
That said..Unlike most other teams they have played so standard. Feel like they were really just wanting to get by here with just showing traditional comps. or troll comps (Chen)
They may in fact be hiding the most.
That's actually how they are. They've always been insistent on playing their own blend of heroes and making it work compared to MVP Black, who play all sorts of compositions. The thing that DK is known for is getting better and adapting over a large span of time, so being knocked down and having to fight through two more series just to get back to the final bracket is actually probably the best thing that could happen to them.
DKs biggest mistake was stealing the monk away Imo. Their support played the monk pretty badly. And well Jaina and Sylv taken bad (for this situation bad) talents didn't help.
On October 31 2015 00:16 FeyFey wrote: DKs biggest mistake was stealing the monk away Imo. Their support played the monk pretty badly. And well Jaina and Sylv taken bad (for this situation bad) talents didn't help.
Ya, DK is a team that relies on their comfort picks. They're very Korean SC2 in their stubbornness - "We're going to do what we practiced and just beat you on mechanics / following our game plan."
Also, BW ended up being a better pick with all the ability damage reduction talents.
Just got around to watching the VODs of the day - holy shit, the Navi vs DK games were fucking amazing. So hyped for the rest of the event. I never thought three warrior comps could look so scary.
On November 07 2015 10:11 ThomasjServo wrote: So China seems like the weakest region by a fair bit. Their meta is unique, but seems really overcomeable
Wow, that was a stomp. GIA is looking really poor, from the drafting phase to everything in game. I don't know what's going on right now, but this is not the same team we saw last week.
On November 07 2015 10:11 ThomasjServo wrote: So China seems like the weakest region by a fair bit. Their meta is unique, but seems really overcomeable
You mean Taiwan?
According to Beijing, I'm not wrong :p. YL will prove my point regardless next round.
On November 07 2015 10:11 ThomasjServo wrote: So China seems like the weakest region by a fair bit. Their meta is unique, but seems really overcomeable
You mean Taiwan?
According to Beijing, I'm not wrong :p
You're welcome to your opinion. And maybe i misinterpreted your first comment. Though GIA is from Taiwan, And they just got beat by a Chinese team.
So its an odd time to call China the weakest region.
On November 07 2015 10:11 ThomasjServo wrote: So China seems like the weakest region by a fair bit. Their meta is unique, but seems really overcomeable
You mean Taiwan?
According to Beijing, I'm not wrong :p
You're welcome to your opinion. And maybe i misinterpreted your first comment. Though GIA is from Taiwan, And they just got beat by a Chinese team.
So its an odd time to call China the weakest region.
I get the political bit of it, lived in China for a while too. In my head, having met far more people from the mainland, I just kind of default to China :/
you would get artanis with the expensive version as well. So Artanis + Mount + wow pet + stuff ... Even now the Void Caller is already in the client under mount select to tease you to buy the expensive version.
Tempo Storm seems to have given up on draft variety, going for Sylv so early. Ah well, they do better with their comfort picks over meta picks, but it doesn't bode well for their chances, I'd say. (Of course, their internal infighting already put an end to their ambitions...)
Its Tassadar + Sonya with Uther. So the 2 best burst healers keeping her up. Well to bad Brightwing Zagara will shut her down. But I do alot of Tassadar Sonya. She can easily solo tank with him.
On November 07 2015 12:46 Tenks wrote: Once Innovation got knocked out I lost my desire to watch the SC2 stream
archon mode showmatch. atm, but hey, TS picked a decent tank this time around.
Archon is pretty fun to watch. You can really focus on the harassing early game units (eg; reapers) since they're controlled by a single person and being defended by a single person while another person is doing the mundane macro tasks. I could actually see Archon being a real-deal spectator sport.
Man TS kept getting sick Maws but there never seemed to be a good follow up by the Jaina. It was so frustrating to see 2-3 people get eaten but never get blizzarded.
was clever by them to constantly port/cancel 4 heroes, the Immortal and Tyreal would have done the job alone. But every second would have counted when YL would have core rushed.
Hungering Arrow showing its power against Ranged Assassins before pixie dust gets evil. To much single target damage explodes everything. Will always use Hungering Arrow build on Garden now. Aww well a few good fights for Braveheart, but damn didn't expected that single target damage to do this well.
hmm Brave Heart is pretty much the chinese all-star team. I wouldn't mind if they went on to win the whole thing, it would make for a great yet funny story line.
That was pretty sickkk. Brave Heart came out and surprised everyone. Ofc, it's not the team proper, but they showed they are actually pretty amazing...makes you wonder what would have happened had eStar made it ^^.
On November 08 2015 03:44 Larkin wrote: incidentally do you guys prefer casters to say the hero name or the player name?
so "zagara and tyrael pushing the top lane here" or "lucifron and vortix pushing the top lane"?
Both are fine to me. I think for newer players, it's better to have Hero names, but as someone who enjoys the esports scene and doesn't necessarily know everyone on all the teams, I like when every once and a while, I can identify X name with Y hero in Z role.
Hero name for me, since I don't always keep 24/7 check on who is playing which hero. Zagara is pushing the top lane says more for me than <player> is pushing the top lane. It also matters more which hero is doing what, rather than which player.
On November 08 2015 03:44 Larkin wrote: incidentally do you guys prefer casters to say the hero name or the player name?
so "zagara and tyrael pushing the top lane here" or "lucifron and vortix pushing the top lane"?
don't care
what I care more about is that Blizz is forcing hero names instead of titles, like Kharazim over Monk or Arthas over Lich King
how do you mean 'forcing'? as in literally giving them names? I've heard plenty of people just call Kharazim 'monk' but it'd be weird for some heroes, like Nazeebo
On November 08 2015 03:44 Larkin wrote: incidentally do you guys prefer casters to say the hero name or the player name?
so "zagara and tyrael pushing the top lane here" or "lucifron and vortix pushing the top lane"?
don't care
what I care more about is that Blizz is forcing hero names instead of titles, like Kharazim over Monk or Arthas over Lich King
how do you mean 'forcing'? as in literally giving them names? I've heard plenty of people just call Kharazim 'monk' but it'd be weird for some heroes, like Nazeebo
Nazeebo is The Witch Doctor. Dota has a lot of characters that are refered to by both name/title and 1 just kinda sticks. It irked me a lot when I called Morales "medic" in HL and people thought I was talking about healer lol
On November 08 2015 03:44 Larkin wrote: incidentally do you guys prefer casters to say the hero name or the player name?
so "zagara and tyrael pushing the top lane here" or "lucifron and vortix pushing the top lane"?
I prefer the hero name over the player playing that hero, since players switch heroes each game. We all know what each hero looks like, but to quickly identify the player, we need to know what hero he's playing anyway (or read the name instead of just see the hero). It's easier to recognize by hero instead of player, which makes viewing easier.
On November 08 2015 03:44 Larkin wrote: incidentally do you guys prefer casters to say the hero name or the player name?
so "zagara and tyrael pushing the top lane here" or "lucifron and vortix pushing the top lane"?
don't care
what I care more about is that Blizz is forcing hero names instead of titles, like Kharazim over Monk or Arthas over Lich King
how do you mean 'forcing'? as in literally giving them names? I've heard plenty of people just call Kharazim 'monk' but it'd be weird for some heroes, like Nazeebo
Nazeebo is The Witch Doctor. Dota has a lot of characters that are refered to by both name/title and 1 just kinda sticks. It irked me a lot when I called Morales "medic" in HL and people thought I was talking about healer lol
Yeah I know, I think it would be weird to call them "The Witch Doctor" idk
imagine casters trying to get hyped over a huge zombie wall from "the heretic witch doctor" instead of nazeebo, doesn't quite have the same effect imo
If they want esports to be taken seriously, this kind of thing just can't happen. They need to have extras on hand ready to switch out I'd necessary like umpires do with baseballs
On November 08 2015 04:08 KrytosSR wrote: If they want esports to be taken seriously, this kind of thing just can't happen. They need to have extras on hand ready to switch out I'd necessary like umpires do with baseballs
they normally do. I have no idea how a sound issue could take this long. Heck they could(and probably should) have switched out the entire PC by now.
What a fiasco... IDK what kind of issue requires this amount of time to fix.
And why are they torturing us and the casters by forcing them to "fill" ? Run a clip or something... A screen saying "Technical difficulties" will do the same thing.
On November 08 2015 04:19 Zambrah wrote: Muradin and Kael'thas aren't humans ToD, gawd.
Yeah, I always thought it was funny that the Alliance in WarCraft III was called 'the Humans' even though humans were the fewest units in the faction.
World of Warcraft is still 99% about the Orcs and Humans nowadays anyways.
With the number of Elf races they've got, I would have assumed they're the dominant species.
10% of the races, 90% of the attenton.
It really does get old though, orc orc orc, human human human, when tha trolls'n gnomes gonna get some love, mon?
Speaking of which, Zul'jin confirmed right?
Yeah, I've been wondering when they'd fill out the last representatives for the player races of World of WarCraft. I don't care that much personally, but with Protoss having only two heroes from the start and none added until Artanis, I feel like I can sympathise a little .
What kind of issues are could cause such a delay? Worst case you have to replace one full computer, which should take 10 minutes tops. Could it be Battle.net?
On November 08 2015 04:19 Zambrah wrote: Muradin and Kael'thas aren't humans ToD, gawd.
Yeah, I always thought it was funny that the Alliance in WarCraft III was called 'the Humans' even though humans were the fewest units in the faction.
World of Warcraft is still 99% about the Orcs and Humans nowadays anyways.
With the number of Elf races they've got, I would have assumed they're the dominant species.
10% of the races, 90% of the attenton.
It really does get old though, orc orc orc, human human human, when tha trolls'n gnomes gonna get some love, mon?
Speaking of which, Zul'jin confirmed right?
We got a wink and a nod for "Troll" Heroes from WC at the panel.
Gimme a Zul'jin and/or a Vol'jin (though Im doubtful we'll see Vol'jin because feels like his abilities would be covered by Sylvanas/Brightwing) and I'll be satisfied. Honestly I'd be satisfied with any Troll though.
On November 08 2015 04:36 Thezzy wrote: What kind of issues are could cause such a delay? Worst case you have to replace one full computer, which should take 10 minutes tops. Could it be Battle.net?
The official reason I heard was sound issue but yes, anything computer related should never take this long.
On November 08 2015 04:33 Pr0wler wrote: What a fiasco... IDK what kind of issue requires this amount of time to fix.
yep. its been more then an hour since the draft finished now.
the sound issues are at their panels, they are out of technical staff atm to run all esports event.
Also they are looking into troll heroes, but they are currently working on guldan as in guldan is at the start of his development. So 3 month + to guldan. Troll hero even longer.
They spent all that money on the spaceship caster desk and fancy screen. But they lack technical staff. I am a bit scared about how they spent all that Hearthstone money, at this point they might have hologram secretaries and golden coffee cups.
On November 08 2015 04:57 Pr0wler wrote: I don't even know what they still have people in the crowd. If it was me, I walk out at the 15th minute. Show them that they fucked up, badly.
I dont get the people in the audience period. Your at blizzcon ffs, you don't go and watch a tournament on a screen :p
On November 08 2015 04:56 Fanatic-Templar wrote: Well, Life calls so I'll be going now, but thanks to these casters for being entertaining despite absolutely nothing happening. Seriously, great job.
Nope, still 30 minutes before the stream starts and probably a whole bunch of talking and introduction before the games. So here I am again, how's everyone doing, did I miss anything?
"sorry" or "this is what is happening, and this is what we are trying to do", or "It will take around this time", or "the tournament is delayed until further notice", nothing of that right? Im out and not coming back.
Any information on Banning Draft? e.g. how does it work? I mean, many people are already complaining about the 10 hero requirement and Banning Draft means: More heroes to play ranked.
Christ now I have to go out soon and SC2 and Heroes are starting (finally)... just caught up on the games from yesterday though, DK vs Braveheart was awesome
I think most just have the stream still open and check it from time to time, which is what I'm doing whilst now starting to watch the SC2 stream and having the Heroes stream muted.
Im pretty new to this game, but it looks like a 2k dota game where all the players are just hovering around mid tower until someone gets out of position. O.o
I don't understand why they don't ban Kharazim vs Dig, Bakery is a lot better on him than on any other healer, it's definitely worth to respect ban him imo.
It really shows that they practiced so much together, expected this giving Dignitas the advantage. Really a shame for me personally. But hopefully that made sure eu will win in the finals. Though I give Navi higher winning chances against the other teams.
I like how people remembered within a week when the best met, that Zagara's Ult basically eats anything that is super buffed and spits it out when all the buffs are gone.
Both Rexxar and Leoric can harass shrines and the center knight relatively safely, so those picks make sense. Rehgar is fine after 13/16 healing talents, so having rexxar/leoric buys time to reach that point.
On November 08 2015 07:51 MotherFox wrote: Both Rexxar and Leoric can harass shrines and the center knight relatively safely, so those picks make sense. Rehgar is fine after 13/16 healing talents, so having rexxar/leoric buys time to reach that point.
I had always thought Misha had a shorter leash range, but she was pretty far off sometimes, makes me feel a lot better about Rexxar as a character.
This game was a good one to show the ways in which Rexxar can be good, educational, entertaining, 10/10.
On November 08 2015 08:31 ACrow wrote: C9 is playing this amazingly, but I wonder, how do you finish with this comp? Hope that some day you'll win the team fight and finish? With a boss?
let Abathur cheap away at the core for 40 minutes?
Such a young game. ..Guess there will be dumb compositions that not everyone is aware of.
DK played well but made critical mistakes. Sniper getting caught out looking try to scout boss. Not disengaging well.
Also not hunting abathur enough, think they could slow the tempo advantage and severely hurt the comp if they were to find and kill abathur more frequently.
On November 08 2015 08:35 zeross wrote: it pain me caster were so bad i did end up watching muted at least its over, no way i'm watching the final today with these delay
bad caster that shout way too much, bad delay, bad production value, wish they'd have leaved this to khaldor
I mute khaldor too tbh. everyon3 has different tolerance of things.
this is why dotaTV is so superior, you can watch the game with just the ingame sounds and don't have to mute entirely any game you dislike.
On November 08 2015 08:35 zeross wrote: it pain me caster were so bad i did end up watching muted at least its over, no way i'm watching the final today with these delay
bad caster that shout way too much, bad delay, bad production value, wish they'd have leaved this to khaldor
LOL so dumb, Khaldor got SO So much hate for his SC2 casting. Its funny how the public changes their opinions when people have been out of the spotlight for a while. Just look at the Re-welcome Day9 is getting now.
(btw i always thought Khaldor was a pretty good caster)
Honestly i don't like bable, his voice just doesn't seem to have a lot of articulation to it.
Though I think Gilly may in fact be one of the most knowledgeable casters, she knows the game well. Shes certainly the best at recalling ability names and even specific talent names. Though i admit her voice is a bit shrill. Still enjoy her casting, wish she were paired with Jake.
On November 08 2015 08:38 Cyanocyst wrote: Such a young game. ..Guess there will be dumb compositions that not everyone is aware of.
DK played well but made critical mistakes. Sniper getting caught out looking try to scout boss. Not disengaging well.
Also not hunting abathur enough, think they could slow the tempo advantage and severely hurt the comp if they were to find and kill abathur more frequently.
If you hunt Abathur and don't get him you have an Boss pushing against you, and then Abathur will push the other lane, which is even worse. But yeah story of DK this tournament, get owned by unusual comps. Didn't adapt enough. But Abathur cursed Hollow ? yeah not getting a Zagara with Nydus is a mistake.
On November 08 2015 08:38 Cyanocyst wrote: Such a young game. ..Guess there will be dumb compositions that not everyone is aware of.
DK played well but made critical mistakes. Sniper getting caught out looking try to scout boss. Not disengaging well.
Also not hunting abathur enough, think they could slow the tempo advantage and severely hurt the comp if they were to find and kill abathur more frequently.
If you hunt Abathur and don't get him you have an Boss pushing against you, and then Abathur will push the other lane, which is even worse. But yeah story of DK this tournament, get owned by unusual comps. Didn't adapt enough. But Abathur cursed Hollow ? yeah not getting a Zagara with Nydus is a mistake.
Well 2 finals went to EU, lets make it a 3rd !
Abathur in the late game was quite bold. very risky positioning. Yes the time in which the hero goes to find and kill abby would be crucial. Sniper would probably die in the stupidest way while attempting it. Still think abathur is the thing that really holds the comp together. Allowing merky the dps he needs.
Well blizzcon is hosted in murica, the casters are murican and c9 is a murican team so obviously there's bias. Nice strat by C9 tbh, very hard to deal with especially if you don't know what's coming.
On November 08 2015 08:35 zeross wrote: it pain me caster were so bad i did end up watching muted at least its over, no way i'm watching the final today with these delay
bad caster that shout way too much, bad delay, bad production value, wish they'd have leaved this to khaldor
LOL so dumb, Khaldor got SO So much hate for his SC2 casting. Its funny how the public changes their opinions when people have been out of the spotlight for a while. Just look at the Re-welcome Day9 is getting now.
(btw i always thought Khaldor was a pretty good caster)
Khaldor is still hated by those that hate him and well liked for his Sc2 casting by those that like it and always was, there was no change. People with a negative opinion just get more vocal if their target is more popular.
And I love Gilly and Kaelaris together and Grubby in the middle !
On November 08 2015 08:38 Cyanocyst wrote: Such a young game. ..Guess there will be dumb compositions that not everyone is aware of.
DK played well but made critical mistakes. Sniper getting caught out looking try to scout boss. Not disengaging well.
Also not hunting abathur enough, think they could slow the tempo advantage and severely hurt the comp if they were to find and kill abathur more frequently.
If you hunt Abathur and don't get him you have an Boss pushing against you, and then Abathur will push the other lane, which is even worse. But yeah story of DK this tournament, get owned by unusual comps. Didn't adapt enough. But Abathur cursed Hollow ? yeah not getting a Zagara with Nydus is a mistake.
Well 2 finals went to EU, lets make it a 3rd !
Abathur in the late game was quite bold. very risky positioning. Yes the time in which the hero goes to find and kill abby would be crucial. Sniper would probably die in the stupidest way while attempting it. Still think abathur is the thing that really holds the comp together. Allowing merky the dps he needs.
He was not being all that risky--- when he was in very forward positions he frequently had ultimate evo available. It's a really great escape in a pinch, which lets you go to forward positions on the map in the late game.
On November 08 2015 08:38 Cyanocyst wrote: Such a young game. ..Guess there will be dumb compositions that not everyone is aware of.
DK played well but made critical mistakes. Sniper getting caught out looking try to scout boss. Not disengaging well.
Also not hunting abathur enough, think they could slow the tempo advantage and severely hurt the comp if they were to find and kill abathur more frequently.
If you hunt Abathur and don't get him you have an Boss pushing against you, and then Abathur will push the other lane, which is even worse. But yeah story of DK this tournament, get owned by unusual comps. Didn't adapt enough. But Abathur cursed Hollow ? yeah not getting a Zagara with Nydus is a mistake.
Well 2 finals went to EU, lets make it a 3rd !
Abathur in the late game was quite bold. very risky positioning. Yes the time in which the hero goes to find and kill abby would be crucial. Sniper would probably die in the stupidest way while attempting it. Still think abathur is the thing that really holds the comp together. Allowing merky the dps he needs.
He was not being all that risky--- when he was in very forward positions he frequently had ultimate evo available. It's a really great escape in a pinch, which lets you go to forward positions on the map in the late game.
This. He also had mines placed in all approach paths, I'd say most of the time he was really safe - Fan is really good with Aba.
Tyrael is one of the favorite heroes of dignitas, they play it well so if you remove a hero they are confortable with you gaina little edge. Furthermore Tyrael is a great pick with a lot of utility and dirsruption. He is kinda bruiser-like so he can also work on dive comps with judgment or turn fights around with the new sanctification so he is not a bad hero to ban.
On tilt most likely, Dignitas is a team that formed out of players, that were let go because they were to bm or similar things. So momentum probably has a huge influence on them.
Wish Blizzcon were 3 days long..Best of 3 simis and best of 5 finals don't seem right to be coming from a SC2 back ground.
Not complaining about C9's win, i fully expect a best of 7 would have been a 4 - 0.
Just saying on the event as a whole, it feels a bit rushed, from the viewers perspective. Like had to choose which finals to watch. due to Sc2 and Hots being run at the same time.
Would like to see longer series, over more days, and finals that don't overlap.
I can't help but think that 3 hour delay really got to Na'Vi. Their play was so uncoordinated, they missed several skill shots and at least one player was out of position constantly. That was not the Na'Vi we saw last week vs DK.
On November 08 2015 11:04 [Phantom] wrote: I think sooner rather than later BlizzCon will move to a 3 day convention, specially with their new games and overwatch esports
they could if the virtual ticket would expand on the esports part lol. Otherwise I can't see what they can do. People hated it really badly, when eliminations happened outside of the Blizzcon, but they have so many games they have to move some out to earlier. And I think its pretty good how they handled that. So we got the maximum that is possible with the current model. They really need a big esports sponsor if they want to expand on 3 days, just for their esports titles.
3 hour delay. Damn that is huge. Just saw the games of c9, loved some of their picks, they really leveraged these heroes that revive quickly to win through attrition. Had expected DK still to beat them fairly handily despite their lackluster showing last week but they were beaten fairly convincingly ultimately.
EPT
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